YouSaid · the spoken record

Perth Tolle

lines on the record: 102
first: 2022-07-01
most recent: 2022-07-01
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Yeah, so when I was first getting started like 20 years ago, it was 20 years ago actually, I think it's when I went to art school in Pasadena to go into advertising design. So I was wanting to go into a creative field. And what I didn't realize at that time is that finance can be very creative. And for me, indexing is a form of expression. We created this for people who believe in the benefits of freedom and want to express that in their emerging markets allocations before there wasn't any way for people to express that if that's what they wanted. And now there is. So we're creating an avenue for people to express their preferences in the emerging market space. And that's a creative thing using data that's not readily available on Bloomberg or Faxet instead of using freedom as a metric was a creative kind of outlet for me. And so”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“When you can recover. Yes. And so when you're young, do what you want, go for it. And don't ask yourself what is the most stable career path? I think a lot of people ask that these days. But ask yourself, what is my ideal scenario? What do I want ideally if I could have anything, do anything I want, what would I do? And then go that direction because you may fail, but you know, you'll be happy. That's one thing I learned from Jan Van Neck of Van Neck funds. Actually early on, I heard him speak and somebody asked him, I have an idea for an ETF, should I launch it? And he's like, yeah, yeah, sure. You know, you might fail, but you'll be happy. And I can attest to that.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Just straight out of college as a startup, right? So I would much rather hire them after they've got that training. And, you know, don't stay forever. Do what you're passionate about. But, you know, get the basic training down. And these are such great training grounds. And yeah, maybe you'll stay for a long time. I stayed for 10 years at Fidelity and I loved it. And that was a tremendous building block and foundation for what I do now. And the second thing I would say is once you do branch out, if you are lucky enough to have a vision or a mission or something that you're passionate about, you know, go for it and try to fail as big as possible.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, so I think a lot of college grads these days try to go into quant. And I think quant does have its place, but I think right now For new grads, I would say look at you and just look at what's happening in the world and invest according to that. And sometimes that can work just as well. For everyone, I would say one. Start at a big firm like Fidelity or a company like Bloomberg, or you can learn a lot. And they have the resources to train you because we've had a lot of college grads come to us and say, Can we work for you? And, you know, my answer to that is I do not have the resources to train someone.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Government interference in private markets and so forth. So Russia is one of those countries that rules ranks poorly on both bullet points. Personal and economic. Yeah. So those China is another similar situation. So yeah, that's a country that.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Both poor personal freedom and poor economic freedom. So, you know, personal freedom I categorize into civil and political freedom. Civil freedoms are things like terrorism, trafficking, torture, disappearances, women's freedoms. There's five women's freedoms proxies. And then, and these are emerging markets, women's freedoms, like women's rights to movement, women's rights to children after divorce, women's rights to inheritance, things like that. And then you have your political freedoms, like due process, rule of law, civil procedure, criminal procedure. And then you have freedom of speech, media, expression, and so forth. And then you have your economic freedoms that we're all familiar with, freedom to trade internationally sound money, right? Fewer countries actually have more sound monetary policies and lower inflation rates historically, looking at inflation as a major risk going forward. Business regulations, taxation.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“No, that rule of law is so important. And Russia is one of those countries I had a client when I was at Fidelity, a Russian client who told me I don't want to invest in Russia because it's like funding terrorism. And you see how precious that was now. But Russia is one of those countries that has...”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Makes perfect sense to me. So I obviously disagree with that. You should still do it because there are some very free markets in the emerging markets, but I agree with his reasoning.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“No, ask Bill Browder how he thinks about emerging markets of vesting. And he'll tell you he doesn't do it because of the lack of rule of law.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That's my next one. Yeah. So that's going to be exciting. I think I heard that it has a happy ending and I love happy endings. And you don't think of these stories as ones that would have happy endings, but I'm looking forward to seeing what that is.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yes, and he said, you know, you should read this book because you will be inspired by how Jack Vogel also went against the grain. And so I love it so far. The other book that, you know, I'm a big fan of Bill Browder and what he's doing also is no.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It was embarrassing. No, I love how he put so many of our friends in there, just like so many quotes. It's like reading a book with all of your friends quotes in there. So I love that. It's so good so far. And he told me.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Meet face to face a family office, and that was a fascinating experience and just these people were so kind and generous with their time and learning about the strategy and sharing with me about their family. And I get my inspiration from these people. These are the people that we created the strategy for. These are the people whose feedback I listen to, right? People who tell me this is what we want to see next or when advisors tell me, oh my gosh, you should hear how our clients respond when we, the joy and the relief from our clients, when we tell them how we invested for them after the Russia invasion, that we had them in this freedom-weighted product. Those types of commons are why I'm in this. And they inspire me.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Of research affiliates. Rob Arnott. And before that, when I was a fidelity, my fellow advisors and my clients, right? So my clients, I learned so much from them. I usually now don't get to meet with end clients very much. I usually talk to only advisors. You asked earlier who most of our investors are and I didn't fully answer that. It's advisors. And I recently got to”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That was the thing. I mean Hear the quote that if you're the smartest person in the room, you're in the wrong room, right? And I can say in this business, I have never been in the wrong room. In fact, I'm usually in the most right room possible. So I think it'd be harder to answer that question as who's not been a mentor at this point because I have so many mentors. I mean, how many times have I called you and asked questions? What should I do about this? All my ETF brethren who have their own products. I talk to them, I ask them questions all the time. Wes is a current mentor early on, you know, looking at people like Rob who pioneered non-cap weighted indexing.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That really matters. But what I love about that is some of these quotes that they have, and I love badass women characters. So, like Letty in the latest one said something like, you know, after she lost all her memory and she was like, you know what, I may not remember much, but I know one thing. No one would have ever made me any do anything I didn't want to do because somebody else was blaming themselves for the trouble that she got into. And she was like, no I wouldn't have done that if I didn't want to do it. And so I love that and I love how in Tokyo Drift, Han was like, I have money. I need trust and character around me. It's like all of these little quotes that just the sense of loyalty.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And now I just finished six. And so because I stopped going to those movies after college. And the last one I saw was Tokyo Drift. And I have no memory of, you know, pre-like 2004. So I basically had to watch them all over again.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“You entertained. I saw Hobbs and Shaw the other day, and I was like, I have missed so many fast and furious movies. And so I started from the beginning.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It'll be 24 hours a day It's like you're asking at three in the morning. Yes, that's the place I don't even remember the food. I think the food was secondary. It was like some weird toast. You know, and tea or something. But yeah, no, it was the best memories.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I really miss going to this place called Trewa. And it was, it's basically like an iHop. Like it's an open 24 hours and it's the one we went to was in Central, which I think is actually closed now due to COVID. That's where you go at night if you stayed up too late with your friends and stayed out and you just want to go and eat. I just had the best memories there. I just remember hanging out with friends there in early morning hours. I'm a night person having the best time. And so that's actually what I miss the most, which is like the cheapest restaurant you could think of there, but it's where I had the best memories.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So that's a very difficult question because there's a lot of good food in Hong Kong. I know. That's why I'm asking. It's like New York. There was a, you know, I don't even remember all the names. There was a Tapas place in mid-levels, which I loved. There was an Indian place with the most incredible nun on the peak that I loved. But I think if I had to pick one.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Massive. Yeah, I loved that about it. It's just the speed and the size, the number, the sheer number of people, the possibility of everything you can do there, the The respect for commerce, the efficiency It was just such an exciting place that the lights, if you look at the city at night, it's beautiful. It's got world-class, you know.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, and there's other ways of solving that problem possibly. So if any listeners are market makers or if you want to help us make a market in some of these names, please get in touch because we would love to solve this problem and make something like an ETF that's available for all investors. Obviously, we could make a hedge fund or something, but I would much prefer to have an ETS structure.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So, Nigeria actually is 6.28 out of 10. Which is higher than Russia, Qatar, UAE, which are emerging markets, but it's not higher than, you know, India and so forth. So yeah, it's still not free enough. If we were to make a frontier market index, it still would not be free enough to be in there.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Uruguay, which is actually not even classified as frontier, I believe, by MSEI. It's not even classified. It's got some very interesting fintech companies and just it's ranked very free.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And that was before last week. Yeah. And they would be very offended to be called a frontier market. But I'm just talking about size. Give me some other frontier markets.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It's low, but it's included. Yeah, so yeah, no, these are the interesting countries. And what I find even more interesting that we don't currently, you know, have a product for is frontier markets. There are some very free frontier markets. Estonia. Give us”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I like these countries that are in places where they're next to a very unfree market and they're like the beacon of freedom in their region, you know, like Taiwan or Colombia or in this, you know, right now Poland. Where does Mexico”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I do think India is very likely to make it back in there. They have some issues. But I think they have enough diversity of viewpoints to kind of push back and push through, I hope. And they have very favorable or more favorable demographics than some other countries. So I think they can possibly make it back in. I think Malaysia is currently in, and it's one of those that I think will stay in. They're making some, you know, reform progress. Colombia is an interesting one that I thought was going to become more likely to come in, but now they're having some issues. Reason I liked Columbia is because they were benefiting from the human migration from Venezuela.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Increased their repression of the Kashmir people. They had increased incidences of government intervention in media, and they blacked out protests in places that blacked out the internet in places that were going to have protests, the farmers protests. And so because of that, their score dropped. And because their score dropped, They became excluded, and they dropped lower than Brazil and Brazil got bumped up. So it's all relative, right? So after that happened, I didn't hear much, but when I do, you know, personal speaking in person, I do hear from Indian audience members that say, hey, India should really be in there, you know, and they give me all these reasons. And I'm like, I completely agree with you.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“But what I found is that in the more free or the borderline countries that sometimes get included, sometimes don't, I was in New York a few years ago when Brazil was not included in the fund. And I was in a subway and I ran into a couple of Brazilian human rights lawyers. And so we were all waiting for the same like late train. And I found out they worked in human rights and I was there for a human rights event. And so we started talking and they were like, hey, is Brazilian your index? And I was like, no. And they were like, yeah, that sounds about right. So I think countries, you know, different people from different countries tend to react differently to not being included. India, right? I have a lot of Indian, we have a lot of Indian fans actually because, you know, India tends to have a lot of fights with China. So they like that. We don't have a balance. But we also now don't have India. And because India a couple years ago”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Chinese holding company. So we actually at the rebalance of that following year made a rule. That if more than 80% of your assets are made up of the shares of another company, then that company is in an excluded country, then you're out. And so they really, you know, regardless of who the messenger is, the message was helpful”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, exactly. It's not my data set. I just am massaging what numbers I get from them. I'm not even massaging the numbers. I'm literally just putting the numbers as inputs into my algorithm. Yeah, and my algorithm is coming out with the inclusions. And so from China, I get a lot of pushback in a less civil way. But some of them make good points and I've taken some of that to heart and changed parts of our index. One of the things that I really valued from that feedback in the very beginning is that somebody pointed out, hey, you have a South African company NASPRS, which is all of their entire market cap consists of Tencent. And so you're essentially... Oh, is that true? That's interesting. This is a quantitative strategy. If the company is based in South Africa and South Africa is included.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So it's interesting because I've heard pushback from multiple countries, but the pushback is different depending on the country it's coming from. I've noticed that from Chinese investors in Hong Kong, I get very virulent pushback, like very angry and”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Be criticized about. And if you didn't like something suggested, you know, you blamed Yuri and Tim or whoever I was getting my research from, right?”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Players. Yes, I do. And that's always interesting because then I had to get used to that because, you know, working at Fidelity, a very conservative corporate culture button down. Yes, we never really had anything to”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“No, not even Hong Kong. And I love Hong Kong so much and I wish I could go back, but because of the national security law. It's best that I don't.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Just by being in a freer country. So all of these benefits of freedom are kind of nebulous. They're hard to visualize. And what we try to do with the FRDM index is to be a scorecard, a running scorecard for freedom in the emerging markets. Because yeah, there are a lot of benefits. Investment-wise, these are the countries that have more sustainable growth, recover faster from drawdowns. We saw this. Sustainable growth meaning it's not government mandated debt-driven growth, kind of like you saw in China again, exhibit A. Evergrand, we didn't know there was a problem until it was too late. And that's, you know, one of the problems with this kind of growth is that lack of transparency, the debt-driven nature of it, and it just causes this problems that become too big to fix.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, so freer countries have a lot of benefits that are beyond even economic benefits. They have higher life expectancies. They have lower infant mortality. They have lower gender inequality or higher gender equality. They have higher GDP growth, higher income per capita, lower poverty rates. Even their poorest quarter of their incomes are much wealthier in the top quartile freest countries than the bottom quartile of the least free country. So the bottom, the poorest people in the freer countries are much better off.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So this happens in all these unfree markets. It's not just China. I know I pick on China a lot or seem to because they're just such a great example. They're exhibit A for all of this stuff right now. So yeah, you know, that happens in all of these countries. In China specifically, you see this major drag on emerging markets indexes as a whole because they have such a large allocation And so emerging markets as a whole hasn't done that well in the last decade or more.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Game if something happened to it. Yeah, so government, you know, for example, in Egypt, the largest dairy company wanted to take it over. The founder said no. He was put in prison. His son said no was also put in prison with him.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, so the NCHI index, which is the MSCI China Index. Investing in China since its inception in 1992, it has had lower than treasury-like returns. So lower than for the”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And we have ourselves to blame for that. It's our regulators that allow this, our lawyers who wanted to make money from this, our investment bankers, and our Wall Street, us. So we have a lot to be responsible for here. And I think sometimes Wall Street, you know, carelessly makes these things up like bricks. Okay, what is that? You know, it doesn't make any sense. And I think now people are realizing that and it's pretty much dead as a grouping in emerging markets investing at least. But now we still have the brick summit and Iran wants to join. So there's a lasting consequence to our actions. When you're in a position to direct assets, whether it's your own assets or someone else's assets, that is a position of power and privilege. And we could use that power for good or not. And in emerging markets, there is no neutral.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Actual owners are, and so you could directly be enriching autocrats and their cronies because we don't know the ownership of a lot of these companies.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“To create alliances against the free world. And so sometimes, and that's a good example, kind of a visualization of what happens when we invest in these unfree markets as well. We lower the cost of capital for these companies in these markets to do business. There is a cost to doing business in a way that puts state interest first. Every company in China has to do that. I'm using China as an example, but the same thing in Russia, Saudi Arabia, Egypt. I mean, you see expropriation in all these countries. And the state interests always come first. So that comes before your shareholders, before yourselves, before your customers. And there's a cost of doing business that way. And we are subsidizing that cost by investing in these places, in these companies. And also these companies typically have very poor accounting standards, very poor transparency. We don't know who the”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Okay, I'm not trying to call him out or anything. I'm just saying on Wall Street, we sometimes deny our own power and we create these things meaninglessly just a cell product. And then the acronym gets hijacked by autocrats.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So they coined that phrase, you know, grouping these countries, but there's nothing in common among these countries except they're all emerging markets, they're all coming from a low base. So it really made no sense except that it made an acronym. And Wall Street, I think sometimes doesn't realize or consciously denies its own powers. And we created that acronym. Then these countries started something called the BRICS Summit, right? So now they're a summit. So kind of a competition to the G7 and so forth. And now Iran wants to join.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, so that was prompted by a tweet that I saw that said Iran now wants to join the BRICS, right? So BRICS was coined by an economist at Goldman Sachs like 2001 or something. Maybe even longer.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, I mean, I think that's a pretty high level of brain drain. I think without capital controls, it would be even higher. So these countries have those capital controls for a reason.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It's very different from EMX China. So ex China just acts as China out of a market cap weighted index. It's not anything else. It's just an arbitrary exclusion. And I think that's a band-aid on a much deeper problem and it doesn't address the root issue, which is the lack of freedom is the problem in China, not China itself.”
2022-07-01 · Masters in Business · Perth Tolle on ETF Freedom Metrics · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source