YouSaid · the spoken record

Ezra Klein

lines on the record: 128
first: 2018-12-12
most recent: 2018-12-12
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Well, that's easy. I was joking with something the other day that I want to start a vertical box of lukewarm takes. Because a lot of things like the lukewarm views, but what is a hot take to you and what does a smart take?”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Wall Street Journal Right. But also, but you can think about smart. One of the reasons I did the times column, because I wanted a global platform for some of these, like a lot of stuff I wrote on Recode, and it had resonance within the community. But I wrote one piece I thought was terrific right after when all the tech people went up to Trump Tower and I call them Sheeple, and it was great, you know, and except for shame, these awful rich people, there's not enough, you know, they're so poor, all they have is money, stuff like that. And how dare they not talk about immigration? How dare they not talk about the tolerance issues, all the things that Trump was railing against, they never said a word. And so that was a great column, and it had resonance within the tech community, but it didn't. But the reason why was that it had a bigger resonance with a wider range of people. And so there is a value to the print publication, not just the print, not really the print, but in a broader sense that I still think does matter, like thoughtful.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That you were particularly good at, and it's why you got all the scoops, but now you're actually just putting a microphone to that part. You get to listen to the whole Kara conversation, not just the part that got into the part the Wall Street Journal had room for. And, you know, in a lot of my work, I feel like what I'm often doing is pulling up the model of politics that I use to evaluate everything else. Instead of seeing everything that got filtered through my model, you see the model itself. A lot of my big stories, you know, like I wrote this piece, I'm very proud of this year called White Thread in a Browning America. And it's like a piece that informs every piece I do, but instead of it being in my head and you get pieces run through the mechanism that I used to decide what news is, you get the mechanism.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But isn't one way to think about that, that we were wrong in the media for a long time about which part of our work people would find most interesting? I think of a lot of your work as there are things journalists did before they wrote the story.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, we don't do the most. I'll go back. The news stuff is not running the website, but I don't think that matters as much. I think the reaction and the better stories are the ones that are, the longer stories, the more smarter stories, the explainer stories are much, which you guys pioneered, are much more important. And to me, I think these live events and also the podcasts are where the real stuff. I mean, that's where Mark Zuckerberg talked about Holocaust deniers being okay, like good people on both sides. That's where Elon talked a lot about his SEC stuff. Like he's just going to tweet what he wants. News was broken there or on stage as a code. So I think that's what I think people find interesting. And I found fans or people that like myself, that's what they tend to value, I guess, value.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I love those. I love those. I still love this. Like, one, I still like when we broke the story about Yahoo hacking years ago, I felt great about that. And because they weren't going to tell anybody, that kind of stuff. I like those. You know, some of them, yes, you're right. There's different levels of them. And so I don't spend almost any time on that anymore because what happens is you do a scoop and now you can't get them all anymore. And before you could, you can get a lot of them or make it seem like it. And then they move so fast now, it doesn't really matter. It doesn't have any, it just doesn't matter. All the time you put into it doesn't matter and most of them are level one that people will find out 10 minutes later kind of stuff. So it's a waste of time. It's a waste of time. So we tend to try to do the fast follow or much smarter stories. I think that's what we, I'm not doing as much day-to-day journal. I know what's going on. I don't do as much.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Like a level one is something that everybody would have known soon anyway. Like right before every four years before people announced their vice presidential candidates, there's this huge crush of news organizations trying to know it 15 minutes before and it's this huge coup. We would have known in 15 minutes, you could have just done anything else. And then there's level two, like you wouldn't have known it, right? Unless you got it, you wouldn't have known it. And that stuff is super valid.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But it isn't. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Before, you could have all the scoops. Like, we were specialized in, first of all, we specialized in scoops, which was like we would get them all. And they seemed more important than they actually really were. I mean, in a lot of ways, but they were because the other, because having been at the Washington Post and the Wall Street Journal, things were brought to us and then we laid them back out. You know, a lot of that wasn't amazing reporting. It was they handed it to you, which I hated. I hated that.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Not really. I mean, I will, if something happens and I can break something in the course of doing something, I will, but that's not what I'm adding.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“They don't put everything up all at once, so you're going through it, and it's like it's not, I feel like I can complete things there.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I've started using a bunch of, I have a lot of news homepages or apps on my phone. I actually really like the New Yorker app.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Instagram or just in general? No, they never stop talking. My kids call me all the time. I've got boys who never stop communicating. I was like, can't you be sullen? You know, I'm like, you know how kids are like, oh, my kids never say anything at home. I'm like, my kids never stop telling me this.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Has it changed? Yeah. The thing that's really changed is I've basically stopped reading any social media, which for a long time was a big part of my news diet. So I don't read Twitter. I don't read Facebook. I took everything off my phone. After you took Instagram off your phone, that was the last thing I had. I took it off my phone. So, you know what? I've actually been doing recently.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I am doing it less since I came out here because I haven't structured that. But, you know, in Washington, I spent a lot of time going up to the Hale or to the White House or to some think tank or another. I don't know. I take an information in most of the ways you would think. Sometimes I watch podcasts.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, I agree. I agree. So essentially it's enough about my concepts. What do you think about my concepts? Exactly. Right. Okay. But it is a reporting technique. I use the podcast absolutely as reporting, which is interesting. And also relationship building between me and the subjects. Sometimes people I didn't know well or people I didn't have. So do you make the old traditional phone calls? Do you do that? And what else”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We talk at Vox, we have this line like using the whole news buffalo. And so the idea is that you want to use as much of the work you're doing. So it's like, if you're working on a story, like maybe you want to do a Q&A with some of the people you're reporting on and then like a shorter piece and then eventually a feature comes out and then we put it on the weeds as a podcast. I mean if you're you want to use a whole news buffalo.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I was talking with someone here in the audience and who's very kind, and he said, You know, I learned a lot about questioning from you. And I said, well, what did you learn? And he said, well, when you question people, what you do is you go and tell them your theory of what you already think and ask them to respond to it. Yeah, that is how I report too. It's like I'm working on this story. Like, what do you think? How can you help me fill in the blanks of it? And I've just made that into a podcast.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“No, I almost never text. In fact, you and I think often have communication breakdowns because I'll email you and you'll text me. And then nobody ever responds to anybody. I don't like texting. It's like, I just don't want my phone to ever interrupt me doing anything for any reason.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think my process, partly right now with the book, is more, it almost works a little bit more like I'm an academic than I'm a”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Oh, yeah I was going through a long, yeah, we were on a meeting and I ended up talking about Jocha Bankler's network propaganda about the way the left and right media ecosystems have developed. It's a useful book, but I can't say I feel like it really worked on that call.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Be together for the general idea. The thing I was thinking about when you said, you know, what is your practice? I do a fair amount of reporting. I talk to a lot of people. I mean, I still do a lot of that. A lot of my reporting is among academics or people who I feel have a high elevation on things. Some of it is among politicians, but less of it lately. And then the other thing is I just am reading a lot of books lately. I'm reading a lot more books than I am news because I kind of feel I have a reasonable handle on the news and I don't have a reasonable handle on the why. And so I'm trying to spend a lot more time by getting some perspective. And that's been good.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The book is about political polarization and identity and basically why everything is fucked up. But it's like an effort to create.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And it's something I just want, like, the audience is into new ideas and somehow it spreads. I think it's the coolest thing about the medium. Anyway, so about half my time goes into the two podcasts, the two EK shows, and the weeds and my own kind of writing, and I do some videos. And because of the podcast, one thing that's been good for me is I just, oh, and then I'm writing a book.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, Elon Musk gets stuff like that. Yeah, yeah. But I find that I have on a lot of people who are like, let's say be list famous, right? Like not Elon Musk. Way better known than random professors I have on and the random professors often do much better.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Do you find that your podcast downloads are correlated highly with how famous a person is? I don't either, and it's something I love about podcasting.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So practice. So, what do I do? So it's split between two things. About half my time goes into what I think of box strategic. So I'm an executive producer on our Netflix show. I'm working a lot on the recode partnership that we're working on. I'm working on helping, we're doing a new YouTube show. So Vox does a lot of stuff, and I'm involved in a lot of that. Then the other half is what I think of as my work. So I do two Ezra Klein shows a week, which if you don't listen to that podcast, recode decode listeners. It's a great second podcast to recode decode. It complements it in really nice ways, and it's much longer and slower paced.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Establish reputations and the training and Wasn't under the thing. Talk about, let's talk about both of us talking about our practices now in Jaha. What is your journalism? How do you do your journalism right now? I can talk about how I do it, but I want to hear about how you do yours for what is your practice.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“A Vox for four ish years, and then before that at Wonk Blog in the Washington Post, and just having it happen both to me and to people I managed or cared about at other institutions, like watching them get blown up and feeling this terrible, I can't help I wasn't under the thing.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I mean a little bit is like I would like to have I do think it I think there's a really good quality of risky ideas right I one thing I loved about blogging was this ability to be wrong in public when I was younger and so like I did have an institution behind me but this feeling that I could try an idea and oftentimes people come in the comments and be like you know that's actually just wrong like if you knew the first thing about this you know it was wrong it's like oh that's great that was wrong now I know it's wrong like it's a useful thing to have happen and I want that I want that ability for myself for my colleagues to be riskier with ideas because you know even a bunch of those are wrong sometimes you get somewhere good but in the long run you can't have that in a dangerous space right you can't have that in a place where there's a lot of risk and partly for people and younger journalists who don't have established reputations and the training and a really good sense of the conversation I mean my a lot of my views on this come from being editor”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Not just jokes, but small town clubs. Like it's a place to work out material. It's like, okay, so the structure of what we're going to do here is we're going to work out our material where it has to be constrained to be shorter and less nuanced in the place where it gets the least generous read of any place on earth you could possibly do it and it's most easy to grab it embed it and pull it out of context and like that's where we're going to try out our new ideas right like no editors like no and i see it happen and you do get good things um i wish we could set up a new culture around some of these things twitter would be so great if we could all agree to be generous on it um if there was some way”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I am so sympathetic to this way of doing Twitter and journalism, and I also have come to think it's so dangerous. Now you live on the edge. You court disaster and eat catastrophe for breakfast. For those of us who don't quite have your metabolism, and I've seen this happen to a lot both to me and to some of my colleagues, there's this tendency to treat Twitter like a comedian treats.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Can take money from the Saudis as this gets worse and worse and worse. And I'm testing it on Twitter actually. I'm like, I keep putting up, oh, look at what the thugs did now. Look at this O Silicon Valley people. And then I wait to see what the reaction is and get ideas and concepts from it. And then it starts to formulating me. So I guess that's a slow way to do it.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Space of context, yes. I knew this. I mean, it was stuff I already knew, so it wasn't, I had been working on it for a long time. I just was able to assimil. What I like about it now is the speed of it, like getting stuff out, getting ideas and concepts out there really quickly to actually not just test them on people, but to get reaction. When I started in journalism, I when I was at the Washington Post, I used to way, way back. Not many people had email addresses, not you people, you don't remember it, but you didn't. And I put my email address at the bottom, and a lot of the reporters like, what are you doing that for? The readers will talk to you. And I'm like, yes, that's exactly what I'm looking for. I'm looking for feedback, which was interesting. And I really enjoy the feedback. I think the story only starts once I put it up. And then I have a really interesting time with it, or I test out concepts. Like right now, I have this, I'm working on a column about how Silicon Valley people...”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You're not in what you produce journalistically, most of it is actually on slower time frames. You do New York Times columns. Right.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Do you think some of that Interesting. Because that's an interesting question that you did that you sit and actually think about things. I actually do like the speed of it a lot. I do. I'm very pleased with it. Some days I'm like, yay, good for me.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And he wrote this great piece about the need to see friction as a good thing on the internet sometimes. Like the idea that a lot of our problems online, he was talking about hackers and malware and all kinds of other things. But the idea that making everything faster and easier and swifter and cleaner and like making sure there's absolutely nothing in between your impulse and the expression of that impulse. Sometimes you need friction. There's a reason I don't keep Oreos in my house. Like I need friction between me and Oreos. And I think there's some of that in editorial processes. I mean, we think about this a lot at Vox and there's a lot of, we are, I think, getting better. And I think this is true for a lot of newsrooms, getting better at letting pitches go by.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“There was this great piece by, I'm going to, Justin Cossen, I think it is, he runs Jigsaw, the alphabet. Do people really call it alphabet out here? Does everybody just say Google? No.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Okay You know, actually, Nicole Wong from Twitter, who used to work at Twitter and Google, I did a podcast with her, was talking about a slow food movement for the internet. It was a really interesting.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Do everything at full speed, and there are no gatekeepers. Like, I was big on there being no gatekeepers. As things got faster and faster, and I began to work at different institutions and see different publishing cycles and different ways of things worked is you begin to realize that time, the fact that it maybe takes time to publishing sometimes, it creates space where judgment can creep in. And I often think that if you're getting the information about the news from things that are a little bit slower right now, you're often better informed than you're staying up to the minute on Twitter. Oh, wait, you're talking about.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“My theory is that Twitter is important to Donald Trump because of how he uses it on the media. Donald Trump's Twitter power is not actually his Twitter account. It does reach a lot of people, but it's not that many people and it's quick and it's going by. It's force multiplier is immediate, it's an agenda setter for us. He's using us in that way where he's able to much more tightly define the message. I don't know, honestly, what you do about it. I mean, part of it is like you have to be editorially thoughtful. What you were just saying, I think, is 100% true. You rewind the clock 30, 40 years. You have seven white guys on the upper east side deciding the news. Like, that's not good either. I came up as a blogger, right? My first job, quote unquote, in journalism was blogging. And I was a blogger forever. I still in some way think of myself as a blogger. And one of the things that I felt then was, isn't it so great? There's like nothing in between me and the publish button and like I can.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, how do you then combat it? One of the things I was thinking about a column of writing about is what if Twitter wouldn't do this, but what if Twitter took, what would Donald Trump do without Twitter, for example, or what would Blank do without Twitter? And it doesn't have to be Donald Trump, but he happens to be the best user of the platform around, essentially. What would certain figures do without it? What would be their power? And I was trying to think, where would they go? What would happen without that particular tool? Would it work on Facebook? Would it work, I guess, cable is there, but it doesn't reach quite as many people. And it's a really interesting question when you start to remove those tools from them.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Because we take that as our assignment. How do you combat that then? Because one of the things, I mean, it's setting a way to combat it? Well, is there a way to combat it? Because there's always been agenda setting. Like, look, whether you like it, whether you think it or not, you were talking about the wheat loss the narrative of newsworthiness, but the fact of the matter is for many decades seven white guys at CBS, seven white guys at NBC, New York Times determined the news, like up on the upper west side of New York, essentially, or upper east side of New York. And that's a different thing too. That's the agenda setting. And in this case, it's just that someone's taken the tools that Silicon Valley has created and are using them in a different way that's essentially become the punch list that you would have at any editorial meeting of a big newspaper, which you and I have both been to those, like at the Washington Post or at the Wall Street Journal, and it's just deciding what the”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Harder to use when he promised that he'd give everybody health insurance. And one of the things that I think we are not good at in journalism right now, one thing I think we're really failing at is we do not have enough of a sense of our own newsworthiness. We do not have a sense of what is our agenda to cover, what isn't isn't important. To resist what's become extremely sophisticated forms of media manipulation and particularly resist it when it's already dominating social media because we take that as our assignment.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The fight between the president and the press is a president's storyline. Right when he was elected, Steve Bannon gave an interview to the New York Times. Like again, Steve Bannon, as chief strategist, gave an interview and said, you need to understand you're the opposite. The media is the opposition. And so one of the things going on right now is that there is, like, Trump is a very good media manipulator. And he works at the intersection of our hunger for ratings, our hunger for things that are outrageous and interesting the way we operate in competitive pressures with others, like what gets pushed up through algorithms, like the way he's able to dominate Twitter. Then he knows exactly how to move the conversation to the fights he wants to be having, not to positive press for himself. We don't cover that stuff positively, but it's a fight he wants, him versus a media, not corruption at the EPA, him versus the media, not the fact that he's actually like trying to make Medicaid hard.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It gets up from CNN and he and Sanders get into a fight, and then the Trump White House takes away costs this press pass. And there's a fight about that. And what they were doing was completely calculated. They made a series of moves, a language Trump used that day, the decision to hold a press conference, so there would be a televised showdown between Acosta and Sanders. Then I looked at the FoxNews.com homepage. There was a huge splash with Sanders' face. What do you do when...”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“This was right after the guy who had been sending bombs to journalists' homes and offices had been caught. So the next day, Donald Trump sends out a tweet that morning because it's the world we live in. And the thing says the real, and he knows a language to use. He didn't say the fake news. He said the real enemy of the people, the media is the real enemy of the people. The day after the guy trying to kill the media, the Trump fan trying to kill the media was arrested, sends out this tweet. The real enemy of the people. So the media goes nuts, right? Because that's fascist. That day, for the first time in some number of weeks, a long number of weeks, Sarah Huckabee Sanders called a press conference, a public press briefing. She had not had any of these four weeks. She had stopped having them. She had explained why she'd stopped having them. But she calls one that day. And sure enough, at that press briefing, Jim Acosta”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I guess you guys have phones. And then there's Trump and the kind of weaponization or the demonization of the press. And then there's distraction and there's social media and algorithms and everything's coming together in weird ways. But the big thing to me that's happening right now is that we are losing control in journalism over like what is the idea of newsworthy. Like we are losing control of the agenda if we ever had it. But I think we've become very, very, very reactive. And I think Donald Trump uses that very much to his own advantage.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, a couple things. So, one, I think journalism is a lot of systems that are colliding in really weird ways right now. And so the couple that I think are the most important are one, people have way more choice than they ever did before. Two, there's much more competition for your attention than there ever was before, not just within journalism, but with everything. Like the number of things anybody can do. Like we are in competition with Netflix. We are in competition with you being here, right? You're here. You're not clicking on box articles tonight. Like you're doing something different.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I want to offer a disclaimer here quickly. You know, when you have you're working on something in your head, but it's sort of still a blob So I've been trying to work through this question, and it's currently in my head like this giant blob, so I'm worried it's all going to come out very inarticulately.”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So let's talk about how that affects everything in terms of the future of journalism. So now that you're here, talk a little bit about what you're studying, because I think one of the things you've and I have talked a lot about is the impact of social media, not just social media, but cable social media on what journalism is. To me, journalism is still sort of block and tech reporting, like calling, calling, calling, finding things out, trying to get to the truth of things, which has been shifted a little bit by the fact that you're right. anybody could get, you don't need to figure out, for example, what someone thinks because they tell you what they think immediately on the internet or on Twitter or wherever they decide to do it. And Trump has changed the game in terms of reporting in that way by just spewing whatever he says every single day. And so what's the biggest impacts on journalism right now from your perspective?”
2018-12-12 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Ezra Klein and Kara Swisher on the future of journalism · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT