Valerie Vaz
MP for Walsall and Bloxwich · Labour · United Kingdom
“May I ask the Leader of the House if we can have a debate in Government time on the best use of public money? Some £50 million has been allocated for a free school—against Government policy and against the evidence.”
“This House has heard, sadly, the comments that the Minister has made about the Government pressing this case. He will know that it was pressure from this House, and from the families, that caused the release of the other hostages in Iran. Will he undertake, as the hon.”
“It is a pleasure to follow the shadow Secretary of State, the hon. Member for Faversham and Mid Kent (Helen Whately). I will try to address some of the points she made, but I am bound to mention the recent elections. Engaging in the democratic process is important, but not all areas had elections.”
“Fifty million pounds has been allocated for a free school in my constituency that, on the evidence, is not needed. The National Audit Office has reported falling rolls in primary schools, and that fall in numbers will feed into secondary schools. I was told that the decision about the school was made in 2017.”
“Despite what the evidence shows, there will be building on Reedswood Park, which is not what local people want. It is the same with the Walsall Leather Museum, a beloved local cultural and heritage icon; the deal with the then Conservative-controlled council was a novel and contentious transaction, made against the wishes of visitors, con…”
“We are the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, so it is very important that we all work together. When it comes to climate change policies, we cannot specify a particular area; they are for our whole country, and our whole planet.”
The complete record
Every one of 600 lines we hold for Valerie Vaz, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 4 of 12.
“Glen was a director at the Brit School, and a director of Equity’s charitable trust, and was involved with lots of other charities, such as the Marr-Munning Trust, which supports overseas development in India. He was a great negotiator who was called on by charities and the Labour party to resolve disputes. He loved jazz and was a member of the all-party parliamentary group on jazz. He stood for Parliament in Ealing and Acton twice, so he could have been one of us. He was passionate about the arts, and was an adviser and volunteer at the Questors Theatre in Ealing. Everyone who met Glen—the many people who served on Ealing Council and are now MPs—always remember him with a smile. May he rest in peace. I was unable to be here when we paid tributes to the Clerk of the House.”
“Finally, I want to mention two public servants. Glen Barnham, a colleague of mine, has sadly died. He was a councillor and we served on Ealing Council together. He was a remarkable politician. He was first elected in 1971 and retired in 1990. He was chair of social services when I was vice-chair and the budget was always protected. Glen had an amazing way with his constituents. When I went round to anybody’s house in his Heathfield ward in Acton, there was always a picture of Glen, as though he was some sort of film star. That was apt, because he was a full-time organiser for Equity and played his part in ensuring that people had decent terms and conditions when they worked at the BBC. In fact, he suggested that I become a member of Equity—not for my acting skills, but when I had a stint on “Network East”.”
“If it had been his baby brother, who is smaller than the dog, I do not think he would have survived. Sami’s mother and a friend came out, but they could not get the dog off him. Sami had to wait 16 hours in Walsall Manor Hospital to get any treatment. His mother says he cannot sleep at night—it is really difficult. Sami is extremely, extremely brave. I want to add my voice and ask the Minister to raise with the Home Secretary considering banning dogs that are bred to attack and dogs that have attacked humans, whether children or adults. It is not sufficient just to muzzle the dogs, because attacks can take place in the home. These dogs are incredibly frightening, so that is my ask. Sami is making a recovery. He goes to Reedswood Academy. I know he would be very pleased if the whole House joined me in wishing him a speedy recovery.”
“I understand that this foreign national offender will not be deported to the first country because there is an issue, but the Minister does have the discretion to look for another country that he could go to. My constituent lives in fear. Yes, she has been told roughly where he is, but he could be anywhere. She was a public servant trying to help him when she was stabbed in the neck. She nearly died. I do not think it is appropriate that she should continue to live under that fear. Sadly, I am coming on to another very difficult issue. I met my constituent, 10-year-old Sami, who was savaged by a pit bull terrier. He went out with his football to play in his front garden and the pit bull terrier, which lives two doors down, came out and stuck its teeth into his arm and would not let go. Sami is lucky to be alive.”
“My fourth point is about Government policy on foreign national offenders. A foreign national offender was convicted of attempted murder of one of my constituents. I have raised this issue many times with Ministers, and I have been told that he cannot be deported because he is engaging his article 3 right to prevent torture and inhuman or degrading treatment. The foreign national offender can engage his article 3 rights, but my constituent cannot engage her article 2 right to life. The balance has been skewed in favour of the foreign national offender. I want to know exactly what Government policy is. Is it for the offender or for the victim?”
“In fact, local authority tried to cut down trees, but the community fought back and that was stopped. Now the West Midlands Combined Authority and the west midlands transport authority want to widen the bus lane. My constituent Zena Owen has worked out that it will shave off just one minute from the travel time. We have the excellent X51 and 51 bus routes, which go from Walsall to Birmingham in 20 minutes. My constituents are really happy with that. I cannot see the logic of phase 2. It will waste money, it will not cut time and passengers are happy with the current service. In fact, we were not even sure whether the X51 and the 51 services would continue. Could the Whip please raise this issue with the Mayor, to tell him that we would like that vanity project to be stopped?”
“Blue Coat Academy had to apply to the condition improvement fund just to fix the roof. It seems sensible that, rather than having to bid every year and waste money on surveyors’ fees and other costs, they just have the funds already allocated to them. They are bidding against each other, which is an appalling situation for schools to be in. My third issue is about buses, like the hon. Member for Filton and Bradley Stoke (Jack Lopresti)—I forgot to say that it was a pleasure to follow him. We, too, have a vanity project—called the Sprint bus phase 2—of the west midlands Mayor. I do not know what it is about Mayors, and why they need to have vanity projects. The Sprint bus has been withdrawn from major cities because it is not safe, but the Mayor seems to want to proceed.”
“I am not clear why expert ticketing staff are moving away from their jobs. Could the Government please look again? The second issue I want to raise is not about reinforced autoclaved aerated concrete but about the condition of my schools in Walsall South. Joseph Leckie Academy was allocated £17 million under Building Schools for the Future, but that was cancelled. The then Secretary of State mentioned that he made a mistake by cancelling Building Schools for the Future. That school has had to bid every time for funds. Given the issues going on with RAAC, the asbestos in the school and the condition improvement fund, I wonder whether the Whip could ask the Education Secretary to ensure that schools are given the funds allocated immediately so that they can deal with the problems.”
“I hope to have a meeting with Network Rail, but could the Whip kindly find out whether there is any obligation under equalities legislation that would enable us to appropriate those funds immediately, rather than having to wait for the next round of Access for All funding? We would like to do it sooner rather than later. Even parents with prams find it difficult to access the station. Walsall station will keep its ticket office, but sadly Bescot will lose its one. In the Westminster Hall debate, the Minister admitted: “The changes are about modernising the passenger experience, by moving expert ticketing staff out of ticket offices to be more visible and accessible around the station.” —[ Official Report, 13 September 2023; Vol. 737, c. 346WH.] The logic is not quite there.”
“I think they will find that this is one of the nicest debates they will have ever responded to. I start with Bescot Stadium station, which has a footbridge linking one platform with the other. However, those with disabilities cannot access the platforms, so Walsall’s disabled supporters have to take the train into the town centre and come back just to get to the football ground. I met with the Minister of State at the Department for Transport, the hon. Member for Bexhill and Battle (Huw Merriman), who was helpful. He made the point that there had never been an application for Access for All funding. I find that disconcerting, because these people are the most vulnerable in society and need access to the station.”
“Madam Deputy Speaker, I associate myself with your words about Margaret McDonagh and my hon. Friend the Member for Mitcham and Morden (Siobhain McDonagh)—I let my hon. Friend know that we are all here for her at any time of the day, whenever she needs us. It is good to see my hon. Friend the Member for Rochdale (Tony Lloyd) back in his place. Like the hon. Member for Chatham and Aylesford (Tracey Crouch), I want to channel Sir David Amess. He would always start his speeches by going around his constituency, and I hope to do that too. I welcome the Treasurer of His Majesty’s Household, the right hon. Member for Nuneaton (Mr Jones), to his place—we are graced with his presence—and the new deputy shadow Leader of the House, my hon. Friend the Member for Blaenau Gwent (Nick Smith).”
“I place on record my condolences to the current Defence Secretary, and my thanks to the former Defence Secretary, whom we wish well in whatever he undertakes to do. I thank the Minister for his full response. He will know that NATO’s obligations are to work with partners, so can he say what discussions he has had with his counterparts in NATO about working with the African Union to ensure stability and security in that region?”
“The Minister gave the example of 28 days or 30 days. Will pharmacists be able to explain to patients that they will not necessarily have to take them for 30 days?”
“The Secretary of State told the media at the weekend that she had found the money for the pay settlement from an underspend in the Department. Can she tell the House exactly where she found the money and what policies have not been delivered?”
“I note that the hon. Gentleman said that he was previously a member of the Parliamentary Assembly. I am one of the newest members, but I want to pick up on what he is saying about the leadership. The UK leadership of my right hon. Friend the Member for North Durham (Mr Jones) and the right hon. Member for Elmet and Rothwell (Alec Shelbrooke) is absolutely outstanding. We also have other members who are very experienced and people who have been Members of both Houses, such as Lord Campbell and Lord Anderson of Swansea. That makes for the extremely important soft power role that we have, and I think that the consensus is very much down to the leadership of all those members.”
“The Minister has been an excellent exponent of soft power during his ministerial career. Does he agree that it is good news that the Secretary-General of NATO has had his mandate extended for a further year?”
“I know the Minister is about to finish, but before she sits down, will she say whether local authorities, which are broadly the enforcers of the measure, will be given extra resources?”
“I associate myself with the remarks the Secretary of State made about Bob Kerslake. He was a true public servant, and his death is our loss. What is the point of a workforce plan if the Secretary of State is not actually talking to the workforce? When will he talk to the junior doctors and the consultants? Can I also ask whether the work on the workforce plan will start forthwith or sometime in the future?”
“May I start by wishing the Foreign Secretary and his family well? At the NATO Parliamentary Assembly in Luxembourg, we unanimously passed a declaration with a clause that specifically recognises the Wagner Group as a criminal and terrorist organisation. Could the Foreign Secretary ensure that the Prime Minister also supports that at the Vilnius summit?”
“The Minister is actually being quite interesting—not at all dry. Does he have an estimate of the numbers and costs? Will the costs come out of the Ministry of Justice budget?”
“Our ambassadors play a skilful role in NATO and I wish to place on the record my thanks to Fleur Thomas in Luxembourg, which hosted the NATO Parliamentary Assembly, for her excellent briefing. What assessment has the Foreign Secretary made of Sweden actually joining NATO, which will strengthen its unity, before the Vilnius summit?”
“The Minister has not answered the question about why he thinks the Government should decide what is and is not relevant, rather than the chair of the inquiry. He has said how well qualified she is; will he please now answer that question?”
“Karen Lumley was indeed a wonderful woman. Our thoughts and prayers are with her family at this difficult time. The statement is admirable, but how will patients have a choice if the Secretary of State does not address the workforce issue? When will he do that? When will he speak to the junior doctors?”
“Does my hon. Friend agree that it is a waste of school resources to have to keep bidding for funds for important things such as central heating? The Joseph Leckie Academy in my constituency was allocated funds under Building Schools for the Future but it has to keep rebidding for them.”
“The Minister has been very kind in meeting with me and heads of schools in my constituency. I know he takes this seriously, but how confident is he that all these assessments are correct? David Smith, who is the head of Blue Coat Church of England Academy in my constituency, has said that there are material errors in some of the assessments that have been made, and that is why the school has been turned down.”
“The Minister will remember what happened with Grenfell Tower in her constituency. Does she think it is important to license HMOs? If she does, why are the Government taking that very important safeguard away from very vulnerable people?”
“Will the Minister look at this case and at the implications of Government policy and of competing rights under articles 2 and 3? The Government may have to review their policy and say that no one can ever be deported because they have article 3 rights, even if those rights have not been engaged and alternative approaches could be taken. For instance, someone who has committed an offence could be deported to the first or second country. There must be a way for justice to prevail in this case. The courts have decided on the case, but why do the Government consider the victim and her rights to be secondary to those of the offender? The victim—a survivor of attempted murder—is crying out for justice.”
“Do the Government have a policy for foreign national offenders who have committed a serious offence such as attempted murder? Can they be deported under current Government policy? Are an offender’s rights under article 3 greater than those of a victim under article 2? Is the threshold for engaging article 3 so low that no other decision, under any other legislation or Government policy, can be given in this case? I hope, in the interests of justice, that there are grounds for review or, indeed, for ministerial discretion. We have an offender who is free to move around and a victim who lives in fear. The offender currently has more rights than the victim. I know that ministerial responses can vary, but I consider the latest decision to be flawed.”
“In the case that I have mentioned, the offender cannot be deported to his original country because it is in flux, but the Home Office has never answered the question of whether we are the third country. So far this case has not followed Government policy. The offender has more rights than the victim under the Human Rights Act. Can the Minister tell us whether she has rights under article 2—the right to life, which is also an absolute right? The former Minister, the right hon. Member for Romsey and Southampton North, said that she would speak to the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees so as to remove the offender’s status. Effectively, the Government are saying that the offender, who has tried to remove someone’s right to life under article 2, will gain article 3 rights.”
“In fact, she said that she had to pay for that support herself. The latest letter from the Immigration Minister rubs salt in the wounds, as he says that the offender has rights under article 3 of the Human Rights Act, on the prohibition of torture or inhuman or degrading treatment —and that human rights here will affect human rights in other countries. I am sure there is case law in this regard, but we obviously do not have time to go into it. The letter set out no reasons, so it is difficult to see how the Minister came to that conclusion, which would mean that under Government policy no one can ever be deported anywhere, even to a third country. Is that the Government’s policy?”
“According to gov.uk, “Government policy is to pursue deportation on grounds of criminality where the person…has been convicted in the UK or overseas of an offence which has caused serious harm” I am sure you will agree, Mr Pritchard, that attempted murder is a serious harm. There is a prima facie case for deportation, so it is not clear why the letter of the right hon. Member for Romsey and Southampton North has not been followed. Remember—the victim was born and raised here and worked in the public sector, helping people—no matter who they were. One would have thought that she, too, has rights. But the trial was delayed, and, as the victim said, the offender was given access to a psychiatrist, benefits and a place to stay, while she had post-traumatic stress disorder and struggled to access support.”
“I have raised this case on a number of occasions with a series of Ministers, who have reaffirmed the Government’s policy that it is a stated objective to protect the public by removing foreign nationals who have committed criminal offences. In a letter to me, one Minister said that “all restricted patients who are also foreign nationals must be considered for deportation before their restrictions are lifted.” In 2018, the right hon. Member for Romsey and Southampton North (Caroline Nokes)—the then Minister, who I thank for all her help—met me, the survivor and the survivor’s family. She took proactive steps to look at ways to deport the offender, and wrote to us saying that he was being considered for deportation.”
“He showed no remorse and was sentenced to an indefinite hospital order, but despite the fact that the judge made an order on 15 May 2015 authorising the offender’s detention in hospital and restricting his discharge without limit of time, he was conditionally discharged by the mental health tribunal; worse—he would not be recalled even if he broke the conditions, because he had not come from prison. I will briefly set out the offender’s immigration status. In 2004, he claimed asylum. It was refused. The appeal was allowed and he was recognised as a refugee in 2008. In April 2013, he was granted indefinite leave to remain.”
“On 14 November, the same thing happened: a psychiatrist asked for more time. On 12 December, no plea was entered and the hearing was adjourned until 6 February 2015. That date was moved to 20 January, when he entered a plea of not guilty. The trial was set for April, but the judge was so incensed by the delay that he brought it forward to the end of January, and there was a three-day hearing in which the victim gave evidence. The offender entered a plea of not guilty, but after a very short time the jury found him guilty of attempted murder.”
“She had 22 stitches in her neck and was told the wounds were 2 mm from her main artery. She also had three operations on her hand. Added to the situation, there was a delay in the criminal justice system. It was reported that the police used to pick up the offender for being drunk and disorderly because he wanted food and shelter, which he would get from the police or in the cells. When he first came to this country, he had a septic abscess removed from his stomach, but later wanted to sue the hospital because he thought staff had removed his kidney; they had not, but he engaged solicitors to make a claim against the hospital. The criminal justice system held the first hearing in the woman’s case on 2 October 2014. The offender did not enter a plea and wanted a medical assessment.”
“Highlighting case studies is always useful because policies can be changed as a result, and I hope there will be a review not just of the case I will discuss but of how Government policy is applied. I will briefly set out the background. It was 26 June 2014. A young BAME woman who worked in a public-facing role in the public sector was trying to help a person get into work. It was the second time she had seen the person. She called him over, and as soon as he came to her desk he pulled her by the hair and stabbed her with an eight-inch knife. She said, “I was covered in blood, hysterical losing consciousness until the police and ambulance were called; started to lose my sight and hearing; I thought I was dying.” She was then taken to hospital, where she was in theatre for over two hours.”
“I beg to move, That the House has considered victims’ and offenders’ rights in the criminal justice system. It is a pleasure to serve with you as Chair, Mr Pritchard, and to open this debate. I thank Mr Speaker for granting it. Mr Pritchard, I am sure you will know that every once in a while a case comes along that captures the reason we go into politics: to right a wrong that grabs our sense of justice—that makes us want to strive with all our might and use every single tool we have to ensure that justice is done. It might start with a case, but that case can go to the heart of the misapplication of Government policy, flawed decision making and the possible misapplication of the Human Rights Act, which in this case has left the victim/survivor with fewer rights and in a worse position than the offender.”
“Member for East Lothian (Kenny MacAskill) accepts that it is becoming a safer place—it will never be completely safe until everyone is around the table and accepts the rule of law—but at the heart of this debate is the fact that there are children suffering and people starving. We see pictures of babies who are skeletons. It is quite horrifying. I just gently remind the hon. Member that all hon. Members are aware of the suffering that is occurring. It is why we are having this debate today. I thank him for allowing me such a long intervention.”
“I was born in Aden and lived the first 10 years of my life there. I want to thank hon. Members who, throughout the time that I have been here, have raised the issue of Yemen, which does fall off the agenda. Hon. Members have done a good job—whether the Government or the Opposition or even Back Benchers, we have put it on the map. We are getting to a position now—I am sure that the hon. Gentleman agrees—where people are talking, and it is much better that they talk than they fight. I have not been allowed to go back to Yemen, but the hon. Member for Meon Valley (Mrs Drummond) and I and the Opposition Front-Bench spokesperson are possibly going on a trip, and that would be an incredible thing for all of us because we have not been back there. I hope that the hon.”
“Apologies, Mr Speaker, for missing the start of the urgent question. May I ask the Minister when the data will be published, and will she ensure that it is published within 28 days of 4 May?”
“Can the Minister say when the Defence Secretary last spoke to the NATO Secretary-General about the announcement he has made today and about the Chinese negotiations?”
“My hon. Friend is making a powerful speech. It is not just Labour councils but Conservative-controlled councils that give land to the developers. There is one development on Broadway where the average house costs £800,000, which is way beyond the reach of most of my constituents. Does my hon. Friend agree that, as well as putting targets on developers, we must give housing associations the freedom to build houses? We see people at our surgeries crying out for homes. We must look at the need and then give housing associations the freedom to build those houses.”
“The Minister is doing a great job of expanding his speech. There is absolutely no cost to ensuring that there is an obligation for every new home built to have solar panels. Why does the Minister not look at that? My hon. Friend the Member for Greenwich and Woolwich (Matthew Pennycook), Labour’s Front-Bench spokesperson, has said that all these new houses have to be retrofitted. Surely the Minister can consider what can be done with new houses in terms of the environmental factors?”
“I missed the Prom where Martha Argerich and Daniel Barenboim played the piano together, but it was captured at the end of the documentary. I suggest that everyone tries to listen to it. Music is inspirational. We can see our achievement as human beings, because a few notes can show what creative people we are. It can start with classical music and move to other forms of music such as jazz and modern music. It forms the basis of every aspect of our life. We need to protect that, because music moves us—it moves our emotions and it speaks to our soul. I hope that the Minister will protect it.”
“It is so important that international artists come here from around the world. What our public broadcasters do is so important. I stumbled upon a documentary about the amazing genius that is Daniel Barenboim on BBC Four last week. The BBC had captured him at 25, conducting a masterclass. It was amazing. Even if someone did not know anything about music, they could see how he explained to the two pianists how they could change and make their music sound better. Added to that, he formed the West-Eastern Divan Orchestra with Edward Said. That is how amazing he is. They brought together young people from Israel, Palestine, Egypt and all across the middle east to play together. Daniel Barenboim said that when they play music, they are all equal—they are just playing Beethoven. It is so important that that continues.”
“When I first came here in 2010, I asked the then Education Secretary to make sure that there is a piano in every school, because I grew up surrounded by music. José Abreu suggested that children can benefit from it and formed El Sistema, which has transformed children’s lives in Venezuela. It has now been rolled out throughout the world. We are lucky to have very good radio here. Classic FM is a must to listen to, and public broadcasting is important, as my hon. Friend the Member for Enfield, Southgate, mentioned, as did the hon. Member for Woking (Mr Lord) in his intervention. We have BBC Radio 3—I do not know whether other hon. Members listen to “Building a Library”, but it is a fantastic programme. The Proms is the biggest music festival in the world—way before Glastonbury.”
“My first piece was Bach’s “Well-Tempered Clavier”, prelude No. 1. I still empty the room when I practise it. My daughter Liberty plays the violin and piano. She did an extended project for her A-level, entitled “Does exposure to music make you more intelligent?” She came down saying yes, it does, but if we have active participation. I appreciate that the Minister is going to give birth fairly soon. She does not need to buy “Baby Mozart”, but I encourage her to listen to relax. It is important for children to hear music in the womb it, and later on. The brain waves change when people listen to music. The same can be said of classical Indian music—Ravi Shankar with the sitar, which takes years to learn how to play, has exactly the same effect. We know how important music is for children.”
“I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Enfield, Southgate (Bambos Charalambous) for securing this debate and for allowing me to speak. I knew that the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) would be here, and I wish him a belated happy birthday for last Saturday. I, too, want to acknowledge the role that my hon. Friend the Member for Worsley and Eccles South (Barbara Keeley) has played in securing widespread support for the BBC Singers. The fight is not over; she will continue, and we will support her. I add my voice to everything that my hon. Friend the Member for Enfield, Southgate, has said, although, hon. Members will be pleased to hear, not in song—I will stick to words. This is an extremely important topic. I start with classical music’s large body of work. I was taught the piano by my mother Merlyn when I was quite young.”
“The probate service was part of the reform programme, which has now been paused following a National Audit Office report, so could the Minister say who is responsible for this shambolic waste of public money, and what the next steps are?”
“The Minister is making an interesting speech. I am looking at regulation 5(2)(d), which refers to fishing vessels. Does that include every size of fishing vessel? Obviously, the other regulations refer to ships. Does that include small fishing vessels as well as the larger ones?”