YouSaid · the spoken record

Grant Hackett

lines on the record
50
first
2021-01-21
most recent
2021-01-21
sittings or episodes
1
sources
podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

  1. “So I think, yeah, no, that's just been awesome. And I've really enjoyed that today. And look, I'm sure that will help a lot of people. And I know that's exactly what you like to do.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  2. “I got to say I'm so proud of Michael as a friend. He knows I love him like a brother. But people have seen him as a product, right? Because a guy's so successful and so amazing and achieved things that no one else ever has in the history of sport. But to hear how open and honest and transparent and forthright he is around mental health because I know he wants to help other people to me is just an outstanding characteristic. And you could never underestimate the strength, but Michael always has that strength to do that sort of stuff. So, yeah, man, it was awesome to hear today. It was emotional for me sitting on the other side because I've been there. I've been right there with you, sitting in the closet, talking”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  3. “The first thing that popped into my head, and I often think that's always the right and best answer if you want to put something in a billboard, I just be you, be you. Two words, very simple because the more you do the things that make you feel like yourself or brings out your personality, brings out who you are, makes you feel good about yourself. And you don't have to be something that's false or superficial or create an image for anybody else or anything else. And I think once you get back to that simplification and to Michael's point, I think often you feel best about yourself. Often you find the things that you enjoy doing more often. Often enough you're living a life that just makes you feel good about yourself and connect better with the people around you. So I think just be you and feel comfortable in that.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  4. “School of Julia, like whatever it might be, those principles are the same. And I'm always trying to identify those because I've got to be honest, I love it. Like I'm passionate about it. I'm passionate about learning about it, talking about it, reading about it. So, yeah, they're probably always the things that I try and tap into. And again, it comes back to that saying that I said before, just do things that make you feel more like you. That's not everyone's cup of tea. Winning Olympic gold medals is not everybody's cup of tea because the sacrifice you have to make for that for most people is probably not often worth it. But for the two guys you've got on this call, we'll do anything to get those things and sort of have the same approach to everything else that I try and achieve or want to achieve.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  5. “Ebba said, okay, we've got to do the A380, but you know what? If we get this wrong, it's actually going to send us bankrupt. What was the inflection point where business became great? And I enjoy Jim Collins, like his book's good to great, really interesting just to learn about. You know, I find any sort of success story is the same. It is just a daily grind of mundane things that you just have to keep getting right and improve by 0.1 of a percent and then do it again the next day, then do it again the next day. Then eventually momentum and the flywheel as it's referred to in that book kind of click into place. And then all of a sudden, many years later, you've got this outstanding result that people think is an overnight success that took you 15 years to get there. So that's the way I find most things work. And so I love reading around the principles of high performance and success in any single field, whether it's a Navy seal, whether it's business, whether it's sport, whether it's in music.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  6. “So I'm in the middle of that. I've got to say that's definitely one that springs to mind that's definitely top of the list. Other ones that stand out, I mean, probably that one for now. The other ones that I enjoy reading, I enjoy just general sort of leadership. So I read a lot of stuff that relates to that in business and knowing and understanding what the fundamentals are. I've probably got, if I walked into my bedroom seven or eight books that I want to read that I haven't at the moment, I always enjoy reading things around Warren Buffett. I've read a lot of books that relate to him just on his mindset and his approach towards things. Because the one thing that I've really found in high performance, you don't actually have to read always on your specific subject matter because when it comes to business, I always find I read articles mostly like strategy articles or, you know, growth initiatives or what was the change in Boeing when, you know, Airbus, when...”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  7. “Got it pisses me off so much. I tried that. And you know what? I realized that's not me. Like doing things mediocre is not me. I can't stand that. And it was funny. All the things that disconnected with my value set destabilized me. And so I focus on reading things, reading journals, doing things that connect more with me. And those things like mental tough toughness, reading about Navy SEALs, reading about different training strategies, that sort of stuff I really love. And I find that an escape for my personality. So that's quite interesting. And then I love commerce and love business. So I read a lot of different business books and articles. So they're kind of the things that I just enjoy. So yeah, it's always just reconnecting with purpose for me that actually slows my mind down, gives me perspective. And then, yeah, the books that I just referred to certainly have...”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  8. “Just do more things that make you feel like you. And that has always stuck with me because it's like, okay, what do I value? What do I truly value? And it's funny upon the basis of that saying or that statement, I really got back to my own core values. And then I did things that sort of checked into those values. And it's funny because I always had people tell me, oh, Grant, just slow down. Just, you know, enjoy it. Just relax. Don't try and do everything to the top level every single time.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  9. “So I enjoy his reading. I read a lot of journals. I even read a lot of Harvard Business Review articles. There's one I like in particular, and it's really funny this will sound a little bit counterintuitive around mental health, but it's about mental toughness. And they've got the sort of mini books that you can read, all the journals that they've had around that particular subject matter. And I love that because it resonates with me 100%. So I find I actually need to not just read things that give me renewed perspective, but actually things that make me feel more like me. And that's one of the things that the psychologists that I've dealt with, because we always talk about purpose and meaning and all this sort of stuff. And he had this really interesting thing that he said to me because, you know, people have this high expectation of you once you've achieved certain things in life and you have a greater expectation of yourself more than anybody else. And he just said to me, goes.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  10. “Yeah, yeah. So that one, I just reread that probably a couple of months ago that that book always just takes me back one or two steps and renews my perspective on situations because, you know, I'm a hyper focused individual when I get onto goals and tasks and things that I want to deliver. Like I sometimes get the blinkers on in such an intense way that I can lose perspective on things around me. So I'm really a lot more aware and conscious of that now and I make sure I've got things like that. His follow-up book was great. I really enjoyed that. I actually read that and bought it for a mutual friend of ours, Tim, Matt Target for his birthday last year in December.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  11. “For me, that works. I cover the areas, the topics that have been on my mind, or the situation. Normally it's more of a situation for me day to day. I'm pretty good. It's more I've come across something that's sustained stress or I can't work through myself. And look, to be honest, that seems to be happening a little bit less in my life. But in saying that, I know it could intensify at any point in time. And I recognize that you've got to always stand top of those things. And it's been great for the work that I do now and the life that I have and the dad that I am. I think I've just improved across so many different areas. And it's probably where I refer back to sport. I'm like, damn, I wish I used that sports psychologist a lot more and tapped into that. I didn't even recognize vulnerability for a split second throughout basically my entire career. And I feel like that was a bit of a disaster now. And it actually probably would have set me up better for post-sport career as well.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  12. “When I go over and stay with Michael, we'll go out and I'll say something and he'll repeat it for me. And I was like, yeah, what he said because everyone's sort of looking at me like I've got two heads. So bullet points is exactly what I jot down. Yeah, double points. Yeah.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  13. “I think you probably got the sense through the chat. You know, Michael and I were very analytical. We think through everything and every situation and every outcome. That's the reason we know every time with respect to our events.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  14. “I have a guy who I tap into, and he's almost got a comical element to the style, which I really like. So I love that because he's extremely intelligent, very, very bright. And look, I'll write down the things that I'm feeling and that I feel like I've got to really check in with and get through and ask questions about. So I'll do that. So that's the structure I come in with. He'll then just pull out stuff on all of that. makes it takes the emotion out of it almost. It almost goes, it's more pragmatic. He goes, you know, this is why that would happen. This is why you feel like that. You know what? You kind of catastrophizing that. That's not as big as you seem. And then you'll make, you know, comparisons and perspectives around other people or other situations. And it kind of gives you a different view. And it's like he just comes in and provides these additional lenses that I didn't have that he's just given me. And I kind of cover off all the topics like that. And then we have a laugh through it all too once you kind of get on the other side of each of those areas. And so I find that that's.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  15. “Said it goes into just let's just stuff it back in there with the others and I don't let that happen anymore. So yeah, it's just its mood more than anything else. And if it's a sustained poor mood, then yeah, that's the thing that I go, okay, we've got to do something about this. in a situation where I've got twins from a previous marriage and I miss them like crazy when they're not here and the impact that that had on me for so many years that I failed to even really talk about has been a big thing that I just highlight now and I'll just go to Shelley and I'm just like I'm really you know missing Jagger or Charlie's or you know and I'll just start to talk about it and then all of a sudden you know you kind of get on the other side of that so they're kind of the things that I recognize now that that aren't as big a blind spots as they were previously”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  16. “I mean, we spoke about anger before. Michael was talking about that and the way he's able to channel it. And look, there's a negative connotation with anger because it's not always a bad thing. Sometimes anger can push you to get more out of yourself, to deliver an outcome that is amazing. But sometimes it can, when you're kind of, you're edgy, you're irritable, you're, you know, you're not sleeping well. Things just aren't escaping the mind. I think all those kind of little red flags that sort of start to add up and compound and you're just not removing that stress, that weight. They're kind of the things that you start to recognize and go, hey, I'm going through a bit of, you know, this is not just a one-off right now. This is not a two-off. This is kind of been a little bit more sustained than what I would like. And I think I have a much greater ability to check in with that now than what I've ever had where before. It would be like that little box that I...”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  17. “I do, if I've gone through a hard sort of period, I won't say on a consistent sort of week to week, month to month basis. But if I am going through a stressful period, I've definitely got that support network there. And I'll jump online, have a talk, get it out. Because sometimes, and I've learned this too, I didn't have really use a sports psychologist too much when I was swimming because I always thought, you know, I was invincible and that was a weakness if I had to tap into that. Little did I know that would have really helped me and I might have had a better trophy cabinet than what I've got if I recognize that at the time. But now sometimes family members, I know I spoke about significant other them, but I know family members sometimes aren't necessarily the ones you should be tapping into because the emotion is just too close. So having someone a little bit more objective, has the skill set, has the understanding, someone you can have a different type of conversation with is really important. So definitely.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  18. “Along the way, but I just know what makes me feel like more of me now and feels like a purpose and the things that help support and maintain that”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  19. “That makes me, you know, because I've been through this stuff with her, you know, like, and, you know, we've spoken about how we're there for Michael. And, you know, Charlene's the same for me. That partnership of someone who gets you, like she gets me. She gets my drive and ambition and yet that other mental sort of fault that whatever you want to call it, vulnerability, those things that are imperfect. She gets that and she likes it and works with me on it. And so I think I haven't necessarily had the right partnerships in life as well. So I think, Tim, that's a really important part of who you're surrounding yourself by. But that significant other can make and break in many respects too, because they've got to connect with a unique personality, which I know Michael and I certainly share uniqueness like that. So they're kind of the things that really matter. And look, it's been a journey to get to know all those things because I've made so many mistakes.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  20. “Make sure that I get enough sleep. That's really important for me. I eat very healthy. And the one thing that I still find difficult that I do, and we just touched on it, is I talk about it. I talk about where I'm at, how I'm feeling, why I'm feeling like that instead of bottling it up. Michael and I, we're the kings of compartmentalizing things and actually just locking them away. I'll deal with that box when I need to deal with that box. But unfortunately, that box is growing and being fueled. And when it goes, and it's not good, it's not good at all. And Michael and I know this best. So I try and jump into that box and I try and work through it, try and get it out. And so I think for me, it's all that sort of proactive stuff that I'm doing. And I feel more settled in my life now than I ever have. And you know what? And I know this with Nicole because I know, you know, Michael's wife extremely well and the wonderful human being that she is, just how good she is for Michael in that situation and how much he cares and loves him. It's actually beautiful to watch.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  21. “I think just doing everything proactively, I exercise like Michael six days a week. I'd try and make myself have a recovery day, which is hard when you've got personalities like ours. We know the importance of recovery, but we just like to keep going and going and going. So that's one thing. The other thing that I do, it's funny I went to stop sort of drinking for a year. And then I got to a year and I was kind of like, you know what? I don't even feel like drinking anymore. It kind of, and it's not like I was ever a person who drank every day by any means. It would be fire and few between, but I could go hard if we were, you know, having a night with the boys or something like that, or use it to escape. So, you know, I stopped drinking. So full stop, like I got to a year and I was like, you know what? I don't even feel like that anymore. It's not something in my life that I value or I like or it brings value to me. So I don't do that. I also.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  22. “And he was my biggest supporter. And, you know, when I went and did therapy and got some help, he was a guy drove me there and dropped me off. And we had talks till 2, 3 a.m., sometimes, you know, later in the morning. And he'd come in and wake me up in the morning with the dogs and boomer crawling on the bed all over me, which I really appreciated. Know it's those sorts of times where we'll just always be there for each other, but people see us as these people who have achieved great things and won multiple Olympic gold medals and world records and all that sort of stuff. But yeah, just because you're good at something doesn't mean that you don't fall into the same fate as everybody else when it comes to mental health or just being a human. And yeah, I had to learn those things definitely the hard way.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  23. “And so it's like, you know, and then I'm like, wow, I feel better afterwards, that open and honest transparency. And my relationship is better as well. So it's like, wow, doing this vulnerability thing, which was the number one thing that I found I had to tap into going through those stages in life and phases whenever they embark upon you. And they come across at the weirdest times too. Like even when things are great and going well, sometimes that can be a low point after that that you have to deal with that. So yeah, I mean, I made that decision back in 2017. I basically lived with Michael most of that year.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  24. “If I start talking about the way I'm feeling in isolation, I'm going through a stressful period and she goes, she is so proud of me. She goes, I just love it when you're vulnerable. And I said, I feel like a bit of a pussy, to be honest. But yeah, cool.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  25. “My phone on WhatsApp on my email and on my SMS within about a three hour time frame. And I think I got back to three people and Michael was one of them. And Alison Schmidt, who lived with Michael too, were the only people that I got back to. And I think I used words like, oh, I'm just scared. And everyone thinks you're invincible for what you've done. But, you know, like everybody else, you just have those vulnerabilities. And when it's so public, it just exaggerates the situation and amplifies it and creates another layer of complexity that you have to deal with. And I just made a commitment to myself, I think, at the end of that, that I'm never going to allow myself to get to this spot again. Like anytime that I feel like you're getting pushed to that edge or things are going wrong, I'm just going to adopt the strategies that I now know instead of denial. Because I would always put myself in denial. I wouldn't let myself be vulnerable. And even my fianc ⁇, Charlene, now.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  26. “I remember I've been through the ups and downs and I really never recognized that about myself because I just kind of thought, okay, just put your boots back on and keep going. But a few years ago when I went through a really public divorce here in Australia and everything that followed from that and innuendo and speculation and people questioning your value set just undid me. And I just didn't realize how much it undid me and how much it took me down. You know, I got to a point where in early 2017, you know, just kind of one more thing. It's one more thing where I was sitting in a hotel room completely isolated. Two security guards on that floor so no one would come near my room, sitting on the front page of the newspaper and the news, just what's going on with me. And then I think the four days that I had there, and I was texting Michael at the time, I literally had over a thousand messages.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  27. “The first thing I'll say at the outset, it's really funny as an athlete, you were told from day one, I mean, I started swimming when I was four and being competitive when I was five. So everything throughout my childhood and throughout my sporting career was, hey, if there's an obstacle, go through it, overcome it, beat it, you're injured, you're sick, whatever. Just turn into a gladiator and just keep going forward. That is your job. So, and it was almost like adversity was your friend. And you used to, I call the expression now with mental health. It's like I got used to Iron fisting my way through different periods in life. And that's not right. That's great as an athlete. That's a great attribute to have to push through pain and overcome those challenges to get the outcome. But in life, that actually doesn't work. And I found that out the hard way. And I realize how real mental health was. So I think, you know, for me.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  28. “Been through a whole heap of emotions just listening to that. Just going back to 2018 and that day when Michael was not Michael or was Michael, just the other side of success. So I just think, you know, it was tough to listen to that. I actually have water in my eyes just listening to it because it was, you know, seeing one of your best mates that you've known for so long and been through everything together. Just go through that. It was brutal. It was really, really tough.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  29. “It's the only sport where you want loose angle ankles. You look at tennis players, they've got all the support in place. We're doing the opposite. We'll have a panel of wood where you've got a strap across the top and you chuck your foot in there and you're leaning back to try and create more flexion and angle. And that's the thing. Like Michael and Ian Thorpe are incredibly flexible and incredibly strong and incredibly mobile. And I didn't have that last part around the mobility that these guys have because think about it. Your feet are like flippers in the water. So if you get that extra bit of angle and you get that flick right at the end, it's going to propel you just that little bit more. And, you know, I'm sitting here at an Olympic Games where I got two silver medals. I think it's over the course of about 1,200 meters of racing. And thereby 0.2 of a second in total. So, you know, every little bit matters.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  30. “We were just so anal and just so focused on recovery and trying to find ways to go, okay, the body is gone. How am I going to get it back to Michael's point? This is not a tractor. It's a Ferrari. And if a bolt's a little bit loose, this thing will not perform. So everything has got to be right. I used to walk somewhere. I would sit down as soon as I got there, just so my hip flexors wouldn't tighten up because I wasn't as good a kicker as what Michael was or Ian Thorpe. So I had to do everything on my legs. I was better on the upper body. I could do that. I could pull. It's called pulling. Just, you know, you sort of tie your legs up and, you know, swim with your arms only. That was my strength, but my lower wasn't. So I used to just be fixated on that every minute of the day to make sure whenever I rocked up to training and particularly competition, my legs were loose, my hip flexors had full range and I was going to get the most out of them. So yeah, it's an obsession and that's the way it needs to be.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  31. “What's good for one person is not necessarily good for another, but what I know today is if I just did a lot more meditation, a lot more things of slowing down, a lot more mindfulness, those are the sorts of things that would have helped me.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  32. “And I check these stats like there's no tomorrow. Like, I'm still a professional athlete. I think you just hardwired to be like that And it depends what phase you're going through your career. You know, there's points where I had injuries and my shoulder would just be, my shoulders would be aching at night. So I'd be sitting there with bags of peas on my shoulders just to get the inflammation down. And, you know, there's so many different sort of cycles throughout my career where, yeah, you'd have trouble sleeping. Sometimes I would feel that the pressure too much coming into competitions after time for some reason. And those are the difficult times where you need your recovery more than ever, but you're finding it hard to be able to get that rest.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  33. “I always found some of the apps are great. I actually used to put on one of these apps that used to just have the rainwater coming down and falling on the leaves and those sorts of just calming type of things Really funny today, the best way I find to fall asleep is just breathing exercises and just focusing away from everything that kind of matters in your life around work. The things that you're responsible for that normally keep you awake at night. It's quite funny to Michael's point just around recovery, you know, sleep is obviously the ultimate thing to rest the body. And I track everything. I'm sitting here with one watch on one hand, another one on the other hand, and I don't even know if either of them tell the time, but they're tracking my heart rate variability. They're tracking my sleep, they're tracking my recovery.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  34. “From a lot of the physiologists out there. So I always just try to take it to the next level every single time. I knew with my event, which probably is different to some of the finesse that Michael had in his events in terms of his underwater and skills, for me it was about being tough. And he's trained with a great 1500 meters swimmer called Eric Vance. So he knows the intensity and the mindset. And I was very similar to Eric in terms of If you have to pull me out of the water after this session and put me in an ambulance, I do not care as long as I get every ounce out of myself. And you've got to show up with that attitude every day because that's how tough the guys are that you're racing. And it's just the way it is. And I think when you get the wins, it keeps you going, right? It keeps you going to the next step. It makes the bits a little bit more digestible. And I just love that feeling. I just love that feeling afterwards. And I knew when I rocked up to race day that if I'd done that work, that no one was ever going to touch me in my race.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  35. “Yeah. So, I mean, that degree of application is one thing, but you're right. You have to be doing a better, faster, harder than the guy on the other side of the world. And I think the goal, the outcome was just so strong, the desire. And I think when something is so meaningful and purposeful to you as an individual, you're willing to do anything. And it's funny, the body does get used to it to an extent. You get used to getting up at 4.45, you know, doing that eight kilometers, doing it to the intensity that you need to, then going into the gym for 90 minutes, doing that, then going back in the afternoon and doing it all again. And it's amazing how much more you can absorb than what you give yourself credit for. But one of the things I always tried to do is whenever my coach would set something like an insanely hard set, and if I finished it, I would do one or two more reps. And he was known as, you know, having one of the top three intense programs in the world.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  36. “Yeah, I think first and foremost around the 30 to 40 hours, that's right. We would train anywhere from kind of five to seven hours a day, six days a week. I know Michael would do seven days a week. I think he trained like 530, 540 days straight into Beijing. So he knows all about that. Yeah. What was that?”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  37. “And I keep testing it, right? Because I'll start ginging him up before that hole just to see if my theory about him is correct. And 100% of the time I am proven right. So that's probably one of the other things about Michael. And, you know, that's an interesting characteristic that I haven't seen in many athletes across a lot of sports that are able to have that ability to increase performance to that extent because of maybe a slight bit of criticism or questioning. So that was one of the other things I really noticed about him very, very quickly.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  38. “Michael is the sort of guy that you never ever want to say that he's not going to do something. You never want to be critical of Michael because he will stick it so far up you it's not funny and not many competitors do that if I actually said something about one of my competitors or tried to intimidate them a little bit not even meaning to half the time it would get under their skin It could almost go into their performance in an Very early on, even when we play golf today, if I'm betting on him on the last hole, it's like this intensity of focus and athletic prowess and everything else you can imagine that makes you great just comes into play, even if he's had the worst 17 holes beforehand.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  39. “And so I saw just how creative and innovative in the sport that he was. And he was just a great guy. I just enjoyed hanging out. We go out to dinner and do things together. And I think that the basis of our friendship was kind of in 2003 kind of springboarded from there. And every time we saw each other at meets, because we'd obviously be traveling all the time, we just always connected and got along well. And we had a lot of mutual respect for each other. What each other was bringing to the sport. And also, there was another sort of counterpart of mine, Ian Thorpe, who's through that era. And I think both Michael and I had a lot of respect for Ian. So, you know, we'd all spent a lot of time together and respect what each other was doing for the sport at that time too.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  40. “Back in 2003, Michael and his coach, Bob, just came over to Australia for a coaching conference. And so he spent a few weeks in Australia. So he ended up training then. And I think at that point in time, we really got to know each other. And I saw Michael's level of application towards his training and all the new things that he was trying to bring to the sport, like the underwater off every single war, which, you know, for your listeners, Tim, not too many people know, but when you're in the middle of a race and you're at like the 200, 300, 400 meter mark and then you try and push and go 15 meters off the wall, it is one of the most difficult things that a person can ever do. It's like a free diver, right? And the last little bit of holding their breath. It is tough. And Michael started doing all these sorts of things that I thought, man, I wonder if that'll actually work.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  41. “So, and then I couldn't believe that a 16-year-old actually did that, and I got to know Michael from that moment moving forward. And then, you know, then we got to train together. And I think I just saw eye to eye on Michael on things, like the approach towards swimming, the approach towards competition.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  42. “That's close to fourth though, so it's right next to it. I remember just thinking, wow, what a freak a 15 year old's gone fifth. I wonder if we'll ever hear of him again. And then the next year when he broke the tournament of Butterfly World record at the World Championships, was that 152? Am I right on that?”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  43. “It's really funny. I remember hearing Michael. I mean, there's a lot happening in our country right now because it's a 20 year anniversary since the Sydney Olympic Games. So there's plenty going on. And that was Michael's first Olympics. And I remember when he got fourth, I think in the 200 meter fly there and it was like a 15 year old on the swim team. What was it fifth? Come on, man.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  44. “It's quite funny. I think just when Michael was talking that, I started thinking of the movie Days of Thunder, when they're in the wheelchair in the hospital and they come up. Push forward, and then the other one pushes forward. That's exactly how Michael and I train together. It's just constantly pushing each other and trying to take it to the next level. And you just disregard the pain in that. The goal is always more important. The outcome is always more important than what you have to go through. I think that's the way we always approached it.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  45. “Yeah, absolutely. No, that was the excruciating. But you still want to see your stats afterwards. It's like the Olympics is over. That's the last day always of the Olympics. And, you know, you would have been doing the 4x1 medley probably that day as well. And you still want to do everything. Like, you know, see what quickly you remove the lactate out of your muscles after you cool down. And that's one thing that Michael and I always share is the stats. Like we can pull out any swimming time, any split, any world record split. We know it back to front.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  46. “Know it's funny, it was never that high after my 15, but I think I hit about a 12 after that, where the 200 I could hit a 13 or 14 and the 15 would normally be like a 9, but I'd produce. There because the oxygen saturation wasn't going down. My blood, so yeah, so it went up. That's a good point. No one's actually ever mentioned that MP.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  47. “It's not good, Tim. Let me tell you that The way I describe that race is like putting handcuffing someone to a treadmill, putting on a max incline, max speed, and then just going for 15 minutes. The intensity of the pain. Normally, where I felt that intense pain at the thousand meter mark, I felt at the 500 meter mark in that race. And it's excruciating those thresholds that you have to go through. So, yeah, to push myself through that, the funniest thing about that race, I hadn't lost it in eight years at that particular point in time. I was going to last 100 meters and it was the first time it actually turned with someone next to me with 100 meters to go. And I actually came home faster in the last 100 meters than what I did than when I broke the world record by seven seconds three years earlier. So it actually taught me the value of competition in my worst situation that I can actually extrapolate or get more out of myself, even feeling like that. But the pain was, yeah, I actually said I'm going to retire. If I can't get better after those Olympics, I'm actually going to retire from the sport because I didn't want to race like that again.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  48. “So, when that was done, because I'm referring to actually the stats in 2004, it's 160 above what it should be for my heart. My age at the time. So, yeah, it was 12.63 liters my total on capacity. So yeah. One of those genetic things that helps”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  49. “Was breaking the American record by about 12 seconds doing a personal best time. And so it pushed me to the nth degree. And that was brutal. I came home. I went under a CAT scan and they said, oh, there's a massive lump on your lungs. We're going to have to inject you with iodine just to see what's going on. And, you know, they said, oh, it's a big ball. And, you know, they inject me with iodine, had a look. They said, oh, it's okay. It's okay. And I said, what do you mean? Is it okay? And they said, well, your lower left lobe has got no oxygen for it for so long that it's actually just deflated and it's just sitting up in a big ball. And I've got a huge lung capacity of 12.6 liters. And apparently that took something like a quarter of it off. So that race to win that gold medal was the most painful moment that I've ever had in my career. And yeah, but probably the most rewarding at the same time. But certainly after that, I promised I would never, never race like that again. And Michael knows how much of a sore spot that 4x2 freestyle relay.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  50. “Yeah, that was a particularly tough Olympics for me. That year, I actually got pneumonia at the start of the year because I was just overtraining. I got a little bit sick and never missed a session. And, you know, I used to do sort of 8K on average per session and used to flog myself. And then I got pneumonia, went to hospital. That turned into a chronic chest infection because I didn't stop training as soon as I came at a hospital because I couldn't because I'd miss the Olympic Games. And then when I got to the Olympics in Athens in 2004, I then one objective was to win three gold medals. And I got two gold medals both by 0.1 of a second, two silver medals, sorry by 0.1 of a second and wasn't too happy about that. Then I raced the 1,500 meter freestyle and I actually had to do it with a partially collapsed lung on my left side because it was blocked with mucus for so long that that race, I probably pushed myself through more pain than I've ever had. And one of Michael's teammates, Larson Jensen.”

    2021-01-21 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #494: Michael Phelps and Grant Hackett — Two Legends on Competing, Overcoming Adversity, Must-Read Books, and Much More · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT