Dawn Butler
MP for Brent East · Labour · United Kingdom
“I will call Michelle Welsh to move the motion; I will then call the Minister to respond. I remind other hon. Members that they may make a speech only with prior permission from the Member in charge of the debate and from the Minister.”
“The Prime Minister has hit the road running and is running into issues where action is long overdue. Following my six-year campaign to scrap “aim to permit”, I thank the Prime Minister for making that announcement over the summer.”
“He had been working for the council for 40 years and was looking forward to his retirement, but when it was time for retirement, he was told that because he was not legally here, he would not have access to his pension. I was absolutely stunned by that.”
“That has a profound effect, and the fact that it is not considered is unacceptable. People were sacked from their jobs and they did not get their promotions. Some people could not find places to live or to rent, and as I have mentioned, they did not get their pensions. All of this is unacceptable.”
“He was offered £10,000, but then was told that giving him that amount of money was a mistake, which has retraumatised him, and he is now showing signs of dementia. There are problems with requests for updates, and there is a lack of transparency and a lack of care. All of this is unacceptable. As my hon.”
“It is an absolute and wonderful pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member for Dulwich and West Norwood (Helen Hayes) and her beautiful tribute to the Windrush generation and her constituents.”
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“That also plays out in the fact that a lot of young people are becoming socially informed, so they like to shop with companies that have good ethics and consider climate change. This approach will benefit everybody and is good in itself. As I come to the end of my speech, some may wonder why I have not mentioned fines. The Minister may correct me, but to my knowledge no company has been fined for its gender pay gap. Unless that part of the law is strengthened, it is meaningless. I am interested to know how we can ensure that we fine companies that are not closing their pay gaps, and what the Government plan to do with any money that is collected. There is a stark difference across UK regions, with some doing better than others. London has the largest ethnicity pay gap, which currently stands at a whopping 23.8%.”
“The Government have a huge role to play not just through legislation, in terms of the Equal Pay Act and so on, but by securing the circular economy. The Government can have an active role in making the workplace fairer by ensuring, as has been done in some areas, that they give contracts only to companies that pay people well and fairly and do not have a pay gap. So the Government’s procurement contract processes can ensure that they give contracts only to companies that follow good practices, which will enrich the circular economy. This is not just about doing the right thing. Companies that pay people well and employ the right people for the right jobs generally have a 15% higher profit margin than their nearest counterparts.”
“That points to pay discrimination, which we must tackle as a Government. How do we tackle that and move faster towards security, fairness and equality? One way is transparency. It is important for people to know who is being paid what and why. We should introduce the right to know. In Kay’s situation, she should be able to see how much X is being paid and know that there is a £6,000 pay deficit. We also need actionable and enforceable action plans. Again, an organisation may have identified a pay gap, but unless it has committed to closing that gap, that probably will not happen. Another way companies can do that is by assigning it as a key performance indicator. We have found that when organisations assign that to somebody as a KPI, real action is taken and pay gaps begin to close.”
“For years, I went to work each day without knowing I was being paid less than those I was working alongside. I am not an isolated case. I know there are many women who, like me, don’t realise they are experiencing pay discrimination.” That picks up on the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool Riverside (Kim Johnson). The law is there, but if someone does not know what the person next to them, who is doing the same job, is paid, they could be discriminated against. Some people will say that some men and women do different jobs, different types of work or different hours. The law says the “same work” or “work of equal value”, but even when men and women work the same hours and in the same roles, nearly two thirds of the gender pay gap remains unexplained.”
“My hon. Friend is absolutely right. If our ambition is to make the workplace fairer and secure it for everybody, we should take the opportunities laid before us. That is one opportunity to ensure that we not only close the gap but make workplaces fairer. There was one case that was easy to identify as a trade union official: men were called chefs and women were called cooks, and chefs were paid a higher rate than cooks. That was an easy one, once we could figure out what was going on. A more difficult case was that of Kay, who said: “I had been working as a chef with a large catering company for ten years. During a casual conversation, my colleague mentioned he was being paid £22,000 a year. This was £6,000 a year more than me. I thought the right to equal pay would mean I was being paid fairly.”
“We know that the gap exists and that equal pay is a problem, and everyone here today has said, “Why don’t we close it?” We know that it exists, and it should not exist for anybody, whether they are male or female; regardless of someone’s gender, colour, class, age or size, this should be about fairness and equality. Yes, we have come far, but not far enough. We will know that we have reached true equality when everybody is paid well. We should shine a light on everything. I thank all contributors to the debate. We have shown that the purpose of government and legislation is to make the world fairer for everybody in it, and we can do that via legislation, by winning hearts and minds and by shining a light on the injustices that exist. If we close the equal pay gap, we will be taking a huge step forward towards that aim.”
“That is taking things further than we would in the UK, but it is interesting to see that because people there have that disinfectant and that light on the problem, as hon. Members have said today, they are able to see the gap and close it. I do not think that we should be scared of having people know what other people earn, especially if they are working side by side. There should not be anything to worry about. It is also interesting that the Employment Rights Bill will tackle a lot of this issue. We need to ensure that as it goes through Committee, we take on all the suggestions that will accelerate progress. This has taken way too long.”
“A big thank you to everyone who has participated in this debate; it has shown Parliament at its best, and it is great to see that there is no real opposition to championing equal pay. It has taken a long time, but we now have a Labour Government and we can deliver it. That is the beauty of having a Labour Government who are committed to ensuring that people who are working are fully paid and respected in the workplace. Although the hon. Member for Edinburgh West (Christine Jardine) said that she wants to be alive to see the gap closed completely, I think we will see that with a Labour Government, so she will be alive to see it. It is interesting that a country where the pay gap is really small is Norway, where anyone can find out how much anybody else is paid.”
“If we want it not to happen again, we have to be honest about why it happened in the first place. My thoughts are with the bereaved families and survivors. Every year, we go on the silent march. I remember speaking to a little girl who is a little bit older now. She said she was studying for her GCSEs and that the day after she was taking them, which she passed. She said that was what she was focused on, but what are the families and survivors focusing on now? It is justice, which they have not got. Until they have justice, none of us should rest, and none of us should feel comfortable—this may well happen again—because justice delayed is justice denied. I pass Grenfell on my way home most nights, and every time I pass that building, I say a prayer for everybody who died, everybody who survived and all the names we will never know.”
“As my hon. Friend the Member for Chelsea and Fulham (Ben Coleman) said, they are still not being listened to. They have been so badly let down, and there needs to be an investigation into what happened, how the council used Grenfell to get funds and what happened to those funds. There is so much that needs to be discussed. I also notice that Kwajo is here. He is a housing campaigner and activist. That is an indication of how much people of colour are not listened to when they try to say that there is an injustice. Why was the cladding put on the building? The residents did not want it. It was so that it looked pretty and nice to the more wealthy residents down the road. We have heard about the profits, the greed and the deregulation that caused this catastrophe.”
“In the short time available I want to say to the survivors and the next of kin—some of whom are here today; some will be watching from home—that I am sorry they have been so severely let down by the previous Government and by their council. I hope that the words of the Deputy Prime Minister today have given some comfort. Brent East is just next door to Grenfell, and we watched the fire unfold. They say that 72 people died, but the reality is that we do not really know the exact number, as people from Kensington tell me. Every time we say that this disaster was preventable, we have to be honest about what happened in the system. Some 85% of people were black and a minoritised group. That is why they were not listened to and were ignored. Grenfell United and Grenfell Next of Kin have been fighting for more than seven and a half years.”
“Whether or not this Bill progresses today, I hope those conversations will continue. After all, we are legislators, and we have the ability to do that. Eighty per cent of my constituents are against this legislation, and I will be voting against it.”
“As a patron of Black Women Rising, a cancer charity that supports black and minoritised women through their cancer journey, someone who had been given six months to live recently told me, “I have had a good life, and I am ready to go.” Six weeks later, they are now fighting to live. The thing is, if we had focused only on the fact that she was ready to go and wanted to die, it would have all been very different. As we have heard today, there are parts of the law that need changing around coercion, and around doctors being able to help people with their end of life treatment. However, I believe those safeguards and discussions can be separated from assisted dying and assisted suicide. I do not see why we need to have a combined discussion. Everybody has the right to die with dignity and compassion.”
“I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Spen Valley (Kim Leadbeater) for how this debate has been conducted. Yesterday, we buried Tony Warr, a GMB officer and a really good friend. He was diagnosed with prostate cancer. He beat it once, but it took him in the end. Earlier this week, the cancer community lost Nina Lopes. She had stage 4 triple-negative breast cancer and was given six months to live in 2018. Six months became six years, and she taught us how to dance through her @frodayss account. As we have heard, it is not an exact science when someone is given a prognosis of six months to live.”
“I also want to highlight the Level Up campaign, which calls on the Independent Press Standards Organisation to introduce an amendment to the editors’ code so that when the press reports on domestic abuse and the murder of missing women, it does not sensationalise them as it normally does. That needs to change. It is inaccurate and undignified, and it prioritises sensationalism and negatively frames the victims—it suggests that they deserved it. I want to see words such as “sexism”, “misogyny”, “extremism” and “terrorism” used to describe violent men; “jilted partner” just will not do. I hope the Minister looks at that report so that we can work together and begin to move in the direction of eradicating violence against women and girls.”
“I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Poplar and Limehouse (Apsana Begum) on securing this debate. Yesterday, I had the pleasure of launching a new report, “Why Should Our Rage Be Tidy? Minoritised Survivors’ Experiences of Mental Health in the Context of Violence-Abuse.” I hope the Minister has a copy—if she does not, I will make sure she gets one—because it contains some excellent recommendations. It was produced by Imkaan and the Women and Girls Network, and it has received UK Research and Innovation funding. When we hear the statistics, such as one woman killed every three days, we think: “When is that going to change? How are we going to change it?” That report will help.”
“May I join other Members of the House in sending my condolences to the Prescott family? I used to sit with John when we did the prep for Prime Minister’s questions, and I now wish that I had taken notes of all the rebuttals and lines that did not make the cut, because they would make one hell of a book. My constituents in Brent East, one of the most diverse constituencies in the UK, deserve fair pay for a fair day’s work. Yesterday was equal pay day, which was two days earlier than normal, meaning that things are getting worse. Will the Leader of the House allow us to have a debate on this issue in Government time?”
“I will end with a quote by Alex Karras, who said: “It takes more courage to reveal insecurities than to hide them, more strength to relate to people than to dominate them, more ‘manhood’ to abide by thought-out principles rather than blind reflex. Toughness is in the soul and spirit, not in muscles and an immature mind.””
“It is important that we tackle that crisis head-on and send a strong message from this House that incels are not in any way a good representation of a good man. Women are not the enemy. One woman is killed every three days by a man, so we need men to speak up and speak out. We need men to be louder than the toxic men on social media who have huge platforms. We need men to speak louder than the men with power, the men in power and some of the men who are soon to get power. We have a lot of work to do. Some 20% of incels contemplate suicide every day. There are well-documented terrorist attacks and mass killings by incels. International Men’s Day is important for everyone. The world will be safer if we all work together to respect each other and make sure that we are all kept safe.”
“When it comes to health, 12,000 men die of prostate cancer every year—one every 45 minutes—one in five UK men do not live to the age of 65, and 14 men die by suicide every day. That is an alarming number; there is a continued crisis in male suicide, which is the leading cause of death for men under 50. I believe that there is a direct correlation between the increase in mental ill health among men and the growth in the number of involuntary celibates, or incels. That growing and worrying underground movement of young men is defined by a misogyny that believes that men have lost the genetic lottery and are destined to fail with women. Incels are often poorly educated boys and men, and they justify violence against women via their ideological stances.”
“This year, there are three key themes for International Men’s Day: making a positive difference to wellbeing and lives, raising awareness of and funds for charities supporting men and boy’s wellbeing, and promoting a positive conversation about men, manhood and masculinity. My hon. Friend mentioned manhood and masculinity. I will talk more about that today. We know that a lot of the way in which society runs is centred on men—from how clothes are made for emergency service workers, to language—so it stands to reason that, for equity purposes, there has to be more of a focus on women. However, as I said, that does not come at the exclusion of men. Being a man is not about being strong and silent—that is very old thinking. We need to encourage more men to speak up and speak out.”
“It teaches the young men things such as timekeeping; they have to arrive on time or they cannot get their hair cut. All those kinds of soft skills are important in later life. I like to highlight that shop because even during the pandemic it had debates about covid, keeping safe and getting the vaccination. That was important. As my hon. Friend the Member for Bishop Auckland said, there is a growing range of charities, including Men’s Sheds, Andy’s Man Club, Prostate Cancer UK, which is doing a lot of work, Harry’s Hikes, WalKing Men and many more. It is important to encourage those organisations.”
“It is important that we campaign, so it would have been nice to see more people in the Chamber. I get a lot of misogynistic abuse online from people who say, “Why don’t we have an International Men’s Day?” Well, we are having an International Men’s Day debate, and the House is not full. This is a great time to talk about the many men’s charities that do amazing work. In my Brent East constituency, we have BoyztoMEN, Moving on Up, 100 Black Men of London, Men United, Making the Leap and the Social Wellness Club. We also have a lot of barbers who do lots of great work. The men and boys who go for haircuts are encouraged to talk and have debates. They are not always great debates—I am not saying that they always make sense—but customers are encouraged to talk and share. There is a particularly good barber shop in Brent called Faisal Barbers.”
“I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Bishop Auckland (Sam Rushworth) on securing the debate. Madam Deputy Speaker, where is everybody? Nobody is on the Conservative Benches, besides the Opposition Whip. I am surprised to see empty Benches on the Conservative side of the House. I am sure the shadow Secretary of State, the hon. Member for East Grinstead and Uckfield (Mims Davies), will give a great speech, but she should not have to hold it all down by herself. International Men’s Day started in 1992 in Trinidad and Tobago, and we started debating International Men’s Day in the House in 2015. I thought it was important to attend today, because it is not a competition. I always attend the International Women’s Day debate, and my fighting for the rights of women does not in any way negate my fighting for the rights of men.”
“Does my hon. Friend agree that trans men are often missed out of the trans debate, that they are also subjected to some really cruel behaviour and often suffer violence, such as rape, and that that is under- reported?”
“On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. During Prime Minister's questions, the shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, the hon. Member for Brentwood and Ongar (Alex Burghart), said that the Government had given a pay rise to trade unions. That is factually incorrect. The Government gave pay rises to workers, and gave them to all workers, regardless of whether or not they were members of trade unions. That is the power of a trade union. I know that it is difficult to educate His Majesty’s official Opposition about the benefits of trade unions, Madam Deputy Speaker, but can you advise me on whether I can compel the shadow Minister to come back and correct the record?”
“We are all moved by these stories, and when we see the pain in the eyes of the children, we think: where has our compassion, our humanity, gone? There have also been some reports that aid has gone into schools, for instance, and those schools have then been bombed, so therefore there is no aid. Does my hon. Friend agree that we have to be serious about ensuring that this crisis ends soon?”
“I have received a number of emails about the winter fuel allowance and access to pension credit, so I have joined forces with accredited organisations to help people access and sign up to pension credit. Does the Leader of the House agree that it is vital that we get as many people as possible signed up to pension credit?”
“The report by the national physical laboratory said that it had to be set at 0.6 for it to have fewer misidentifications, but there is no such thing as no misidentifications or people not being wrongly identified. It is also easy for a police service to lower that number. Because we have no judicial oversight, it is very problematic.”
“With this technology, if the machine says an individual is guilty because they have been identified using live facial recognition, they then have to prove their innocence. That is a huge change in our democracy that nobody has consented to. We have not consented to it in this place, and as we police by consent as a society, that should really worry us all.”
“It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Dame Siobhain. I thank the right hon. Member for Maldon (Sir John Whittingdale) —or I could say my right hon. Friend, if he does not mind—for securing this debate. I have spoken to the Secretary of State and Ministers in the Department for Science, Innovation and Technology, and there is an awareness that we need a lot of careful and considerate thinking on this issue. Obviously, a new Government have just come in and this is not a new issue, as the right hon. Member for Maldon said—LFR was first used in 2017, so there is a lot of clearing up that has to be done. Live facial recognition changes one of the cornerstones of our democracy: an individual is innocent until proven guilty.”
“The shadow Minister has hit on an important point regarding reasonable suspicion. What is reasonable suspicion? How have the police got to that point? If he is then going to make reference to watchlists, who is put on a watchlist? We know, for instance, that the Met police has hundreds of thousands of people on its system who should not be there. We know that the watchlist can consist of people it considers to be vulnerable, such as those with mental health issues. Anybody in this room could be put on a watchlist, so I am afraid the shadow Minister has not quite nailed the point he was trying to make.”
“They do not really like the music, but they will come anyway because they do not want to miss out. We then have the person who is completely drunk on it all: “Give it to me. I’ll take everything.” There are people who just love anything to do with technology and will say, “Look, let’s just throw it all in the mix and it’ll all be fine.” And there is me. I am the person who likes the music and the food, but I need to keep sober to make sure everyone gets home safely. In this debate about AI, we need to be sober to make sure that everybody gets home safely and that when we roll out AI, we do so in a way that is fair and compassionate and in line with our values as British citizens.”
“Member for Maldon said, the EU permits LFR only where there is prior judicial authorisation and in cases in which the police need to locate a missing person, for instance. That is something we need to consider. I want to say this: I like technology. I am very much into our civil liberties. We need to protect our digital rights as human beings and individuals. I love technology— I used to be a coder—but we should not rush to do things because people get excited. There are really four people in the debate on this issue. It reminds me of four of my mates when we go out clubbing. Bear with me. We have the person who will stay at home because they are not bothered—they do not care—and we have the people who do not care about this issue: “It is going to happen; let it happen.” We have the person who will come, but they are a bit moany.”
“It is also really interesting that even when LFR is set at 0.6, a police super-spotter is more accurate. We have specialist police officers who spot people very quickly, and they are more accurate than this system, so it becomes the case that a police service will try to prove that the system it has bought is value for money. We can imagine a police officer not getting many hits with LFR at 0.6 and lowering that to 0.5 so that they can get more hits, which in turn means that more people are misidentified, so there should be regulation around this issue. Taking away somebody’s liberty is one of the most serious things we can do in society, so we need to think very carefully if we are going to introduce something that accelerates that. It is good that for the first time we are having the debate on this issue. As the right hon.”
“Thank you, Dame Siobhain. Yes, it is really important that we talk about this openly. That is what we are supposed to do in this place, right? Anybody can be put on the watchlist. Seven police forces are currently using LFR. One that I know of—I am not sure about the others—the Metropolitan Police Service, is in special measures. I do not think it should be given any additional powers while it is in special measures. The thing is that we know very little about the software or what is in the black box that is developed by these systems. What we can look at is the outcome, and we know that the outcome does not identify very well black women’s faces, especially, and black and Asian people. There is a lower identification threshold for those people, so that is a concern.”
“The hon. Lady is making an incredibly powerful speech. Is she aware of the Big Brother Watch campaign to try to stop large shops from capturing people’s faces and saying that they are shoplifters? They then get stopped in other places, but they are not aware of that process.”
“Is the hon. Gentleman aware that black men are eight times more likely to be stopped and search by the police than their white counterparts, and 35 times more likely under section 60? This technology accelerates the discrimination that is already in the system.”
“But when we look at the numbers of people, something like 0.5% of scans—I cannot remember the statistic—still result in somebody being misidentified.”
“In my borough of Brent, the average private rent has increased by an eye-watering 33% to £2,121 a month. We have the highest eviction rate in England and Wales. I am inundated, as I am sure many Members are, with emails about mould and disrepair. The Government’s Renters’ Rights Bill is very welcome, but does the Leader of the House agree that we need to talk more about rent controls?”
“No one with a conscience or any compassion would say that is a good business model, but six years ago, in 2018, I received a message, as did everybody else in the country, to inform me that we had finished paying the reparations owed. The message said: “The amount of money borrowed for the Slavery Abolition Act was so large that it wasn’t paid off until 2015. Which means that living British citizens helped pay to end the slave trade.” I was absolutely shocked when I received that message. I thought, “I won’t consent to my taxpayer’s money paying slave owners compensation.” The British Government paid £20 million, which was 5% of GDP at the time, and that is now the equivalent of about £100 billion. This money was paid to compensate slave owners for lost capital associated with freeing slaves—40% of the UK’s budget.”
“I always remember a teacher saying to me at school, “Don’t assume, because when you ‘assume’ you make an ‘ass’ out of ‘u’ and ‘me’.” When I met Pam, whose family owned a cotton farm in Mississippi for over 100 years, I was expecting all these stories about uprisings and everything, and she just told me about the entrepreneurship, the sustainability and the fair pay. I was so enthralled by her story—mytunika.com—that I purchased the shirt I am wearing today, and I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Luton North (Sarah Owen) for helping me iron it. The thing about business is that it is easy for someone to make huge profits if they do not have to pay people, if they do not have to provide accommodation, if they do not have to treat them fairly and if they can treat them as if they are nobody.”
“I remember that when I stood at that Dispatch Box in 2009, and I was the first black woman ever to stand there as a Government Minister, it was so moving and I almost felt as though I had the weight of history on my shoulders. I congratulate her on that, and also on the Windrush announcement. That is a phenomenal announcement, and a lot of people today will be very grateful for it. I would like to thank Wendy Williams, Jacqueline McKenzie, Martin Forde and Patrick Vernon for all the work they have done on Windrush. Reclaiming narratives is important for this Black History Month, because it is not about explaining black history, but about reclaiming some of the narratives out there changing some of the assumptions.”
“It is a pleasure and a privilege to take part in this debate on the Floor of the House in Government time for the first time ever. I thank the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for East Grinstead and Uckfield (Mims Davies) for her excellent speech. It is a pleasure to co-chair the all-party parliamentary group on women in Parliament. Talking about footballers, Raheem Sterling is from Brent—a proud Brent boy—as is Rachel Yankey, and they do amazing things in the community. I thank the Minister for her moving and excellent speech. I am sure the Nigerians would disagree about jollof rice, but I will try not to get too involved in that. As she said, she is the first woman of Ghanaian decent at the Dispatch Box.”
“While the British Government have not disclosed a complete list of the recipient individuals and firms of bonds related to compensation for slaves, researchers at University College London have compiled a list of over 46,000 current individuals and groups who have received Government payouts related to the abolition of slavery. Many powerful British families, including current business and political elites in the United Kingdom, are among the recipients uncovered by the UCL team. So when we hear the arguments that to make our money—to make our millions—we just have to work hard and pull ourselves up by our boot straps, that is not quite the full story. That is why the narrative needs to be reset, and structures created in order to uphold a white supremacist view need to be revisited and restructured.”
“I thank my hon. Friend. I understand that the Prime Minister has said we have to look to the future and that he is dealing with 14 years of corruption and mismanagement by the Conservative Government, but we do have to consider reparations because it is the right thing to do. This question makes me wonder whether it would ever be conceivable that this decision would be made today. Would we pay traffickers for their loss of trade? Would we pay pimps for their loss of trade? It is a ridiculous assertion. So I thought to myself, who made this decision and how was it made? Obviously, it was made in Parliament. Back then there were no women, no black people, no people of colour; it was just white men and they made that decision. And we only finished paying nine years ago, so it is still very current.”
“Because I am the chosen one As I am of the first ones So you wanted to see me broken Head bowed and tears in my eyes More fool you, you haven’t realised My strength is despite your lies. No one should shy away from the truth even if it hurts and is painful. Slavery has always been wrong, and that is why we have a modern slavery Bill which has started in the other place. We should remind ourselves that knowing the truth is not the same as hate. This is not hate speech; this is love speech. This is the way we right the wrongs of the past and look forward to the future.”
“It led me to write a poem about being of the first ones that seems to have upset quite a few racists, and I say to them that they should not scroll through my social media feed unless they want to get upset. This is my poem. So you wanted to see me broken Head bowed and tears in my eyes More fool you you didn’t realise my strength is powered by your lies. You are the wrong one The violent one The weird one Whereas I, I am the chosen one of the first ones You see this skin I am in This beautiful mahogany brown This skin you don’t like I believe So why try so hard to achieve By burning yourself by the sun For me there is no need Because I am the chosen one I am of the first ones I know I am black and beautiful An African freedom fighter My skin is my protection And you my friend don’t matter.”
“We could make good the land and seas ruined by oil spills, correct the education of history, compensate land and home owners, and cancel the debt. There are lots of things that can be done to make sure we have reparations. I realise that it is complicated to calculate what is owed, but we must not forget that in order for slavery to continue people put a number on other people’s lives; people were sold for money. If it could be done then, it can be done now. The first homo sapiens on earth—modern humans—are thought to have evolved in Africa around 300,000 years ago, and it is fascinating reading about the different continents and about Africa and the middle stone age and how they developed different tools and painting and where they came from.”
“Friend the Member for Clapham and Brixton Hill (Bell Ribeiro-Addy) said, there are lots of big numbers being mentioned such as that $777 trillion needs to paid in reparations. Most recently Dr Michael Banner, dean of Trinity College Cambridge, claimed Britain owed £205 billion in reparations. Patrick Robinson, leading judge at the International Court of Justice, declared that the UK should pay $24 trillion for its involvement in slavery. There are a lot of figures and that is a lot of money, but at the end of the day some things will be easy to compensate. It is not just about money. We could give back artefacts and the bodies of freedom fighters and stolen jewels and precious metals wherever they may be.”