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Sonal Desai

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68

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2025-07-24

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2025-07-24

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1. “Number one When you challenge yourself, you really can step up. Number two, there are parts of fixed income that I thought would be I'll just say it boring. They're not as exciting as going out and finding that emerging market. And what you find is actually everything is fascinating if you spend enough time looking at it. So that's been great. And I'd say the other part of it which has been somewhat surprising to me, I'd say, is it goes actually into the broader markets, not just my role within this group. It is the extent to which Markets look at what is happening currently, and it's a very short step for analysts to look at what's happening extended into the future and give you a reason for why it happened, how difficult it is to break out of the mold and try to actually genuinely look forward. Does this make sense? Yes.”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

2. “It's a real genetic difference because my instinct is, well, I haven't done that before. So I can't do it. And between my husband and Jenny, they basically kicked me in the pants and said, no, you can do it. Learn. Learn on a job. And I guess I did. It was fantastic. It's been really fantastic”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

3. “Jenny Johnson, the CEO of Franklin. She asked me if I thought I could take this role on. And I have to say, my first reaction was that there's too many pieces that I can't do. And I tell you something, this is a difference between men and women. My husband, when he looks at a job description, there are something like 20 things on that job. And so I can apply for this. I said, but, you know, you haven't done, you haven't ticked every one of these boxes. He says, I take that one and he will apply for it. And he will likely get the job.”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

4. “So it was a big change, and now we get to the point where my predecessor was retiring and Jenny asked if I thought I could do this”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

5. “So Ashley, you know, the reality is the team I joined at that time was the global macro team within Franklin Templeton. And in many respects, that team works with deep value investing in a sense looking for emerging markets which are totally out of favor, thinking in terms of long business cycles, and really investing abroad. So it was a bit of a natural transition, the part which was more complicated to get my head around was being part of an enormous organization after having basically been a part of a very small team, a small boutique team where if you want to do something, you could be very entrepreneurial and go out and do it. At Franklin, you had to get your arms around a much bigger organization. But it was very good.”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

6. “Barry, take it one step further and recognize that somebody, some kid who got into JP Morgan as a trader and was fortunate enough not to lose their job in oh eight oh nine this is somebody who Probably through COVID, ended up being a senior trader and has never lived through truly non-zero interest rates. I mean, yeah, the Fed started raising them, but through what I would consider normal business cycles, it is remarkable. That's when you really realize, wow, you've lived through interesting times.”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

7. “It was just amazing. And now I look back and it's like great, we did that, we did that. But I will tell you one of the best things about that time was remembering to look out of the window. We worked out of Berkeley Square lovely offices looking out of the window and watching people having normal lives and realizing the world doesn't begin or end with finance.”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

8. “true alternative. Private markets, especially for EM, had not deepened enough, and now as we got into zero eight oh nine, you started seeing the strength and power of the private sector, and then we had the global financial crisis. Holy cow, that was, you know, that was when I would walk around and I used to walk home from my work. I was just thinking, everyone keeps talking about, oh, you know, living in unprecedented times, living through history, I'd rather read about it. Living through it was amazing. I remember waking up at three or four in the morning to find out what had happened overnight, what were markets doing. It was a whole different level.”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

9. “Yeah, actually, so I started with them in 2006 and in 2009 I moved back to the Longone Lee side. I think it was absolutely eye opening, all right? And I think one of the great things about working with them, small team, boutique firm, hedge fund, but a macro hedge fund. So at every stage it felt like, and I'd been on the sell side and now I was on the buy side, it gets you a little bit closer to the end point. I think it was a fascinating point of time because essentially Over the course of the two thousands, the private sector really came into its own. So in a sense, when we were at the IMF, a lot of these emerging markets, they came to the IMF because there wasn't”

   2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

10. “Much baking anymore? My husband always complains. He says, I baked more before the Batissari course, because after that I would come into our rental apartment and say, I can't work in these conditions. So you became a chef primadonna. Is that what you were suggesting? Looking back at myself, I have to believe I became a primadonna. So you relocate with your husband to London. I'm going to assume that's how you end up at Thames River Capital. Is that right? No, first, actually I was on the South side. So I've done it all. I've done academia. Then I did the public sector at the II.”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

11. “It was six years. It was six years in DC. And then half a year, basically, my husband and I, at that time, we chose to move to the private sector. He was moving to the private sector in London and I was following him. And I had accumulated six months of vacation. They let you do that. They wouldn't cash me out for six months, but they said, take the holiday. You know what I did? I had the IMF pay for me to do a professional patisserie course in London because I had to take the holiday. I couldn't go out and work. But I was being paid and I couldn't not be paid. So I took a one-year course question to six months. Full on pastry and basic intermediate and superior. Do you still do a lot of cooking? So I do a lot of cooking, but I don't do much.”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

12. “My enormous respect and belief in macroeconomics actually comes from my time at the IMF. You know, the IMF got a lot of dings for program countries, for programs which were put into place around the world. Some were better than others. I get all of that. But here's the thing. We would go to these countries, and the idea was really, frankly, orthodox fiscal and monetary policy and sometimes when you're starting from a certain point, be it hyperinflation, be it out of control, fiscal balance, be it lack of any kind of international reserves, you need to go back to orthodoxy. It kind of works. And that carrying that forward, I think it's influenced a lot of how I've thought about emerging markets through the years, for sure. How long did you stay at the IMF for?”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

13. “International Monetary Fund. No, no, no. So I worked out of Washington, D.C. I worked on Eastern Europe. So I'm talking about countries like Bulgaria, Macedonia, Romania, Croatia prior, the wall had fallen in the late 80s, 89, was it? And so these countries, some of these countries didn't even have the concept of GDP as we know it. They had gross social product. They didn't have CPI indices. So it was in some ways the initial piece was like an extension of being at university because we were bringing these concepts to them. It was an amazing experience. So any lessons that you learn at IMF that ultimately influenced your investment philosophy?”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

14. “Intellectually very much so. Look, academia, I admire it. I think it is the pinnacle of what this country does brilliantly, having academia, having those research universities, all of that is absolutely superb. For me, the problem was I'd spent five years of my life essentially doing research, and now I wanted to get out there and do something with it. To me, getting into the IMF, it was mind-bogglingly, it was fantastic. Remember, this is in the mid-90s, so let me date myself. So this is in the mid 90s. Eastern Europe is just coming in from the cold. And that was where I focused most of my time. So how long did you stay at Pittsburgh before you joined the IMF? Two years. It was two years. So what was the experience like in Europe in the 90s working for the”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

15. “I was an assistant professor of economics at the University of Pittsburgh. And here's the deal. When I got that job, I had also interviewed with the IMF and I had really liked the IMF, but you have to understand, I don't know if it's that way today, but at that time, there was no way I was going to my thesis advisor and telling him, yeah, I do have a tenure track offer from a decent university, but you know, I'm going to go to the dark side and work for the IMF. So I couldn't bring myself to do it. I went and I did the academia thing for a couple of years. And I was young enough that the IMF told me at that time that, look, if you change your mind within the next two years, let us know. I mean, academia isn't for everybody, and it might take a year or two to figure that out. I mean, if that lifestyle works for you, it certainly could be rewarding.”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

16. “learnt enough about economics and so I decided you know not having understood the concept of sunk cost I decided to do even more and I did a PhD And was that two years, three years? The PhD? Yeah. No, that was a full five. Five, four and a half years. So that's more than sunk costs. That's double, more than double. Exactly. So you come out of Northwestern with a PhD in economics. What was your first job in finance? Or what was your first job out of school?”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

17. “Welcome to Bloomberg. Thank you, Barry. It's so kind of you to have me here. Well, it's a pleasure. I'm excited to talk to you. Let's start out with the background that you come from, bachelor's in economics from Delhi University, PhD from Northwestern also in economics. What was the original career plan? This is a really interesting one because I grew up in India. There are two careers at that time. There were two careers any good parent wanted from for his son or in my case daughter. You could be an engineer or you could be a doctor. And if you really didn't want to do either of those, you could work for the government. I didn't want to do any of the three. And economics seemed at that time to be the one which left the most options open for me. So I did economics. At the end of my undergraduate degree though, I didn't feel like I'd really...”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

18. “This week on the podcast, I have another extra special guest, so now I'll decide what can I say. She runs the fixed income group as Chief Investment Officer for Franklin Templeton. She directly manages $215 billion in assets. Sonala's been named to just about every most influential woman in finance list. Barrons, five years in a row, Forbes, pension investments. If you are at all interested in fixed income, what the thought process is like in trying to figure out how to structure a portfolio of fixed income, what you think about, what affects the returns you're going to see, this is going to be a great podcast for you. I thought this was interesting, really fascinating, and I think you will also, with no further ado, Franklin Templeton's Sanal decide.”

    2025-07-24 · Masters in Business · Franklin Templeton's Sonal Desai on Fixed Income · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source