Luke Pollard
MP for Plymouth Sutton and Devonport · Labour (Co-op) · United Kingdom
“I welcome the hon. Gentleman to the Dispatch Box. I am sure there will be no shortage of parliamentary questions from him—indeed, this relates to a question he asked about Boxer to which I have already replied. We look at the criteria for what we need to buy for our armed forces, and that includes looking at the Boxer programme.”
House of Commons19 October 2026Contains Parliamentary information licensed under the Open Parliament Licence v3.0Source ↗
“I thank my hon. Friend for that work. She will know that we have stood up the Defence Office for Small Business Growth, which is a dedicated front door for small businesses to access and navigate the defence procurement process and speed up security clearances and cyber essentials.”
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“We inherited defence spending of roughly 2.3% of GDP. That figure will be 2.7%-ish next year, and—as the hon. Gentleman will know, having read page 11 of the defence investment plan—at the spending review next year, the Chancellor will set out the spending profile that takes us to 3% and 3.5%.”
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“I may be a south-west MP, but I am a north-east MP when it comes to increasing defence spending, just as my hon. Friend is. I want to see more spending in the north-east. I would be happy to meet my hon. Friend to discuss how Steel Benders UK can access more of that increased defence spending.”
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“Project Safari is a superb example of how, when we have asked industry to step up, it has responded. Steve Wadey, the chief executive of QinetiQ, is pioneering a new set of requirements for test and evaluation, with more access to our ranges for small businesses, a greater focus on more collaboration, and more utility for us to test new c…”
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“Thanks to our growing defence budget, last year we spent £1.8 billion in the west midlands, benefiting not just west midlands businesses but those in my hon. Friend’s constituency. That is an increase of 3% on last year.”
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“I thank my hon. Friend for her question. I also thank all those who served in the Falklands in the 1982 conflict. Yesterday marked the 44th anniversary of Liberation Day, which is celebrated in both the United Kingdom and the Falkland Islands; it is important that we remember the sacrifice of the people who went to the south Atlantic and never came back. That is one of the reasons that I want to see more defence investment and for us to have the deterrent capability. I come from a military family, with members of my family having served across the forces, so I know that when serving personnel go away, there is always a question mark over whether they will come home. That is precisely what drives me in my passion for more defence spending.”
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“We support all 62 recommendations of the SDR, and they are all in progress. The defence investment plan sets out how we will deliver our equipment, personnel and estates for the next 10 years. I want to see more defence investment—the argument that was made by my former colleagues is powerful. I do want to see more defence spending, and I welcome the argument and debate about that across the House.”
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“Friend the Member for North East Derbyshire (Louise Sandher-Jones)—another veteran serving in a key role. Both of them will do a good job for our nation.”
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“I can confirm that we will continue to invest in our people. I think the last time we had a defence review that did not cut the size of the British Army was in the late ’80s. In the strategic defence review published under this Labour Government, we announced that we will increase the size of the British Army to 76,000. We know that the Army’s strength fell considerably and that there was a retention and recruitment crisis in our armed forces under the Conservative Government. That is precisely what we are addressing with the biggest pay rise for our armed forces and by taking action on housing and childcare. I welcome the new Minister for Veterans and People, but I also want to say that I am really proud of the new Minister for the Armed Forces, my hon.”
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“It means doing something that the armed forces have not done for a very long time: discarding some of that kit and equipment that has been around for many, many decades and investing in newer technologies. That is a difficult argument for Ministers to make—it is difficult for those people who are attached to old equipment in particular—but when we have armour that has been in service since before the Vietnam war and ships that are decades past their decommissioning date, we need to be honest about the need to retire old equipment and buy new equipment. The hybrid Navy is just one example of what we will be setting out in the defence investment plan.”
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“I have a lot of time for the former Defence Secretary and the former Armed Forces Minister, and I agree with much of the argument they have made about the importance of increasing defence spending. That is why today I have set out continually from the Dispatch Box that I want to see more defence spending, and I want to see it directed at British companies. I want to see us prepare to deter the next conflict. To do that, we need to invest more in drones, and that is what the defence investment plan will set out. However, as I have said, the defence investment plan is a deliberately scalable document that can reflect an increasing defence budget. That is what we are projecting over the coming decade, delivering our commitment to 3.5% on core defence by 2035. Spending more on the new capabilities, though, does mean retiring old capabilities.”
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“Member will not get me, or any other Minister, to comment on special forces. I suggest that she thinks carefully before asking questions like that again.”
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“I will say two things to the hon. Member. I know that she is relatively new to the House, but it is a really important rule that we do not comment on special forces. We neither confirm nor deny activities or visits to any special forces location. We do that deliberately, because any question that helps define who is where and what they are doing is of benefit to our adversaries. I appreciate that she was looking for a “gotcha” question, but let me take her back to the important thing: we do not comment on special forces. What I have seen from our Prime Minister and the former Defence Secretary is their meeting the crews of our ballistic submarines when they return on zero day, after many months under the sea. I have seen them support the brilliant service of armed forces personnel. I am afraid that the hon.”
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“For the Royal Navy especially—he mentioned the importance of air defence—we are looking at how uncrewed systems can sail alongside crewed systems, providing that air defence bubble. Learning lessons from our friends in Ukraine and from recent activities in the middle east and Cyprus will be an important part of that. He will be able to recognise that immediately when he reads the DIP, on its publication.”
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“I thank the right hon. Member for his question. He will know from his time in the Ministry of Defence and on the NATO PA that getting procurement right and fixing the broken procurement system we inherited is important. We have already taken a number of steps to get there. I think he will recall that I gave an answer on the Type 83 last week, at the last urgent question on this topic. If he looks back at that, he will get his answer. Let me say clearly to the right hon. Member that we inherited an equipment plan that was overcommitted and unsuitable for the challenges we now face. That is one of the reasons we are looking to invest more in autonomy and more in hybrid and uncrewed systems.”
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“That is especially true of those small and medium-sized enterprises with huge growth potential, and we need to ensure that they can compete for contracts. That is one of the reasons we are looking at new ways of procuring through the Commercial X procurement model and learning lessons from the Taskforce Kindred for Ukraine procurement. We are bringing those into mainstream UK armed forces procurement to speed it up, which means that more SMEs will be able to benefit from it. More capital injection into defence—both from the Government, as we are planning, and from private sources—is a good course.”
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“I thank the hon. Lady for her question and Martin for his interest in how we increase defence spending. She will know from our debates in this Chamber that it is not just the defence investment plan that we are working on currently. We are also looking at how, through a defence finance and investment strategy, working with our defence advisory group for City professionals, we can look at accessing new forms of capital, including patient, sovereign and a whole range of capital options. I know that the hon. Lady and her party are keen on the war bonds option, and I am happy to look at the detailed analysis of that if her party has any, but we do not just need investment in core defence; it is also about investing in the supply chain.”
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“I have seen the previous Defence Secretary make the case for defence spending, and I have seen the Prime Minister and the Chancellor increase defence spending since Labour came to office. I know that there is a very strong case, to meet the moment, for further increasing defence spending. That is why the new Defence Secretary has been speaking to the Prime Minister and to colleagues across Government about how best we can deliver a DIP that will increase our warfighting capability and end the hollowing out and the absence of funding in the equipment plan. About 30% of the equipment plan we inherited from the Conservatives was unfunded. There is lots of work to do, but we will publish the DIP before the NATO summit.”
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“When I held the shadow Environment brief, the hon. Gentleman and I were in many debates where I made the case strongly that food security is national security. This is something that really matters. He also mentioned cables, and he will know that we are investing in the operations that Royal Fleet Auxiliary Proteus and HMS Stirling Castle can undertake to support our undersea infrastructure. We need to continue to support those items, and he will see more in the defence investment plan. The Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs covers food security here, but I agree with him that food security is national security.”
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“Yes, I have been involved in doing it. Let me be very clear and answer the hon. Gentleman’s question in full— [ Interruption. ] His Front-Bench colleagues want to shout at me, but let them listen for a moment. The defence investment plan is a good, scalable plan that provides the capabilities—”
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“I have just replied: yes. The hon. Gentleman needs to listen to the answer. Yes, I have seen it, and I have been involved in writing it. The plan itself is a good plan; the debate is about the funding that goes into it. I am up for a debate about how we increase defence spending, because I want to see more capabilities, I want to see defence housing improve faster, and I want to see more support for our armed forces so that they can recover their strength. That is precisely what the defence investment plan will set out, and it is good to make the case for more funding to go into it.”
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“I recommend that the hon. Gentleman reads the new defence diplomacy strategy, which we published a few months ago to deliver on what he has just asked me.”
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“As a fellow Plymouth MP, I was exceedingly proud of the Royal Marines from 42 Commando in Plymouth for participating in the action. If the hon. Lady were to look at 47 Commando, another Royal Marines unit based in Plymouth, she would see some of the new capabilities that we have bought to support them, including the Kraken K3 Scouts. The Royal Marines have a bright future ahead of them, and superb professionalism, as we saw on the weekend.”
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“We are already increasing defence spending, and we will continue to increase defence spending. The defence investment plan is designed to be scalable to match that increased defence spending. The question is what profile that increase should have. I will always argue for more defence spending, but we are increasing defence spending. That is something that I want to see more of.”
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“I point the hon. Gentleman not just to the £1.6 billion contract that we have placed with Thales in Belfast for its lightweight multirole missile—supporting our friends in Ukraine—but to the increasing investment we are working with Thales on to support our middle eastern friends, as well as the £50 million Northern Ireland defence growth deal, which is especially supporting SMEs in Northern Ireland to access more of the increasing defence spending. I want to see more defence spending in Northern Ireland, as I want to see more defence spending across the United Kingdom.”
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“It is unusual for the hon. Member not to be on the money with his questions, but as the media reports on the weekend’s meeting make clear, we will be signing the full international contract by the end of the month. We are committed to GCAP.”
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“There is lots on which I agree with the former Defence Secretary, and he and I have worked together for a very long time on this. I respect his decision and that of the former Armed Forces Minister. I am staying to get this done—to deliver a defence investment plan. I will continue working with our brand-new Defence Secretary to get a good deal for defence, and to support our armed forces.”
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“Further to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I am grateful to my Devon neighbour, the hon. Member for Exmouth and Exeter East (David Reed), for allowing me to say again that the Government back all 62 recommendations of the strategic defence review, and we are implementing all 62 of those recommendations. It is an important, first-of-its-kind review, and it is one that this Government fully back.”
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“In their first five years in government, they cut it by £12 billion. This Labour Government are rearming and renewing our armed forces, and ending the Tory hollowing-out, by spending over £11 billion more on defence this year than was spent in the last year of the Conservative Government. Our defence investment plan, which will deliver our strategic defence review, will put that right. Backed by our commitment to the largest sustained increase in defence spending since the cold war, and by the most ambitious programme of defence reform in 50 years, we will deliver for Britain and for defence.”
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“In just the past four weeks, we have announced a £115 million hybrid Navy package for the UK-led mission in the strait of Hormuz; a £1 billion contract for new mobile artillery for the British Army; rapidly procured new weapons for our Typhoons, which have already been deployed to shoot down drones at low cost; 13 new contracts, worth up to £4 million each, with small, home-grown British businesses to foster growth and innovation, and to find the next billion-pound UK defence unicorn; and a pay award of 3.6%, so most armed forces personnel have received a cumulative pay award of 14.1% since this Labour Government were formed. Let us not forget that the Conservatives left the defence programme overcommitted, underfunded and unsuited to the threats we now face. In their first year in government, they cut defence spending by £2 billion.”
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“As the Prime Minister set out today at Prime Minister’s questions, and as the Defence Secretary outlined just last week, we will publish the defence investment plan ahead of the NATO summit in just a few weeks’ time. The Prime Minister, the Defence Secretary and the entire Defence team are determined to get the DIP right to ensure that we deliver the best equipment and technology into the hands of our frontline forces, while investing in and growing the UK economy. We are determined to make the right choices for the country to ensure that the UK is secure at home and strong abroad. Even as we finalise the DIP, we continue to back British jobs, British businesses and British innovation. Since July 2024, the Government have signed 1,400ysv major contracts, with 94% of that spend going to UK-based firms.”
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“We are, however, very clear that we are investing more in defence. We are ending the hollowing out and underfunding that his Government presided over. We are very clear that the DIP will be published before the NATO summit. [ Interruption. ] He can keep chuntering, but I am trying to answer his questions. He had an opportunity to ask them; let me have a go at answering them. [ Interruption. ] He is choosing not to do that. Spending decisions are made by the Prime Minister— [ Interruption. ] The hon. Gentleman is still chuntering, which is not good. Spending decisions will be made by the Prime Minister and the Chancellor in the usual way, as applies to any Department, including the Ministry of Defence, and we will publish the defence investment plan before the NATO summit.”
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“I join the hon. Gentleman in passing on my personal condolences in relation to the helicopter crash in Devon, which, as a Devon MP, I know has hit the military city I represent very hard. I come from a Royal Navy family and know many people who fly similar helicopters, and I welcome the cross-party support for the families of the victims. The hon. Gentleman asked when the DIP will be published. As the Prime Minister and the Defence Secretary have said, it will be published before the NATO summit in only a few weeks’ time. The “few weeks’ time” should have answered his final question, but I understand he wanted to get that in for a social media clip. Instead of wanting to know the answer, he would already have known it. The hon. Gentleman would also have known that the SDR was not market sensitive, so what he said was not correct.”
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“That is why the defence investment plan will go beyond just equipment and deal with people, estates and infrastructure, as well as dealing with this reform. I am certain that he will have heard the commitments given by the Prime Minister and the Defence Secretary, and I look forward to debates in this House on the defence investment plan, when it is published.”
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“I thank my hon. Friend for the work he does for defence and the work he does on the Defence Committee. He knows that the commitment the Defence Secretary made from this Dispatch Box to publish the plan before the NATO summit will be honoured. When it comes to the details, we have committed to go beyond the equipment programmes we inherited. The equipment plans published by the last Government dealt only with equipment, and as my hon. Friend will know, 47 of the 49 major defence programmes we inherited were delayed and over budget at the general election. He will also know that 30% or so of the equipment plans were unfunded, and many of them were unsuitable for the threats we are facing.”
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“The 1,400 major contracts I mentioned in my response to the initial question support not only companies such as BAE Systems, Babcock and Thales—the very large defence primes—but the entire supply chain, with many of those contracts going to small businesses. We want to see the innovation, job creation, energy and dynamism of small businesses have a bigger role in defence, and that is especially true in areas such as autonomy, in which many of the companies from which we are buying capabilities are small businesses with huge growth potential. When the defence investment plan is published, the hon. Member will see that we are backing those innovative companies and SMEs.”
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“I thank the hon. Member for his questions, and for the condolences on behalf of his party. It was polite of him to promote me in his question; I will ensure that the Secretary of State has heard what he had to say. It is important to set out that we have not waited for the defence investment plan to deliver the new capabilities, the new contracts and the new investment. The hon. Member mentioned small businesses, and earlier this year we stood up the Defence Office for Small Business Growth to create a single doorway for small businesses to access defence. We have supported more small businesses, and we have increased the target for direct spend by the Ministry of Defence by 50%, which is an extra £2.5 billion of direct spend going into small businesses. We will continue to support SMEs.”
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“My hon. Friend is absolutely right that the difficult decision made to move 0.2% of GNI spent on international aid to defence spending was an important one. It showed that, in this new era of hard power, we need to increase spending on defence and to increase capabilities, which is precisely the decision taken in the past. We are very proud to be increasing defence funding. Compared with the Conservatives, who cut defence spending in their first Budget, we increased defence spending in the first Labour Budget.”
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“I have a lot of time for the right hon. Gentleman, and I enjoy listening to his clips on social media, on which I am sure this will appear very shortly. [ Interruption. ] I have to say to him politely— [ Interruption. ] I have to say to him politely— [ Interruption. ]”
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“I have to say to the right hon. Gentleman, politely, that when we have military families living in housing with black mould in bedrooms, broken boilers and leaky roofs, the investment we are making in defence housing is absolutely vital. He says that there may have been errors—there certainly were. Defence matters to me, as someone who comes from a military family and represents a military constituency. We will publish the defence investment plan shortly. What it will show is a Labour Government increasing defence spending, ending the hollowing out and underfunding that his Government, in which he was a Minister, presided over: new capabilities for our armed forces and a stronger Britain in a more dangerous world. [ Interruption. ] I look forward to seeing the entire answer on his social media, not just his clip. [ Interruption. ]”
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“I thank my hon. Friend for her question and for how she presented it. She is absolutely right that we need to increase investment. Barrow in her constituency is a really good example of that. There has been a massive increase in employment, with people working in the BAE Systems facilities building the latest generation of nuclear submarines. The commitment is for up to 12 SSNAs to be built in Barrow. That huge investment, not just in our nuclear deterrent but our hunter-killer fleet, shows that when we get defence spending right and we put the effort into skills and communities, defence really is an engine for growth. She will see that writ large when the DIP is published.”
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“The hon. Gentleman asks a number of questions, which are typically sensible. I look forward to when he sits on the Opposition Front Bench as the shadow Defence Secretary, if the rumours are true. We have made very clear our commitment to the global combat air programme. The Secretary of State discussed it with our GCAP partners—our Italian and Japanese counterparts—when he was in Singapore only a couple of weekends ago at the Shangri-La Dialogue conference. We are committed to the GCAP programme. We have signed the first international contract for that. To deliver that, we will continue to work with our GCAP partners. I do not have the precise answers to his questions off the top of my head, but I will be sure to write to him.”
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“I thank my hon. Friend for his question. I have seen for myself the skill and experience of the workers at Samlesbury and Warton in supporting our Typhoon operations and building parts for the F-35 programme. One lesson we can take from the war in Ukraine—a key learning recommended in the strategic defence review—is that we look at the growth of autonomy in particular. We can see that already in how drones have massively changed the frontline, the fighting doctrine and the force structure required to deter and fight in the 21st century. That is true on land, in the maritime domain and in the air domain. A key part of the DIP will be to provide the latest technology for our forces, and to support our industrial base to not only build more of those capabilities in Britain, but ensure we can export them to our allies, too.”
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“I am not sure the hon. Gentleman is suggesting we delay the DIP further, but I understand his argument. We will publish the DIP before the NATO summit. That commitment has been made by the Prime Minister and the Defence Secretary, and we will do that.”
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“The money announced yesterday, not just for Bournemouth but for universities and colleges nationwide, will help to support the next generation of talent to work in defence—good, well-paid, decent jobs.”
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“My hon. Friend is a real champion for defence businesses in and around Bournemouth. I am really pleased that we were able to announce yesterday the universities and colleges across the country that will receive the uplift in student places, with the supplementary places grant that will enhance the skills provision. We have already enhanced the provision of skills for further education, with the announcement of five defence technical excellence colleges in England, hopefully two in Scotland if the Scottish Government will support a second one, and one in Wales. We need to go further with more higher education places in defence and defence-adjacent courses.”
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“I equally have enormous respect for the hon. Lady, which is why I will say politely that I disagree with her characterisation. I will also politely say to her, as someone who reads the media speculation on what is in the DIP and what discussions have taken place, to not always believe what is written down online.”
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“Also, when we retire UK kit, we look at whether there is a Ukrainian need for it, so I assure him that that is a process that is under way. I continue to speak to my Ukrainian counterpart about the additional support we can provide not just for the fight tonight, but for the deterrence that Ukraine will need in the future, when peace has hopefully arrived, to prevent Putin from ever invading again.”
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“My hon. Friend is certainly right that recruitment matters, and that this Government inherited a retention and recruitment crisis from the Conservatives. I am pleased to report to the House that inflow to our armed forces is now up 11.6% in the last year, outflow is down 8.9%, and morale is up three points in the last year alone. My hon. Friend make a good point about recruitment, and I would be pleased to arrange a meeting between him and the Minister for Veterans and People, who looks after recruitment. My hon. Friend is also right about disposals. We work closely with our friends in Ukraine to provide them with kit and equipment direct from British industry, supporting procurement with our allies as well.”
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“The hon. Gentleman knows very well that this Labour Government have been delivering for Yeovil quite considerably, with a £1 billion new medium helicopter contract for Leonardo, support for Gripen exports, supporting a number of firms in his constituency, the defence technical excellence college we funded in Yeovil, and the announcement yesterday of the additional places for Yeovil College. There will be more places for Yeovil College, more opportunities for young people to study, and a growing defence sector in Yeovil that I am happy to continue to support. I look forward to making further announcements, for not just the hon. Gentleman and Yeovil but the rest of the country, in due course.”
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“As Devonport’s MP, I say to my Portsmouth colleagues that after many years under the Conservatives where Devonport, Portsmouth and Faslane were pitched against each other, it is welcome that under a Labour Government we can confidently say that there is work and resources for all three. After much delay by the last Government, we will see a multibillion-pound investment across our naval bases, and the defence investment plan will lay out some of that. I am happy to meet my hon. Friend and her Portsmouth colleagues to say how we are investing in the kit and capabilities that our Royal Navy needs, as well as in military houses, skills and support for veterans and cadets across the country, which will improve our warfighting readiness, ensuring we have the ability to deter aggression—and to defeat it if necessary.”
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“Madam Deputy Speaker, it is indeed a prop, but I have read it and welcome the hon. Gentleman’s contribution, because I want to see more scrutiny of defence and ensure that we can answer that. The issue he raised on article 3, which concerns homeland defence, is important. That is one of the reasons why I said in my opening remarks that the equipment plan we inherited was unsuited to defence. It also had gaps in our defence. What the hon. Gentleman and others will see when the defence investment plan is published is how we are supporting not only our warfighting ability and the defence of NATO allies, but homeland defence. Let me be clear that homeland defence means the entirety of the United Kingdom and our overseas territories.”
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“We have to look at lessons to improve our personnel and experience. We are in regular dialogue with our friends in Ukraine, learning lessons on kit and capability, how Russia fights, how we deter Russian aggression against NATO allies, and how we invest in the capabilities that Ukraine needs. Programmes such as Brakestop, as a low-cost cruise missile informed by the work of our friends in Ukraine, deliver that. The lesson I take from Ukraine and Iran is that we will need more autonomy, drones and understanding about mass as well as exquisite high-end capabilities. Expect to see more of that in the defence investment plan when it is published.”
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“I sit in his chair now, so that explains what happened with the previous Minister and the voters. To be fair, the hon. Member for South Suffolk was one of the few Defence Ministers re-elected as an MP at the last election, with many others not returned to the House. My hon. Friend is right about the importance of long-term security, which is why we are setting out the investment in our kit and capabilities, effectively replacing the equipment plans that were published previously, and looking at our personnel, skills and infrastructure. One of the areas that was hollowed out and consistently underfunded as capital was taken from those budgets was our defence estate. We know the scandal of the armed forces housing that many of our constituents were asked to live in, which is something we are addressing with a £9 billion programme.”
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“We will fund one DTEC in Scotland, and if the Scottish Government can support the initiative with a second, we can have one in both the east and the west of Scotland, supporting the hugely important defence industry there. I hope that is a point on which we can find consistent cross-party support. If we are looking for more cross-party support, I encourage the hon. Gentleman and his party to back the brilliant submariners who support our independent nuclear deterrent, which sails from Faslane. The independent nuclear deterrent is the foundation of our national security, and something that we will continue to support in the defence investment plan.”
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