Liam Kerr
Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party · Scotland
“Producing the same amount of electricity through ground-mounted solar—a technology that I stress I support and that must form part of our energy mix—requires many times more land. Most of us would agree that reducing emissions matters.”
“In the years since I first contributed to a debate in this Parliament on new nuclear power in Scotland, four of the six parties in the chamber have come to support the proposition that I put forward, in some form or other. In that, they are on the side of the majority of the public, which supports nuclear power.”
“No wonder: electric vehicles, heat pumps, hydrogen production, advanced manufacturing, artificial intelligence and high-tech industries all require enormous amounts of reliable power. That means nuclear. However, we do not just need reliable power. We need local power.”
“In 2019, it even legislated for a 75 per cent reduction in emissions by 2030, although it scrapped that target five years later because it could not meet it.”
“In fact, over the year, wind turbines operate only around 25 to 40 per cent of the time. The point is that we must be able to guarantee electricity when homes, businesses and hospitals need it.”
“For more than 65 years, the STV North news programme has done far more than simply report the news. As Maggie Chapman said, it has given a voice to rural and regional communities. It has reflected local priorities and provided scrutiny, balance and accountability at every level of Government and public life.”
The complete record
Every one of 538 lines we hold for Liam Kerr, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 10 of 11.
“To ask the Scottish Government what its response is to reports that 506 sex offenders in Scotland have changed their name in the past two years. (S6T- 02471)”
“If the Conservatives want to be treated seriously—it is becoming increasingly difficult to treat them seriously because of the way in which they go about exercising their politics, as one of their members has found out and has today publicly made clear is the case—they should engage constructively in a debate about how we can meet the real challenges that this Government is focused on addressing. The Presiding Officer: We move to constituency and general supplementary questions. As ever, I am keen to enable as many members as possible to take part, so concise questions and answers would be appreciated. Kirkcudbright Bridge (Closure)”
“Liam Kerr has said that there is a lack of a holistic strategy, and he has then gone on to suggest one of the options that could be considered as part of such a strategy. I dispute Mr Kerr’s claim—I think that we have a holistic strategy. The Cabinet Secretary for Justice and Home Affairs has been completely open with the Parliament about all the challenges that we face, and, in my opinion, she has handled those challenges superbly well. Liam Kerr has asked me for a holistic strategy but has ruled out one of the possible options in that regard.”
“The lack of a holistic strategy has led to the cost of our overcrowded prisons spiralling. In response, the Government dropped a proposal to let long-term prisoners out early, but it did not rule out doing so in future. Victim Support Scotland, Rape Crisis Scotland and Scottish Women’s Aid all say that such a move would be a threat to victims and to the public. Will the First Minister put the public interest first and rule out the early release of long- term prisoners—yes or no? The First Minister: In a sense, that question sums up the problem that we have here. [Interruption.] The Presiding Officer: Let us hear one another. The First Minister: Apparently, the Conservatives believe in free speech—unless it is me who is speaking. Really!”
“The Scottish Conservatives will support the principles of the bill at stage 1 this evening, as both parts are commendable and largely achieve what they are designed to do. There are, of course, areas that can be improved—I associate myself with the convener’s remarks about helping the cabinet secretary to do so—and I am particularly worried about the finances. I hope that the cabinet secretary will be able to address my points in her closing speech. The Deputy Presiding Officer: I call Pauline McNeill to open on behalf of Scottish Labour. Ms McNeill is joining us remotely. 15:22”
“Furthermore—this picks up on a point that was made earlier—Social Work Scotland, COSLA, NHS Tayside, and EmilyTest all raised concerns about the duplication of processes, particularly the strain that its impact could put on children and families. I listened to the cabinet secretary’s comments on that earlier, and I note that the Government seeks to address the point in relation to children by saying that only one review should take place into a child death “unless this is unavoidable”. Perhaps the cabinet secretary could add a definition as to what circumstances would constitute a second review being “unavoidable”. I do not think that the Government’s letter addressed how overlapping would be avoided in practice for adult deaths. Perhaps the cabinet secretary could address that in her closing speech, too.”
“It seems to me that the organisations that take part in the reviews must be provided with the necessary resources to enable them to do so effectively, otherwise I worry that we risk letting down victims and their families. To pick up on Jamie Greene’s intervention, we must do all that we can to prevent a lack of resources during the review process from allowing key failures to go unexposed. I am sure that the cabinet secretary agrees with that. However, the Government’s response to the issue in its letter of 28 March runs to only two sentences, suggesting that it is up to the domestic homicide and suicide review task force to identify the costs. In her closing speech, perhaps the cabinet secretary might commit to properly quantifying those costs by stage 2.”
“I also point to a quote from Police Scotland that said: “It is probably a bit early to apply specific price tags.”— [Official Report, Criminal Justice Committee, 29 January 2025; c 5.] I remind Mr Kerr that all but two of the measures in part 1 of the bill have been in place for five years. Liam Kerr: That is noted. I am grateful to the cabinet secretary for that clarification. However— and bearing in mind that I am talking about part 2—it was not just Police Scotland that had concerns. COSLA said: “The financial memorandum does not reflect the costs and capacity needs of local authorities and their strategic community planning partners” to do all the things that they need to, including providing support to families during the review process.”
“In the context of there now being more than 900 fewer police officers than there were in 2020, ever more demands on police time, 140 police station closures and the police being forced into a situation of not investigating some crimes, it must surely concern us to hear Police Scotland say that the financial memorandum is “silent on the anticipated financial impact on the police budget.”—[Official Report, Criminal Justice Committee, 29 January 2025; c 27.] Angela Constance: I make Mr Kerr aware of the correspondence that I sent to the Finance and Public Administration Committee, which dealt with his issues in full.”
“Those financial concerns continue with regard to part 2 of the bill, which will introduce a mechanism for domestic homicide and suicide reviews. Again, the principle is sound, but the committee heard Police Scotland and the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities explicitly suggest that the bill’s financial memorandum does not provide enough funds to deliver the intention effectively or provide on-going support to families.”
“The cabinet secretary’s letter on 28 March provided an alternative and seemingly complementary solution, which is welcome. I listened carefully to the remarks that she made earlier. It would be useful if she could say, in her closing speech, whether she has any further details on when she might lay regulations to address that issue. A key concern that a number of stakeholders expressed about part 1 of the bill was to do with finances. For example, there were concerns about the cost of virtual court appearances, with the Faculty of Advocates noting that remote hearings depend on courts having reliable and properly resourced technology. Furthermore, it was highlighted that the financial memorandum does not provide figures for the costs of expanding virtual attendance.”
“Concerns were also raised in committee about national jurisdiction and the principle of appearing in one’s local court. Pauline McNeill MSP has been particularly exercised on that point, so I will leave her to elaborate on it later. I want to flag something that the cabinet secretary raised earlier. I was concerned in committee that the bill does not seek to address the current temporary provisions that extend some time limits in solemn cases. We heard evidence from Malcolm Graham, the chief executive of the Scottish Courts and Tribunals Service, who said that the court system will still not be ready to return to the pre-pandemic time limits by November. That point was picked up in our committee’s report, which suggested a solution and amendments for stage 2.”
“Although I remain to be convinced that conjoining two fundamentally different principles together like this is the best way of doing things, because that requires committees to be creative in their evidence taking, I agree with what each part of the bill is intended to do. Part 1 focuses on making permanent some criminal justice measures that were introduced in the Coronavirus (Recovery and Reform) (Scotland) Act 2022. Reassuringly, the various stakeholders that the committee heard from largely welcomed that part of the bill. The committee has advised that, at stage 2, the Parliament will wish to consider provisions on virtual attendance and how those who give evidence are protected and where they might give that evidence from.”
“Members across the chamber, including the convener of the Criminal Justice Committee, the deputy convener—which is me—and various others whose views and experience merit respect, have made representations to the Minister for Parliamentary Business not to risk the legislative process, not to downgrade the bill that is before us today, which we have all already put a huge amount of work into, and not to prioritise legislating cursorily over legislating competently. They asked him instead to postpone this debate so that both bills can be given their due. Regrettably, the Minister for Parliamentary Business—whose busy diary appears to have kept him from the chamber for this debate—seems to prefer process to prudence. That being said, the Scottish Conservatives will vote in favour of the principles of this bill at decision time.”
“He also focused on committees, which are absolutely essential in a unicameral Parliament that does not have a revising chamber to fix oversights. For the past three weeks—plus tomorrow and possibly Thursday—the Criminal Justice Committee, the cabinet secretary, the minister, many parliamentary staff, special advisers and MSP staff have worked on the Victims, Witnesses, and Justice Reform (Scotland) Bill and its several hundred amendments to ensure that it is as good as it can be.”
“This weekend, I enjoyed reading a thought-provoking and well-articulated opinion piece in which Edward Mountain, who has been the convener of two of the Scottish Parliament’s more heavyweight committees, sought to highlight the amount of, let us say, legislation with flaws that comes out of this place. He referred to Holyrood as “one of the most powerful devolved parliaments in the world”, which, rightly, seeks to legislate accordingly. Mr Mountain drew attention to the workload of committee MSPs and staff; the pressure to interrogate, understand and stress test legal principles and to grapple with often unfamiliar concepts; and the need for much reflection on the detailed evidence that is given. He proposed solutions that some members may agree or disagree with.”
“On legal aid, I have committed to introducing primary legislation that would provide for non- means-tested legal aid for families participating in deaths in custody FAIs. That would include non- means-tested advice and assistance from day 1. That is what requires primary legislation. I cannot deliver that right now, but I am conscious that ministers will have to provide support for the implementation of recommendations through the provision of finance or personnel. The ministerial direction that will become live from 7 April will enable families to get civil legal aid from the point that they are notified that there will be a fatal accident inquiry.”
“I will pursue everyone—not just within the justice portfolio but across Government—to the very best of my abilities, because we desperately need action, and we cannot have any more delay. It is fair to say that, given the depth of the work, some of our aspirations and some of the recommendations will not all be completed by a week on Tuesday and will require sustained endeavours over the next year. On Crown immunity, I wrote to the Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice in the UK Government in mid-January and have not had a response. I want to have a meeting with the UK Government and will consider other means to pursue such a meeting. Sheriff Collins’s narration of the issues on Crown immunity and its history was powerful.”
“Will the cabinet secretary provide us with an update on any discussions that she has had with the UK Government since that statement? Finally, the cabinet secretary gave a very welcome commitment to make legal aid free, from 7 April, to close family members in tragic cases such as these, but we all know that the legal aid system is in crisis—it lacks funding and, indeed, legal representatives. How will the cabinet secretary ensure that she urgently addresses those issues so that families who find themselves in such tragic circumstances not only get legal aid but get the representation that they deserve? Angela Constance: I thank Mr Kerr for his acknowledgement that we have accepted all the recommendations. I have always been clear to Parliament that accountability starts with me.”
“I thank the cabinet secretary for an advance copy of her statement. I acknowledge and welcome that all of Sheriff Collins’s 25 recommendations relating to the tragic and preventable deaths of Katie Allan and William Lindsay have been accepted. However, there is clearly a desperate need for action without delay to prevent further tragedies. I recognise the progress that the cabinet secretary has just reported, but will she make a commitment today, on the record, that all the recommendations will be implemented urgently and within the timescales that are set out in the report? Furthermore, I recall from her statement in January that the cabinet secretary committed to pursuing with the United Kingdom Government the removal of Crown immunity.”
“On Mr Kerr’s specific point, an outline business case for the wider Aberdeen route upgrade, including service improvements and route decarbonisation, was concluded, and it has been duly considered by Transport Scotland’s investment decision board. A decision was made to progress the procurement of a replacement intercity train fleet as design works continue, the latter being fully funded this financial year. Options for progressing to the next stage of the Aberdeen to central belt service improvements remain under consideration. The Presiding Officer: Question 4 was not lodged. Disability Payments 5.”
“The 2016 Aberdeen city region deal included a promise from the Government of £200 million over 10 years to drastically speed up rail journey times to the central belt. However, the Government has covertly dropped “2026” from the project’s title and only £16 million has been spent, with mere months to go. Why has it broken its promise and yet again betrayed the people of the north-east? Tom Arthur: The significant investment that I outlined in my answers to Jackie Dunbar demonstrates the Government’s significant commitment to the people of the north-east and its significant investment across a range of areas.”
“The Deputy Presiding Officer: Foysol Choudhury—very briefly.”
“To reassure Mr Harvie, here is something that we can do under devolution. For decades, the USA has had positive results on regression, recidivism and public safety using continuous drug abstinence monitoring technology. Australia and New Zealand have moved ahead with that, and England has it in its family law courts. Will the cabinet secretary consider a trial of that technology in Scotland to see whether the positive outcomes that have been seen elsewhere happen here? Angela Constance: I am very open to developments in technology and will consider how any advancement could play a role in the management of offenders, including those in custody. We have the Management of Offenders (Scotland) Act 2019, and, of course, the electronic monitoring commercial contract in Scotland allows for new technological capabilities.”
“I will be happy to update the member on the work that is done to inform the public about independence, which is, of course, the normal status of countries in the international community.”
“What is the full direct and indirect cost to the taxpayer of the work that has been done and is still to be done? Given the cabinet secretary’s constant refrain that there is not enough money, from which bodies was that money taken? Angus Robertson: I cannot give the member the answer that he asks for. However, I regularly update Parliament and colleagues—perhaps even him—on that in answers to written questions, and I will be happy to update him on it. I think that Liam Kerr appreciates that this Government was elected with a mandate to inform the public about Scottish independence, and that that policy position is supported by the majority of MSPs. It is absolutely right and proper that we do the necessary work.”
“Earlier this week, it was announced that the UCAN swift urological response and evaluation— SURE—unit cancer facility at Aberdeen Royal infirmary is facing more than a year’s delay before opening. Meanwhile, NHS Grampian has the lowest number of beds per head and the worst cancer rates in Scotland, it has lost its proposed national treatment centre, and the Baird family hospital and the Aberdeen and north centre for haematology, oncology and radiotherapy— ANCHOR—centre units are massively delayed. All that is compounded by grave underfunding from this Government. Will the First Minister personally step in to address his Government’s abandonment of NHS Grampian and provide it with the funds and resources required to get the UCAN SURE unit open?”
“It is testament to the hard work of Police Scotland and, indeed, other parts of the justice system that there has been a significant fall in reports of victimisation from around 20 per cent to around one in 10. Independent Schools’ VAT Liability (Impact on State Schools) 2.”
“Reports say that up to a quarter of crimes go unreported, with more than 215,000 calls to 101 having been discontinued between January and July 2024. Since 2013, more than 140 police stations and 100 police counters have been closed. There are nearly 1,000 fewer police officers than there were in 2020, with the Aberdeen pilot of not investigating all crimes having been extended across Scotland. Given those facts, is the cabinet secretary investigating their impact on recorded crime rates, or are simplistic comparisons to other parts of the UK simply easier? Angela Constance: I have no interest in making simplistic comparisons, but it is important that we focus on the facts. The strength of the Scottish crime and justice survey is that it captures not just recorded crime but the experience of crime.”
“He particularly highlighted the contribution that previous Tory United Kingdom Government policies and immigration rhetoric have made to the fall in international student numbers, which is exacerbating the problems that our institutions face. There is a raft of challenges. In answer to the specific question, I say that the SFC and the Scottish Government are alive to the challenges and are engaging with the university sector on the challenges that it faces.”
“The SFC loan will go almost entirely to the University of Dundee. This week, Steve Olivier of Robert Gordon University warned that institutions face a “major existential threat” due to “significant” underfunding. Neil Cowie at North East Scotland College—NESCol—said: “We’re constantly being asked to do more with less, and that is simply not sustainable.” What help will be announced for such institutions? Will the minister risk the “existential threat” becoming reality? Graeme Dey: In his question, Liam Kerr did not mention Sir Peter Mathieson of the University of Edinburgh, who made a number of points about the challenges that his institution faces.”
“The Sunday Post revealed that a legal loophole is denying answers to Scots families when their loved ones die abroad. Confusion over the term “ordinary residence” means that, since 2016, no fatal accident inquiry following the repatriation of a body has been held. Families such as that of Aberdeen’s David Cornock have been denied closure. David died in Thailand in 2019, and his children were made homeless because the insurance would not pay out. The Government has been aware of the situation for years but has not fixed it. Will the Government urgently review and resolve it before any more families have to suffer?”
“I am pleased that the latest official statistics show that, as of December, police officer numbers were at more than 16,500. The deputy chief constable, Alan Speirs, confirmed last month that police officer numbers were at 16,614. We will also be wrestling with the demands that are created by the rise in employers’ national insurance contributions. Although I do not dispute the changing nature of crime that Liam Kerr has highlighted, which requires being very focused, I remind him that the statistics that were published earlier this week show that there has been an overall 1 per cent decrease in recorded crime over the past year and that this country remains a safer place under our Government. Antisocial Behaviour (City Centres) 6.”
“Between 2020 and 2024, non-sexual crimes of violence were up 10 per cent, sexual crimes were up 11 per cent and crimes of dishonesty were up 16 per cent. As at June 2024, the number of police officers had fallen to its lowest level in 17 years, while many aspects of the estate and resources continue to decline. If we accept that fewer officers dealing with rising crime using older resources—all matters that are within the ambit of this Government—will lead to harder workloads, greater stress, mental health challenges and more burn-out, what is the Government’s specific plan to make life easier for our officers? Angela Constance: The Government has a very robust approach through the £1.62 billion that will be invested in policing in Scotland, following the passing of the budget yesterday.”
“That is 18 years without the Government having developed a holistic, coherent strategy to understand why the prison population is so high and propose whole- systems approaches to address it. It is 18 years of the Government introducing admittedly extremely important legislation to address appalling crimes such as historical sexual offences and domestic violence but failing to adequately prepare for and provision the wholly predictable resultant increase in prisoners. It is 18 years of failure to replace and increase capacity in an antiquated prison estate, which is consequently incapable of providing the rehabilitation opportunities required to break the cycle of reoffending that the cabinet secretary rightly talked about.”
“The Scottish Conservatives have been demanding a review of sentencing and penal policy for years. I am pleased to hear that progress has finally been made and we look forward to contributing positively to that, but the cabinet secretary announced almost a year ago to the day that she planned “to commence an externally led review of sentencing and penal policy.”—[Official Report, 27 February 2024; c 13.] In the meantime, rather than getting going with the urgency that is required, we have seen a series of panic-stricken knee-jerk reactions to the crisis of the prison population. Responsibility for that lies entirely at the feet of the Scottish National Party Government, which has been in charge of Scotland’s justice system for 18 years.”
“Decision making about the economic aspects of the master plan does not necessarily lie in my portfolio, but I was enthused and impressed when I met the harbour trust port board members, who do that work on a voluntary basis, and I think that they are doing a fine job. Shawhead Flyover (Safety) 6.”
“It is crucial for its master plan that Fraserburgh harbour can leverage private finance, and that will be made far easier with the Government’s full support. Will the cabinet secretary confirm her Government’s unequivocal support for the Fraserburgh harbour master plan and promise to do all that she can to back it? Fiona Hyslop: I have heard at first hand about the master plan and, as the Cabinet Secretary for Transport, I am enthusiastic about its vision and ambition. Members will be aware that there is £150 million in offshore development support, which is a tripling of the funding that has been available.”
“I look forward to engaging with Mr Kerr and others on issues such as the further innovation that is required in community justice services to prevent people from going into prison in the first place, when that is safe to do, and on the innovation around electronic monitoring vis-à-vis home detention curfew. There is also work on the implementation of the Bail and Release from Custody (Scotland) Bill, so we are not short of actions on that side. It is a shame that every time we come forward with another piece of the jigsaw to reform the system, members of the Opposition resist it strongly.”
“The failure to improve the estate means that the Scottish Government has failed for years to provide the amount of space that is required. With the average daily prison population up 6 per cent last year, Scotland desperately needs to increase capacity to ensure that dangerous criminals are kept off the street. Rather than releasing dangerous criminals after only 40 per cent of their sentence, does the Scottish Government have a proper long-term strategy to increase the capacity of the prison estate? Angela Constance: In short, yes, we do.”
“I know that there are many issues to address and many asks for improvements around fatal accident inquiries, but first and foremost, in order to deliver for families who have been affected by death in custody, we must take a focused look at the death in custody fatal accident inquiries. Legal aid is, of course, demand led. I have had a number of discussions with Cabinet colleagues on the work that we are about to commence. Inevitably, there will be implications in relation to the financial and human resources that are released to focus on that work.”
“There was live discussion at stage 2 of the Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill about the much broader issue of good conduct or misconduct in public office. It is imperative that we all recognise that public confidence and trust in all our public services is what binds us together. On the underpinnings of the work on fatal accident inquiries, I will come back to Parliament with a more detailed timetable, but I must be up front and say that I do not expect any work on fatal accident inquiries to be straightforward or plain sailing. I really hate the word “complex”, but in this case, that is what it is. I will consult others, but I want to ensure that we set the terms of reference for the work correctly so that it can be completed timeously.”
“Finally, the cabinet secretary says that she will extend legal aid to bereaved families participating in FAIs, but the legal aid system is already very short of money and resources. What extra funding and resources does she consider are necessary in that respect, and when will they be made available? Angela Constance: I very much appreciate Mr Kerr’s questions. He will know that Crown immunity is not in my gift to deliver—it is a reserved issue. Nonetheless, I have made a commitment today to Parliament and, indeed, to the families who are sitting in the public gallery that I will pursue that matter in good faith. I know that other members in the chamber will have party connections on both sides of the border.”
“I thank the cabinet secretary for advance sight of her statement, and I extend my deepest condolences, too, to the families of Katie Allan and William Lindsay. I have three questions for the cabinet secretary, which I will keep brief to ensure that she has time to give full answers. The cabinet secretary has signalled that she will pursue the lifting of Crown immunity. Will she set out for us when she anticipates real progress— and, I hope, success—with that? Secondly, the cabinet secretary referenced the system of investigating the deaths of prisoners, but she said that it will take a further year to report. Will she explain why that further delay is needed to point out what seems to be obvious to everyone in the system, which is that it is not working?”
“To ask the Scottish Government what its response is to reinforced autoclaved aerated concrete being found in current and formerly council-owned residential properties in Dundee. (S6O-04244)”
“The bill introduces changes such as the new code of ethics, which has been welcomed as a step in the right direction. Although the duty of candour has been welcomed, some stakeholders and members have questioned whether it will have a meaningful impact. Perhaps the cabinet secretary can allay those fears in her closing remarks when she answers the concerns of Unison and the SPF, as raised by Katy Clark. There are changes to the disciplinary processes to allow them to continue even after the cessation of engagement, and on the independent adjudication of senior officers, and there are significantly expanded powers for the”
“I have listened carefully to the stage 3 debate, having not been directly involved in the bill until shortly before the stage 3 consideration commenced. Since becoming an MSP, I have heard a number of members plead that we should not let the perfect be the enemy of the good. I fear that, by failing to seek perfection in the bill, which I think that we need to strive for when we are legislating, the Parliament risks settling for the bill being just about good enough. On the one hand, the bill is important and it will achieve important changes, as my colleague Sharon Dowey set out. That point was also reinforced by the persuasive submission that we received from Victim Support Scotland last night, which actively urged us to support the legislation.”
“The Deputy Presiding Officer: Group 6 is on complaints handling: information provided to complainer. Amendment 28, in the name of Douglas Ross, is the only amendment in the group. 16:00”
“I have worked constructively with Ms Dowey on it following her stage 2 amendments in this area. I agree very much with her intention of ensuring that practices, policies and guidance related to misconduct are aligned with the code of ethics, as appropriate. Amendment 7 will mean that the chief constable will have one year from the commencement of the new section to carry out the review. That is important because it will allow the code of ethics to be published and the new set of conduct regulations to be made, ensuring that the review will be of the up-to-date polices, practices and guidance. I ask Parliament to support the amendment. The Deputy Presiding Officer: I call Sharon Dowey to wind up and to press or withdraw amendment 7. Sharon Dowey: I have nothing to add. I press the amendment. Amendment 7 agreed to.”
“The chief constable is also required to make changes that are appropriate in light of the code of ethics, as soon as practicable. The amendment requires the review to take place within a year of the commencement of the new section, allowing time for the code of ethics to be published and the new set of conduct rules to be put in place before the review begins. That means that the review will be of the new policies, practices and procedures to ensure that they are fit for purpose. It is our responsibility as a Parliament to ensure that the legislation that we pass is meaningful and effective. Amendment 7 goes some way towards ensuring that I am happy to move amendment 7. Angela Constance: I support amendment 7, which places a one-off duty on the chief constable to review misconduct policies, practices and guidance.”