YouSaid · the spoken record

Robert Buckland

lines on the record: 38
first: 2020-06-19
most recent: 2020-06-19
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Well, indeed, we've just heard the sad news, and indeed I have, I did sing that for my constituents on VE Day, so we can have a go, can't we? We will meet again. Don't know where, don't know when but I know we'll meet again some sunny day There we are, how's it about that?”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Oh, yeah, so we had a Christmas carol concert in the department last Christmas and I was joining in with the choir. And again, it's just music, I don't know what I would do without music, Nick. It's an essential part of who I am, what I am. I mean, I think some people get the idea that I'm a rather straight-laced sort of serious fellow. Well, yes, I take the job that I do seriously, but I don't really take myself too seriously. I think that's a very good way of working and living, especially at a time like this when, as you say, the pressures in prisons have been immense and the day-to-day responsibilities can be overwhelming at times.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I love singing. Oh, I mean, as a child, I sang in school, never worried about getting up in front of the school and singing the Welsh National Anthem. And I still love performing. Online.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I loved Hardy, I read most of Hardy, all of Dickens, Trollop, I just devoured Victorian literature. I was an English A-level student, so it had a higher purpose, but I just wild away the hours. And I think it entered the soul because some people have accused me in the past of having perhaps a more flowery rhetorical style, which I then had to sort of hone down when I became an advocate in court. But, you know, these influences have never left me. And then music in the background are perhaps a bit of Duke Ellington in the background. I was a great and I still am a great lover of jazz and that's extensive.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, actually, my son and I collaborated on that one. And that's something of a ritual in our household that every Christmas we treat ourselves to a new set and set about the work that's needed to be done. And it's a joint project. And frankly, it's a wonderful bond to have because when I was young, we talked about my solitary existence. It was LEGO that helped to keep me going together with all the books, all the literature I could find and all the music I could find as well. So those are the creature comforts, if you like, that line my study.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, you go through a series of emotions. I mean, first of all, it's denial. Then it's acceptance that something is not right. Then when you find out what the issue is, it's a sort of a mixed feeling of relief that you have a diagnosis, but then a sort of mourning, really, a grief. You go through a sort of period of grief understanding what it is that you might have lost. And then after that, it's acceptance that that is how it's going to be and it's not going to change and an understanding that really you've got to work within those parameters to do the best for your child. And there are so many families that have gone through all those processes and of course it teaches you a lot about yourself. But it also teaches you about the fact that there's no such thing as normal. That's one thing I've learnt as a result of this and I've given up worrying about what might be normal.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yes, I think it's taught us a lot about ourselves and also about the system and the fact that frankly it was a battle 15 or so years ago to get a diagnosis for my daughter and then to get a statement of special educational needs for her. And whilst in my case, you know, being a lawyer, having the wherewithal to have those sharp elbows and not take no for an answer is great. What about all those families that don't have that? And, you know, in the years since, I've worked very hard in...”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, yes, I am looking at that very carefully. I'm very attracted by the idea of smaller juries as we did in the war. I think that could deliver us some capacity. The Lord Chief Justice has talked himself about perhaps having a judge and two magistrates for some of the less serious cases that end up in the Crown Court. I think that has clear merit. And also what we'll call the Zoom trial, the Zoom jury of 12 men and women all sitting together in one place, perhaps remotely, working together but viewing all the evidence. I think that has merit as well and I've seen a lot of mock trials taking place. I've spoken to the participants and I've been impressed by the work that's been done there. So I think I'm going to have to use every tool in the book in order to deliver the swift justice that victims, that witnesses, the public would want us to.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Actively examining potential change but limited for the period that would be strictly necessary and not the sort of change that would in any way be permanent or would be allowed to be permanent by Parliament. So yes, wartime juries.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, Nick, I think listeners will be glad to know that I'm not just sitting here and waiting because already with the judiciary, we've been working really hard to get the courts reopen. A number of them were closed because we concentrated our energies on a few courts. That's now changing. We're also developing Nightingale courts or Blackstone courts, as some people are calling them, looking for civic centres and other buildings where we can expand to use space for a whole myriad of cases, perhaps families, civil cases and some criminal cases as well. And all that work's going on apace now. But from all the information I've seen, I think we need to do more. And I want to go further than just managing the caseload, bearing in mind the caseload has increased somewhat, we need to eat into that. And that's going to take us over a period of quite a few months this year and next year to get sorted. So yes, I am indeed.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“A case in point. I think that we can weather these constitutional blowups and with some adjustments which I think are inevitable in a developing and mature constitution like ours, we can maintain that balance and ensure that we have an independent judiciary that is beyond reproach and an executive and a legislature that can get on with the job that it is elected to do.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I think judges, the tradition in these islands, England, Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland, is for judges to answer the question that they give and no more and no less. And what I've seen over the years is that where courts answer the question directly and confine themselves to that, then that is good law. And where you see perhaps departures from that good principle, then things get a, shall we say, a little unclear and perhaps people are misunderstood. I think that the principle of comedy, which is where the judiciary operate in their sphere and have respect for the parliamentary sphere of activity and vice versa, is what we should adhere to. And yes, there have been times when we've had tensions. I mean, last September was...”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I think we're all believers, Nick, at an independent judiciary, and none of us, certainly on the conservative side, want to see a sort of US-style constitutional court. The specter of congressional hearings we all saw in the Kavanaugh case. So I think you and I are old enough to remember Clarence Thomas back in the 80s, you know, the ideological war between Democrats and Republicans. None of us want to see that in the United Kingdom. The appointment of judges, I think, has to be somewhat more, shall we say, refined process. We shouldn't be interested in judges' political opinions. We want to know how good they're going to be on the bench. Are they the right quality to meet senior responsibility?”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, we've got a deal. The question is the depth of it or otherwise. So for my money, no deal is gone. We're now in a position about degree and how far we can go and how quickly we can reach that agreement. And therefore, we're in a very different position from the one that faced me last year and the one that openly worried me when it came to the way in which we left the European Union. So I'm very realistic about this. I think that there's a lot of work to be done. It's a bumpy road ahead for both sides, but that I'm sure that we're going to get to a position where we will be able to leave with that particular FTA, the particular deal that we're going to have at the end of the year, and carry on working with and having the dialogue with the EU and European member states in a way.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Unfinished business, Nick, and the fact that we will conclude a round of negotiations now with Europeans does not preclude us from continuing to have that dialogue, continuing to look to make separate agreements on various measures as various things that are”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I definitely feel that I can have sway and have my voice heard. And I do make my voice heard. And whilst I think that this is not an easy process, COVID has complicated it. We all know that the face-to-face talks have been difficult, though they're coming back and that's a really good thing. It's also difficult for our European friends as well, distracted as they are by the challenges of COVID-19. And therefore, really, we're now all in this together in a way that we could live envisaged only six months ago. And I believe ultimately, you know, that's going to focus minds in a way that will result in a sensible outcome at the end of the year, one that might mean that we will have unfinished business with our European friends. But, you know, isn't that the reality of international politics? It's always.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It because I'd taken part in the process, then I felt boned to carry it out. However bitter the goal might have been for me.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I mean, you could turn the question back and ask them how they managed to sit around the table with me, I suppose, Nick. I mean, I think having lived this experience and been through the mill on the issue of Europe, not just since the referendum, but for many, many years before that, because you are right. I was a passionate pro-European, a great believer that as a Welshman part of a United Kingdom, not worrying about my identity and being part of a greater union, then it was logical for me to be supportive of our membership of the European Union. But I, like many other Conservatives, voted for a referendum. I supported the referendum as a means to decide an issue that clearly was dividing the country and which was necessary to be brought to a head sooner or later. And therefore, I felt honor-bound by the fact that although the result went in a way that I didn't agree with and didn't like, because I'd support.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I mean, we've all got our different outlook on these things. And I can't really comment as to what his precise personal view is of it. We will all have our different approaches to these things. And I wouldn't seek to criticise people who did it, but at the same time, I think you've got to ask yourself, you know, what do I feel about how I can contribute to this debate? And I feel that it's far better for us to make that individual judgment and to act rather than make gestures that look good, but perhaps don't really mean very much when it comes to the substance.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“For me to mean it. And therefore, I think, judge me by the actions that I take as Lord Chancellor. But remember that I will and will regularly continue to be on my knees praying for and with my brothers and sisters from wherever they're from.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“That's a question that I've thought about a lot over the last week or so. And I do take to my knees to pray with all my friends, brothers and sisters, whoever they might be, from wherever they're from, and I've done it many, many times, and I will continue to do it. What I'm wary of doing is making some sort of gesture. I suppose a bit like the Pharisees in the New Testament who were very loud at portraying and professing their loyalty to God by beating their breasts and being prominent in the temple, but who underneath actually didn't mean it and didn't represent the values that we would want them to represent. And I think it's easy for me to make a cheap gesture much more difficult.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It's not Well, no, I don't think it needs to, Nick. And I think that having seen the increase in the proportion amongst tribunal judges, which is very welcome, then I think that we will see that change coming in the crown courts, in the high court, and in other parts of the system where judges are more, perhaps more public figures, more visible figures, and in a way that I think people will understand is not mere tokenism, but an understanding that here we have people of talent, of merit who have come through the system, have championed those obstacles and have themselves played their part in helping to remove the obstacles that clearly exist.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I'm always ready for a fight where I am absolutely convinced of the case. I'm convinced of the need for change and progress. But what I also have to make sure is that when judges are selected, merit is the primary consideration. And that means that, as I said earlier, some of the consequences of the state of the professions 20 years ago are ones that we're still having to live with. Therefore, it's my job, and I think the job of the professions as well, to get the flow of the supply of talent right now so that we can benefit from that future balance. I'm seeing many more.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“What we're trying to do there is to level the playing field before the applications are made. So doing more training and support work with professionals from that background before they make the application will, I believe, help just bring things forward that bit quicker in order to see that increase in the proportion of judges. I think the problem with the judiciary is that, of course, we're looking for experience and we're looking for ability. And the decisions and the career choices made 15 or 20 years ago are still with us in the sense that the flow and the supply is going to be a slow one. And therefore, I'm really the captain of a”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“And the fact that we now have these statistics is as a result of the work that this department's been doing over the last few years, Nick. I'm not pretending that that's a position that anybody should be content with. There's work going on already to pilot new schemes to deal with young offenders from a BAME background in a different way, not necessarily taking cases to court as the first response, but actually intervening before those arrests, those charges are made in order to try and, if you like, level the playing field when it comes to the particular challenges being faced by that group of people that then sadly end up in our young offenders institution. That work is going on now. The chance to change program is happening. It's something that we are going to have to evaluate and understand. And then when it comes to the judiciary,”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I think what I found is that this work is never done. You might think at the end of the day you've achieved things, you've moved things on, you've made decisions that will hopefully bring benefits to people. But then it's as if on the next day you have to start all over again because there will be people out there, groups out there who you haven't reached and you haven't been able to communicate with, you haven't been able to convince. And that work of advocacy and that work of communication, if you like, is one that has to continue.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yes, it has. I've had the opportunity to speak to members of staff here in the Ministry of Justice remotely, but in a way that perhaps I wouldn't have been able to do only a few months ago to make the point that when it comes to what happened in Minneapolis and their reaction to it, it was not just a creed occur, but actually an expression that people have had enough. An understanding that and wishing to respond to that and adapting is something that I think we're all duty-bound to do. And therefore, it would have been, I think, wrong of me not to search my own soul and to try and understand even better the challenges that face people who come from different walks of life from me. You know, my view has always been, certainly as an advocate and as a politician, is that whilst I might not have lived the experience,”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I mean, in truth, it's a combination of a myriad of experiences working as a practitioner, legal aid practitioner mainly in South Wales, representing a plethora of different people. They came in all shapes and sizes, a lot of young offenders who I represented, and many, of course, living and working in Cardiff from a very diverse ethnic population in that city, some of whom, of course, have been there for generations and understanding the cultural variances, the great diversity within that urban area, I think it really equipped me to understand that the question of trust is one that you have to build from the bottom up if you are really going to make headway in ensuring the criminal justice system actually is serving everybody in an equal way.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Absolutely right, Nick. When I came in, I said the wig is back. And the reason I did that was that for me, this is an office that has been of huge significance constitutionally down the centuries. And I'm a great believer that when you are appointed to a great office, you need to respect that office. And the way you respect it is by respecting its traditions. It's easy to take a Corn Meb approach to these things, be the sort of amateur iconoclast. That's not my style.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“In a word, yes. I think this unusual role that I have, it's a very recent role, although the Lord Chancellor's office is ancient, it stretches back to Saxon times. And when I think about some of my predecessors, Thomas Beckett, Thomas Moore, Cardinal Wolsey, it sort of stops you in your tracks, really. But it is a modern role in the sense that the last Labour government combined it with something called the Secretary of State for Justice, a new ministerial role. So I have this dual job of running a department and also holding the constitutional role of guardian of the judiciary and the rule of law. And they are horses that can be sometimes a little unroody, but which with my background and my understanding of the courts having not just appeared as counsel but sat as a part-time judge as well, I think give me the equipment to deal with whatever”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“You can vary the law at the moment, the maximum is three months for any type of criminal damage under £5,000 in value. Now, I can think of a lot of examples of, you know, as George Elliot said, unvisited tombs, which might not be worth much, a Commonwealth war grave, for example, in a town cemetery, of which we have many, but which when they are damaged causes real hurt to the local community, a real sense of loss actually, which I don't think at the moment we reflect properly in the sentencing limit that we have. And I think we can do something about that.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“To give them more discretion to pass a sentence that meets the gravity of the offence. So I'm going to be working with my colleagues on this.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I think the current campaign that has been launched by my colleagues on the back benches is the latest manifestation of a series of concerns about the fact that although items might not be of huge monetary value, they are of vast symbolic value, whether they be war memorials, whether they be cemeteries, perhaps headstones, Jewish cemeteries, for example, or other types of religion. And whilst the monetary value might not be great, they're symbolic and cultural value is enormous. And at the moment, it seems to me that the law doesn't fully reflect that. There are things I think we can do just to change the way in which the courts deal with that type of criminal damage, which doesn't mean I have to start tampering with sentence maximums, but which allows the courts to deal with that type of case in a more flexible way.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“It is a fear, and it's one that worries me weekly, which is why I think it's incumbent upon people like me, and particularly in the position that I know hold, to really stick to the lath and continue to make the case for a democratic and lively and vigorous and sometimes heated debate within a framework of the rule of law, something that we can all be treated equally under, something that gives us redress of grievance if things go wrong, and something which I think is the hallmark of a civilization that doesn't just pay lip service to democracy, but actually lives and breathes it through an independent judiciary and an independent legal profession to boot.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, it was, Nick, but what was driving me was this real sense of concern or passion, if you like, about unaccountable power. And what I saw happening in those days of industrial strife was one group of people, a self-appointed group, who hadn't obtained a strike through democratic means, trying to use it as a political device. And that's what really concerned me. I've never liked unaccountable power. I've always been suspicious of it from whatever source it comes. And it happened to be the manifestation through this particular union that caused me, that drove me, if you like, to stand up and say, look, I bet I've got to do something about this. I've got to get involved. I've got to try and make sure that if we have democracy and the rule of law, they actually mean something. And I suppose from then, you know, that beginning 35.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“No, it wasn't. And it was something that I got stuck into from the age of 15. Again, people might look askance at that and think that I donned the political anarak a little bit young. But I use my public library. I went down there. I had to think about it. I read various tracts about politics and decided that actually I was a Tory. And actually a one-nation Tory to boot. That's been something that's been consistent throughout my life and something that I'm proud to uphold now in Boris Johnson's cabinet.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, it's a bit. I mean, I was chairman of a lively YC branch internationally. There were twenty or twenty-five of us, and this was back in the deep eighties when, as you say, the minor stripe was raging. We were going through a very ideological time in our politics. So being a young conservative...”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I think it was my young life that taught me a lot about solitude, if you like, loneliness, ploughing a different path, taking the road less travelled, are not worrying about it, not worrying about what other people might think and not really caring about what other people might think of my views, but understanding that in doing so the path taken did mean that perhaps I wasn't going to be the most popular person in the neighbourhood or necessarily somebody who wanted to fit in particularly. I never really remember worrying about having wanting to fit in with other people, always feeling perhaps a sense of just being a little different, but not really worrying about that too much.”
2020-06-19 · Political Thinking with Nick Robinson · The Robert Buckland One · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source