YouSaid · the spoken record

Sam McAlister

lines on the record: 58
first: 2022-10-10
most recent: 2022-10-10
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Well, I'm hugely lucky I'd never written a book before. I'd written a legal opinion, but they weren't very good, I would have thought for reading. But my book's been optioned to be made into a film. So I do speaking and I advise companies on how not to do a Prince Andrew, to be frank, or how to convince brackets, a prince. But I'm also currently working on a screenplay with Peter Moffat, who has won a zillion Emmys and was just working with Brian Francison, and now he's stuck with Sam McAllister. Poor man, I can only apologize. So I'm hugely fortunate to have these opportunities and I'm very grateful that I made the decision I did.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Too late though. It's all on camera. I mean, if you think about the repercussions of trying to do something about it, that would make the story even bigger. So take a cataclysmic interview and then take phone call to the DG, BBC puts out 45 minutes anyway, and then we do a separate two-way with Emily talking about how we were approached by this law firm and this individual. And then we got a sinister phone call and makes it even worse.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“He is the most shocking part of all not one jot Take that in for a second. I was expecting the machinations of the establishment which I believe they call it, but I know it's out there somewhere. I don't seem to be part of it. I was expecting phone calls, lawyers. I would have faked my own death in that interview to make it stop if I was Amanda or indeed Prince Andrew. I really would have done anything. I would have set the place on fire. Absolutely nothing. Now, isn't that astonishing? I mean, I know they say the palace is, you know, never complain, never explain. But on this one occasion, you would have thought that they would have done something and they unbelievably impressively once it was done, that was that.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Risk on me. I wrote the book and I left. I wish it had been different and that I could still be there and have written the book and all of that jazz. But the system is not set up to give credit to producers. And so I'm just trying to do a little bit. It's no shade on Emily or the BBC. That's just how it is. I'm just trying to do my little bit to change that a little bit.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Look, it's a tricky thing, Credit, I think, because obviously there are a number of people on the team and all of them worked extremely hard and I'm just one part of that. Obviously, there's a point at which there are opportunities that came my way. And for people who've read the book, they will know, for example, and I don't say this with any side, it's just a fact, you might expect, for example, that somebody would get a pay increase or something like that or, you know, something, a bonus or something if they did something like that. And that's not how the BBC works. So there's a stage at which you have to have an honest conversation with yourself and say, this was something huge that I was a part of and that frankly, you know, I wanted to have the opportunity to tell my tale about it. And it was clear from conversations I had privately that I wasn't going to be allowed to write a book if I wanted to. So I had to make a decision. So I pulled on my big girl pants and I took her.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Really, that is the crux of everything that I recommend. You know, don't be smart ass. Listen, be polite. If you don't get the negotiation, if you don't get it, ask why not politely, not with a bob. And maybe you can change. Maybe you can change their mind in the future. Make sure you get proper feedback. Always say thank you. Be on time. So not being an arsehole, I think, is crucial to the whole negotiation process and treating people with dignity and respect and remembering it's a long game. They may say no today, so leave a good impression just in case there's a possibility of saying yes tomorrow.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“My top tip, first of all, is a very basic one, which is your first impression is everything. So if you're negotiating with somebody, whether it's on the phone or whether it's by an email, make sure you triple check how to spell their name. Make sure you don't mix your fonts. Do not use a generic email. Make sure you use the right pronouns. Nowadays, that's particularly contentious, but I mean, I meant previously he or she, but, you know, whatever the pronoun is, make sure you get the pronoun right. Make sure you do a modicum of research so you can drop something into your email or your conversation that shows that this is not a generic call. The generic negotiation is the enemy of excellence. And one of the reasons I was”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Bad for public trust because if you don't really understand how things come about, then how can you understand that journalism is fair or unfair or is opaque or clear? So I think producers do deserve more attention and value given to them. And I hope my book is a tiny little bit because I've received hundreds of messages from producers all around the world thanking me for giving them a bit of a voice. So I hope it's helpful on that front.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Hello, Sally, new best friend. What's so interesting, Picture, isn't it? It's like when somebody does, for example, Lee's do set at the BBC, it's really excellent as a BBC example of always adding in her producers when she does an item. And people just kind of like hero worship her for that. Now, I think it's wonderful that Lise does it. But isn't that a strange thing in a sense that somebody gets a load of credit for mentioning the other people who actually did work? And I think there's a problem in the industry, which manifested itself with a speech I did, an award I was lucky enough to get for the women film and television awards with Emily, where I talked about producers basically being undervalued and kind of like pretended that they don't exist. And the industries created a dynamic in which credit is given in some quarters and not others. And I don't think that's good for the industry. I don't think it's good for producers. You can't really say, well, this is what I did because no one knows because it's not talked about.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Extremely hardworking and gifted, but that disconnect between what I would call the BBC world, the world journalism, it's not just the BBC, and the real world, to put it crudely, I think is problematic.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think the nobody cares test is actually hugely important, and I probably made myself quite unpopular towards the end of my career, if not throughout, by having what I would call the nobody cares test. You know, that is not what the average person on the street is talking about. Nobody cares about you're in the bubble, Westminster piece of gossip, about how this undersecretary of something said this thing in the new statesman or the spectator that some other common nobody cares. People have got children to feed. They've got kids to educate. They've got energy bills to pay. And I think that that diversity of opinion has reduced over the years that I was working there, I would say. And my concern was that the average BBC journalist might be spending too much time getting their opinions from others in the same group of thoughts in the same world. And they're very nice and decent people and lots of them.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think the joy or the horror of working at the BBC is everybody, it's like almost 50 50. Everyone thinks we're too pro-conservative, then everybody else thinks we're too pro-Labour. You know, you're too pro-Israel, you're too anti-Israel. It's quite hard to tell when you're in there, really, you know, how the pendulum swings. I think if you're getting a healthy amount of criticism on both sides, that's probably a good thing. But I do worry about the connection between the organization and the country because we are the British broadcasting corporation and we should be accountable to the license fee payers. I do think that there is a disconnect between the way that sometimes the BBC sees the country and how the country is and a lot of that I think comes from a lack of direct experience.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“For the uninitiated who haven't read the book, you have the choices that we have are basically the two poor women that were incarcerated by the monster Ariel Castro, the daughter of Rudolf Hoss, who I don't think goes out to drink very much. Julian Assange, who you're right, I didn't particularly bond with his limp handshake killed me. And then on the other end, we've got Stephen Segal who walked off set, then we've got Sean Spicer who hates us, James Comey, who seems very nice but quite serious. So my answer would definitely be drum roll, stormy Daniels Loved her brilliant interview because, as Perstella's point, honest. Listen to questions, gave honest answers, looked like she's a lot of fun. I bet she's got some good tales. So stormy if you're watching, available drinks on me.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, I call it the royal delusion because I'm used to talking to people in power and the problem about being a person in power and why many of our politicians I believe are out of touch despite having been nice people or still being nice people in some way at some juncture is you have so much smoke blown up you and people tell you you're amazing and no one ever tells you that you're wrong and now times that by 100,000 favorite son of the queen live in a palace never had a knockback for a job never lived on the breadline never had an appraisal none of the normal things that rain you in in terms of your ego ever happened to Prince Andrew so I call it the royal delusion the disparity between what he thought he was capable of having been told he was amazing amazing amazing and what he was actually capable of was obviously writ large in that interview”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“They now say 100%, Seller. I think that's a really great point. And it's one of the things I say in the book this was an incredibly unusual interview because of his frankness. I mean, imagine a politician doing that. Imagine if you sat down, a minister, and you said, oh, this energy crisis, how it's going, and they went, oh, well, basically we haven't got a clue what to do, it's a total disaster, you're going to have to choose between energy and eating. Good luck to you left the set, dropped the mic. I mean, he...”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Step back from public life? Do you get pizzas thrown at you now everywhere you go? They were really peed off with me. I have to be honest. It's taken me two years. So Pizza Express, I don't know whether you saw, but after that happened and it became part of our lexicon. I mean, Anton and Dick mentioned it and I've really made it at that stage. Peter expressed the Twitter account did something like, oh, you walk away from your computer for 10 minutes on the night that it happened. And then I have to say no free dobles. I want you to know that my integrity is intact. And I'm not sure that I am their most popular person, but Peter Express, I love you. Sam McAllister, thank you. Right. We've got questions coming in. So let's start. This one is from Stella in Willsden Green. Do you think Prince Andrew should be given any credit for just being himself in the interview, however crassly he came across? He didn't, you know, he told his truth as.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“journalists in news, cataclysmic, and my other brain, criminal defence barrister a long time ago, but the training still stands, he was so, so done for by that interview. You knew what the newslines would be, sweaty pizza, all of that jazz, and you knew if you were a prosecutor, looking at that interview, it was a dream come true because whether or not the things he was saying were true or not, which I don't know the answer to, they were easy to disprove. And if you were running a multi-million pound litigation against somebody of his standing, that was a gold mine. So I knew he was in double whammy trouble as a news journal and as a lawyer. I knew it was cataclysmic, but I didn't realize quite how much it would profoundly affect him and how quickly he would effectively”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You know, he gave Emily a sort of 20 minute tour of the palace. I didn't go because you know what I'm like. If he'd ask me how it went, I wouldn't be able to lie to him. I'm not good at that. It's the job of the presenter, as you know, to keep things more formal, more distant. So it's not so tricky to if he says, how did it go? You can go, well, you know, very interesting chat, sir. I'm not that kind of person. I knew I would mess it up. So I steered clear. But that was like a 20 minute tour. And those famous pictures of the two of them striding together, they were taken after that interview had taken place, which is an extraordinary thought. That is extraordinary. Before we get to the questions, which we will in a moment, could you have foreseen that this would really finish him off as a royal? It's interesting that because Emily says she didn't realize how bad it was until the edit. Well, I can tell you, Petri, I realized straight away how bad it was. My two brains.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Be extremely disadvantageous to him, but as to your question, did I feel bad? No, because his answers and his behaviour, alleged, or unalleged as the case may be, were what put him in that situation. So he is the opposite of say, for example, an interviewee whose child has died in tragic circumstances or who finds themselves, you know, falsely arrested or some terrible thing has happened to, he was the polar opposite. His answers were his responsibility. He's a big grown up man with every privilege and every opportunity for advice and support, and his answers were what did it for him, and they were his responsibility and his responsibility alone. So although you obviously feel God, you know, Paul Bloke hasn't realized how badly this has gone, there wasn't a feeling that I had of guilt about that because that was entirely self-inflicted.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I barely knew him. That's the thrust of what you want to say here. And as we know, none of the answers gave us that basic message which was this was a terrible mistake, and I am terribly, terribly sorry. And as every minute continued and every answer came, and we got further and further away from that simple proposition of what the interview should have been, a heartfelt apology, I knew how terrible it was for him. I mean, it really was terrible for him. As the person that put him in that seat, how did you feel? Because you're not a bad person. You would have felt, you would have known what this would have done to him. Yes, it's an interesting one, that isn't it, because you feel obviously human empathy in the sense that he has done something that you know is going to.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I was 15 feet behind him, and I could only see the back of him. So all I could see were the physical manifestations of what he was saying coupled with the words, some of which we'd heard in that last negotiation on the Monday. The yes was on the Tuesday, the interview was on the Thursday. So sort of, you know, not that many hours later. I was expecting a very different interview from the interview that happened because I assumed he would have been, you know, kind of like coached within an inch of his life to basically not say much. Yeah. You know, that political answer, that kind of political, you know, run down the tape, run, you know, keep talking. All you need to do is the simple thing is you turn up the first thing you say is, you know, I'm so sorry that this happened. Terrible crimes that this man has committed. I deeply regret my friendship with him. I wouldn't even call it a friend.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So you are, I may or may not have seen a photograph of you on that day, but you were not far from obviously the action. You're the producer of this interview. Emily briefed and researched, okay? So she was sitting there, he was sitting there, just the two of them. And the interview starts. How long was it before you realized that this was explosive? This was other. This was something else. Well, absolutely. I mean, I should clarify that the exec on this interview was Stuart McLean, who's now the editor. So he was the overlord at that stage because you bring the baby, if you like, to the party and then somebody takes overlooking after it. And Jake Morris was also there, a producer who'd been working on the investigations, if you like, to be able to provide Emily with those calm, methodical questions. So I was not the only producer in the room.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I expected to turn up to a very angry lawyer who he or she would be looking like they wanted to basically take me outside and skin me, I expected some other head of communications who was probably, you know, angry that this was happening. Sats standing next to me with some kind of recorder exactly taking pictures of me, taking pictures of a man, taking pictures of Stuart, standing next to Emily, kind of like giving her a sort of, you know, sort of slightly intimidating vibe. That's what I expected, but that is not what's happened.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yes, he brought Princess Beatrice to the final negotiation, which was definitely unusual and really through a spammer in the works. But on that day, what was unusual actually, Petri, was how few people there were. Amanda was there and someone junior to her, I think a couple of interns, not entirely sure who all the protagonists were. At one stage, somebody else turned up. That's become somewhat contentious, so I'll be a bit careful about what I say about that. But someone who worked for the Queen arrived and then may or may not have left it's unclear, according to the current briefings about that. So I didn't see him again, but he may have been in the room and I didn't notice. But really, I was expecting the cavalry.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Reason, which is you don't want your interviewee to corner you and ask you a load of tricky questions, so absolutely correct that she wasn't there, but it meant we then just had like a casual little chass about, you know, the weather, how British, about the cinema club that was going to be there that evening. It was going to be Judy with Ren ⁇ Zelweather. We had a chat about Renee Zelweger and the projector, which he kindly got out from behind a wall. I mean, this is really bonkers surreal at this stage. You know, Prince Andrew's clambering up a wall, pulling out a projector. You know, you're just kind of like, how did this happen? But, you know, fascinating because that's the experienced billionaire, isn't it? That conversation actually was the thing that for me, if you like, was the most interesting part of my day, aside from the incredibly cataclysmic interview, because that's the thing that you'll always remember. So, yeah, chatting with him.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, what's so interesting about it is we're like scattered elements as the team on a day because the first people to turn up at the camera crews, it takes about two hours to get all of that television magic, the lighting, the sound engineer, all of those cables. It's a huge room. You see about 5% of the room. Nightmare, the lighting was nightmare, the sound was a nightmare. We couldn't bring all of our stuff because there were security issues. You name it every problem. So they'd been there about an hour and a half. I always turned up super early to anything I was working on because to be frank, I always say I'm an experienced billionaire. I mean, you know, how many times you're going to get to go and do that? So I think I was about 45 minutes early from when the interview was going to start. So as luck would have it, Prince Andrew ambled into the room. Emily wasn't there at that juncture. As you know, presenters tend to arrive at the last moment for really good practical.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Personal bond that we made, and I think that that foundation was absolutely crucial in making sure that the interview happened. And of course, the brilliant assistance of Emily and then latterly the Deputy Editor Stuart McLean, who's now the editor there, was hugely, hugely helpful and important, but without the foundation, there is no house.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, look, I mean, I would say that, wouldn't I, given that obviously it's about me in a sense, but to be fair, it's impossible to know. But of course, I do feel that that relationship of trust gave us such a huge advantage because I don't know who else she was speaking to, but the fact that we built that relationship of trust, she's always talked about to this day my integrity and how fair I was. Can you imagine, just take just one second. Imagine that a woman whose life was basically, some people may say brightly, but professionally, ruined by having met me because I was the person she met first, that she is so magnanimous and so fair that she still wishes me the best. Now, what greater measure could there be of her generosity, of spirit and her adultness, but also a measure of the bond, the professional bond and the”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Directly rather than just to me, I'd never taken a Because by this stage, we're many months in. Is this just for fun, basically? Is this Japes? Or is this something real? And she said, yes, I think we're going to do one. And then we were scurry down, Emily and I, and I remember us looking at one another and just at that point it became real for the first time because prior to then it could have just been that they wanted to bring us in and you know they they're talking to everybody at that point I knew that we had a palpable and possible interview because she would not have said that unless it was true she was not that kind of person”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I felt it had reached my negotiation point always was that you reach a point of critical mass at which your silence is deafening. They'd sent out these little, you know, little tiny commentaries, you know, it's like three lines, relentless interviews with all the alleged victims, this cataclysmic kind of like news thing rolling towards them and they're still there giving out their three-line written statement. The atmosphere had definitely changed. Of course, it felt even less likely that he would do an interview in one sense, but more likely that if he was going to do one, now was the moment because it was only going to get worse. So when I went back that time, I took Emily with me. I thought it would be hugely useful. Obviously, star power, but also in terms of the trust relationship for her to be able to speak to Emily.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Every time the story moved me getting in touch with her and being politely declined over and over and over again goes on from May until October, when Miracle of Miracles, suddenly she invites me back.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Coming along soon, hopefully, looking into the wistful future. Of course, never imagining that it would be this. But the skill, of course, from that moment of spending time with Amanda and building that trust and building kind of like that mutual understanding is that as the story started to cataclysmically change for Prince Andrew, Epstein's arrested, Epstein's charge, Epstein's dead, Maxwell's arrested, Maxwell's charge, Virginia Roberts is doing interviews galore, the FBI are involved. I mean, it just becomes cataclysmic. At every single increment, because you don't want to be harassing somebody or imposing on them, but every time the story changed, I'm back in touch with Amanda saying Things are looking very tricky, you sure you don't want to reconsider, the public wants to hear what Prince Andrew has to say on the record. Would you consider meeting me? And this merry dance of every few days.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, I'm very used to know. I mean, the misfortune of the interviews producers, you have to be excellent with rejection. You do have to have a thick skin about it. It's a very hard job because you can work for two years and nothing comes of it. I remember actually I just had an appraisal just before Prince Andrew eventually did say yes later in the year with my lovely deputy editor. And we'd sat there rather awkwardly because I'd been put on trying to persuade US presidential candidates to come on the program. To be frank, they've never heard of the program. They've never heard of our presenters. They don't know who we are. As I used to say, we're poo on the shoe to them. They don't know who we are. It's impossible. And I got literally nowhere with any of them other than maybe a response to an email for about six months. So we'd have a somewhat awkward appraisal where he'd very kindly gone, well, you know, obviously I know how brilliant you are, but it's been a bit of a barren six months. I'm like, yeah, well, I'm sure something.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, we'd never had a rural interview, so it definitely was. I think the process was quite short-lived, Petra, I've got to be honest. I got back to the office. I would have got the bustle, the tube, I can't remember. Maybe I walked. And it was probably three minutes of excitement followed by the inevitable no. I mean, Emily would have been like, oh, that's exciting. My colleague next to me, Rebecca, who always sat next to me and was my cheerleader, would be like, that's amazing. And then obviously within three minutes, you've told the editor there's a condition. You know she's going to say no. But I enjoyed the three minutes. Yeah.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That entire front of Buckingham Palace with all the tourists thinking who the two is that Rando and of course understandably not knowing who I was because I'm not anyone they would have known who existed luckily and then walking in through that door and being shown into the waiting room on my own where rather D class A, what can I say? Forgive me if anyone who's listening or watching I may or may not, I can't confirm or deny that I took some selfies, I can't confirm or deny, but I haven't put them on Instagram.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It was, it was really surreal because usually what happens is I would always try and do negotiations face to face, but usually obviously you're going to some bank or some embassy often impressive or beautiful or a coffee shop as the case may be, BBC budget, very careful with money, always walk to my meetings. I think I got a bus that day. But you would largely be doing that kind of faceless office or coffee shop negotiation to go and do a negotiation where you turn up and I'd never been inside Buckingham Palace and I doubt I will be again let's be clear. Pretty sure they're not going to be giving me an OB and lucky me that I'm not in the Tower of London but arriving at those steel gates that you've walked past or gone past on the bus and never really thought about and going up to the guys of the semi-automatics, having your name walking perilously in my case because as you know I always wear ridiculously high heels across”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Maybe one day our Davos will come. But he'd spoken about it there. He'd been asked a question and he'd basically sort of fobbed it off and the journalists hadn't followed it up. And I felt that they, yeah, I think he felt he closed the door there. He felt that he'd comment on it and that was that. And isn't that the beauty of being a member of the royal family that you think you can comment on something once and then, you know, the case is closed? But I had that in the back of my head. And when it was raised, I said, well, obviously he's already spoken to it, gave a little pretentious speech about freedom of the press and all that jazz knew I wasn't really getting anywhere with it. It wasn't going to happen because she was a woman of steely resolve. But, you know, once it's been mentioned, you can't put it back into the bag. So I knew it would probably be mentioned at some stage, but I certainly wasn't going to be the person to raise it.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, I think it depends on the person. With someone like Amanda, because clearly she was so highly intelligent, extremely, you know, gifted intellectually, that there's no elephant in the room with someone like that. You know, you're not dancing around something where you know perhaps they won't mention it because they might not have realized, of course you knows that that is an issue for them. That is a big issue for them. So I suspect we went, though we didn't mention it during, it's not my obligation to raise anything with her. We don't give questions, a myth about journalism. We don't tell them what we're going to ask, of course. So in my head, I looked at what his comment had been on Epstein in case she did raise it, and he'd previously commented on Davos, you know, that very posh Swiss.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, at that stage, to be honest with you, Petri, I mean, it wasn't such a. I mean, it sounds mad now, but it would have been something we would have asked, of course, you know, obviously this unfortunate, but it wasn't in the news. It wasn't really sort of like this huge story, this cataclysmic tale at that point. So question or two would have been asked, but it was possible that if we had done that interview and she hadn't set that red line down, we would have done a perfectly nice interview with him, got some newslines about Brexit in the future of the monarchy, asked him one or two questions about Geoffrey Epstein, game over, and then 10 weeks later or whenever it was that all of the shit, pardon my French, hit the fan with that story. We'd already done our interview, game over. So how lucky we were, can't do it. And then we said, I mean, I went back to the office and of course you're like, oh, this is just, I wish I hoped she was going to change your mind. Of course she didn't. And so then obviously the editor was like, we have to decline this. Absolutely 100% right.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“About Brexit, which at that point really was quite a coup. And then asking about Megan and Harry, also a coup, the future of the monarchy, the Prime Minister. So I felt brilliant. This is going extremely well. But then we got to the end point of the conversation, which is where you say, or, you know, is there anything else I can help with? I'm going back to the office. We'll discuss the possibility of this logistics, blah, blah, blah. We'll get back to you, all that generic stuff. And then she said, oh, there is one thing. And that is when your negotiation alarm bells just go ring, ring, ring, and you think, oh no, what is the one thing? And of course the one thing at that stage even that wasn't in the news so much was we don't want to talk about Geoffrey Epstein. That's a closed issue for us. But of course, that was the nail in the coffin for us doing.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Very often, frankly, so I would just sit and patiently listen. I never take notes because I think that makes people nervous. I never record a negotiation. I think that makes them jumpy too. And then, you know, once I'd heard what it was that they wanted to do, which was relatively similar to the first proposition and not very close at all to what I needed, which was anything we want to ask interview about any news issue out there, you know, freedom of speech and all that jazz, you know, then you know what the sweet spot is. You know where you have to aim. You know what the dance is between the two of you. And then that's the point at which having listened and understood, you're then able to formulate what your actual suggestion is in light of what they've said. And the actual suggestion at that stage may even be, well, I'm sorry that's not going to work. In this occasion, it felt that there was some room for conversation. I managed to get onto the table asking.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The first part would absolutely be just, you know, chit chat about this and that, obviously, at a relatively high level. Then you move, I would say, into the first part of a negotiation, which is then when you casually say, well, obviously, you know, we're here to talk about X. Can you tell me what you're thinking in your mind? Because the second mistake of negotiation is going in there and only looking for your own outcome. It's bleeding obvious what I want. I want an interview. So what's much more important is what does she want? So that would always be the first question I ask. What is it that you're looking for? So I understand, not say I can give it to you, but I need to understand what's in your mind before I do that terrible thing that most people do, but they just throw the pitch out straight away. Well, this is what we can offer. She doesn't care what we can offer. I need to know what she wants before I respond to it. So then the next phase will be listening. A shocking tactic, but one that's not you.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I mean, you're absolutely right. You know, that's the thing. And negotiation is not about the terms, it's about the surrounding elements. Hopefully this is the next book, the Rules of Negotiation. But you're absolutely right. That is one of the biggest rules. If you go in and you just talk about what you're there to talk about, then you're going to be out of there very quickly because it makes you look utilitarian. You make no connection and it doesn't show that you've thought about what the other person's experience of the negotiation is. Absolutely. The first part of our conversation would have been me establishing a genuine connection, asking about her professional life. It was clear from the room that we were in, which was very small and the room in which we did the eventual negotiation further down the line with Prince Andrew himself. There were pictures everywhere of him and his achievements, his family. We're very close quarters. We're a couple of feet apart. And so I would say...”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“100%. And for me, because I think that that is also sometimes a professional gambit to create a connection in order to get good answers. But the added element for me was that that's just genuine. It's every interaction I have. So I feel that often people would feel reassured by the fact that they knew I wasn't fake, to be frank. So they felt comfortable with what I was saying because they knew that it came from a place of integrity rather than the place of just trying to close the deal.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That's really kind. I mean, if I have a superpower, then that would be it. You know, I genuinely, I think the word genuine is hugely important. A lot of journalism and negotiation and dealing with people comes from a place of telling people what they want to hear and closing deals with people on basically sometimes slightly unfair or false premises. That is not my vibe. But quite separately, you're right. You know, I genuinely love people. I say in my book, my mum taught me to mix with princes and paupers, but didn't mean it literally. You know, you'll see me chatting to Raluca, who is the lovely young homeless woman at the end of my street, and you'll see me chatting to a billionaire and I treat them both the same pet as you know. So I think that connection to other people is actually at the core of excellent negotiation, but it's a thing people don't like to talk about because.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So we had that kind of commonality, but yes, it was surprising. The PRs were also there who'd introduced us, but they were largely silent for the two or three hours I was with her. And that was a really fascinating meeting because at the end of it, in the end, it didn't work out that time in May for reasons that we'll come to. But what it did is it was built that mutual respect, that mutual trust, and the way I negotiate is very plain speaking and very direct for better or worse. So we had by the end of that meeting a mutual respect and understanding that last to this day we are still in touch.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“No, that's what I found really interesting about it. And I think I may have just by luck, have entered the palace and entered his world, his realm, factually, in a very sort of like heady moment where there didn't seem to be much oversight on them. The oversight was with Harry and Meghan. They were talking about leaving at that juncture. Amanda was there on her own. She was, I know people may say, roll their eyes when I say this, but she was a hugely impressive woman, you know, superficially extremely high achieving. She was ex-city. We were bringing up children on our own for different reasons. I always researched the people I'm meeting, number one, ruled of negotiation, of course. So she was bringing up some girls. Her husband had sadly died. I was bringing up my son on my own, as you know. So we had that in common. My background is criminal defence barrister briefly. Her background was high flying city woman, briefly.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think it's very chicken and egg. I mean, in truth, the advisor is a bit like a producer in a sense. You know, when everything goes well, then probably the attention will fall to the boss, you know, the presenter or the member of the royal family. And when everything goes wrong, it's your neck in the line. So I felt we had almost that kind of understanding of one another. I do feel that basically if you're working for someone like that, a CEO, you know, let alone a member of the royal family unfettered, it's never going to be a situation that you're going to say, oh, tell you what, Prince Andrew, you really must do this interview and he's going to go, oh, okay then, it must be the case that the driving force would have been from him if he were in two minds, perhaps her opinion would have, you know, a weight on whether or not he said yes or no, but I can't believe for a second that I was in that room if there hadn't been a”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Conditions, no issues. We're not doing a thing. And remember, this was before it got really sticky for Prince Andrew. Epstein was still alive. He hadn't been charged. Maxwell's at large. Virginia Roberts is bringing her cases, but they haven't really hit kind of like the civil courts at that stage, the coverage is a bit kind of like low. So he was kind of a one out of ten in terms of peril by the time, obviously, we were doing the latter negotiations. He was at 10 out of 10 on peril. So it felt like a road to nowhere, but it was a road to Buckingham Palace. So of course, I duly obliged, packed my bag, and went off to meet Amanda Thursk on my own. I think that was in May, so before the interview happened in November.”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, the tone was basically I'd left the last email with, you know, obviously we're a news program, and so the kinds of things we would be insistent upon asking about would be, for example, you know, Brexit. Remember that? Future of the monarchy, Harry and Megan. So just to give them examples of how different their request was from what we would accept. So when they asked me to go back, they said basically that the palace was, or Amanda was open to a conversation to see whether there was any possibility of finding a way to do something with Newsnight, a way to collaborate. But it's so general, Petri, that as I said, I didn't even tell my boss. It felt like sort of a fishing sort of expedition that they wanted to see the cut of our jib, invite us in, and then I was 99% sure I would not be invited back because I was going to be extremely clear that unless it is no”
2022-10-10 · Intelligence Squared · Prince Andrew's Newsnight Interview: Behind The Scenes, with Sam McAlister · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT