Gill German
MP for Clwyd North · Labour · United Kingdom
“Many seaside towns, like Rhyl and Colwyn Bay in my Clwyd North constituency, are working really hard to regenerate their high streets and attract investment.”
“I recently had the pleasure of visiting the Denbigh youth shed, led by the inspirational Scott Jenkinson. Youth Shedz is youth-led, with young people in leadership roles shaping their own activities, ranging from upcycling old guitars to creating comfort packs for children going into care.”
“That feeling of security also means tackling the root causes of the high cost of living, not just the symptoms. The energy independence Bill will reduce reliance on volatile global markets and deliver more secure, home-grown energy to stabilise and lower bills for households in Clwyd North.”
“Things feel insecure right now, whether that is because of the war in Iran, the cost of living pressures on families or the sense that systems are not working quite right. In Clwyd North, I hear that all the time.”
“I want to make sure that those people know that they are heard and that things can and will get better. We must be honest about the challenges, but focus on what matters to people: building something that works better.”
“These changes matter because of the difference they make to everyday life, with fairer work, stronger families and safer communities here at home. The need to feel secure is important to us all. In this King’s Speech, we are taking crucial steps to strengthen security, because people deserve to feel safe.”
The complete record
Every one of 113 lines we hold for Gill German, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 2 of 3.
“It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Ms Lewell. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Wrexham (Andrew Ranger) for bringing this important debate to Westminster Hall. Every young person deserves the opportunity to thrive, explore their talents, pursue their ambitions and succeed on their own terms. Too often, however, a child’s future is shaped more by their postcode than by their potential. Young people in every community need to see the full range of what is possible. For many, that means opening up direct conversations with local employers; whether those careers are in tourism, renewable energy or the creative industries, we need to connect students with real-world routes into them.”
“In Clwyd North, local authority partners work with DWP colleagues, the third sector and local employers to create bespoke pathways into work from any starting point. I am pleased that their work is now a Wales inactivity trailblazer, but that kind of support must not be the exception; it needs to be the norm.”
“It is a pleasure, Ms Jardine, to serve under your chairship. From discussions I have had in Clwyd North, it is clear that our systems need urgent reform. I have heard too many stories from PIP claimants of unacceptable obfuscation and delay that have led to both mental anguish and financial hardship. That has to stop. I welcome the measures already being taken, but we urgently need to do more. We must waste no time at all in the review of the PIP assessment to make sure that it is fit for purpose, including the assessment criteria and the descriptors. We must also be more ambitious and far-reaching with employment support, both for those seeking and those already in work. I know it can be done.”
“I warmly welcome the Chancellor’s statement and, like my hon. Friend the Member for Cardiff West (Mr Barros-Curtis), in particular the historic £445 million investment into rail in Wales. I also echo my hon. Friend’s thanks for the tireless representation of our Secretary of State for Wales and our Welsh Labour MPs. For my constituency, the investment means vital funding for Network North Wales to seamlessly connect with Northern Powerhouse Rail, bringing us closer to realising the ambitious vision of our UK Labour Government, our Welsh Labour Government, and our Labour metro mayors. Does the Chancellor agree that it is only with Labour working together that we can truly deliver for the people of north Wales?”
“I thank the Minister for his statement, and for the extensive time he spent with the Work and Pensions Committee last week. Our inquiry on pensioner poverty has found that this issue is multifaceted and complex. Can the Minister assure me that he will work cross-Government on a policy that will ensure that pensioner poverty is a thing of the past?”
“It is not a clever ruse or a trick; it is exploitation, and the trauma it leaves behind is real. That is why we must break the stigma around being scammed and take a victim-centred approach that recognises both financial and emotional harm, treating victims of fraud as what they truly are—survivors of an often life-altering crime. Our constituents are not just losing money; they are losing trust, and it is time we fought back, not just with systems, but with the empathy and urgency that will give this crime the attention it deserves.”
“Those fraudsters exploit loneliness and trust by building fake relationships and then vanishing with a person’s savings, dignity and sense of security. Victims suffer a double hit: financial loss and emotional betrayal. The real damage is hard to measure, with 69% of fraud victims reporting a mental health impact, and more than a third saying that they have become less trusting of others. Unlike victims of burglary or assault, many fraud victims do not see themselves as victims of crime. They blame themselves. They feel stupid. They are embarrassed. Lloyds bank found that 23% of people who lost money to fraud said that they were unsure whether what happened was even serious enough to report. That tells us something deeply troubling about how fraud is viewed and how society, including Government and enforcement, has downplayed it.”
“It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Sir John. I will start by thanking my hon. Friend the Member for Hendon (David Pinto-Duschinsky) for introducing this important debate on an issue that affects so many across the UK. I would like to focus on the real human impact, and the effect that the crime can have on individuals. Fraud is the single commonest crime in England and Wales, making up 40% of all crimes against individuals last year. That includes authorised fraud, where the victim is tricked into paying money into an account controlled by the criminal. Fraud of any kind is traumatic, but authorised fraud is not just a financial crime; it can feel like an emotional and psychological assault. One of its most devastating and insidious forms is romance fraud.”
“Clwyd North is a proud coastal constituency, home to a dedicated hospitality sector with many small businesses, including the recently opened Bobcats Coffee, where young entrepreneur Bobby is an example to us all. Economic circumstances have been tough after a decade of neglect by the Tories. Will the Chancellor outline the Treasury’s plans to support the small businesses that are such a vital part of our local economy?”
“This report is both important and timely, and I am proud to be a member of the Committee that has published it today. It was good to hear the Minister recognise during the inquiry that the culture of the Department needs to change and that safeguarding must be at the heart of this. A duty to report safeguarding concerns is second nature to me. As a teacher, I had a clear understanding of the safeguarding duties expected of me, and rightly so. The safeguarding of vulnerable adults is just as important, so this needs to be second nature to those at the DWP. Does my hon. Friend agree that we must see clear action from the Government to create the more compassionate system that we need to make this a reality?”
“Yesterday, Wales lost a musical icon with the passing of Mike Peters from The Alarm. Mike had an extraordinary relationship with his fans, and he brought thousands of visitors from across the world into the area for his annual event, the Gathering. Mike Peters, his warmth and his music put north Wales on the map for visitors from far and wide. Will my right hon. Friend join me in paying tribute to Mike and to the power of music to bring people together like nothing else?”
“I was glad to be a member of the Public Bill Committee that considered the Bill in more detail, and I throw my weight behind the comments made about how the Bill Committee progressed, and how helpful that was to Committee members. The explanations and expansions by the Ministers served us well and have brought us to where we are today. I spoke on Second Reading about the distinction between intentional fraud and accidental individual error, and I am pleased that Government amendments speak to reservations relating to that, and to proportionality. Crucial safeguards will be strengthened to ensure that no one is pushed into undue financial hardship because of debt recovery. Those safeguards include strict affordability checks on recovery payments, and checks on vulnerabilities.”
“I welcome the return of this Bill to the House. I was happy to speak on it on Second Reading, when I welcomed the Government’s crackdown on fraud, because every pound lost to fraudulent claims is a pound that could be spent on the vital public services on which my constituents in Clwyd North rely. It is extremely good to see the recognition of the issue, and the action taken in response to the £7.1 million of fraud and error payments in 2022-23 in Wales alone—that figure is up by £600,000 on the previous year. The fine-tuning of this Bill is important, and that fine-tuning is done through the Government amendments, which speak to the correct application under devolution settlements, policy intent, the application and limitation of part 3, and the consequential amendments proposed to parent Acts.”
“I was pleased to serve on my first Public Bill Committee, and thank the Chairs, Ministers and all involved for its smooth running. I am happy to support the Government amendments put to the House today.”
“We must all reinforce the narrative that benefit fraud is not a victimless crime, and our tackling it through the Bill is long overdue. Throughout the passage of the Bill—in Committee and now on Report—I have been reassured that those who have genuine difficulty navigating the social security system have nothing to fear from the Bill. Indeed, it will raise awareness of the importance of early dialogue. However, I still have concerns about the complexity of the system and how it is administered, as I voiced at Second Reading, but that is for another day. As a member of the Work and Pensions Committee, I will continue to focus on that, as well as having regular dialogue on the subject with my constituents. To conclude, I welcome the Bill and the fine tuning that has come about through Government amendments passed in Committee.”
“The measures put DWP powers in line with those that already exist for His Majesty’s Revenue and Customs and the Child Maintenance Service, and put the importance of the public money spent by those bodies on an equal footing. The behaviour change that is expected to come as a wider benefit of the Bill is welcome. The Bill encourages debtors to negotiate a repayment plan ahead of using the measures of last resort. Importantly, as has been said, it deters organised fraudsters and those looking to become involved in fraud by ensuring that it is not framed as a victimless crime. It is anything but, because it robs us all of vital money for public services. We are not willing to shrug our shoulders at that, as the Conservative party did at the rising tide of fraud during the covid pandemic and beyond.”
“The Bill will protect vulnerabilities where we see them and it is very much a Bill of last resort. It is aimed at people who are not engaging with the DWP on fraud and error cases. Now that carers are aware of the problems that have occurred in the system, we hope that they engage, so I do not believe that the Bill will impact them in the way that the hon. Gentleman suggests. Indeed, the Bill will protect claimants by enabling early dialogue, which will stop errors sooner and prevent debt building up through genuine mistakes; I initially had a reservation on that point. It is clearer than ever that the measures are powers of last resort for those who have refused to engage and are able to pay—it is important to emphasise that point.”
“I am delighted to hear my right hon. Friend announce additional investment in high quality, tailored and personalised support to help people on a pathway to work and the recognition that for so many it is indeed a pathway, not just a series of referrals that merely lead back to square one. Can my right hon. Friend assure me that joint working with local support services like those in Clwyd North, which are already doing great work, will form part of this reform so that a truly local, person-centred approach can be achieved?”
“Does my hon. Friend welcome, as I do, the additional £20 million announced by the Welsh Government last week to improve education standards, on top of the £262 million extra in total for education in Wales? Is she as perplexed as I am as to why the Conservatives and Plaid Cymru voted against extra money for education in the Welsh budget?”
“Will my hon. Friend join me in congratulating the Welsh Labour Government on their work on schools in Wales, keeping the investment in school buildings going after it was cut in England in 2010 through the 21st century schools programme? Now, through the sustainable communities for learning programme, which has seen schools and colleges across Wales—”
“In Clwyd North this means that long-held regeneration ambitions can finally start to become a reality, which is no less than our communities deserve. This St David’s Day we have more to celebrate than ever in Wales, with a vision and a plan for the future backed by two Labour Governments. Mae Cymru yn symud ymlaen gyda phartneriaeth o bŵer—Wales is moving forward with a partnership of power. Dydd gŵyl Dewi hapus, bawb.”
“In 2015 we passed the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act, giving Wales the ambition, permission and legal obligation to improve social, cultural and environmental wellbeing. That of course chimes loudly with the long-term aims of our UK Labour Government, and this is no coincidence. United by our shared Labour values, our Welsh Labour Government at last have a partner in our Westminster Government to jointly work towards our shared Labour aims. With the partnership in power of Eluned Morgan as First Minister and my right hon. Friend the Member for Cardiff East (Jo Stevens) as Secretary of State for Wales, we are finally setting about realising our hopes and ambitions for the future. We have made a great start, with the largest funding boost to Wales since the dawn of devolution.”
“Our Clwyd North coastline is truly something to be proud of and to behold, but there is so much more, including the market town of Denbigh, where everybody knows each other’s names, with its historic Denbigh castle and the fabulously renovated Buttermarket, which is now a centre of wellbeing, culture and heritage; the fine Welsh folly that is Bodelwyddan castle, which is now a beautiful hotel; the magnificent cathedral of St Asaph; and the majestic splendour of Rhuddlan castle. Clwyd North has so much to offer. Across Wales we have lots to be proud of. The coastal path is just one of the achievements that show the value we place on wellbeing and rights in Wales. It was a journey hard travelled by our Welsh Labour Government against the hard winds of 14 years of Tory rule in Westminster.”
“We can walk beside wide sandy beaches that other coastal areas can only dream of, from Rhyl and past the Pavilion theatre and the lifeboat station that has served our waters for over 150 years; through Kinmel Bay, Towyn and Pensarn, with its hundreds of caravans nestled by the shore, which host visitors who have holidayed there for generations; through the glorious Porth Eirias in Colwyn Bay, with its watersports centre and divine seafood at the Bryn Williams bistro; and to the bobbing boats, and chic cafés and shops, of Rhos-on-Sea.”
“I need no excuse to wax lyrical about Wales—particularly the mighty Gogledd, or north Wales, which I am proud to call home—but I am delighted to have the opportunity to do so here in this House as part of my first debate to mark St David’s Day. In my teaching days, I would have spent St David’s Day organising paintings of red dragons; cutting, folding and sticking yellow paper into daffodils; and conducting singing in the round for the song “Dydd Gŵyl Dewi ydy hi”. However, in the run-up to St David’s Day, dyma fi—here I am—in the House of Commons as the proud MP for Clwyd North, or yr Aelod Seneddol dros Ogledd Clwyd. Thanks to the coastal path running along the coastline of Wales, I can take the House for a walk along Clwyd North from end to end.”
“We could potentially quantify that, but the challenge is directly relating it to the Bill, particularly if you introduce other measures at the same time. I think there will be a powerful deterrent effect if it is exercised correctly and at scale and the public can see the benefits. Kristin Jones: I agree. If people know there is an increased likelihood that they will be detected, that will have an effect. It is also important to use similar means to get the right narrative across about what you should and should not be doing.”
“Q We have talked about the increased public acceptability of fraud, and attitudes towards that, and indeed the social-media guides that are out there—the “how to” guides—that present it as a victimless crime. Along with improvements to investigative powers, what will the Bill’s very existence do to change that public narrative? Alex Rothwell: One thing that we have always struggled to do is put a value on deterrence, because it is quite hard to say categorically that someone has not done something because of a change in approach to something. However, it is my view that, once it is known that there are increased powers in this space and that individuals will be pursued for funds, we will see some behaviour change.”
“It is as much a lever to try to bring them to the table and have the sorts of conversations you referenced as anything else. This is also about addressing the existing fundamental unfairness. We can directly deduct from somebody in receipt of benefits, by deducting from that benefit entitlement, and we can do the same for someone in pay-as-you-earn employment, but we do not have that opportunity for people in receipt of income through other means—most obviously, but not exclusively, self-employed people. There is a fundamental point about addressing that inequity in the system. Having made those financial assessments, we know that these are people who can afford to pay. We have tried to reach out with the wraparound support that you suggested, and ultimately, they continue to refuse to engage.”
“We know that, whatever the reason—whether it is fraud or error, but particularly, as you say, if it is error—it is an incredibly stressful time for people. In debt recovery terms, the power that we are taking is intended to be a power of last resort. What we always want to do, having been through all the things that you would expect us to do—the vulnerability management framework that was referenced earlier and the assessment that we make of people’s ability to pay—is to agree an affordable repayment plan. By the time we reach the point where we are looking for a direct deduction order, we would have looked to engage somebody on multiple occasions, contacting them several times and trying to agree that plan. This is for people we have no other means of engaging.”
“Andrew Western: As I have highlighted in my questions to witnesses throughout the day, there is the potential, through the eligibility verification measure, for a number of overpayments to be detected earlier than they would have been otherwise, thereby avoiding the large numbers that we have seen people rack up in overpayments through, for instance, the carer’s allowance challenges that we have seen in recent years. The breadth of the conversation we are looking to have with people who are in debt with the Department is significant. We heard about the MoneyHelper service, on which the Money and Pensions Service works with us. That is just one of a range of organisations and packages that we utilise to support people who are in debt.”
“Q We heard earlier from Anna from the Money and Pensions Service, who believes that the relationship between the service and the DWP is good. She said that a link has been established with Jobcentre Plus advisers to make sure that people are referred for advice to do with debts if needed. How important is that kind of person-centred approach in the practical application of the Bill, particularly in the case of error and the preventive measures we have spoken about—the wraparound care so that people do not get into problems with error much further down the line?”
“Tu Mundo, or Your World, is a growing independent business that recently opened its third coffee shop, in Rhyl. Tu Mundo has a distinctive style, not just with the toucan motif that graces everything, including its teapots, but with its commitment to economic growth in the local area. In partnership with the local employability service, Working Denbighshire, Tu Mundo hosts work-start placements for those entering or re-entering the workplace, with several graduates going on to become permanent employees. Will the Secretary of State join me in congratulating Tu Mundo and Working Denbighshire on that work? Does she agree that that is exactly the sort of partnership work that will bring fair economic growth across the UK?”
“This Bill must tackle fraud and error in a way that is fair and proportionate and does not punish those who have made an honest mistake. I know that the Government have worked hard to include measures that will ensure that these critical distinctions are made as the Bill progresses. However, it is crucial that we do not shy away from coming down on this issue, and that we ensure constituents see their hard-earned contributions going directly to the services that strengthen our communities.”
“Without this distinction, there is a risk of penalising individuals who have simply struggled to navigate the system, and those people may already be in vulnerable situations. Getting this Bill right, however, will mean that £1.5 billion of taxpayers’ money over five years will be saved. That money can be invested in the services that people in my constituency and across the country rely on, from public transport to local infrastructure. With fraud and error costing nearly £10 billion a year, we must act decisively to drive down this fraud and error and protect public funds. At a time when families are struggling and public services are under pressure, ensuring that taxpayers’ money is spent where it is truly needed is not just responsible, but essential.”
“This causes significant stress, and it exemplifies the risks of penalising individuals who may simply have been unable to navigate the system, further entrenching the fear of making a mistake. The Bill must therefore go hand in hand with reforms to make this navigation far more straightforward. A YouGov survey for Turn2us in 2024 found that 77% of respondents believed they would struggle when they needed to claim benefits if their circumstances changed. This highlights the real challenges that people face in navigating a system that is often confusing and difficult to understand. The Government must ensure that their powers to recover overpayments differentiate between fraudulent criminal activity and genuine mistakes.”
“It is also essential that we crack down on organised crime gangs and streamline the process through which DWP investigators can act to bring these serious offenders to justice more swiftly. I welcome this Government’s crackdown on fraud, because every £1 lost to fraudulent claims is £1 that could be spent on vital public services—services that my constituents in Clwyd North rely on to strengthen our communities and improve lives. However, it is crucial that we make a clear distinction between intentional fraud and accidental individual error. Errors leading to overpayments may be the result not of deliberate wrongdoing, but of the inherent complexity of the social security system itself. Many of my constituents have shared their struggles with the complexity of applying for benefits, and knowing what to apply for and how.”
“This Bill is crucial for delivering on this Government’s manifesto commitment to safeguard taxpayers’ money. As the Secretary of State has rightly stated, we must be “turning off the tap to criminals who cheat the system and steal law-abiding taxpayers’ money.” In Wales alone, the national fraud initiative found £7.1 million of fraud and payment errors in 2022-23, up by £0.6 million since the previous year. Figures such as this show just how much a blight on the economy fraud and error continue to be. I have heard at first hand from constituents about instances of benefit fraud that they are well aware of, such as individuals using past addresses to make claims to which they are not entitled. They know that this is not right, and they expect us to take action.”
“T8. The Secretary of State for Transport, the Secretary of State for Wales, the Chair of the Welsh Affairs Committee and the Welsh Government all went on record last week to recognise the previous Government’s low spending on rail infrastructure in Wales. Does my right hon. Friend agree that this Government must put that under-investment right, and can she assure me that the Treasury recognises the crucial part that our railways play in economic growth in Wales?”
“To be clear, this Bill is not about diminishing local authority control; it is about ensuring fairness and efficiency when large-scale events call for a national approach. Coming from a local authority background, I know that the provisions in the Bill would ease the pressures on councils and their licensing committees. It is a common-sense proposal that will unite communities, bolster the hospitality sector and reduce unnecessary bureaucracy. I urge Members from across the House to back this Bill.”
“The hospitality industry is a fundamental part of Welsh culture, and it is vital to the economy of Clwyd North. However, pubs are closing at concerning rates across the UK, with the number of licensed premises down by 30% since 20 years ago. More needs to be done to encourage tourism in smaller pockets of the country, such as mine. In my view, supporting our pubs is a crucial step. This Bill would bring together locals and visitors in north Wales during significant national sporting events, be they football, rugby or something else. I am proud to champion Welsh rugby union games at Parc Eirias in my constituency. I believe it is vital that we support such games in north Wales, and this Bill allows us more opportunity to celebrate successes together locally.”
“I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Wrexham (Andrew Ranger) on his private Member’s Bill, and I am proud to be a named supporter. As a Welsh MP, I know that few things unite Welsh people like supporting our rugby and football teams, and love for our local pubs runs deep. Places such as the Mayquay in Kinmel bay, the Mason’s Arms in Denbigh and the Station in Colwyn bay are vibrant hubs of our communities, and they bring people together during moments of national significance. This Bill builds on that important role by ensuring that communities can gather for major events, while boosting local economies. I am sure that we have all heard from the hospitality sector in our constituencies about the challenges they have faced, particularly in recent years.”
“As a fellow Welsh MP, I have to say that people are incredulous, when I speak to them on the doorstep, at the complexity of the system in Wales. A digital option is unavailable to them to participate in such important local and national elections. Does my hon. Friend agree that the maximum opportunity to vote in all elections in Wales and Scotland, in whichever way they choose, is crucial to create equality across the UK?”
“I am a mum to not one but two 16-year-olds, who I am pleased to say are newly eligible to vote in both the local and Senedd elections in Wales. Because of that, I know at first hand how all-encompassing exam periods are. Elections often occur at these times. Does my hon. Friend agree that allowing young people to apply for a postal or proxy vote online—a way that will be most familiar to most of them—is important to get around that issue?”
“As my hon. Friend the Member for Rugby (John Slinger) pointed out, the victims and survivors panel really needs countrywide representation. Given that I am a Welsh MP, can the Secretary of State confirm that Welsh voices will be heard loud and clear?”
“UK Music describes copyright as the foundation of the music industry, providing a means for creators to monetise their work, an incentive for investment in talent, and an opportunity for us, the public, to enjoy the fruits of creativity. It is important that we get this right, so will the Minister set out how the Government will work with both developers and rights holders to make the most of this groundbreaking technology while still protecting artists’ work?”
“This is clearly not a decision that the Secretary of State has taken lightly, and an apology on behalf of the Department for Work and Pensions is long overdue, but let us make no mistake: the responsibility for this lies squarely with the Conservative party, which oversaw the maladministration and kicked the can down the road yet again, for us to clear up the mess. That must be put right. Can my right hon. Friend assure my constituents that a serious case like this will not occur again, and that this Government will continue to do everything we can to support pensioners going forward?”
“T4. This Government have rightly made tackling child poverty a top priority. Of course, this is not a children problem but a society problem, so I welcome the cross-Departmental approach that has been taken. Last week, the “Get Britain Working” White Paper was published. Does my hon. Friend agree that helping people, particularly parents, into decent, well-paid jobs is a key part of that agenda?”
“Seaside towns such as Rhyl and Colwyn Bay in my constituency have much in common with our north-west neighbours. The 2019 “Future of Seaside Towns” report highlights the need to avoid a one-size-fits-all approach, while recognising common issues. How do the Government plan to use national funding streams while ensuring local delivery to deliver long-term growth in our seaside towns?”
“T8. A recent report by the Federation of Small Businesses Wales highlights the thriving creative businesses that exist in coastal areas like mine. What can the Secretary of State do to increase awareness of them and ensure that the next round of the creative clusters programme focuses on areas such as Clwyd North?”
“I warmly welcome my right hon. Friend’s statement. I believe that these reforms will be transformative, and it is not before time. In my constituency, we have long recognised the gaps that exist in the system. Our local authorities have put in place the brilliant “Working Denbighshire” programme and Conwy employment hub, which really drills down into what local people need and takes them on a pathway into work. Does the Secretary of State agree that devolving power and—crucially—funding in the way she set out is key to achieving the best results we can for local people in their area?”