YouSaid · the spoken record

Emmett Shear

lines on the record: 117
first: 2022-07-18
most recent: 2022-07-18
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

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“They never used it. They've never used it. They've sat on it for years. They've never used it. They never sold it to anyone. I have a fantasy someday I'll buy back Kiko, but I just don't, I think they'll want more money than that. That's like a nostalgia purchase. It's not like a I don't want to spend a four-letter pronounceable domain name probably costs these days”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Was it going to be Twitch size lucky? No, no, no. I mean, there's a lot of lower levels of lucky that are still success, absolutely. Yeah. And so I think at some level that I was successful at all, I attribute to some combination of hard work, persistence, intelligence, that I was successful in anything resembling the scale of Twitch. There's a huge portion of luck there that is undeniable.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“As the famous quote goes, 50% luck, 50% skill, 100% concentrated power of will. Yeah, I don't know if that's, you know, it's sort of a joke. It's sort of not a joke. I was very smart. I was very hardworking. I was very persistent in the face of a lot of failure. And then I was also very lucky. And for something to be as big and successful as Twitch, you kind of got to do all four. I guess more luck can make up for less of the other three, but the best you're going to do is like 50% luck. I've now been around the valley for 15 years and I came here with a bunch of people who started making companies. And I don't know anyone who persisted. Tried again and then tried a new thing and then tried again. Who hasn't had some level of success? Eventually you do get lucky.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And I really don't like investor relations. I like building the product. I like working with my team. I like working with streamers. And I think the fact that I'm still with Twitch and still at Amazon shows, I think we chose the right buyer. I get to basically really actually be the CEO of Twitch.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah. We weren't that big yet. Now we were growing fast. It was clearly a winner. There's a reason they were paying us a premium. But we got the forward evaluation that I think makes the, if you look at it in an economic sense, yes, yes, Twitch is much more valuable today, but I think from an economic perspective, I never really worried, like, oh, I didn't make as much money as I should have made. I mean, first of all, I made plenty of money to the point where it doesn't really matter. But also... I feel like when you actually do the math, it was a good deal. The real question for me was like, What's the best home for Twitch? What's the best job for me? I mean, selfishly, like, am I going to enjoy doing this? And I hated raising money.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So we got paid a pretty good premium over the last round we'd raised have been $100 million valuation, not that long ago, a year ago, year and a half ago.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah. And my hope is to engage our community more and more deeply over time and helping set rules for itself. I really believe that ultimately as communities grow up, that there's a sense in which communities should become self-governing. And I don't think the right abdication of responsibility. Oh, not our problem. We'll let everyone just govern themselves. If bad things happen, not our fault. I don't want that. But I want to in a way that is levels up the level of nuance, levels up the level of buy-in, have our community over time help standard for itself more and more. And we're just at the very start of that journey. Right now, we're just trying to make the simpler centralized system work. But I would like to get there over time.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, first and foremost, I think of Twitch as being about community and about connection. And part of being part in a community is being willing to join that community's standards. And it is not easy to set standards that work globally, that make sense. Right now we tend to have one global standard, which I think is a good, safe place to start, but we can do better. And we're fortunate that unlike most social media, you can't really go viral on Twitch. It's almost because it's live, it can't go, you can't get to, oh my God, look at this, millions of people see it. It's like whoever many people saw it saw it. That's over.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And I think there's a role for it. I think it's great to get around and play games with your friends. And maybe that hopefully for me it was, and I think hopefully for many people, it can be a step towards eventually having deeper, more emotional connections. I view trying to help build community in this way, sort of my life mission. It's like the most important thing I do at Twitch, but it's beyond Twitch. It's the most important thing I think I can work on in a lot of ways.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Until later on. No, definitely not. I realized this. 10 years I've been really focused on a lot of emotional growth stuff. And I probably realized this maybe six years ago. I realized seven years ago. I realized like, oh. That's why I needed to play games so much as a kid. And like, I still play games, but way less now. And the reason was I couldn't handle actual social connection. And this was the scaffolding that got me there.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And I will say that there's a lot of incremental steps there because when I was a kid, what I realized was I wasn't capable of handling the intimacy of real human connection in a lot of ways, which is why instead of actually looking at my friends and talking to them about them, I looked at a video screen and not at my friends' faces because my friends' faces were overload. I couldn't handle it.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I agree that it's deeply impoverished versus coming together in person. But I kind of think of, if you think of social stuff as nutrition, which I kind of think it is, I think it's essential for a social connection and community cohesion is essential for us the same way food is. And we can provide not everyone who uses Twitch feels this way. For some people, it's supplementary, there's other reasons, but there's a set of people for whom Twitch. It is the vitamin supplement they need socially. And I think it's one of the most important functions we offer. And it's a stepping stone. It shouldn't be that you get all your socialization from Twitch. That's terrible. That's like getting all your nutrition from a multivitamin. That's not how you should live.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Because they're together because they're. And lots of people say they have community, but community is not a collection of people who all like the same thing watching the same thing together. Community is fundamentally about... Communication between two people being witnessed by a third in that community.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Users who love it, who come back day after day is Always the same. They don't mention entertainment. For our core users, we are not an entertainment product. We are a community product. I'm here because it makes me less feel less alone.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It's the screen time question, right? I'll note that's not a new problem, right? TV, people watch eight hours of TV a day. People come home and the kids plopped in front of the boob tube, right? And the electronic babysitter. That's like a, this is not entirely a new problem for digital entertainment, although I will admit phones make it more omnipresent, right? It's easy for it to take over more and more time. There's another thing which is video games themselves. And while I admit there are shooters in violent games, I've learned so much from video games. Video games are incredible teachers. I've learned teamwork. I've learned analysis. I've learned critical thinking. I've learned how I've learned socialization skills. I've learned so much from video games. And when we ask people, why do you use Twitch? Not new people, but people who have used Twitch for years who are our core”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, I think there's a lot in there. I think there's a bunch of really, they're all really important, really good questions. I'm trying to take it to take apart the various pieces of it. So the first part is.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And so there's this most of the money actually gets made, not in the top tier of streamers, not the people with many thousands of viewers, but in the people with hundreds of viewers. That's actually where the bulk of revenue happens. It is that middle class of streamer who can have the more personal connection, who has a more intimate community where subscriptions really work great and where community gifts work. And there's this whole set of dynamics around that community supporting that streamer, that really that's what powers the jobs on Twitch effectively for streamers.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“While you're a subscriber for $5 a month, you gain access to all the subscriber remotes. It's micropatronage. You are getting the positive glow of supporting someone whose content you like and their gratitude for your help. And some of them really leaned into it. And I could see someone was making, I think like $1,000 a month. And pretty quickly, I was like, oh, this is going to be a thing. Because if they can make $1,000 a month doing it part-time, they're going to go full time. And now we have many thousands, if not tens of thousands of people who earn their living on Twitch. What's interesting about Twitch is we actually have this very thriving middle class because big streams monetize much more poorly per viewer than medium-sized streams do.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, sometimes there was no promise of that, but yeah, you sort of assense you might pay more attention to the comments. We pretty quickly added special emotes. So you got to use special emoji. That were only for subscribers”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“No, you got a badge next to your name in chat, and when you subscribed, a notification happened in chat, and he said thank you.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I was pretty clear I was going to be advertising driven. And I was very excited about the idea of getting to scale with a gaming video product and selling video advertising. And so my original plan was just advertising. And then this streamer day nine, who was a StarCraft streamer, I was at an event. We were talking, and he was saying how I have these people who really just love my stream who come and hang out in the comments. And I think if we made a fan club for them, like a subscription, where they could pay $5 a month and get a badge just so they could be a member of the club and be a supporter, I bet you'd sell a lot of those. I think we could sell a lot of those. I think you should build that. And I said, you know, that makes a lot of sense. I believe you. Let's try it. So we built a...”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But that was sort of our attitude. And the result was we didn't value the coordination function. It didn't really even understand it. And so it was this process both of getting better at it, but also just coming to appreciate what is the point of having a manager in an organization at all? Like what does that person do for you and do for employees? It was a big personal growth thing for me. I think becoming a manager was really helped me grow emotionally, grow socially. I'm really glad I got the opportunity to do it.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I was had at difficult conversations and giving hard feedback, bad at praising people when they did well, bad at delegating effectively, micromanaging when I shouldn't be micromanaging, but then being completely disconnected on things I needed to look at. There's a whole craft to management. And I was, you name the thing that a manager is supposed to do. I did it poorly. And I remember at the beginning, our point of view on management was actually, it was kind of common in the valley at the time. Why do we need managers anyway? Google had, every manager has 40 reports because what do managers do anyway is people should just self-manage and do their thing. What do you need managers? Pointless middle layer. And that's not true. Managers serve a very important function in any kind of organization that's bigger than about 10 people.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It turned out that Niche was a. I mean, to be honest, one of the proper reasons I had trouble raising money is that VCs go off of your own confidence. And I'm not very good at convincing myself of things that I feel it's truly unknown. Like, I thought it could be big. But I didn't know how big it could get. And honestly, I've been surprised at how big it has gotten. If you'd asked me, you know, five years ago, how big can Twitch get, I don't think I would have believed it could be as big as it is today. But I knew for sure we were onto something. And it really, it felt like between Justin TV and Twitch, it felt like I'd been bumbling around in the dark trying to like, you know, solve a puzzle with the lights off. And I just turned the lights on. I was like, oh, this is much easier. And that was a really powerful experience”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You've nearly saturated the market already. You're going to run out of people who want to do this. It's not going to be big.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You want to buy the game, or you want to play the game more, you want to buy the sequel. And it's just good for you. You can't pay for that kind of advertising. If anything, they should be paying us, which in fact mostly they do. They buy advertising with us. So if anything, game companies would like even more exposure rather than less. And that was actually that insight was one of the reasons I was so excited about gaming. I pushed us to go into gaming because I was like, this is the only category where we have this great IP and the people who own the IP are excited about us using it.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And our response is always the same. You're totally right, and that's totally your IP. And if you don't want us to do it, just tell us, well, we'll turn it off. We'll tell every streamer, stop streaming your game. And the reaction to that was universally the same. Whoa, whoa, whoa, let's not be hasty because they recognize the truth that watching a movie for free on a service instead of buying the movie to watch it is a substitution for what you're doing. But watching someone else play a game is actually marketing for the game.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“From the very beginning on Justin TV gaming, all the way through. There was always a webcam of the person's face over the video talking to the audience because You're there. You come for the video. You come for the entertainment and the gaming content, but you actually stay for the relationship and for the chat and for the connection. That's been a core part, that was a core part of the Justin's show. It was a core part of Justin TV. You can talk to the people making it and they can react to you and you can impact what is happening on the stream in real time.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And then those people would watch the streamer they came to watch, but also spread out and watch other streamers. And it became this cascading exponential growth process where the bigger we were, the easier it was to recruit more streamers who could then bring across more of an audience, which would then let us recruit more streamers, et cetera, et cetera.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We had a very simple closed loop growth strategy. We would make the product better for game streaming. We would go out to all the game streamers and say, we've made the product better. You should try it out. Hey, we'll pay you $1,000 to like switch services. For the larger streamers. Or some of them would tell us, no, you don't do this, you don't do that, and that would become our future request list. And we would go, we wouldn't always build the thing they suggested, but we would go solve the problem they were pointing out. And we'd make the service a little better, and then we'd go out and we'd recruit more streamers. And every time a streamer came on, they would onboard all of their audience. They would tell everyone who followed them online, hey, come check me out on Twitch.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“No, so what's interesting is we'd been growing at 25%, 30% a month for almost nine months before we ever launched Twitch. It was fully validated by the time that we were launching a new domain name.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, Boxer was potentially the most famous Korean StarCraft player. If you've never watched Boxer execute a three-site drop tank attack at the same time, you don't understand the level StarCraft can be played at. It is a thing of art. But the best news fundamentally is You don't need, I don't need them to understand it because I got it and the people watching got it, the people streaming got it because for the people who loved it, it was self-evident the instant they saw it, like they were like, oh, this is, yes, this is what I want. This is what I've been waiting for.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I mean, I used to get that question every interview. Now I'd say it's only half of it all interviews. Then usually, what I would do actually is I'd ask them, well, first of all, just tell me, do you watch TV? Oh, well, what do you watch? Oh, you like watching the NFL. You like watching football. Oh, interesting. So you like watching someone else throw a ball around rather than you throwing the ball. Fascinating. Well, it turns out people who like video games do the same thing. People like watching other people do stuff. It's a core human desire. But it never worked. Nobody gets it. You can't explain it that way.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And it kind of had a correlation with the liveness of the streaming in addition to gaming. And so I was like, okay, that kind of makes sense. And most importantly, I could get the domain. And we told everyone it was Twitch, and Twitch it was. And Jacob, our designer, made a logo in two hours, and we launched it.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So We had been calling it Justin TV Gaming. We decided it needed its own brand in its own home over time for a variety of reasons. And all the names we had for the product were bad at the time. And I literally locked myself at a conference room and just for two days just like went through looked for domain names I could buy. Looked for stuff that was available, and eventually I found Twitch through just free associating words associated with gaming and Twitch gaming as a kind of like, you know, fast reaction gaming.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Advertisement, a midrole advertisement in the middle of your stream. Press button, run ad, get money. And we invited like 50 people, and they loved it. It was super popular, even though they weren't making that much money in the beginning.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And not because they wanted to make a living. Like they knew they would be, I was like, you know you're going to be making $17 a month given how big your audience is and how much money we can make you. And the streamers would say like, yeah, totally. I know that. That would be amazing. I would love to make $17 a month streaming video games. And I was like, okay, I believe you. And so one of the very first things we did is we started this partner program where you could press a button and we would roll a mid-roll on your channel and we would give you half the money.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Oh yeah, I mean, and bigger than us too. It's like USTream was a live streaming competitor. They had more gaming and they were bigger than us. Live stream.com. There was a European startup owned 3D that was, I think, already functioning at this point. Those were the primary competitors in the beginning. And so we did all these little customizations to Justin TV. We promoted the gaming content more. We made the front page promote a lot of gaming content more. And I just went out and I talked to a ton of streamers and I just wanted to understand like, how did you get started streaming and what do you like about it? What do you get out of this? And the biggest surprise for me was how much they wanted to make money.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The first thing I did was I asked myself, I had had this realization I need to actually know who I'm building for. I need like I'm tired. I was sick of failing at product. And I was like, I need to know what the actual problems are. And the first thing I asked myself was, who's more important here? Do I need to build stuff to make it better for the viewers? Or do I need to build stuff to make it better for the streamers? And obviously they impact each other. But like, who is my focus? And I realized there were about 200 people who are streaming video games across every service, including ours, who garnered maybe 80% of the total audience at the time. And I was like, oh, I just need to make them happy. I can talk to those 200 people.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Like doing anything new and risky is likely to fail. So let's fund two Skunk Works initiatives internally. We'll take resources away from Justin TV. We'll give each of them two or three employees plus a founder who are going to go focus on doing that thing. And Justin will sort of continue to run the core business in the meantime. And we set these basically growth bars in which everyone exceeds the growth targets we hit for the first three months, we will pivot the company to do that. And so I sort of grabbed all the Justin TV infrastructure and focused it on sort of customizing Justin TV, building Justin TV to be better for gamers.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“This was before Instagram had videos. This was before Snapchat. There was no video recording stuff on mobile yet, really. And so we had these two ideas and we were like, we don't know which one is right I felt pretty strongly mine seemed good. Michael felt pretty strongly his fumes seemed good. We both thought the other person's made sense. So we got together as a founders and made like a four-hour meeting to figure out what to go do. And the conclusion was they're both likely to fail.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Michael's insight was it was obvious mobile apps were going to be massive. There's going to be a wave of social media mobile stuff, and we should focus on being video for mobile. No one had done great video for mobile yet. There's a lot of photo apps, but not a lot of video.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It was the first time I'd ever actually enjoyed watching my own product. Like, we've been running an entertainment product for like four years at this point, and I was like, this is fun. I like watching this live. This is great. I can ask the pro questions. I'm hanging out with other people who also like the same thing I do. And I know that if other gamers who I know understood had the experience I'm having and understood it, they'd like it too. And so I was like, I think there's something here. I think we focus on this. We could grow something really big. I think gaming is the vertical for us to work on.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, yeah. I mean, that was how I got interested in the idea in the first place. People started Justin TV always had a smaller, small amount, 1, 2%, of gaming content. So the StarCraft 2 beta came out, a bunch of people started streaming it. They'd run screen capture software. Like, you know when you're out in a Zoom call and you share your screen. So they do screen share with the video game plus their webcam sort of overlaid on top so you could see their face.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, so the original StarCraft is a very deep multiplayer competitive game. Think of it. Playing it is kind of like playing real-time chess plus poker at the same time. It has a very high skill cap. It's possible to get very, very good at it. And so in South Korea particularly, it really took off. There were basically esports stars became like StarCraft stars became celebrities. And they had a cable TV channel devoted to the matches. And it became a whole league. And there was a whole culture around watching the very best StarCraft players.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“If you've seen the movie, it's like bug aliens versus Terran Space Marines. So you're looking at the battlefield from the top down, but you're building an army and you're commanding it versus other players.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The StarCraft II beta had just come out, and StarCraft 2 was a sequel to a game I played as a child, still the original StarCraft. And I was so excited because I couldn't believe they'd finally made a sequel after 10 years.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We thought it was boring. We didn't want to do enterprise sales. We knew what that was going to be. We had friends doing enterprise companies, and we knew what that was going to get us into. It's not building great, beautiful software to win. It's building good enough software and great sales. And we just... That wasn't what we got into the game to do, I don't think. I mean, consumer software is like buying lottery tickets. You have no idea. Like, when it's really successful, the biggest consumer-oriented companies are incredibly successful. Right. Enterprise software is a little more rational, maybe more boring, but the pathway to success is more controllable. We decided we'd like to buy more lottery tickets instead.”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Like, we just didn't want to do enterprise software. That would have been, I mean, look at how successful Zim is now, right? That would have been, I think we were right, but instead we...”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We could go build that business. And we were all like, yeah, that's probably a big multibillion dollar business. Does anyone want to work on that? No. Okay. We're not doing that”
2022-07-18 · How I Built This with Guy Raz · Twitch: Emmett Shear · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT