YouSaid · the spoken record

Michael Hudson

lines on the record: 37
first: 2020-10-12
most recent: 2020-10-12
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“The way it's going. And so I don't see the economy as recovering. The coronavirus has simply left us idling at a low level, and I don't see any way of getting out of the level as long as we have to pay the debt legacy, the arrears that have all mounted up and are just a burden on families, on businesses, and on states and localities. They can't carry it. And it's crunch time. And unless you alleviate the debt problem, you're going to be in a slow new depression.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“As interest rates came down from my former boss, the Chase Paul Volcker's 20% in 1980, you had the greatest bond market boom in history. Bond prices soared, stock market soared. You created huge financial wealth without creating actual industrial and consumer wealth. So you had a shift of the beneficiaries of the system from labor and business to finance the Wall Street, the real estate sector, and the insurance sector. So the whole economy changed in 1980, and it's changed in a way that has left us now debt ridden. The economies run up as much debt as it can. It can't really push up anymore, although the Federal Reserve can certainly keep pushing up the stock market, but it is not pushing up the economy.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“1980 certainly was a turning point you had Margaret Thatcher in England and Ronald Reagan in the United States the whole tax system was shifted to favor real estate and the financial system not the real economy and then you had the shift of American corporate employment to low wage countries in Asia so yes 1980 was the turning point and all of the trends from World War II to 1980 for more and more prosperity for labor were suddenly reversed in retrospect the 1970s looked like a golden age now but since 1980 real wages haven't really gone up very much debt has gone way way way up so you've had a debt driven economy debt leverage economy you had the corporate takeover and corporate rating movement begin in the 1980s you had”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Austerity, more and more austerity, a slow crash, a slow debt deflation. And that's what I've outlined in my book, Killing the Host. I described debt deflation, which was discussed in the 1930s when it was actually happening when people had to pay their debts and couldn't afford to buy goods and services. What happened in the Great Depression is happening again today, but it's happening in slow motion.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“China certainly is not going to privatize banking. It is absolutely drawing the line. It is not going to let banking be private because credit is the main public utility. An economy is basically planned through its credit system. Who is going to supply the credit? America is turning into a centrally planned economy, not planned by Washington, but planned by Wall Street. Just like European countries are planned by their financial sector. And the problem is who's going to do the planning and what is their planning going to be for? Is it going to be to make the economy grow or is it going to get rich off the economy by shrinking the economy? That is the whole question. I don't see the United States getting more like China despite MMT being used modestly. I see the United States getting more like Greece and England.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“In a way that has not caused any more inflation there than it would here. If New York City and New York State received money creation to just continue operation, that wouldn't inflate prices at all. In fact, what we're in now is debt deflation. If we don't write down the debts, then the debt service is going to cause a deflation of prices. That's the real problem today, not inflation, but deflation as people can't afford to buy goods and services and have to cut back their family budgets and buy less and less to employ fewer and fewer people producing and selling goods and services, fewer restaurants and business and so on.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“They're trying to get rid of corruption now, and from what I'm told by Chinese businessmen, it seems to be working quite well, certainly compared to what it was before. But getting back to the other question, what is the cost? Begin by, what are the benefits? The benefit is when there's an economic downturn like the coronavirus, the company did not go out of business, lay off its employees, and be sold to foreign buyers. The economy was able to maintain stability. So the cost really is money is cost free if the government creates it. Borrowing is not cost-free, but money creating is cost-free as long as it's not inflationary. And China does not create money in an inflationary way. It creates money simply to stabilize employment.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I think the recent weeks newspapers have shown there's just as much corruption in the United States financial system as there is in China. I mean, look at Deutsche Bank and look at all the banks that have been involved. Ten years ago, corruption was a very serious problem in China. And when I'd lecture there to students, there was, you could see the idealism. I hadn't seen it in any other country. An idea that they can really, they'll graduate. They'll go into government and they're going to clean up corruption. And really, if they felt it was their country and they had a chance of actually shaping the economy because it was something entirely new. Well, the problem 10 years later we can see is a cleaning up corruption does entail a lot of government oversight into the economy and the cost of cleaning up corruption is a very heavily regulated economy.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That's the main thing that MMT says that there are two ways of financing governments. Printing it, borrowing, and the effect on inflation is identical.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Where you're limited to what bondholders will let you do, you can simply print the money. And by printing it, you save the amount of taxes that have to go to paying interest. You would save the amount of taxes that have to go to amortize and pay down the debt. Certainly for states and local governments here, it would be probably the only way the states and local governments can avoid drastic downsizing is government lending to them not going to private bondholders because in New York if New York State a borrowers and private bondholders, the bondholders will say, well, you'll have to balance the budget by selling off property or by cutting back public services, less transportation, and with less transportation, people are just going to begin moving out of New York. It'll become not as livable as it used to be.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“The important thing about MMT is you realize that money doesn't, governments don't have to borrow to spend money. Governments can create the money. They don't have to borrow from a bank or a bondholder to lend out. The effect of borrowing from a bondholder and creating money is identical. If a central bank will print the money to spend into the economy, it's no more inflationary than borrowing from a bondholder because the bondholder do what a bank does simply take decide, okay, I'm not going to spend money on other financial assets, a bondholder is not going to cut back consumption spending in order to lend money to the government. Stephanie, an MMT's point is that government money creation is no more inflationary than borrowing and you don't have to borrow and pay interest to an independent financial sector.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Shown the most successful way of doing it. There was hardly any interruption of activity there. There's a very quick recovery. And it's because of the way that China has structured its financial sector under public direction instead of leaving it to individual banks to foreclose, take over real estate, grab factories, and create, make the economy look like Greece.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Been a diversion of income away from the real economy, the production and consumption economy, to the financial sector. So the financial sector in the United States, let's face it, has become dysfunctional. And I think almost every financial manager that I know realizes that the sector has become dysfunctional and they're saying this is a hell of a way to make a living. I'm going to play by the rules of the game, but I would be nice if the rules of the game were for me to be a banker and I was actually helping the economy grow instead of just diverting income from the economy into the banking system. So somehow the financial system has to be restructured so it can cope with a coronavirus chroma or act of God like we're having now and be able to restore normalcy and I think the only way to do it would be China has”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Extended up to the point where they absorb 43% of the borrower's income to pay the mortgage. That'll be guaranteed. Well, imagine if you're paying 43% of your income to pay your mortgage, you're paying taxes of maybe 10 or 20%, you're paying health insurance, you're paying Social Security withholding. There's been less and less and less income available to spend on goods and services because more and more American income is being used to pay the financial sector and it's associated real estate and insurance sector. So as more money is paid to the financial sector, is debts grow, same thing for corporations as corporations have to pay more money to the bondholders and dividends and the banks. There's less and less for new capital investment and the economy is shrinking largely because there's”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Education. And just as a house is worth, whatever a bank will lend against it for the new buyer, an education is going to be worth whatever a bank is going to lend to a student to buy an education. And as banks have made loans with government guarantees with no risk, they've made loans without taking into account the ability to pay. When I went into Wall Street 60 years ago, the first question any banker would ask is, can the borrower pay? Well, right now, that's not anymore. Now that the FHA is guaranteeing mortgages and the student loan are guaranteed, banks don't have to worry about repayments. So they're just creating as much credit as they can without reference to the ability to pay. The government isn't looking at the ability to pay. The FHA now lets mortgages be”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, what are its interests? I think you can say that a lot of the problems that America has been in slowing down for the last 10 years, really slowing down since 2009, has been financialization. And the problem is that the financial sector doesn't create credit for the reasons that M&T would. The financial sector creates credit against assets, against collateral. 80% of bank loans are for real estate. And so as the credit standards have been loosened for real estate, banks will lend more and more and more money against any given piece of real estate. And the effect of financialization has been to increase, to inflate real estate prices. Banks will lend money against stocks and bonds, and they'll lend money to finance corporate takeovers. And they also lend money, of course.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“What he was doing MMT, but it's exactly what MMT is creating the government just simply creating the credit. That's what quantitative easing is. That was all MMT, but it was MMT going into the stock market. And most of us at Kansas City are trying to create prosperity for the economy as a whole, for labor and industry and agriculture, not simply high asset prices.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Into the regular economy of production and consumption, people who work and produce things. But you've just seen the main practitioner of MMT, of course, is Donald Trump. And he just did the enormous $10 trillion MMT example, but he only put $2 trillion of that into the economy. The rest of the money went into the stock market and the bond market. So the question is, who are you going to run MMT for? Are you going to run it just in order to pump up the stock and bond prices and real estate prices and to keep the debt system in place? Or are you going to pump it into the economy and let the economy survive? Something has to give. Either the economy loses or the financial sector loses. And that really is the debate in MMT. Mr. Trump didn't call...”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I was one of the developers of MMT in the late 1970s. And Stephanie was our department chairman there. We were all brought to Kansas City together in order to popularize MMT. And Stephanie and I have gone around the world together giving lectures on it. She usually gives the introductory lecture about how running a deficit pumps money into the economy and then I follow up with the second and the economy needs to be pumped up or else we'll have austerity and then I give the lecture to say well the economy is really two sectors there's the financial sector, finance insurance and real estate the property sector on the one hand and then there's the production and consumption sector on the other now most MMT people talk about the government printing money”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Who are unable to do business to the Federal Reserve that will continue to keep them afloat? And then when the crisis is over and the vaccine is in and life goes back to normal, the Fed will say, okay, we provided the credit, now we can just wipe it out, and life can go back to normal. The idea is to restore the status quo on ante. The idea is to make the economy as workable as it was before the crisis.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Lend to keep a restaurant afloat or a museum afloat or a city and state afloat. And then you can simply wipe out the debt. And you're only canceling the debt to yourself. You're not threatening to take it away from any banker or bondholder or a stockholder. So by making finance a public utility or at least making the credit emergency credit public utility, you create the credit and then you say, okay, we've provided you the credit. And when we provide you credit in a shutdown, this is not inflationary. I think Germany is paying its labor 70% of the normal wage income. The Federal Reserve could create enough credit to keep most employees who've lost the jobs able to break even. Most restaurants and most”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Just keep lending it the money, and then because it creates the money, it'll write it off. It's easy to cancel the debts when the debts you're canceling are owed to yourself. Hammurabi could cancel the debts because most of the debts ultimately were owed to the palace. He didn't have to deal with an independent financial class that said, wait a minute, we're going to lose if you cancel the debts. We're going to overthrow you if you try to do that. He was canceling debts to themselves. The Roman emperors were canceling debts owed to themselves, not to the wealthy Romans. Now, in China, because China's government provides the credit, it premises that finance and banking should be a public utility. It should not be privatized, and the advantage of having a banking is a public utility or like operating the Federal Reserve here is a public utility, is you can create the money.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That happens very well at China is able to cope with this quite well because it's monetary policy. Its central bank is part of the government. There are many companies in China for the last 10 years are longer that have not been able to pay the debt. What do you do when a industrial company can't pay the debt? Well, in the West, if a company can't pay its debt, it goes bankrupt and it's sold to the highest bidder and it could be a foreign buyer and it closes down and the workers are unemployed. But what the Bank of China does, the government simply keeps creating the credit and lending the bank the money, the corporation that's the debtor the money. Now here that company would be called a zombie corporation but China”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“What are the children going to move in with the wife and kids going to move in with the parents? Having to pay the student loan crowds out the ability to take out a mortgage loan, to take out other loans you need. And then, of course, you have the medical debt that is probably the main source of bankruptcy for many, many people. You get sick, you go into the hospital, or even if you get tested, you're broke. And if the Federal Reserve is correct when it said that half the Americans cannot raise $400 in an emergency, and it costs that much just to have a COVID test, and it costs maybe $2,000 or more if you go in just to be admitted to a hospital, you can imagine the devastation that this causes to people that not paying a debt is not a matter of choice. It's a matter of the money is There.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Able to scrape by and pay your student loan, good for you. You were able to survive. Most of the people who don't pay their student loans are not paying because they're going to the movies or their gambling or they're consuming more. They're paying because they really don't have the money to do what you did to scrape and pay, especially minorities who've gone to junk colleges, the sort of private colleges that say they're going to get them a job in manual labor or some kind of technology that really doesn't work. There are many people stuck with loans that they're unable to pay. And if they do pay it, suppose that all the people with student loans now actually have to pay the student loans, then they're not going to have enough money to take out a mortgage to buy a home of their own and form a family. They're going to have to live with their parents. They get married.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“This line of approach at all. In fact, we could see that it made them feel very uncomfortable to talk about that. So I think the people who are realizing that something has to be done about debt are mainly financial. They're mainly on Wall Street. For years, I worked with Chase Manhattan as our balance of payments economist. And it was the banks that saw, well, wait a minute, how much can a third world country afford to pay? How much can such and such an industry afford to pay? The banks know that many sectors can't pay. The rest of the economy isn't looking at this because there's an assumption like you said that the assumption is that anybody can pay if they just cut back on their spending enough. But that's not the case. You mentioned student loans, and certainly many people think, well, I really straight buy to pay my student loan. Why would other student loans be forgiven? Well, the answer is simple. If you were”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“All of the people borrowing to buy real estate on credit and because everything has to be couched in terms of Marx's capital there because they say they're a Marxist state. David Harvey said, well, you know, Marx wrote more than volume one of capital, which is all about labor and employees working for their employers. They're volumes two and three in capital. Volume three, Marx talks about how debt grows by its own purely mathematical laws, which have nothing to do with the economic rate of growth, the financial system is wrapped around the economy as a whole and really is independent from capitalism that existed long before capitalism and probably, and it obviously is existing after capitalism in China. They did not seem very interested in”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I think because of unfamiliarity with history and the fact that the left in America doesn't discuss debt or finance, I don't think I've had any discussions about finance or debt forgiveness or even monetary policy with the left at all. I've talked to Federal Reserve branches. I talked to Wall Street people. I talked to financial people. I talk to Republican politicians. Nobody on the left has been interested in this. And in fact, in China, where I was a professor for the last few years in Beijing at Peking University, I went over a few years ago along with David Harvey, a colleague of mine from CUNY here in New York. And we didn't find any discussion in China about what are you going to do about the Chinese housing boom that's come up with”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Roma had been engaged in fighting with the north, with the Germans. He canceled the debt so that you wouldn't have the army falling into bondage to creditors so it couldn't fight in the army anymore.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Creditor is not going to be paid, and in this case, it would be either the landlords are not paid or in special conditions where small landlords, they'd lose the property, in some way the banks and the creditors are obliged to take the loss because they're rich enough to take the loss without disrupting society. If you have the debtors absorb the loss, society's disrupted and torn apart and the tax systems torn apart. If the creditors lose, well, they're not quite as rich as they used to be, but they still get by. That's why Hammurabi did not cancel the business debts. Debts of merchants, debts that were denominated in silver for trade, none of the business debts were canceled. Only the personal debts, mainly of cultivators on the land were canceled. Same thing in Rome, when Emperor Hadrian canceled the debts.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Normal activity. How do you restore the ability of life to get back to normal so that the equivalent would be in modern days? How do you let restaurants reopen without having to say, well, we're just going to go out of business rather than pay all the money that we owe that we end up working for the landlords and for the creditors or the city? How do you enable the cities to start their transportation system again at a fourth rates that people can afford to pay on the subway or the other transportation? How do you prevent the economy from being permanently wounded? And again, the only way to do it is to write down say the debts don't have to be paid. Somebody has to suffer because as Tracy pointed out, one person's debt is another person's claim. And if you don't pay the debt, then some saver or”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“The king, and they did in Byzantium powerful enough to overthrow the king and prevent the king from having the power to tax them. And the whole economy would have turned into an oligarchy instead of a steady state system. Now, the idea behind Hammurabi was taken over from the Sumerians. And their word for these debt cancellations, think of it as a clean slate. Everything goes back to the way things were before the crisis. And the word for clean slate in Sumerian was Amargi from Ama, the mother. It was the mother condition, meaning it's the original condition. The whole idea is how do you come out of a crisis, whether it's a doubt, drought, or a disease, and end up in the kind of way you were before, which you assume to be rough balance. People produce enough to live and pay their taxes and get by and conduct.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“You have in the Bible debt bondage when you can't pay the debts. And if a debtor ended up owing his labor time to the creditor, then he wouldn't have the opportunity to work on Corv ⁇ labor, that is public labor to build the castle, the walls, to dig the irrigation ditches. He wouldn't be able to serve in the army, and if he owed the crops to the creditor, and we're talking about 33 and a third percent interest for crop loans, then he wouldn't be able to pay the taxes. So Ahmad Rabi would have, the palace economy would have not only collapsed, but you would have had a wealthy creditor class emerging from the palace bureaucracy, the local leaders. And the first thing they would have done once they got power was to overthrow.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, the laws of Hammurabi were announced around 1750 BC are an example. That's the first set of laws that explicitly refer to an act of God. In this case, Aded, the storm god. Hammurabi says that if the storm god added floods the fields or cancels the fields that causes a drought, then the taxes don't have to be paid and the debts don't have to be paid. In another part of the laws of Hammurabi, he said, if there's a disease and the disease prevent people from operating in normal activity, then the debts that they owe are cancelled. Now, the reason he did that was if he did not cancel those debts of the cultivators, and we're talking about an agricultural economy, low surplus economy, then you would have the debtors fall into bondage to the creditors, just like”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Retical to say, well, let's transfer property to creditors, let's close down family businesses that have been there for many decades. Let's completely leave the economy in a closed-down position. The reason people have canceled debts over time is to restore economic normalcy. This has been going on for over 3,000 years, 5,000 years. My book be What is much in the news right now are Acts of God by insurance companies. You can look at the virus as being a kind of act of God. What do you do when something happens from outside the economy? It's not the fault of the income earner. It's not the fault of the restaurant. It's not the fault of the homeowner who's lost a job. It is just happens from outside the economy. Well, thousands of...”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Bronson, New York City going out of business. You could say the same for gyms. You've seen the Metropolitan Opera close down, Carnegie Hall concert stopping. So you're having an interruption in economic activity. And the main effect of debt, people think of debt as transferring interest and money to the creditors. But in this case, we're talking about transferring property to creditors. We're talking about landlords or people who've bought a house in a mortgage. They've lost their job or they're on a part-time basis and they're in danger of defaulting on the mortgage. And there's a danger of the same kind of decline in homeownership today that you had after 2009 when there were the widespread defaults. So the question is, radical as it seems to write down the debts, even more”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, both of you have already in the introduction gone over what the problem is. And I think it's much easier to understand the logic of cancellations or write-downs if you look at what happens if you leave business as usual. What happens if you leave things the way they are right now? Well, think of restaurants, for instance, restaurants in New York City have been closed or operating at a minimal basis for six months. They've accrued back rents and taxes. There's no way that they can reopen and hope to earn the six months rent in the next two or three or maybe four years. And if they did have to pay the rents that have accrued when there are no revenues at all, then they're going to have to go out of business. And there's talk of 70% of revenue.”
2020-10-12 · Odd Lots · Michael Hudson On Why The US Risks Becoming The Next Greece · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source