YouSaid · the spoken record

Amy Edmondson

lines on the record: 35
first: 2022-09-28
most recent: 2022-09-28
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Aim high Go for gold, right? Play to win, don't play not to lose. It's very human and very spontaneous to play not to lose by which I mean, you know, it's like non-growth mindset. Only engage in things you know you can win. But go for the things that you may not win, which is, of course, related to grit. But aim high, if you are really passionate about solving some important problems in the world, you can't do it alone. So team up. Team up with people who are different than you. That's not easy. So there will be failure along the way. That's okay. Fail well. Learn fast, repeat.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Thriving in the New World, and one is self awareness, one is situation awareness, you know, what kind of context is this? What are the stakes and so forth? How much uncertainty? And then the third is system awareness, trying to overcome our very natural tendency to be preoccupied with Me and now, so that I can be interested in the larger system and later.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I'm working on a new book called Right Kind of Wrong, The Science of Failing Well. And this is very, it's related to psychological safety. And maybe what it does where psychological safety describes the nature of the environment, the climate that we need to innovate and problem solve together. This book looks at some of the sort of technical details of failing well. What is a good failure look like compared to a bad failure? And how do we avoid the bad failures? And how do we increase the frequency of the good failures? And then I dig into three competencies that I think are necessary, not just for failing well, but for”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So it's like we're still collaborating, sending lots of emails, I'm having lots of meetings, but slowly but surely I've been having fewer meetings with new people and new employees are getting less mentoring and less exposure to people they didn't know because of the casual interactions or gone.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“You know, it's funny because on the one hand you're comfortable at home, right? So there's a kind of home isn't scary for most people, unfortunately. But on the other hand, the technology that mediates our communication is a hurdle for candor and honesty and jumping in So there's a potentially, in fact, we're seeing this depressing effect of at the very least people working from home are less likely to be collaborating with people they haven't worked with before. They're also less likely to be teaming up across silos, you know, organizational silos than they were before the pandemic started.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“The one robust gender difference that I've found and seen in other data that relates to psychological safety is on average, and again, there's always variance, but on average, women are less likely to speak up with something uncertain at the same level of confidence as a man. A man might be, well, I'm not quite sure this is right, but they'll say it anyway. A woman will often put the threshold for when is it okay to speak up?”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yes, and not just at the bottom, right? The top is anxious too because they know, you know, I'm at the top of this hierarchy or I'm near the top of this hierarchy. I'm supposed to know things. And, you know, when you have a deep belief, In the hierarchy and in the roles that are represented in that hierarchy, then you have a kind of anxiety about the gaps that you know you have, but you believe them to be undiscussable.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Between the top and the bottom. Yes. On average, yes. And you'll still see enormous heterogeneity. You'll see teams that are very have very low psychological safety, maybe because they just have a tyrant or a bully as the leader.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I'm looking forward to the feedback after his podcast, by the way. Yeah, my husband gives it to me. He's probably sometimes my grown sons give it to me as well. One of the downsides of being more successful in any career, I suppose, but in an academic career is you become more insulated. People might, you know, my father used to say years ago, and I used to get good grades in school, and he would say, your teachers are just scared of you now, right? Thanks, Dad, right? No, no, I worked hard. He was essentially saying they're giving you an A because they just are scared of you. Like, no, no, no, not true. But honestly, it's a good question. And I think we all need it. None of us like it. But I think we're able to withstand it because of the greater joy of becoming more effective. At the things we care about.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“For one of two reasons either the person giving it hasn't really thought very carefully about it, they aren't really being data driven or concrete in their feedback, or they believe you don't want to hear it or nobody wants to hear it, so they just sort of give you some nice, yep, you did great. Oh, this is a small thing, but they barely mention it, right? So you go, wow, I'm great. You walk away. It wasn't very useful. I mean, it was nice. You had a nice conversation, but you didn't learn anything.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Crucial. And then feedback is probably the most important activity for learning. And psychological safety is the kind of climate in which learning can happen. And by the way, I'm more receptive to feedback when I'm... In a more psychologically safe work environment. But feedback is critical. And the challenge of feedback is none of us really like it. We all need it, but none of us like it. And in organizations, a lot of times it's not very high quality.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So then they learn oh, that wasn't so bad. I mean, part of the challenge with many young people is that they haven't had a failure experience. They've had nothing but good marks. They get a trophy for coming out for the sport rather than for being the winning team in the league. And there's this. When you have had less experience failing, you have more fear of failing. So we got to give them opportunities to fail in a safe way to then go, hey, that wasn't so bad. What's next?”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And how do you develop grit? I think you develop it through baby steps. I mean, you give whether younger people or anybody the opportunity to kind of have a stretch assignment, a stretch opportunity, maybe something doesn't go well. They experience a failure. And guess what? They don't die.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“We are, and if we want to truly be excellent, which I think we do, I mean, at least I do, we need to be learning oriented because yesterday's excellence is not tomorrow's excellence. We're sort of playing a game where the challenges just keep intensifying and the goalpost keeps moving. So the only way to achieve excellence is through learning and the only way to achieve learning is through speaking up and taking risks and trying new things. But I think you touched on this sort of fragileness or the brittleness of, we could say younger generations, or we could say many humans. And to me, that's the biggest challenge that we have to overcome. Because if we're brittle, we'll be tiptoeing. And if we're tiptoeing, we won't be doing great things.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Need Well, since you're new, I'm hoping you've got some new ideas that we haven't thought about. But guess what? You should do that too, right? You should say, hey, I think we've never done work like this before. I've never done work like this before. This is pretty interesting. And you should ask questions of your new colleagues because you don't know them yet very well. You need to learn about them. You need to sort of connect with them. And you should respond productively to people when they say things you disagree with. You should say like, wow, that's an interesting perspective. I'd like to learn more. So just take care. In other words, your job as an individual or as a CEO is to control the things you can control and not spend a whole heck of a lot of time worrying about the things you can't control.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“More about the quality of the work than about the self protection. I mean, I think we are naturally about self-protection unless we overcome that.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I think they can keep emphasizing both the importance and the nature of the work we do. So, this is the kind of work that depends on all of us to bring our A game. And by the way, our A game, we're not here as individuals running a race. We're here as team members coming up with new solutions every day to delight our customers, and that's a team sport. So we're emphasizing that the nature of the work is, it requires innovation, it requires problem solving, therefore, you know, it requires your brain, not just your... Being here And then probably importantly, both modeling at the top the kinds of learning-oriented behavior we need and then putting in place systems and structures and trainings and reminders that Just help us help people become more self aware, more other aware, more curious.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I think where most of us would aspire to be is to get ahead and make a difference. And I think if you want to be in that quadrant, you do have to listen to others. And you do have to. Kind of keep holding yourself honest. Like, what am I missing? It's like the difference between I'm sure I'm right and I don't need to listen to anyone to, all right, I kind of think I'm right, but What am I missing? Even selfishly. I ought to care about what am I missing?”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I don't think we too many people are buying into that mode anymore. But here's the sort of model I want to share. There's getting ahead, which is succeeding in your career, doing well in the world and in society's eyes. And then there's Making a difference. And we can fill out all four quadrants of that model. I mean, you can not get ahead, not make a difference, and that's sad, but frequent, right? And you can, you know, you can make a difference in the world but not get ahead. You could be a healthcare worker toiling away, you know, really having an impact on people's lives, but not in any way having sort of success. God bless them, right? And you can be someone who gets ahead and has tremendous success, but doesn't really make a positive difference in the world”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“There is a way to think about that, that Apple succeeded in spite of that, not because of that. So I like, you know, there's two counterfactuals that you can do. One is if you think you're Steve Jobs and you're always going to have the best answers and the best designs and the right everything and you want to boss people around and tell them to just do it your way and yell at them if they don't and you think that you can get away with that by all means go for it I'm skeptical right I think it's unlikely and then the other is you know what again what could you have done if you listened a little more in that in that setting but let me let's back up because there's this idea of and there's plenty of evidence of sort of not good people getting ahead yeah”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yes, yes. Very strict way of working. So called scientific management, right? Which worked when, again, when the project was to tame complexity and conquer production at scale. But in a sort of knowledge intensive work, that management style would not work. Now, we come to jobs, right? So Steve Jobs was sort of famously Unkind to different points of view, not known to be a great listener, and yet really one of the most successful companies in history.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Say if you're there. Not at all. Not at all. How come Well, different answers for different people, and probably with Ford and jobs they have in common that they're both geniuses. And I like to say, you know, and Ford, you know, Ford was a leader at a time when the name of the game was to sort of tame complexity, get people in line, not listen to them. Make them follow the formula that you and your Frederick Taylor buddy came up with and that was the way to get excellence at the donor.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I don't know. I mean, I think that's a tremendous point. I should. I've experienced all those things you just said, and I haven't studied it. But you're right, I haven't emphasized it. The only thing to keep in mind with humor is that I think it's a great leveler. I think it's a great energizer. And you have to be very aware that it's not humor that is mocking others. Self-deprecation is fine, in fact, powerful. And just sort of human condition humor is fine. But the kind of humor, and you often do see it in work environments that is inadvertently jeering at someone or at a group does exactly the opposite.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Transparency is important in part because of trust, right? It comes back to trust. When you are being transparent, you are more trustworthy. You've put it all out there. It conveys the reality, which you need others, right? Sort of here's what we're up against. I always think that the art, the leadership challenges, how to be transparent. About reality, which is sometimes grim, without making people despondent. And so you have to be transparent. Here we are. Here's this global pandemic. This is what we're up against while also conveying hope. And that's the creative part, I think, while also saying, I believe that if we work together, we can get through this for the following reasons.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Is a fact, not a choice, then you realize that your only choice is whether or not you admit it. And I think it's a sign of strength to admit it.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yes, you do. Exactly. But listen to what you just said. It's almost paradoxical that showing weakness is actually a sign of confidence. And I think intuitively we understand that. Like when someone, you know, there's a little part of our brain that worries, well, if I admit a mistake, then people will think I'm incompetent or less good at something. When in fact they go, wow, you know, she's confident enough to say, oh, I got that wrong. I got that wrong, right? So there's a confidence in being willing to say, I missed that. I didn't see that coming. Then there's also the reality that any leader is vulnerable. I mean, any individual is vulnerable to the actual uncertainty in our environment. In other words, anything can happen. A global pandemic can happen that I didn't see coming. And so if you, once you recognize that vulnerability...”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I need your help. I have some ideas and I will be listening. I will be all ears. So they're conveying the message that they know that they are dependent on the brilliant men and women working for them. And then they are overt in their quest to learn more. They ask good questions. They lead good team processes. They empower and enable others in the organization to ensure that there's the right kinds of training programs or structures or systems to kind of help people have great teams and create learning environments throughout. Because as a leader, depending on the size of the company, I don't get to interact with everybody directly anyway. But I can ensure that I can try to set a model whereby those who are interacting with others directly are showing up with a similar level of”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“The first job. Job one is that passion about who we are, whom we serve, and why it matters. Then the leader has to be very humble, right? So you're passionate and humble at the same time, humble about the fact that I'm passionate about where we're going. I don't know how to get there.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Start with passion I do too. I do too, but it's just, you know, it's not the first thing you think of when you think of psychological safety. And I'm saying more important, it's really important to create psychological safety, which another way to talk about that is a learning environment. Really important. But learning for what? Because learning is effortful. Speaking up is effortful, taking risk is effortful.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I'm going to say something I don't usually say, but you start with passion. You start with the passion about who the company serves. Why it matters So you're talking about the purpose, really, why it matters that we exist and why I personally am excited to be here and to be leading this organization so that we can do X, Y, and Z in the world.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“In organizations, sometimes it's not very easy for people to say, especially in hierarchies, this just isn't working for me because it doesn't seem very nice to say things like that. And so they've created processes and norms whereby you got to criticize the heck out of it. We get to do that behind closed doors so that by the time it gets out for primetime, it's ready to go.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I would say one of the more delightful companies where it works well is Pixar. Yeah. Which is in the innovation domain. It's in the innovation space every time their products are creative films that delight people of all ages and that are not just good storytelling, but beautiful computer graphics and storytelling and color and ideas and this company has really accomplished the remarkable feat of hit movie after hit movie after hit movie. So they've been persistently innovative. The only way this actually works is that they have trained themselves to be unafraid to criticize the evolving product. When the movie is just part way there, it's boring in parts. It's sappy in parts, right? It's not good enough yet.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, you become more creative not as an individual for sure. I would not say that, but you become more creative as a team. Because a team is creative when it's able to access the diverse expertise and ideas of its members. And all of us are smarter than any one of us kind of thing. And especially for innovation, where you might have an idea, it's kind of half-baked. But then it makes me think of something else and then someone else and then we're sort of tying these ideas together and it takes us somewhere new. So teams will be more creative when people are unencumbered. And they're not worried about, oh, how do I look? Is that going to be, are people going to like that idea? Are people going to reject me for saying that?”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Two big risk factors. One is that you will have preventable business failures, that you will launch products that a handful of people knew were not going to work, but they were afraid to speak up. Another is that you will fail to innovate. So they're related problems. But one relates to kind of visible, sometimes catastrophic business failures, bad decisions that got made that didn't need to get made. And the other is harder to see, but shows itself over time. Like we're just not innovating. We're not coming up with the new ideas and services and products that customers want. And slowly but surely, we become less relevant in the market.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So important because today nearly all of us do knowledge intensive work. We do work that requires problem solving and creativity and innovation and catching and correcting errors so that the quality of the work is not harmed. And that kind of work is dependent on our ability to notice things and to have ideas and to offer them.”
2022-09-28 · In Good Company with Nicolai Tangen · Psychological safety with Amy Edmondson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source