Sin Boon Ann
Singapore
“Madam, with growing affluence, rising obesity has also become a national problem. Other than the health risk for the individuals, there are other related problems such as healthcare expenses, loss in productivity and so on.”
“Madam, mental health problems still hold some stigma in the society and will prevent patients from seeking help and professional advice early and impede their re-integration into the workforce and community after treatment.”
“Sir, the silver tsunami is almost upon us and we must be prepared for the transformation of our social landscape. One in every five residents will be above the age of 65 by 2030. Many Singaporeans can expect to live another 20 years more but the quality of life can vary greatly.”
“If they are eligible for HDB concessionary loans, they will not be affected. However, quite a number of HDB upgraders or downgraders do not qualify for such loans. They may be upgrading due to additional children in the family or taking in elderly parents.”
“Sir, rigorous and thorough training for our servicemen is necessary to prepare them adequately for their role as defenders of our country. However, training safety is just as important.”
“But I feel more needs to be done to consolidate the understanding even further. What are MINDEF's action plans with this aspiration in mind? What are the upcoming educational publicity and other programmes MINDEF has planned to enhance the awareness and understanding of our public.”
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“Mr Speaker, Sir, the present Bill before this House to amend the SAF Act seeks to improve the administration of military justice and to allow for the appointment of outside auditors to audit the SAF SAVERS Scheme, a pension plan unique only to the SAF. While the amendment may be limited in scope, the issues that the Bill seeks to address may well be fundamental in nature. This Bill addresses the process by which a court martial is constituted and further defines the types of court martial that may be convened. As a consequence, when approved by Parliament, the SAF (Amendment) Act will provide for the appointment of a panel of members from whom the convening authority, who after the Act will now be a single person, may choose, and will allow for a qualified person acting as a single judge to try cases. The amendment has provided the Government with much flexibility in constituting and convening a court martial from a panel. While I can accept the need for flexibility, it is important for us to bear in mind that flexibility must not come at a price of unwittingly undermining confidence in the administration of justice. Sir, the process of determining the outcome is as important as the outcome itself. This is particularly true in the administration of justice. It is for this reason that our Constitution goes through great lengths to ensure that the trial of any accused person is fair and just; and that question must equally be determined by looking at the process by which judges are appointed, who makes the appointment, whether there is security of tenure in relation to the appointment of judges.”
“Sir, do I take it that it is also not within the remit of the Council on Governance to determine how much a charity or an IPC can keep as its reserve in its accounts in order to meet its future expenditures?”
“Sir, in our debate last year, the issue of conflicting demand of the Sports School was raised by several Members in this House. Essentially, the idea is for the Sports School to groom our next generation of sportsmen who are of suitable calibre and who can help us break out of this long medals famine in the world sporting arena. Not all sportsmen are necessarily academically inclined. There are many who are well-talented in sports, but who do not come across academically. So when it was announced that the Sports School requires minimum academic standards as a pre-requisite for admission, it does seem a little bit conflicting with its original intention, as that by itself would deprive many capable boys and girls with sporting talent from qualifying for school. The Minister, in his reply, said that the criteria for admission are that the students must first have talent in sports and that sports are a primary consideration for admission. However, Sir, unfortunately, the general perception still persists that academic requirements still prevail and that those who go in on pure sporting talent alone are few. I would therefore like to ask the Minister whether the school still accepts students with ability in sports but without strong academic ability and, if so, how many have the school accepted so far.”
“In the one year since we started the IRCC, we have not got anywhere nearer to our objectives, or have these been captured by the concerns for formality rather than substance. I would therefore like to ask the Minister whether he thought the IRCC, while well-conceived, is really working out the way in which it is intended, or is it one of those programmes that got more attention to its form rather than its substance. I would also like to ask the Minister one more question, whether more can be done to improve the level of social cohesion in our society today. Volunteerism”
“It is highly unlikely that interaction with the other ethnic groups extends to social settings, where there are frequent social exchanges in the context of home visits and outings. It is also highly unlikely that we have over the years gained a better understanding of each other's religious and cultural practices. Yet, in Singapore, because of our firm belief and affirmation that we are a nation founded on multi-racial and multi-religious principles,we are concerned tosay anddo things that are correct in appearance. In other words, we make every effort to ensure that our presentation of images of Singapore must necessarily portraythe major races here. After a while, such presentations appear rather contrived as the form seems more important than the substance. The question is how much of the other races have Singaporeans really come to understand. This question becomes even more pressing after the September 11 incident. Indeed, our Government thought it important enough thata new initiative to start the IRCC began to take root with the grassroots organisations. The idea was to actively promote inter-racial understanding. Various programmes to promote the objective of IRCC were, therefore, put in place. However, it soon became apparent to many that the grassroots organisations were just going about organising the IRCC events in an almost mechanistic way. There are the usual visits to the places of worship, the token Malay dance at a Lunar New Year function, and the perfunctory participation of all ethnic groups at each major ethnic group's event. I am not saying that these are necessarily wrong. The problem is how much understanding have we really fostered within the society by doing these things.”
“Sir, Singapore has never been a melting pot of races, but a salad bowl of cultures and religious beliefs. Likethe salad, we do not merge our identities, but co-exist in an atmosphere of respect and tolerance for each other. This atmosphere of respect and tolerance has been tested at various times in the past and recently, it has been stretched yet again, following the arrest of some members of the militant Muslim group, the Jemaah Islamiyah. For Singapore, we have always prided ourselves in social stability. It is this stability that has given us the premium that we are able to command with foreign investors. Yet, we cannot take this stability for granted. We have to remind ourselves, time and again, that the foundation to social stability has been relative cohesiveness of our society. Our bonding as a society, Sir, would have been a lot stronger and thus, leading to a more stable society, if our people were a melting pot of raceand cultures. However, we have never been one and should never pretend to be one. There is, therefore, a greater onus placed on us to ensure that Singaporeans continue to hang on asone and to treat our future as one collective destinydespite our differences. It would not be wrong for us to say that after close to 40 years as an independent nation, we are not anywhere nearer to the point where our people can safely say that they have deep knowledgeand understanding of each other's religious and cultural practices,where we can say that our closest and trusted friends whom we may go out with sociallyare those from the other ethnic groups. Instead, what is probably true is that for the majority of Singaporeans, interaction with those from the other ethnic groups is confined to the marketplace or workplace.”
“Sir, as much has been said in this House in the last few days on procreation, I do not think I can procreate any more new ideas to this discussion. I therefore would like to pass on this cut.”
“It is my understanding that in other countries, the elderly citizens are actively encouraged to share their experiences either in relation to life or work experience with the next generation in order that the wisdom and knowledge that was accumulated is not lost in that generation. The need to pass on the cumulated wisdom and experience becomes even more acute as a greater number of well-educated and highly skilled Singaporeans retire. These Singaporeans would not only have worked locally but have also widened their experience through regional engagements. There is much that succeeding generations of Singaporeans can learn from. I would therefore like to ask the Minister whether more can be done, and on a systematic basis, to harness the wisdom and experience of Singaporean retirees for the benefit of younger Singaporeans. Elderly Programmes and Services”
“As was expressed by my colleagues earlier, Sir, Singapore is a maturing and aging society. Increasingly, and with our present birth rate, we will have more Singaporeans who are retirees than we have those who are working adults. With better healthcare and consequently, better life expectancy, we are expecting Singaporeans to enjoy many good years on retirement. Sir, retirement is always a frightening prospect for many. The common question that confronts almost all people who are at the crossroads of retirement is how they are going to spend the retirement years. At my meet-the-people sessions, I have many elderly citizens coming to see me for work, even though they do not need to work and could well do with a well-earned rest. However, the idea of sitting around and not doing very much at home other than look after their grandchildren is a prospect that frightens many, especially when for them, sitting around in the final phase of their life is not something they want to think about. This is really a pity because many of the retirees retire with a wealth of experience and health to go on. There is, at least, for many a good10 more years that they can contribute to society. The problem is that the culture of spending their time fruitfully by contributing something meaningful to society does not come naturally to the elderly. Today, only about 11% of seniors, aged 65 and above, are volunteers. The NCSS has established a local chapter of retired volunteer programme. There are many retired Singaporeans who have a wealth of experience and skills that they can pass on to the next generation. However, it is unfortunate there are very few well-established programmes which provide the opportunity for the sharing to take place.”
“Sir, we have had this debate on training safety several times in this House. Each time, MINDEF will take pains to assure parents of our National Servicemen that their children are in safe hands. I have no doubt that the Government is very serious and committed that our soldiers train in a safe environment and that no expenses will be spared to ensure maximum safety in all circumstances within what is reasonably possible for them. What I would like to caution is that no amount of improvements to safety standards is going to guarantee that there will be no accidents in training. As we have heard earlier, very often accidents can happen because of human error and miscalculations. And even if MINDEF makes every effort to improve the safety environment, accidents do and will occur. Perhaps the issue is not whether or not MINDEF convenes an enquiry each time an accident takes place or training standards are reviewed regularly. What matters is how we rank, in terms of safety standards. It would help the public if MINDEF would perhaps have a benchmark that measures their safety level against the training safety level in comparable armed forces elsewhere. This would provide a better comparison on the extent to which MINDEF has paid attention to training safety and would also, at the same time, provide much assurance to parents that their children are in safe hands. I cannot reasonably expect my son, when he goes to National Service, not to be in danger. But if I know that the odds of getting hurt in a road accident are higher than when he is training under the SAF, for me, speaking as a parent, I will be very much assured indeed.”
“Sir, no one ever said that maintaining SAF as an effective and credible fighting force to defend our homeland is going to be cheap. However, we have, over the years, been able to build up the SAF into a highly regarded organisation, while keeping a cap on the SAF expenditure at no more than 6% of GDP. Our Government has consistently maintained a high level of expenditure, even when the economy seems uncertain. Our budget policy towards defence spending raises one basic issue. Should we continue to spend so much or even increase our defence budget when the economy does not appear to be so robust? Sir, to be sure, the issue has been raised in previous years, and will no doubt be an evergreen issue as MINDEF, together with the other Ministries, will have to compete for limited resources that are available. In terms of total expenditure in absolute terms, the actual amount that the Government is spending this coming fiscal year on defence is definitely going up by 4.5% over 2003's budget. This is quite a significant increase. I would therefore like to ask the Minister why there is an increase in our defence spending. Secondly, whether MINDEF has made every effort into ensuring that increases in expenditure could not have been partially offset by other savings within the organisation.”
“The issue, therefore, is the extent to which the public can be assured that there is proper segregation between the work of intelligence officials and the elected leaders whose task is to take political decisions based on the outcome of intelligence reports. No doubt, this issue will be addressed in the next few months as the public enquiries in the UK and US progress. What has happened overseas will no doubt be relevant in Singapore. I would like to ask the Minister what assurances there are for Singaporeans that our intelligence gathering is accurate and reliable, and that the work of intelligence officials will not be unduly hampered by the interference of any party, to avoid a repeat of what has taken place elsewhere.”
“Sir, the Western alliance, comprising mainly the US and the UK, went to war with Iraq last year, almost certain that the evidence they had on hand would prove beyond doubt that the belief that President Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. So confident were the Americans that Mr Collin Powell went to the United Nations Security Council, believing that the photograph he had was enough to convince the world. One year on, after the invasion of Iraq and the fall of President Saddam Hussein, we are nowhere nearer to finding any weapons of mass destruction than when we first started out with. All they ever found were some old canisters, probably used for chemical weapons. These were probably remnants of the time when Iraqis wielded chemical weapons against the Iranians and the Kurds. There was certainly no evidence of any nuclear, biological or even chemical weapons that were ready for deployment within 40 minutes, as the British Prime Minister had led the world to believe then. It is becoming increasingly clear in the minds of many that there were probably no weapons of mass destruction or any programme leading to the development of weapons of mass destruction. This has become most embarrassing to political leaders on both sides of the Atlantic who have been left scrambling for an explanation for the failure of intelligence gathering in the run-up to the Iraqi war. Of course, there had been accusations of political interference in the work of intelligence officials which led to the famous BBC comment that intelligence reports had been sexed up to gain public support.”
“Whereas the soldiers in the past were being prepared to fight conventional wars, in the aftermath of September 11, we are now mindful that the SAF may also have to engage in low intensity battles with enemies that may not be as easily defined. Such a transformation may at times require a paradigm shift in the way in which doctrines are written and training schedules are planned. I would like to ask the Minister to share his vision to the extent possible of the kind of organisation that the SAF is likely to evolve itself into in the next 10 years, whether the SAF, as an organisation, is nimble enough to deal with changes in the nature of challenges that we face. For instance, can the SAF deal with low-intensity conflict as opposed to having to fight in a conventional warfare? Are we confident that our on-going efforts to transform the SAF will be adequate to prepare our armed forces to adequately deal with the situation when it arises?”
“Sir, if we look at the SAF today, we will realise that it is a very different organisation from what it was when it first started. The SAF has over the years transformed itself into a lean and well-organised armed force that leverages heavily on technology as a force multiplier. This reliance on technology has given the SAF the edge that it enjoys today. In fact, independent analysts hold the SAF in very high regard as an effective fighting force in the region. The experience of the recent war in Iraq has proven the effectiveness of leveraging on technology to fight a modern war. This shows that we were doing the right thing in moving in the direction that we did. Yet, we know that the transformation was no easy task. It requires vision and far-sighted planning to bring these changes. Even before the Iraq war, I am sure our planners had an idea of how military technology is evolving, and must have thought about using information technology and smart weapons as an integral part of our defence system. I am grateful that MINDEF has, on its part, invested resources into making this possible. In fact, more than just relying on foreign technology to meet our needs, our Government has even got down to designing weapons systems and platforms to ensure that our armed forces are equipped with tools to meet our own local specific requirements. There is never an end point in a transformation process. For the SAF, the organisation is constantly evolving. Besides, even aside from the transformation in the way in which battles are fought, the conditions and nature of the battlefield are also evolving.”
“Sir, in recent years, our country has been involved in UN's various peacekeeping missions largely through communication, logistical, medical provisions and support staff to countries, such as Cambodia, Afghanistan, East Timor and Iraq. SAF, for instance, assisted in UNTAET's peacekeeping mission efforts in May 2001 to maintain law and order in East Timor by contributing a platoon of combat peacekeepers for the first time, on top of Ship Landing Tanks, medical teams and military staff officers. It was also the first time that we had the full NSmen as well as operationally ready NSmen who embarked on this mission. The SAF has also deployed staff in the Gulf region in support of Iraq's reconstruction in recent times where the 10th team is still serving. In the light of increasing overseas deployment of SAF, what are the policies drawn in preparation for engaging them in frontline action and where do we draw the line? How prepared are our inventory for such a scenario? Will there ever be a scenario where we will engage in frontline action on behalf of another country? SAF”
“And I think the association will be in a better position to properly assess the credit risk. This does not mean that the cooperative must necessarily be loss making. The interest charged may be higher, and I am told that this is not an issue with the SMEs who are members of the association. Sir, I think that such an approach may well work, and it may well obviate the need for an SME bank, because banks operate a wider scope of functions than that which is required for SMEs. For instance, banks provide deposit taking and treasury services which, for the moment, I do not think SMEs require. I therefore would like to ask the Minister whether the Government will seriously consider supporting the call for a credit cooperative for SMEs in Singapore. Talent Management”
“Sir, this subject of funding the SMEs is not new. I have heard the comments of my colleagues earlier about how difficult it is to get support for the SMEs in relation to their funding needs. The perception still remains that it is quite difficult to navigate through the maze of the bureaucratic rules in order to get some support from the Government. Rightly or wrongly, the perception remains that it is easier to move a mountain than to try and qualify for the scheme. This may have been an exaggeration but I think there is an element of truth in this. Many SMEs find the paperwork and the compliance requirements to be rather overwhelming. On top of that, I think many will agree with me that the recent merger of local banks did not help to expand the choices available for our SMEs to choose from. In fact, many SMEs find themselves squeezed with credit lines withdrawn as a result. One of the problems with lending to SMEs has to do with the inability to properly assess the credit risk of the SME applicant. I believe this problem can be easily overcome if we can bridge the information gap. In this regard, I would propose that the Government continues to work with the SMEs to set up a credit cooperative to help the small enterprises that would have difficulty with the local financial institutions to raise funds. Our Government can help kick start this process by helping to seed the initial fund. Our strong financial control system will help to ensure that the money is properly applied. However, the SMEs can help to run it. The reason is clear. The cooperative will help to overcome the information gap that exists presently because the lending institutions are not in a position to fully comprehend the business of the SMEs.”
“Madam, ASEAN governments have a moral duty, as well as economic interest, in safeguarding the safety and security of our sea lanes and, in particular, the Malacca Straits. Ships plying in the region are our life-blood and they continue to underpin the region's economic foundation. Lately, there have been several reports of increasing number of incidents of piracy in the region. Last year, there were 445 cases of piracy reported, up from 370 cases reported in 2002. It is with concern that I note that Southeast Asia has acquired a notorious reputation of being one of the most dangerous places for commercial shipping. I note that the Singapore Government has stepped up security measures to combat piracy in the region. The formation of a high-level task force to boost maritime security evidently demonstrates this commitment. This is very assuring for Singaporeans indeed and also for the shipping industry. However, we all know that the efforts to combat piracy are not just the Singapore Government's alone, but also the collective efforts of the ASEAN governments. I would like to ask the Minister whether greater efforts have been made towards getting the regional governments to work closely to deal with this problem once and for all. And if efforts have been made, would the Ministry give us an idea of the plans that have been put in place to deal with the problem?”
“This will also give them an opportunity to understand Japanese people and culture better. We do not have such an arrangement with Japan at the moment, but I thought it would be good if the two countries can have one. I would like to ask if the Ministry would consider such an arrangement with Japan. Middle East”
“Madam, we have enjoyed close ties and cooperation with Japan over many decades since independence. We are mindful that the Japanese MNCs were early investors in Singapore and have helped transformed Singapore into what it is today. Japan is also one of the first countries that have concluded an FTA with us, which we believe will begin a new chapter in our bilateral ties. It has been a year since we signed the FTA with Japan and, I am sure there are many issues that the two Governments have yet to iron out. I would like to ask the Minister if he could give us an update of how the FTA is working out, thus far, and whether there are outstanding issues to-date. And, if so, what these issues are. Separately, I also know that the number of Japanese arrivals in Singapore has fallen in recent times and this has affected our tourism industry somewhat. In order to attract more Japanese tourists to Singapore, our Government should perhaps look into new initiatives. Recently I had lunch with a Japanese diplomat in my capacity as the Embassy's Legal Counsel in Singapore. Over lunch, he told me that Japan has tied up working holiday programmes with several countries. This allows young Japanese to travel to foreign places on working holiday trips, which can last between six months and a year. Japanese travelling in such countries get special visas to work. The Japanese Government felt that this is a good exposure for the Japanese because it gives the Japanese a better opportunity to understand their host culture better at close quarters. This will help to strengthen the bonds between the two countries on a people-to-people basis. Equally, countries that have concluded such treaties would also be able to have their young people go over to Japan to work and stay for a limited duration.”
“Madam, like Malaysia, Indonesia is a close neighbour of ours and we have had the good fortune of maintaining close ties with the Indonesian Government over the years. This strong foundation, which was laid by Mr Suharto, has helped us to continue with our close exchanges during the period of political transition. However, as with the concern expressed by my colleague and Chairman of the GPC, I know that a number of issues have surfaced in recent times which have put our ties to the test. And, sharing the sentiments of my colleagues here, I would just like to reiterate my concern relating to the supply of sand and also the dispute over trade statistics that we have with the Indonesians. I would like to ask the Minister how far we have progressed in our discussions on these issues with the Indonesian Government and also whether or not more can be done to strengthen the ties between our two countries.”
“Madam, during the recent Chinese New Year celebrations, Singapore and Malaysian leaders showed a high level of goodwill on both sides. This is a welcome development as I am sure we would rather much prefer that both sides spend their energy focusing on the positive rather than the negative aspects of their relationships. There is much that both Singapore and Malaysia can benefit from closer cooperation than intense competition. The interests that both countries share, as we have said many times before in this House, need not be mutually exclusive. It is not a zero sum game, but one which we can bring about a win-win situation for the two countries. Since the last update in this House on the progress of the various issues that we have with Malaysia, I would like to ask the Minister whether there has been any further progress on our on-going talks with Malaysia; for example, whether we have plucked any fruits yet and whether there is any real basis for hope that the new leadership in Malaysia will signal the dawn of a new beginning between the two countries.”
“Once we set out the rules of governance for the IPC, we will be in a better position to see what part of these rules is also appropriate for the charities. Then we will progressively extend these rules of governance to the charities as well. I take in Mr Sin Boon Ann's point that there ought to be a code of governance and we are progressing along that path. The council will set out the rules and we will implement these rules first for the IPCs and increasingly, where these rules are relevant, we will be able to codify these for the other group of charities. Sir, I think I have answered all the questions.”
“The Commissioner of Charities, when he accepts a particular organisation as a charity, has certain rules, ie, the objective is charitable purposes, 80% of the income should be spent on the purposes that are set out, their charity is meant for Singaporeans and not for overseas because we do not want organisations to be set up in Singapore, raise funds and then remit the funds overseas. There are certain rules put in place by the Commissioner of Charities. I take the Member's point that we should review the regulations on how charities are allowed to raise funds and how these funds are spent, that there should be better transparency so that people who donate to these charities can be assured that their money is put to the right purpose. This is what we are progressively trying to do. The starting point is to insist that they put up their accounts on the Internet so that anybody who wants to donate to these charities can look at their past years' accounts and see how they have spent the money. When it comes to the next group of institutions, called the Institutions of Public Character, I think this group comes under a stricter regime because the donations enjoy double tax deductions. The way we go about it is to set up a framework so that not just IRAS confers this IPC status but, in fact, we have 11 central fund administrators, each for different sectors, whether for the arts, for sports, for community service, etc, because these fund administrators understand the sectoral demands much better than IRAS. This is how we administer the IPC regime. The council that we recently started - the Council on Governance for the IPC - again, it is meant to look after the IPC. But we will not stop there.”
“We have reached out to those in the prisons. I think we have made a more concerted effort in this exercise. We are constantly reviewing our performance. For the next exercise next year, we hope that this number will be further brought down. Ms Braema suggested recognising samsui women in the National Day Parade. I will pass that suggestion to MINDEF which is in charge of National Day parades. Dr John Chen asked whether we will conduct an overall review of safety nets and Government subsidies. I think he has pointed out a very important challenge facing us. As the economy matures, as the population gets much older, we do need to constantly review our safety nets. I think that is what the DPM sets out to do in putting out the philosophy and the approach towards university education and healthcare expenditure because these are the two areas which will grow in the long-term. On whether we will extend means testing beyond healthcare, we are increasingly doing so. In the many MCDS financial assistance schemes, these are all targeted. "Targeting" means that we need to do case management, we need to look at the situations of the people and see how deserving they are of the assistance. The more deserving cases will then be given higher assistance. Finally, let me turn to charities. From the questions raised, clearly there is a need for us to explain our whole approach to charities. Let me just try to do so in a very quick way. There are two groups. The first group is charities where the income is exempted from income tax. Then there is another group called the Institutions of Public Character where the donations are exempted from income tax or they get double tax deduction. We have many organisations which are registered as charities. We have about 1,600 registered charities.”
“For that particular aspect, I will get the Ministry officials to examine this and see whether they can come under the same rule as we do for the other Ministries. Let me turn to the ERS raised by Ms Braema and Dr Tan Boon Wan. I think we have learnt from our first exercise. In this particular exercise, in fact, we do not require the elderly to put up the $50 top-up. All they need to do is sign the form authorising us to deduct $100 from this year's ERS, and that means they will qualify for this year's ERS as well as next year's ERS. It is a simple exercise. They just sign the form and we do not require them to put up the $50 cash. It is already a great improvement. The reason why we do want that act is to make sure that people are around to put up their hands and say that they do qualify for the money. As we discovered, out of the nearly 80,000 who did not qualify for the ERS this year, nearly 24,000 have invalid addresses. The bulk of these people with invalid addresses are people who left Singapore before the 1995 identity card conversion exercise. Many of these people could have died overseas. It is important for us, in going through this exercise, that we discover such situations. Otherwise, we would have been merrily paying out all this money and it has been collected by I do not know who. What we have done is the right thing. But, at the same time, we are looking at all the various categories and if we can improve the implementation and make sure that those for which the ERS is targeted at, do receive the shares. Members will know that we have mounted a very big exercise by getting the grassroots leaders to visit the 1- and 2-room flats. We have reached out to the old folks, the long-stayers in the hospitals and in the nursing homes.”
“We have less problems with the arts and cultural groups because many of them can be classified as charitable organisations and if they are registered as charities, and if 80% of the funds raised is used for the purpose for which they are set up, then they are exempt from tax. The problem is therefore not as comprehensive as Mr Ng painted out. I think it is more acute in the case of sports associations because the National Sports Associations do not qualify for charity registration. Notwithstanding that, we do take a fairly benign approach, for example, capital grants and donations from the public to sports organisations are not taxed. The basic problem which Mr Ng Ser Miang raised is that some of the other rules, for example, the 50% income rule, that 50% of income must come from members. This rule is necessary because we want to differentiate a business or an organisation that collects revenue by providing services to others, in which case, it is more akin to a business than an association meant for the benefit of its members. That is why we have the 50% rule. The second rule is that only Government operating grants which are given to the sports associations are taxed. The way we see it is that the operating grant is treated similarly like revenue for the sports associations and, therefore, this is treated in the context of a revenue and is taxable. Mr Ng Ser Miang brought up the point that sometimes, because of timing and prudence, these Government grants are not spent for a particular fiscal year and for us to tax it may encourage the sports associations to spend them just before the end of the financial year.”
“45 pm But in this debate on marriage and procreation and since foreign maid levy has been raised as one of the 50-odd suggestions, my Committee will take a look at them. For the purposes that it was designed, it should have been appropriately named as "Working mothers' tax relief". Next, let me turn to GST. Our approach to GST is that it should be a broad-based consumption tax and that it is not wise for us to differentiate between different groups of people. If we say that we should give exemption to the disabled, then I think another group could make an equally cogent case for exemption for education, exemption for babies and exemption for all different groups. In the end, we will end up with a very complicated GST system, like what we see in many countries. When we embarked on the GST in 1994, we did a very comprehensive study. We decided that in the long term, it is better to have a clean GST system, like what they have in New Zealand, rather than have a very complex system with all kinds of exemptions and then we have to constantly make rulings whether this exemption is allowable. For example, if milk for babies is exempted, we will have to differentiate milk for adults. We do not want to run into all these problems. It raises compliance cost. Our GST tax rate at 3% when we started, and 5% now, is very low and if we have all these exemptions and complications, the cost of administering the GST will be much higher. Mr Ng Ser Miang put up a very persuasive case for sports organisations. Let me try and put it in a broader context. I think the problem arises because sports organisations are not defined as charitable organisations.”
“So, because of the higher costs incurred, particularly through the construction of the Circle Line and the Kallang Expressway, the funding has gone up. Where there is merit, we will continue to support the building of such systems. Let me now turn to foreign maid levies. Again, when Members look at certain tax schemes, I would appreciate it if they understand the purpose of the tax scheme. The foreign maid levy relief was put in place with the primary purpose of encouraging working mothers to return to the workforce. As you know, our labour force participation rate for women is not very high compared to the other OECD countries, and we do want to encourage working mothers to return to the workforce. So, the foreign maid levy relief was designed for that purpose, ie, to encourage the working mother to return to the workforce and, at the same time, we allow relief from the foreign maid levy. But when we start looking at this particular arrangement and you look at it from the objective of procreation or of looking after aged parents, then of course you will say that this is not adequate. But, for the other purposes, we have other schemes and arrangements for them. For procreation, for example, we have the Enhanced Child Relief, special tax rebates and the further tax rebates. For looking after aged parents, we have the Aged Parents Relief, which amounts to $5,000 per parent. If you have both parents living with you, you can claim a total parent relief of $10,000, which is much more than the foreign maid levy relief which is capped at $8,280. So, we have other schemes targetted or meant for other social objectives. 1.”
“Beyond a certain level, if we keep tying these two together, then we will defeat the purpose of the SRS as a complementary or a supplementary scheme to the CPF. So, for the time being, since the reduction is not a very big one, it still makes sense to peg it, but we will have to examine this. It cannot be an automatic peg. In the end, we have to reach a balance, ie, how to encourage people to save more and at the same time not giving them such a big tax advantage in doing so. So, we will continuously review this linkage. Mr Andy Gan suggested that we should target the tax collection from road taxes towards transport expenditure. As a general rule, it is not good financial management to pre-allocate tax collection to a particular purpose, because the chances are that resources will be misallocated. We collect taxes on cars primarily because we are a very compact urban city and we have to control the car population. So, the tax collection is for that purpose. On the other hand, we incur quite heavy expenditure both on road building and on mass transit systems, based on our assessments of the needs. I would like to assure Members that we will continue to spend appropriately when necessary on road building, on mass transit, to improve safety for pedestrians and to improve the entire traffic and pedestrian walkway system. But this should be assessed based on its own merits and not because we have collected "X" amount from road taxes and, therefore, all this money should be channelled to road construction. This year, for example, the budget for the Ministry of Transport is in fact raised from $1.5 billion last year to $2.2 billion this year.”
“We have to have all kinds of rules to prevent anti-dividend streaming provisions like dividends being targetted at people with much lower personal income tax than the average shareholders. So, over the years, all these rules have accumulated, and the assessment from the business community is that we ought to go to a one-tier system. It is simpler, more direct, the compliance cost is lower and makes us more competitive. Hong Kong, for example, runs a one-tier system, and that is the reason why we have done so not so long ago. Of course, this affects certain groups, eg, the retirees, as Dr John Chen raised. But it is not true that we are taxing them twice. When the retirees pay GST, it is not paying out of savings. It is paying out of expenditure. So, when the retirees pay GST, they pay like every other Singaporean, ie, only when they spend on goods and services. Let me next turn to the SRS. I think Dr Tan Boon Wan brought up a valid point, ie, what is the appropriate posture we should take with regard to the SRS? If we want to encourage people to set aside more money in the SRS, then of course we should not have any caps. On the other hand, if we are too generous with the SRS, then this is a very big tax advantage for wealthy individuals. So, our current posture is that we encourage Singaporeans to set aside money for retirement, but we use the CPF salary ceiling as the cap for such contributions, so that the tax advantages of such savings are limited or capped to the CPF salary ceiling. So, when the CPF salary ceiling was brought down, correspondingly the SRS ceiling caps were also brought down. But I think Dr Tan Boon Wan brought up a valid point.”
“Our projection for this fiscal year is the same as the year 2000, where Members will remember, the world economy was doing well, the stock market was doing well. So, it is not an under-projection of what we expect to receive this year. Mr Inderjit Singh asked how is the performance compared to benchmarks. As you know, when we designate GIC and the various companies to invest the reserves, we also set for them international benchmarks like the MSCI and other benchmarks for bond funds. Compared to these benchmarks, our performance has been fairly good. But, basically, our overall philosophy in investing our reserves is a very prudent and conservative posture and, therefore, we cannot expect our returns to be very extraordinary. If we want returns to be extraordinary, then we have to take a higher risk and that, I think, is not the approach in investing our national reserves. Let me next turn to Dr John Chen's question on the tax on dividends. This was discussed a couple of years ago when we decided to move from the imputation system to the one-tier system. I think the reasons for having to make this move still remains today. If we have kept to the imputation system, we would have to have many, many very complex rules to make sure that the imputation system is correctly carried out and the companies would have been very greatly hampered in their approach. They would find difficulties in executing share buy-backs, share redemption, capital reduction. There will be higher compliance costs because, under the imputation system, we have to make sure that the dividends are issued out of income and not out of capital gains.”
“This is because the NII, as you all know, is defined as the dividends, interest and other incomes that are received by the Government from investing of reserves and also interest on loans that the Government gives out. Then, we have to net off the expenses that we have to incur on the investments and also the debt servicing costs, ie, the interest that we have to pay out on the loans that we take. So, if you look at this definition, you will notice that there is interest income and dividend income. The interest income would depend on the interest rates around the world. Dividend income would then depend on the performance of the global economy. If the global economy is doing well, companies are doing well, then of course profits are up and they will declare higher dividends. So, it is quite clear. For example, in 2001, when there was a global recession, our NII dropped to slightly below $2 billion. When we were budgetting for FY2003, we originally estimated an NII of $3 billion because we expected the global economy to recover. Unfortunately, because of the Iraqi war and the uncertainties, the global recovery in fact did not take place till the latter part of 2003. In addition, many big companies were intent on repairing their balance sheets and they were very conservative. So, even though the companies did well, the dividends policy was very conservative, and that is the reason why, instead of $3 billion, the NII came down to $2 billion. Going forward, we think the global recovery is gaining traction and, as you can see, the results of the companies are doing well. Therefore, this year we projected the NII income to be around $2.3 billion. This is not very much different from the year 2000, where we managed to get $2.24 billion from our NII.”
“It goes to reason that if we do not tax the foreign income, then it will not be right to allow foreign losses to be allowed. If we do so, then of course we are subsidising foreign operations, compared to local ones. But we do agree with Mrs Lim Hwee Hua that we do want to encourage and facilitate our local companies to go abroad. The way we go about it is not through a general tax scheme like what Mrs Lim proposed, but more targeted incentives and grant schemes. Under this approach, we have several arrangements or facilities. For example, under the overseas investment incentive, an approved Singapore-based company can defer its income taxes due from its profitable operations in Singapore for two years, if its approved overseas investment incurs operating losses during the first three years of the investment. So, this is a direct benefit. In addition, IE Singapore administers other various schemes which encourage and facilitate companies to go abroad. Examples would be like the regionalisation finance schemes. This gives us the opportunity to be more targeted rather than a blanket arrangement. Mr Inderjit Singh asked about the performance of NII. He described the returns as erratic. I would prefer to describe them as a little volatile over the last five years rather than erratic. But you notice that the NII has ranged from about $2 billion to $3 billion over the last five or six years. So, even in the most volatile financial situation that we have experienced since 1997/98, our NII has been around $2 billion to $3 billion. In the difficult years where there is low interest rate globally and where the global economic growth is low, then of course our returns are lower.”
“And for those other incomes which the companies do not have the exemption, they can continue to claim foreign tax credit for this foreign sourced income that is not covered by this exemption. The reason why we are reluctant to extend foreign sourced income to companies is because of the tax avoidance concerns. As you know, tax avoidance by companies in businesses is much easier through devices like transfer pricing and round tripping through jurisdictions with significantly lower tax rates in Singapore. So this is still a big concern and the tax loss through such a tax avoidance is a very significant amount. So that is the reason why we are reluctant to extend exemption of foreign sourced income from individuals to companies. Mrs Lim Hwee Hua asked about corporate taxes and group relief. I think she also understands the reasons why we have to be initially cautious in our implementation of group relief and we start off by saying that this is extended to subsidiaries which are 75% owned by the parent company. She asked for this to be extended to 50% ownership. We have looked at other tax jurisdictions and 75% is already fairly competitive. But of course we will keep reviewing our situation and if we can do so, then of course we will be prepared to make it more generous and move it down to 50% ownership. But as at today, at 75% ownership, we are already fairly generous. 1.30 pm The second rule is that these companies or subsidiaries should be registered or incorporated in Singapore. As you know, Singapore has a territorial and remittance system. So, we tax income which is earned in Singapore and we tax foreign income only when it is remitted to Singapore. Foreign income is not taxed, unless it is remitted to Singapore.”
“We think, overall, the tax burden on Singapore companies and Singapore individuals is light compared to other countries. If you look at Hong Kong, for example, the tax structure there is more heavily weighted on direct tax and the mix there is probably something more like 80/20, compared to our 54/46 because they do not have GST. Other countries, like Malaysia and Taiwan, do have the equivalent of a sales tax, or GST, and therefore the balance is more on the indirect tax. So we do consider this situation regularly. As DPM said yesterday, we are very comfortable with our position today. We think we have a very simple and very effective tax regime. But we have to continuously monitor the situation and if indeed the circumstances require us to readjust, then we will have to readjust. DPM explained yesterday that if we have to readjust by lowering further the corporate income tax or the personal income tax, we will have to look for other sources of revenue. But this is something that we will address when we have to cross the bridge. Among the review that we have to do is, of course, to look at the other tax structures like the flat tax structure in Hong Kong, which the Member also described. Sir, I would like to assure Members that we will continue to review our situation. The other point which the Member raised is whether we can extend the exemption of foreign sourced income from individuals to companies. I think Members are aware that for foreign sourced income received by companies, we exempted qualifying foreign sourced dividends, branch profits and service income at the last Budget. This exemption effectively covers 90% of total foreign sourced income remitted into Singapore.”
“Sir, I share the sentiments expressed by my colleague earlier in relation to a call for greater clarification in relation to which monies are raised, and how these monies are spent. I understand that there is a council formed to look into this area. However, I think there is an absence of a definitive code like the one you have in relation to the conduct of directors in companies. Perhaps, if the Government could consider a stronger regulatory environment in relation to the governance of charities, guiding these charities in the way in which they raise monies, the way in which monies are spent and the way in which these monies may be held to be more accountable to people who dig deep into their pockets to fund some of these voluntary organisations. The Second Minister for Finance (Mr Lim Hng Kiang): Sir, let me respond to the various issues raised. First, Mr Leong Horn Kee asked about the overall tax structure. I do not think there is any ideal long-term overall tax structure. I think we have to make the assessment as we go along, comparing the needs of our country together with our competitive position with other countries. What has happened over the last 10 years is that we have decided that there ought to be a better balance between the indirect and direct tax and therefore there has been a move since 1994 when we first introduced the GST to move the sharing between direct tax and indirect tax. So over the last 10 years, the proportion has gradually moved from 60/40 to about 54/46 today. With the reduction in the 2% corporate income tax and when we eventually reach 20% personal income tax, then we expect the mix between direct and indirect tax to be closer to about 52/48 or 50/50. This fits our circumstances and we are very comfortable with this position.”
“At the moment, we have a means test where you either qualify or you do not qualify for legal assistance or legal aid. I agree with my colleague's suggestion that perhaps a more flexible means test can be introduced to open up accessibility to justice for more Singaporeans in this regard. Compensation in Criminal Cases”
“Sir, I have previously asked in this House whether more can be done to improve public accessibility to justice. By this, I do not mean just having more lawyers, but making sure that we do not put ourselves in a position where only the rich have access to the judicial process, and hence justice. In his reply, the Minister gave the assurance that assistance given is adequate as the means test, which was revised recently, even allows someone who earns more than $1,000 to qualify for legal aid. Sir, I must confess that I am a little disappointed with the reply. Before I go on, I would like to declare, once again for the record, that I am a practising lawyer and hence may have an interest in the outcome of my comment. Sir, legal services are not cheap. Charges generally vary, based on the complexity of the matter and the standing of the lawyer concerned. Going to court to litigate a matter and to defend against a charge can set a person's finances back quite substantially. A three-day trial can easily set a party back by $10,000. If a man with a wife not working with two school-going children to feed, and not to mention aged parents to support, is barely making over $2,000 a month, how much savings do you think he will have? And how much more do you think he will have left over for legal expenses? Compared to the budget we set aside for healthcare subsidy, our budget for legal aid seems miniscule indeed. Yet, both legal aid and medical well-being are a necessary part of a person's happiness. In Singapore, I have worked out the sums of the extent of legal aid to about $1.60 per head. Whereas if we compare that to Hong Kong, the extent of legal aid comes to about $12 per head.”
“Only by allowing competitive forces to prevail can we be sure of us finding our place in the international economy where we can make a living for ourselves. We have no choice. Our survival depends on it. The only requirement on our Government is that its deeds must be equally matched by its words. I have no doubt that this Government will, as is evident in the proposed enactment of competition laws later in the year. ADJOURNMENT OF DEBATE Resolved, That the debate be now adjourned. - [Mr Wong Kan Seng].”
“As I see it, competitive pressures may compel us to force property prices down in the days ahead and, to mitigate the financial harshness of such an outcome, our Government may have to provide some form of subsidy or rebate on taxes for those who are more badly hit. Otherwise, more retiring Singaporeans will be forced to downgrade their residential properties and continue to work past their retirement age in order to see themselves through their golden years. And I am beginning to see more elderly Singaporeans coming to my meet-the-people sessions asking for help in terms of employment. This problem will get increasingly acute as our population ages and the economy matures. Our revenue collection to fund our public services will continue to decline. With 10% of the population paying tax while the rest of the working population does not, one wonders how such a model can effectively sustain a growing number of retirees who do not have enough savings to see them through old age. Going forward, in the coming years, if public revenue continues to decline because of shrinking tax base and if the state is still expected to deliver the same level of public services, I cannot see how this can be proceeded with without increasing the level of tax to be paid both by the individuals and companies. Madam, the challenges ahead of us are indeed formidable. If we truly believe that free market forces will help to make us more efficient and competitive, then the Government must press on with its efforts to divest more non-core assets, create a more open market to competitive forces, and refrain from intervening, except only where it is absolutely necessary to correct market imperfections or for strategic purposes.”
“This is a serious problem for us indeed. If it is indeed the case that Singaporeans are going to end up with negative equity, then I would say that it will be a very sad indictment for us indeed. Why is this the case? We must remember that Singaporeans have a reputation of having the highest saving rates in the world. In very few places in the world will you find the working population saving up to 50% of the salary, a savings rate which we once achieved. Even at 30% of salary, our savings rate is considered one of the highest. And, yet, the sad truth of the matter is that many Singaporeans who retire will not have enough to see them through their retirement. This problem, unfortunately, is somewhat aggravated by the losses sustained in property investment. Against the backdrop of financial exposure of many Singaporeans to property bought at relatively high prices is the difficult question of how much further should we allow property prices to slide. To make Singapore competitive, we have only dealt with part of the equation when the Government moved on, among other things, wage reforms and the CPF. However, we seem to have rather conveniently forgotten that land cost is the other major cost component in our economy. Because of the relatively high land cost, our reforms in wages to increase our competitiveness is at best only limited to an extent, as long as we have not reformed our property prices to help keep the cost of business competitive. The challenge for our Government really is how to bring prices of land down to an acceptable and competitive level without wiping out the wealth of property-owning Singaporeans.”
“The Government was concerned with the development of the property bubble, as was evident in its implementation of the anti-speculation measures. These measures, unfortunately, may have come a little too late. Rising property prices created a wealth effect among Singaporeans. Public housing sold at subsidised prices, only because Government was able to acquire land on the cheap, gave people the opportunity in a rising market to upgrade and move to bigger and more expensive housing. Through the 90s, many Singaporeans bought property at peak or near-peak prices. Often, properties were mortgaged to the credit limit, and many Singaporeans had housing loans and other loans up to their eyeballs. Indeed, it would not be wrong to say that much of the average Singaporean's CPF is spent on housing. Madam, there is nothing wrong with that, except for one material particular. This model assumes that property prices continue to defy the law of gravity and that the Singapore economy continues to grow and power away. If Singaporeans are hoping to cash in on capital gains to boost their nest egg when they retire, they may be in for a rude shock. What many of our fellow Singaporeans may have failed to appreciate though is the very real prospect of a deep recession similar to the one that Japan suffered from in the last decade. A deep recession will necessarily bring about asset deflation which will, in turn, have a negative knock-on effect on property prices. Singaporeans who draw on a substantial portion of their savings to fund their property purchases may end up with what others will call negative equity when they retire, ie, they will have substantially less cash in their savings because of the depreciating property value and interest charges.”
“Just last month, PowerSeraya announced a massive retrenchment exercise which affected more than 110 workers, some of whom had worked for the company for the better part of their lives. I believe that PowerSeraya closed because of competition and over-supply of electricity generating capacity of the company. Were we right in over liberalising the electricity market? Must the need for lower electricity cost and, hence, lower operating cost necessarily come in the form of building more generators? Of course, the prevailing argument is that in order for Singapore to compete, our cost must be sufficiently attractive and, for that to happen, our factors of production should be pegged at a level enough to attract investments. And so we tweaked our wage levels through CPF contributions and the imposition of flexi principle in wage restructuring to be competitive. However, that is only part of the equation. The other question is: how far should we and are we prepared to undertake reform in land pricing in order to help us improve our cost to value proposition to our prospective investors? This is a tricky question. Over the years, we have got ourselves into a conundrum over land. The wealth effect brought on by the increases in property prices in the 90s resulted in a frenzy of property developments, investments and, worse, speculation. Many, including a number of GLCs and even a bus transport company, got into the act. Singaporeans queuing up overnight for property launches were a common sight then. The social phenomenon of Singaporeans queuing up overnight did not begin with "Hello Kitty". Therefore, property prices escalated sharply over the years in tandem with the strong growth of our economy.”
“Madam, while we accept the logical imperative of the marketplace as the purveyor of choice and efficiency of distribution of scarce resources, it cannot be said that free competition will always result in greater benefit to the economy. In our hurried desire to subject ourselves to the full rigours of the market forces, we may have over-estimated what can be achieved through competition. Some developments in recent months raised concerns over whether privatisation is effectively the best route to raising efficiency and lowering price. I am referring to the apparent change of thinking on the wisdom of having two main operators for our mass rapid transit system; the apparent wastage from competition by hospitals in two sectors; the intense competition in the power generating industry where we are seeing an unrealistic over-capacity today. Can a market the size of Singapore sustain unbridled competition in all cases? The answer apparently is that it cannot. The recent suggestion that the North-East Line be passed on to the SMRT to operate in the face of mounting losses by SBS Transit seems to suggest a change of mind on the part of the Government. Moreover, many are indeed asking whether, within the context of the healthcare industry, it makes sense for us to have two gamma knife centres for neurosurgery. Are we necessarily better off with competition at this level? What is perhaps more startling is the extent of wastage that competition produces. In the case of the power industry in Singapore today, our present supply of electricity exceeds peak demand by 74%, according to EMA data. The consequence of over-supply is perhaps no more keenly felt than the cost in human terms.”
“In other words, in the scheme of things, we may be no better than the command style of economy of the communists. Because everywhere you turn, you see the hands of the Government, either in public policy, or in the GLC, or in the TLC. The concern raised earlier is about the common perception of the people here in Singapore and I am referring to the example raised by my colleague, Dr Tan Cheng Bock. If we truly believe in the principle of competition, then we must continue to provide the right environment to foster a culture of entrepreneurship. DPM, in his Budget speech, has indeed recognised the need to promote enterprise and initiative. Apart from the Budget, our Government's commitment is clearly demonstrated by the adoption of the Yellow Pages rule, that is, Government should not go into business which literally can be found in the Yellow Pages. How far the Government is prepared to adhere to this principle remains to be seen. However, I am pleased to note from DPM's statement that the Government is continuing to aggressively divest its non-core business while maintaining its strategy of growing a global presence, partly through established brand names like SingTel, the Raffles group of hotels and the ST Group. It is only by freeing up the local market to the local small and medium enterprises that we are able to better provide a conducive environment to allow the best of local talents to be brought out by competitive forces. This will truly free up any constraints of public and social obligations which GLCs and TLCs are faced with simply because of their Government connections. Perhaps in the longer term, it may be better if our Government completely divests itself out of any business that does not have any strategic significance to the development of the country.”
“What then emerged are hybrid entities that are partly public because of the way these agencies are wholly or partially owned by Government and partly private, because these agencies are private law corporations that are typically not subject to public accountability. Business as a result came to be dominated by these big corporations, leaving little room for the small and medium enterprises to effectively develop. Unlike Taiwan, Korea and Japan, Singapore does not have many large privately held enterprises of the scale known in these countries. What results, whether we accept it or not, is a relatively weak state of affairs of our small and medium enterprises. This is an unfortunate outcome and an indictment of our policy process. After close to 40 years of independence and development, the absence of a strong SME sector is indeed a poor record of our economic success. Is it any wonder that very few well-known international brand names came out of the small and medium enterprises? Consequently, there is an effective absence of real competition in the marketplace. And we wonder why our SMEs are so weak compared to SMEs of the other countries. What this has resulted, Madam, according to one eminent local economist, Manu Bhaskaran, has been an over concentration of economic decision-making in Government hands. The central thesis in that argument, which I agree, relates to the highly unified and centralised decision-making by the Government. The consequential lack of diversity in economic decision-making simply means that the risk is substantially raised, as a mistake by the Government could be transmitted to a substantial part of the economy, causing dislocation in the process.”
“Mdm Deputy Speaker, I support our Government's policy for the new financial year. However, I do have a number of observations that, with your indulgence, Madam, I would like to make. Some weeks back, Mr Ngiam Tong Dow, an ex-senior civil servant at a public lecture gave a frank and surprising critical review of the manner in which public policy has evolved over the years. Mr Ngiam raised a number of policy issues in his address. Some revelations made by Mr Ngiam are indeed surprising, to say the least, and have set many of us thinking about whether some of the problems that Singapore is faced with today may not have had its genesis in some policy miscalculations earlier. Madam, it is an accepted wisdom in policy making that free market forces should be left to effectively and efficiently allocate goods and services, and state intervention should only take place principally where there are market failures. Underpinning this principle is the belief that the imperative of competition at the marketplace brings out the best in a person. However, in some, it may bring out the worst which is why, in some cases, it may be necessary for the Government to intervene. This perhaps explains why we introduced the Consumer Protection (Fair Trading) Act last year. However, the Government may also intervene for a number of other reasons. This may be for strategic reasons, as in the case of our interest in finance and manufacturing, or for social reasons, as in HDB's role as a real estate developer for public housing. Some of these functions were carried out by statutory agencies while others took the form of private corporations.”
“Sir, I think the Minister of State missed my point. If we are going to have a law that punishes parents for child abuse, there is obviously some concern on the part of parents that if one resorts to physically punishing a child, he may have crossed the line and broken the law. If the Government's policy is really one of concern of child abuse, then where does chastising a child end before it begins at abusing a child? And this obviously requires some level of public education.”