YouSaid · the spoken record

Dennis Whyte

lines on the record: 244
first: 2023-01-21
most recent: 2023-01-21
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Because of the low density. So if you take water is at about 100 million to a billion times more dense than this. So even though it's at much lower temperature, it's actually still, it has more energy content. So for this reason, one of the ways that I explain this is that if you imagine a power plant that's powering Cambridge, Massachusetts, if you were to, you wouldn't do this directly, but if you went like this on it, it actually extinguishes the fusion. Because it gets too cold immediately. Yeah. So that's the other one. And the other part is that it does not because it works by staying hot rather than a chain reaction. It can't run out of control. That's the other part of it. So by the way, this is what very much distinguishes it from fission. It's not a process that can run away from you because it's basically thermally stable.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Per unit volume than that. So this is very interesting because it's extraordinarily hot, 100 million degrees, but it's very tenuous. And what matters from the engineering and safety point of view is the amount of energy which is stored per unit volume because this tells you about the scenarios and that's what you worry about because when those kinds of energies are released suddenly, it's like what would be the consequences, right? So the consequences of this are essentially zero because that's less energy content than boiling water.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Number of atoms per cubic meter, right? So it's actually turns out to be 10 to the 25th. So this is one with 25 zeros behind it per cubic meter. So we can figure out cubic meters about like this. The volume of this table, like the whole volume of stable. Okay, very good. So fusion, or a few of those. So fusion, like the mainstream one of fusion, like what we're working on at MIT will have a hundred thousand times less particles”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Even concluding the walls of the containment, or even air or anything like this. So it's that part that makes it safe. And there's actually another aspect to it. But that fundamental part makes it so safe. And the main lines approach diffusion is also that it's very hot, but there's very, very few particles at any time in the thing that we do the power plant that actually is more correct way to do it is you say there's very few particles per unit volume. So in a cubic centimeter, in a cubic meter or something like that. So we can do this. So right now we're, although we don't think of air really as, there's atoms floating around us and there's a density because if I wave my hand, I can feel the air pushing against my face. That means we're in a fluid or a gas, which is around us. That has a particular number.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, yeah. So, this is also the counterintuitive thing. So I told you temperatures which like 50 million degrees, or it actually tends to be more like about 100 million degrees is really what we aim for. So how can 100 million degrees be safe? And it's safe because it is, this is so much hotter than anything on Earth where everything on Earth is it around 300 Kelvin, you know, it's around a few tens of degrees Celsius. And what this means is that in order to get a medium to those temperatures, you have to completely isolate it from anything to do with terrestrial environment. It can have no contact like with anything on Earth, basically. So this means the technology that I just described is fundamentally what it does is it takes this fuel and it isolates it from any terrestrial conditions so that it hasn't no idea it's on Earth. It's not touching any”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Technologies Exactly. It will have a revolution. I'm certain of it. So about clean. So clean is at its heart what it does is convert, it basically converts hydrogen into its heavier forms of hydrogen, the most predominant one that we use on Earth and converts it into helium and some other products, but primarily helium is the product that's left behind. So helium, safe, inert, gas. In fact, that's actually what our sun is doing. It's eventually going to extinguish itself because it'll just make so much helium that it doesn't do that. So in that sense, clean because No emissions of carbon or pollutants that come directly from the combustion of the fuel itself.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“In the center of stars, in fact. So there's only one natural place in the universe that fusion energy occurs. That's in the center of stars. So that's going to bring a price to it depending on the cost, sorry, the size and complexity of the technology that's needed to recreate those things.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It's free. Okay. This is why it's hard to, in some ways, I think it's hard to understand fusion because people see this and go, oh, if the fuel is free, this means the energy source is free because we're used to energy sources like this. So we spend resources and drill to get gas or oil or we chop wood or we make coal, we find coal or these things. So fusion, this is what makes fusion. And it's also not an intermittent renewable energy source like wind and solar. So it's like, but this makes it hard to understand. So if you're saying the fuel is free, why isn't the energy source free? And it's because of the necessary technologies which must be applied to basically recreate the conditions which are in stars.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“We should separate those two. The fuel is already cheap. It's basically free, right? What do you mean by basically free? So if we were to be using fusion fuel sources to power your, and it's like, that's all we have to do is fusion power plants around. And we were doing it, the fuel cost per person or something like 10 cents a year.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Not yet. We'll talk about that. Actually, we'll come back to that because this is cheaper or a more technically correct term, that it's economically interesting is really the primary challenge, actually, of fusion at this point. But I think we can get back to that. So what were the other ones? You said.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And that is at the heart of why you use something like fusion. It's because that is a fundamental of nature. Like you can't beat that. So of whatever you do, if you're thinking about, and why do I care about this? Well, because mass is like the fuel, right? So this means gathering the resources that it takes to gather a fuel, to hold it together, to deal with it, the environmental impact it would have. And fusion will always have 20 million times the amount of energy release per reaction that you hit of those. So this is why, you know, we consider it the ultimate environmentally friendly energy source is because of that.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And what that tells you is that it's the relative change in the mass we'll tell you about the relative amount of energy that's liberated. And this is what makes fusion, and you asked about fission as well too. This is what makes them extraordinary. It's because the relative change in the mass is very large as compared to what you get like in a chemical reaction. In fact, it's about 10 million times larger.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“A very large number and it's totally constant everywhere in the universe, which is another weird thing. Which is another weird thing, and in all rest frames and actually the relativity stuff gets more difficult conceptually until you get through. Anyway, so you go to that and...”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“From mass. So it turns out even though we used equals MC squared, this was burning coal and burning gas and burning wood is actually still equals MC squared. The problem is that you would never know this because the relative change in the mass is incredibly small. By the way, which comes back to fusion, which is that E equals MC squared. Okay, so what does this mean? It tells you that the amount of energy that is liberated in a particular reaction when you change mass c squared is that's the speed of light squares.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yes. But it takes a long time. Haven't for a while, but often I teach the introductory class for incoming nuclear engineers. And so we put this up as an equation and we go through many iterations of using this to how you derive it, how you use it and so forth. And then usually in the final exam, I would basically take all the equations that I've used before and I flip it around. I basically, instead of thinking about energy is equal to mass, it sort of mass is equal to energy. And I ask the question in a different way. And usually about half the students don't get it. It takes a while. To get that intuition, yeah. So in the end, it's interesting is that this is actually the source of all free energy because that energy that we're talking about is kinetic energy if it can be transformed.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It has to do with everything we do. It's the fact that energy and mass are equivalent to each other. They're just the way we usually comment to it is that they're just energy just in different forms”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“For example, free unlimited access to the fuel, but it has technology implications. So what does this mean geopolitically? What does it mean for how we distribute wealth within our society? It's very difficult to know, but probably profound.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Your car with a circle around it. And the physics or the science of it too is the energy use that it takes to do that digging up, which is also important and all that. Anyway, so. We wandered away from fusion, but yes, it's a beautiful straw. But it's very important, actually, in the context of this just because those of us who work in infusion and these”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Which is energy, which is amazing for how fundamental it is to our society and way of life is a very poorly understood concept, actually, just even energy itself. People confuse energy sources with energy storage, with energy transmission. These are different physical phenomena, which are very important. So, for example, you buy an electric car and you go, oh, good, I have an emission-free car. And ah, but it's like, so why do you say that? Well, it's because if I draw the circle around the car, I have electricity and it doesn't emit anything. Okay, but you plug that into a grid where you follow that wire back. There could be a coal power plant or a gas power plant at the end of that. Oh, really? You mean so this isn't like carbon-free? Oh, and it's not their fault. It's just, you know, they don't like the car is...”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That takes months, but with I mean, fusion will be because it's energy, its nature is that it will be, and anything that has to do with energy use tends to be a slower transition, but they're the most, I would argue, some of the most profound transitions that we make. I mean, the reason that we can live like this and sit in this building and have this podcast and people around the world, at its heart is energy use and its intense energy use that came from the evolution of starting to use intense energies at the beginning of the Industrial Revolution up to now. It's like it's a bedrock actually of all of these, but it doesn't tend to come overnight.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So, you talk about that day, that insight, the universe changed. It's like, oh, this is the, I mean, and they still didn't understand all the parts of it, but they basically got it. It was like, oh, because of the understanding of these processes, it's like we unveiled the reason that there can be life in the universe. That's probably one of those days the universe changed, right? And that was in the 1930s.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“He says, the universe is what we know and perceive of it. So when there's a fundamental insight as to something new, the universe for us changes. Of course, the universe from an objective point of view is the same as it was before. But for us, it has changed. So he walks through these moments of perception in the history of humanity that changed what we were, right? So as I was thinking about coming to discuss this, people see fusion. Oh, it's still far away or we've been, it's been slow progress. It's like when my godmother was born, like people had no idea how stars worked.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I really recommend them. It's called the Day the Universe Changed. Is that a movie? James Burke. He's a science historian based in the UK. He had a fairly famous series on public television called Connections. I think it was, but the one that I really enjoyed was the day the universe changed. And the reason for the title of it was that”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“How silly we are. There was an email thread going around the professors in my department already. So what is it going to look like to figure out if students have actually written their term papers or its chat GPT GPT? So as usual, we tend to be empiricists in my field. So of course they were in there trying to figure out if it could answer questions for a qualifying exam to get into the PhD program at MIT, which was they didn't do that well at that point. But of course, this is just the beginning of it. We have some interesting ones to go eventually both.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I would see it in a slightly different way. It's actually because we have creatures that live with us on the earth that have cognition, that understand and move through their environment, but they actually see things in a way or they sense things in a way which is so fundamentally different, it's really hard. It's the problem is the translation, not necessarily intelligence. So it's the perception of the world. So I have a dog. And when I go out and I see my dog. Like, see, a teeny, teeny little sliver of this so that even bees, for example, see a different place than we do. So I don't know. I think if you think of, there's already other intelligences around us in a way, in a limited way because of the way they can communicate. But those are already baffling in many ways, yeah.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, that's the way I look at it. I mean, the multiverse model is an interesting one because quantum scientists who look at and it's like, oh, it's like, oh, yeah. Like quantum science perhaps tells us that there are almost an infinite variety of other universes. But the way that it works probably is it's almost like a form of natural selection. It's like, well, the universes that didn't have the correct or interesting relationships between these forces, nothing happens in them. So almost by definition, the fact that we're having this conversation means that we're in one of the interesting ones by default.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yes, exactly. Yeah. No, I mean, there are people who do study such things of the fact that if you look at the, for example, the ratios between those fundamental forces, people have figured out, oh, if this ratio was different by some factor, like a factor of two or something, I was like, oh, this would all like not work. And you look at the sun, right? It's like, so it turns out that there are key reactions that if they had slightly lower probability, no star would ever ignite. And then life wouldn't be possible.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“operates the way that it does is because all matter is made up of individual particles that interact each other through forces. That was it. Atomic theory, basically. Which is like, wow, that's so simple, but it's not so simple. It's because who thinks about atoms that they're made out of? This is a good question I give to my students. How many atoms are in your body? Like almost no students can answer this. But to me, that's like a fundamental thing. By the way, it's about 10 to the 28 So that's trillion, million, trillion, trillion, or something like that, yes.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“He's never been on the podcast. He was unfortunately passed away, but one of a hero to almost all physicists. And part of it was because of what you said. He kind of looked through a different lens at these, what typically looked like very dry equations and relationships. And he kind of, I think he brought out the wonder of it in some sense, right? He posited what would be if you could write down a single not even really a sentence but a single concept that was the most important thing scientifically that we that we knew about that in other words you had only one thing that you could transmit like a future or past generation it was very interesting it was so it's not what you think it wasn't like oh strong nuclear force or fusion or something like this And it's very profound, which was that the reason that matter”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So it's interesting because as a scientist, I see the universe through that lens of essentially the interesting things that we do are through the forces that get used around those. And everything works because of that. Richard Feynman, I don't know if you've ever had Richard Feyman. It's a little bit of a tangent, but...”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“To get enough fusion that you would be able to make get energy gain out of it. So you can trigger fusion reactions at lower energy, but they become almost vanishingly small at lower temperatures than that.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“When you go through the math of this, the average velocity or energy of the particles must be very high to have any significant probability of the reactions happening. And so the center of our Sun is at about 20 million degrees Celsius. And on Earth, this means it's one of the first things we teach entering graduate students. You can do a quick basically power balance and you can determine that on Earth it requires a minimum temperature of about 50 million degrees Celsius on Earth.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It is one of the criteria for doing this, but it's the easiest one to understand why is this? It's because. Effectively, what this requires is that these hydrogen ions, or which is really the bare nucleus, so they have a positive charge, everything has a positive charge of those ones, is that to get them to trigger this reaction, they must approach within distances which are like the size of the nucleus itself, because the nature, in fact, what it's really using is something called the strong nuclear force. There's four fundamental forces in the universe. This is the strongest one, but it has a strange property is that while it's the strongest force by far, it only has impact over distances which are the size of a nucleus. So to get that into, what does that mean? It's a millionth of a billionth of a meter, incredibly small distances. But because the distances are small and the particles have charge, they want to push strongly apart, namely they have repulsion that wants to push them apart.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“The most abundant element, most of the universe is hydrogen. And it's essentially a sequence through which these processes occur that you end up with helium. So those are the primary things. And the reason for this is because helium has Basically, conversion engines of hydrogen into helium. This also tells you why you love fusion. I mean, because our sun will last 10 billion years approximately. That's how long the fuel will last.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“When they're with no kinetic energy. And when you look at the product afterwards, it has less rest mass. And so you go, well, how is that possible? Because you have to keep mass, but mass and energy are the same thing, which is what equals mc squared means. And the conversion of this comes into kinetic energy, namely energy that you can use in some way. And that's what happens in the center of stars. So fusion is literally the reason life is viable in the universe. So fusion is happening in our sun. And what are the elements? The elements are hydrogen that are coming together. It goes through a process which is probably gets a little bit too detailed, but it's a somewhat complex catalyzed process that happens in the center of stars. But in the end, stars are big balls of hydrogen, which is the lightest. It's the simplest element, the lightest element.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Let's start with a big question What is nuclear fusion? It's the underlying process, the powers of the universe. So as the name implies, it fuses together or brings together two different elements technically nuclei that come together and if you can push them together close enough that you can trigger essentially a reaction what happens is that the element typically changes so this means that you change from one element to another chemical element to another underlying what this means is that you change the nuclear structure this rearrangement through equals mc squared releases large amounts of energy so fusion is the fusing together of lighter elements into heavier elements and when you go through it you say oh look so here were the initial elements typically hydrogen and they had a particular mass rest mass which means just the mass”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
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2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
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2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“This show is also brought to you by Inside Tracker, a service I use to track biological data. They have a bunch of plans, most include blood tests that give you information to make decisions about your health. Like John Mayer said, your body is a wonderland. It's a source of a lot of signal, a lot of data. It's obvious to me that in the 21st century, maybe the 22nd century, we're going to create systems for the collection.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
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2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
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2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
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2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Netflix, maybe Spotify, I'm trying to think things I pay for every single month and things that add a huge amount of value to my life. And in that list, there are a bunch of subscriptions that I don't need that I completely forgot. Or actually, I aspired to use, but I end up not using. And then you kind of have to confront. Yourself with the reality of the fact that you plan to use a service and you don't use it and why pay a huge amount of money every month, every year to use it. And so it's really nice to kind of have an introspective analysis of your life, reflect and start anew.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Following is a conversation with Dennis White, nuclear physicist at MIT and the director of the MIT Plasma Science Infusion Center. And now a quick few second mention of his sponsor. Check them out in the description. It's the best way to support this podcast. We got rocket money for helping you cancel unwanted subscriptions, masterclass for online education, and insight tracker for biomonitoring. Choose wisely, my friends. And now onto the full ad raids, as always, no ads in the middle. I try to make this interesting, but if you skip them, please still check out our sponsors. I enjoy their stuff. Maybe you will do. This show is brought to you by Rocket Money, a personal finance app that finds and cancels unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps you lower your bills all in one place. I use it especially to monitor my subscriptions. It actually in an indirect way makes me realize all the things I'm subscribed to that actually add value to my life. For example, it shows audible.”
2023-01-21 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #353 – Dennis Whyte: Nuclear Fusion and the Future of Energy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source