Linda Nelson Murray
Industrial and Commercial Panel · Fine Gael · Ireland
“Navan hospital always needs to be strengthened, not sidelined. We need investment in that to grow with the population that is growing in Meath, and that Meath people have a hospital that grows with their needs and does not fall behind. I am discussing this with the Minister for Health, Deputy Jennifer Carroll MacNeill.”
“The Irish Cancer Society is in the news today. We met its representatives last week and had a very good engagement over in Buswells Hotel where they were giving us some numbers. I wanted to home in on bowel cancer. There are 2,500 people diagnosed with bowel cancer each year in Ireland.”
“We have had amazing debates in here from all sides of the Chamber. Everybody, without a shadow of a doubt, is a pleasure to work with. We can achieve things together whether we are in opposition or in government. I thank everybody. It is really nice to come in to the Chamber and I look forward to it every Tuesday.”
“I thank everybody in that group, particularly the Senators in this Chamber who worked on the group, because it is a day to be acknowledged. Hopefully, we will see it come through quickly. I want to follow on from that by asking the Leader to speak to the Minister, Deputy Calleary, who is working very hard on a baby loss register.”
“Senator Nicole Ryan and I, with other Senators, including Senators Patricia Stephenson, Tom Clonan and Evanne Ní Chuilinn, and many TDs - it was a complete cross-party Oireachtas group - came together and have been working on how to actually do this over the last year. Today is a very positive day for all of us in our group.”
“It was about a year ago that we had a very emotive debate in the House when Senator Nicole Ryan brought suggestions for a Bill on miscarriage leave. I was on this side of the House. It was very hard to actually be debating it when I think everybody in this House wanted to see something like that happen.”
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“If a business in Ireland has a turnover of €3 million and it has to bring its case through the courts, for example, the High Court, its legal fees will be in the hundreds of thousands. On foot of that, will the owner actually bother? Probably not. You need to win the case for your employees and business, so what do you do? You have been unfairly treated by a financial provider and do not know what to do. You cannot bring it to the Financial Services and Pensions Ombudsman because your turnover is €3.1 million. Now is the time to increase the threshold to €5 million rather than waiting until 2026 or beyond. The Financial Services and Pensions Ombudsman' office needs many more staff. I welcome the changes in the Bill to provide for the appointment of additional persons to act as deputy ombudsmen.”
“In other words, our case helped many businesses all around Ireland. I am delighted that it had that impact. No words I can use here today could vividly portray the anxiety we all felt. At each point when we thought we had won, there was an appeal. Even when we got to the High Court, there was an appeal. If I was to have brought the communication into this Chamber, I would have had to have brought in two Lever Arch files. Given that experience, while we have the opportunity to discuss this Bill, here are my thoughts on the changes and the changes I think we should bring in. In order to bring a complaint to the Financial Services and Pensions Ombudsman, your business needs to a turnover of €3 million or less. We can consider that one fact. This threshold was set 22 years ago. How can we possibly be using turnover figures from that time?”
“We needed to ensure that insurers were not just going to fob us off like they tried to do. As a side note, complaints to the ombudsman regarding insurance, as my colleague mentioned, rose by 26% between 2023 and 2024. We need to look at why so many complaints about insurance are coming in, with motor insurance being the highest. Getting back to our case, the Financial Services and Pensions Ombudsman said we had a case. We were delighted. That process started in April 2020 and ended four years later. It took four years to get through the ombudsman. It would take me all day to express to the Minister of State the anxiety and distress that we experienced during those four years, as well as the other businesses that we were trying to help. As it turned out, the ombudsman used us as a test case.”
“Unfortunately for us, we still had to pay our high rent and our bills, so we were desperate. As far as I was concerned, our policy showed that we were covered, so I called the Financial Services and Pensions Ombudsman. I felt my first phone call was very welcoming. I remember feeling safe. However, at this time, I was reading articles from the UK where its Financial Conduct Authority was bringing test cases through, which was not happening here. To my innocent mind, I thought this process with the ombudsman would last perhaps a few months. We did not have €1,000, never mind many thousands of euro, to pay legal fees to fight our case. Being able to work with and use the ombudsman's office was something we needed to be able to do and were glad to be able to avail of. We needed to fight for our business and all our employees.”
“I welcome the Minister of State. Our paths have crossed a few times. I harp on about insurance issues. He is great in that sphere. I welcome the opportunity to speak on this Bill as I feel I have first-hand experience of the ombudsman's office. I am here to stand up for businesses and for people who feel aggrieved about financial services providers or their insurers. I was in a position five years ago, practically to the day, where I had to contact the Financial Services and Pensions Ombudsman's office out of utter desperation. Covid had just happened and our business was closed. Like everyone else, I did not know what to do. I immediately read the business interruption part of my policy to see if I was covered. We are a small business in Navan and we employ more than 20 people. It was affecting us all.”
“These three asks involve the Minister for Justice, the Minister responsible for insurance, the Minister for Finance and the Minister for enterprise. I call for a cohesive approach to ensure motorists, business owners, homeowners, sports clubs and local community organisations can obtain fair insurance.”
“Our figures are still higher than those of many of our European counterparts, including our closest neighbour, the UK, and that is after the reductions of three years ago. To date, we have not seen the impact of the Government's substantial reforms from the past four years because insurance premiums are still not coming down and, in fact, have risen 17% since 2020. Insurance Ireland would lead you to believe this has all to do with inflation. I call today for three very important tasks to be completed. First, we should encourage less litigation and more claims through the Injuries Resolution Board. Second, we should not increase the personal injury awards. Third, we should demand that insurers reduce premiums based on the many reforms they in fact requested years ago and are now completed.”
“The Government needs to encourage people to process their claims through the Injuries Resolution Board because, if we continue to see cases brought through the litigation process, it will continue to have an adverse effect on businesses, which could result in businesses closing and people losing their jobs. The cost of insurance overheads for businesses and organisations is still a major problem. Today's report shows there has been a 17% increase from 2019 to 2023 in cases going through the litigation route. To add to that, the recommendation put before the Minister, Deputy O'Callaghan, to make an increase in respect of the personal injury guidelines, which commenced only in 2022, is a pure recipe for disaster.”
“Many of us will be aware of the publication today of the report of the national claims information database, NCID. The establishment of the NCID was one of the recommendations made by the cost of insurance working group, which was established in 2016 by the then Minister for Finance. Today's NCID liability report may surprise you. Why? It states the average legal cost is less than €1,000 for cases finalised through the injuries board but in excess of €23,000 once cases enter litigation. Even more surprising is that the award for claimants – what they get or their payout – was €23,000 whether they went through the injuries board or litigation.”
“We need to ask the Minister for Transport to consider other ways to provide more funding for better speed control measures in small villages, as we see in the rest of the country, to prevent fatalities. It is becoming a serious issue. For a village to be asking for this for three years is too much. The residents can see the issues and somebody will suffer a big accident.”
“There were ten people, including children, on the paths at the time. I cannot imagine what might have happened if the car had lost control and hit some of the people who were on the paths. For three years, residents in this particular village have been asking Meath County Council to put speed control measures into the village. I cannot blame Meath County Council for not doing so. This village has a population of 1,000 people. To put speed control measures into villages, you need to pass traffic surveys, which are generally done during the day when it is nice and bright. Drivers can see the people who are doing the surveys and slow down. The surveys are not done at weekends, on Sundays or at night time. In order for the council to get the money to put in speed control measures, it needs to pass a survey.”
“I concur with my colleagues. No abuser or rapist should ever be given any platform whatsoever. That is a matter we need to debate in a more thorough manner in the future. I raise a local issue that is relevant to every village and town in the country, that is, the dangerous issue of the speed of traffic and the potential for fatalities. There is a particular issue in Kilmessan village in County Meath. I will refer to a message I received while I was having a lovely St. Patrick's Day. The message stated that at 8.15 p.m. on St. Patrick's Day, my correspondent noticed a vehicle acting erratically. It sped through the village and was on both sides of the road, swerving from one side to the other. The driver conducted three handbrake manoeuvres through the village, leaving tyre marks on the road.”
“They say ageing is an extraordinary process where you become the person you always wanted to be. All of us honoured with representing people should ensure we do all we can so our ageing population can live as they want to. I love helping people access this type of funding. In County Meath, €3.5 million was allocated to the housing adaptation grant last year and I reckon the council could have done with twice as much. As I said, I am going to be short and sweet and ask that we allocate a much higher amount to housing adaptation for our older people. Let them live where they are most comfortable.”
“I will take just a minute and focus on one thing. I fully support this motion, which is very close to all our hearts. A year ago yesterday we lost our dad, who was the most beautiful man. My dad was sick for many years with his heart and hip problems and with cancer but he overcame it all and lived to just short of 88. He loved collecting his pension, going to choir and he loved life. However, the many illnesses he suffered made him less agile, along with 60 years of standing at a bench making furniture, which was a job he absolutely loved. The housing adaptation grant was a game-changer in my dad's life and in all our lives. We had put a bedroom downstairs in the house but he did not have close access to a shower or bathroom and the housing adaptation grant sorted that out.”
“Trust me, their well-being will be much better for it. To all my colleagues, whenever you find yourself doubting yourselves, remember how far you can go and how far you have come. Remember everything that you have faced, all the battles you have won and all the fears you have overcome. Sometimes you forget that you are awesome and this is simple a reminder.”
“and "Your kids are very young for you to be in politics?"? Yesterday, I got a spokesperson's role. I was delighted with myself. I got a text from a close friend, who I know meant well, but it read, "Delighted for you, make sure you still give time to your kids." While I was canvassing for the local elections, one person asked me who was minding my kids while I was canvassing. I hate that I am about to say this, because I do not want to separate us women from men, but would any of these people have asked the same question to men? What I am putting forward for women's health is that we simply support women to be working mammies, if that is what they choose to be, do not judge them for it, try not to worry about their children, and instead tell them we are proud of them and we would imagine their kids are too.”
“I recognise that it is a priority issue in the programme for Government, which I welcome. That being said, I will add to that, taking a holistic approach to women's health in general. I am a mother to two beautiful girls. I became a mammy much later in life. I had my first daughter at 39 and my second at 40. Let us just say, it took me a while to get there with some medical help and losses. I share Senator Nicole Ryan's feelings there, but I am truly blessed. I like to think that I could be a role model for my girls, and it is one of the reasons I decided to run for politics. We all know it is not easy, particularly for women, to enter politics. Does the Minister know the questions I face on a daily basis? They are: "Who is looking after your kids while you are here? Are your kids missing you?”
“I thank the Minister for coming in. No doubt she will do a fantastic job. She already is doing so. There are many issues on women's health that have been brought up by all my esteemed colleagues here and I concur with many of them. Knowing today was coming up, I spoke to a female doctor friend and I asked her what we can do in government to support women's health. I was surprised by the answer given. The answer simply was to support women, especially younger women, to work by providing childcare. I know it is not the Minister's brief but she will understand in a second. This, in turn, will change their health for the better. Access to childcare supports women to work, to exercise, to meet friends, to join groups and to play mothers and others football. It allows them to help their overall health by providing a means to do so.”
“I ask the Department of Education to consider a transport manager to look after this. It is worth noting that these schools are not looking for their own transport managers but rather one who could work on behalf of a few schools. Imagine taking this stress away each morning from the people whose goal it is to teach people in the school rather than look after transport. It would be transformational.”
“It is left up to the school to be, more or less, the employer of the bus escorts. For this, they get 5% of the bus escorts' wages to cover administrative costs. However, it way more than that. Special schools are at capacity. The role is challenging and managing bus escorts is just adding to a pot that is about to boil over. I ask the Department of Education to look at this situation from a fresh perspective. I am not sure if people realise that the management of the school is stretched enough. In cases such as St. Ultan's school, this means looking after 24 extra staff who are not technically part of their work remit. I also spoke to staff at another fabulous school in Navan, St. Mary's Special School, in Johnstown. This school manages 21 buses and 24 bus escorts.”
“The principal and vice principal have to stand in the yard to help get the children off the buses and direct them to where they need to go. They may also have to arrange for them to have a little run around after being on a bus for sometimes more than an hour. Members will appreciate that this is quite overwhelming for some children. The rest of the children are sent off to their classes to begin their day's work. Members may be thinking what is the issue here. Very often, bus escorts are unavoidably sick, they have to take their holidays, or they may have an unexpected situation, just like most employees in any job. When they are unwell, the calls to the schools will start from 5.30 a.m. It is up to the school principal to sort this out, along with everything else, and as Members can appreciate this can be very difficult.”
“I want to discuss the issue of bus escorts and transport police. I am on the board of an amazing special school in Navan, County Meath, called St. Ultan's. It was a big eye opener for me to see the work done there by all the staff. From 8.30 a.m. to 9 a.m. the school is a hive of activity. However, there is one area that I did not understand until I began to work with the school. This is the issue of transport to and from the school, and indeed to most special schools, and the difficulties associated with this. Some 24 buses with vulnerable children arrive from all over County Meath and in some cases from Dublin all at the same time. The children are escorted by bus escorts, who do an incredible job. These schoolyards like the one I work with are packed with buses, bus escorts, children, parents and staff.”
“Three times a year, craters open up on the road. The council comes out and fills these large potholes, but it is obvious to me that rural roads need greater funding and attention. Right now, most of our reporting on roads is done from councillors and public to the council, but perhaps we need a roads safety manager whose job it is to identify roads with problems and link in with the engineers. I am sure we will be delighted to set up such a pilot scheme in Meath. I thank the Minister of State for attending and look forward to hearing his thoughts on all these matters.”
“-----and we need people to stand safely while waiting for the bus. I encourage the Minister of State to seek extra funding for the provision of bus stops, particularly in smaller villages in Meath West. I wish to discuss our roads. I thank the Minister and Department of Transport for the €26 million that they recently provided to Meath for regional and local roads. However, it seems that we have a significant problem with potholes. In 2024 alone, Meath County Council paid out €55,000 in compensation for cars because of potholes, an increase of €13,000 on the previous year. What is even more concerning is that we paid out €530,000 for public liability claims in 2023. There were 290 claims, of which 270 were for potholes and footpaths. The road I have been living on for approximately 15 years has never been resurfaced in that time.”
“With the average bus shelter costing approximately €30,000, this creates 16 shelters for the entire county. Remember that we have the most commuters of any county outside of Dublin. We are getting just €500,000 for bus stops. If we are encouraging people to use public transport, we need to have covered shelters in as many places as possible-----”
“Will he assure us that when it is completed, it will be within budget? If he can give me those answers, thousands of people in Meath will be very happy today. The next issue I will mention is that of fairer fares, which my Fianna Fáil colleagues mentioned previously. I was glad the Minister, Deputy O'Brien, said he was hoping to see it sped up. We need more than hoping to see it sped up. We were promised this would be done by the end of this first quarter and I hope we will see it done. My colleague in Meath East, Councillor Sharon Tolan, has put a lot of work into this and I would like to see it happen as soon as possible. My next topic is the bus stops. In Meath, we get €500,000 a year to construct bus stops. That is €500,000 for the whole county.”
“This project was promised 20 years ago and many people bought their homes in Navan in good faith, expecting a train line. Then nothing. Moving forward from the 1850s when we actually had a train line in Navan to now, it is only 175 years later and we learn we are going to get the train. Consultants have been appointed and we are on our way - choo-choo. I was informed at a meeting with Iarnród Éireann that a route will be identified by the end of this year and decided upon by next year, with public consultation as part of the process. However, I feel like I am watching a kettle that is never going to boil. Such is the frustration of people in Meath that many of them do not think it will ever actually happen. Can we blame them, in fairness? Will the Minister of State guarantee that this project will be completed?”
“This is to get in work in Dublin. Never mind that the bus also has to stop at Dalgan Park and Garlow Cross before it sets off on its journey to Dublin. I have no doubt it had to leave people behind. Does the Minister of State know that the people of Meath spend more time commuting to Dublin than those in any other county in Ireland? We have buses at capacity at peak times, we have the M3, which is basically a carpark at Blanchardstown in the mornings, and yet we have over 3,500 people per day leaving Navan, never mind all the other towns, to get to Dublin to work. This does not include the people leaving for hospital appointments, college or university. We are desperate for this rail line in Navan. When the public consultation was released on this two years ago, over 4,000 responses were sent in, such is the want for this in our county.”
“It is great to speak today on the Private Members' motion and I thank my colleagues in Fine Gael for tabling it. I have four topics to speak on and I will be quick. When a representative of the Department of Transport is in the Chamber, it is too important not to cover as much as possible. I represent County Meath. My fellow Senators will never guess what I want to talk about relating to County Meath. What is the elephant in the room? It is the Navan rail line. I bet they have not heard that one before. County Meath had a population of 230,000 people according to the most recent census, carried out in 2022. I have no doubt the current figure is way more than that. Only this morning, my sister-in-law texted me from the bus she got at 5.30 a.m. from Navan. It was full by 5.40 a.m. at the Johnstown stop, which is just outside Navan.”
“I note the Minister’s comment that once the Defamation (Amendment) Bill 2024 is enacted "the provisions of the Bill dealing with retail defamation will provide for balancing of the rights of retailers and consumers, promote good practice among retailers and allow retailers to deal effectively with unwarranted claims". I urge the Minister to stop these cases at source so they do not cause retailers thousands in legal fees. Were we to work out how many defamation cases there are in Ireland by cost, it would add up to about €70 million. Small businesses just cannot afford that.”
“Another issue is people’s fear of being sued for defamation if they approach someone suspected of having stolen goods from the premises. Between 2009 to 2022, Ireland had more defamation cases than the UK, a jurisdiction with 12 times Ireland’s population. Businesses are playing their part and now the Department of Justice needs to play its part. What plans are there to protect businesses and their employees from the explosion of retail crime? How can we help communities ravaged by antisocial behaviour? When will Meath get more gardaí? I do not mean gardaí to fill retirements but an increase.”
“These were teenage boys who thought it was hilarious to push one person against another like dominoes with the last person pushing my daughter to the ground. Thankfully, she was not injured physically but it did take a while to get her back out shopping again. I reported it to the centre and the response was to say it was sorry it had happened and there was nothing it could do because they would just come back the next day. Then I reported it to the Garda. The individual garda was very helpful but also advised there was no point in brining it back again because it could not be brought further, so we just sucked it up like everyone in our community does every day. People are worried about getting out of their cars at supermarkets. If you cannot shop in peace without harassment, what does the future hold?”
“Why not make them pay for what they have stolen? Should people who regularly offend only be allowed free legal aid on, say, three court appearances and not the sky is the limit? My daughter was eight when she was pushed to the ground when out shopping for her first little handbag. These were teenage boys who thought it was hilarious to push one person against the other. Excuse me-----”
“Another shop owner said that they live in constant fear of their staff being injured. That is a very sad reality. I hear repeatedly that the issue is not Garda support but the lack of gardaí to deal with these issues and the lack of punishment of offenders. Shops feel they report an issue and the following day they see the person on the street again, practically laughing at them. Seven days ago, the Minister, Deputy O’Callaghan said "I don't want to see our prisons clogged up with people who are in there for ... crimes of shoplifting". If that is the case, what is he going to do about it? Would it help if ASBOs were administered at sergeant level rather than superintendent level? Should there be stiffer fines for people who steal? What about barring orders preventing someone from being able to re-enter a store?”
“The major issues that I am being informed of are as follows: significant increase in shoplifting and retail crime, particularly high value items; growing aggression and violence towards staff with little fear of consequences with the gardaí, which is very concerning; and notable increases in youth involvement in theft, often in groups influenced by social media trends. Security measures are proving less effective as criminals act openly and without fear. Repeat offenders are a real problem. Many come back on the same day to rob again. I spoke to one small shop in Navan. It must be open around 40 years. It is a fabulous family business. They have always run the shop with one member of staff but now require two. Unfortunately, it is not because they are extra busy selling lots of clothes but to keep each other safe.”
“On a daily basis we see issues of antisocial behaviour on our streets, and it is of massive concern, especially to the people of Meath. I will move on to businesses and what they face. According to a survey by Retail Excellence Ireland, 20% of retailers experience crime on a daily basis and 41% on a weekly basis. Approximately 82% of this crime is shoplifting. However, what scares me even more is that 60% of these outlets reported abuse of their staff. In fact, one store told me of how one of their staff members was spat at in the face. Another industry representative body, RGDATA, reported that 90% of its retailers were victims of crime in the previous 12 months.”
“I thank the Cathaoirleach for the opportunity to speak. There are many challenges in the Department of Justice. I am really looking forward to seeing the positive changes the Minister can make. My area is Meath West, which includes great towns like Navan, Trim, Enfield and Oldcastle and villages like Kilmessan, Ballivor, Longwood and Rathmolyon. Speaking to the constituents at the doors - believe me, I knocked on a lot of doors over the past year, as I have run in three elections – they are extremely worried about safety within their community. They are worried about walking down their streets, not only at night-time, but during the day too. One man I spoke to was coming out of a bank in Navan where he was jumped on at 3 p.m. in the day and attacked.”
“I worry about the impact this increase would have on the Personal Injuries Resolution Board, PIRB, if general damages are to be reviewed and potentially increased every three years. Will this leave us in a position where people are going to hang on? It has taken the injuries board two and a half years to get to a resolution, so are people wait the extra six months to try to get it increased? We cannot let this happen. I am beginning to fear for businesses such as play centres where our children can play. Businesses have had to take on so many increased costs over recent years. A few years ago, insurance was the main issue. Now, everything is an issue when it comes to the increased costs of doing business. We do not need to add this 17% on to businesses. Allow them to be in business. Allow employees to stay in business.”
“I thank Retail Excellence Ireland for nominating me. I will be the voice for business, jobs and communities, as well as all the other issues that I am passionate about. I ask the Leader to request that the Minister for Justice be invited here to discuss the personal injury guidelines. These came into effect in March 2021 and we are already looking at increasing them by up to 17%, less than four years later. We have not even seen the impact they have already had. I speak from experience of nearly losing my own business over insurance. I speak for the likes of play centres, pet farms and any business that has anything to do with fun, play and risk. This is a significant concern.”
“I congratulate the Cathaoirleach and wish him an energetic and peaceful term. I also congratulate my colleague, Senator Kyne, who I know will be fair and wise. I am honoured to be elected to the Twenty-seventh Seanad. My colleague, Senator Ahearn, told me yesterday to take it all in and I am certainly doing that. I take my seat here as the greatest privilege. I thank my party, Fine Gael, my husband, Finbarr, and my daughters, Elle-J and Savannah, my friends who have supported me, my mam and dad, looking down from heaven, and all who have helped me over the last two years to get here. I am following in the great footsteps of many who treasured this position. I can assure the people of Meath West of my full commitment to this role and I look forward to the next few years of working with everyone.”