Lincoln Jopp
MP for Spelthorne · Conservative · United Kingdom
“All my residents in Spelthorne and I are desperate to get Spelthorne’s five stations into the travelcard zone. The Secretary of State has looked at this in the past, but will she look again, with South Western Railway, at the financial modelling being used to say that it is not possible?”
“My residents in Spelthorne love their racecourse and have no desire to see it flattened and turned into housing so, as any Member would, I started a petition. It has received over 3,500 signatures so far. I also organised a public meeting in the Magpie pub in Lower Sunbury last week, attended by about 70 people.”
“Barratt Redrow told me on 20 March that it was going to put in a planning application by the end of this year. After I started campaigning vociferously for Kempton Park, it elicited a media statement from the company on Friday that it had no plans to put in a planning application during this calendar year.”
“In the centre, Jukebox Man; on the far side, Gaelic Warrior; and on the near side, Banbridge, in a classic renewal of the Ladbrokes King George.” The reason I focus on that is because I was there on Boxing day last year to watch the running of the King George.”
“The proposal had been seen off under previous planning rules. However, hon. Members will be aware that, under the new national planning policy framework, there is an assumed yes for planning purposes if a proposed development is within 800 metres of a train station with two departures an hour in the same direction.”
“Member for Liverpool Walton (Dan Carden), that it is “an internationally recognised venue and a major economic asset that, once lost, can never be replaced. Locally, it supports jobs and generates substantial spending for hospitality, retail, transport and many other businesses, while providing valuable green space.”
The complete record
Every one of 599 lines we hold for Lincoln Jopp, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 7 of 12.
“The Minister seems to have co-opted the amount of money spent on the Royal Air Force into his argument. Is he aware that absent the defence investment plan—it was promised in the autumn, and the House rises tomorrow—we have no idea about the size, shape and cost of the Royal Air Force, because the Government are late with their homework?”
“The Minister for Defence Readiness and Industry said that we would have the defence investment plan in the autumn. The Secretary of State has now told us that they are working flat-out to get it to us by the end of the year. When I was in the Army, we had a saying that two minutes early is three minutes late. Can we just make sure that this lackadaisical approach to punctuality has not spread to the military? Can the Secretary of State confirm that the King’s birthday parade will indeed take place at 11 am on 13 June?”
“National Grid is going to spend about £30 billion by the end of the decade building pylons, but only 2% of the steel used to build those pylons will be British; similarly, in the offshore wind projects, only 2% of the steel will be British. That is because of carbon taxes and energy costs. Does the Minister recognise that rather than promoting the opportunity of the great, green revolution that they were espousing earlier, the Government are actually killing British business with high energy costs?”
“The Minister’s magnificent waistcoat reminds me that last night I was at the grand opening of Tulip Treasures Florist on Shepperton high street in my constituency. Will the Minister wish young Rhiannon, who is taking that brave step, every success in her endeavours?”
“I spent about five years, on and off, working in the Ministry of Defence, and we had a saying: plans without resources are hallucinations. On 8 September, the Minister for Defence Readiness and Industry told my hon. Friend the Member for Huntingdon (Ben Obese-Jecty) that the Defence investment plan would be published “in the autumn.” Some people think autumn ends on 30 November; others, being generous, say it ends on 21 December. Will the Minister tell us today when the defence investment plan will be published, given that, in her words, national security is the Government’s “first priority”?”
“I welcome the Leader of the House’s opening remarks about charities. Spelthorne Dementia Support does outstanding work throughout my constituency, so I was delighted when it was given the King’s award for voluntary service in the recent list. It occurred to me that all hon. Members will have similar charities so awarded, and it would be fantastic to have an annual debate in Government time on the King’s award for voluntary service so that all hon. Members across the House could celebrate in the same way as I am celebrating Spelthorne Dementia Support.”
“The Minister mentioned the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister, of course, appointed Lord Mandelson to be our ambassador in America. For those seven months, someone had politically fatal kompromat on Lord Mandelson. I am not asking the Minister to give away any secrets, but could he tell us that he has personally investigated whether the presence of that kompromat left Lord Mandelson subject to foreign influence, or whether he knows the answer to that question one way or the other?”
“There is a bit of a debate going on. Unemployment has gone up every month since the Government have been in power. The Government say that is the fault of the last Government; we Opposition Members say that it is the fault of two Budgets that have been anti-business. If the hon. Member has faith in the Chancellor’s policies, will she put her money where her mouth is and say that unemployment in Shipley and across the country will come down for the first time? If she could put a month and a year on it, that would be great testament to her faith in the Chancellor.”
“The Conservatives are often accused by Labour Members of talking down the economy, but from my recollection, over its 14 years the Conservative party set the conditions for the creation of 800 jobs per day, on average. I have just checked the recent statistics and the number is running at about 373 under the current Government. In addition, net inflation has risen every month that the Government have been in power, since July last year. Will my hon. Friend take an intervention from any one of the very few Members present on the Government Benches who is prepared to say when they think that unemployment might start to fall from the record levels of low unemployment that they inherited from the last Government?”
“I notice that there are quite a lot of people on the Public Gallery at the moment. The former Government left almost record levels of low unemployment, and unemployment has gone up in every month that this new Government have been in power. Would the hon. Lady like to answer how this Government in a hurry are heading in the right direction, and perhaps suggest when unemployment in her constituency and across the country might start to come down, rather than continually going up?”
“Following the Budget, a furious Labour voter, 30 years old, texted me to say, “I am furious about the salary sacrifice thing. I give up a lot of things to put 20% of my salary into my pension. That’s going to cost me almost two grand a year for being responsible.” Why are the Government so keen on punishing savers?”
“The Government’s proposals on jury trials are causing concern and consternation in my constituency, and my mailbag is quite full of people’s messages opposing the Government’s proposals. Just so we understand where the Secretary of State is on this, could the Minister please explain to us what he is doing right now such that he could not come and answer this urgent question himself?”
“I think the procurement Minister will know that I asked his predecessor whether the National Armaments Director would have carte blanche to tear up the book when it comes to defence procurement. She answered from the Dispatch Box that not only would they have that ability but they would be held to account for so doing. Defence Committee members do not want them coming in front of us in a year’s time to say, “We wanted to change things, but they wouldn’t let us.” Now that the Minister is in his role, will he reassure us that the policy remains that the National Armaments Director, for their £600,000 a year, will be given carte blanche to tear up the book when it comes to procurement?”
“Last week, the National Security Adviser was due to appear before the Joint Committee on the National Security Strategy. Did he? If not, why not?”
“Indeed, every year visitors flock from miles around to witness the start of that most quintessentially English and iconic event, swan upping, which starts at Sunbury lock. We are also home to the Swan Sanctuary in Felix Lane; started in the 1980s, it now cares for injured and damaged mute swans from across the south of England.”
“I represent Spelthorne—I feel compelled to remind the House that Spelthorne is not in Lincolnshire or Lancashire; it is everything immediately south of Heathrow airport down to the River Thames. As well as having a decent stretch of one bank of the River Thames, from Staines to Sunbury, we are also blessed with extensive and much-prized green spaces such as Staines Moor, Sunbury Park and Leyland Park. Water is a major feature of Spelthorne, because the land has been quarried over the years—much of it for the building of the M25—and we are home to half of London’s drinking water, stored in four enormous reservoirs. All that means that Spelthorne, for a largely suburban area inside the M25, is a good home for wildlife, particularly bird life.”
“I beg to move, That this House has considered the matter of catapults and anti-social behaviour. It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Sir Desmond. I am going to give this speech backwards, inasmuch as I am going to start with the end and the ask. I ask the Government to introduce an amendment to the Crime and Policing Bill, which is in Committee in the House of Lords. I would like the Bill amended to reduce the minimum age at which community protection notices can be issued, from 16 years old to 10 years old—the age of criminal responsibility in England. That was proposed under the last Government’s version of the Bill, which died when the general election was called. Having started with the end of my speech, now let me begin at the beginning.”
“As a boy growing up on Barnes common, I remember finding a good Y-shaped stick, making a catapult for myself and shooting at discarded Coke cans as target practice—but catapult technology has moved on from its Dennis the Menace days. The ones that can be bought now will fire a ball-bearing at 73 mps.”
“I thank the hon. Member for his intervention, and for his faith in my knowledge of Northern Ireland-specific wildlife legislation—funnily enough, I am going to mention Northern Ireland in a moment. I certainly believe in robust enforcement of existing legislation, and I will come on to some practical additional measures that could be taken to rid us of this scourge. When I visited Steve and his amazing team of volunteers at the Swan Sanctuary, I saw at first hand the horrible injuries to swans—and to all the other types of birds that the sanctuary cares for—caused by people firing at them with catapults. I said that I would look into the matter further, and have secured this debate in order to share what I have learned with the House. In many people’s minds catapults have a sort of cheeky-chappie, comic-book image.”
“I thank the hon. Member for bringing her personal experience as a police officer to this debate. I thank her for her service. These new catapults have awesome power, and could easily take out your eye, Sir Desmond, or indeed other hon. Members’ eyes, and cause life-changing injuries. In fact, in my time in the army, in riots in Northern Ireland, I had them used against me; they were a gateway weapon for kids who would later graduate to the coffee jar bomb and the nail bomb.”
“The police tell me that in Spelthorne over the past year and a half crimes involving catapults have been reported to them more than once a week. The crimes happen predominantly after schools have ended, and in 90% of cases no suspect or even person of interest is identified. Spelthorne police, to their credit, tell me that they are going back to reviewing a number of these cases to make sure that they did not miss anything the first time round and to see whether any particular patterns emerge. My constituents notice the crimes happening; sadly, they too often see the wounded and killed wildlife when they are out enjoying our green spaces and river walks.”
“The hon. Gentleman echoes my cry. Since being elected as the Member of Parliament for Spelthorne, in all my dealings with the community, too often it becomes a conversation of the deaf, inasmuch as people think that there is no point in reporting crime because the police will not do anything about it, and the police say, “Well, no one has reported any crime, so there’s nothing for me to do.” We must unlock that conversation of the deaf by encouraging everyone to report every crime; in cases where they are worried about intimidation, they have the opportunity to use Crimestoppers, and I commend that outlet as well. In Spelthorne, we have a serious problem with young kids using catapults on animals. I am obliged to Inspector Matthew Walton of Spelthorne police, who has helped me a great deal in preparing this campaign.”
“I attended a meeting earlier this month with the Home Office’s Minister of State and two members of parliament to discuss solutions to combatting this very issue. I am determined that with key partners, we can agree a way forward to protect our wildlife, the public and property from these appalling acts.” I hope that what the Minister hears today can inform those considerations, and I will gladly take an intervention from either of the two mystery Back Benchers the Minister referred to in her letter, if indeed they are here today.”
“A volunteer at the Swan Sanctuary launched a public petition to make catapults illegal, which received 24,521 signatures. There is currently a live petition asking to make it an offence to carry a catapult in public without a lawful defence, which currently has more than 33,000 signatures and is live until next year. The Government know they have a problem; I am obliged to the Minister for animal welfare, Baroness Hayman, for replying to me recently. She said that the Government feel that there is sufficient legislation on the statute book to handle the problem, but nevertheless stated: “Having said this, I recognise the concern that the misuse of catapults is causing to communities in certain parts of the country.”
“To be clear, the process at the moment is that the police can combine the public space protection order and the community protection notice to intervene early. It is a civil offence. A community protection warning is the first step; if people do not adhere to that warning, they get a notice, and the breach of a notice itself becomes a criminal offence currently punishable by a £100 fine, although in the consideration of the Crime and Policing Bill in the other place, on the back of the former Government’s draft legislation, that is going up to £500. I know that there is public support for an outright ban on catapults. Others want them regulated in the same way we regulate guns, or possession of them treated as we treat possession of knives.”
“There was, of course, a whole raft of things that we did and drills that we learned in order to react and save life when those things when went off, but the majority of effort and ingenuity was applied to try to stop it happening in the first place—we had to do everything to the left of the bang, as the saying went. It is similar with catapults. The police would like to pre-empt this problem before it happens, and believe that reducing the minimum age of a community protection notice to 10 years would allow early intervention before bad behaviour escalates. It would also provide a proportionate civil response without criminalising children and reduce reliance on lengthy court processes.”
“We had an intelligence briefing beforehand, and what was striking was the ages of the young people we were keeping an eye out for—they were all 16 and under, and had records for some very serious offences. Catapults are predominantly kids’ stuff, by which I mean children of 10 years old and up. Currently in Spelthorne, anyone committing an offence will have their catapult seized and be issued a fine by the council, while those under 16 will have their parents informed and the catapult returned to the parent. The trouble with the current powers is that they rely on someone’s being caught offending and, as I said earlier, these crimes are rarely witnessed. When I was in Iraq and Afghanistan, we faced a lethal threat from improvised explosive devices.”
“I believe that the Green party is led by a hypnotist; it seems that the Government Benches have a mind reader, too, because the hon. Gentleman must have seen into the future and what I was about to say. My constituents write to me in numbers to express their distress at this scourge. Spelthorne borough council has responded and has in place a public space protection order for catapults across the whole borough. Unfortunately, though, the council will not enforce a PSPO breach if the individual is under 16. That is the council’s choice, but I would prefer it to reduce that minimum age considerably. I went out for a ride-along with the response team of the Spelthorne police two weeks ago.”
“Although the Government’s position is that they consider sufficient legislation to be in place, I ask that the Minister consider our proposed amendment to the Crime and Policing Bill, which would reduce the minimum age from 16 to 10 years old for community protection notices.”
“In a BBC documentary, a ballistics specialist confirmed catapults can fire at 134 mph, and surgeons have treated people with shattered bones and life-changing injuries. These are not toys—they are weapons. We are not asking for a ban. We are asking for basic regulation, no more extreme than requiring a fishing licence. Catapults should be classed as offensive weapons, and it should be illegal to carry them in public without lawful reason. What is extreme is the violence and impunity we are currently facing.” While that correspondent has a different solution from the one that I am proposing, I hope that the Minister can understand the strength of feeling, both in this House and out in our constituencies.”
“He continues: “A recent FOI request showed only 13 wildlife-crime convictions across England and Wales between 2023 and 2024. We are told the laws ‘already exist’, but these outcomes say otherwise. Government departments continue to insist catapults are not weapons and are not used against wildlife. On the ground, we know this is simply untrue. This is no longer just a wildlife issue. Two cats have been shot dead. A dog has lost an eye. I myself have been threatened, chased, and ignored. I have provided body-cam footage to police only to watch nothing happen. In another incident, after being repeatedly targeted with eggs, officers arrived two hours later and refused to speak to the boys responsible. The message this sends is dangerous: you can commit these acts and face no consequences. Experts agree on the seriousness.”
“The gentleman concerned is not a constituent, so I will not name where he is from, but Members will get the general picture: “My name is Chris, and I volunteer with the”— here he mentions the location— “Wildlife Network. I’ve spent years on the front line—picking up bodies, comforting dying animals, and witnessing a level of cruelty that is rapidly escalating. I appreciate that my concerns have been acknowledged, but I am devastated that no action is being taken to regulate catapults. The situation is stark. At one of my local lakes alone there were 13 catapult attacks in May, 19 in September and 7 in November. This year I have reported 54 attacks, yet only two are being investigated—even with clear video evidence”— again, I stress that this is not in Spelthorne.”
“Lastly, I will highlight my boxing club, which is predominantly staffed by volunteers. I think it has 20 boxers and another 20 on the waiting list. Its site is very cramped and they would dearly love to expand. The combination of parental responsibility and parents just giving enough of a whatever about their young people’s wellbeing to invest in them and get them to go and do these activities—or, indeed, parents investing their time to make these things happen—is all to the good. It means that the attraction of sitting in a hedge, firing ball bearings at swans recedes into the distance. I will end in a couple of minutes, but first I will read out some correspondence that I received earlier.”
“We’ve got 36 on the waiting list now.” On the night that I was there, I asked a parent who had driven their child there how far they had come, and they said from Notting Hill. For Members who do not get the geography, I am out near Heathrow airport. They said that it was the only place that does this. So all points in between—take a note of this Westminster Hall debate. For those who want to point and shoot, we also have the Laleham archery club, which has a very good youth programme. They compete, and I had a go myself at Laleham fair. It is a lot of fun and, again, it teaches discipline—there is shooting and all of that. Of course, we then have the cadets. I am blessed with sea cadets, air cadets and Army cadets, all of which are a brilliant way of channelling young people’s energy and giving them a sense of purpose and discipline.”
“In Shepperton, I also have a kids’ darts thing—if anyone is looking for a side-hustle business idea, this is the one. It is above what was probably a Conservative club before. It is a sports and social club, and on the top floor, there are five dartboards and they run two one-hour sessions. The first is for nine to 14-year-olds and the second is for 15 to 18-year-olds. There are five boards and five people per board. I was there for two hours, and I did not see a single one of those young people get a phone out once. They learn brilliant mental maths, sportsmanship, discipline, competition, mutual respect and understanding. I was absolutely blown away. When I went to my local barber the other day, the guy who runs the darts, and is one of the coaches, was coming out. He said, “Lincoln, you will not believe it.”
“Another mystery cleared up by Inspector Jopp; I wish I had been as successful on my drive-around with the Spelthorne police the other day. As well as my ask on reducing the minimum age at which protection notices can be served, I also want to put in a word for parental responsibility and alternative outlets for young people’s energy, competitiveness and desire to shoot and hit things. I hear weekly in the Chamber how my party is responsible for running down youth services to the point of annihilation, so I want to raise the roof in relation to what happens in my constituency. On Friday night, I went to the extraordinary, world-leading Spelthorne Gymnastics. It has 1,600 students. At the European championships at Easter, Team GB took away five gold medals, and all five were won by people who came from Spelthorne Gymnastics.”
“I am grateful to the Minister and conscious of time. Does she agree that, when people are concerned about intimidation and identification, they can ring Crimestoppers anonymously and report in that way?”
“I am very grateful to all the hon. Members who have attended this debate and the public officials who have recorded our deliberations. I heard from the Minister that there is broad consensus on the fact that there is a problem, and that early intervention is better than picking up the pieces. I have made my point about extending the age group eligible for community protection notices, and hope that, in the Minister’s wider considerations, she can give a second thought to that before the Crime and Policing Bill continues its progress through the House of Lords. Question put and agreed to. Resolved, That this House has considered the matter of catapults and anti-social behaviour.”
“I thank the Foreign Secretary for that answer. There is a rumour going round Whitehall that the Foreign Secretary is not the Foreign Secretary, and that the real Foreign Secretary is Mr Jonathan Powell. That could not possibly be the case, of course, because it would make a mockery of the ability to hold the Foreign Secretary to account. Can the Foreign Secretary demonstrate that she really is in charge by telling us the precise instructions that she gave Mr Powell before he met the Chinese Foreign Minister four days ago?”
“I have just been checking my notes, and I think that the Minister may have inadvertently referred to you, Sir Desmond, as “Mr Swayne”. I thought it might be good to offer him the opportunity to correct the record, and show that he did not mean any disrespect to the Chair.”
“On 16 June I asked the Secretary of State what she understood to be the drivers behind the phenomenon of the exponential rise in the number of children with special educational needs. She replied: “My Department, and the Department of Health and Social Care, are keen to understand…the drivers”. —[ Official Report , 16 June 2025; Vol. 769, c. 11.] May I ask what work the Secretary of State has done in the intervening six months, and what she understands better today than she did on 16 June?”
“I thank the Minister for coming to the Chamber to answer this urgent question. I have taken note of what she has said and, if I may, I will quote it back to her: “a swift and prompt trial is a fundamental ingredient of fairness”, a three to four year delay is “deeply demoralising”, and “justice delayed is justice denied”. How does she square that position with her support for the Northern Ireland Troubles Bill?”
“I completely agree with my right hon. Friend about the inherent contradictions. Would it be fair to characterise this Budget as the left hand not knowing what the further left hand is doing?”
“I am grateful to the hon. Member for giving way. What is his message to the people who have been made unemployed since the Labour party came to power?”
“I am grateful to the hon. Member for giving way a second time. The Chancellor said on Sky News, “It’s on me now.” I would be grateful if he could set a date for when this Government are going to take responsibility for the country. I have plenty of things I could be doing in Spelthorne, so I will go away and come back when he is prepared to be accountable and take responsibility for the state of the nation under this Government.”
“Does the hon. Member acknowledge that whether parents get their money from income or from benefits, the Government, having inherited 2% inflation, have taken it up to 3.6%, which reduces the value of that pound in parents’ pockets?”
“No one can doubt the hon. Member’s commitment to the people of Oldham. He is being very loyal to the Chancellor and her Budget. I have a simple question: if unemployment goes up in his constituency from today, before the local elections next year, will he resign?”
“The hon. Gentleman is being very generous with his time. I am a bit confused by his answer to my last intervention. Why was it a bad idea to lift the two-child benefit cap when the SNP suggested it, but a good idea now that his Chancellor suggests it?”
“Does my hon. Friend share my concern that we have lost, I believe, 90,000 jobs from the hospitality industry just since the last Budget? While I do my bit to try to save the British pub industry on my own, does he worry, as I do, that today’s Budget will just make it harder and harder for hospitality?”
“Member for Birmingham Selly Oak (Al Carns). I can only assume from this Bill that he has not done so, and I will be voting against it tonight.”