YouSaid · the spoken record

Matt Pottinger

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2024-05-08
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2024-05-08
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  1. “Only say one thing, which is that service is really good stuff, like a life of service, whether it's military service or teaching, but public service is one of the best mistakes I stumbled into in my life. So especially for your young listeners. And I joined the Marine Corps at 32 and wouldn't trade that experience for anything.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  2. “The best part of the story is my commander, my platoon commander, is looking at me. I mean, I'm just a mess, right? I mean, I've been unconscious. And Captain Gaskell, who is my platoon commander, says, hey, do you know where you're going? And I said, you know, to the infirmary. He says, No, you're going straight back in. And so I get my mask fixed and then I go and do the whole thing again. And it worked out. One of Back on the horse, son. I lost some IQ points that I never got back from that whole incident, unfortunately.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  3. “Entire throat closed off And I passed out and I slid down the wall. And I ended up getting carried out on the back of a fellow lieutenant. And so here you've got a whole company of Marines getting ready to go through. And I'm the first one out. And they lay me down on the ground, stripped my mask off. And everyone at first thought it was a joke, that it was meant to just kind of like spook them. And then they saw that I was deep, deep purple, like blue and not breathing. And one of the corporals, it was a sergeant, came over and literally was about to give me mount the mouth and was sort of pushing my chest and so forth. And then I sprung up to my feet again. Mean instantly, like you know, wild wake up. And apparently I turn from purple to blue to green in front of everyone's faces. And a couple of lieutenants started puking.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  4. “And because I was either insufficiently attentive, but also because I was still getting acquainted with the gear, one of the valves was partway open. So you get these two like coin size valves on the side where one side, depending on which side you hold your rifle on, you put the canister there that filters out the gas. So when I got in there, I cleared the mask and put it back on, but I was sucking in pure CS gas through this whole gaping hole in the front of my mask. And anyone who tells you that tear gas isn't lethal is full of shit, you can easily die from this stuff. And I ended up asphyxiating my...”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  5. “The Marine Corps talks a lot about both physical courage but also moral courage. So moral courage is more important. It's this idea that you will do the right thing when no one's looking. The idea that you will sacrifice yourself, not your integrity or your honor, but your position in order to make sure that the right thing gets done, even when it exposes you to ridicule and moral courage isn't something that people talk about a lot in everyday life. I'll tell you one funny quick story you just reminded me of because we're talking about the basic school. You have to do gas chamber training where you put on a gas mask and you run into this concrete hut which they fill with CS tear gas. And I was in the first wave to go through this and they're teaching you how to wear the mask, how to clear the mask so that you take the mask off and then learn how to clear it.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  6. “In it and where young 20 year old, 19 year old Lance Corporal or Corporal has immense responsibility, very, very quickly.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  7. “Is that the Marine Corps in particular pushes down responsibility, delegates to the lowest level? So the idea is, think about how many things in American life are about, we're going to give opportunity to the guy who's at the top. The creme de la creme de la creme de la creme. We're going to keep skimming and giving you unlimited opportunity to achieve your goals, to achieve fame and fortune. Marine Corps is the opposite. It says, I want to know who the worst guy is in your platoon, and I want to make sure that you're pulling him up so that the baseline is impressive. Now you're talking about an organization that is incredibly effective because the worst guy is pretty good. So it's very much about the focus is on the bottom layer of the pyramid. And the officers just have the privilege of being custodians for a while and being able to lead a group that has leadership already imbued.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  8. “Now you're suddenly feeling real responsibility. It's like, holy shit, I'm not responsible for myself in war. I'm responsible for a platoon of 40 young men and women. It's a shock. And, you know, I didn't have any leadership skills naturally. Everything I learned had to get pounded into me through repetition and screaming and making mistakes and touching the electric fence and finding out it hurts. And it was really something. The other thing about the Marine Corps that people should all know, and this goes for the military generally.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  9. “I don't smell it on you that you're going to be a good leader of those Marines whose lives you're going to be responsible for and putting at risk, then I'm not going to let you march across the grinder and become a Marine officer. You're not going to pin those lieutenant bars on. And so this culture where suddenly”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  10. “Funny. I mean, one of the first things you learn, you just inhabit your own head all the time. That's what we do when we walk around. You're being human. It's called being human. And you come into this thing and they're like, hey, this isn't about you. You're like, well, what do you mean? I made a decision to be here. They're like, no, no. We had this great colonel, Colonel Chase, who was running the Officer Candidate School. He's a former enlisted guy. He had been a drill instructor. Now he's a colonel running the officer candidate school. And he gives his talk. It was very personal. It was visual. It was because he had been a drill instructor too. And he basically said none of you are going to make it through here if I don't believe that you're going to be a good leader of Marines. And this was a promise. This was a threat. And he held to it. I heard that he got in trouble for tritting so many officer candidates at a time when we were at war that he got some shit for that. But I'm proud of him, irrespective of whether that's true. He basically winnowed out almost half of the group of us. And he basically said, if I don't see it.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  11. “Trains me to be ready and trains me so well that by the time I get to Officer Candidate School, I'm actually near the front of the pack, at least on the physical aspect, because I'm not a big guy. I'm light. You know, he got me so I could do 20 pull-ups, dead hang pull-ups, and I could run my ass off. And then I was in for the shock of actually going through 10 weeks of officer candidate school training, six months of the basic school training to become a provisional rifle platoon commander, and then Intel training after that. It was an unbelievable organization and culture.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  12. “That's what you're going to ask me. The Marines who guard our embassies around the world every year for the Marine Corps' birthday when it was founded November the 10th, they put together a ball where they invite dignitaries and the ambassador and foreign attaches and so forth. And I got invited to one of these things and I end up meeting this Marine Captain who's in his dress blues and I tell him, I got to let you in on something. My family doesn't know this. My employers don't know this. But I just have to spill my guts to you. I'm thinking of joining the Marine Corps. And so within two days at SunUp, I'm at a stadium with him in the middle of Beijing. And he's PTing me, giving me physical training. We're doing sprints and interval training around the workers' stadium. And this guy becomes my personal trainer. He just kicks my ass. His name's Cedric Lee. He's still in. He's a colonel now in the Marine Corps working at the White House. And Cedric Lee.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  13. “I discover that I'm out of shape and I meet a marine who is studying in Beijing. He's a captain and he's there doing an Olmsted Foundation scholarship, which is like, you know, you can go study in a foreign university for a year or two. And he's getting his master's degree is such a great Marine Corps moment because I'm a nobody, I'm a stranger. But I meet him at the Marine Corps birthday ball, which I don't know if you've ever any city you go to in the world. I've never been.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  14. “No, no, it was sort of out of body experience, like the logic became more and more apparent as I made those tentative steps. And then it came to feel almost inevitable. What if I don't do this? I have a happy job. I'll become a bureau chief in one of the Wall Street Journal offices. I love the Wall Street Journal. I love reporting. But I also had this sense that if I don't do this, I may regret it because this is the moment where I'm supposed to serve. We're in two wars. They're not going well. If I don't serve now, I won't be able to serve. I'll be too old to do it. So I need to do this gut check and see if this is something I'm up to. And it became a test of myself, too. It was a self-test.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  15. “Around that time, who challenges me to go visit a recruiting station. I couldn't even believe it. It was actually an officer selection office, right? It's a recruiting office for officers of the Marine Corps. And I started reading up on the Marine Corps. I ended up taking an appointment and going down to the USS Intrepid, which is the aircraft carrier museum on the Hudson River.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  16. “By that tsunami day after Christmas 2004, I got scrambled down to Thailand to cover that story and ended up pulling back from the devastation along the beach where I'm interviewing family members, survivors of this thing. And I went up to Udapau Air Base, which was an old air base in Thailand that the US used to use during the Vietnam War, except it was bustling again with American troops who had all arrived basically to carry out the humanitarian response to that tsunami. And the guy who was in charge was a Marine met a bunch of these young kids who were like, I couldn't even make coffee when I was 20. And here you had corporals who were leading squads of Marines and they were really gung-ho and proud of the work they were doing to help get humanitarian stuff out there. So anyway, one thing leads to another night. Suddenly I meet a Marine Colonel.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  17. “Watching out of the corner of my eye as the US went into Afghanistan and then ultimately in 2003 decided to invade Iraq. And by 2004, as I'm watching these developments, it became clear to me that the war in Iraq was going very badly. We had the two battles of Fallujah. It was metastasizing into really an insurgency. And then there was sort of a confluence of a bunch of different influences in my life. My stepfather had been an Air Force officer. His dad flew B-17s in World War II. I grew up with those stories and with a strong sense of respect for military service. As a result, they were both West Point grads. I also met a bunch of Marines in quick succession by Happenstance. You know, I don't know if you remember the Indian Ocean tsunami that struck the Indian Ocean country, Southeast Asia, you know, devastating. A quarter million or so people were killed.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  18. “I'm going to be talking to Paul Steiger and John Bussy, the top editors at the journal. I want to tell them what I want to work on. I want to tell them what I've been working on and some of the ideas I have. And I'm exhausted. I'm jet lagged. Let's just sleep in and you can just drive me straight in. I'm going to grab a bagel for the car ride. So as we were headed into town, we got the news that the towers had been hit while we're listening to the talk radio, a.m. talk radio. And as it unfolded, became clear and clear what had happened. This wasn't an accident. It was something much more serious than that. We left the city before we'd even really gotten deep into it, went back home, and I stewed on that. I mean, I was absolutely in a state of shock about the September 11 terrorist attacks. I ended up going back to the bureau and writing in Beijing and in Hong Kong and other places in China for the next few years.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  19. “I spent my 20s for the most part as a reporter writing for Reuters in the Wall Street Journal in China. I spent, you know, eight or nine years in total, either as a student or as a reporter living in China. It was a great, exciting time to be there through the 90s into the early 2000s. But I had a near miss on September the 11th. I was coming back from our Hong Kong Bureau to visit the editor, the managing editor, and the foreign editor of the Wall Street Journal. And our office happened to be right across the street from the World Trade Center. So the World Financial Center was the old Wall Street Journal headquarters at that time. And I had gotten in the day prior, my father, who lives in Westchester County, New York, said, I've got an idea. I'll drive you into town tomorrow. You're right there at the World Financial Center. Why don't we get breakfast at Windows on the World in the World Trade Center? And I said, look, I've got to prepare my story ideas.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  20. “Yeah, I mean, President Biden has given some good speeches. You know, when he first came into power, people rarely read strategy documents. I wish the press would do a better job of reading them because the president took the time to write an introduction to his strategic guidance six weeks into his administration. And he said, we're facing a serious moment right now that's going to determine whether the world is predominantly democratic, law-abiding, peaceful, or whether it's going to be authoritarian, anti-democratic, violent. And so I'd like to hear him talk more about that, but then also to follow up with more policies that show that we're doing something about those problems. That's where I think the disconnect has been with President Biden. But I think those speeches were admirable.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  21. “Secretary of State. This is not a country that we're going to be able to do business with amiably. This is not a leader who has declared himself essentially an agent of chaos in the world and who's funding anti-democratic and anti-American propaganda. That's not someone who we're going to be able to resolve problems with. Okay, so we need to be a bit more real. We need to impose more costs. We need to be rhetorically sharper in drawing the distinctions between who we and our allies are and other democracies.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  22. “Saying, look, we are a country that navigates by a North Star that is really worthy of navigating by. Even though we don't reach the North Star, when we deviate from that path, we know that we're on the wrong path. So we have to keep going towards those higher human ideals, the things that the founders framed in the declaration and in the Constitution. These are very powerful ideas and things that we should continue to try to live by, but by speaking more openly about those things, we should also not be afraid to be candid about what distinguishes our system from ones that are actually pretty dark. I'm sorry, genocide in the year 2024 as recognized by a number of countries, as recognized by both Mike Pompeo when he was Secretary of State and by Tony Blinken when he was his.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  23. “People remember that he made this very hostile set of remarks about the Soviet Union. He called it an evil empire. He also talked about the legacy of evil in American history. He talked about slavery. I mean, can you imagine a Chinese leader or Putin giving a speech like that? It's impossible because they don't.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  24. “Exactly. The Kim family regime is spoils a lot of dinners at the holidays. But what you were facing now is a very significant decision by these unnatural partners to decide to work together because they believe they have a once-in-a-century opportunity right now to break the back of American credibility and American power. So first we have to recognize that as many problems as we have at home, and I'm the first That'll be another podcast for us to talk about We are a country that deals with those problems openly and with the participation of our citizenry and with the protection of the rule of law those are very very special things that we should not take for granted and we should actually be proud of them and own them and I think if we were to do that even as we talk openly about the legacy Ronald Reagan when he was president”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  25. “Iran is a more important partner. North Korea is a freakish, difficult partner, but a partner nonetheless. And then you've got Russia.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  26. “Because the nature of these Leninist systems or totalitarian systems that are more like monarchies like you have with Russia or North Korea today, they are compulsively hostile because they will never feel safe within their borders or confined to their borders when their neighbors are liberal democracies. It's just, you know, it doesn't matter how much you try to reassure them the nature of that kind of a system is that it is compulsively hostile. And so small countries are not going to have an easy time standing up to a juggernaut like the People's Republic of China so long as it is a totalitarian-Leninist system. And now China is stitching together an axis of these countries. Venezuela is one of the minor partners”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  27. “One thing we should first do is. Recognize that we are a very special country. We have to recognize that the things that the United States has made possible well beyond our borders, democracy, the Bill of Rights. Look at how many countries around the world have emulated that model. And yet that model is not sustainable without the United States. You can't have British successful parliamentary democracy today or in Denmark or in Japan if the United States does not remain the strongest democracy.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  28. “China's playing Go, we're playing checkers right now. If we can get our game up to playing chess against their go, we've got a chance.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  29. “It's a 19 by 19 board and famously up until recently a computer could never beat a pretty good human being at Go until Alco. It's been years and years that chess masters have been defeated by AI. And then, of course, you had Alpha Go a handful of years ago, which changed it and actually taught Go Masters new ways of approaching the game.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  30. “And Japan is another one, but I was told that a very outspoken wealthy Chinese guy was recently run over by a car in Japan. I have to double check the story. But what I was told from someone who's pretty well plugged into that community was it had a chilling effect, that people viewed this as an effort by Beijing to cause discomfort about even speaking your mind in a free country like Japan. So we should be getting creative about ways to neutralize that sort of terror. We should be identifying people who are conducting that sort of extra legal interference in our own system, people who are thugs, people who are coerced into spine. We should be focusing on that so that people feel safe in the United States.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  31. “To make them quiet. I talked to a friend recently when I was visiting Japan, a lot of very wealthy Chinese have moved to Hokkaido in northern Japan. And recently...”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  32. “We're not just going to repress our own people in our borders. We're not just going to threaten our people when they go abroad. We're going to threaten foreign citizens so that the things they say in their home country about us can be punishable under the national security law that's taken effect and has really undermined the autonomy and the rule of law of Hong Kong. So this is the new phase that people have to face up to. We should be helping, I mean, look, there's a mass exodus of people out of China right now. from China want to live in countries where they can enjoy the rule of law, where human rights are going to be respected, where they have a lot of different opportunities that they can pursue. They're leaving by the millions to go to other countries. I think that we should view those people as natural allies, but that means that you have to make some work. You have to take some steps because Beijing will use their families as hostages.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  33. “There are Hong Kong citizens who have now moved to the UK or they've moved to the United States. Many of them are now Americans or British citizens who still come under coercive pressure. I can think of a couple who their parents have been called in in Hong Kong. And there have been warrants issued for the arrest of American citizens for things they say about Hong Kong, not even in Hong Kong.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  34. “Which is used also as a surveillance tool. Don't put that on here. Put all your free society things onto this phone and then know that your other one is being monitored by Beijing, by the party. We should be doing much more for the Chinese diaspora that comes here to study. We should be giving them a shot at actually breaking free from this bubble of surveillance and censorship that follows them when they come to the United States. We should be breaking out of that.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  35. “Risky move, and she does have family in China. And one of her friends one day told her who was actually part of this organization, he made sure that their phones weren't on them, that were in another room. He said, I really like you. That's why I have to tell you we shouldn't talk anymore because I have to report back everything you tell me to handlers that ultimately, you know, go back to Beijing. And so here you have people who are coerced into spying on U.S. campuses on fellow students. And so I think this is something we should take a head on, you know, put a spotlight on it. I think we should be issuing a smartphone to every student who arrives from an authoritarian country in the United States. Make it a university program to say, this is your freedom phone. You can put any apps on here that you want. Don't put any Chinese apps on here. Don't put TikTok on here. They'll see everything. Don't put WeChat, Wei Sin, the Chinese app.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  36. “Tell us about some of the issues they were dealing with. And she had a friend on campus. She's from China. Her friend was from China. And she was organizing things having to do with the freedom of the Uyghur people and specific Uyghurs who are being held as political prisoners.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  37. “Association, which is actually reports to and is funded by the Chinese consulates and embassies. And they get special additional jobs. They're on 220 U.S. campuses. That's by an old count. They have people who organize protests against professors or students who are talking about things like Tibet or talking about the Uyghurs and the genocide there or talking about democracy in China or talking about Taiwan and all the great things about Taiwan. They will organize demonstrations because they have a playbook. That's actually one of the reasons that they've been constituted. And they also keep an eye on other Chinese students on campus who come from China. I met this terrific student who was at a university in the Midwest. I met her when she was still a student. I had a number of students come to the White House individually to...”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  38. “Yeah, a lot of them have the name friendship organizations. Okay. There's a whole plethora of these groups. And it looks like it's an organic sort of small movement of people saying, well, this is something we believe. We believe that Taiwan really needs to become part of China again. That's our personal view. But in fact, the funding is coming from the Communist Party. The group has a huge tail to it. It has information that's being fed to it about people that show promise that look like they're ideologically sympathetic or susceptible to some of those messages. And then it identifies up-and-coming politicians. They start to target and sometimes compromise a mayor who looks like someday he might be governor or even president. I'll give you another example are some of the student associations that look like, you know, we were in college. There are all kinds of student associations. But there's one, the Chinese students and scholars.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  39. “Between legitimate organization and espionage. So it's things that involve a lack of transparency about what the real goals are. But what it's designed to do is to spot and assess and recruit allies to the party's goals, but they don't always let you know that it is actually for the sake of the party's goals. You think it's just an individual group.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  40. “Sunshine is a good disinfectant. You know, if people understand what these modalities are, there have been a number of cases that MI5 and the UK and FBI here in the US have cracked that have involved people being approached through social media and things like LinkedIn. And you don't want to take money from strangers to share secrets and things that you know. You need to know who you're really dealing with. In that system, that type of activity always has to feed back into the party apparatus. It's what they're really good at. The Chinese Communist Party was really superior in many ways to the Soviet Communist Party because they perfected what's called United Front activity. Now, what is United Front? We don't use that word very often. It's a central concept in the history of the party, but especially under C Jinping. He is massively increased funding for United Front activity. What it is is it's something that...”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  41. “Getting more sophisticated about it. And of course, AI tools. I'm still waiting for our AI firmament, all these smart technologists who are developing these technologies to figure out how to use that to sniff out foreign government interference. And I don't have a good answer yet. But what I can tell you is that Beijing is experimenting with deep fakes. They create whole personas that look like Westerners speaking in very fluent local English or other languages so they're able to localize the messengers and to create them out of digits. So they look like Fraudulent or deceptive sorts of messages”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  42. “To seize the initiative in that dynamic and to become a protagonist again in the story. Xi Jinping is the protagonist. I don't mean that in the sense that he's the hero. I mean it in the sense that he is the one driving events by his own admission in his little meeting with Vladimir Putin. He's the protagonist of the story and it takes immense effort will coordination and guts to actually seize back the initiative and to become the protagonists again in the story because it's not a story that's going to end well if we let C continue writing it.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  43. “It would be very dangerous not to respect an adversary that's as committed and capable as they are. When I worked at the White House, when I was Deputy National Security Advisor, my boss was Robert O'Brien, who was the national security advisor at the time. I remember him once saying to me, doesn't Xi Jinping take off a weekend to play golf? It's just relentless, right? It's this constant and it takes enormous effort.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  44. “Until Beijing starts to back off of lighting or squirting lighter fuel on these conflagrations that are taking place now on multiple continents.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  45. “And as Xi Jinping was leaving the Kremlin, he was caught on camera saying, in essence, that he was not only benefiting from chaos, but that he was one of the architects of global chaos. What he said specifically to Putin was, Vladimir, you and I are seen changes occurring in the world that only happen once in a century. And this is a phrase Xi Jinping uses a lot. Opportunity that comes once every hundred years. And he's talking about the opportunity for China to become the global dominant power. And he said, you and I, Vladimir, are the ones driving those changes. So in essence, he was saying, we're the architects of turmoil. We are agents of chaos. And so it gives you some insight into the way that he's thinking about these things. That's why I would tell the president of the United States, step number one is impose massive costs on China's economy.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  46. “Chaos literally literally chaos. And it gets worse. He goes on in the speech to say that this works to China's advantage. He says that this trend of chaos will continue and the trends are in our favor. He also goes on to say that the risks of world turmoil are outweighed by the benefits to the Chinese Communist Party. Two years later, that was right before the Ukraine war went into overdrive. He signed an agreement. a no-limits pact with Putin in February of 2022 and less than three weeks later Putin was sending tanks in to try to take Kiev. Now, a year after that war began, Xi Jinping went to visit the Kremlin. He went to go see his best and most intimate friend. That's his own phrase, by the way. Xi Jinping says, my best, most intimate friend is Vladimir Putin. He went to go check in on his friend. See how the war is going? See what he needs.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  47. “Primarily about us because they view us as the main obstacle to a world vision that Xi Jinping calls a community of common destiny for all mankind. And that is his mark. Sounds good. I know. He's tied it to Marxist-Leninist theory that basically you would have a series of Leninist single-party dictatorships. And the United States is a big obstacle to that. So it's about spreading us thin. In 2021, Xi Jinping gave a speech where he said the most important word to describe the world today is chaos.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  48. “Guyana has a lot of energy deposits and they've discovered more. And so Maduro's just signed a law sort of claiming that the big, huge chunk of Guyana is actually Venezuelan territory. Guess who's backing him in that? Chinese Communist Party diplomatically, propagandistically. They're one of the main customers for the Venezuelans.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  49. “Yeah, that's number one imposing costs. You can't be an agent of chaos around the world to try to weaken the United States. By the way, the next one is Xi Jinping is backing the dictator in Venezuela. Maduro, to threaten his small neighbor Guyana. Why? Chaos. Like I said.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT

  50. “Number one, I would ask the president to call C Jinping to tell him that we are imposing significant costs on his economy in response for the support he is providing to Iran, which is waging terrorist proxy wars against us and Israel and others in the Red Sea and across the Middle East and so forth, as well as his support for Putin and the biggest war in Europe since 1945. Xi Jinping's the main backer of that war. He's the underwriter. The State Department says that Xi Jinping is spending more money on pro-Russian propaganda worldwide than Russia is spending on pro-Russian propaganda worldwide. I have no idea.”

    2024-05-08 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #736: A Strategic Deep Dive on TikTok, The Boiling Moat of Taiwan, and China’s Next-Gen Statecraft — Matt Pottinger, Former U.S. Deputy National Security Advisor · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT