John Grady
MP for Glasgow East · Labour · United Kingdom
“Q4. The Family C official report, about the most depraved sexual abuse of children, identifies serious failures by Glasgow city council and other bodies. The report says that one child victim “banged on the windows shouting at the health visitor not to leave”,but this was treated as “streetwise”, instead of a desperate cry for help.”
“The Roma have suffered centuries of prejudice and hate. Under the Nazis, they were subjected to concentration camps and genocide. Roma people have made their home in my constituency and in Northern Ireland, and should be treated with decency, yet they have been subjected to terrible racist violence in Northern Ireland.”
“Businesses trading with unlawful settlements can be under no illusion that the settlements are unlawful and that the majority of Members of this House view them as utterly morally repugnant. Nor can they be under any illusion that the UK Government’s position is that people should not trade with unlawful settlements.”
“People across Glasgow East welcome the proposed ban on social media for under-16s. I thank the Secretary of State and the Minister for AI and Online Safety for their excellent work, which means that young people across Glasgow and Scotland will be much safer.”
“The RSF have slaughtered children and used rape as a weapon of war. As we return to our constituencies, we should reflect on how we would act if this were happening in them—to our mothers, our sisters, our partners and our children. The UN Security Council says that there will be no impunity for those committing war crimes.”
“The long-term strength of the economy depends on long-term investment in the UK. UK growth companies still struggle for capital, while UK savers’ money flows to trackers, which are concentrated on a small number of US stocks. That is bad news for our future. My right hon.”
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“Does the hon. Gentleman accept that one of the key purposes of a consumption room is to reduce harm to people who would, in any event, consume the substances in question? In Glasgow, we have had significant problems with needle-borne viruses, infections and illness, so it is only morally right to help these people, as they struggle with their addictions, to consume in a safe way. Otherwise, people lose their loved ones, their mothers and fathers, and their sons and daughters. It is a question of compassion.”
“I wonder whether the right hon. Gentleman might clarify one point on the Opposition’s position. In Scotland, there has never been a right for the accused to elect to have a jury trial. The prosecution decides whether a case will go to jury trial. Is the Opposition’s position that such a reform in England should be opposed?”
“There has been much mention of Shakespeare. I wonder whether the gravediggers in “Hamlet” might give us some clues as to what the last Conservative Government did to the British economy.”
“Tackling this Government debt in the longer term is very important, and the Chancellor is quite right to focus on her fiscal rules and face the tough decisions that need to be taken. All of us must play our part in assisting with something that is incredibly important for our country.”
“I fully support the Chancellor’s decision to rebuild the headroom, tackle Government borrowing and stick to her fiscal rules. It is consistent with Labour values. There is nothing progressive about 10% of Government spending being on interest. There is nothing progressive about leaving unsustainable debt to future generations. I worry that there is a lot of criticism of the Chancellor’s proposals but very little by way of fully worked-up alternative proposals. Tackling debt is very important because the nature of Government debt buyers is changing with the closure of defined-benefit schemes, and as the OBR has outlined in a report, where we borrow money from in the future will be very different from what we face now. Furthermore, there is rising debt across many Governments in the western world.”
“It is about choices—choices to invest in the health service so that people can return to work and contribute to the economy. There is nothing more heartbreaking than being a constituency MP and listening to people who have been waiting for over two years for a hip operation and cannot work. It is about choices to invest in infrastructure and in new nuclear power stations. These are the choices that the Government are making, and I am proud of them.”
“I have worked in hospitality. I am not sure I was particularly successful at it, but there is a macro point here—an important point not to lose sight of. We hear from Opposition Members objection after objection to the Chancellor’s decisions, but no credible alternatives.”
“My constituency of Glasgow East has some of the highest levels of child poverty in the United Kingdom. This is a disgrace and a scar on our society.”
“It would mean higher bills for consumers, and would make the country poorer. I welcome the Chancellor’s reforms to gambling taxes. There is a clear distinction between going to the bingo and gambling on the horses—I will disclose that in the past I have enjoyed quite a few trips to the races—and online gambling and gaming, which, as we heard in the Treasury Committee, cause serious harm. It is essential that we start to tackle this issue. I realise that it is not a matter for the Treasury, but the marketing of online gambling and gaming needs to be reviewed, and I encourage the Treasury to act robustly against any evasion and black market activity. I have heard some mention of choices today. This Budget and the Bill put in place steps to remove the two-child limit.”
“Private sector investment—like many Labour Members, I have worked in business—is supported by contract law, the rule of law, confidence in the independence of our courts, and the reliability of the Government. The European convention on human rights also has an important part to play, particularly article 1 of protocol 1: the right to peaceful enjoyment of possessions. Those Members who argue for the complete unilateral withdrawal from the ECHR may wish to consider the catastrophic effect on the economy of such a step. In the summer, Reform threatened investors with the cancellation of contracts for difference. That shows that a Reform Government would be happy to rip up contracts and to shred Britain’s reputation as a place of stability. I fail to see how that would promote economic growth.”
“I am going to make some progress if I may. Given the public finance situation that we face, I am afraid it is incumbent on Opposition Members to come up with some credible alternatives. But of course we know what their credible alternatives are; they are the sort of decisions made by the gravediggers Liz Truss and Kwasi Kwarteng—back to Shakespeare. Control of public finances is one part of the equation. The other is growth, and the Government are promoting growth in the economy through things like the Planning and Infrastructure Bill, which was shamefully delayed in the other place. I suppose we should talk about Reform’s proposals for growth.”
“I will make some progress—I am mindful of Madam Deputy Speaker’s time limit. Child poverty blights the lives of children in Glasgow East, and the levels of child poverty are a moral outrage. The Conservatives’ approach is to refer to my constituents as being on “Benefits Street”, which reveals the contempt that they have for my constituents, and Reform UK Members have been speaking about children in my seat with real racist malice. I say that it is a privilege to be a Member of Parliament for those children and I am proud that this Bill will help to lift hundreds of thousands of children out of poverty. I am proud of our Labour Government’s actions on child poverty and I fully support the Bill, which raises the funds to reduce child poverty.”
“Perhaps Reform UK is polling high in Perthshire as well. Leaving that to one side, let me tell the hon. Member what my constituents in Glasgow East are not relieved about: record NHS waiting lists, an SNP Government who block nuclear developments that would bring in hundreds of thousands of pounds a year through the creation of good employment, excellent jobs and growth in the economy, and an SNP Government who are anti-business and anti-growth, and who have just spent 18 years running Scotland into the ground. That is what concerns my constituents and that is why next year Anas Sarwar will be the next First Minister and create optimism for Scotland.”
“The Scottish public finances have been aided by a record budget settlement from the UK Government, but there is a £5 billion black hole in them. Might it be the case that after 18 years of the SNP, some responsibility for such matters lies closer to home, perhaps in Edinburgh?”
“Does the Minister agree that it is due to the careful management of the public finances that we have record investment in defence and other areas of the Scottish economy, creating lots of well-paid jobs in Glasgow?”
“It is brilliant to listen to all this chat about thousands of new jobs and billions of pounds of investment, but we are not getting any of it in Glasgow, because the Scottish National party is against nuclear power. Nuclear power is a source of reliable baseload energy and is essential for security of supply. In fact, we import nuclear energy to Scotland from time to time when the system is short. Against that background, does the Minister agree that the SNP’s anti-nuclear stance defies logic?”
“I shall close by paying tribute to the Hillsborough families. They are the embodiment of the greatest of human qualities: immense courage in the face of the most terrible grief; determination to get to the truth; determination that every possible lesson is learned from Hillsborough; and determination that the law is changed to protect people they will never meet and never know. I admire them greatly. Each of us owes those families the greatest of debts.”
“Clause 18 and schedule 6 concern public inquiries, and the provisions are designed to ensure that the conduct of public authorities and their legal teams is fair and reasonable, in particular to ensure the equality of arms that we have heard described so eloquently today. The law relating to public inquiries in Scotland and England is broadly the same, so I would be grateful if the Minister could explain why the schedule 6 provisions do not extend to Scotland. Schedule 6 also makes provision for the expansion of legal aid and again, quite properly, this does not apply to Scotland, but I would be grateful if the Minister could explain the Scottish Government’s position on this. My concern is simple: a family in Glasgow should have the same broad rights as a family in Newcastle upon Tyne when trying to get the truth from public authorities.”
“I am not the first to raise concerns about the transparency and openness of NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde: my friends Anas Sarwar and Jackie Baillie have repeatedly raised serious concerns about institutional cover-up. I agree with them, and join them in their call for a radical change of culture and their support for Milly’s law, with a public advocate system. I would like to ask a couple of questions about the Bill’s application in Scotland. It contains three criminal offences that are not replicated in Scotland. That is quite proper because, as we heard earlier, criminal law is a matter for the Scottish Parliament, not this place, but it would be interesting to know what the Scottish Government’s position is on this.”
“The second report was completed over two years after their child’s death, and that report itself was concerning as the NHS could not identify one of the doctors involved in the child’s treatment and could not source two nurses involved, so they were not interviewed. How can it be that the NHS cannot identify three people who worked in a hospital on the day in question? The family do not have answers even now, two and a half years after the death of their beloved child. I have tried my best to help them, and I have pressed the NHS to complete the long-delayed report and meet them. Despite that, I am afraid that this grieving family has been treated appallingly. I therefore welcome the provisions of chapter 2. They are seriously needed.”
“I will focus on chapter 2 of part 2 of the Bill, which provides that public bodies must operate in accordance with the highest ethical conduct. That is very important to my constituents in Glasgow. Shortly after I was elected, I met a mum and dad at one of my surgeries. They want to know how their beloved child died while being treated as an in-patient in NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde. They know that they cannot get their beloved child back; they just want to know that lessons have been learned so that other families do not suffer the same anguish every day. This family wrote to NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde two months after the death of their child; the first response was less than candid. They asked for proper investigations; one partial report was issued 10 months after their child’s death.”
“I do apologise, Madam Deputy Speaker. We are talking today about a massacre at a hospital where mums, dads and little babies should be safe and helped. With that in mind, those who commit war crimes should be held to account. Can the Minister please reassure me that the UK is doing everything possible to ensure that international criminal law is enforced, and that its application and enforcement are improved? Can he also reaffirm to me our Government’s absolute support for the independence of the International Criminal Court?”
“The proposed changes to agricultural property relief in Scotland will ensure that, by still providing full relief for the first £1 million of assets, farmers continue to benefit from Government support far beyond that which is available to other assets. Given that 7% of claimants—117 claimants—receive two fifths of all agricultural property relief at a cost of some £219 million, does the Minister agree that this Government’s reforms are essential not only for fairness but to help fund vital public services in rural Scotland?”
“The facility is located in my constituency. The report stresses the importance of engagement with the local community. Drug litter and public injecting very close to the facility are a cause of real concern for my constituents, whose worries are not being properly addressed. There are now suggestions that the facility could open for 24 hours a day—a cause of real worry for my constituents. The community must be properly consulted about material changes to the facility. Does my hon. Friend agree that a robust strategy is essential not only for communicating with but for listening to and addressing the concerns of my constituents?”
“Has the hon. Gentleman considered some of the reforms that the FCA is considering, such as the advice guidance boundary review? I understand the thrust of what he is trying to do—to ensure that people get proper pension advice. Hopefully, everyone would agree with that, but I wonder how it fits in with the wider context of the work that the FCA is doing.”
“My hon. Friend makes a very good point, at the heart of which is the question of what work needs to be done to introduce anything along these lines. One would have to look at what the Financial Conduct Authority is doing, the existing service provisions, the costs, and how we smooth out implementation. There are a lot of practical issues with implementing something like this, are there not?”
“Is it possible to identify any particular gaps in the competition regime? Chapters 1 and 2 of the Competition Act 1998 cover things like exclusivity arrangements, and so on. There is a regime for market studies, which would also enable this issue to be addressed, and, manifestly, this would be of serious consumer interest under the competition regime. I just wonder what gap new clause 2 addresses in the current regulatory regime.”
“There is a serious question when people can act with impunity without fear of prosecution and conviction for serious crimes. I ask the Minister to set out how the United Kingdom Government are working with international allies to strengthen international law, so that people cannot act with such impunity, to protect children in Gaza and all the other conflict zones of the present and future. I am obliged, Mr Stringer.”
“It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Mr Stringer. I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Cowdenbeath and Kirkcaldy (Melanie Ward) for securing the debate and I agree with everything she said. This is a time when children are starting school for the first time—a moment of optimism, pride and love for their parents. Imagine being a Palestinian mum and dad, unable to feed their children, unable to take them to school or to pray at a church or mosque, unable to find a doctor when they are ill. This is a moral outrage of the first order. At present, under international law, people are able to act with utter impunity. There is a question of whether the scope of international law is wide enough to cover the atrocities being committed in this and other conflicts.”
“Would the hon. Member accept that pension trustees should, in accordance with their fiduciary duties, actively consider investing in such things as private equity, private patient capital and interests in land? The fact that so many people have agreed, under the Mansion House arrangements, to invest in such classes of assets, which have grown exponentially in scope over the last 25 years, makes the basic point that they will yield much better returns for my constituents. The thrust is simply to get better returns for pension savers in the United Kingdom.”
“We know that it is much easier for people to manage greater-sized pots of money. For the industry, it is a huge cost to manage lots and lots of very small pots of money. I think it benefits savers and it benefits the industry to have this. This is a pragmatic solution that is within the Bill, as far as we are concerned. The industry has considered a number of different ways of addressing this problem, and we feel that this is actually a very pragmatic solution. It does rely on a technology platform, so we were pleased to see that it is further down in the timeline for the Government’s road map for implementation, because we all know that introducing technology platforms can take some time and there are a lot of other things that we need to be working through, including consolidation and so on.”
“Q I apologise: I should say that my wife sits on the committee of the Scottish Government pension scheme. I should disclose that to the Committee. I would like to move on to a slightly different topic: small pots. Ms Singleton, the SPP made supportive comments in its submission about small pots. Would you like to elaborate on why you support the small pots element of the Bill, and are there any practical considerations you would like to draw to the Committee’s attention? Sophia Singleton: Small pots are a challenge for both the industry and for individuals. You have got a much more mobile workforce, and more and more people have small pots and have lost sight of those pots. Obviously, the dashboard will help them to gain sight of them, but actually bringing them together will help them to manage it.”
“It is really important that the pot size is kept low, as is proposed in the Bill, at least initially, to solve the problem of the smallest pots in the market. Pensions UK has undertaken a feasibility study, working with Government, to look at how that small pots system might be delivered in practice. That work is publicly available. It gets quite technical quite quickly, so I will not go into the details of it, but we believe there is a feasible model of delivering the small pots solution at low cost—one that should not involve Government in a major IT build.”
“Q This question is for Ms Alexander. A lot of my constituents are driven mad by small pots; they have worked in different jobs and have no idea how much money they have saved for a pension, so please could you outline the benefits of the small pots reforms to people in my constituency, and the practical steps needed to make the small pots regime work—for example, by way of IT? Zoe Alexander: The small pots reforms are absolutely critical. The problem of small pots was foreseen by the Pensions Commission years ago. We all knew we would face that problem with automatic enrolment, and I think people would agree that it has taken too long to grasp the nettle. We at Pensions UK are really delighted to see the measures in the Bill to deliver the multi-consolidator model.”
“Within the Bill, introducing a guided retirement duty enables those institutional investors to start to guide individuals or cohorts of members into the right kind of products for them, with clear opt-outs for them to choose a different way. As Charlotte said, the type of support and new form of regulated advice could really help inform savers and make good choices at that point.”
“So, working with providers at the moment on how they can support people when they are making these sorts of decisions, and just think about whether, if it is not full financial advice—I understand that can be very, very costly—are there other areas where we can give people help that is not as kind of extreme as that but allows people to think about those decisions in the round? Patrick Coyne: I would just add that one of the reforms in the Bill around guided retirement is reflective of that default conundrum we face. We have a brilliant system—11 million more savers—but nobody making an active choice. That means that when people approach retirement, only one in five has a plan to access and when they do, as Charlotte said, half are taking it as cash. That cannot be the right outcome.”
“You are right that we are doing quite a lot of work, largely around the ISA area and the at-retirement area. One of the challenges at the moment is people taking money out of their pension and then putting it in cash. That may seem like a really wise decision if you are 55, but if you do not need that money for 20 years, it may keep track with inflation but you are going to miss out on asset returns, equity returns or other aspects of investment. So, we are really thinking about how we engage with people about those sorts of discussions. How can we make sure they are getting the right support? It comes back to the targeted support programme, which goes live in spring next year.”
“Charlotte Clark: It is important to say that most people who are saving in a pension are probably saving in the default. When you say that they are choosing their investment, most of them are not. Whether it is the trustees of that scheme or whether it is the independent governance committee of that scheme, most people are going into that default, so the importance of the default is really crucial. While it is important to really think about engagement and talk about the advice guidance boundary review and some of the work that is happening there, it is also important that some people will not want to make those decisions. It is only people like us who seem to care about these sorts of things. Getting other people engaged in their investment is quite a challenge.”
“Q With DC—defined contribution—schemes, as you know, savers themselves have discretion about where they put their money. The issue we face, illustrated by Dimson, Marsh and Staunton’s regular review of asset returns, is that people are not saving in things that will get them a long-term return, are they? The other issue we face is that there has been a real shift from public markets to private markets over the past 25 years or so. If you are not investing in those, you are missing out on returns that mean more money when you retire. I was just wondering, Ms Clark, if you could just put into context the work you are doing on the advice guidance boundary review and wider advice to savers, and how that will help pension savers and, therefore, help these reforms succeed?”
“I explain to my constituents every week how hard the Foreign Secretary and his ministerial team are working in this context, but every day women and children are killed and are starving. What is happening is a moral outrage of the first order. The International Criminal Court is a key pillar of international justice. Will my right hon. Friend reassure me that he is doing everything possible to protect and enhance its independence from political interference, and to ensure that it is more than properly resourced to carry out its important work in this conflict?”
“I welcome the independent water commission’s report—it is a serious piece of work. The water companies were privatised with no debt, yet following years of dividends, excessive debt and opaque financial structures, the financial stability of the water sector is a cause of very serious concern. Recommendations 56 to 59 engage substantially with that topic, as do other recommendations. Will the Secretary of State commit to carefully reviewing whether the implementation of many of the recommendations dealing with financial stability can be accelerated ahead of legislation, to protect both resilience and bill payers?”
“The reforms are targeted at getting greater investment into British infrastructure and cutting red tape. Does my hon. Friend agree that it was a little bit rum for Opposition parties to criticise our Government for introducing red tape when they voted against the Planning and Infrastructure Bill, which creates projects that people can invest in and provides houses, which are a key restraint on house price inflation?”
“I rise to speak against the Opposition motion. My right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer has raised taxes. She has done so to stabilise the public finances, because the public finances that the Labour Government inherited were in a shocking state; she has done so to invest in public services, in particular the NHS and schools, because public services were left in a shocking state by the previous Government; she has done so to invest in national security; and she has done so to invest in Scotland. My right hon. Friend has raised taxes because public finances need to be managed carefully. We cannot keep pretending that we have money when we do not.”
“What cuts would they make, and what effect would that have on the businesses they claim to support? They need to explain whether they would reverse the investment in the NHS, which is essential to businesses. Many businesses have said to me that they want to see investment in the NHS in order to get the waiting lists down and reform the service. That is exactly what my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Health is doing. The disruption caused to businesses by NHS waiting lists is significant, but they are now coming down—if only the same could be said for Scotland. The Opposition must explain whether they would reverse the investment in education, because businesses say to me every week that they want to see investment in skills. They need skilled workers to grow their businesses. It is essential for economic growth.”
“I am very happy to reflect that the covid pandemic happened, but I also reflect that Liz Truss and Kwasi Kwarteng’s mismanagement happened. The Conservatives lost the last election because they made a mess of the economy. They have lost their reputation for economic competence, which is why they have lost so many MPs and suffered an extinction event. I read in today’s Times that it was thought that the common crane had been extinct for more than 500 years in Scotland, but it is now reported that there are six or seven nesting pairs in Scotland—more than we have Conservative MPs, and there may be a reason for that. The Opposition motion implies a reversal of more than £20 billion in taxes. The Opposition need to explain how they would fund that.”
“All I will say, Madam Deputy Speaker, is the plain fact is that North sea oil and gas will be produced for many years to come, and the Government support that. The Government are also supporting investment in the industries of the future, such as offshore renewables. Under the Conservative Government, there was a contracts for difference auction with no successful bids, setting back our access to fixed-price, cheap electricity. That is the Tory economic policy on energy: turning up their noses at cheap, fixed-price energy. It is little wonder we are in such a mess.”
“I cannot recall saying anything disparaging about Scottish education. I did criticise the Scottish NHS—[ Interruption. ] Well, the reality is that businesses are absolutely petrified of the way the SNP is dealing with Scottish education. We have insolvent universities and colleges in crisis, and education standards are plummeting. Those are the facts, and they are why the Scottish SNP Government will lose in 2026 and we will have a new First Minister. The Conservatives are meant to be patriotic and pro-defence. How is the investment in defence to be paid for? Would they reverse the record settlement for the Scottish Government given that we have Scottish elections next year? I think they should explain.”
“The Conservative approach to the economy simply does not grapple with the serious state of the public finances; it inhabits a world of wishful thinking—a world of higher inflation, higher Government borrowing costs and higher interest rates.”
“I will make some progress if I may. Our debt to GDP ratio is almost 100%, and we inherited that from the previous Government. Conservative Members object to tax rises while wanting tax cuts and increases in public spending and objecting to spending cuts. That is not realistic. We know from the disastrous Budget of Liz Truss and Kwasi Kwarteng that we must manage finances carefully. Some Opposition Members suggest that we should get rid of the Office for Budget Responsibility. The Conservatives shunned the OBR when Liz Truss and Kwasi Kwarteng put forward their Budget and we know what happened then. I find it quite surprising therefore that we still have Conservative Members who want to get rid of it.”
“No, I will make some progress. The huge inflation unleashed by the previous Government caused immense misery to my constituents. The interest rate rises made life a misery for hard-working families who had bought their homes in Glasgow East. That is why my right hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer is right to focus on appropriate management of the economy and not wishful thinking. The real question is this: what has the Conservative party come to. Will it ever return to seeing things as they are, rather than proposing policies that bear no relationship to reality? Its proposals, as I understand them, are a form of magical realism, which is why the electorate have cast them into 100 years of solitude.”