Teh Cheang Wan
Singapore
“The Board does not propose to reinstitute the procedure for the resale of flats at the respective Area Offices in Ang Mo Kio New Town. As a pilot project, the Board has centralised the resale of Ang Mo Kio flats at Sales Section, Maxwell Road.”
“At the contract price or whatever it is, and this is due to the mistake made by the HDB, the HDB has been quite generous. If the mistake made by the HDB staff has been to sell the flat at lower than the posted price, then the owner has the benefit of this mistake.”
“The Member for Potong Pasir is asking a question which I have to check for an answer. I do not carry with me the millions of accounts of HDB flat-owners with me. So I cannot give him an immediate answer. But I can assure the Member for Potong Pasir that those people will be refunded.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, since the announcement by HDB on 4th July 1986, 49 HUDC lessees appealed to the Board to buy their flats. All were unsuccessful. As at 20th September 1986, 27 HUDC flat owners had sold their flats in the open market. Twelve of them sold their flats above their original purchase prices.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, since the implementation of the policy, HDB has resold 13 HUDC flats from among those flats HDB bought back from the HUDC owners. In addition, HDB has sold 44 new HUDC flats. The slow sale of HUDC flats is due mainly to the depressed property market.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I have no figures readily available as to how many of these 49 HUDC flat-owners who requested the Board to buy back the flats have committed themselves to buying other property.”
The complete record
Every one of 1,213 lines we hold for Teh Cheang Wan, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 10 of 25.
“Mr Goh Chee Wee asked the Minister for Communications and Information, Second Minister for Defence and Second Minister for National Development (a) whether he will consider reviewing the quantum of diesel tax to be imposed on taxis if, after the fare increases, the demand for taxis drops significantly to the extent of adversely affecting the income of taxi drivers; and (b) if his Ministry will suspend the release of more taxis on the road until the supply and demand pattern has become clearer after the fares revision. The Minister for Communications and Information, Second Minister for Defence and Second Minister for National Development (Dr Yeo Ning Hong): Mr Speaker, Sir, the objectives of the taxi fare adjustment are to slow down the excessive demand for taxis brought about by unrealistically low fares and, at the same time, to provide the average taxi driver with an increase in take-home pay. The Member for Boon Lay's first question is concerned with the income of taxi-drivers, whether they will be affected by the new fares. We are confident that their income will increase because we believe the demand for taxis will not drop more than 15% after the fare adjustment. Sir, I understand the apprehension of the taxi-drivers at the moment. That is why we have asked the Ministry of Finance for a six-month period before the diesel tax is introduced. Let me say that before the period of six months is up, taxi-drivers will be able to see for themselves the full benefits of the increased fare. There is no better argument than for the taxi-drivers themselves to see the increased fare coming in. I am confident that this increase in fare will be the case.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, the Ayer Rajah Expressway (AYE), when completed, would run from Shenton Way in the east to Jurong Town Hall Road in the west, over a distance of 13 km. It forms the westward extension of the East Coast Parkway. The Expressway is being built in two phases. Phase I of the project between Shenton Way and Alexandra Road is now under construction. This stretch of the Expressway will be completed by early 1986. The second phase of the Expressway is now being designed. This phase of the project will involve the widening and upgrading of Ayer Rajah Road and Upper Ayer Rajah Road to expressway standards, with flyovers at major road intersections. Construction work is scheduled for commencement in late 1985 and completion by mid-1987. Seventeen lots of private land, 11 lots of State land, and some HDB land were affected by the first phase of the AYE. For the second phase of the Expressway, the PWD is unable to furnish details of the land that would be affected, since the design has not yet been finalized. However, a large proportion of the land off Ayer Rajah Road and Upper Ayer Rajah Road are State land and statutory board land which are occupied by Government institutions, such as the Kent Ridge Hospital, Science Park and National University of Singapore. Land required for this phase of the Expressway has already been set aside when these projects were built. REVIEW OF DIESEL TAX ON TAXIS 5.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, the villages along Pasir Panjang Road and South Buona Vista Road are largely in private ownership. There is no plan at the moment to redevelop the area comprehensively, The area around Zehnder Road, however, will be developed as an extension to the Science Park. AYER RAJAH EXPRESSWAY (Progress) 4. Encik Abbas Abu Amin asked the Minister for National Development if he will inform the House of the progress of the Ayer Rajah Expressway and details of areas affected for road widening.”
“Mr Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to report that the Committee of Supply has made progress on the Main and Development Estimates for the financial year 1st April, 1985 to 31st March, 1986 and ask leave to sit again tomorrow.”
“In other words, you find that the shops are located in various places in the estate and the resettlement cases do get shops which are just as good or as bad as the public because they are getting 50% of the shops allocated.”
“I suspect the Member for Potong Pasir also does not read it. In the Annual Report, in fact, HDB has listed out quite clearly the construction cost for each item. And if the Member for Potong Pasir has read it, he would know what is the construction cost of HDB flats. HDB has also published a bi-monthly Home magazine which is distributed to every resident. On the income ceiling for applying HDB flats, I have mentioned in this House that this would be reviewed. The Member for Toa Payoh brought up some points and I think I have answered most of them except a rather strange point. He says that HDB has built some playgrounds which are not wanted by the residents. This is a bit strange. I thought all Members are asking HDB to upgrade the amenities and to improve the environment of the estates, but this Member says that they are not interested in the upgrading o their amenities and asked HDB not to improve their environment. I will pass this message to HDB. The Member for Hong Kah brought up the point about shops for resettlement cases. I think he has been misinformed by his constituents. This happens quite often. A new Member of Parliament is generally very enthusiastic about his Meet-the-People sessions; so these people tell him all sorts of stories. The first point he brought up is that after waiting for 18 months they have still not been offered the shops. This is totally untrue. HDB usually offers shops straightaway. The second point he made is that HDB somehow keeps a lot of shops at a very bad location to be offered specially to the resettlement cases. This again is not true. HDB sets aside 50% of the shops for resettlement cases and, in fact, the locations of all the shops are inter-mixed.”
“Their complaint is not so much the great distance from home to the lorry park. What the lorry owners' association is talking about is that there are no office facilities in these lorry parks. There are no toilet facilities. There are no facilities for drinks. There is no place to park bicycles or motorcycles if the lorry driver rides a bicycle or motorcycle to get there, and so on and so forth. Anyway, HDB and URA are talking to them and I hope they will find a solution. It is a problem, but I believe that a solution can be found. On landscaping in front of the shops, perhaps some of the architects have been carried away by their own artistic approach. HDB has received a considerable number of complaints about the artificial hill blocking the view of the shops. HDB is aware of that and I hope that they will take the necessary action to rectify the landscape and resolve the complaint. On air-conditioners, this is arguable. Some people like the air-conditioner to be installed at a low level, while others like the air-conditioner to be installed at a higher level. I will ask HDB engineers to look into this again, and if the majority of the residents want to install their air-conditioners at a higher level, I think this can be done. There is no magic really that the air-conditioner has to be installed near the floor. On free car parking on Sundays and holidays, I will ask HDB and URA to look into it to see whether or not it is practical. The Member for Kuo Chuan has raised the point that HDB should give more publicity to its achievements. I would like to thank the Member for his suggestion. I will ask HDB to look into it, although HDB at present has a few publications. For example, we publish an Annual Report which, unfortunately, not many people read.”
“This is a problem which worries HDB very much, and HDB has paid great aftention to it. They have been checking on the problem of coloured water. It can be due to a rusty tank. It can be due to rusty supply pipes, and it can at times be due to the PUB sources also. HDB has not ignored this problem. They are looking into it and will take the necessary action. If it is necessary to change the water tank, HDB will change it. If it is necessary to change the water pipes, HDB will change them. The Member for Ayer Rajah also mentioned about the position of the kitchen sink. HDB is aware of this, and they are looking into it. On the location of the car park, I am not very sure which car park the Member is referring to. He said that access to car park is just like a jig-saw puzzle; it is difficult to reach that car park. If the hon. Member can let me know which car park it is, I will ask HDB to look into it. On lorry parks, this is a problem. Residents have been complaining that the lorries have taken up their car park lots and that there is a shortage of car parks in the estate. One lorry usually takes three to four car park lots because a lorry i's very much bigger. And also HDB car parks are not designed for lorries. For this reason, HDB has built a large number of fringe lorry parks, specially for lorries. Of course, the lorry drivers would very much like to park their lorries in front of their flats where, if they open their windows or they go near their windows, they can see their lorries. That is what they want. But unfortunately it is not practical to provide such a convenient lorry park. The URA and HDB are talking to the lorry owners' association on how to provide additional facilities to make these fringe lorry parks more functional.”
“If I have a son and he is not so bright, I can employ five tutors but he is not going to score an "A" result for me because he is just incapable. That is a practical problem. So it is the same with the unskilled workers. If he is an unskilled worker, no amount of supervision will make him skilled. Of the remaining 25% Singaporeans, most of them are skilled but they have different work anitudes. Before the war and in the 1950s and 1960s, the Singapore construction workers were just like the Japanese construction workers of today. They took great pride in workmanship. You do not need to be an expert architect, but just go and look at City Hall at the Padang, Mr Deputy Speaker and Members. Look at those columns. You ask the contractor today - and you can give him any amount of money - and say, "You produce a set of those columns for me." They will say, "No. It is not possible." Because the old Singapore workers, with that degree of skills, do not exist in Singapore today. In Singapore today, our workers do not take pride in their work. Our workers are more intelligent and more calculating and therefore their main interest is money, as the Member for Nee Soon said, "money-faced." They calculate as to how to make the most money out of his work and not trying to achieve the best workmanship. Even the skilled workers are adopting that sort of aftitude in Singapore. Poor workmanship is a problem with us today and the solution to this problem is to try hard to train a core of our own Singapore construction workers who take pride in their skills and who take pride in their work. If we achieve that, then we will return to the days of good workmanship. The Member for Fengshan also talked about the yellow water supply.”
“Even if we go higher. You will find that, in the old flats, the children have grown up. One family becomes two families, So among the 240 families living in 1-room flats, because their children have grown up, you may find that they have now become 300 families. But in its place, the HDB can only build 100 units of new flats. How do you put the 300 families into 100 new flats? It is a practical problem. This is obviously not possible. We cannot go around and say, "Now, after the new development, three families share one flat." You are going to get a big scream. So there is no other way out. 200 families have to move elsewhere, and this again is a practical problem. When we re-develop an old estate, a large number of residents in the old estate have to move out. We would very much like them to go back to the old estate, but this again is not practical. The Member for Fengshan and also the Member for Bukit Merah talked about poor workmanship. I have a feeling that a lot of other Members also complain about poor workmanship. This again is one problem which it is very difficult to find a solution. I would just simply explain. 75% of our construction workers in Singapore are guest workers, ie, they are not Singaporeans. They are foreign workers. Most of them are either unskilled or semiskilled. Only 25% of the workers are local workers. When you have this very large component of foreign workers who are semi-skilled and unskilled, you cannot achieve very good workmanship. There is a practical limitation. If the worker is unskilled, you can put three supervisors on his back, he is not going to produce good workmanship. It is as simple as that.”
“On the request of the Member that the residents living in these old estates should be allowed to remain in the old estates after the whole area has been redeveloped, that is to say, after the 1- and 2-room flats have been converted into larger flats, this again, I must explain, is not practical. I will give an example. 4.15 pm For example, in one block of 1-room improved flats, we have 240 units. Just for argument's sake, let us say in the whole estate we have five blocks of these 1-room improved flats and so we demolish these five blocks of flats. If we find that there are not enough car parks or not enough open space, nothing is built on the land occupying one block. But on the remaining four blocks we build 3-room flats, 4-room flats or 5-room flats. The chances are that the number of flats will be reduced by one half because in one block of 1-room flats which occupy a very small area we could get 240 units. Therefore, when we build in its place 4-room flats, the chances are that we will get only 100 units.”
“If the Government had not introduced this Golden Shoe scheme, I think Cecil Street would have been completely redeveloped much earlier, but because of the disagreement among the private owners the scheme was delayed for many years. Eventually Government had to go back to acquiring the property, except that this time when acquiring the property, Government had to pay a price four or five times higher than in 1968 when the property prices were much lower than in 1978. The Member for Bukit Merah has talked about the redevelopment of old estates. HDB is aware that in comparing the amenities of the new estates with those in the old estates, there is a great disparity or a great difference in the environment. HDB has an on-going scheme to continuously upgrade the old estates, wherever feasible. HDB also has a scheme to demolish the poor HDB flats which were built in the 1960s. For example, the 6-storey 1-room emergency flats. HDB built altogether about 18,000 units of these flats in our first 5-year building programme, that is, between 1960 and 1965. Most of those 1-room emergency flats have now been demolished, cleared away, and redeveloped into befter housing. In the old estates where there is not enough open space, these flats will be demolished and created into open spaces. If the estates do not have good community centres, or the community centres are not of present standard, then one block of these 6-storey buildings will be demolished for the building of a modern community centre. This is an on-going project to improve the amenities of the old estates.”
“After the HDB took over the functions, the Government decided that HUDC flats should form part of the mainstream of Singapore housing estates and that HUDC flats should be built in HDB estates. For that reason the Beauty World flats have not been offered for sale to the HUDC applicants. This has, in fact, been the instruction given by the Government to the URA that they are not to sell the Beauty World flats to the HUDC applicants. On the question of the URA acquiring land and then parcelling it together for resale for private development. The Member has queried, "Why not allow that? private owners to develop their property? In fact, this experiment was carried out in the area known as the Golden Shoe. In the Golden Shoe area, the private property owners were allowed to pay compensation to the rent-controlled tenants and to clear the tenants and to develop their own land. I think the Government allowed the scheme to be implemented from 1968 onwards, Some private owners with big parcels of land could develop them. But owners with small parcels of land could not develop their property for the simple reason that if a person owned one or two shophouses, he could not develop it. He would have to buy the adjoining shophouses, but whose owners were not prepared to sell it to them. As a result, the URA in 1978 had to acquire all the undeveloped Golden Shoe private land, parcel them together, clear the encumbrances, and then sell the land to the developers. Therefore, it was because of these problems of parcelling together the land for developments, that Government has discontinued the scheme. In fact, development along Cecil Street is now completed. The redevelopment of Cecil Street has been implemented since 1968.”
“On the question of the Member's complaint about the defects in the flats, he has suggested that the HDB architect should visit these flats. I think this is a good suggestion and I will pass it on to HDB. I think the HDB architects do visit the flats after the flats have been occupied. But I will remind the HDB architects to visit the flats. They should see what they have built. I think the Member also referred to the big open spaces left by the old quarry in Bukit Batok New Town. The Bukit Batok New Town has an old quarry and the area is quite nice. HDB converted the old quarry area into a park. Because it was an old quarry, the area is quite hilly. So HDB has provided some steps for the people to climb up the hills to the elevated parts. The hon. Member says that the steps are not very safe. I will ask HDB to look into this. The Member for Whampoa mentioned about road signs. The road signs along new roads built by the PWD are visible and are very good. I will pass this compliment to the PWD engineers. They will be very happy. The road signs along the old roads are inferior in quality. I think that is understandable. In Singapore, everything is being improved, including the road signs. So when you compare the old road sign with the new road sign, of course, the old road sign is not so good. Anyway, I will pass this message to the PWD and see what can be done about the old road signs. On the URA sale of the Beauty World flats. I have explained to the House earlier about the policy on HUDC flats. Previously before HDB took over the functions of the HUDC, the HUDC flats were built in isolated areas. They are no different from the private condominiums.”
“But, on the other hand, if there is a genuine case of HDB being too harsh on these people, then HDB is prepared to re-consider arvd to waive the debarment imposed on these people. The Member for Bukit Batok talked about development charges. I agree with the Member that the development charge is a levy and not a tax on profit made by the development. I agree with him. As I have mentioned earlier, a few days ago, the Government will review the development charge. So I will not go further into this. On the question of the tendering of HDB shops, in fact, this question has been raised in this House repeatedly, since I became a Member of this House six years ago. I must say that I cannot find any other practical method which is better than the tender system. I would be very happy to receive any suggestions. The Member has made a suggestion that HDB should rent out the shops at a fixed rental for five years. But I would like to ask him this: once HDB fixes the rental, then who should we allocate the shop to? The simple thing is this. If we fix a very low rental, then of course you will find hundreds of people wanting to have the shops. Then what next? They will say, "Ballot, luck of the draw." So we draw. Somebody gets it, because of the cheap rental. But he is not a businessman. And if he is not a businessman, he would not be able to run the shop efficiently; he would not be able to provide the service to the residents, But if we fix the rental very high, then you will find outthat nobody wants the shop. So to fix a rental is a very difficult thing. The Member's suggestion is not practical. I would be very happy to receive any suggestions by Members for any other better method than the tender system.”
“They should not come out with all sorts of excuses and write to HDB saying that the HDB is being very unreasonable, very hard, very this, very that, and do not allow the mother or mother-in-law to stay on her own in one of the flats. Because of our constraints of land, we have no other way. 4.00 pm The Member for Buona Vista mentioned that the HDB has been very harsh in placing a debarment on the adults for a period of five years, ie not allowing them to apply for HDB flats. I want to mention that there are very few cases of this nature. Severe punishment is meted out only to those who have sublet the whole flat or are harbouring an illegal immigrant. Other than these two types of offences, the HDB will not take this harsh measure. The first case is quite obvious. If a person buys an HDB flat, or is renting an HDB flat, and he sublets or rents out the whole flat to others, obviously that person does not need the flat. Since he does not need the flat, HDB debars him from applying for another HDB flat. The second case is that of harbouring illegal immigrants. We must take a very harsh measure against people who harbour illegal immigrants. This is simply because an illegal immigrant means a person who is living in Singapore without approval, and usually he is jobless. And to earn a living, he is liable to commit all sorts of crime. I do not think we should allow this type of people to be housed in HDB estates. Anybody who harbours an illegal immigrant should be severely punished. I hope hon. Members will understand so that if they appeal on behalf of such people, they will know that the HDB is likely to turn them down.”
“No. I am just assuming that 10% of the households is a single person household, not everyone. We will have about 900,000 households. If 10% of the household is a single person family, then we need 90,000 units of flats. How much land will be needed for 90,000 units of flats? It is two Ang Mo Kibs, or 20 Teck Whye estates because the Member most probably knows befter as Teck Whye estate is in his constituency. Teck Whye estate at present has 3,000 flats and the HDB is proposinh to expand it to 4,000 flats. So, in fact, if 10% of our households are single person households, then we need an additional 20 Teck Whye estates. Mr Speaker, Sir, I am very sorry to say that it is not possible for us to accommodate single person households, and other suggestions have to come up. My suggestion is that we ryiust go back to our Asian values - to be tolerant and live with our parents, or allow our parents to live with us and allow our brothers and sisters also to live with us, or we live with our brothers and sisters. There is no other alternative. If any hon. Member has any better suggestions, I will be most happy to receive them to solve this problem. This is going to be a growing problem if the family continues to split. If the children move into the new towns leaving the parents, husband and wife, in Toa Payoh or in other old areas, sooner or later, one of them will die; usually I think the father dies first, leaving the mother. When this sort of event occurs, then I would suggest that the children should welcome their mothers or mothers-in-law to live with them.”
“What I am saying is that if our family size declines to three persons per family, then the HDB has to build another 300,000 flats. And if we have a population of 3.6 million, then at three persons per family we need 1.2 million units of flats. 300,000 flats means six large new towns. Then we need another Queenstown, another Toa Payoh, another Ang Mo Kio, another Bedok, another Tampines, another Yishun. You just imagine, where in Singapore can we build another six large new towns? Where? Tell me, which part of Singapore that I am not aware of is there plenty of land where we can build these six large new towns. So even for a th ree-person family we do not have the land to accommodate our population. Members may think that we can reclaim land. But I would like to inform the House that almost all our shallow coastal areas which can be economically reclaimed, have been reclaimed, the whole lot in Jurong, in East Coast, in Marina. Any additional reclamation is very limited. At the most, perhaps we can reclaim land to build one new town or one and a half new towns. So if we cannot afford to accommodate our population when the family size goes down to three, how can we accommodate our population with single person households?”
“At present, HDB manages half a million dwelling units, of which three-quarters or 375,000 units are sold flats where the residents own their flats and another 125,000 units are rental flats. Let us project our population to 3.6 million people when we reach zero population growth. At present, our family size is 4.5 persons but this family size of 4.5 will quickly decline to about 4 persons in the next few years, not in the next 10 or 20 years. In the next few years, our family size will be 4 persons per family. In fact, at the end of 1984, the average family size of our applicants on the HDB waiting list to purchase flats was only 3.5 persons. If we assume a household size of four persons, we need 900,000 dwelling units to accommodate 3.6 million people. And we are assuming the private sector, ie, private flats, bungalows, terrace houses, semi-detached houses, will accommodate 100,000 families. Then the remaining 800,000 families will be accommodated in HDB flats. And the HDB will have to build an additional 400,000 flats to accommodate the projected population of 3.6 million, ie, 300,000 flats for new applicants in the next 20-30 years and another 100,000 flats for our existing tenants, because our objective is to upgrade by 1999 when all the tenants will become flat owners. So we need to build another 100,000 units of flats to make all the tenants become flat owners. If our family size is decreased to three persons, it means that we need another 300,000 flats. At present, working on the family size of four persons per family, Singapore barely has sufficient land to accommodate the 3.3 or 3.6 million population that we have projected in the year 2030. And this is based on the household size of four persons per family.”
“I hope that we will be able to finalize the proposal in the second half of this year, and one or two, or preferably even three, pilot schemes can be set up on the local councils to manage the HDB estates. One point has been mentioned by several Members and it is about a single person family. Some Members have requested that the HDB allows single persons to apply for HDB flats. Such cases arise when, as a result of a divorce, the family has been split, leaving a single person in the household. And there are also cases where a husband and wife live in an HDB flat and then one of them passes away, then the family becomes a single person family. From all points of view, there is totally no reason to object to a single person family. But unfortunately in Singapore, we have one very strong reason why we cannot afford a single person household. In Singapore we have only 620 sq km of land for a population at present of 2.5 million and which eventually will go up to 3.3-3.6 million in the year 2030 when we reach zero population growth. If Singapore has a large land area, I would be the first to advocate allowing single person families to apply for flats because financially Singaporeans are moving up to the stage where they can afford their own homes through- the CPF savings scheme; all working Singaporeans would have sufficient CPF to buy their own flats. That is why I am confident that we can achieve our Government's policy of 100% home ownership by 1999. But I have totally no confidence that we can allow single person families to apply for HDB flats. Sir, I will just do some simple mathematical calculations to prove to the Members here that we cannot afford a single person family.”
“" Another point is that some farmers may be interested in leasing some of the State land which Government is not using at present for immediate development schemes. I think the Primary Production Department has a scheme to lease such land to the farmers for a period of three years for cultivation. So hon. Members can pass this information to those who are interested in carrying out short-term farming, to get in touch with the Primary Production Department to rent the vacant land for cultivation. 3.45 pm The hon. Member for Leng Kee has raised a point on the proposed local authority to be set up to manage the HDB estates. At this stage, there is a team of officers in HDB working on the decentralization of the management of HDB estates and the setting up of the local authorities. However, at this stage, the concept, structure, and the role of the town councils are still under study. So nothing has been finalized. In the last few days after the Presidential Address, the Members here have expressed various opinions on how the local authority should be run and how the local authority should be formed. I sense that the majority of the Members are in favour of setting up local authorities to decentralize the HDB's management. And when I discussed with the HDB officers, they are very happy to hand over the management of housing estates to the local authorities. So I would like to assure Members that there will not be any difficulties created by the HDB's staff or by the civil servants, to block Government's proposal, or to make it difficult for the Government to implement this proposal of setting up local councils. They are working very hard on it.”
“That means in areas where there is surplus earth, HDB has to cut the surplus earth in these areas to fill up areas where there is less earth, like swamplands and ponds. This is the most efficient way of carrying out the earthworks. The most efficient way means the most economical way, where the earth is being carried in the shortest possible distance. After the earthwork is completed, some of the areas will be developed by HDB while other areas may be developed by other authorities at a later date. For example, I again quote Toa Payoh. In Toa Payoh a lot of sites have been left vacant for more than 10 years or for more than 15 years because those sites have been reserved for schools. However, the school building programme is determined by the Ministry of Education and the Ministry of Education may decide that it is not necessary to build any schools. So those sites in the new town reserved for schools will be left vacant. But the farmers do not understand this because they are not aware of the planning of a new town. So when the farmer who has been cleared for resenlement sees that his land has been left vacant, lying there for many years, he feels very angry. He says, "If you do not need the land, you should not clear me. After you have cleared me, you allow the land to lie idle for so many years, then the Government administrative system is confused and very unreasonable." And, in fact, some Opposition politicians may go around and say, "Look, the Government is purposely making it difficult for you. The Government is inefficient, confused and purposely making it very difficult for farmers. They do not need the land but they chase you away.”
“And if we look into the quality of durians, they say the durian tree that bears yellow flesh durians, certainly has better value than the white flesh durians. But if we are to go strictly according to the value of a particular durian tree, then HDB cannot clear any durian tree. HDB will have to send inspectors there to wait for the durian tree to flower, wait for the durian tree to bear fruits, and when the fruits drop, to open up the fruit to see whether the fruit is a good fruit or a bad fruit. So it is an impossible task. Although to the farmers or to the settlers, the argument is a valid argument - how can we classify all the durian trees based on the height, say, they must at least be three metres tall, or they must all be the same type of tree before we pay the same rate? And also the value of each durian tree can be different from another? This rule similarly goes for other farm house improvements and other things where a uniform rate has to be adopted because, administratively, it is impossible for HDB to adopt a different system. If we are going to adopt a different system, then the HDB will have to employ hundreds of thousands of specialists as valuers for the various types of plants, for the various types of structures, and so on and so forth. So it is an impossible thing. A uniform rate is a must, and we must adopt an administrative system which can be easily implemented so that it will allow the resettlement programme to go ahead. On the question of large areas of land that have been cleared by HDB and have been left vacant, let me explain the reasons. There are good reasons for that because HDB, when developing a new town, usually has to clear a very extensive area in order to carry out the earthworks. In our earthworks programme, there is cut and fill.”
“I have already waited for two years and I am still not cleared." When we develop a big area, it is impossible for HDB to clear everybody. The simple reason for this is that when we clear an area, we have to provide alternative facilities. If the HDB were to clear everything all at once, then we need tens of thousands of flats, tens of thousands of alternative facilities, like thousands of units of shops, thousands of units of factories. Of course, this is impossible because HDB just simply does not have those alternative facilities immediately available. So, for resettlement cases, the hon. Members here must understand and explain to their constituents that resettlement has to be carried out in phases and they have to wait for their turn because HDB does not have the alternative facilities. Another point is on rates of compensation raised by the Member for Nee Soon, and also other Members. They complained about HDB giving uniform rates of compensation. The Member for Nee Soon raised the point of du rian trees. He said durian trees classified by HDB as large trees are paid the same compensation rate at $156 per tree. He also said that it was unfair to compensate a uniform rate of $156 per tree for durian trees which bear fruits as well as for durian trees which do not bear fruits. I agree with him that if the compensation is paid for the loss of that particular durian tree, then a uniform rate is not justified because no two durian trees are of the same quality. A durian tree can be taller or shorter. A durian tree can bear more fruits or less fruits than another. Also for a durian tree that can bear seedless durians, of course, it will have much higher value.”
“Yes, they are in and out. In fact, they are within Nee Soon New Town, but not yet developed. I think they are within Nee Soon New Town, but some, in fact, will be outside Nee Soon New Town because the clearance will cover a much wider area than just Nee Soon itself. I would like to explain that the pace of the resettlement programme is set by factors such as the urgency of the resettlement scheme. There are some areas where the land is required for very urgent development. So therefore the clearance will take place very quickly. In other places where the land is not so urgently required, the resettlement will take place at a slower pace. The second point is the phasing of the scheme. In a very large area, the development is usually divided into several phases and carried out over a number of years. For example, in Toa Payoh, when HDB developed Toa Payoh New Town, the clearance actually started in 1961 and the last phase of the clearance for Toa Payoh New Town was completed in about 1971. In other words, the phases actually stretched over 10 years. And if we include part of Potong Pasir as the Toa Payoh New Town extension, because it is, in fact, part of Toa Payoh, then the last phase comprising part of Potong Pasir was cleared by HDB in 1981. In other words for the Toa Payoh New Town, the clearance actually spread over a period of 20 years. A lot of the resettlement cases do not understand this. When HDB resettlement inspectors move into an area, for example, in Nee Soon a few years ago, the people misunderstood this to mean that clearance had come to Nee Soon and the whole Nee Soon would be cleared within a short period. And having waited for a year, two years, they got very angry and said, "What has happened to HDB?”
“Outside Nee Soon Town. An hon. Member: They are in and out.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, several Members have raised the question of resettlement. The Member for Nee Soon has raised the problems faced by senlers in Nee Soon New Town.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, the answer to the question of the hon. Member for Whampoa is Yes, because in the Presidential Address the Government has clearly stated that the policy of the Government is to achieve 100% home-ownership for Singaporeans by 1999, and obviously HDB has to price the flats at a level where every Singaporean can afford to buy, so as to achieve our objective of 100% home-ownership. SUPPLY AND SUPPLEMENTARY SUPPLY BILLS (Business Motion) Resolved, That, notwithstanding the Standing Orders, the second and third readings of the Supply Bill for the financial year lst April, 1985 to 3lst March, 1986 and the Supplementary Supply Bill for the financial year lst April, 1984 to 3lst March, 1985 may be proceeded with immediately on the conclusion of the proceedings on the Budget for the financial year 1st April,1985 to 31st March, 1986. - [Minister for Finance, Minister for Education and Minister for Health). MAIN AND DEVELOPMENT ESTIMATES OF SINGAPORE FOR THE FINANCIAL YEAR 1ST APRIL, 1985 TO 31ST MARCH, 1986 Order read for consideration in Committee of Supply [1st Allotted Day). [Mr Speaker in the Chair] 11.35 am COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY (Disposal of Amendments) Announcement by Mr Speaker”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, as I have stated in my statement, this is to achieve correct accounting for the pricing of the HDB flats. As I have mentioned earlier, previously HDB flats were built on SIT land. In fact, there was no land cost involved, which means that HDB was getting land free from the Government, at no cost at all, for the building of flats. This is wrong in terms of accounting for the pricing of flats, where you show the construction cost is so much, while the land cost is zero. So the correct way of accounting for the cost of the flat is to show the land cost, plus construction cost, plus other costs, altogether. Then you can get the actual cost of the flats.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I am sorry I do not have the details of the fees paid or to be paid to the consultant, plus the HDB's own cost. It is a fully computerized system and as it involves a lot of hardware and software, I would not be able to give the answer now. But I will give the hon. Member the details of the costing in writing. On the question of the land cost, it does not really make much difference whether HDB buys the land from the Government either as vacant land or encumbered land. If it is vacant land, then the land value will be valued at the vacant land value. If it is encumbered land, then the value will be much lower, because resettlement costs will be involved. Therefore, HDB will be able to buy the land from the Government at a lower price.”
“In order that the new accounting system will fully reflect the true economic cost of flats, the HDB will return all its undeveloped land stock back to the Government at cost before 1st April, 1985. As and when land is required in future for public housing and related facilities, the HDB will buy the required land from the Government at current market value for similar private residential land. Thus the true current economic cost of flats, both of land and construction cost, will be clearly reflected in the HDB accounts. The Government will continue to subsidize any deficits incurred by HDB arising from selling public housing below their cost. With Government subsidies, prices of HDB flats under the new accounting system are expected to be similar to those under the old accounting system.”
“In response to the Auditor-General's comment and to meet its own needs, the HDB embarked on plans to change its accounting system in early 1982. A committee comprising the Auditor-General, the Accountant-General and representatives from the Ministries of Finance and National Development and the HDB was formed to oversee the change of accounting system. In April 1983, the committee selected the international accounting firm of Price Waterhouse as the consultant for the design of fully integrated and computerized accounting system for the HDB. The new system of accounts has since been designed and tested. The new accounting system has been accepted by the Auditor-General, Accountant-General and the Ministry of Finance. As I have informed the House on 15th March 1984, the new system will be implemented from 1st April this year. The existing presentation of accounts will be replaced by the new format of balance sheet and income and expenditure presentation. The accounts will be drawn up on the basis of cost centres. It will enable the operating results of specific activities to be reflected separately. Thus, the sale of flats, rental of flats and service and conservancy operations will constitute distinct cost centres besides others like car parking operations, hawker/market operations and so on. The fundamental shortcoming of the existing system is that the cost of the flat is not reflected in the accounts. Currently, besides annual subsidies provided by Government for HDB operations, the Government has been subsidizing public housing through the provision of cheap State Land. In some cases, land inherited from SIT was at no cost to HDB.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I wish to make a statement on the new accounting system for the Housing and Development Board. The Housing and Development Board's existing accounting system has been used for over two decades. This system was inherited from the former Singapore Improvement Trust (SIT). The SIT system was a system used by most of the United Kingdom's local authorities. It was adequate in the early years when the HDB's main function was to provide low-cost housing for rental. Over the years, the HDB's major activity has shifted from rental of flats to the sale of flats. For the past few years, the Auditor-General in auditing the HDB's accounts has stated that the HDB accounting system did not provide for the costing of flats. This means the sale proceeds could not be matched against the cost. As a result, the HDB's accounts do not show adequately the entire operations of the Board. The HDB on its part increasingly feels the need to have a modern integrated computerized accounting system to replace the present manually operated one. The HDB's activities affect almost every family in Singapore. At the end of 1984, almost 81% of the population live in HDB housing. Three-quarters of these HDB dwellers live in purchase flats, while the remaining quarter are tenants of rental flats. In addition to managing half a million dwelling units, the HDB owns and manages factories, shops, hawker stalls, offices and parking lots. The number of accounts handled by the HDB exceeds one million, comprising 479,000 service and conservancy accounts, 216,000 loan and instalment repayment accounts, 137,000 rental accounts and thousands of hawkers' accounts, parking accounts, etc.”
“An anti-inhalant abuse team has also been formed in the Central Narcotics Bureau to monitor all detected cases and to assist the Coordination Committee in formulating and implementing plans to curb the spread of inhalant abuse. If preventive, educative and counselling measures prove inadequate, we will consider further measures including, if necessary, legislation requiring offenders to undergo treatment and rehabilitation.”
“The number of inhalant abuse cases who were school children detected in 1982, 1983 and 1984 were 54, 133 and 128 respectively, Measures taken to curb the problem of inhalant abuse are as follows: (a) Abusers who are school pupils are referred to the Guidance and Social Work Unit of the Ministry of Education for counselling and guidance. (b) Abusers who are below 16 years of age and not schooling are referred to the Children and Youth Services of the Ministry of Community Development for counselling. They are also encouraged to join the Boys' Clubs so that they can take part in organized activities. Chronic abusers, ie, the repeaters, who are beyond parental control, are dealt with by the Juvenile Court under the Children and Young Persons Act. They may be placed by the Court in an approved home or on probation for care and protection. (c) lnhalant abusers who are above 16 years old and not schooling are warned, together with their parents, of the dangers of inhalant abuse. Offenders with drug records are referred to the Drug Rehabilitation Centre for medical examination and observation to determine if they had relapsed to drug consumption. Habitual offenders are placed on voluntary supervision by enforcement officers. (d) lnhalant abusers who are mentally affected by the inhalants are referred to the Woodbridge Hospital for psychiatric examination. Bad cases are warded for treatment. An Anti-inhalant Abuse Coordination Committee comprising representatives from my Ministry, the Ministry of Education, the Ministry of Community Development, the Ministry of Health, SANA, SAF and Scientific Services Department, has been set up to monitor and plan strategies to solve this problem.”
“Mr Ng Kah Ting asked the Minister for Home Affairs and Second Minister for Law (a) if he will enlighten the House on the problem of glue-sniffing by youths, particularly in the schools; (b) what measures are being taken to discourage them from such practice; (c) whether there are programmes to rehabilitate youths with such addiction; and (d) whether the situation is under control, Mr Wong Kan Seng (for the Minister for Home Affairs and Second Minister for Law): Mr Speaker, Sir, the abuse of volatile inhalants, commonly known as glue sniffing, was first detected in Singapore in 1980. The number of cases detected had increased from 24 in 1980 to 820 in 1983 and 812 cases in 1984. The inhalant abuse problem is therefore increasing and is a cause for concern, although it has not reached epidemic proportions. This explains why the Singapore Anti-Narcotics Association has launched a three-month island-wide campaign on llth March 1985 to inform the public, especially the parents, on the dangers and evils of inhalant abuse. Although the abusers are not physically addicted, the increasing number of repeaters arrested shows that some of them had developed psychological dependence on inhalants. Long-term inhalant abuse leads to permanent and irreversible damage to the brain, liver and kidneys. A study of the abusers detected from 1980 to 1984 shows that 88.7% are under 20 years of age, 20.5% of them are below 15 years old and 68.2% of them between the ages of 15 and 19. The majority of these inhalant abusers are school dropouts.”
“Sir, as at December 1984, a total of 11 lorry parks with 1,873 lots have been constructed at the fringe of various HDB estates. Three more lorry parks with 567 lots are now under construction at Defu, North Buona Vista and Jurong Stadium. The lorry park at Jurong Stadium will serve the Jurong area, including Boon Lay Garden Estate. It will have 256 lots and will be ready in April 1985. CHILD CARE CENTRES IN CHONG BOON CONSTITUENCY (Establishment of) 6. Mr S. Chandra Das asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Minister for Community Development whether there are any plans to establish child care centres in Chong Boon constituency to assist working mothers. The Minister of State for Home Affairs and Community Development (Mr Wong Kan Seng) (for the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Minister for Community Development): Mr Speaker, Sir, I am replying on behalf of my Minister. There is no plan to set up a child care centre in Chong Boon constituency in fiscal year 85. Chong Boon is situated within the eastern sector of Ang Mo Kio estate. If we divide Ang Mo Kio into east and west, using Avenue 6, we have two sectors. At present, there are already three centres in the eastern sector of Ang Mo Kio New Town and none in the west. For fiscal year 85, there are plans to set up two child care centres in the western sector of Ang Mo Kio. And they are likely going to be in Kebun Baru and Yio Chu Kang. ABUSE OF VOLATILE INHALANTS (Measures to curb) 7.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, 762 units of HUDC flats are now in various stages of construction in Hougang North. Allocation will be made with the completion of these flats from mid-1985 onwards. LORRY PARKS IN HDB ESTATES 5. Mr Goh Chee Wee asked the Minister for National Development if his Ministry has drawn up specific plans to provide centralized lorry and heavy vehicle parking lots in or around all housing estates and whether such centralized parking lots will be constructed within or fringing Boon Lay Garden Estate.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, the Sing-Thai Farms Co. Ltd was established in 1979 by the Thai Government and the Primary Industries Enterprise (Pte) Ltd to initiate the export of disease-free pigs from Thailand to Singapore. This role has been fulfilled and the farm has been able to show the way for other pig exporting farms in Thailand to export their pigs to Singapore. The farm has served its purpose. The management of Sing-Thai Farms is now reviewing the role and objective of the farm. In 1984, the Sing-Thai Farms exported only 1,100 pigs to Singapore. This number of pigs is insignificant and will not affect the overall supply of pig% in Singapore, even if the farm is closed. The question of securing alternative sources of supply of pigs from other countries to replace those supplied by the Sing-Thai Farms therefore does not arise. LITIGATIONS OVER MEDICAL INCOMPETENCE (Particulars) 3. Mr Yeo Choo Kok asked the Minister for Finance, Minister for Education and Minister for Health (a) how many doctors have been sued in the past 10 years for negligence or incompetence; (b) how many patients have died as a result of such negligence or incompetence; and (c) whether it is necessary to have a "sue the doctors and hospitals" campaign for the benefit of the general public.”
“The HDB does allow businessmen, who are unable to continue paying their rentals, the option of terminating their tenancies and re-tendering for the same or new premises at a lower rental. SCHOOLS WITH TEACHER SHORTAGE 3. Mr J.B. Jeyaretnam asked the Minister for Finance, Minister for Education and Minister for Health if he will list all schools which do not have the full complement of teachers setting out for each school the number by which the teaching staff falls short of the full complement.”
“It has never been the government's policy to deliberately suppress rentals by over-building office and shop premises. The commercial premises built by the HDB in its estates are to meet the needs of residents. The URA and HDB also build office and shop complexes to cater for the needs of resettlement cases. Some ministries and statutory boards have built their own office buildings. In their planning to cater for their long-term needs, they may have built space that is in excess of their immediate needs. They therefore have some surplus space for rental. The Minister for Finance has announced in his Budget Speech that the government will not build any more commercial buildings unless there is a need for them. To build or not to build an office and shop complex is basically a business decision. When there is demand or when developers perceive that there is a demand, they will go ahead. This happened between 1980 and 1983. As a result, there is an over-supply of office and shop premises now. The current poor business situation has also not helped. To attract more tenants, developers began to reduce rentals for office and shop premises. The Development and Construction Company (Private) Limited followed suit. Unlike private developments, HDB commercial premises are let out on monthly tenancies with rentals determined by the tender system. It would not be good for the HDB to start reducing its rentals because of poor business. Businessmen know that if the HDB is prepared to reduce rentals because of poor business, they will not mind submitting high bids in order to get a shop unit and subsequently appealing for a reduction in rental because of poor business. This will make tender bids extremely high and is not beneficial to the economy.”
“Maj Fong Sip Chee asked the Minister for National Development (l) if he will enlighten the House whether the glut in office-shop space is (a) the result of over-building; (b) the consequence of a deliberate government policy to suppress rentals for office-shop premises; or (c) due to a depression in the economy peculiar to Singapore or any other reasons; (2) if the Development and Construction Company Private Limited, a subsidiary company of a statutory board, was the first to announce a reduction in rental; (3) if it is not logical that a similar reduction in rental should be applied to shop premises under the Housing and Development Board; and (4) if the Minister is satisfied that the glut is due to over-building, whether he will consider it prudent in the circumstances to prevent such profligacy of public funds by way of restraining the public sector in the development of commercial buildings.”
“The Ministry of National Development does not monitor the construction of headquarters buildings by Ministries and Statutory Boards, or commercial complexes by subsidiary companies of statutory bodies. However, based on the records kept by the Planning Department, two government ministries, one government department and seven statutory boards have built their own headquarters buildings. According to the Ministry's six-monthly surveys of occupancy of offices, the occupancy of these buildings as at September 1984 is as follows: Owner-occupied - 138,112 sq metres Rented out - 36,013 sq metres Vacant - 4,713 sq metres The above data do not include the MAS Building which has just been completed. The Ministry is unable to provide details of the commercial complexes built by subsidiary companies of statutory bodies as our planning records do not distinguish these complexes from those built by other companies in the private sector. The Ministry also does not keep records of the amount of public funds expended in the construction of these buildings, and the revenue lost as a result of the vacant space. GLUT IN OFFICE/SHOP PREMISES 2.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, this matter is still under study, and it is a bit premature at this stage to make a definite commitment on the methods and ways of the sale of shops by HDB. Once the HDB has finalized the proposal, there will be discussions among the Members before a decision is made on this matter. TAX ON PUB AND TELEPHONE BILLS AND CONTRIBUTIONS TO SKILLS DEVELOPMENT FUND 9. Dr Toh Chin Chye asked the Minister for Finance, Minister for Education and Minister for Health (a) what is the total government tax on Public Utilities Board bills for each of the years 1979 to 1984; (b) what is the total government tax on Telecommunication Authority of Singapore bills for each of the years 1979 to 1984; and (c) what are the contributions collected under the Skills Development Fund for each of the years 1980 to 1984. The Minister for Finance, Minister for Education and Minister for Health (Dr Tony Tan Keng Yam): Mr Speaker, Sir, to avoid boring Members by reading out a long list of figures, may I have your permission, Sir, to ask the Clerk to distribute a Schedule (Cols. 827 - 828) which gives information requested by the Member for Rochore.[Copies distributed to Members] Schedule (Cols. 827 - 828)”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, HDB is aware of the points raised by the hon. Member and, therefore, in the sale of shops, these points will be taken into consideration.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, the sale of HDB shops through tender or other methods has far-reaching implications. Among these are the financing required for purchase of the shops, the management of sold shops and the needs of resettlement cases. Owing to its complexity, the matter is being carefully studied before a decision is made.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, in Singapore we have a free market economy and the prices of the goods in the shops are determined by shopkeepers. The rental is, of course, one of the elements but I do not think the rental is the sole factor in determining the prices of the goods. HDB SHOP PREMISES (Sale by open tender) 8. Mr Ng Kah Ting asked the Minister for National Development if he will recommend to the Housing and Development Board that it sells off its shops by open tender with a view to encouraging shop-keepers to own them and, if not, why not,”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, the first and only rental increase exercise by the HDB was in 1983 when the rentals of premises let out as far back as the 1950s were raised to the 1980 level. This 1980 level is still below the current market level. However, after considering the numerous appeals by PAP MPs during the recent Parliamentary sittings, and in view of current poor business conditions, I will ask the HDB to defer the final stage of the rental increase due in September 1985, for one year to September 1986.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, this is only the construction cost of building, excluding the land cost. Perhaps my colleague, the Minister for Finance, is in a better position to answer the question raised by the hon. Member for Rochore.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, the building cost is the cost reported by the owners to my Ministry. So, in fact, my Ministry is not involved in the financing of these buildings. For example, the Ministry of National Development is not involved in the financing of the PSA building. PSA only reported to the Ministry that their building cost was $185 million. The Ministry of National Development is not involved in their financing.”