Jack Abbott
MP for Ipswich · Labour (Co-op) · United Kingdom
“T6. I recently visited Northgate high school in Ipswich with the Children’s Commissioner. As ever, the pupils were thoughtful and articulate about what they needed for the future, but the subject of digital and AI came up a lot. They said that they need greater access to public services and skilling up for future employment.”
“As the Minister says, conversion therapy is dangerous, widely discredited and frankly barbaric, and it is about time we got rid of it. Suffolk Pride’s fringe festival starts next month with Pride Blooms. I ask the Minister to make a powerful statement today, and to say that this terrible practice will end under the Labour Government.”
“I thank the Minister for her detailed speech. I look forward to working with her over the coming months and years on these important issues. I thank everybody who has contributed and shared not just the experiences of their constituents—as awful and harrowing as they often are—but some deeply personal stories.”
“Women learn from a young age to hide their pain away because they must be overreacting and to feign headaches and stomach pains, migraines and food poisoning. More than 1 million women mask period pain sick days every year, because they feel unable to tell their boss the true reason.”
“Despite years of chest pain and breathing difficulties, she was refused referrals to a thoracic specialist and ended up seeking a private opinion. She lives in daily pelvic and chest pain, constantly deals with breathlessness and spends many days bedbound—thankfully not today, Monica.”
“I thank my hon. Friend and could not agree more. For women with endometriosis who may have already waited years for a GP even to mention the word, and who have already been utterly failed by institutionalised and deeply structural medical misogyny, this is a complete dereliction of duty. The human cost of inaction is devastating.”
The complete record
Every one of 373 lines we hold for Jack Abbott, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 3 of 8.
“In October 2020, it was noted that data on disability across the Government was “fragmented” and did “not allow comparisons to be made across Departments.” The information mainly came from anecdotal reports or charity sector surveys. Departments were tasked with improving the collection of data on disabled people. Needless to say, however, nothing much improved and no preparations were made for communicating properly with disabled people in appropriate formats. For example, for a significant period, there was no British Sign Language interpreter on Government broadcasts. The list of clinically extremely vulnerable groups who received online deliveries in the early stages of the pandemic was entirely medicalised, based on an outdated medical model of disability.”
“I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. We also saw severe cuts to early intervention support during the pandemic in my home area of Ipswich and Suffolk. At the height of the pandemic, children’s centres were closed and the number of visits by health visitors was slashed. I absolutely echo his call for more funding, which is why I am really pleased that the Government provided £1 billion in extra funding for special educational needs and disability in comparison with the previous year. In Suffolk, £10 million of that will be spent on specialist places. I absolutely echo and support what the hon. Gentleman said. Data reporting on disabled people during the pandemic was also woefully inadequate.”
“Is it not extraordinary that the Conservative party is still pretending to be the party of law and order, despite being the party that slashed police numbers, hollowed out our criminal justice system and failed victims time and again? In the years prior to covid, the Conservatives artificially capped sitting days, with allocations declining from 109,000 in 2015-16 to a record low of 83,150 in 2019-20, the year leading up to the pandemic. Is it not the case that that reckless decision led to a growing court backlog even before covid struck?”
“Politics has been guilty of seeing communities as an afterthought or a nice-to-have, not as the serious policy tool they should be. The truth is that members have a direct stake in their co-operative’s success because they own it. In fact, they are more than businesses; they are routes to power, ownership, decision making and community. Ipswich’s story, from its proud co-operative roots to its renewed sense of local pride, shows exactly why that matters. True growth is achieved when local communities shape their own future, when we grow our economy from the grassroots and when we keep wealth and power local. That is why the future of our economy, our country and my town must have co-operation at its heart. That is what the Co-operative party’s Community Britain campaign is all about, and why I am proud to be a Co-operative MP.”
“Ipswich is leading the way with projects that bring long-empty buildings back to life, and with community groups exploring new co-operative models to run venues and services that matter to them. There is a genuine sense of momentum in our town, a belief that when we work together we can shape the future of Ipswich ourselves. Although there is much to do, progress is being made. Co-operatives and community enterprises are essential partners in building a stronger, fairer economy that works for everyone. Ministers have rightly spoken about the need for economic growth, not simply seeking growth for growth’s sake, but the type of economic growth that serves people and places. The quality and distribution of growth matter just as much as its pace.”
“That means supporting community ownership of assets, backing partnerships that keep wealth circulating locally, and giving neighbourhoods the tools to plan and deliver the change they want to see. Whether refurbishing an empty shop for social enterprise or helping a community group take over a much-loved building through a co-op or trust, this policy puts power and pride back into local hands and connects directly with the other work the Government are doing to grow our towns more fairly and sustainably, from the community ownership fund to the local skills improvement plan and the growth mission fund. Those are all examples of looking to boost growth, yes, but also sustain it. Together those policies form a clear picture of what co-operative economics looks like in action: growth that is built with communities at the centre.”
“That is why I am so pleased that our Labour Government’s Pride in Place programme is investing £1.5 million in Ipswich, plus millions of pounds across our region and our country, to revitalise our high streets, bringing empty buildings back into use and empowering communities to take control of the spaces that mean most to them. That is more than simply a regeneration grant; it is co-operation in practice. Pride in Place is built on the same principles that drive the co-operative movement: local decision making, long-term stewardship and reinvestment for community benefits. It is designed so that local people, local councils and local businesses can come together to shape projects, not have them imposed from Westminster.”
“There are now dozens of Labour and Co-operative MPs, including Ministers across Government, from the Treasury to the Department for Education and the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government. Fairness, participation and local ownership run deep in this Government’s approach to growth, local empowerment and building an economy that truly works for everyone. In Ipswich, the spirit of shared ownership and civic pride is something we see every single day. For too long under the previous Conservative Government, our town centre was allowed to decline, but local people never gave up on it.”
“The East of England co-operative began in 1861, when a group of people in our region decided to trade fairly, work together and reinvest profits for the common good. From one small store, the movement has grown into a network of more than 200 businesses across Suffolk —including many in and around Ipswich—Norfolk and Essex, providing jobs, training and investment where they are needed most. That legacy still shapes our community today. Co-operatives are rooted in their places. They keep wealth local, invest for the long term and give people a genuine stake in success. Those are principles that this Government proudly celebrate and learn from as we seek to build a fairer and more resilient economy. The co-operative spirit is also alive and well in Parliament, as we can see here this afternoon.”
“It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Mr Turner. I, too, thank my hon. Friend the Member for Oldham West, Chadderton and Royton (Jim McMahon) for securing this important debate, and Joe Fortune, general secretary of the Co-op party, in the Gallery. My hon. Friend has been a tireless champion for the co-operative movement, and rightly so. This part of our economy combines purpose with productivity, and values with tangible social value. I am wearing my hybrid Labour and Co-operative tie—it is not official merch, although the general secretary might want to consider that. I am incredibly proud to stand here as the Labour and Co-operative MP for Ipswich, and to represent a town and region where the co-operative movement runs deep.”
“In my view, making SEND training mandatory for teachers is long overdue, and I hope the Government can strongly consider that in the upcoming White Paper, because every teacher must be a SEND teacher.”
“I have seen that work so effectively, most recently at Hillside primary school, and it was a cornerstone of the plans that I helped to deliver in Suffolk when we created 800 new places. Hubs provide the specialist support that meets the needs of many children, while keeping them close to home in a local setting. The last thing I want to mention is teacher training. As a former teaching assistant, I worked with some brilliant teachers who knew how to be inclusive and to differentiate, but I also know that it is still a postcode lottery. There is a lot of good practice, but we have to be honest: we do not have an education system that allows every child with SEND to thrive.”
“However, while extra funding is incredibly encouraging, it is just one element that needs to be resolved. I want to highlight a few areas that require attention. The first is the extortionate and unregulated private provision that was allowed to grow and prosper under the previous Conservative Government. The problem is not just that the provision is grossly expensive, driving up costs for local authorities; it is also incredibly poor. Secondly, while we desperately need more SEND places, they have to differentiate according to need. We cannot keep shoehorning kids into the few settings that are available, regardless of whether the provision is right for them. That effort must include special schools, but it should also involve specialist hubs within mainstream schools.”
“I thank the 150,000 people who signed the petition. As I have said in previous speeches in this place, although SEND is very much now a national issue, we have been battling this crisis in Ipswich and Suffolk for a decade. Just last month, at my public event, I sat with desperate families who told me heartbreaking stories of their children being failed time and again. I welcome the early changes that our Government have made in looking to address some of the problems in Suffolk. They have approved more than 100 new specialist places in our county, including through the building of a brand-new hub at Ipswich academy. That is in addition to the multimillion pound uplift to the core funding and a near £10 million settlement, meaning that even more specialist places can be created.”
“I proudly support this Bill, and in doing so, I will continue to work for an ambitious devolution settlement that meets the needs of people in Ipswich, Suffolk and East Anglia.”
“I moved to Suffolk when I was 10 years old, a quarter of a century ago. It is my home, and I care deeply about what happens next. For a long time, we have been ill served as a town and a county by short-termism and a do-nothing approach. Every day I have entered this job, I have thought about all the ways in which we can leverage the change we need to set us on a new path. The Bill we are debating today will be the driving force behind how we do that. As my right hon. Friend the Deputy Prime Minister has set out time and again, the goal of devolution must not be to tinker around the edges of our current system, sticking with a system that is not working for anyone. Instead, we should look to the future and take this opportunity to transform local government, our public services and our communities for the better.”
“Lowestoft and the energy coast will be able to power new jobs and investment for their area, and Bury St Edmunds will be better able to align itself with the opportunities offered by the growth around Cambridge and Peterborough. People want their councils to deliver public services effectively, responsibly and accessibly, which is why I believe our devolution settlement needs to produce unitary authorities of sufficient scale to achieve that. However, people rightly also want their councillors and councils to be rooted in their local community so that they can listen, understand, and act in their best interests. I believe that three unitary authorities in Suffolk, working alongside a Mayor for East Anglia, would achieve that balance. This is not about loosening the fabric that holds our county together—it is about strengthening it.”
“While I am supportive of the Bill for the transformative effect it will have on our country, on a local level, a Greater Ipswich council could do far more than just regenerate our town and the surrounding area. It could become a nationally leading economic powerhouse, and our friends and neighbours in east and west Suffolk would also greatly benefit from being able to set the direction of their local communities. This is not just my personal view; it is a view shared by every district and borough council in Suffolk, as well as by political parties of all stripes across Ipswich. From my discussions with local residents, including at my recent town hall event, it seems to be the option that they favour, too. A Greater Ipswich will renew our area’s economic foundations and deliver the infrastructure we need after years of neglect.”
“Residents will question why the Conservatives at Suffolk county council are spending so much money and resources on such an overwhelmingly negative campaign at a time when our potholes go unfilled and our children with special educational needs are so badly failed, all the while raising council tax by its maximum level every single year. Suffolk county council looks not like an authority that is ready to grasp the future, but like one that looks to keep power and status for itself. Alongside the investment in our communities by my right hon. Friend the Chancellor, this Bill and the wider efforts of my right hon. Friend the Deputy Prime Minister offer Ipswich, Suffolk and East Anglia a once-in-a-generation chance to turbocharge investment, growth and opportunity, giving us the chance to determine our own future.”
“It has been really concerning to see that more time is being spent on aiming to discredit alternative ideas and proposals, rather than promoting why the plans are right for our county. Tactics have at times been bizarre, but there is a serious point here. Residents are entitled to proper information, not a spin-heavy PR campaign. I fully accept that turkeys do not vote for Christmas, but I expect local authorities to hold themselves to a higher standard. While running such a misleading campaign betrays a lack of confidence in their own proposals, it does them a disservice and, more crucially, treats local residents with a lack of respect and no little disdain.”
“Devolution and local government reorganisation must not simply be a sticking plaster over the problems of today; instead, we must determine what we want the coming decade to look like for our local communities. We must ensure that people in places such as Ipswich and Suffolk have the resources, powers and trust to determine our own futures. We can end the fragmentation of services and decision making that has at times hampered progress and instead usher in a new era of energy, ambition and delivery. It has been really encouraging to see all Suffolk’s district and borough councils, led by different political parties, working collaboratively and with compromise to form a forward-facing submission. However, there is a stark and disappointing contrast with Suffolk county council.”
“T9. In a recent report, the Victims Commissioner said that she feared that the delay in victims getting justice “will drive some victims to give up on seeking justice altogether—a second injustice compounding the first.”This is completely unacceptable, and at Ipswich Crown court the backlog of open cases has more than doubled since 2016. What are Ministers doing to reverse the harm inflicted by the Conservatives not only on the justice system itself but on victims’ confidence that justice will be served at all?”
“Instead, they simply want to feed resentment, and pit neighbour against neighbour. I know that we are stronger when we stand together—not divided by fear or set against each other, but united in our determination to make our town and our country safer, fairer and more secure for everyone. That is exactly what the Bill will give us.”
“The safety of our communities cannot rest on central Government alone. I welcome this Bill’s focus on partnership—not passing problems between agencies, but solving them together. The national initiative matches our local initiative in Ipswich. I have been working with Labour-led Ipswich borough council to put in place a groundbreaking partnership with Ipswich Central to tackle street drinking in our town centre. The Bill is proof that if we work together, we can deliver at every level. While we bring forward fully formed and fully costed plans to make a difference to the lives of people in my town, and in others, I am only too aware that some people still want to divide communities such as ours in Ipswich. They rarely offer real solutions, policies or change.”
“We know this abuse can be pernicious, and the tactics that are used are constantly evolving, but these new clauses and other parts of the Bill seek to tackle the issue head-on. Like the Bill, the new clauses also put victims where they should always have been—at the heart of the legal system. The Bill sends a clear message: we will no longer tolerate survivors being shut out by the technicalities of the system. Their voices matter, their experiences matter and their right to seek justice matters. Public confidence does not just rest on tough talk or new offences; it rests also on a system that people trust—trust that the police will respond, victims will be supported, those who commit crimes will be held to account, and powers granted will be used fairly, proportionately and with accountability.”
“I therefore strongly support stronger stalking protection orders and the new spiking offence. However, the Bill is about more than new laws; it is also about faster justice, stronger protections, and proper accountability for police and councils when victims are let down. That is why I support new clause 59, which rightly removes time limits for civil claims in child sexual abuse cases. The law should never compound the trauma of victims by closing the doors to justice simply because too much time has passed. New clauses 54 and 56 also apply much stronger protections for children and young people. The abuse and coercion of children is a grotesque crime, and the cowards using children to carry out their criminal operations should face the full force of the law.”
“As I said earlier, we should never accept such things as simply being part of the job. The new measures ensure that when people threaten or insult those emergency workers, there are clear criminal consequences. To our frontline workers, I say this directly: “This House stands with you. You deserve not just our gratitude, but our full support. You protect us, so we will protect you.” Another sad indictment of the last few years is the absolute impunity for violence against women and girls. I speak to so many women in Ipswich who feel uncomfortable, particularly at night. Women have been told to keep an eye on their drinks for fear of spiking, and victims of other heinous crimes have felt that they are fighting not just the perpetrator, but a system stacked against them.”
“That is why I strongly support new clauses 60 to 62, which strengthen the law to ensure that emergency workers are properly protected from the threats, intimidation and abuse that they all too often face while simply doing their jobs to serve the public. Too many of our frontline police officers, paramedics, NHS staff and firefighters have faced unacceptable abuse. Let me be frank: it is utterly disgusting that those serving our communities and country, who keep us safe, sometimes with great sacrifice and selflessness, all too often suffer such unacceptable behaviour. I am sure that everyone in the Chamber has heard awful stories of emergency workers who have endured abuse on account of their race or religion, and the new clauses make clear the consequences for an individual if they engage in such bigotry.”
“It will give the police the necessary powers to act when individuals enter a premises with the intention of committing serious criminal acts, be that burglary, theft, assault or criminal damage. For businesses in towns such as Ipswich, that matters hugely. I speak regularly with local shop owners, small business owners, and retail workers who are proud to serve their communities but who have seen at first hand the impact of rising theft, vandalism, break-ins and antisocial behaviour on our high streets. The new clause gives our police a tool to intervene early before harm is done and when there is clear intent to commit a crime. The amendments also extend protection to those who protect us.”
“As has been said, we are scrapping the £200 shoplifting threshold, which has disproportionately hit small and independent businesses in my town and across the country. It also introduces tough new respect orders to tackle the worst antisocial behaviour offenders, so that our town centre is no longer blighted by the same offenders again and again. Any retail worker in any corner of our town will be able to list a shocking litany of abuse, harassment and sometimes even violence. As has been said, USDAW and the Co-operative party have done incredible work in that area, but such abuse is not part of the job, which is why the Bill creates the specific offence of assaulting a shop worker. New clause 52 will introduce a new offence of trespassing with intent to commit a criminal offence.”
“This has been a good conversation and cross-party debate, but I say gently to the shadow Minister, who tried to claim credit for a number of the changes, that I do not think the argument “If only we’d had 15 years, rather than 14” will wash with many of the people watching. The challenges that we have spoken about did not happen overnight; they were years in the making. Although I appreciate the conversations that we have had today, we must acknowledge the years of suffering that many of our residents, businesses and emergency services—I will come to them in a moment—have faced. With those years behind us, I welcome the amendments that introduce important provisions to help turn that tide. The Bill gives the police the power they need to tackle mobile phone thefts and recover stolen goods.”
“I will be speaking to a number of new clauses, but I will start by setting out a tiny bit of context and saying why the Bill is so important for my town. At the heart of Ipswich is a community—neighbours who support each other, and small businesses that serve us in the town centre and that are seeing real shoots of recovery. However, there is no doubt that when I was proudly elected as its MP, we were arguably at our lowest ebb for generations. Regenerating our town is not just about economics; it is about rebuilding our community, and that is exactly what the Bill helps to deliver. I welcome the Government’s new clauses and amendments, which strengthen the Bill further.”
“I welcome the huge raft of announcements today, not least the announcement that we will expand free school meals, which will benefit 6,500 children in Ipswich. I also want to celebrate the enormous, multibillion-pound green light for Sizewell C. We all know its national importance, from energy security to powering 6 million homes, but I cannot overstate the difference it will make in Ipswich and Suffolk, particularly to our young people, who now have the promise of a skilled, secure and well-paid job. I thank the Chancellor from the bottom of my heart for the investment in my town and county. Can she expand on how else the new age of nuclear will benefit our whole country?”
“T6. Labour-led Ipswich borough council recently announced investment to reopen the iconic Grimwades building in our town centre, which has been left vacant for more than a decade. This local ambition matches the Government’s national initiatives, but challenges remain, so what steps are the Government taking to go even further and reform the unfair business rates system for good?”
“Q4. I refer the House to my declaration in the Register of Members’ Financial Interests. For young people in Ipswich, there is no shortage of ambition, just a need for greater opportunities. That is why last autumn I was proud to sign an agreement with Sizewell C to guarantee 500 jobs for people in my town, alongside additional investment for Suffolk New college’s courses on welding, engineering and fabrication, so that kids in my town can access the well-paid, secure, skilled jobs on offer. May I therefore urge the Prime Minister to support a final investment decision for Sizewell C, not just for our country’s energy security, but for the once-in-a-generation opportunities for young people in Ipswich and Suffolk?”
“Q10. Stone Lodge academy, a special school in Ipswich, will be one of the first schools in the country to benefit from a new breakfast club this month. That is an important step in tackling Suffolk’s decades-long special educational needs and disabilities crisis, as is the multimillion-pound funding settlement given to opening new specialist places across the county. Will the Prime Minister outline what steps he will be taking to break down the barriers to opportunity further for all children as part of our plan for change?”
“I think all Committee members can appreciate why such a scenario, rare as it may be, needs to be considered for the reasons we have discussed today in relation to coercion or other sorts of abuse, whether it is obvious or more pernicious. We know that in certain situations there will be people, particularly if they are married or in a long-term partnership, for whom such aspects may be at play. I am sure that they are a rare minority of cases, but I hope that these things are considered. Greater scrutiny is probably needed in these scenarios. Essentially, the new clause would allow for a more comprehensive and thorough assessment of people’s wellbeing and social context, including their relationship. I am not minded to press it to a vote at this stage.”
“The new clause stipulates that if any medical or healthcare professional receives any indication that a patient is seeking an assisted death at the same time as one of their family members, especially a partner, both the co-ordinating doctor and a registered medical practitioner from the person’s GP practice must be notified and the patient must be referred both for a psychiatric assessment and for an assessment by a social worker. The assessing doctor would then have to take into account any opinion provided by the psychiatrist and social worker and share it with the assessing doctor. I appreciate that the new clause may be a little too prescriptive at this stage, but I would like the matter to be considered on Report and to be given further deliberation by the Government if the Act is passed and goes into the implementation phase.”
“I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time. I am minded not to press the new clause to a vote, but I have a few brief remarks to make. The new clause does what it says on the tin. It applies to the rare—I underline the word “rare”—cases in which two family members, particularly a couple, both receive a terminal diagnosis within a relatively short space of time and would therefore qualify under the Bill. For very many couples, there would be absolutely nothing untoward. Many people will make a decision in their best interests, particularly if they have been married or partners for a significant period.”
“I agree that that may be an incredibly rare scenario and that two people may just want to go through the stages towards the end of life together, but extra checks may need to happen at some point to ensure absolutely that there is nothing untoward such as other sorts of pressure or coercion, rare as that might be.”
“I appreciate the points made by the Minister and by my hon. Friend the Member for Spen Valley. “Family member” is a relatively non-specific description, but I think the thrust of the new clause is clear. Clearly, it is directed particularly at couples. I fully understand why my hon. Friend does not want people to have to go through a huge number of extra layers; I have said at length several times that I do not want people at the end of their life to go through an awful period of sitting in endless meetings, assessments or courtrooms. However, I reiterate that although they would be relatively exceptional, there will be situations in which coercion and other sorts of pressure are potentially at play.”
“Having this sort of panel, with expertise and life experience, would be a significant step forward for people with disabilities, learning needs and anything else that might be included. Once again, I pay tribute to my hon. Friends for this work. I am fully supportive of the new clause.”
“At this point, I pay tribute to my hon. Friends the Members for Penistone and Stocksbridge and for Bexleyheath and Crayford. They have consistently tabled really important amendments that are very close to my heart, measurably improving the Bill. I am briefly speaking in favour of new clause 35. We have had a number of good amendments about ensuring proper representation for vulnerable people during the process. We have also had a lot of discussion about the very important need to regularly monitor and report back on the Bill. This new clause brings all this together, ensuring that there is real oversight, with real thrust and a point to it. It is not good enough just to report back some statistics; the question is what we do with them.”
“I do not want to go over ground that we covered in the later hours of yesterday, but this is sort of the issue that my amendment 533 sought to resolve, albeit via regulations rather than in the Bill directly. I am sure that our colleagues on the Front Bench will be doing some thinking about it. As the hon. Member for East Wiltshire alluded to, in some situations the question of place—of where we will be able to carry out these procedures—is not black and white. I fully appreciate what my hon. Friend is saying, which is that if someone chooses to end their own life in their own home, they should be able to do so. In some cases, however, the Government will need to give further thought to the issue of place. I think that is really important.”
“Again, I do not think it is as black and white as saying, “This care home already had a set position.” Some care homes or other settings might change their position over time, even when residents are in situ for a long time. That is the big problem with this particular clause: the situation is not as straightforward as some Members have perhaps suggested today.”
“A lot of the focus in the last few minutes has been about a care home having already made it clear that it does not support the process of assisted dying and the fact that anyone entering it would therefore know that. However, there is a clear scenario where some care homes might change their position over time. Someone may be in a care home for many years, but then the care home might change its position and say, “Actually, now we do not support assisted dying.” In that scenario, people would actually have gone into that setting thinking that it supported assisted dying. Although I am sympathetic to the issue of place being made clear, it has real ramifications.”
“I appreciate that, but as my hon. Friend has said a number of times over the last few weeks, some of these things unfortunately do happen. As I am sure we all do, I have had casework involving people with guide dogs saying that they have been refused certain services, including taxis, even though that is a civil offence because they have a guide dog with them. We have said a number of times that there are flaws in every single system. I appreciate that we want to adopt a good-will attitude, and I am sure the vast majority of settings across the country will operate on that basis, but we know that, in certain circumstances, that is not always the case. That is why, if we put anything in the Bill, it needs to have real clarity and not unintended consequences.”
“Another example raised by the hon. Member for East Wiltshire was about hospitals under certain trusts—because of the word “premises”. In the Government’s view, would hospitals and other such facilities beyond hospices and care homes also be included within this new clause?”
“I cited a stat yesterday when speaking to an amendment that around 10% of people using the assisted dying route have complications during the final stages, but as I said then, that came from an incredibly small sample size of just over 100 people. It is therefore critical that, if the Bill is passed and we go down this path, we pursue robust and expansive data gathering in a number of different areas, and I am sure that any Government would look to do so. As long as it does not create any loopholes or unintended consequences, that sort of evidence gathering should be in the Bill because, at the very least, that would provide reassurance that it will happen if the Bill is passed.”
“Without trying to sound like a broken record, however—I have made this point several times over the past few weeks—it is critical that in certain situations, although there may be some regulations or inferences that exist that may lead to certain outcomes that we on this Committee would all like to see, there is nothing necessarily wrong with putting them explicitly in writing. Hon. Members have used different stats from different jurisdictions in their own way to lend weight to their arguments, and although many of those stats are relatively consistent in a number of areas, they are not necessarily decisive.”