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Spencer Kimball

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2017-04-14
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2017-04-14
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  1. European customers and Australian customers, people are doing that right now. But the reality is that the latencies are terrible for those customers that are further afield. And further, there's a growing concern about the liabilities around violating data sovereignty laws. And those laws are being put into place all over the world. Pretty sure that they're not going to get less strict given what's going on geopolitically. So what we're really trying to do is build databases that can span regions. So this is cockroach is such that you're keeping individual customers or users data in close proximity to them, but still providing one logical global database for your application developers and for your system operators.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  2. Well, you know, I think this is a very interesting question. One of my central theses, which I touched on earlier, is just that databases actually suck for the most part. They never let you do what you really want to do for your business use cases. And that's always been a game of sort of leapfrog. You get a new database technology that handles the big gaps and the business use cases in terms of technical capability. And then the business use case immediately moves forward into trying to do, again, more than the database can provide. And I think we're already pushing the envelope there. There's some additional stuff. So right now our MBP, our version 1.0, which is imminent, is very much concerned with feature parity with Spanner, Google's cloud spanner product, where we want to go even in 2017 is to really push into supporting businesses that are trying to build global services. So in other words, you're not just trying to stick a data center on the East Coast and serve your

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  3. Yeah, exactly. You can glean about what's likely to happen. And I'd say that their track record in terms of prognostications is incredibly good. I mean, it just blows everyone else out of the water. So I'd say that I think everyone's constantly wrestling with macroeconomics, which is a whole nother subject, which is very interesting, which is why all of the econ programs around the world essentially at this point focused just so dramatically on microeconomics. And when I think macroeconomics has the potential to bear so much fruit.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  4. Actually, the two that I spend, I will never fail to read every single article would be Ben Bernanke's blog at the Brookings Institute and also Paul Krugman's blog that's sort of associated with his editorializing for the New York Times. So I guess I'm a bit of an economics nerd at heart. And those two writers seem to have the most accurate model, like mental model of reality, especially as it pertains to macroeconomics. And that's something that seems to be woefully short supply with most other pundits and commentators. And if you read those two blogs, there's a lot that you can

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  5. Culture, actually. And I give Larry and Sergei tremendous credit for how early and how steadfastly they perceived culture to be a crucial aspect of Google's DNA. I was there for 10 years from when it was maybe 350 people until I guess there were probably 45,000 or so when I left. And the culture seemed effortless. And I did a startup right after coming out of Google. And we did that for two years. And I just assumed, you know, obviously it was my absolute intention to build a Google-like culture there. And I assumed, along with one of my co-founders, Peter, who was also co-founder of Cockroach Labs and both of us were at Google for 10 years, we assumed that it would just happen because we believed in it. That's not the case. We really fell down on culture on that first startup. And we've done things very differently at Cockroach Labs because what we realized is that culture is something that takes a very conscious effort and it takes consistency. You really have to apply yourself to achieve it.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  6. That's a good question. And you know what? I think that the thing that has frustrated me most is just how closed source everything is. And I know that there's efforts underfoot to help address this problem. But one of the big things that we're always wondering is what kind of salaries should we pay? How much equity should we pay? Most people keep this stuff pretty close to the best. And that, I think, would be wonderful if it changed. It would be so nice if everyone had access to sort of a pooled set of resources. And you see some green shoots in that direction, but hopefully that's just the start of a much larger trend.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  7. For the books? No. The books, the prose is incredible. I mean, they have to be read in little bits. It's best to read it on a commute.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  8. And everyone, I think, was everyone that had enough perspective in terms of history was faced with this burning question, which is, is a decline and fall of an advanced civilization and inevitability? And Edward Gibbon was really exploring the causes for the decline and fall of Rome and whether those applied, the sort of nascent European civilization. And his ultimate answer was that no, those two things were substantially different. And that was, I think,

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  9. My favorite book is actually a series of books, six volumes, and it's called The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire by Edward Gibbon. And the Y part is sort of an extensive answer, so I'll try to keep it short. But Edward Gibbon, the original author, was convinced actually by Adam Smith to write it in English as opposed to French, which was very perceptive. Yeah, I was contrarian at the time, absolutely, but it was a very perceptive view of what history, how history would unfold. And what was amazing about the decline in fall was it was really the first work of history that truly broke the stranglehold that Roman Catholic Church had maintained over the idea of historical cause, right? Before as everything was God's problems. And this was actually putting the onus on human beings and the decisions that they make that actually led to the history. And the most fascinating thing about it is to imagine the context in which it was written. And you had this nascent European rebirth of civilization and advance of

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  10. You're able to balance the sort of grind of those four days, which honestly people put a little bit more effort into those four days, but then you still have that fifth day where you can look at your job differently, you can look at the problem you're working on differently in a more relaxed way. And I think that ultimately leads to a much higher level of satisfaction and happiness.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  11. I think sort of died on the vine there. And our hope is that by allocating a specific day and really where you have that full day, you really have that 20% time, then we can encourage people to actually work on things that are interesting outside of the priority roadmap. So what we'd really like to see is the birth of fantastic new ideas through people's sort of passion project. And we've had some of that already. We've had a number of them. And we blog about them when someone does something particularly interesting. I think that approaching the normal work you have to do from a much more relaxed perspective is incredibly valuable for our employees, right? You take that day, you wake up when you want to wake up, and you sort of leisurely approach the problem that might have been bedeviling you during the week. I think that ultimately leads to a much happier work environment in the sense that

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  12. The four day work week is kind of a provocative stance, and it is not necessarily all that we intend through this program. A better way to think of it is we call it Free Fridays as opposed to a four-day work week. So free Fridays mean you're self-directed. Like right now I'm sitting in the office in the conference room, and the office is pretty empty. I mean, it is 10, 20 right now here, but the office on any other weekday is busy. So people stay at home. Sometimes people want to have a three-day weekend to go on vacation somewhere, or if Monday's free, it's a four-day weekend. It's kind of a nice bit of extra flexibility. But what we really intend is something similar to Google's 20% time. Because one day a week, the Friday is 20% time. What happened at Google was that nobody really took the 20% time. It was a little bit of a failed policy. What would happen is that kind of store it up, some people would insist on taking it. Most people wouldn't take it. And ultimately, it...

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  13. Next round, and sometimes so far it's happened sooner every time than we were expecting. And in that next round, we get pretty far along through the process, and it comes down to, okay, we just got to decide who at this point. And then many of the VCs that I talked to in the previous round, they start to hear about it through the prapevine and they pop up and they want to be involved. And no matter how much I like them, it's often pretty far along at that point. Usually past the stage where I'm going to consider, like seriously consider putting someone else through the process and extending it, right? The reality is because I've talked to so many BCs, I'm not putting out like a bat signal if we're going to do another round. There's just very interested investors that are kind of pushing in the direction. And I'll pull in the people that I've developed a relationship with over the last year. Does that make sense?

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  14. Very helpful. And if you request something from them, even if they're not currently an investor, they'll almost always go out of their way to provide a positive response of some sort. But I think that what separates the wheat from the shaft there is that the really good VCs, the ones that really want to land the deal, assuming that is their priority, these guys will and gals will stay in touch and they'll be proactive about it. It's funny, but it seems kind of corny, but honestly, we're in New York, but if the California VC comes out or when they're in New York visiting their other port coasts and they take us to dinner or they stop by the office doing Q&A or they invite you to the various events that they do. So that constant sort of not high touch, but just some moderate form of keeping the conversation in the communication and the relationship going is extremely effective. And I haven't seen very much of it. And then what happens is we go to them.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  15. Funny because I've had so many news I've probably talked to 40 or 50 venture capitalists now and many of them seem to be very interested in the next round if they can't make it into the one that we're just closing. And that's obviously the majority don't make it in, not necessarily the majority you're interested in investing in the next round, but we've had a very good hit rate with potential investors. What they do is they see the round close. I give them what I think is probably going to be the optimistic and the conservative scenarios for when we'll do our next raise. And then we really just don't hear from them. And I get it that everyone's busy and so forth. But if you really want to get into the next round, this is like any other kind of a relationship. You're much more likely to be considered, especially if you weren't necessarily at the top of the list for the sort of runners up. If over the course of the next year or however long it is, you're constantly involved. And a lot of people sort of promise to do that. And certainly I've noticed that venture capitalists as a group, I've noticed.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  16. Investor from Benchmark and led our first round, and he's on our board. When I ask him when I come to him with a request like that, he's out there pulling those contacts, talking to those people and getting them fired up. So that is a very, very different thing, no matter how good the associate or the BD person or the BD team even.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  17. Useful. On the other hand, when you're really evaluating the quality of a new investor, I think you need to take into consideration the proclivity of that firm to allow the partner, the person that's going to be on your board, let's say, to pass off what could be in many cases fairly important, at least from the perspective of you, the port co, but a very important function or requirement or request to a larger staff, right? For example, you want to find the 10 biggest companies in some market segment or some vertical that you'd like to pitch your product to, there are lots of venture capitalists out there that have programs in place to give you that or to research that for you and give it to you. But in many of those where they have a big team behind them, you're not getting that investing partner to do that work on your behalf. And the reality is that Peter Fenton is our

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  18. That's a good question. Let me give you an example. There is somebody that I met with in exactly this capacity at one of the really big funds, and she was working in Palo Alto for them. And she was the one that I was interacting with. And I actually really liked her. I thought she was incredibly intelligent, really sharp out of MIT. She had been on Wall Street and she was doing this BC stuff. And ultimately, I recruited her. She joined Cockroach Labs as a product manager. She's that sort of the direction she wanted to go in. So I would not say that, you know, like I said, it kind of comes back to the question I answered just previously about the fact that I like talking to all these different people. Oftentimes that associate or non-investing partner that you're talking to can be more down to earth, more in the weeds, and sometimes more helpful to you as someone to bounce your ideas off and to do that initial evaluation of your company. So I wouldn't necessarily say that those people should be shunned, far from it. I think they're quite

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  19. Opposite approach in the industry than the one that benchmark takes, for example. Now, this is a very small VC fund, you know, not necessarily in dollars, although it's not by far not the largest. But it's a small number of partners and there's equal shares for all of them. And when a partner is interested in a deal, that's your partner. They don't have a huge support staff. They're not sending out funkies in order to move the process along before they deign to become involved. This is one of the world's best investors who is constantly available for you, is following up immediately with anything you ask for, is obviously clearly excited about what you're doing, isn't yanking your chain about, you know, oh, well, we've got these other startups that, you know, port codes that might be competing with you. And no, no, they're just straightforward. Everything's on the table and you're dealing with exactly the person you're going to deal with for the rest of your association with that investor.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  20. I have a lot of opinions on this particular topic, and I'll sort of answer it in two parts. First part being, you know, how do you get into the initial deal? And then second part being, you know, when you've lost out on a deal, how do you then get in on follow-up rounds? And I would say that for the initial deal, the best way to get in is to have the true decision maker be the main point of contact for the company. I've come across a number of venture capital firms that the first point of contact and what to me almost feels like the boots on the ground tactical brain behind the operation is somebody that's not actually an investing partner. That's a major turnoff. And I know that it saves people time and they send out somebody that's sort of more of an associate level. And that person says to kind of bring the deals in and then the general partner, the investing partner then takes the relationship over. I on the other hand think that that is off-putting. And there's no more.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  21. Is not a good way to have that person transition onto your board. I think that there's a much more constructive way, and that actually involves being very fair and open with your offers and not trying to lowball as a negotiation tacket. And it feels like a used car salesman. That's not the kind of person I want on my board.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  22. I think there are bad approaches. I certainly would not name any names, but I think that where when it comes to the negotiation of the pricing, I've certainly run up against approaches that I wouldn't take with someone I was interested in investing with. They're just too adversarial. And ultimately, I think that many people view that with the expectation that the pricing and the negotiation is a sort of unpleasant baking phase. And then once you get past that, it's going to be all roses. But my feeling is that, you know, there's a huge amount of trust that needs to be established and then carefully nurtured over the course of what's going to be a many year relationship that people often joke in this industry. It's more likely to last longer than your marriage. You establish that trust early. And I'm sorry, but a very chaotic and unpleasant negotiation phase.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  23. It's a little frustrating when people beat around the bush too much and try to be too nice. I like to think I don't have a very fragile ego. Obviously, everyone does on one topic or another. And I've certainly found, though, that when my ego is most fragile and I'm at least likely to take constructive criticism is when I'm probably wrong. So I do think that a mature venture capitalist, a mature investor on the other side of the table, will not be to round the bush, but will be constructive. And I certainly respond well to that. It might take me a day or two if I'm really sunk down into a sort of losing proposition and I've got some of my pride tied up in it. But the frontal approach that is constructive always, I think, yields the best results.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  24. Find yourself in the position of being a venture capitalist and not having anything to offer. And so, you know, even now, when we have a lot of inside investors that in each subsequent round have really pushed to do the next deal and to lead the next deal, we don't need the money from these other investors necessarily. But what I do find is that it's still additive. It continues to be. And sometimes that is someone challenging my sort of, you know, you just can't help but these things become received wisdom, whatever your current operating strategy is. And it's nice to have that challenge. And some people are willing to do that when you're having a conversation with them. Another sort of benefit, which I think is actually quite important, is it's always a set of fresh ears, passion intelligent human being, for me to give this sort of latest version of our vision and where we think the industry is going. That has evolved, even though we have not pivoted yet in terms of our

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  25. Yeah, you know, I've actually found out very early on, especially when I was doing my first pitches, and I think I was pretty wooden and clueless, didn't really know how to put these things together. But I found that the VCs were typically a very intelligent audience. And everyone I talked to in that sort of initial round when I was raising money, this series we called the series A, for cockroach in 2015, was that every VC brought something to the table. And I actually happened to find the venture capitalists that find me to be the most helpful because they already have a thesis that they're working from. You know, sometimes they're following a trend in the industry that might be less useful. But a lot of times these are investors that are looking at cockroach from sort of a first principles perspective. And the ones that come to me and they have their own idea of why cockroach is good are often more complementary. But even the ones that are fairly clueless and that just kind of heard about us, these are fairly intelligent people. I think it'd be difficult to

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  26. Systems that also were crying out for a data storage technology like this. And that's when the idea was reborn, and I started it in GitHub, and the rest is sort of history. But there's then a surprising uptake in the open source world and then in the world of venture capital. And now in the more commercial world.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  27. I was kind of thrown back out into the wild world of open source software and wasn't too impressed with what I found out there. I thought things would be further along. I tried all the various technologies as potential backends for the startup. And they all came up short. And that's really where I first got the idea of cockroach. And I guess that would be what you call the aha moment when I realized that the existing open source software with relatively modest tweaks could get you a lot further. And I was a little shocked that no one had taken it that far. This used a lot of the same ideas that Google had employed in order to develop and put Spanner into production. So the reality, though, is we were building a private photo sharing startup, not a database startup. So this idea remained really just kind of a manifesto. It was called Cockroach at that point in time because I have sort of a dark sense of humor about naming. And I'd never really thought it was going to turn into a company. Three years down the line, we've been aqua hired by Square, Square had a bunch of issues around their payments.

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  28. Was in the black, but no one really knew how far into the black in fact they were. And this adverts product that they developed was about a year old was just exploding. So there was no way that the databases that they were using at that point was MySQL could keep up. So they were also sharding the database. And I got to see it go from eight shards to something like 30. And that was a very fraught process. And there was an ads war room that met every morning trying to solve the latest problems in terms of scaling that. So that was sort of one track at Google. And meanwhile, Google had a huge infrastructure team, very talented, and they built first big table, which really spun the entire NoSQL movement that's with us today. And they also then quickly iterated to what was something called Mega Store, and then finally to Spanner. Spanner is the database technology that Google has used to consolidate all of their various applications on top of. So they no longer use sharded MySQL. Everything's on spanner or on big table. So when I left Google in 2000,

    2017-04-14 · The Twenty Minute VC · 20VC: How Investors Can Get Into The Best Deals & Why Founders First Point Of Contact Should Be With The Investment Decision-Maker with Spencer Kimball, Founder & CEO @ Cockroach Labs · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  29. It's actually quite a long Odyssey. In fact, I'd say that cockroach is about databases, and I have been struggling with the inadequacies of databases for more than 20 years now. So I did a dot-com startup, and we were sharding Postgres and sharding Oracle. And so that was sort of the first instance where I realized that, you know, these very venerable databases that did exist, both the open source and the commercial versions, came up pretty short when it came to the business needs and an evolving startup, even as early as 1999. So in 2002, I joined Google. Google had a whole new set of massive problems that they were undertaking. And I got to really have a front row seat to quite a bit of evolution there. The very first project that I was on was AdWords. And you have to realize that this time, Google was experiencing tremendous growth. AdWords was, you know, at that point in time, I think that most people were aware that Google

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