Mickey Brady
Newry and Armagh · Sinn Féin · Northern Ireland
“I thank the Minister for his answer. Given that the show identified issues of police integrity, will the Minister now publicly encourage former and current members of the PSNI/RUC to cooperate fully with the Police Ombudsman and the historical investigations unit?”
“No, I will not. I absolutely refute that. I went in with an open mind, as did my party members, associates and comrades, so they can dress it up whatever they want. We went in expecting to hear evidence and expecting to make a decision based on the clear and unequivocal evidence that was given.”
“He was aware of the time spent on the inquiry by the Committee and departmental officials and looked forward to dealing with other issues under his remit. I am glad to hear that. He lamented that the time had not been spent on other important issues. I think that the Committee did as well, but as I said previously, this had to be done.”
“<BR /> <BR />Following consideration of the Committee's draft report, the DUP members of the Committee agreed that it did not in any way reflect their views, and, that being so, a minority report was produced and included in the appendices to the Committee report.”
“Mr Brimstone suffered from selective memory losses all the time. One of the arguments put forward was, "Well, her vote wouldn't have affected the board anyhow, so why would we have said this and that to her?" Why bother ringing her in the first place if her vote did not affect it?”
“As somebody who was involved with his own election campaign, I did not give it much thought. However, from Mr Campbell's point of view, it is my understanding that you probably wanted the report published the week before.”
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“I thank the Minister for her answer. When will all not-spots be connected? Go raibh maith agat.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. I thank the Minister for his answers so far. He has answered most of my question; I was going to ask him whether he has restricted weed spraying and grass cutting in North Down and, indeed, in other constituencies.”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. Given that the show identified issues of police integrity, will the Minister now publicly encourage former and current members of the PSNI/RUC to cooperate fully with the Police Ombudsman and the historical investigations unit?”
“<BR /> <BR />If there is one thing that we can agree on, it is perhaps that the glaring gap in the current procedures for holding Ministers to account needs to be addressed. That is in the recommendations of the Committee's report. As the Chair said, there are lessons to be learned from this inquiry for individuals, Departments and our political institutions. We should all be big enough to recognise that and strive to put that learning into practice. I ask the House to support the motion.”
“Other Members have acknowledged the efforts of the Committee to conduct an objective, evidence-based inquiry and agreed with the findings of the report. <BR /> <BR />For many, the division of opinion will not be surprising. In fact, it may just reinforce the negative perceptions that the public have of our political system. I dare say that the wider public will not be divided on the need for holders of public office to be accountable for their actions, and that is currently sorely lacking for Ministers, at least when allegations are made in the context of the ministerial code of conduct. As I said, it is my view that the Minister and, indeed, the special adviser should have gone a long time before they did.”
“Mr Brimstone suffered from selective memory losses all the time. One of the arguments put forward was, "Well, her vote wouldn't have affected the board anyhow, so why would we have said this and that to her?" Why bother ringing her in the first place if her vote did not affect it? They must have had some inclination that it was going to have some effect. Otherwise, it would have been a waste of time to make that infamous phone call. <BR /> <BR />Today's debate has been robust. Some Members have chosen to defend the former Minister — strangely enough — and the special adviser Mr Brimstone. Mr Brimstone has gone on to fresh fields and greater things now, so I presume that he will not be too worried about the outcome of this, although he should be, and will disparage the report and dismiss the evidence.”
“She was attacked constantly by Sammy Wilson in particular, and by Mr Campbell. It was an absolute disgrace, and I would hate to think what would have happened to her if she had not been a member of the DUP. I imagine that she would have fared a lot worse.”
“He was aware of the time spent on the inquiry by the Committee and departmental officials and looked forward to dealing with other issues under his remit. I am glad to hear that. He lamented that the time had not been spent on other important issues. I think that the Committee did as well, but as I said previously, this had to be done. He indicated that he would provide a written response to the Committee within eight weeks. He felt that the report lacked substance and he reminded Members that he would focus on working with the Committee to fulfil his statutory role. He ended by saying that he trusted that this report would conclude matters. <BR /> <BR />To address the issues as a Sinn Féin member of the Committee, my view is that the DUP has circled its wagons. Jenny Palmer came across as a very credible woman of integrity.”
“Mr Campbell should reflect long and hard on raising that issue, because it was absolutely disgraceful. <BR /> <BR />Mr Campbell went on to refer specifically to Mr Allister's role in securing, as I have said, a position on the Social Development Committee, and he referred to the severe under-representation of the Protestant community in the Housing Executive. I have been on the Committee since 2007, when Mr Campbell was its initial Chair, and he seems obsessed with the make-up of the Housing Executive staff. It is my understanding that people get jobs on merit, not because of their religion or political beliefs. Mr Campbell needs to reflect on that as well. <BR /> <BR />The Minister asked what had happened in the two years since the first debate in September 2014.”
“As somebody who was involved with his own election campaign, I did not give it much thought. However, from Mr Campbell's point of view, it is my understanding that you probably wanted the report published the week before. <BR /> <BR />Mr Campbell criticised the BBC for not attending the Committee and for its lack of investigation into other companies. He said that spurious claims were made in the programme and during the Committee's consideration. He referred specifically to Mr Allister's role in securing a position on the Social Development Committee through discussion with Mr McClarty. As someone who knew Mr McClarty and regarded him as an absolute gentleman and of high integrity, I think that it is an absolute disgrace for the name of someone deceased to be brought into this contentious debate.”
“I thank the Member for his intervention —”
“He stated that the commercial interests of Red Sky and the political interests of the DUP coalesced. He was of the view that the DUP treatment of Mrs Palmer was disgraceful and said that Mrs Palmer's integrity stood above this. He noted that the behaviour of Mr McCausland and Mr Brimstone at Committee was totally unhelpful, and that Mr Brimstone's treatment of Jenny Palmer was beyond description. He said that Mr Brimstone should hang his head in shame. <BR /> <BR />Gregory Campbell referred to the political nature of the report and highlighted the leaked report as evidence of this. He noted the attempts to lambaste Red Sky but not the sectarian attacks on the organisation.”
“<BR /> <BR />Mr McCausland disagreed with everything in the report, surprisingly. He just thought it was a waste of over 1,000 pages. He talked about everything being the fault of everybody else but him. It was all to do with the Housing Executive, the chair of the Housing Executive and everybody else — Uncle Tom Cobley and all — but had absolutely nothing to do with him. As Minister, he was supposed to stop the buck, but unfortunately he created most of it. <BR /> <BR />Mr Allister noted that, even at this stage, there was no recognition of wrongdoing by Mr McCausland. He referred to this as the worst abuse of power under devolution. He said that the minute of the 27 June 2011 meeting was the key piece of evidence, in particular its reference to the new company, a reconstituted Red Sky.”
“Alban Maginness said that there was a series of smoking guns in relation to Mr McCausland and Red Sky. He said that the BBC should have given oral evidence. He noted that the Minister attended the meeting on 27 June 2011 against the advice of officials and that the Committee concluded that to be inappropriate. He also noted, about this particular meeting, that the Minister referred the matter to the Housing Executive, despite it being an operational matter. Mr Maginness agreed with the Committee that, had the Housing Executive board agreed with the Minister, this would have favoured a private organisation and impeded proper competition. He said that the Minister's actions stood in contrast to those of previous Ministers Attwood and Ritchie, but then you would expect Mr Maginness to say that.”
“I accept your ruling, a Cheann Comhairle. <BR /> <BR />Roy Beggs also believes that Mr McCausland has dragged the Housing Executive and the Assembly through the mud. He commended the report to the Assembly. <BR /> <BR />Ross Hussey noted that he had taken part in the 'Spotlight' programme and had been appalled at the evidence presented to him by the BBC. He said that Mrs Palmer's honesty had been rewarded with disciplinary action. He said that the minority report was a joke.”
“He commented that key players in the DUP were more wedded to the party line than they were to the people they represent.”
“He remarked on witness evidence from senior officials that they had not encountered such ministerial interventions in their careers. He referred to the DUP circling the wagons. It has already done that. As I said, the special adviser has been moved into the office of the First Minister as, I presume, some sort of reward. Roy Beggs also emphasised that the gap in existing mechanisms for the accountability of Ministers must be addressed. <BR /> <BR />Stewart Dickson suggested that the debate could leave the institutions in a perilous state, given the position of the DUP in the report's findings. He applauded the actions of Mrs Palmer and remarked on her integrity as a witness. He placed that in contrast to the actions of the former Minister and special adviser.”
“In showing integrity, Mrs Palmer had been vilified and was vilified by her party members. In Mrs Kelly's view, Paula Bradley has not taken an objective position, despite the inquiry being evidence-based, and the DUP members have put the party first. I would have been surprised if they had taken an objective position. Mrs Kelly said that the Assembly owed the BBC a debt of gratitude for exposing the actions of the Minister and special adviser on 'Spotlight', and she hoped that the report's recommendations were implemented to ensure proper accountability. <BR /> <BR />Roy Beggs referred to Mr McCausland not following the advice of his officials and meeting some of the former Red Sky management team to discuss Housing Executive contractual matters.”
“I absolutely refute any suggestion that, in our case, that was the case. She went on, surprisingly, to refer to her support for the minority report. She said that the former Minister, in taking the action that he did, was attempting to achieve the best outcome for Housing Executive tenants and that his action was based on the advice available to him at the time. Mr McCausland, apparently, is a born altruist for taking that view. <BR /> <BR />On the other hand, Dolores Kelly had a different opinion. She believes that few people came out of this in a good light, with the notable exception of Jenny Palmer, who was castigated by her own party members. She was absolutely castigated. At one stage, Sammy Wilson did all but call her a liar, which, in the circumstances, is absolutely reprehensible.”
“No, I will not. I absolutely refute that. I went in with an open mind, as did my party members, associates and comrades, so they can dress it up whatever they want. We went in expecting to hear evidence and expecting to make a decision based on the clear and unequivocal evidence that was given. As I said, I contend that the process that the Committee followed during phase 3 of the inquiry and the production of a minority report disaffirms any claim of bias. <BR /> <BR />I do not intend to rehearse everything that Members said, but I will address some key points. Paula Bradley noted that two years of the Committee's time could have been better spent on other matters. I think that most people would agree with that, but it had to be done; it is as simple as that. She believes that certain members, in effect, had already made up their mind.”
“<BR /> <BR />Following consideration of the Committee's draft report, the DUP members of the Committee agreed that it did not in any way reflect their views, and, that being so, a minority report was produced and included in the appendices to the Committee report. I note that Members who disagree with the Committee position have largely drawn on the content of the minority report today. I contend that the process that the Committee followed during phase 3 of the inquiry and the production of a minority report to capture opposing views clearly disaffirms any claim of bias having played a part in how the inquiry has been conducted, concluded or reported on by the Committee. Apparently, some DUP Members are psychics: they could tell me how I felt before the inquiry started, how I felt during it and how I felt at the end.”
“It is my view that, in any other circumstance, the Minister should have gone a long time before he did — and his special adviser. It is interesting to note that, while the DUP members were happy to castigate one of their own — Jenny Palmer, who came across as an extremely reliable, believable and credible witness — the special adviser has now, I believe, been rewarded with a move to the First Minister's office. The First Minister should have dealt a long time ago with Mr McCausland, who eventually went — maybe the light eventually dawned — and the special adviser. I just wanted to make that point.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. On behalf of the Chair and me, I thank the Committee staff, who had an extremely difficult job. In fact, they ended up taking personal abuse, which is absolutely reprehensible. <BR /> <BR />I thank all those who participated in the debate. It is important to note that, throughout the inquiry, there was a painstaking and detailed process of evidence gathering and a careful consideration of different views around the Committee table. The Committee has drawn a number of conclusions throughout the phase 3 report. On the key issue of whether the Minister acted inappropriately, on the basis of the evidence that it received the Committee concluded that he did. The Committee also concluded that the Minister's actions were politically motivated.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. The Chair has arrived.”
“Gullion has been a tourism success story, and the inclusion of the names of two areas of outstanding beauty was something that the new council hoped to build on. Obviously, the Mournes are another area of outstanding natural beauty, and they have been included. However, the exclusion of an entire region of the new council area has detached and isolated many who day and daily work to ensure its well-being and sustainability.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Giant's Lair in Slieve Gullion Forest Park is a very successful project that has attracted people not only from the surrounding area but from all over Ireland and from abroad. We hope that the council will recognise the depth of feeling on the issue, because those who live and work in the area have invested in and promoted it, and they are rightly angry that south Armagh has once again been cast aside.”
“The decision of the SDLP and unionists to block any inclusion of Gullion or south Armagh in the name of the new council is and was a deliberate snub to the people of the entire area. <BR /> <BR />South Armagh is an area with incredible tourism potential, and, at a time when we are trying to raise its profile, this double blow dealt by the SDLP — funding has also been taken off the project that deals with the area of outstanding natural beauty — has caused a serious backlash. Many local businesses, community and voluntary groups and individual residents have contacted me and my colleagues to register their anger at this decision in the strongest possible terms. We are calling on the council to reconsider its name and introduce something more reflective of the entire region.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. The petition that I am going to present has been signed by the local community and the Crossmaglen and South Armagh Chamber of Commerce. A petition has also been handed over to the CEO of Newry, Mourne and Down District Council, Liam Hannaway, which was accompanied by DVDs made by the BBC highlighting the unique cultural significance of the area. <BR /> <BR />It is very important that the area is recognised as a unique and important part of the new council area. It is simply unacceptable that south Armagh has been left out of the new council's name. As a distinct cultural region, steeped in the history and folklore of Ireland, it forms an essential part of the identity of the new council.”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. What consideration has he given to stopping the ongoing sell-off of publicly owned housing?”
“Will the Member give way and I will explain? The remarks I made were taken totally out of context. When asked the question, I said, "All policies can be reviewed" — "all policies", not "a policy". I wish that people would stop misquoting me because it suits their purposes.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. I thank the Minister for her answers so far. What level of investment in superfast broadband is provided in Newry and Armagh?”
“Will the Member consider that there are many cases of people who should be compensated who are not currently provided for under the law?”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. Will he also join with me in calling on the PSNI and an Garda Síochána to step up their activities against these criminal gangs in order to bring them to justice and ensure that we do not see a repeat of the injuries received by Mr McCabe? Go raibh maith agat.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. How can DCAL continue to support and assist those boxing clubs that will not receive funding in this phase of the programme?”
“I thank the Member for her answer. Our party's position is that we hope that cuts will not necessarily target agency staff, who may not have the protection of permanent staff. What has the Commission done to protect jobs, including agency staff? Go raibh maith agat.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Phríomh-LeasCheann Comhairle. I thank the Minister for her answers so far. How will she ensure that real community benefits are an integral part of this project?”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Phríomh-LeasCheann Comhairle. Will the Minister outline if and how his Department will continue to engage with local government following the transfer of neighbourhood renewal policy and funding?”
“On a point of order, Mr Speaker. Mr Bradley made personal references that I absolutely refute. In 1986, when the Welfare Rights Centre in Newry was looking for funding, the DUP, Sinn Féin and independents all gave their support. I have a recorded vote to show that the SDLP refused.”
“Well, we are all entitled to our opinion. <BR /> <BR />After it was made, the complaint was investigated by the council which, after much deliberation, found that the name should be retained. Since then, there has been a very focused and nasty campaign to demonise the area and its community. <BR /> <BR />The Equality Commission believes that the council may have failed to comply with its undertaking, at paragraph 1.3 of its equality scheme, to discharge its statutory duties as set out in paragraphs 1.1 and 1.2. We have asked for the evidence that brought the Equality Commission to that view, and we are still waiting for it. It has not come back to us. Whatever the Equality Commission has or has not done, it has not answered the relevant and pertinent questions.”
“What I actually said was that the park was named in 2001 under the tutelage of a council dominated by unionists and the SDLP.”
“No, I will not. I want to finish, and I have a few things to say. <BR /> <BR />In the seven-year period from the naming of the park in 2001 until 2008, no unionist councillors, SDLP councillors or members of the public raised any concerns or complaints about the decision.”
“Council procedure was fully followed, and surveys taken by the council indicated clear support for naming the park after Raymond McCreesh.”
“I thank Mr Kennedy for that lesson in scripture, but I was not accusing him of bearing false witness. I said that it took from 2001 to 2008 for an objection to be lodged with the council. As far as Sinn Féin is concerned, our position on this issue has been consistent. We and the vast majority of people from the area believe that the name of Raymond McCreesh Park should remain unchanged. I reiterate that the park was named in 2001 under the tutelage of a council dominated by unionists and the SDLP.”
“In 2001, the council agreed to the naming of the play park and erected its own bilingual signs. No complaint regarding the decision was received by the council between 2001 and 2008, which is a significant factor in the consideration of the issue. I am sure that Mr Kennedy objected vehemently to it, but it took seven years for the Orange Order to come to the conclusion that it objected to Raymond McCreesh Park and that it was some sort of anathema to them. It ill behoves people to make excuses now and turn round and say —”
“The council-maintained play facility did not have a name before. I reiterate that: as I said, I grew up within spitting distance of it, and it never had a name. It is a play facility in the Barcroft/Ballybot area of Newry. The name of Raymond McCreesh Park came from within that community in 2001 on the twentieth anniversary of his death. Evidence of support for the proposition in the form of a community survey was presented to the council. The council, in accordance with its policy at that time, conducted its own survey and found 84% support in the Barcroft/Ballybot community for the naming of the play park after Raymond McCreesh, a resident of the council district, who died on hunger strike in 1981.”
“Apologies, a Cheann Comhairle, but I will not take an intervention from a lady who went on a rant against Sinn Féin yesterday and could not even express concern for someone who was seriously injured in south Armagh.”
“— who went on a rant against Sinn Féin yesterday —”
“No, the Member will not give way to somebody —”
“— on the SpAd Bill. Just get over it and get on with it. You have been all over the place on anything that has happened recently. <BR /> <BR />I will put into context what else happened with the play park —”
“You could elect Tom Elliott as your leader and support his Bill. You would not need any excuses. You certainly jumped to Mr Allister's dance —”