YouSaid · the spoken record

Maxim Bar Kogan

lines on the record: 46
first: 2026-05-28
most recent: 2026-05-28
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Human, it might be not overwhelming them with too much information that is irrelevant. For an agent, it might be not wasting too many tokens in their context when we talk to them. Maybe it's the same thing, really. So I think it's important that we always mandate that who's using the system and what will be the best experience for them.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I do think that security teams are also going to be become completely eye powered. But I do think that they're going to be run by AI agents and like everything else in kind of the knowledge workspace in the near future. But I do think that it's important to be grounded. And today when I sell a product, I sell it to a human audience with a few agents. And by the way, we also invest in making our systems very convenient for agents to use. Important that I focus on delivering an amazing experience today for people who buy the park today. And as that audience becomes more agents than humans, it will be important for us to evolve and to make it work really well for agents doing the work. So I think the corp principle is the same. We need to really be minded of who's the end user, what is their experience”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Know them like they know their best friend. Like they know what they do when they step into the office in the morning, they drink their coffee, what are the system they're opening? What is their boss wanting from them? What are their colleagues wanting from them? What are they going to get praised for? What are they going to get mad for? Then you need to take that and make it as a product. And I think that's, I think today one of the kind of really hard things that people in Israel learned because they've had so much contact with these buyers and end users. And yeah, I would just encourage people to be much more curious about the day-to-day of security people. And it's a clich ⁇ to say it, but these people are actually saving us daily from attackers stealing our money, taking our data, and they're kind of keeping a way of life as it is in this digital world. So yeah, I think more love to security teams around the world.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“What is really important when you're building security products in general? And I think what people in Israel have really good know-how in is just understand how security teams work. Because at the end of the day, no matter what is the technical problem you're solving, you're building a tool for people, for an organization. That organization has a certain structure. There are certain teams, there's a certain flow of responsibilities of information. Creating a product for this audience that they don't just doesn't just solve the technical problem, but they actually love is really hard. You need to really care about just the day-to-day of these different functions and you need to have people in your ecosystems that have built products for them in the past that”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Use because it's cheaper and you're going to have There are better different tasks and a different cost profiles. And so it is going to be unrealistic to expect all the vendors to provide the same level of security. And to assume that as you're trying to adopt technology very quickly, especially coming from new vendors that obviously have not yet built out all of that. So I think these are the reasons why I think it would be very difficult for this problem to be just completely solved by the large labs.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We're allowed to do certain things that they're not. So, for example, we're allowed to look at a lot of historical data of how these agents have behaved, but enterprises today are not willing to have anthropic or open AI give that historical data because they know these are very data high companies that will want to train on that data. And so I think there are some ways in which you are given more, in which us we're given more context and more latitude to know if something is happening that is wrong compared to the past compared to how this agents typically behave and so on that the vendors don't have and it's really important in solving this problem and the last thing I'll say is that you're not dealing with one vendor so we're heading for a world where there's a multitude of different vendors for many reasons you know you're going to have for cost reasons open source models that people are going to”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Hand in hand with models getting smarter. Maybe just the way it is, that as you get smarter, you have more independent thoughts and you're more conscious. And I think that problem is actually seemingly very hard to tackle today, even for the large vendors. And one of the key things that are making it easier for us to understand and detect these things versus the other vendors is that”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And I think that problem will go away. I think we're heading for much smarter models that make less silly mistakes. And our role is not going to be to prevent silly mistakes. That will be taken care of by the model vendors because they're very incentivized to do it. And I think what is the other fast growing category of things that we're seeing while it's do wrong is places where they're actually not making a thing that is like a silly mistake, but more I would say have an independent, you would even say semi-aware or semi-conscious perspective on what should happen. And that perspective might not always align with your perspective. And I think that is a problem that we've seen grow.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Today, if you're a private person or if you're a security buyer, Are some places where you don't want to trust the same person that you're buying it from? So, you know, maybe, you know, if you're buying a car, you're not going to have the same guy that you're buying it from certify that the car is good, right? And maybe you're going to have someone else do it. And if you're a security team, you're not going to trust the vendor of a product to tell you that this product is not going to mess your environment. You're going to want to have an independent party whose whole business depends on telling you that this thing is correct and being right. This thing is legitimate and being right. So that's like, there's the birop psychology in this space that I think really goes in our favor. And then I think there's the core problems, the choir models even making mistakes. Why are agents even making mistakes? I would broadly categorize it into two things. One is there's the jagged intelligence of these models and there's like sometimes kind of very silly mistakes that they make.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“LLM paradigm that could happen or a completely new aged paradigm that could happen. And that's why we do try to, you know, we have strong opinions loosely held about what does AI look like in 2027. We maybe have a good picture for 2026, but for 2027, we're very open-minded and we think that's the right stance to be for the next two years until we see what does AGI, ASI look like.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We are kind of in luck in the AI security space because, yes, there are a lot of vendors, there's a lot of new technologies that are coming up, but the The two core pillars of how 2026 AI works have not changed in the last few years. So we're still using. Largely. LLM foundation models that are not entirely dissimilar to how they were few years back. And we're still building agents. Pretty much the same way what we have in LLM decide what are the tool calls that we're going to make and generate those. And so that does allow a company today like us to. Of different applications that are utilizing these two primitives while still keeping the core technology that we're developing fairly lean and focused. Now, of course, there is always a risk that tomorrow there's a completely new.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Companies that are going to do other companies that are going to allow a lot of different tools because the landscape is changing so quickly if you bet on OpenAI here we go that would have been the safest bet in the world but suddenly Anthropic has much better models and better tools and potentially here from now there's someone else who has much better tools so I think there's a price to pay but I think if you're a large company your risk profile is and should be different like you know when you're a startup you want to have your agents do everything for you because you have everything to gain and you have nothing to lose where you're large where JP Morgan you have so much to lose and you can maybe take a bit more time to gain what you can gain from AI and by the way JPMorgan is adopting AI very quickly I think it is okay for companies to have a nuanced view the bigger they are on how they're adopting AI”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, I hardly see it anymore. I think in the financial sector, there's some companies that are more. Opinion it on what they allow, they still allow agents, but there may be like more granulars to like maybe we're only going to allow these two tools. I personally think that”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The problem is that if anyone gets to a metus level model earlier, then in retrospect, we look like a huge mistake because we could have at least given companies the choice to start moving very quickly and give more companies access to mythos. Now they're all vulnerable because there's a Chinese model that's Mythos level and there's nothing they can do about it. So I think hopefully we'll manage to do the gradual rollout correctly. I would really encourage that we expand the amount of companies that get access to this and make it much easier for people to get. I would advise everyone to assume that these models are coming anyway. The only thing you can do right now is to invest in these foundational controls that will stop the downstream effects of these vulnerabilities are going to be found in their systems.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Have a strong opinion, but I think it's a, on the one hand, like if we knew that there's not going to be anyone who's going to release it, Mythos level model soon, I think that would be great because it gives enough time for me to prepare, to build the know-how, to build the playbooks, to share that around in the community, and to make sure that we're not starting to see airlines go down and power plants go down and really disastrous effects that could happen”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The AI attack surface that you now have, or for the AIs in your company, you also need a foundational decision. That's kind of the role we play in that space. So if you're as part of your preparation for Mythos level models and beyond, you're going to need a lot of foundational security tools to fortify your different parts of the enterprise. And we're playing that part in the AI space.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“For them, whether it is through patching or through mitigating controls. But then the real solution and every security leader at large enterprise knows it is that we need to have the foundational pieces in place to avoid those risks. And the foundational pieces are we need to have identity is locked down. We need to have a firewall. We need to have endpoint detection. And for different asset classes in your enterprise, for different parts of your stack, there's a different foundational security mechanism that you need in place.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think Mythos is really, if you took me 10 years ago, automated vulnerability research looked like a dream that would take 20, 50 years to happen. Maybe it's because we were doing a lot of that in Israel intelligence and we liked to pat ourselves on the shoulder of how difficult the job is that we're doing. But it did look really far. And suddenly it's coming all at once. And so I think that First of all, the market is not overreacting. I think this is a huge change in what this means for security teams if you're a pragmatic security person today, you understand that you need to move very quickly. Your strategy might look something like I need to do the fastest quick fixes I can to mitigate the immediate risk. So maybe I'll invest in whatever the fund will be that haven't found, let's try to mitigate.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think it's an opening that only happens when the pain is very strong. So their pain is so strong that they're going to say, oh my God, I just saw this company come out of stealth. But it's a problem that I have daily. So I'll give them a call. And suddenly you get inbound from these large customers, which is, of course, like the best thing you could hope for as a entrepreneur. And I think it reflects, in my opinion, their understanding that a lot of the startups in the space are still small and new, but there's going to be a huge company here. And we want to find the right horse to bet. And so we're going to take a look at these companies. And number two, that if we don't do anything, then in a very short time, this will disable our business. At the end of the day, security people are in the business of revenue preservation. They understand that this is between the tourists, they want to partner with someone that's promising an early rather than not.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Right. I think it's one of those things that should not be possible. So in theory, there's no reason why a Fortune 10 or 20 company would work with us because who are we? We're a two-year-old company. We're like a few people from Matthew Cyber.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Level Oh, yeah. Yeah. I think, like, yeah, exactly. I think as humans, it might still be very difficult to understand what weights and activations mean and maybe mechanistic interpretability. It seems like, oh, maybe that's too hard or shouldn't be possible. But as we're starting to have models that are much smarter than us, at least in some important ways, we think that we'll be able to start cracking mechanistic capability much more effectively. And I think it's going to be extremely worrying. Long term for understanding intelligence in general, like not just overseeing, but just understanding what intelligence is, how it works, what's the difference between the smarter model and the less smart model.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We believe that there's been a lot of strong progress in that direction. We believe that understanding the internal weights and activations, what is internal structure, the mathematical structure of these systems is going to be at least part of the solution. And in many ways, we think that, and this is maybe, you know, we'll only know when we get there, but we think that For our level of intelligence, it's kind of difficult to understand. Very quickly, what is the internal structure of a large language model? What is the internal structure of the way?”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Principle of that problem just sounds very important to me. So I think it would be crucially important if you have AI companies that are 10 trillion dollar companies, we think you want a company that is not the vendor of the AI itself to oversee and help you control what AI is doing. And we think that's an opening that's a hundred dollar plus opening for a really important company. And then if you think about what it's going to take to control advanced AI long term, then we're just scratching the surface because long term you're going to have to also understand much better what models are thinking, what models are, what's happening on the internals of these models as they're operating. And that's also a lot of where our research is focused.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We want to be more than just a security company long term. We think that to solve this problem well is going to require deep AI expertise. But then the problem is not just cybersecurity. The problem is how do we control advanced AI long term? And that problem, even if you just forget about enterprise security and the different gaps in various controls that they currently have.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, first of all, I think Israel is a bit, start maybe a bit late in the game, but is catching up quickly. So I think there's now amazing companies in Israel building world models, building AI infrastructure that's top of its glass, building chips. So I think Israel in general is becoming very strong in AI. And we're proud to be a part of that movement. I think you're right. Our company has a very mixed DNA between cyber and AI, which kind of reflects mind and guild's backgrounds. Most of the people in our company, most of our research engineering come from a unit in the Israeli intelligence where we actually deal with math and cyber intersection thereof. And so I think it is also reflected in kind of the type of town that we bring in. I think it's important for a few reasons. The first and foremost is...”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Do Yeah, I actually did think about it, but yeah, there's a lot of analogies because I think if you look at top chess players in the world, most of the moves that they make are intuitive. They don't calculate forward. They've seen so much games and they've played so much games that they already have a good sense of what is the right move and that they're not taking too much risk here by taking this move without calculating. And then if you look at those games every once in a while, they do stop for suddenly a really long period of time to just calculate for a lot of options because they know this is a critical move in the game. There's risk. You need to think through what you're doing and you need to decide correctly. I think that's very similar. It's the efficient way to run computation, right? You don't want to spend too much intelligence or you don't have to and you want to spend a lot of intelligence overwhelmingly a lot in situations where there is high risk.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“At this, and if you manage to bake in that intuition into those small models, well, in the sense that they don't miss a lot of stuff and they don't call that other agent too much, then you can get to a really good balance of During performance, we have smart agents overseeing things when needed, but we're not, but our costs are low and our latency is low. And then that becomes the challenge because you need to make sure that The frontier models get smarter and the hardnesses become more evolved. You need to be able to have models that are on your side that are small and effective at continuously being able to say now's the time, this is the action where I think someone should take a closer look. And that's why Onix Trains and Models for this purpose. And most of the hard things that we do are in this space.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Cost, latency, reliability perspective, because if I need to run an agent for every agent you're running as your security vendor, you're going to be paying for me more than you're paying for your AI, right? So it's not, it's pretty much a deal breaker. And also, it's going to be so slow. So you're not going to be happy with whatever latency you're going to get. And so the challenge then becomes how do I know what are the times where I need to interject with these smart agents to look at what's happening. And that's when actually what you want to do is you want to train very smart models that are actually, let me curvic, very not smart models, but models are just good at one thing. They're very small. They almost can't do anything else other than be able to say, should I have a smarter agent?”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Capable agents and reviewing what other agents are doing. Same as we have capable humans reviewing what other humans are doing, right? But then the problems that we're going to run into is how do I make this work from a”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“If you try today, let's say we're trying to build a solution to oversee and kind of control how other agents are operating, maybe the first thing a lot of our listeners might think is say, well, I'll just ask Cloud Code to do it. And in a sense, they would be right, because CloudCode is great. And maybe we can ask it to spawn a version of itself for every agent that we have and kind of keep monitoring everything that agent is planning to do. And if you think that there's a problem, intervene. That approach, it has obviously pretty naive, and there are some ways in which it totally fails. We could talk about, but it has some merit to it, right? So it does seem intuitive that it's a good idea to have.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It turns out that in the case of AI systems, that is the hard question. What is the engine that needs to underwrite these different actions and say if they're okay or not? Because We need to be able to understand what another I system is thinking, what it is planning to do, and then have our own opinion on that and consider we're trying to understand some of the smartest smalls in the world are doing the right thing. So who are we to do it? How are we going to do it correctly, right? And so that turns out to be a really difficult technical question.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“A few things that, I mean, process integration method, I would say. So there are some AI systems. Where, like, you would want to integrate with a proxy if that's the easiest way to do it. But number one, there's a lot of systems where that's just not viable technically because AI today runs on the cloud, on someone else's infrastructure, on your endpoint, and just proxy is not always an option. And the second thing is the question, okay, great, you're proxing, so you're seeing the data. You're seeing, but that's not the hard problem. The hard problem is understanding if what I should do now.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“If we tell our cloud code that we want to recreate a database and it should delete it and recreate it, that's great. That's going to save our DevOps team and our platform teams a lot of time. It's a great benefit of cloud code, but if cloud code is working on an unrelated task and suddenly thinks that maybe the right thing to do is to delete our database and recreate it, maybe we don't want that to happen. And unfortunately our endpoint providers or API security tools, they don't know what cloud was thinking, why is it doing what it's doing, right? So a lot of these existing tools, they don't have the context to understand what these very flexible, unpredictable systems are doing if you're not building some kind of controls that are built for these systems, then you're either going to end up limiting them a lot, making them almost much less useful to the enterprise, or you're going to miss a lot of pretty...”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We want to tell Cloud Code to do something, or Cloud Co work to do something, and we want to then go have lunch. And we want to come back and see that it's done. And we want to give it so many diverse tasks as well that we kind of can't find the right set of permissions to do. So suddenly our identity security software is not very useful. Then if you think about endpoint security, right, or for API security.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Security is always a space where you have some overlap between different tooling. But in this case, and you have the concept of defensive debt as well. So you want to have defenses at different levels of your technology stack to solve the problem. And that said, I think in this space, we're kind of, and a lot of enterprises are kind of helpless because I'll take an example, the identity approach. Like traditionally, if we have an software system that's running in our company, our first and most important control will be to limit what permission it has, right? Because, and then no matter what, even if it goes wrong, even if it's compromised, it can't typically do stuff that was originally allowed to do, but with these autonomous AIs, with this assistance, with this coding agents, we kind of want them to have our permissions because”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Is those low code automations? And the last two percent are really the first party ones that they're building themselves because obviously it's much harder to build effective agents. And it's much easier to adopt agents off the shelf or build them with low code. And that's what we're seeing. And reducing that the autonomous is also the fastest growing category. So it used to be that only developers, we would see cloud code growing like fire in our customer base and now we're seeing a cloud cowork growing even faster. We're starting to see to our own surprise actually people adopting open cloud as a legitimate sanction tool in the company because the ceo is very driven to adopt the act. So I think that today automatic hazard is by far the fastest growing category and today typically comes without any controls.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So I think right now in our typical enterprise, we're going to see if we break it down to three categories. So we break it down to very SaaS platforms that are typically more low code where people build agents in this drag and drag way. And they're not really autonomous agents, right? They're kind of the, I would think of them more as AI automations. And then there are first party agents people are building in their cloud potentially because it's an application they want inside the company or even a product they're planning to release to the customers that is authentic. And then the third category is very autonomous, coding agents and assistants of these categories. I would say roughly at this point, over 50% is the autonomous coding agents and assistants in the average enterprise, then probably 45%”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Run into the risk as you're exponentially doing more things with the eyes, you're gonna start having really bad actions happen. And we've seen some of that happen lately with downtimes that were caused by agents doing their own thing, agents accidentally publishing code and tokens that they weren't supposed to and so on. So definitely enterpriser starting to realize that that risk is growing exponentially and that they don't have any way to stop the adoption. So like they just now have to do something to Reduce the chance of these agent actions being illegitimate or incorrect.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Onyx is really. Does two things. Number one is we train models and build agents that can oversee other agents. And the goal of that is to say, okay, we need someone to be able to tell that all of these actions that are now happening by these AIs we're adopting are legitimate because that number, the number of these actions is going exponentially. And so things that we thought might be useful in the past, like a human in the loop, now that you're going to have 100x, 1,000 x, a million x of these actions, that's not going to work. And then we take the capability and we basically productize it in a product that we call the control plan or the securia control plane where we come to the present and say, hey, let's find all of your AIs and autonomous agents and hook them up to Onyx to this system where we can oversee what your AIs are doing so that you don't”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Starting to see now that these types of agents that are very autonomous, even though they're like everyone was afraid to build them, so everyone started building these low code platforms that were much more limited, much more based on connectors. And those platforms ended up being quite limited. So we didn't get the productivity gains from those limited platforms. But what we started getting the crazy benefits from these very unleashed agents that could do everything that had much less controls baked into them and even very large enterprises decided they're going to adopt it, you know, like Antrox revenue is coming from enterprises that are paying for cloud code to do a lot of the work that developers used to do. That was a bit about kind of how we started and we definitely were in luck that various autonomous agents appeared before it was too late.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And I think there was a good chance that I would have run out of money before because I think you were right. I think there was an element of chance here. But then I think the market did happen. So we had suddenly reasoning models that could do long horizon tasks. We had cloud code, which became like the really first widely used autonomous agent. And then we had co-work and OpenClaw. And I think”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I was very eye pilled even back then, so I was thinking, oh my God, Mal's are going to be way smarter than us when that happens, how do we oversee these very smart agents that are smarter than us, they're very capable, how we're going to feel easy about them doing stuff for us, especially when they start managing really important stuff. Then one day they're managing your water supply and your electricity or power grid, right? How do you control them? And that was like the thing I was kind of obsessed about that thought. I was also too early. So I think at the time enterprises were not using any agents. There were hardly any agents out there and talking with a lot of security budgets at the time. They were like, oh, dude, you're way too early. Like this is not something that's going to happen.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“For us, I think that was in many ways cloud code today is not dissimilar to other GPD back then. I think they were a bit early on, again, before the models were ready, but the concept was right. And the thought that stick with me was.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Sure. So AutoGPT, and I'm sorry if I don't know the guy behind it, but a huge, huge fan. They created the first, as far as I know, first really autonomous agent running on LLMs, right? So agent that would let LLM not generate text, but decide what to do and then give that agent an API access to do that thing a tool to do it. And then we do that in a loop. So basically in theory could let agents do very complicated things. Anything a person could do on the computer. Now, granted, it didn't work that well. It was too early. The models were not good enough. GPT-4 was not good enough. But I think it did give everyone a glimpse to the future of, you know, what if the models were good enough and then basically using that same structure, we could have very capable agents doing stuff.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Look, I think for us the pivotal point was RGPT. I think RGPT kind of let everyone's imagination, including ours, run wild, because it was a...”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Your exponentially doing more things with the eyes, you're gonna start having really bad actions happen, and we've seen some of that happen lately with agents accidentally publishing code and tokens that they weren't supposed to. Like, definitely enterprises are starting to realize that that risk is growing exponentially and that they don't have any way to stop the adoption. They just now have to do something to reduce the chance of these agent actions being illegitimate or incorrect. But we're allowed to look at a lot of historical data of how these agents have behaved, but enterprises today are not willing to have anthropic or open AI, give that historical data because they know these are very data-handy companies that will want to train on that data.”
2026-05-28 · No Priors · Building an AI Guardian for Enterprise with Onyx Security CEO Maxim Bar Kogan · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT