Brenda Hale
Lagan Valley · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“There has been a further £170 million allocated to support covenant commitments since 2011, and, to date, as Doug has said, Northern Ireland has received £450,000 for combat stress and £60,000 for the Somme Nursing Home.”
“Mark Lancaster went on to say clearly that they needed to do better and that this will be his focus in the coming year. I look forward to that end result and his active support. I visit my constituents in prison. I visit them in hospital when they have attempted suicide.”
“I welcome the opportunity to speak on the motion. However, before I begin, I must declare my many interests. First, I am an army widow and receive an HM Forces pension. I am an ambassador for the ABF — the soldiers' charity — and a member of the community that we are debating today.”
“We know that there is an open invitation for the Northern Ireland Executive to join that reference group, and, in fact, in October this year, when I spoke on 'Talkback' about this particular issue, my party leader, Arlene Foster, stated her support for me to be appointed to the group.”
“It was at my invitation that Lord Ashcroft's transition review team came to Northern Ireland. It met Ministers, senior personnel at 38 Brigade and representatives of the military charity sector. In his second follow-up report, published in November 2016, reference is made to Northern Ireland and the failings of the Armed Forces Covenant.”
“We must not lose sight of the fact that the armed forces community is tri-service and multi-cap badged, and it comes from every section of our communities.”
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“I thank the First Minister for his answers so far. First Minister, you talked about how childcare places should be flexible and suit working parents. How many childcare places do you hope to create under the framework?”
“While we need to identify areas of cooperation between our Departments and the Commission, it should be noted that areas of divergence in approach also exist. The drive for greater monetary and economic union is not in our interests. In the agricultural and fisheries industries, we need to ensure that our farmers and fishermen respectively get the best deal. It is important that we hold DARD to account and ensure that it works with other Departments to safeguard these important industries. <BR /> <BR />Finally, we broadly welcome the report and hope that greater collaboration on European issues across the Executive will be established. I hope that we will see a positive engagement in Europe leading to a greater drawdown of funding beyond the inroads that we have already made.”
“That should be the priority for all our Departments.”
“That is why the report and the ongoing work of all the Committees in scrutinising European priorities are important. <BR /> <BR />We need to identify areas where our policy and the policy of the Commission intersect and build upon those synergies. For instance, our Delivering Social Change (DSC) agenda has a clear linkage to the social investment package. The Commission’s social investment package recommends that investment be made in children and young people and in eliminating poverty, but DSC has worked across Departments and they have worked together. If we are to make inroads to develop our European priorities, we must do the same. <BR /> <BR />A vast knowledge bank exists in Europe. We need to ensure that we are drawing down from that knowledge bank and also feeding into Europe our experiences here in Northern Ireland.”
“I welcome the opportunity to say a few words on the priorities for European scrutiny. President Juncker’s agenda in promoting jobs, growth and investment is to be welcomed, particularly given the emphasis that the Executive have placed on those areas in our Programme for Government. It is clear that, in scrutinising European priorities across Departments, we must examine how we are working to bring greater investment to Northern Ireland from Europe. <BR /> <BR />For too long, Departments have been working in a silo mentality. The consequence has been that some Departments have worked well and diligently, using Europe and the potential of competitive funding for the benefit of our economy, while others have had a very hands-off approach.”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. You walked right into my supplementary, so I thank you for that, Minister. You said that it is the quality of teaching that matters most, not the class size. Given what you have said, what should the pupil:teacher ratio be in a Key Stage 2 class, considering that modern classrooms have a smaller square footage?”
“I thank the Minister for her answer. I know that trained enablers are planning to visit up to 2,000 households this coming year, but is the Minister aware at the minute, before the data is available, whether there are areas where MARA is not being accessed fully or where take-up is very low?”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. Lisburn welcomes the investment that has gone into it. What impact does the Minister expect that investment to have on the city centre when it is eventually completed and what are the expected outcomes for the scheme?”
“Minister, what are you going to do about it?”
“Minister, you will be aware that I have been working with Plastec and its managing director, Thomas Hawthorne, and Avodah Renewable Energies and its owner, Alistair Dickson, who are investing significantly within Lagan Valley. However, they are being obstructed by NIE through a failure to deliver grid connection, which they already paid tens of thousands of pounds for over 18 months ago, and a regulator who appears to be powerless to intervene, and, indeed, said only last week that they could do nothing about it.”
“Deputy First Minister, you anticipated part of my supplementary question. Do you agree that the sooner we have the devolution of corporation tax and know the rate at which it will be set, the better it will be for Invest NI and the Executive to attract more jobs to Northern Ireland?”
“I thank the First Minister for his statement to the House this afternoon. You reiterated that no functions are being done away with and no policies are being terminated, so do you expect financial savings when the changes take place?”
“I thank the Minister for giving way. You just mentioned the figures and talked about how the other new schools had to have additional classrooms. However, given that a mobile classroom costs £200,000 and the pilings will cost just under £65,000 at this stage, do you not think that it makes more sense to put the pilings in now and save £140,000?”
“Minister, it is time for you to step in and make the correct decision that meets the long-term needs of Dromore Central Primary School. The best way that makes long-term financial sense is to order the piling to be done while the present construction is under way and to save moneys in the long term to the public purse. Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker and, hopefully, thank you, Minister.”
“The sensible suggestion has been to save money now by putting in the additional pilings that would allow for future building works and extensions as and when the school has the required numbers to facilitate the additional classrooms. Minister, it is very apparent that your officials and senior representatives from the board have been so busy saying, "No, no, no" that they have not even looked for a way to say yes. I understand that the school finances were due to finish in the red for this financial year, but I am hopeful that the school and the principal have managed this issue and will finish the financial year in surplus. I am sure that the board and the Minister will be watching to see how prudent and responsible Mrs Allen has been in managing her inherited financial projection.”
“Approximately 6,000 additional places are required to meet that growing demand over that period, which causes me to question why it is the policy of the Department, the board and Mr Boyd to limit the development of Dromore Central at a time when it is abundantly clear that there is a serious need for additional places in the Southern Board region. How do the Department and the board believe that they will meet that need for additional primary-school places? I am left perplexed and confused, with no viable or future-proof solutions. <BR /> <BR />Let us talk compromise. From day one, Dromore Central has made it clear that 28 classrooms at this stage may not be needed in the short term.”
“You may think that it is fairly logical and simple maths, and I assure you that I agree. <BR /> <BR />When I bring all those points together, it is clear that the board has disengaged when it comes to long-term planning and meeting the needs of the pupils at the school. How can I be so sure? It is very simple. In July 2014, the board released a set of statistics that indicated that it would be the only education and library board that would see a dramatic rise in the need for primary-school places over the next 12 years.”
“It looked at key areas of economic development to ensure long-term financial viability for the local economy. That is matched by the additional 341 new houses that have recently been passed for planning in Dromore and the surrounding areas. Interestingly, it has been made clear by the board that these are irrelevant figures, and it appears that the attitude is akin to dealing with growth as and when it happens and illogical solutions such as mobile classrooms. It brings me to question what will happen when the old primary school and high school sites are sold. What is the business plan for the board? It is likely that both those sites will be used for further housing developments, which, in turn, will again increase dramatically the number of children wishing to attend Dromore Central Primary School.”
“Unfortunately, that leads me to question the decision-making capabilities of the Southern Board when it comes to making sound economic and financial assessments on projected growth, creating the capacity to meet growth and giving due consideration to the needs of the local and surrounding communities. <BR /> <BR />Ensuring that we build a school that provides foolproof educational help for children well into the future is key. As I said, Dromore is a key commuter town on the A1 Belfast-to-Dublin corridor. It is continuing to expand, and will continue to grow in line with future trends. Indeed, I am sure that the Minister for Regional Development will concur that one of the busiest routes for public transport and commuting is the A1 corridor. <BR /> <BR />In recent months, the draft master plan for Dromore has been released.”
“The school for Dromore Central has been reduced from a 28 class base to a 25 class base. Consequently, the phasing-in of the admission and enrolment numbers should be reviewed. In layman's terms, in order to justify the irrational decision on reducing the number of classrooms, the board is capping pupil numbers to fit the school rather than the school being fit to meet the pupils' needs. Perhaps the Minister or Mr Boyd could explain to the pupils, parents and local community the rationale behind capping the numbers at a time when the surrounding schools are filled to bursting.”
“<BR /> <BR />On 24 September 2014, the Department of Education wrote to the principal of Dromore Central to advise her that the numbers had been capped at 104 pupils, with the enrolment number of the school becoming 710 pupils. Last year, there were 109 applications for a total enrolment of 104. The principal managed to take in 106. Based on the data, it would be fair to say that the school would have approximately 116 applications this year for 104 places. Where does the Minister propose to send those children? Surely not to the same surrounding schools that are already full to capacity and which are turning pupils away? <BR /> <BR />This was not pure coincidence. Correspondence between representatives from the Department and the board clearly show that the reason for capping numbers was:”
“One of the biggest reasons put forward by the board for not developing the school in line with projected growth is the adverse impact that it would have on the surrounding primary schools. Frankly, I have never heard such balderdash, since, when you consider the surrounding schools, a clear picture begins to emerge of something that all the local schools have in common: they are bulging at the seams. At Fair Hill Primary School in Kinallen, there were 41 applications for 39 places. At Maralin Village Primary School, there were 45 applications for 41 places. At Donacloney Primary School, there were 40 applications for 30 places. What is the best thing that the Department and the board can do? Yes: cap the enrolment figures for the only school in the area that can meet that demand in numbers.”
“At a further meeting on 27 June, having been presented with the information to show the development of a further 341 dwellings, the same chief executive expressed his willingness to request that the foundation should be put in place in order to accommodate possible future expansion, thus equipping the school for future growth at minimal cost to the public purse: a job well done, you may think. On 28 October, the Minister agreed that he would reconsider the decision if the board came forward with a development proposal. To date, I am not aware of any further consultation with the school or its governors by the board on such a development proposal, something that I believe the Minister is still waiting on. <BR /> <BR />The confusion and contradictions do not stop there.”
“Earlier correspondence between the Department, the board and the board of governors clearly shows that the school was to be built to allow for the future expansion of Dromore and the surrounding areas. Are you confused by all this? I am sure that you are, but there is more. <BR /> <BR />Subsequent meetings with the chief executive, Mr Boyd, have added to the confusion. At a meeting on 16 May 2014, the chief executive expressed his support for the 28 base school to be reinstated.”
“It is clear that, since the new school was planned in 2007, there has been utter confusion in relation to economies of scale, financing, projected LTE and a lack of understanding of the future demographics and expansion of the Dromore area and its strategic importance on the A1 Belfast to Dublin corridor. Earlier figures had projected that Dromore Central would increase to somewhere in the region of 884 pupils in line with the proposed additional housing developments and economic growth. That was reviewed a number of times. In February 2013, the Department announced that a 25 base school would be built in line with current enrolment numbers. That is somewhat confusing, as a proposed new build was based on future, not current, projections.”
“Frankly, it is an indictment of the Department and the relevant education boards that, soon after a new school is built, hundreds of thousands of pounds have to be found to put up temporary accommodation when a rigorous development plan would have ensured that the school was built a little bigger to accommodate the growth in pupil numbers.”
“<BR /> <BR />It is clear that, if consideration had been given to the projected figures in relation to growth and expansion, with leeway built in for future development, additional moneys would not have needed to have been squandered on mobile classrooms and should have been put into creating a brand new school that was fit for purpose. <BR /> <BR />It must make greater economic sense to ensure that, when building new schools, weighting is given and money spent to ensure that a new school can meet the growing demands placed on it by the local community.”
“When building Fairhill Primary School at Kinallen, potential growth in the local area was underestimated, and no sooner had the board financed a new build than further moneys had to be spent on mobile classrooms to meet the demand in pupil numbers. A similar set of circumstances unfolded with the new build at Donacloney Primary School and Bronte Primary School. Money was spent on a new build and additional moneys had to be found to be spent on mobile classrooms. Likewise, St Colman's in Lisburn, having undergone a £3·4 million spend, was given a new 12 class base school, yet it needed 14 classrooms. That saw the loss of the new school library and the state-of-the-art multipurpose suite to accommodate the two additional classrooms that were needed.”
“Not only would that save time, but, importantly, it would save finances, as there would no longer be the need for heavy plant machinery, which would come at a great cost at a much later date. <BR /> <BR />Unfortunately, the request was turned down by the Department on the basis that it felt that the long-term enrolment of Dromore Central was 730 pupils. Senior personnel in the Department have acknowledged and, indeed, stated that, as the population grows in Dromore, they are happy to facilitate the growth with mobile buildings, which cost in the region of £200,000 each, with additional costs for heating, grounding and health and safety. <BR /> <BR />This will not be the first time that the board has failed to anticipate and plan for growth.”
“Why is there no vision and foresight for future growth? Why is there no room for common sense in relation to financial and economic projections? <BR /> <BR />In England, newly planned schools are built with a 10% leeway allowing for any upward trends in the future. That obviously does not exist in Northern Ireland. When you consider the original business plan for Dromore Central, you realise that great weighting was given to the potential future development and projected increased numbers. That was why, on 13 June 2014, the senior principal architect of the Southern Board wrote to the director of investment, Mr Philip Irwin, to request additional expenditure of £64,320 to provide piling and ground beams for an additional two-classroom extension.”
“Decision-making has been changeable and stormy, with periods of false calm and hope. Back in March 2007, Maria Eagle announced a new build for the primary school. That heralded the beginning of a new journey filled with hope and vision for the pupils, staff and families of the Dromore area. <BR /> <BR />On 7 February 2008, the Southern Education and Library Board carried out an updated economic appraisal with the Department of Education and revised the long-term enrolment (LTE) from 760 pupils with a 26 class base to 800 pupils with a 28 class base. That was based on looking at future projections. However, by February 2013, the decision had been overturned in favour of a 25 class base school based on the current pupil intake figures. Why is there no room for optimism bias in relation to future housing?”
“I rise to speak, yet again, on behalf of Dromore Central Primary School and, indeed, the wider Dromore community. The Minister will be au fait with the school's persistent campaign for 28 classrooms, and no one in this Chamber will contest that Dromore has an outstanding reputation for excellent education from preschool to sixth form. Mrs Sharon Beattie's commitment to her children is matched only by Mrs Allen and her staff and Mr Wilkinson's passion for his pupils. I have been privileged to share part of the journey with all three and count it an honour to be sought out for helping each school. You, Minister, have been and are pivotal in the life of every pupil and family in my constituency. <BR /> <BR />It has been a long and tumultuous journey for Dromore Central Primary School.”
“I thank the First Minister for his answer. First Minister, you are aware that many of the injured victims are now elderly, so this has become urgent. You will also be aware of my private Member's Bill on the issue. Can you give an assurance that your Department will work collaboratively with me on the case?”
“I thank the Minister for his answers today. He will remember that I raised a similar issue last week, and I thank him for meeting me at lunchtime. Will you confirm that, despite staff shortages, the number of prisoners on landings actually increased? What are you doing to remedy the staff shortages at Maghaberry prison?”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. Given that Maghaberry houses every category of prisoner within its walls — you have already touched on this in answer to my colleague — what do you intend to do to ensure the safety of prison officers so that it is a priority in Maghaberry prison?”
“<BR /> <BR />I take the view, at this stage, that OFMDFM is still best-placed to deal with the collaboration of all other Departments, through its duty of care to monitor, report and produce strategies on issues that directly impact on children. Whilst there have certainly been some challenges in delivering the 10-year strategy for children and young people, the Executive have not shied away from such programmes as Delivering Social Change (DSC). The journey has started in challenging the difficulties that many families find themselves in. <BR /> <BR />I welcome the moves behind Mr Agnew's Bill, and share the passion that has brought it to the Floor, but I reserve my judgement until more is known about the financial implications of the Bill.”
“I thank Mr Agnew for his intervention. I think that while we are drilling down on this, and on the amount of resources being put into bringing this Bill forward, we need to be assured that the money will be well spent and is not taken away from front-line services. <BR /> <BR />Going back to the Bill, I think that, in some places, it is a little short on detail. That does not mean that I do not share the sentiments of the Bill; only that, if we are to pass any type of legislation, it must be able to stand up to both current and — more importantly — future litmus tests to ensure best delivery on the ground. So, while we are supporting the Bill today, if it is not radically redrafted, our support cannot be guaranteed.”
“My genuine worry is that we spend a huge amount of resource at this time when budgets are already limited. I believe that the additional resources needed, coming off the back of the proposed Bill, could be better used in ensuring that we protect the most vulnerable in society. <BR /> <BR />Thirdly, I agree —”
“However, I do not think that we have enough evidence, at this stage, to show that the model proposed will create outcomes that are any better for the most vulnerable in our society. More information in relation to that specific area would be welcomed and will help us to ensure that we are making the right decision for our children and young people. <BR /> <BR />Secondly, I share the same concerns as many of my party colleagues in relation to the financial cost, and the indirect cost of planning, managing, reporting and reviewing such collaborative programmes, placed by statutory demands, that would become mandatory for all relevant Departments as part of the Bill. Whilst we do not have the full costs of implementation it is clear, at this stage, that they will be considerably high.”
“<BR /> <BR />First, I have concerns that, although Mr Agnew believes that budgets pooled amongst Departments will ensure better collaboration on many issues, I do not believe that that will create a culture of mutual benefit or prevent Departments from delivering their own priorities. Whilst this model has grown progressively throughout England and Wales from 2004, there is little evidence that it would work well for Northern Ireland, given our uniqueness in relation to both our systems of government and Departments. Notably, I agree that we must continue to pursue an agenda that strengthens collaboration among Departments when it comes to issues that affect children and young people.”
“I welcome the opportunity to speak briefly on the Second Stage of the Children's Services Co-operation Bill. I place on the record the hard work that Mr Agnew and his team carried out in bringing the Bill to the House. <BR /> <BR />It is up to us as representatives to ensure that we keep issues such as child poverty, youth justice and children's mental health at the top of the political agenda. Those issues must remain visible, not hidden, and, for that reason, I welcome the sentiments in the Bill. However, whilst I welcome its sentiments and the drive to ensure that we deliver for children at all levels across our Province, I have a number of concerns about it.”
“I do not know whether to thank the Minister for that very diverting answer. Can the Minister advise who said that consultation was not needed, given that this is a sensitive subject? The people should decide; it should not be an SDLP policy.”
“Have additional resources been allocated or obtained for next year to support the actions under the T:BUC strategy?”
“I ask that the Minister give an assurance that the curb on enrolment is not a clear intention to ensure that the school is no longer viable to meet future demand.”
“<BR /> <BR />On 16 May 2014, and again on 27 June, the interim chief executive, Mr Gavin Boyd, expressed his support for the 28-base class school when he was presented with evidence to show that an additional 341 houses were agreed for the development area. In the case of Dromore Central Primary School, the major financial risk is that the Southern Board and the Department will have to pay over the odds to extend the school at a later stage, as has already been seen from similar case studies in the area. I call on the Minister of Education to reflect on the decisions taken to date, to consider the wider economic reasons for extending at this time and to ask the South Eastern Education and Library Board why no development proposal was ever presented with a firm financial risk assessment.”
“Indeed, such schools as Ballydown, the Bronte and Dromore have had to turn pupils away over recent years. Unfortunately, that begs me to question the decision-making capabilities of the Southern Board when it comes to making sound economic and financial assessments in relation to projected growth, creating the capacity to meet that growth and giving due consideration to the needs of the local and surrounding communities. <BR /> <BR />It is clear that there would be no financial risk to the Southern Board, the Department or to any other education board if we planned new schools and developments with a 10% spare capacity, similar to that in England. Extra capacity is not a financial risk if planned correctly.”
“By 2007, the school had to add an additional two classrooms. Fair Hill Primary School in Kinallen was opened in 1997. In 2006, it was extended by two classrooms, with an additional mobile, and, in 2014, a further two classrooms were added. Donacloney Primary School also had to be extended considerably in 2014. The Minister of Education stated that that extension was consistent with the increasing demand for primary-school places in the area. When we consider the schools in the Southern Education and Library Board region, specifically those within the five-mile radius of Dromore, it becomes apparent that all the schools have reached their full capacity for admission intake.”
“Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I present this petition on behalf of all at Dromore Central Primary School. I thank the parents, the children and, indeed, the local community of Dromore for helping to support this petition. The sheer numbers of local people who have shown their support during this campaign powerfully indicates that the residents of Dromore and the surrounding areas will not settle for second best when it comes to the education of their children and grandchildren. <BR /> <BR />Dromore Central Primary School, as well as some of the other schools I will mention, lies on the A1 Belfast to Dublin corridor, which has been host to some of the biggest housing and economic development projects in the last 10 years. That growth is best reflected in the need for local primary-school places. Brontë Primary School was opened in 2000.”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. You spoke earlier about how high-level skills drive our economy, so would you agree that funding appropriate programmes to deliver and support expansion of the advanced manufacturing and engineering sector would send the right message to not only women but to the industry as a whole?”
“I thank the Member for giving way. Does he agree that NIE should follow a proper process and that the regulator should deal robustly with long delays that result in huge costs to individual companies, as is seen in my constituency of Lagan Valley today?”