YouSaid · the spoken record

Arvind Jain

lines on the record: 66
first: 2026-07-11
most recent: 2026-07-11
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

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“For me, maybe not, but at the same time, you know, I'm a man with minimal needs and my needs were already met a long time back. So I guess I've definitely built these startups without that worry of can I feed my family. So yeah, maybe that has helped me. But as I've seen more success, it hasn't changed me fundamentally in terms of you have to have that drive. You have to work continuously, you have to work more than every other person in your company. Lead by example and keep pushing and you have to have this irrational need to make something big happen.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That's a good one. This is a tough job all around. And I think oftentimes people who have not done it, they feel that there's a lot of glamour. They feel that there's going to make a lot of money and their life will be fantastic. They're going to have a lot of respect. And I think almost all of those things are irrelevant. You have to be truly mission oriented to survive as a founder.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Startups have never been easy. Like, I think, in fact, I would say in the last 25 years that I've seen, I would say it's easier to build a startup and get a good exit from it these days than it used to be in the past. Start is a brutal game.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Actually, I do think that there is too much capital available today for startups. And it's actually sometimes creating failure paths for people. I think they're not getting what it takes to build a great company. I'll give you an example. Like a startup that has raised a seed round decides to pay half a million dollars to an engineer like you were saying before. And it's happening today. And the startup founder is okay with it. The investors are okay with it. Or it's just surely not a sustainable path to actually win. And they're paying it while Google is not. And Google knows that they don't need to actually buy talent like that. So I think that is one thing that I feel this overabundance of capital is getting startups to sort of create structures which are not going to be sustainable for them.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I don't know. I won't answer that question. I actually don't have the answer, really. I get to think about it. I think it's probably circumstantial depending on what I'm doing. Different people bring different strengths”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Are you willing to call Google a legacy company? So, Google probably rates higher than anybody else in terms of not only embracing AI internally, but also in their launching products. But there, I guess they are AI companies to put them in their category.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Those maybe, yes, but the US open source models, they are going to have a lot of tailwinds, and they have to. Like, you know, this is the known accepted issue that every technologist in Bay Area talks about. There's a lot of motivated parties that actually want to promote, like including Nvidia, for example, putting a lot of investment and promoting development of great open source models in the US.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And US needs to build its own, like, you know, US can't be seen as a country that doesn't innovate on technology. So it's actually paramount for the US to build open sourcing models.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I mean, I guess I just believe more in the US system, and I don't think right now, by the way, you need to curb open source. Like, you know, it's too far behind in the US.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“The fact that you can actually run inferencing on those in that contained environment makes people feel comfortable. But I don't think that's as US. US won't feel, absolutely won't feel okay with, you know.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“You're right that we don't have open models, but it's not because open source as a movement, as a concept is weak in the US, is actually quite strong. If you think about models, there required a lot of upfront investment, which is not open source friendly in many ways. A lot of open source software has been skunkworks, developers is getting no funding associated with them, and they still get something built. They couldn't build models that way. And so that's why naturally this thing didn't work out. And you need these techniques where super high investment is not needed.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, yeah, yeah, but like, you know, even before that, I think it just hasn't happened, right? Like, you know, the only country in the world that has produced models outside of US is China. And then, of course, maybe a little bit France with Mr.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So I think the desire for sovereign models is strong. And it was actually, I would say it was probably stronger a year back compared to now. At least I feel like I'm hearing less of it to some day. There was a period where every nation thought that they could build one when AI was still in its early stages. But then a lot of those nations actually figured out that that's not going to be the way. And so they're okay with letting their enterprises within their own countries use OpenAI or Anthropic or all the other models. So I'm not an expert. I don't know whether this trend is on the rise or sort of like on the fall a little bit.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“A lot of analyst roles, the data analyst roles, which are not business thinkers, they were given a task that, hey, like I need to see this data and then they produced, like they sort of go and build those specific dashboards, configure backend systems. I think that kind of work definitely goes away. I think business intelligence is just going to be very different. Business owners will directly be able to get answers to their questions. So business analysts, data analysts, that's sort of one many HR roles. sources for example source like in recruiting that's a role that i think is going to definitely get consumed you know into like a full cycle recruiting role”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Is yes. But as I said, you have to do 10 times the work to get the same amount of revenue from your customers in the future. You have a much smaller team to deliver the same amount of work that you used to deliver before. You just are forced to do more.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“The composite rolls will be very common. So, like, as for example, somebody who can build a product, I don't know what to call them, but they act like engineers, product managers, designers. Similarly, in go-to-market, somebody who can sell the product and they are capable of not only doing the business negotiations, but they can actually demo the product, they can actually talk about use cases. And instead of having that segregation between account executives and solution engineers and then post-sales solution architects, I think we're going to see more and more generalization of roles, like away from specialization. And in fact, I was trying to drive that very, very hard even in our company.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Are absolutely in a land grab, like you know, no question, every single company in the world wants a product like ours today. Either we get in today or it's going to be 10 times harder to actually get in the future.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Personally, like my style has been a little bit too disciplined to be the right strategy anymore. I get that feedback from my team that, you know, we are trying to become subservative, we're trying to make sure that our capital goes a long way. And in that sort of mindset, we may lose the land grab. I'm sort of feeling the pressure to change it myself, like just change how I think about how we should be spending, how we should be investing. But at the same time, this fundamental belief that a business is always built on discipline. Like you have to charge for the product. It has to generate value for the customers for every dollar that you invest in marketing. There has to be some good return back from it. You cannot assume that you just keep raising the money to make up for all those things that were not there.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“We thought about it more was that there was a statement to be made to the prospective employees more than anything else. If we wanted to make the market understand that we're building something special and that kind of gives us that validation.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So, first, actually, we never actually went out to raise, except for our first round of the company. We always had somebody come in. It was a relationship that got built over some time and kind of became the de facto like, you know, that they are going to be the ones putting money.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Because I think companies have been growing, their head count. If you look at the big, the largest employers of tech talent, many of them actually haven't been growing. Many of them have been laying off continuously. I think about Meta, for example, right? Like every year, there's significant layoffs. I don't know if the overall headcount, my guess is that it's probably down from the peak of like 2021 or 2022, right? So actually there was more talent available in the market as such than before. But if you now start to talk about, okay, AI talent, ML talent, top people are sought after way more than ever before. And also the pay scales have completely changed and not just from the model companies, but even from startups because startups are also like, you know, you are giving them too much money to compete for talent. So like even startups actually these days pay a lot.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I would actually say maybe last two or three months. Let's put that aside for a minute. I would say that routing was actually getting easier for compared to the SaaS peak time.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That's actually a really good idea. I've thought about doing that. We never did the token maxing dashboards, and I always thought that was not the right idea to just sort of reward people who are consuming more tokens. I felt like we didn't need to do that. We are a native AI company ourselves, and people are already kind of educated enough, and they will use AI when they need to. But executives like sharing a success story, we haven't sort of demanded it from every single exec every single week, but we have the showcase, like in our town hall, for example, will always ask people to share those wins. Like every town hall, like, you know, there's a section dedicated to these are the new AI agents that teams are using to work differently.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Is a power law like you know in our company and also at all of our customers, you will see some people who spend $10,000 or $15,000 in tokens every month and then you have others who are spending $20. One thing is interesting though that everybody has embraced AI to some degree. Like everybody is using the basic as I mentioned before the number one application of our use case for AI today in the world is information seeking question answering and everybody's doing that like everybody on the team in our team as well as our customers they're all doing that everybody's asking questions everybody's getting some basic summarization information synthesis going but the advanced advanced use cases are limited to like 5% of the employee base.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I think we did probably what most companies did, which is we didn't do anything. I think like, you know, because we were in this phase off, let people figure out what they can do with this”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Think per person productivity is going to shoot up, but so will the demands. To make the same amount of revenue, you have to produce a 10x better product in the future, unfortunately.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I think good technologies figure out how to make technology really, really cheap, and it's going to happen here too. That's my belief. You're going to see inferencing costs come down by orders of magnitude. I think we saw something bizarre, actually. In the last six to nine months, every model actually increased their per token price. And if you go back 15 months, everybody thought that the per token price is going to just keep falling like it was before. So we don't know what happened here. This is also sort of unique.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I mean, I think the point that I'm making is the 3.8% number actually doesn't seem high at all when you look at it that way. But I also know that already receive with open source that you can do the same work for a tenth of a cost. That's number one. Number two, like historically, for as far as I can remember, we've not put technology cost and labor cost in the same sort of sentence ever before. This is the first time we're actually hearing that, that, hey, I would rather have fewer humans and more tokens. The first time, this is not how technology works. Like the morals are supposed to get cheaper and cheaper. The tech is going to be more and more affordable.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I would say it's absurdly expensive. I'll give an example. We had this cool triage agent for engineering, and we have 15 people team on-call team. Their work was to actually triage every single production issue that happens, like any system alerts, things that are going bad. And we built this agent that actually now is taking care of like 95% of those issues automatically for them. But even there is actually doing it at a cost, which is actually questionable. Like, you know, is it actually more efficient than humans? We were spending a million dollars a month on that particular agent, and that was actually more than the cost of”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I'm not sure about that either because I think technology is actually not supposed to increase in cost. First of all, I think, do you admit that the currently this technology is priced in absurdly for what it delivers?”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Product going out. Well, look, even in the, we have these AI discussions right now. But before that, just post COVID, like many companies felt they were bloated. They cut down 15%, 20% of their staff. And every CEO came out and said that actually, as a result of that, they're actually moving 20% faster. So a lot of companies came and talked about that. So that's the argument that's always there. At some point, teams get large, they start to slow each other down. Humans do that. I also believe in that. But ultimately, people are also your asset. And you have to be able to deploy them correctly in the right set of projects. I don't think the world's greatest companies are going to be companies with 100 people. And look at the model companies, you know, like same, same for them. Like, why are they hiring so aggressively?”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I absolutely don't believe in it. I mean, I think first thing logically, take two companies take Coca-Cola and Pepsi, or two companies that compete with each other. One company decides to shrink and the other one still has a lot more people. Both of them have full access to the same AI tools and technology. And so now the question is, if you were trying to do the same amount of work and you believe you can do it with fewer people and therefore you shrink, your competition can also do the same, but they chose actually not to do the same amount of work. They chose to actually elevate and build a 10x better product or build 10 times more, produce 10 times more goods because they have more people, they're going to be larger, they're going to beat you.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“But I'm not But I mean, look, it's not about you not being cost constrained. It's about you have to be competitive in your work with others. Remember, they also have all the AI tools that you have, but if they also have a human on top, how are you going to compete with them?”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Not sure, and I'll tell you why. You want to be performing the best in whatever you do. And I don't think you're going to take a 90% solution.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And that's the thing. It can actually take care of a lot of things for any given role, but it cannot replace the final intangible.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It's a wrong goal, in my opinion, to say that replace yourself with AI. First of all, I think giving too much credit to AI when you say that. It's just not ready right now. You give me a name of one job that you can replace with AI. For example, do you think it can replace your EA?”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“About is to make AI really perform and deliver, you have to sort of invest around it. You have to make sure that you provided the right context so that it can actually work faster at a lower cost.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“First thing that we have to do is make sure that you are able to bring the right context to these AI agents. If you think about most enterprises today, the way they're rolling out AI is that they actually just throw it into the system and connect AI with all of enterprise systems in a rudimentary manner using MCP servers. And now you're letting any piece of work that you are trying to do with AI. You're letting the models sort of brute force their way into trying to figure out and assemble the right raw materials that they need to complete the task and then do it. And in this sort of, in this mode, AI is super slow. It takes a lot of time to actually just assemble the basic information it needs to do the work. It also becomes very, very costly because most of the tokens are being burned just trying to assemble the right context for that given task. And you're trying to sort of use AI for things where it's not even good at or needed. So instead, like what we talked about.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, only thing is that it's not that perfect right now. I think right now we're willing to pay the cost of reviewing the code. So we're still faster than before because the writing part is actually much faster now. And the person who writes is the one who actually does the first review.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, it's true. But I think what it's doing right now is we're still in the learning phase of using AI effectively thinking about long-term ramifications of it. Because when you write code, for example, with AI, you can write a million lines of code, but it becomes incredibly hard to actually maintain it and understand it and manage it over time.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Now is probably about almost 100. Nobody's actually writing the initial code by hand anymore. Yeah, so almost all the code is being written with AI, but we actually enforce human reviews. So you cannot actually generate tons of AI code and then just check it in the repos. We're probably more conservative than most other companies. There was in fact a discussion inside the company that, well, like, you know, now AI can write so much code and the real bottleneck has shifted from the person who writes the code to person who has a review. And so there was a proposal to actually eliminate code reviews. And many companies are doing that. Let AI write the code and directly get submitted into the repos.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I would say it's hard to actually measure. That's the challenge because engineering productivity is one of the most difficult things to measure. It's the fuzziest of the jobs out there. If you look at some of the metrics like lines of code written, of course, we're writing way more lines of code now. But if you look at, are we shipping features at a greater pace? Yes, we are, but it's a result also of a larger team. We have a team that is more tenured than it was before.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It by hand anymore. In some ways, you can say that yes, like AI made a big impact, but are they shipping the products faster or not? And that's where we hear most of the companies saying that no, that the actual shipping speed of products has not increased even though coding speed increased significantly. Because I know that's only a small part of overall shipping a product.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I would say that there is pockets of value realization today. For example, take customer support as a vertical. I think there it was easy to measure productivity. You could actually say that in your company is support agent resolves 10 cases a day and now they're able to do 12 because of AI. So you could see that a very concrete measure of productivity increase. And that's it. That's the use case where AI is actually pretty good because a lot of that time that is spent by the support teams is about reading knowledge and then summarizing it to your customers. So there are definitely areas where there is clear value realization and enterprises are feeling good. Some other ones are more complex. Like for example, I think the majority of the AI spend right now is on coding. And you know that the coding as a practice has changed like most developers now actually use AI to write code.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Question. I think it's early to tell that, but Microsoft is formidable. So if we look at our experience with SVGO and Prospect, I think we hear this answer more often that, well, like, you know, we are a Microsoft customer and we already have, we're getting co-pilot. And so therefore, it doesn't make sense for them to consider us. Like, we do hear that, and we hear that more often, then we don't hear from somebody that, oh, like, you know, I've embraced one of the lab products and therefore there's nothing else that I'm going to do.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Is true, but I think I would say that if you go and talk to companies that have been on the other side of the Microsoft onslot, most of them will talk about pricing as the main killer because I think it's hard to compete with free.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“For us, they are one of our most significant competitors, and the bundling strategy actually works. You to fight, you know, against that. I mean, there's luckily there's always been room for best of breed software and people and all customers think of us exactly like that. If you are trying to actually bring a great search product, if you're trying to build a horizontal, comprehensive AI platform, they know that we do it better. So companies are willing to invest on top of that as part of the bundled product suite from Microsoft. But the other thing is actually is maybe making bundling not as effective of a strategy anymore is the fact that AI is moving towards consumption-based models. So once you move towards consumption, there's no inherent bundling advantage because, and as a business, I can get six tools. And I let the users choose where they want to do their work, wherever they do their work. I have to pay for it for that particular unit of work. So consumption can ultimately break that bundling strategy.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, we've been telling customers, I believe that majority of enterprise workloads will actually be on open source models in three years, for sure. Yeah.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, well, I mean, if you think about, first of all, these two labs are very fundamentally different businesses, OpenAI, of course, has amazing consumer product and anthropic. Actually, the interesting thing that is happening is people are actually building on top of their platform. And so when you think about entropic, right now, there are a lot of folks who are actually developing automations and skills and everybody's sort of creating these MCP servers to their internal systems, getting connected all to cloud. So there's an ecosystem actually that's being developed. So they very much, you should consider them an application level company, not just a model company.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I do feel like the model business on its own, regardless of forget open source for a minute, there is plenty of competition even within the labs and more and more companies are coming into that space. So, you know, in that fierce competition, even in a three-way race, I think you can actually get a good amount of pricing, pressure. And now, of course, with open source, it actually is an order of magnitude, cheaper prices. So I actually heard rumors that OpenAI was going to drastically reduce their model prices in response to these developments, like competition and open source. The model business on its own is actually probably not as lucrative as everybody believes. But these companies now have a lot more things. It's not just, they're no longer model companies only.”
2026-07-11 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: Why OpenAI and Anthropic Won't Win the App Layer | Why Teams Will Get Bigger Not Smaller in a World of AI | Why AI Removes Incumbents Advantage of Bundling | China vs America: Who Wins the AI War with Arvind Jain, Co-Founder @ Glean · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source