YouSaid · the spoken record

Debbie Millman

lines on the record
114
first
2024-06-27
most recent
2024-06-27
sittings or episodes
1
sources
podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

  1. “W-A-R-E. And from there, some of my favorite episodes over the last year, aside from my episode with you, which I cherish, my episodes with Amanda Palmer, my episode with Alain de Beautain, my episode with Krista Tippett, Nico Mooley, the great composer. Those are all episodes in the last year that I'm most proud of.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  2. “Would suggest that they start with Chris Ware. He is an extraordinary graphic novelist. It's one of the most favorite episodes that I've ever conducted.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  3. “Well said. And I thought that was very Sure, absolutely. I'm Debbie Milman on Twitter and Instagram. You can see more about my program at the School of Visual Arts at SVA.edu and DebbieNolt.com where you can listen to all my podcasts and see my visual essays and my books and so on and so forth.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  4. “Highly overrated, and that most confident people or overly confident people tend to be kind of annoying. And she said, what she felt was more important than confidence was courage. And I fully, fully agree. Taking that first step, confidence really only comes from repeated attempts at doing something successfully. But in order to take that first step, you need courage. And that's much more important than confidence over anybody that's waiting for the confidence to show up, take the first step in a moment of courage, even if it's aberrant courage to come full circle in this conversation.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  5. “I also think that if you're waiting for something to feel right before you do it, if you're waiting for a sense of security or confidence that those things are sort of like being on a hedonistic treadmill. If you think you need enough of this before you do that, when you achieve whatever that is you think you need, you're going to then up the ante and you're never ever going to be satisfied with whatever it is you think you need before you do something if it's not something that is real. If you think, oh, I need this much money before I do this when you get that much money, then you're going to realize, oh, I actually think I need this much more and it's just going to be this carrot in front of you that you're agonizing over trying to reach. And then the other thing is I'm going to quote Danny Shapiro here, the great writer Danny Shapiro. If you're waiting for confidence and she, I asked her once about confidence and she said that confidence is highly”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  6. “Something up, we will just have less. What ends up happening is that we don't think about all the possibilities of things that could come up if we give ourselves openings to receive them. And so now, as opposed to having less than what I thought, I have way more because I have all these new things that I'm doing that I never would have thought possible. Second, that hard decisions are only hard when you're in the process of making them. Once you make them, they're not hard anymore. Then it's just life and freedom. And it's an extraordinary experience that I really would like to share with your listeners, with our listeners.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  7. “But I turned it down. I turned the CEO job down. And then two things happened. First of all, one of the things that I realized was that I was in this trapeze. And rather than just let go of the trapeze and do something else, I had every single crook of my body holding on to some other trapeze. And that there was this sense of if I am not doing enough, I am not worthy, if I'm not making enough, I am not worthy. If I'm not producing enough, I am not worthy. And suddenly I had to not just let go of the trapeze, but let go of the entire apparatus. And I have realized now two things. One, most people live in a world of scarcity. We think that all we have now is all we were of or have. And if we give.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  8. “Of or do I say no? Actually, I am not going to double down. I'm going to live the way in which I have been saying I wanted to with more freedom and more opportunity to do personal projects and pro bono projects and give back. And I had to decide. And it took me four months to decide Simon Williams finally said to me, Debbie, anything that takes you four months to decide probably means you don't want to do it. And it was the hardest decision of my life”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  9. “I became terrified. I became terrified that if I made this change, that I would not have financial stability anymore, that I would not be able to fulfill all of the dreams that I had and would have to confront that. And so five years turned into six years and six years turned into seven years. And just at a point where I was starting to think about really doing it, sort of like El Pacino and Godfather 3, I was offered an opportunity to take over as CEO of the company. Simon Williams, the then CEO, was looking to become chairman and needed to appoint a new CEO. And he came to me and asked me if I wanted the job. And here it was. This is the big decision of a life. Do I become the CEO and have this amazing continuation of money and career and security and everything else that is conventionally approved?”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  10. “And then leave and transition to working at SVA and doing all of the personal projects that I had been talking for so long about doing. So the five years happened and we had a really wonderful, successful earnout. So there was no excuse him for me to continue on this same path. And it was time to make that change. And the last thing I wanted was to end up like the characters and revolutionary road that remarkable book where people talk about making.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  11. “And had been very lucky to be able to sell the company that I was a part of and ultimately a partner in after about 13 years of working there. So in 2008, the two partners that I had, the man that originally hired me, Simon Williams and then Austin McGee, who is the third partner to come in after me, we sold our company to Omnicom. And at the time I had been offered this opportunity with Steve Heller to start the master's in branding program at the School of Visual Arts and organized my time so that my day job at Sterling Brands wouldn't be impacted by what I was going to be doing at SVA, which was made possible by starting my branding program as an evening program. So I had two full-time jobs a day job at Stirling and my night job at SVA. And most people thought that I would go through my earnout at Stirling.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  12. “I recently went through a pretty major transition in my life. It was something that I had to make a pretty big decision about. And it was a somewhat prolonged, agonizing decision so much so that my friends and loved ones were no longer listening to my sort of machinations and making the decision because I thought I never was going to actually make the decision. And so I can share that because I do think on the other side of that decision now is an important realization that I think can help people. I was working, I've had a full-time job since I graduated college. And for the last 22 years, I was working at a branding consultancy, as I mentioned, called Sterling Brands.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  13. “Yeah, clearly. I think that the more care you put into it, the likely, the more success you'll have coming out of it. Mine was, I wrote it in a journal that I was keeping at the time, so it was about five by seven, and it was probably about 10 handwritten, big handwriting, big handwriting, 10 big handwriting pages. And it was the whole day. And then because I was really excited about it and because I love lists, I made a list of everything that I wanted to come true.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  14. “Summer two pages, some are 20 pages. I think the longer it is, the more likely it is to be affirmed for some reason. I find the more carry put into it. The more care and detail you put in”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  15. “And the idea that at that same time in my life, that intersection on Bleaker Street and 6th Avenue peering deep into my future and not knowing that anything was possible for me, to give somebody at that same stage in their life or any stage really, but particularly at that vulnerable stage when you are so worried about what you can or can't become, to give somebody that sliver of a dream, of a hope that this could happen and have them declare what they want, I think is a remarkable exercise. That's why I call it your 10-year plan for a remarkable life.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  16. “I'm not asking for some hypothet It is astounding, and I do this now with all of my students, and I can't begin to tell you how many letters I get from students from 10 years ago that are like, Debbie, it all came true. How did this happen? And I am so thrilled that these things can make a difference. And this goes back to the earlier part of our conversation about my own fears about what I could or would or should become.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  17. “Your teeth, have your coffee or tea all the way through till when you tuck yourself in at night. What is that day like for you? Dream big. Dream without any fear. Write it all down. You don't have to share it with anyone other than yourself Your whole heart into it. And right? Like there's no tomorrow, right? Like your life depends on it because it does. And then read it once a year. See what happens. It's magic. It's magic. I need to do that.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  18. “No, so it's all our bad So let's say it is winter 2027. What does your life look like? What are you doing? Where are you living? Who are you living with? Do you have pets? What kind of house are you in? Is it an apartment? Are you in the city? Are you in the country? What does your furniture look like? What is your bed like? What are your sheets like? What kind of clothes do you wear? What kind of hair do you have? Tell me about your pets. Tell me about your significant other. Do you have children? Do you have a car? Do you have a boat? Do you have, talk about your career? What do you want? What are you reading? What are you making? What excites you? What is your health like? And right this day, this one day, 10 years from now. So one day in the winter of 2027, what does your whole day look like? Start from the minute you wake up, brush.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  19. “They are so full of hope and optimism and well-being and goodness that it gives me a sense that Humanity can be saved. And so I've borrowed that exercise from Milton and now used that both in my graduate program and the undergraduate classes that I teach.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  20. “Has just been, he has this sort of generosity that is all about here. Take this, do that, make this happen. This is for you. With no strings, no ties, no obligations. It's just pure generosity. And he has done that over and over and over and over again for me since meeting him back in 2004. The exercise that I do now with my students, because they're quite a bit younger than I was when I was doing this five-year essay or five-year plan, I asked them to do a 10-year plan. And so this gives them a chance to really mature into who they are in their 20s and into their early 30s. And it's this 10-year plan for what I call a remarkable life. And it's about imagining what your life could be if you could do anything you wanted without any fear of failure. And they are the most life affirming essays.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  21. “Absolutely. I mean, Steve is one of the most generous and engaging people I have had the privilege of knowing. And I often tease Steve and say that he's my fairy godfather because he's the only person in my life, or maybe one of two people in my life now that I could say.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  22. “Well, I teach undergrad and graduate classes at the School of Visual Arts. I run a master's in branding program at the School of Visual Arts, which I was given this opportunity via Steve Heller, who I again would not have met had that whole speak-up experience not happen. So yet another thing, every single thing that I'm doing now in my life, Tim, stems from that experience.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  23. “Succeed. I wrote an essay in July of 2005. It was supposed to be a five-year plan. And he asked us to dream big and not to edit and said that it had a bit of a magical quality that he experienced with his students over and over. So to be careful what we wished for. And I created this essay with these long-ranging, far-fetched goals that I can tell you now, 12 years later, have Almost all come true. It is spooky, spooky. And so that's an exercise I do now with my students. Milton has had one of the most profound impacts on my life, aside from the profound impact he's had on the world. I feel really, really lucky that I have been a student of his and have gotten to interview him now numerous times and feel that my relationship with him is certainly one of the luckiest things that's ever happened to me.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  24. “But it was over the phone. And while I cherished that interview, it was one of my very, very early interviews. So I'm somewhat gunshy to send people to listen to that one because it's so early in my journey as a podcaster. But in any case, I took this class with him. And that class, you know, it's interesting about how we started the show talking about my eight-year-old drawing and you talking about your friend who had written this essay that then predicted his life. Milton taught this summer intensive, I think, for about 40 or 50 years. And he used to say that it was one of the most important things that he did. He's not teaching it anymore. He had us do an exercise in that class where we had to envision the life that we could have if we pursued everything that we wanted with the certainty that whatever it is that we wanted, we would.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  25. “Milton Glazer is the elder statesman of the design world and is the world's certainly one of, if not the greatest living graphic designer. He's in his 80s. He is responsible for the iHeart New York logo. He did that iconic Bob Dylan poster of Bob Dylan in profile with the streams of colorful hair. He is one of the founders of New York magazine. The list goes on and on. He's had more impact and created some of the most memorable, well-known and iconic brands and identities in the world. My relationship with Milton really began when I took a class of his at the School of Visual Arts as summer intensive in the summer of 2005. I had already interviewed him for Design Matters.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  26. “Those were my early shows, but I had no idea what I was doing. There was no podcast when I started. I started to upload my show to iTunes just for the kick of it, just to be able to share it. And now 12 years later, three weeks I'm going to have my 12th anniversary of Design Matters. We won a Cooper Hewitt National Design Award in 2009. Transitioned the show from a show about why design matters to a show about how creative people design their lives and the trajectory that people take. Even from this conversation, you can probably tell how Interested I am in how people make their lives, the choices that they make and how they live. What they dream about and what they become. And so that's the direction that the show has taken. I'm about to approach my 300th episode.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  27. “I was doing my show with two handsets. You ever have a conversation with two people on the same phone line in your house and you're on different handsets in different parts of the house and the echo and all of that?”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  28. “But I was really excited about this, and at that time, you know, everything I was doing was very commercially driven and felt that this would be a way for me to talk about graphic design and engage with people in a way that had no commercial value whatsoever and was just all about how to satisfy sort of our souls, our creative souls. And that's how Design Matters was born. My podcast was born on this sort of Wayne's World-esque internet radio network called Voice America. I did the show for four years on Voice America, paid them for four years to do it, and then brought the show to design observer, Bill Drentel, the late, great Bill Drentell, the founder of Design Observer, invited me to bring the show over to Design Observer in 2009 with the proviso that I improved my sound quality.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  29. “And that's just the start of it, Tim. If it weren't for speak up and that story, I was then contacted by a fledgling internet radio network called Voice America in 2004, shortly after a piece that Mark Kingsley and I wrote about election graphics that kind of went viral. And they wanted me to host a show about branding. was worried that if I said no, I'd never get another opportunity again and asked if I could sort of do it about branding, but maybe do it more about design and pitch this idea to them about design matters, radio network show. They said yes, just when I was beginning to think, ooh, I might get rich from this. They told me that I needed to pay them for the airtime.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  30. “I agree. I write my first piece for print magazine that year, and I've written for every single issue since. 13 years later, two years ago, I was appointed the editorial and creative director of Print Magazine.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  31. “I went away a little bit discouraged, but still happy that I had met him and he told me that I'd get a book just to be patient. Four months later, a publisher calls at the recommendation of Stephen Heller with a book that he had turned down. They had wanted him to write with the horrific title, How to Think Like a Grade Graphic Designer. Once again, I think if I don't say yes to this, I'm never going to be asked for anything again and I take on this book. But I ask them if I could do it in a different way because I didn't believe that there was just one way for a great graphic designer to think. There were myriad ways. And could I interview great graphic designers and reveal how they think? They agreed. And that became my first book. In the meantime, Joyce, writer K, the editor of Print magazine, reaches out and asks me if I'd like to write a review about Wally Olin's then upcoming book on branding.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  32. “And there are three of us I come in second, which is not terrible. I don't win, but I don't lose. And another aberrant moment of courage, I ask Steve because he was nice to me that day if he'd want to have lunch in New York City when we were back. He lived in New York City as well. He agrees. We go to lunch. I was so intimidated. I had a cheat sheet that I'd prepared of topics in which I could discuss with Steve. I wrote it on a paper napkin, put it in my lap. and I could refer to it if I choked and knew not what to say next. In any case, I had some book ideas. Steve told me they were both bad.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  33. “Yeah. And I'm afraid to say no. I feel like if I say no, I'm never going to be offered an opportunity to do anything with Joyce again. So I say yes and I'm further humiliated when I get to San Diego when I realize that I have to wear a chef's outfit on stage. There are pictures of this, by the way. I'm not lying or exaggerating. So I go through with this, I am on stage with the MC Steve Heller, who I had never met Steve Heller is one of the world's foremost design critics. He was the art director of the New York Times book review for 30 years. He started numerous programs at School of Visual Arts, graduate programs, and he's written about 170 books about design and graphic designers. He is the judge. I am terribly intimidated because he is Steve Heller, one of the greatest people that has ever lived.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  34. “It is called It is called print magazine. It's the oldest graphic design magazine in the country. It's 75 years old. It has won, I think, five magazine awards, which is the highest honor, and Effie, I believe it's called, that a magazine can win. And it's a remarkable magazine. And I had the stream someday writing something for it.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  35. “I invite her to the party. She comes and we start a correspondence. I harbored this hope that maybe I could write for print magazine one day. And a couple of months later, she writes me and asks me if I want to participate in something she's putting together for the upcoming How conference the next year in San Diego. And at the time, reality TV had just sort of burgeoned into culture and There was a very popular TV show called Iron Chef about cooking in real time and the audience voting and she wanted to do a riff on that called Ironic Chef where three designers would create work on stage in real time and the audience would vote. This to me sounded like the definition of hell.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  36. “You know, I don't know why I didn't think that I would see people that I knew on this flight. Well, in any case, so I started talking to this woman next to me, and turns out she's going to the conference as well. I ask her what she does. She says she's a writer, a print magazine. I tell her about Speak Up. She's all interested in what we're doing. She gives me, I tell her that we're having this get-together, this party over the course of the conference. I'd like to invite her. She gives me a card. Without looking at it, I put it into my bag. We talk through a couple hours and then we go off into our own thing with whatever else we were doing on the flight. When I get to my room in Vancouver, I take her card out of my bag and I see that she's the editor-in-chief, choice writer K.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  37. “Right, because brochures changed the world, you know that, and I'm sitting next to people that are also, there was at that time one direct flight from New York to Vancouver. The flight is filled with design luminaries, Michael Beirut and Paul. Elegant and I'm wearing sweatpants and carrying a bag of McDonald's breakfast, you know, and the only people that like the way McDonald's breakfasts smell are the people eating it, not the people smelling it.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  38. “So, sort of similar to that Robert Edelstein's story back when I was in college, where he rejected me or what I thought was a rejection of me, then ultimately became one of my lifelong friendships. And now Armin and Bryany are also family at this point, family.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  39. “That had previously vilified me not only accepted me, but over the years, Armin and his wife Briany and I become such good friends that I am now the godmother to their eldest daughter.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  40. “Together called Stop Being Sheep, which was a riff on the great typographer Eric Speakerman's book, Stop Stealing Sheep, which is about letter spacing. Know thin slicing here to the very best of our ability. And so we went with this little brochure en route to the conference.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  41. “Exactly. Exactly. So, what happened after that was it was really surreal. And this is why I say that what felt like at the time in May of 2003 to be the lowest point of my professional career actually became the catalyst upon which everything else has been built. And so I started writing for Speak Up and all of a sudden I started to have that sense of what I had been originally searching for in my efforts with speak up. I felt like I was part of something bigger than myself. I felt like I was part of this sort of renegade group of misfits that were trying to change the world through graphic design criticism and online conversations. We all decided that year in the fall of 2003 that we were going to go as a group of sort of guerrilla speak up writers to the upcoming AIGA annual conference in Vancouver and we were going to give out this little brochure that Armin had put.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  42. “Well, what was so interesting about the experience, Kim, was that what the speak uppers were calling the precious design world, the AIGA world, they had already rejected me. And now the renegades, the anti-AIGA contingent, they were rejecting me. So at that moment, I actually felt like the most hated woman in graphic design”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  43. “So he apologized for the bullying and for the unprofessional way in which the conversation ensued as opposed to he made it very clear that he still thought my work was a pair of turds, but he didn't feel that it was right the way that I had been spoken to. And I took a lot of care in responding to him. I accepted his apology. But at the time, I was really fascinated by this whole blogging thing. It was really interesting to me, this sort of real-time communication, holding people accountable. And I wrote him this sort of diatribe about it. And he responded and said, well, would you like to write for the site? And I was like, whoa, didn't expect that one. So I said, yes. And I started writing for Speak Up.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  44. “Well said. But I'd still, you know, I'd go home and look, but whatever. A couple of weeks later. The founder of Speak Up, a young man about 23 years old named Armin Witt reached out to me. He wrote me an email and he apologized. He didn't apologize for calling my work a pair of turds, which is what he did.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  45. “Very subtle. At that point, Tim, I was obsessed. I was going to this site 15, 20 times a day, constantly refreshing, seeing what they were writing about me, and finally gave up and went to my IT person and said, put parental controls on my computer at work. I don't want to be able to see this site. And he did.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  46. “Compromise in viewpoints, but to my chagrin, the writers at Speak Up kept writing about me. And the next article was called, Is the Dark Side Prevailing?”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  47. “Was the original writer of this open letter Felix Sockwell, the illustrator designer. And then I thought it was over. I thought it had ended with some sort of a”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  48. “Landor is one of the world's biggest and most respected brand consultancies. Started by Walter Landor about 80 or 90 years ago. And he wrote in, you know, let's see what Felix could do with that Burger King logo and great work over there at Sterling. And that was sort of the end of that conversation. Nobody else came in with another comment. And what I thought was over really wasn't because Felix.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  49. “Quoting the book. So, yeah, I came in, and that's what I said. But I ended up having the best possible back and forth I could muster. I tried to talk about how we had constructed the Burger King logo and the amount of testing we had done around the world and how consumers really seemed to like it and who were they to sort of declare that it wasn't worthy. I tried to be as opened and as defenseless as possible. And ultimately they continued to pile on some more insults and made fun of the practice that I had. And then a couple of people weighed in otherwise. And the final comment was from a man named David Weinberg, who I've since become friends with as well, who at the time worked at Landor and wrote in Landor.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  50. “I wrote, What a cool discussion! I I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. You know, the book Cool Girl had not come out at that time, but had it been out, I would have said, that's what I was trying to be. I was trying to be the cool girl. Nothing matters. I can eat five chili dogs and I don't gain weight, you know.”

    2024-06-27 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #750: Neil Gaiman and Debbie Millman · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT