Nicola Sturgeon
Scottish National Party · Scotland
“If you pick up this baton and run towards the finish line with every ounce of your energy, you will hear me cheering you on, but if you do not, be in no doubt—you will definitely hear from me.” Presiding Officer, I have an eye on the clock, but I hope that you might indulge me for just a moment longer.”
“This will be my final contribution in the Parliament, so forgive me if I get a bit emotional. It feels fitting—fated, even—that I am making this final speech on an issue that is as close to my heart as the Promise is and always will be.”
“For as long as those with care experience are more likely than the rest of us, through no fault of theirs, to end up homeless, incarcerated, addicted or dead, Scotland will have no right to claim the mantle of equality. Changing that is what the Promise is all about. The bill represents, in the words of Who Cares?”
“What we do with those chances is up to us, but the circumstances of our birth should not place limits on what we can achieve. I believe that we have made progress towards that during my time here, but the global moment that we live in warns us that it cannot be taken for granted.”
“Since I have not always lived by these principles, I should probably frame what I am about to say as advice to my younger self, rather than to those who will come after me. Either way, here it is. Make friends in other parties.”
“I also say thanks to my own staff, who have worked with me in the Parliament and in my constituency. To my constituents in Glasgow Southside—the best constituency in the country, bar none—thank you for the incredible honour of representing you.”
The complete record
Every one of 160 lines we hold for Nicola Sturgeon, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 3 of 4.
“Amendment 113 disagreed to. The Deputy Presiding Officer: The question is, that amendments 114 to 126 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No. The Deputy Presiding Officer: There will be a division. The vote is closed. Douglas Lumsden: On a point of order, Deputy Presiding Officer. My app did not connect. I would have voted yes.”
“On a point of order, Deputy Presiding Officer. I would have voted no. The Deputy Presiding Officer: Thank you, Ms Sturgeon. I will ensure that that is recorded. For Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Briggs, Miles (Lothian) (Con) Carlaw, Jackson (Eastwood) (Con) Carson, Finlay (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Choudhury, Foysol (Lothian) (Ind) Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Dowey, Sharon (South Scotland) (Con) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Ewing, Fergus (Inverness and Nairn) (Ind) Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) Fraser, Murdo (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Gallacher, Meghan (Central Scotland) (Con) Golden, Maurice (North East Scotland) (Con) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Griffin, Mark (Central Scotland) (Lab) Hamilton, Rachael (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Hoy, Craig (South Scotland) (Con) Johnson, Daniel (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Halcro Johnston, Jamie (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Kerr, Liam (North East Scotland) (Con) Kerr, Stephen (Central Scotland) (Con) Lumsden, Douglas (North East Scotland) (Con) Marra, Michael (North East Scotland) (Lab) McCall, Roz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Mochan, Carol (South Scotland) (Lab) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Con) O’Kane, Paul (West Scotland) (Lab) Ross, Douglas (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Rowley, Alex (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Russell, Davy (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (Lab) Simpson, Graham (Central Scotland) (Reform) Smith, Liz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Stewart, Alexander (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Sweeney, Paul (Glasgow) (Lab) Villalba, Mercedes (North East Scotland) (Lab) Webber, Sue (Lothian) (Con) Wells, Annie (Glasgow) (Con) White, Tess (North East Scotland) (Con) Whitfield, Martin (South Scotland) (Lab) Whittle, Brian (South Scotland) (Con) Against Adam, George (Paisley) (SNP) Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire South) (SNP) Beattie, Colin (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) Brown, Keith (Clackmannanshire and Dunblane) (SNP) Brown, Siobhian (Ayr) (SNP) Burgess, Ariane (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Chapman, Maggie (North East Scotland) (Green) Coffey, Willie (Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley) (SNP) Cole-Hamilton, Alex (Edinburgh Western) (LD) Constance, Angela (Almond Valley) (SNP) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Don-Innes, Natalie (Renfrewshire North and West) (SNP) Doris, Bob (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) Dornan, James (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) Dunbar, Jackie (Aberdeen Donside) (SNP) Fairlie, Jim (Perthshire South and Kinross-shire) (SNP) FitzPatrick, Joe (Dundee City West) (SNP) Gibson, Kenneth (Cunninghame North) (SNP) Gilruth, Jenny (Mid Fife and Glenrothes) (SNP) Gougeon, Mairi (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) Grahame, Christine (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) Gray, Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (LD) Greer, Ross (West Scotland) (Green) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP) Harvie, Patrick (Glasgow) (Green) Haughey, Clare (Rutherglen) (SNP) Hepburn, Jamie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) Hyslop, Fiona (Linlithgow) (SNP) Kidd, Bill (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) Lochhead, Richard (Moray) (SNP) MacDonald, Gordon (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Gillian (Central Scotland) (Green) Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) Macpherson, Ben (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (SNP) Maguire, Ruth (Cunninghame South) (SNP) Martin, Gillian (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) Mason, John (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) Matheson, Michael (Falkirk West) (SNP) McAllan, Màiri (Clydesdale) (SNP) McKee, Ivan (Glasgow Provan) (SNP) McLennan, Paul (East Lothian) (SNP) McNair, Marie (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) Minto, Jenni (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) Nicoll, Audrey (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) Rennie, Willie (North East Fife) (LD) Robertson, Angus (Edinburgh Central) (SNP) Roddick, Emma (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) Ruskell, Mark (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Slater, Lorna (Lothian) (Green) Somerville, Shirley-Anne (Dunfermline) (SNP) Stevenson, Collette (East Kilbride) (SNP) Stewart, Kaukab (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) Stewart, Kevin (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) Sturgeon, Nicola (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) Thomson, Michelle (Falkirk East) (SNP) Todd, Maree (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) Torrance, David (Kirkcaldy) (SNP) Tweed, Evelyn (Stirling) (SNP) Whitham, Elena (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (SNP) Wishart, Beatrice (Shetland Islands) (LD) Yousaf, Humza (Glasgow Pollok) (SNP) The Deputy Presiding Officer: The result of the division is: For 41, Against 66, Abstentions 0.”
“The work goes beyond the pitch, too, supporting families, older residents and people who are facing real challenges, and strengthening the very fabric of our town. St Mirren is the heartbeat of Paisley and, through partnerships with organisations such as the University of the West of Scotland, it creates real pathways into education, skills and opportunity. All that comes from a fan- owned, community-based football team.”
“Could we not go down the same route as rugby and the National Football League, in which the microphones are live and we can hear the decisions that the referees are making? However, that is an example of how the game brings us all together, regardless of our backgrounds, even when we have opposing views on the subject. In Paisley, we always look after our own, and St Mirren proves that every day. Under the leadership of Gayle Brannigan, the club’s community work supports people of all ages, from weans kicking their first football to adults getting back into fitness. It is not just about sport—it is about confidence, belonging and giving people a chance to be part of something bigger.”
“On that point, I was reminded by Advice Direct Scotland that, for some people, following football can be very expensive. Last year, the charity urged Scotland fans to enjoy the excitement of the 2026 world cup responsibly, but to try to avoid falling into financial difficulty. With the tournament set to take place in North America, the costs of attending could be astronomical and could easily run into thousands of pounds, so the charity has urged supporters to think twice before borrowing money or using high-interest credit in order to fund such trips. Nevertheless, football unites us in Scotland, even when we are arguing over the ins and outs of the game. There is much to be said about the latest controversy, on the use of the video assistant referee—VAR—but, in order to keep the play flowing, I will say just one thing.”
“Would George Adam confirm for the record that, great though St Mirren is—and it is a great football team—it is, in fact, not the best team in Scotland that plays in black and white? Members: Oh! George Adam: I know that Ms Sturgeon and her family are big supporters of Ayr United. I have gone down there for many a pre-season game. Our teams have never been in the same leagues—St Mirren are normally in the top echelons of football—but it is a nice trip down to Ayr on a Saturday for a wee friendly. Football can give us moments such as Kenny McLean scoring from the halfway line against Denmark. It provides sheer joy when Scotland qualify for the world cup, as the First Minister acknowledged when he stated that we should have a bank holiday on the Monday after the first game of our world cup finals.”
“We should follow suit. Indeed, as the proportion of care that is provided by the private sector is already lower in Scotland than it is in Wales, it should be even easier for us to achieve that, and I hope that we arrange to do so at stage 2. To conclude, this is a good bill—a very good bill—and we must not lose sight of that. When I vote for it this evening, I will do so proudly. However, with some key changes, including those that I have mentioned, I think that it can become a truly great bill, one that will genuinely transform the lives and opportunities of those who grow up in care. That is the opportunity that we have over the next few weeks, and I hope that Parliament, collectively working together in the interests of those young people in our care, now and in the future, will seize that opportunity. 16:31”
“Let me be clear: I am not making an argument against profit per se—of course I am not—but I am saying that we should no longer allow private companies to make a profit from the lives of our most vulnerable young people. Every penny that the state spends on children in our care should be invested in improving their lives, not providing dividends to shareholders. The bill is a step in the right direction. It will provide greater transparency about the financial position of private providers and allow excess profits to be identified. However, we can and should go further. We should aim for a situation in which care is provided only by not-for-profit entities. Wales has already mandated that and set out a clear timetable for implementation and—to Willie Rennie’s point—given time for good providers to transition to a not-for-profit model.”
“Properly implemented and resourced, that has more potential to do what the Promise is all about—making young people feel loved, valued, supported and able to fulfil their potential—than any number of laws or policy documents. But—and it is a big but—in order to achieve that, advocacy must be truly independent. Someone who has one eye on a young person’s best interests and the other on the resources or pressures of a local authority or other public body will not make the difference that is needed. Therefore, I add my voice to the call for a clear definition of independent advocacy to be placed in the bill. The second issue is that of private profit in children’s care services. My view is simple: there is no place for it.”
“The first is what I have already referred to as a catalyst for delivery of all the other changes that we want from the bill, which is the right to independent, lifelong advocacy for all care- experienced young people. I think that it is impossible to overstate how transformational that could be. To put it simply, having an independent, relationship-based advocate is about giving care- experienced young people what most of us take for granted from our own parents. It is about having someone who has our back, who is unequivocally in our corner, who has our best interests—and only our best interests—at heart, and who, when necessary, will go into battle for us.”
“Indeed, I hope that parts of it will be significantly strengthened at stages 2 and 3. For all that, though, it is a good bill. The minister deserves great credit for that. It deserves to be enthusiastically supported at decision time. The bill’s provisions will make life better for care- experienced young people. Indeed, one provision in particular, if implemented properly, will be a powerful catalyst, not just for the wider delivery of the Promise but for its sustainability. Time is limited, so I do not have time to go into all, or even most, aspects of the bill. However, there are two tangible provisions that I want to highlight.”
“Obviously, scrutiny should be robust, but if there is any piece of legislation that should be protected from pre-election frenzy, this is surely it. I hope that it is so. I know there are many in the care community who feel that the bill will not fully deliver the Promise. I understand that, but to them I say this: the Promise was never going to be delivered by legislation alone—it is as much about culture, relationships, resources and mindset as it is about laws and regulations. Even so, I recognise that there is more that can—and must—be done by legislation than the bill will achieve. For example, I have considerable sympathy with points that have already been made about decluttering the landscape and about the UNCRC. Of course, even on its own terms, the bill is not perfect.”
“As the First Minister who made the Promise, I feel a particular responsibility to see that it is fully honoured. Children whose lives are shaped, for better or worse, by our care system deserve nothing less. For me, that responsibility will not end when I leave this place. The Promise is a cause that I will continue to dedicate my time and energy to. Although I feel a special responsibility to it, the Promise was made on behalf of us all, and it is owed to care-experienced young people by the Parliament as a whole. I echo Willie Rennie’s point—I say this from experience—that delivery needs the whole heft of Government. I hope that a spirit of collective endeavour will characterise the debates around the passage of the bill.”
“Loss of heritage, culture and traditional ways of life are no less devastating than loss of infrastructure. The world is at a critical juncture on both climate action and climate justice, and there are many who would like to see us go backwards. It is therefore crucial that Governments such as ours continue to be strong, principled, practical and resolute in pushing progress forward. I know that the cabinet secretary will be stalking the corridors at COP30, using her voice, her experience and the hard-won credibility of the Scottish Government to help to get the world back on the right track. I wish her well. Effectively tackling climate change and ensuring climate justice are vital imperatives that matter for the peace, security and prosperity of all of us. 19:17”
“Of course, here, we must put our money where our mouth is by protecting our own climate justice fund and the way in which funding is made available. On the latter point—the how—we should champion our own approach. The projects that are being funded by the Scottish Government are seen by international partners as prototypes for the world. It is the principles that underpin those projects that we must urge the international fund to follow. First, funding must be in the form of grants, not loans. It would be unconscionable for loss and damage funding to add to already unsustainable debt burdens. Secondly, funding must not come tied up in strings. Communities must be empowered to devise their own solutions to the crisis. Thirdly, funding must cover non-economic as well as economic loss and damage.”
“Although our pledge then of £2 million was small in a global context, our leadership forced the momentum that led to the establishment of the international fund for responding to loss and damage at COP27 in Egypt. Our funding is already making a tangible difference. Scotland should be proud of that global leadership, but we need to keep it up. More than that, in fact, we need to intensify it, because, without firm action now, progress will stall. The international fund is due to start disbursing money soon, but it is woefully underresourced. There is a real fear that it will be bureaucratic and inefficient and, of most concern, that it will operate in a way that increases the indebtedness of global south countries. This, then, is a time to raise our voice again for the principle of loss and damage and for the quantum of funding.”
“Of course, the countries bearing the lion’s share of those costs are those that have done the least to cause climate change. It is some of the poorest people on the planet who are now paying the price of the emissions that made industrialised countries like ours very rich. Therefore—and I make no apology for saying this—funding to help pay for loss and damage is not charity, but reparation. It is a moral obligation that the global north owes to the global south. Since 1991, when a proposal for a loss and damage fund was first mooted, developed countries have stonewalled. That started to change in Glasgow. At COP26, the Scottish Government became the first Government in the world to pledge hard cash to loss and damage. We were inspired by the work of organisations such as the Loss and Damage Collaboration.”
“Let me turn now to funding for loss and damage. Loss and damage is the term used to describe the catastrophic impacts of climate change that can no longer be avoided through cutting emissions or building resilience—known, respectively, as mitigation and adaptation. Those impacts do not lie in some dystopian future; they are the present reality for the world’s most climate-vulnerable nations. They include hard economic losses such as infrastructure destroyed by floods or crops lost to drought. However, they also come in non- economic forms, such as the loss of cultural heritage or indigenous ways of life. The total cost of loss and damage is estimated to be more than $500 billion since 2020 alone, and it is anticipated that, by 2030, the annual cost will rise to $400 billion.”
“On emissions, we must urge action that will get the world back on the 1.5°C track as quickly as possible. Of course, we must lead by example. That means a strong climate change plan, which I know that the cabinet secretary will publish shortly. I also encourage active discussion with the United Kingdom Government on policies such as a levy on private jet flights, which the First Minister has previously expressed interest in. In my view, there should also be a formalisation of the presumption against new oil and gas development. That is not about turning off oil and gas taps immediately, but recognising that new fossil fuel developments are not in the interests of either the climate or the North Sea workforce, which urgently needs all available skills, capital and focus to be on the renewables transition.”
“Although I hope that that will be only a temporary overshoot, the consequences will be devastating. Momentum on finance is also at risk of stalling. Against that backdrop, it is impossible to overstate the importance of COP30. Scotland, of course, does not sit around the COP negotiating table. However, make no mistake that, because of the leadership that we have shown on climate action generally, but especially on loss and damage, our voice is respected and listened to. I pay tribute to the First Minister for grasping that baton of leadership so firmly, as demonstrated on his recent trip to Zambia and Malawi. Nevertheless, I urge the Scottish Government to raise its voice even more loudly and to continue to match its moral leadership with tangible policy.”
“Although delivery on finance commitments continued to fall woefully short, there was a recognition that much more needed to be done. And, after a 30-year stalemate, we suddenly had momentum on the crucial issue of funding for loss and damage—to which, as it is the focus of my motion, I will return shortly. Four years on, though, it feels very hard to stay optimistic. Climate action seems to have fallen prey—in some parts of the world, anyway—to the culture wars. Climate change denial has even raised its head again, and we are witnessing a rearguard action from the global fossil fuel industry, which, in my opinion, threatens the just transition to clean, renewable sources of energy. As a result, it now seems all but inevitable that global warming will exceed 1.5°C over the next few years.”
“It is a long time since I led a members’ business debate from the back benches, and so I am very pleased to have the opportunity to do so today. COP30—the 30th UN climate change conference of the parties—will kick off in Brazil in just a few days’ time. As someone who attended five COP summits in my time as First Minister, I know how tense and high stakes they can be. Progress is never guaranteed and, more often than not, the talks go right to the wire. However, in 2021, coming out of COP26 in Glasgow, there was cautious optimism that the world, albeit belatedly, and very tentatively, might be on the right track. There was consensus about the existential importance of taking action to limit global warming to 1.5°C above pre-industrial levels.”
“For Briggs, Miles (Lothian) (Con) Burnett, Alexander (Aberdeenshire West) (Con) Carlaw, Jackson (Eastwood) (Con) Cole-Hamilton, Alex (Edinburgh Western) (LD) Dowey, Sharon (South Scotland) (Con) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) Fraser, Murdo (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Gallacher, Meghan (Central Scotland) (Con) Golden, Maurice (North East Scotland) (Con) Gosal, Pam (West Scotland) (Con) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (LD) Gulhane, Sandesh (Glasgow) (Con) Hamilton, Rachael (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Halcro Johnston, Jamie (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Kerr, Liam (North East Scotland) (Con) Kerr, Stephen (Central Scotland) (Con) Lumsden, Douglas (North East Scotland) (Con) McCall, Roz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Mundell, Oliver (Dumfriesshire) (Con) Rennie, Willie (North East Fife) (LD) Ross, Douglas (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Smith, Liz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Stewart, Alexander (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Webber, Sue (Lothian) (Con) Wells, Annie (Glasgow) (Con) White, Tess (North East Scotland) (Con) Whittle, Brian (South Scotland) (Con) Wishart, Beatrice (Shetland Islands) (LD) Against Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire South) (SNP) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Beattie, Colin (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Brown, Siobhian (Ayr) (SNP) Burgess, Ariane (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Chapman, Maggie (North East Scotland) (Green) Choudhury, Foysol (Lothian) (Ind) Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Coffey, Willie (Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley) (SNP) Constance, Angela (Almond Valley) (SNP) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Don-Innes, Natalie (Renfrewshire North and West) (SNP) Doris, Bob (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) Dornan, James (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) Dunbar, Jackie (Aberdeen Donside) (SNP) Duncan-Glancy, Pam (Glasgow) (Lab) Ewing, Annabelle (Cowdenbeath) (SNP) Fairlie, Jim (Perthshire South and Kinross-shire) (SNP) FitzPatrick, Joe (Dundee City West) (SNP) Forbes, Kate (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) Gibson, Kenneth (Cunninghame North) (SNP) Gilruth, Jenny (Mid Fife and Glenrothes) (SNP) Gougeon, Mairi (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) Grahame, Christine (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Gray, Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) Greer, Ross (West Scotland) (Green) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP) Harvie, Patrick (Glasgow) (Green) Haughey, Clare (Rutherglen) (SNP) Hepburn, Jamie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) Hyslop, Fiona (Linlithgow) (SNP) Kidd, Bill (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) Leonard, Richard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lochhead, Richard (Moray) (SNP) MacDonald, Gordon (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Gillian (Central Scotland) (Green) [Proxy vote cast by Ross Greer] Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) Macpherson, Ben (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (SNP) Maguire, Ruth (Cunninghame South) (SNP) Marra, Michael (North East Scotland) (Lab) Martin, Gillian (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) Mason, John (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) Matheson, Michael (Falkirk West) (SNP) McAllan, Màiri (Clydesdale) (SNP) McKee, Ivan (Glasgow Provan) (SNP) McLennan, Paul (East Lothian) (SNP) McMillan, Stuart (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) McNair, Marie (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) McNeill, Pauline (Glasgow) (Lab) Minto, Jenni (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) Mochan, Carol (South Scotland) (Lab) Nicoll, Audrey (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) O’Kane, Paul (West Scotland) (Lab) [Proxy vote cast by Michael Marra] Robertson, Angus (Edinburgh Central) (SNP) Robison, Shona (Dundee City East) (SNP) Roddick, Emma (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) Rowley, Alex (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Ruskell, Mark (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Russell, Davy (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (Lab) Slater, Lorna (Lothian) (Green) Somerville, Shirley-Anne (Dunfermline) (SNP) Stevenson, Collette (East Kilbride) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Fulton MacGregor] Stewart, Kaukab (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) Stewart, Kevin (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) Sturgeon, Nicola (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) Sweeney, Paul (Glasgow) (Lab) Swinney, John (Perthshire North) (SNP) Thomson, Michelle (Falkirk East) (SNP) Todd, Maree (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) Torrance, David (Kirkcaldy) (SNP) Tweed, Evelyn (Stirling) (SNP) Villalba, Mercedes (North East Scotland) (Lab) Whitfield, Martin (South Scotland) (Lab) Whitham, Elena (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (SNP) Yousaf, Humza (Glasgow Pollok) (SNP) The Deputy Presiding Officer: The result of the division is: For 30, Against 81, Abstentions 0.”
“Amendment 29 disagreed to. Amendment 30 moved—[Edward Mountain]. The Deputy Presiding Officer: The question is, that amendment 30 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No. The Deputy Presiding Officer: There will be a division.”
“For Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Briggs, Miles (Lothian) (Con) Burnett, Alexander (Aberdeenshire West) (Con) Carlaw, Jackson (Eastwood) (Con) Choudhury, Foysol (Lothian) (Ind) Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Dowey, Sharon (South Scotland) (Con) Duncan-Glancy, Pam (Glasgow) (Lab) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) Fraser, Murdo (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Gallacher, Meghan (Central Scotland) (Con) Golden, Maurice (North East Scotland) (Con) Gosal, Pam (West Scotland) (Con) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Gulhane, Sandesh (Glasgow) (Con) Hamilton, Rachael (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Halcro Johnston, Jamie (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Kerr, Liam (North East Scotland) (Con) Kerr, Stephen (Central Scotland) (Con) Leonard, Richard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lumsden, Douglas (North East Scotland) (Con) Marra, Michael (North East Scotland) (Lab) McCall, Roz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) McNeill, Pauline (Glasgow) (Lab) Mochan, Carol (South Scotland) (Lab) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Mundell, Oliver (Dumfriesshire) (Con) O’Kane, Paul (West Scotland) (Lab) [Proxy vote cast by Michael Marra] Ross, Douglas (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Rowley, Alex (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Russell, Davy (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (Lab) Smith, Liz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Stewart, Alexander (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Sweeney, Paul (Glasgow) (Lab) Villalba, Mercedes (North East Scotland) (Lab) Webber, Sue (Lothian) (Con) Wells, Annie (Glasgow) (Con) White, Tess (North East Scotland) (Con) Whitfield, Martin (South Scotland) (Lab) Whittle, Brian (South Scotland) (Con) Against Adam, George (Paisley) (SNP) Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire South) (SNP) Beattie, Colin (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) Brown, Siobhian (Ayr) (SNP) Burgess, Ariane (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Chapman, Maggie (North East Scotland) (Green) Coffey, Willie (Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley) (SNP) Cole-Hamilton, Alex (Edinburgh Western) (LD) Constance, Angela (Almond Valley) (SNP) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Don-Innes, Natalie (Renfrewshire North and West) (SNP) Doris, Bob (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) Dornan, James (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) Dunbar, Jackie (Aberdeen Donside) (SNP) Fairlie, Jim (Perthshire South and Kinross-shire) (SNP) FitzPatrick, Joe (Dundee City West) (SNP) Forbes, Kate (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) Gibson, Kenneth (Cunninghame North) (SNP) Gilruth, Jenny (Mid Fife and Glenrothes) (SNP) Gougeon, Mairi (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) Grahame, Christine (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) Gray, Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (LD) Greer, Ross (West Scotland) (Green) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP) Harvie, Patrick (Glasgow) (Green) Haughey, Clare (Rutherglen) (SNP) Hepburn, Jamie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) Kidd, Bill (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) Lochhead, Richard (Moray) (SNP) MacDonald, Gordon (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Gillian (Central Scotland) (Green) [Proxy vote cast by Ross Greer] Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) Macpherson, Ben (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (SNP) Maguire, Ruth (Cunninghame South) (SNP) Martin, Gillian (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) Mason, John (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) Matheson, Michael (Falkirk West) (SNP) McAllan, Màiri (Clydesdale) (SNP) McKee, Ivan (Glasgow Provan) (SNP) McLennan, Paul (East Lothian) (SNP) McMillan, Stuart (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) McNair, Marie (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) Minto, Jenni (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) Nicoll, Audrey (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) Rennie, Willie (North East Fife) (LD) Robertson, Angus (Edinburgh Central) (SNP) Robison, Shona (Dundee City East) (SNP) Roddick, Emma (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) Ruskell, Mark (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Slater, Lorna (Lothian) (Green) Somerville, Shirley-Anne (Dunfermline) (SNP) Stevenson, Collette (East Kilbride) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Fulton MacGregor] Stewart, Kaukab (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) Stewart, Kevin (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) Sturgeon, Nicola (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) Swinney, John (Perthshire North) (SNP) Thomson, Michelle (Falkirk East) (SNP) Todd, Maree (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) Torrance, David (Kirkcaldy) (SNP) Tweed, Evelyn (Stirling) (SNP) Whitham, Elena (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (SNP) Wishart, Beatrice (Shetland Islands) (LD) Yousaf, Humza (Glasgow Pollok) (SNP) The Deputy Presiding Officer: The result of the division is: For 42, Against 86, Abstentions 0.”
“Amendment 28 disagreed to. Amendment 29 moved—[Edward Mountain]. The Deputy Presiding Officer: The question is, that amendment 29 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No. The Deputy Presiding Officer: There will be a division.”
“On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I could not connect. I would have voted no. The Deputy Presiding Officer: Thank you, Ms Sturgeon. I will make sure that that is recorded. For Briggs, Miles (Lothian) (Con) Burnett, Alexander (Aberdeenshire West) (Con) Carlaw, Jackson (Eastwood) (Con) Dowey, Sharon (South Scotland) (Con) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) Fraser, Murdo (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Gallacher, Meghan (Central Scotland) (Con) Golden, Maurice (North East Scotland) (Con) Gosal, Pam (West Scotland) (Con) Hamilton, Rachael (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Halcro Johnston, Jamie (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Kerr, Liam (North East Scotland) (Con) Kerr, Stephen (Central Scotland) (Con) Lumsden, Douglas (North East Scotland) (Con) McCall, Roz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Mundell, Oliver (Dumfriesshire) (Con) Ross, Douglas (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Smith, Liz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Stewart, Alexander (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Webber, Sue (Lothian) (Con) Wells, Annie (Glasgow) (Con) White, Tess (North East Scotland) (Con) Whittle, Brian (South Scotland) (Con) Against Adam, George (Paisley) (SNP) Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire South) (SNP) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Beattie, Colin (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Brown, Siobhian (Ayr) (SNP) Burgess, Ariane (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Chapman, Maggie (North East Scotland) (Green) Choudhury, Foysol (Lothian) (Ind) Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Coffey, Willie (Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley) (SNP) Cole-Hamilton, Alex (Edinburgh Western) (LD) Constance, Angela (Almond Valley) (SNP) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Don-Innes, Natalie (Renfrewshire North and West) (SNP) Doris, Bob (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) Dornan, James (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) Dunbar, Jackie (Aberdeen Donside) (SNP) Duncan-Glancy, Pam (Glasgow) (Lab) Ewing, Annabelle (Cowdenbeath) (SNP) Fairlie, Jim (Perthshire South and Kinross-shire) (SNP) FitzPatrick, Joe (Dundee City West) (SNP) Forbes, Kate (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) Gibson, Kenneth (Cunninghame North) (SNP) Gilruth, Jenny (Mid Fife and Glenrothes) (SNP) Gougeon, Mairi (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) Grahame, Christine (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Gray, Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (LD) Greer, Ross (West Scotland) (Green) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP) Harvie, Patrick (Glasgow) (Green) Haughey, Clare (Rutherglen) (SNP) Hepburn, Jamie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) Hyslop, Fiona (Linlithgow) (SNP) Kidd, Bill (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) Leonard, Richard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lochhead, Richard (Moray) (SNP) MacDonald, Gordon (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Gillian (Central Scotland) (Green) [Proxy vote cast by Ross Greer] Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) Macpherson, Ben (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (SNP) Maguire, Ruth (Cunninghame South) (SNP) Marra, Michael (North East Scotland) (Lab) Martin, Gillian (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) Mason, John (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) Matheson, Michael (Falkirk West) (SNP) McAllan, Màiri (Clydesdale) (SNP) McKee, Ivan (Glasgow Provan) (SNP) McLennan, Paul (East Lothian) (SNP) McMillan, Stuart (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) McNair, Marie (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) McNeill, Pauline (Glasgow) (Lab) Minto, Jenni (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) Mochan, Carol (South Scotland) (Lab) Nicoll, Audrey (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) O’Kane, Paul (West Scotland) (Lab) [Proxy vote cast by Michael Marra] Rennie, Willie (North East Fife) (LD) Robertson, Angus (Edinburgh Central) (SNP) Robison, Shona (Dundee City East) (SNP) Roddick, Emma (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) Rowley, Alex (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Ruskell, Mark (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Russell, Davy (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (Lab) Slater, Lorna (Lothian) (Green) Somerville, Shirley-Anne (Dunfermline) (SNP) Stevenson, Collette (East Kilbride) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Fulton MacGregor] Stewart, Kaukab (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) Stewart, Kevin (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) Sturgeon, Nicola (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) Sweeney, Paul (Glasgow) (Lab) Swinney, John (Perthshire North) (SNP) Thomson, Michelle (Falkirk East) (SNP) Todd, Maree (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) Torrance, David (Kirkcaldy) (SNP) Tweed, Evelyn (Stirling) (SNP) Villalba, Mercedes (North East Scotland) (Lab) Whitfield, Martin (South Scotland) (Lab) Whitham, Elena (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (SNP) Wishart, Beatrice (Shetland Islands) (LD) Yousaf, Humza (Glasgow Pollok) (SNP) The Deputy Presiding Officer: The result of the division is: For 25, Against 86, Abstentions 0.”
“We have to make sure that it is right, but I think that we are all committed to making that transformation and fundamental change. I certainly am. I move amendment 109.”
“It is not as though we are creating a new sexual offences court; it will be the same courts that we already have. It is important to note that there will be no new facility. I concede that, under the Government’s proposal, because sheriffs are interchangeable in rape cases, more courts might be able to be used than under my proposal, but some of it will be limited by geography. We would not use all 38 courts that we have in the sheriff courts system, because we would not want a victim to have to go to Inverness if they were a victim of a crime in Glasgow. There will still be limitations on which courts can be used. Crucially, that issue should have been given much more consideration than it got. If nothing else, it is really important to test this. A lot of resource will be put into making this fundamental change.”
“In speaking to another amendment, I will address the question whether it is right that High Court judges should not preside over rape cases, which they currently do. That begs the question of what the High Court will do if all those cases are taken out, but there was not really any examination of that. As members will, I am sure, hear in the debate tomorrow, the committee had to wrestle with big, fundamental issues, which the Parliament is having to wrestle with now, such as the removal of the not proven verdict and the creation of a new court—there is a lot of fundamental reform in the bill—but we have not really addressed what will happen to the High Court if all those cases are moved out. It might be a minor issue, but, at the end of the day, we should have the chance to consider the impact. The new court will not be a new facility.”
“The Law Society and the Scottish Solicitors Bar Association will tell you that recent audits suggest that we have 250 lawyers in the whole of Scotland. Sheriffs sitting in the High Court as temporary judges are acting as High Court judges in all cases. Sheriffs who are appointed as judges in the sexual offences court will be exercising the powers of maximum sentencing. There is a difference there, and, whether members support the proposal or not, it is important to understand some of the structural changes and make some assessment of whether they are the right changes. More sheriffs will be appointed to the sexual offences court, but they will not be new ones. They will not be additional ones, but they will preside over cases. It slightly concerns me that rape cases will be taken out of the High Court.”
“The rule on corroboration has been changed, which affects all cases, not just sexual offences cases, and trauma-informed practice can be applied to any court. I do not think that the bill currently requires the defence to do that, but all practitioners must be able to do so. When we are looking at how a court system fits together, it is very important to address all the problems. We know from debates in the Parliament that one of the big issues that has not been addressed is the number of defence practitioners who are leaving the profession. If we do not address the gap in relation to lawyers leaving the criminal justice profession, we will not be able to run any court, whether it introduces my proposal or the Government’s proposal.”
“Putting all solemn cases— sheriff and jury—that deal with sexual offences, including solemn cases that are currently heard in the sheriff court, into one court will create a very large court. We need to be satisfied that, in doing that, we will achieve a reduction and get those delays in court proceedings reduced. The volume of cases is potentially a problem. 18:45 We have already heard that witnesses and victims can give their evidence via commission. The Government has championed that, which I totally applaud. We have already taken steps to change the court system. Tackling rape myths, which juries are told to sign up to, is now part of the judge’s direction to a jury. We are beginning to make incremental change in the system.”
“The first step is to embed trauma-informed practices and procedures throughout our courts and justice system. To reduce court delays, Scottish Labour supports the proposal to establish a special sexual offences court”. I am curious to know why there has been a change of heart. Pauline McNeill: There has not been a change of heart. I am arguing that there can still be specialism and trauma-informed practice. I will go on to talk about and welcome some of the fundamental changes that the Government has made, with the Lord Advocate contributing to those. There is no contradiction between the Labour manifesto and what I am arguing for. I am simply saying that the structure should be the High Court, a specialist division of the High Court and a specialist division of the sheriff court. That is what I am arguing for today.”
“We have expressed our support to the creation of specialist divisions within the current court structure. We therefore support amendment 109 and consequential amendments 112 to 160 introduced by Pauline McNeill MSP”. To answer the question that Nicola Sturgeon raises about culture change, I note that I am still arguing that there should be culture change. However, creating specialist divisions in the existing court structures would be the easiest and most efficient way of achieving that. Rona Mackay: I hope that Pauline McNeill will forgive me for quoting from last year’s Labour manifesto. It says: “While structural change is important, transformational change within the court system will only come through changing culture and practice.”
“Otherwise, I might have been persuaded that it is the best way to proceed. Rona Mackay: Will Pauline McNeill take an intervention? Pauline McNeill: I will take one in a minute; let me just develop the argument. There will be no additional sheriffs. There will be the same number of sheriffs and judges—there is no suggestion that new members of the judiciary will be appointed. The Law Society of Scotland supports the division of existing courts, which is what my amendments seek. The society said: “We consider that the new court will create more complexity in the system, affecting the efficiency of criminal proceedings in cases of sexual offences. ... While we appreciate the efforts made by the Scottish Government in addressing some of the concerns expressed at earlier stages, we are still unconvinced that a standalone court is needed.”
“As she progresses her argument, will she address the question of how her amendments would effect the culture change that many people think is essential and how her amendments would address the delays that often bedevil the current system? In the amendments that she has lodged, neither of those points is clear to me. Pauline McNeill: That is a central question. The evidence that survivors gave to the committee said that delay is the most concerning aspect of their poor experiences in the criminal justice system. If we do not reduce delay, victims will continue to experience something that is unacceptable. That is my primary concern. The creation of a stand-alone court is a big, bureaucratic organisational change and I am not convinced that it will get delay down, which, as I said, is my primary worry.”
“Will Pauline McNeill take an intervention? Pauline McNeill: Yes, of course I will. The Deputy Presiding Officer: We need Nicola Sturgeon’s microphone on. Does the member have her card with her? She could collect a spare one and come in shortly. Pauline McNeill: I am happy to come back to Nicola Sturgeon when I am summing up, if she wishes. Nicola Sturgeon: I apologise, Presiding Officer, for omitting to put my card in, and I thank Pauline McNeill for taking the intervention. Does she acknowledge that it is the overwhelming view of survivors of sexual offences that a stand-alone specialist court would help to reduce the compounding trauma that they are often subjected to in criminal proceedings under the current system?”
“Amendment 128 disagreed to. The Deputy Presiding Officer: I call amendment 129, in the name of Pam Duncan- Glancy. I remind members that, if amendment 129 is agreed, I cannot call amendment 131 because of pre-emption. Amendment 129 not moved. The Deputy Presiding Officer: I call amendment 130, in the name of Pam Duncan- Glancy. I remind members that, if amendment 130 is agreed to, I cannot call amendment 131 because of pre-emption. Amendment 130 moved—[Pam Duncan- Glancy]. Amendment 130A moved—[Jenny Gilruth]—and agreed to. The Deputy Presiding Officer: I call Pam Duncan-Glancy to press or withdraw amendment 130, as amended. Pam Duncan-Glancy: I will press it. Amendment 130, as amended, agreed to. The Deputy Presiding Officer: That is agreed, and therefore I cannot call amendment 131—”
“For Baillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Balfour, Jeremy (Lothian) (Con) Bibby, Neil (West Scotland) (Lab) Briggs, Miles (Lothian) (Con) Burnett, Alexander (Aberdeenshire West) (Con) Carlaw, Jackson (Eastwood) (Con) Carson, Finlay (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Choudhury, Foysol (Lothian) (Lab) Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Dowey, Sharon (South Scotland) (Con) Duncan-Glancy, Pam (Glasgow) (Lab) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Fraser, Murdo (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Gallacher, Meghan (Central Scotland) (Con) Golden, Maurice (North East Scotland) (Con) Gosal, Pam (West Scotland) (Con) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Griffin, Mark (Central Scotland) (Lab) Gulhane, Sandesh (Glasgow) (Con) Hoy, Craig (South Scotland) (Con) Johnson, Daniel (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Halcro Johnston, Jamie (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Kerr, Liam (North East Scotland) (Con) Kerr, Stephen (Central Scotland) (Con) Lennon, Monica (Central Scotland) (Lab) Leonard, Richard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lumsden, Douglas (North East Scotland) (Con) Marra, Michael (North East Scotland) (Lab) McCall, Roz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) McNeill, Pauline (Glasgow) (Lab) Mochan, Carol (South Scotland) (Lab) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Mundell, Oliver (Dumfriesshire) (Con) O’Kane, Paul (West Scotland) (Lab) Ross, Douglas (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Rowley, Alex (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Russell, Davy (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (Lab) Sarwar, Anas (Glasgow) (Lab) Simpson, Graham (Central Scotland) (Con) Smith, Liz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Smyth, Colin (South Scotland) (Lab) Stewart, Alexander (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Sweeney, Paul (Glasgow) (Lab) Villalba, Mercedes (North East Scotland) (Lab) Webber, Sue (Lothian) (Con) Wells, Annie (Glasgow) (Con) Whitfield, Martin (South Scotland) (Lab) Whittle, Brian (South Scotland) (Con) Against Adam, George (Paisley) (SNP) Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire South) (SNP) Beattie, Colin (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) Brown, Keith (Clackmannanshire and Dunblane) (SNP) Brown, Siobhian (Ayr) (SNP) Burgess, Ariane (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Callaghan, Stephanie (Uddingston and Bellshill) (SNP) Chapman, Maggie (North East Scotland) (Green) Coffey, Willie (Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley) (SNP) Constance, Angela (Almond Valley) (SNP) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Doris, Bob (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) Dornan, James (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) Dunbar, Jackie (Aberdeen Donside) (SNP) Ewing, Fergus (Inverness and Nairn) (Ind) Fairlie, Jim (Perthshire South and Kinross-shire) (SNP) FitzPatrick, Joe (Dundee City West) (SNP) Gilruth, Jenny (Mid Fife and Glenrothes) (SNP) Gougeon, Mairi (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) Grahame, Christine (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) Gray, Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (LD) Greer, Ross (West Scotland) (Green) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP) Harvie, Patrick (Glasgow) (Green) Haughey, Clare (Rutherglen) (SNP) Hepburn, Jamie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) Hyslop, Fiona (Linlithgow) (SNP) Kidd, Bill (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) Lochhead, Richard (Moray) (SNP) MacDonald, Gordon (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Gillian (Central Scotland) (Green) [Proxy vote cast by Ross Greer] Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) Macpherson, Ben (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (SNP) Maguire, Ruth (Cunninghame South) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Rona Mackay] Martin, Gillian (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) Mason, John (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) Matheson, Michael (Falkirk West) (SNP) McAllan, Màiri (Clydesdale) (SNP) McLennan, Paul (East Lothian) (SNP) McMillan, Stuart (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) McNair, Marie (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) Minto, Jenni (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) Nicoll, Audrey (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) Rennie, Willie (North East Fife) (LD) Robertson, Angus (Edinburgh Central) (SNP) Robison, Shona (Dundee City East) (SNP) Roddick, Emma (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) Ruskell, Mark (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Slater, Lorna (Lothian) (Green) Somerville, Shirley-Anne (Dunfermline) (SNP) Stevenson, Collette (East Kilbride) (SNP) Stewart, Kaukab (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) Stewart, Kevin (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) Sturgeon, Nicola (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) Swinney, John (Perthshire North) (SNP) Todd, Maree (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) Torrance, David (Kirkcaldy) (SNP) Tweed, Evelyn (Stirling) (SNP) Whitham, Elena (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (SNP) Yousaf, Humza (Glasgow Pollok) (SNP) The Deputy Presiding Officer: The result of the division is: For 49, Against 65, Abstentions 0.”
“On a point of order, Presiding Officer. My app would not connect. I would have voted no. The Deputy Presiding Officer: I will make sure that that vote is recorded. The Minister for Higher and Further Education; and Minister for Veterans (Graeme Dey): On a point of order, Presiding Officer. Apologies—my app did not connect, either. I would have voted no. The Deputy Presiding Officer: Thank you, Mr Dey. I will make sure that that is recorded.”
“On a point of order, Presiding Officer. My app did not connect. I would have voted yes. The Deputy Presiding Officer: Thank you, Ms Sturgeon. Your vote will be recorded.”
“We reflected together on how short life is and how important it is to live every single day of it to the full and, even in the darkest of times, to find reasons to laugh. It is that, ultimately—her laugh and her unfailing ability, no matter what, to lift my spirits—that I will remember most about the beautiful, funny, wise woman that was Christina McKelvie. Christina, I loved you. We all loved you. And I am going to miss you so very much. [Applause.] 14:28”
“Finally, Christina McKelvie was an absolutely incredible friend. Over the past couple of years, in particular, when she must so often have had the weight of the world on her own shoulders, she was always concerned to know how I was. On St Andrew’s day last year, we were both at Janey Godley’s funeral. I could tell that day that Christina was not feeling well, so I forced her to let me drive her home. I will gloss over her assessment of my driving, but I am deeply grateful to have had that time with Christina. It was probably the most profound conversation that we ever had. She opened up about her fears of what lay ahead and for the loved ones she knew she would leave behind far too soon.”
“No disrespect to my other ministers, but that was not normal. Secondly, she was the beating heart of her family. Forgive me, Presiding Officer, if I address them directly. Keith, you were her soul mate. I do not think you will ever know how much happiness you brought her. I know that she made you deeply happy, too. Lewis and Jack, she was so very, very proud of you. Rare was the conversation with your mum that did not involve accounts of what one or both of you were up to. A little-known fact is that Jack and I share a birthday, which meant that Christina was always one of the first people I would hear from on my birthday every year. I will so miss those texts. However, from now on, Jack, whether you like it or not, in my little mark of remembrance, I am going to be the first person you hear from on your birthday every single year.”
“This chamber feels far too quiet without Christina’s infectious laugh. It is impossible, in three minutes, to encapsulate the remarkable human being that she was, but let me share these fundamental truths about a woman I was privileged to call my friend. First, she was a truly exceptional politician, with abilities that are all too rare in places like this. The connection that she made with people came from her heart—a heart that she always wore proudly on her sleeve, and which burned with a passion for social justice and equality. When I made Christina a minister, I knew that she would do a good job, but I did not anticipate the strength of the impact that she made. As First Minister, whenever I encountered someone who worked in her policy field, they would invariably tell me that they loved her.”
“4) Bill insert followed by Legislative Consent Motion: Great British Energy Bill - UK Legislation delete 5.00 pm Decision Time and insert 5.30 pm Decision Time—[Jamie Hepburn.] Motion agreed to. Topical Question Time 14:23 Grangemouth (National Wealth Fund) 1.”
“Motion agreed to, That the Parliament agrees that, for the purposes of consideration of the third supplementary legislative consent memorandum on the Great British Energy Bill, Rule 9B.3.5 of Standing Orders is suspended. The Presiding Officer: We come to consideration of business motion S6M-16586, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau, on changes to business. Motion moved, That the Parliament agrees to the following revisions to the programme of business for Tuesday 25 February 2025— after followed by Topical Questions (if selected) insert followed by Ministerial Statement: Response to Concerns Raised Regarding Care of Children at Skye House after followed by Stage 3 Proceedings: Budget (Scotland) (No.”
“On a point of order, Presiding Officer. Likewise—I could not get the app to connect; I would have voted yes. The Presiding Officer: Thank you, Ms Sturgeon. We will ensure that that is recorded. For Adam, George (Paisley) (SNP) Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire South) (SNP) Baillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Balfour, Jeremy (Lothian) (Con) Beattie, Colin (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Briggs, Miles (Lothian) (Con) Brown, Keith (Clackmannanshire and Dunblane) (SNP) Brown, Siobhian (Ayr) (SNP) Carlaw, Jackson (Eastwood) (Con) Carson, Finlay (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Choudhury, Foysol (Lothian) (Lab) Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Coffey, Willie (Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley) (SNP) Cole-Hamilton, Alex (Edinburgh Western) (LD) Constance, Angela (Almond Valley) (SNP) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Don-Innes, Natalie (Renfrewshire North and West) (SNP) Doris, Bob (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) Dornan, James (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) Dowey, Sharon (South Scotland) (Con) Dunbar, Jackie (Aberdeen Donside) (SNP) Duncan-Glancy, Pam (Glasgow) (Lab) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Ewing, Annabelle (Cowdenbeath) (SNP) Ewing, Fergus (Inverness and Nairn) (SNP) Fairlie, Jim (Perthshire South and Kinross-shire) (SNP) Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) FitzPatrick, Joe (Dundee City West) (SNP) Forbes, Kate (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) Gallacher, Meghan (Central Scotland) (Con) Gibson, Kenneth (Cunninghame North) (SNP) Gilruth, Jenny (Mid Fife and Glenrothes) (SNP) Golden, Maurice (North East Scotland) (Con) Gosal, Pam (West Scotland) (Con) Gougeon, Mairi (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) Grahame, Christine (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Gray, Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (Con) Griffin, Mark (Central Scotland) (Lab) Gulhane, Sandesh (Glasgow) (Con) Hamilton, Rachael (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP) Haughey, Clare (Rutherglen) (SNP) Hepburn, Jamie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) Hoy, Craig (South Scotland) (Con) Hyslop, Fiona (Linlithgow) (SNP) Johnson, Daniel (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Halcro Johnston, Jamie (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Kerr, Liam (North East Scotland) (Con) Kerr, Stephen (Central Scotland) (Con) Kidd, Bill (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) Leonard, Richard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lochhead, Richard (Moray) (SNP) Lumsden, Douglas (North East Scotland) (Con) MacDonald, Gordon (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) Macpherson, Ben (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (SNP) Maguire, Ruth (Cunninghame South) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Rona Mackay] Marra, Michael (North East Scotland) (Lab) Martin, Gillian (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) Mason, John (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) Matheson, Michael (Falkirk West) (SNP) McAllan, Màiri (Clydesdale) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Jamie Hepburn] McArthur, Liam (Orkney Islands) (LD) McCall, Roz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) McKee, Ivan (Glasgow Provan) (SNP) McKelvie, Christina (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Jamie Hepburn] McLennan, Paul (East Lothian) (SNP) McMillan, Stuart (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) McNeill, Pauline (Glasgow) (Lab) Minto, Jenni (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) Mochan, Carol (South Scotland) (Lab) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Mundell, Oliver (Dumfriesshire) (Con) Nicoll, Audrey (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) Rennie, Willie (North East Fife) (LD) Robertson, Angus (Edinburgh Central) (SNP) Robison, Shona (Dundee City East) (SNP) Roddick, Emma (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) Ross, Douglas (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Simpson, Graham (Central Scotland) (Con) Smith, Liz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Smyth, Colin (South Scotland) (Lab) Somerville, Shirley-Anne (Dunfermline) (SNP) Stevenson, Collette (East Kilbride) (SNP) Stewart, Alexander (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Stewart, Kaukab (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) Stewart, Kevin (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) Sturgeon, Nicola (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) Sweeney, Paul (Glasgow) (Lab) Swinney, John (Perthshire North) (SNP) Thomson, Michelle (Falkirk East) (SNP) Todd, Maree (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) Tweed, Evelyn (Stirling) (SNP) Villalba, Mercedes (North East Scotland) (Lab) Webber, Sue (Lothian) (Con) Wells, Annie (Glasgow) (Con) White, Tess (North East Scotland) (Con) Whitfield, Martin (South Scotland) (Lab) Whitham, Elena (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (SNP) Whittle, Brian (South Scotland) (Con) Wishart, Beatrice (Shetland Islands) (LD) Yousaf, Humza (Glasgow Pollok) (SNP) Abstentions Burgess, Ariane (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Chapman, Maggie (North East Scotland) (Green) Greer, Ross (West Scotland) (Green) Harvie, Patrick (Glasgow) (Green) Mackay, Gillian (Central Scotland) (Green) Ruskell, Mark (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Slater, Lorna (Lothian) (Green) The Presiding Officer: The result of the division on motion S6M-16585, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, on suspension of standing orders, is: For 110, Against 0, Abstentions 7.”
“That the Parliament agrees that the Moveable Transactions (Scotland) Act 2023 Amendment Regulations 2025 [draft] be approved. That the Parliament agrees that the Registers of Scotland (Fees and Plain Copies) Miscellaneous Amendments Order 2025 [draft] be approved. The Presiding Officer: That concludes decision time. Rural Crime and Equipment Theft”