Julie MacDougall
Reform UK · Scotland
“Our stance on the growth zone initiative is that, obviously, we recognise that, where a data centre development is proposed, it must have strict environmental impact assessments associated with it, and we must have an idea of the number of data centres that are likely to go through planning.”
“Last year, the UK Government announced plans to introduce AI growth zones, which would involve giving data centres a £24 per megawatt-hour discount in Scotland, starting from April 2027.”
“In Fife, the Kingdom Community Bank has been a breath of fresh air for many of my constituents. It provides access to physical branches and a personalised service, often manned by volunteers, at a time when big banks are shutting up shop and cutting jobs.”
“I am happy to engage with members to identify any opportunities where the Scottish Government can work constructively with local authorities, community organisations, the regulators and, indeed, the UK Government to ensure that we maximise access to banking services across Scotland, recognising the vital role that they play.”
“I thank Jenny Young for bringing this important motion to the chamber. There have been important, heartfelt and moving contributions in the debate so far. Above all, I pay tribute and my respects to the late Jo Cox.”
“I welcome the fact that the Scottish Government will consider multiyear funding as a minimum standard, as has been advocated by organisations such as Citizens Advice, so that providers can plan services years ahead instead of just crossing their fingers at the end of every Scottish or local government budget.”
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“Our stance on the growth zone initiative is that, obviously, we recognise that, where a data centre development is proposed, it must have strict environmental impact assessments associated with it, and we must have an idea of the number of data centres that are likely to go through planning. We also need to ensure that our regulations are fit for purpose. There are opportunities that arise if data centres are sited in the right locations, and I have mentioned a few of those opportunities. We have an enormous amount of constrained renewable electricity that cannot make its way into the grid and which is being wasted—indeed, constraint payments are given to the generators. Data centres can provide an outlet to use that renewable electricity, but they cannot come at the expense of other environmental concerns.”
“Last year, the UK Government announced plans to introduce AI growth zones, which would involve giving data centres a £24 per megawatt-hour discount in Scotland, starting from April 2027. Given the enormous opposition that local communities such as mine in Auchtertool have to these data centres, and their rightful concern about demand on local water and power, which has been mentioned, does the Scottish Government have an updated stance on the AI growth zones in Scotland? Gillian Martin: As Julie MacDougall said, the AI growth zone is a UK Government initiative, and that initiative has resulted in speculation in the areas that were designated as growth zones, as in Lanarkshire.”
“I am happy to engage with members to identify any opportunities where the Scottish Government can work constructively with local authorities, community organisations, the regulators and, indeed, the UK Government to ensure that we maximise access to banking services across Scotland, recognising the vital role that they play. “Coming Home” Report (Hospital Placements) 5.”
“In Fife, the Kingdom Community Bank has been a breath of fresh air for many of my constituents. It provides access to physical branches and a personalised service, often manned by volunteers, at a time when big banks are shutting up shop and cutting jobs. Does the Scottish Government have any plans to support or encourage the creation of community banks as a possible alternative for rural communities across Scotland? Tom Arthur: I thank the member for highlighting the positive impact of the example that she cited in her area. Although, as I said, I recognise the reserved nature of the issue, I want to work constructively on it.”
“As we have heard in the debate, words are powerful so we should be mindful of how we use language in order not to jeopardise the safety of others. Democracy and fairness should always be at the heart of our politics and society. Let us embrace our differences, recognise one another’s strengths and work towards stronger communities in which we all belong and everyone can thrive. Let us honour Jo’s memory and build better politics for us all—politics in which every voice matters and we can build up our bridges. When we come together, anything is possible. 18:40”
“As elected politicians, we have an absolute duty to lead by example. We often speak about honesty, integrity and respect, but our actions do not always reflect those values. That must change. Each of us brings different perspectives and ideas to our debates. As we have just heard, if we listen with respect and understanding, we can build stronger relationships, work more constructively together and set a better example to our communities. When we have open and honest discussion, we can learn and grow. We might not always agree, but we can put aside our differences and, as we have said, focus on what unites us and our shared hopes, values and aspirations for communities in our country. As we know from Jo Cox’s death, safety is very important, and it is something that she also spoke about.”
“We have heard lots of really good contributions on that. We know that she wanted to build stronger communities and a safe and respectful democracy, while also tackling loneliness. Her lasting message has been mentioned. Jo said that we “have far more in common than that which divides us.”— [Official Report, House of Commons, 3 June 2015; c 675.] We can all learn something especially important from that message and apply it to our politics—not just say that we will do it, but do it. Jo campaigned passionately for promoting a kinder and more compassionate politics, with mutual respect. We can bring that to the Scottish Parliament, as a starting point. Since I was elected, it has been clear to me that there is work to do to make our politics more respectful, civil and courteous.”
“I thank Jenny Young for bringing this important motion to the chamber. There have been important, heartfelt and moving contributions in the debate so far. Above all, I pay tribute and my respects to the late Jo Cox. I did not know her personally, but I feel as though I did, having listened to members’ remarks today and having read a lot about the great work that she contributed. On the 10th anniversary of her death, I recognise her dedicated work as a campaigner, activist and humanitarian, and her deep commitment to her community, which comes over loud and clear. I echo what everyone has said about her horrific and tragic death in 2016. I pay respect to her family—my deep thoughts are with them—and to the family of Sir David Amess, who, tragically, also suffered a horrific death. Jo’s legacy continues through the Jo Cox Foundation.”
“I move amendment S7M-00356.2, to insert at end: “; further agrees that a key part of sustainability can include long-term support for organisations, beyond initial funding periods, where there is clear evidence that continued support delivers continued value; recognises the potential efficiencies that organisations can make with long- term budget certainty, and believes that organisations that are in receipt of Scottish Government support and public funds have to commit to deliver the same value for money and reform agenda that was agreed by Parliament.” 15:56”
“However, we cannot keep going down the same path of funding first and worrying about sustainability later. Sustainability must be baked into the funding from the very start; it must not be just another bumper slogan attached to an obscure policy memorandum. We must prove to the public that we can do things differently, that we can work constructively together on the issue and that we are listening to them. That is why I hope that members will support my amendment.”
“A deeper conversation about that is needed, as it will change the relationship that we all have with the third sector, and I hope that we can have that conversation not too long after today’s debate. There should be a commitment by every organisation that is in receipt of Government funding to demonstrate full value for money, to ensure that their presence represents an overall saving from public investment. I lodged my amendment as an open hand to all members in the chamber to engage in more forward thinking when it comes to supporting the third sector. We all value third sector providers. Some of us have needed them, and we, on the Reform benches, are certainly not opposed to funding them where they can fill a genuine gap in local public services.”
“We cannot have a situation in which communities are wholly reliant on those services only for Government money to dry up and councils to be unable to fund them. My final point is about having realistic conversations about what we expect from our third sector. Much of the third sector prides itself on the unique way in which it delivers its services. It is a major part of the appeal of third sector provider services, and it is why they can be favoured over similar services offered by public bodies. However, I feel that we are moving to a point at which third sector provider services are becoming a permanent and necessary appendage of local public service offerings and not just a welcome addition.”
“We cannot ignore that. Councils are sometimes forced to use Government funding for certain areas although it is unneeded and they have other entire service areas that are literally dying for want of essential cash. The duplication of funding and service provision is too common a problem. Therefore, we must ensure that our councils and third sector providers can properly co-ordinate funding and activities so as to streamline service delivery. I would argue that that discussion should be held not just between the Scottish Government and one collective body or sector. All 32 of Scotland’s councils need to have their own unique input into how future funding can best be used in their communities. That emphasises my point about the longevity of third sector providers.”
“I welcome the fact that the Scottish Government will consider multiyear funding as a minimum standard, as has been advocated by organisations such as Citizens Advice, so that providers can plan services years ahead instead of just crossing their fingers at the end of every Scottish or local government budget. We also need to be aware of the vital role that our councils play in the execution and funding of those services. Many of us in the chamber have served, or continue to serve, on councils in our respective areas, and we all know that the constituents we represent come from communities with different priorities and different needs—in different council areas or even in neighbouring wards. Too often, policies are ring fenced when the funding from the Government needs to be bespoke to the needs of different council areas.”
“For example, I recently raised with the First Minister the fact that, although colleges and employers receive funding from the Scottish Government, it is structured in such a way that it disincentivises the creation of new apprenticeships, and it does not guarantee the long-term security of some campuses that are at risk of closing. The point that I tried to make then, which the First Minister either did not pick up or refused to answer, was not that the sector needs more money but that the funding structure for how the money is spent is completely at odds with the needs of the college sector and skills development in Scotland. In short, it is all about priorities.”
“My feedback rests on three main points: first, the future structure and framework of any proposed funding model, which has been touched on; secondly, the role of local government; and, finally, our expectations for the third sector. On my first point, I truly believe that no problem can be solved simply by throwing money at it. Although more money is, of course, welcome for anyone who receives it, the way in which the money is given and the conditions that are imposed clearly have massive ramifications for service delivery. Speaking to representatives of colleges and other organisations across my region that are dependent on public funding has been a massive eye-opener for me. A big problem that I have noticed across most Government funding projects is that they lose sight of the issues that they hope to address.”
“I declare an interest as a trustee of the John MacDougall Mesothelioma Trust and the Glenrothes & Area Heritage Centre. I thank the minister for her comments. As a Fife councillor, I am all too aware of the work that people in the third sector do, much of it unpaid, to step in where council budgets and personnel have, unfortunately, been stretched too thin. I think that everyone in the chamber agrees that third sector providers become vital lifelines in many communities because of that. We all want to do the right thing in supporting them. The reason I lodged my amendment is that I hope to work constructively with the Government on this important issue, as too much is at stake for it to involve the usual Punch and Judy politics of previous sessions.”
“To ask the Scottish Government whether it will provide an update regarding the future of the Elmwood campus of Scotland’s Rural College in Cupar. (S7O-00052)”
“In my portfolio, I am starting to explore the use of planning as a tool. I had a meeting with planning officials yesterday. I am still to get my head around exactly what can be done, but I am sympathetic to using planning as more of a tool to stimulate the kind of growth and benefits that Julie MacDougall has talked about. Given our devolved powers, planning is a tool that we could use to our advantage. I will take that on board as I continue my thoughts and questions. I do not yet have an answer, but the issue is on my agenda and in my mind.”
“I firmly believe that Scotland cannot be left behind in the new digital age. However, that should not come at a direct cost to the environment or local communities without those communities seeing substantial benefits. Many parts of Fife have been hit badly by deindustrialisation, with generations of people struggling with unemployment and underemployment. Does the Scottish Government agree that, if those data centres go ahead, the sufficient creation of permanent full-time jobs, with upskilling opportunities for local workers, should form part of the conditions for granting planning permission for them? Hannah Mary Goodlad: Economic growth, job creation and benefit within communities that host infrastructure projects such as data centres have to be at the front and centre of the issue.”
“I recently met the chief executive of Forth Valley College. It was incredibly harrowing to hear about how apprenticeship courses are being cut, with the survival of the Alloa campus being put into jeopardy yet again. Inadequate real-terms funding was one of the main reasons cited for Forth Valley College’s recent hardships. The broken funding system also plays a role in disincentivising employers and colleges from creating new modern apprenticeships. On top of committing to sustainable multiyear funding, as recommended by Colleges Scotland’s “2026 Election Manifesto”, can the First Minister confirm whether the Scottish Government plans to review and overhaul the public funding model for Scotland’s colleges, which is so clearly unfit for purpose?”
“I recently met the chief executive of Forth Valley College. It was incredibly harrowing to hear about how apprenticeship courses are being cut— The Presiding Officer: That is not relevant to this question. We are on supplementaries to the question that Patrick Harvie asked. Julie MacDougall: I apologise. The Presiding Officer: Lloyd Melville has a supplementary.”
“The First Minister may be aware of a live planning application for a new data centre just outside of Auchtertool. On the back of last week’s energy debate, can the First Minister assure my constituents in Auchtertool that the Scottish Government will take our community council’s concerns seriously and ensure that decisions on planning applications for data centres across Scotland are not imposed on the community or rushed through without serious consideration of water and energy demands?”
“The reality is that it does not help the people of Scotland when two thirds are paying for subsidies for the so-called just transition. The reality is that net stupid zero is the biggest act of self-harm in a generation. We need to take the ideology out of this. Can we just all grow up and be intelligent about it? Can we just agree that we want a balanced scorecard, that our obligation to our people first and foremost is to get energy prices down, in order to allow people to heat their homes and increase their productivity? Of course, we will have oil and gas, which needs to be the bedrock and our transition fuel. If, in time, renewables become merchant viable, they can be at the table, as well. However, we need to build prosperity, so I cannot back the motion. 16:50”
“They were given 15 years’ subsidies on the basis that they need to be nurtured, like a child growing into an adolescent and becoming an adult, and will mature into being merchant viable. Fifteen years ago, they were given another 15 years of subsidies and, in February this year, they were given 20 more years of subsidies. That is 50 years of subsidies to what is meant to be the cheapest part of our electricity system and all the jobs that come with it, which Offshore Energies UK says are less than half of the transition from hydrocarbon to renewables and at less than half the salaries. Here is the thing that Mr Melville needs to be reminded of: this is the biggest transfer of money from poor people to rich people in our generation. If he is proud of that, proud of that industry and proud of what it is based on, he should feel free.”
“Malcolm Offord and I have both witnessed at first hand the impact on our communities in Fife with the closure of the Fife ethylene plant at Mossmorran and 400 job losses. That was due to bad policy choices. Does he share my concerns about the proposed large data centre in Auchtertool, as that will create nowhere near the amount of jobs lost at Mossmorran? I would like to know— The Presiding Officer: That is enough for an intervention. It is not a speech within a speech. Malcolm Offord: I agree with Julie MacDougall. It is the classic example of the ideology that is put in front of people. The reality is that renewables are a big, fat racket, and I will explain why. They first came to our shores 30 years ago— [Interruption.] I will talk about exactly that.”
“His Government already has a poor track record spanning nearly two decades, and, with Scotland facing so many pressing issues, a second referendum on separation is completely tone deaf to the concerns of our people. In the meantime, let us focus on getting the basics right. Fixing broken Scotland is our priority for the next five years in this underperforming Parliament. Together, we must make the Parliament work to its full potential and thrive for the Scottish people. I look forward to working with all members, across parties, to do so. The Deputy Presiding Officer: I call Jackie Baillie, who has five minutes. We still have time in hand. 16:34”
“I think that there is a unique opportunity here. There is much work to do, but we should do the right thing for people in our communities across Scotland and get to work in their interests, not ours. As we know, with power comes great responsibility, so I ask the First Minister to use his power wisely and to offer our nation no more division. This Parliament serves with a mandate only from the 53 per cent of Scots who voted, and it will need to tackle a massive Government spending deficit. We need to work together, and our collective mission should be to encourage the other 47 per cent of disillusioned Scots to vote next time round and to restore faith in our politicians. That is why I cannot support the First Minister’s motion.”
“We must also support our veterans and ensure that they have access to decent housing and support services. Our councils are continuously underfunded, and each year they go cap in hand, begging the Scottish Government, “Please, sir, can I have some more?” I have seen that happen too many times in Fife Council budget discussions, in particular. Our schools, hospitals and college estates are deteriorating. There are potholes, crumbling roads and unsafe pavements—and so it continues. However, if we focus on the day job, we have an opportunity to prepare and to tackle those challenges, working collectively to rectify this mess. I have listened carefully since arriving in the chamber, and so many members, including our new Presiding Officer, have confessed that, since its opening, the Parliament has not been used to its full potential.”
“In education, parents are having to pay for extra tuition for their children, and those who cannot afford it are simply left behind due to the pressures placed on our education system. Teachers are under enormous pressure. The police are overburdened and are constrained in the execution of their duties. We have the highest rate of drug deaths in Europe. Young people face a lack of opportunities. I want young people who do not choose university to have the option—as I did—to take an apprenticeship that offers them hope for their future. More than 340 businesses, approximately, are closing weekly in Scotland. Farmers are working all hours with little return, struggling to make an income for their families. We are now in a housing emergency, and the conditions of overcrowding are simply unacceptable.”
“Our job is to listen, to be honest and to shape policy on the basis of what we hear from the grass roots of our communities. As a local councillor, I am only too aware of these day-to-day issues. Let me share what I hear and see every day. Due to the cost of living, people are unable to heat their homes or to afford food, and they are reliant on food banks. In employment, people who have the desire and ability to work struggle to find a decent, well-paid job. As for the NHS and social care, people are unable to access appointments for procedures such as hip operations, and they are using their hard-earned life savings to pay for those privately, even going abroad in too many cases.”
“Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. First, I wish to offer my congratulations to you. It is a privilege to be elected to this chamber and to make my maiden speech today. I begin by congratulating all colleagues on their election and thanking all voters and volunteers. I would also like to take this opportunity to pay tribute to my late father, John MacDougall, who was a respected and dedicated Fife politician and a true champion of the people. It was his passing that set me on this path. Like him, I will always stand up for our communities first and foremost. Alongside my 16 Reform UK colleagues, I have been given a mandate by our communities to serve the people of Mid Scotland and Fife—and Scotland as a whole—by prioritising what matters most to them.”
“I, Julie MacDougall, do swear that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to His Majesty King Charles, his heirs and successors, according to law. So help me”