YouSaid · the spoken record

Andrew Keen

lines on the record: 138
first: 2018-01-22
most recent: 2018-01-22
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“And they're run by people who have drunk the kool aid, who believe they're correct, who live in our echo chamber culture, and who confuse the public and the private good, as I think somebody like Mark Zuckerberg does, and believes that whatever is in their interest and the interest of their company is in the interest of the world. So ultimately we have a world run for and by big tech, a tiny group of people, maybe in Silicon Valley, maybe on the East Coast, maybe in India or China, maybe attach the government, but who are creating what Huxley famously called a brave new world, one of sort of a dictatorship of technology which undermines democracy, undermines civilization, and ultimately may even endanger us as the species.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“My biggest worry of everything is that nothing is done. The biggest worry is that we drift into what Neil Postman called a technocracy. a world where in a dystopian world where these companies are bigger, more powerful, wealthier than governments.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, and I don't, you know, some people say, oh, I didn't cost much for bees. For bees, it's not money. It's attention. It's attention. It's an opportunity. He could do anything he wants. He can spend his money in any way. He chose to invest in the post. I mean, my last book was incredibly critical of Amazon. It had about five pages where my publisher was like terrifying. You really should write this, and I did.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, he just wants to buy Yahoo, or he was using it as a cudgel. Like, I want to get this and I want to, it's not, to me, it's not a well thought out theoretical thing. It's more like, I just don't think it's as smart as it was. I just don't. And I don't have any, like, we had some issues with them, but I used to think of the journal as a much more thoughtful. I thought Paul, who ran it for years, was fantastic. I'm not as enamored with the new editors. I think they're very transactional. And I find, I think they have a great opportunity to really do some, and believe me, there's so many great journalists there, so I don't want to insult all of them. I do think the post certainly has become emboldened and in a good way under two things. A leader like Marty Barron, who runs it and then an owner who really does it.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Historically I mean, maybe it reflects Murdoch's own problem with the business model. Yeah, he just wants to buy Yahoo or”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Although to be fair to the journal, I think they have been certainly more vocal in their critique of Silicon Valley than the Times or the Post”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Oh, awful. It is awful. I don't think they have vision. I don't think they have a vision. I think they jump from things. I don't think they have a vision under Rupert Murdoch. Not at all. I can't see what it is for sure. They've always been a great newspaper, but I don't think they're as great as they were, and they certainly, you know, the leadership has problems. Although recently they've been trying to be...”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“New York Times. I want them all to survive. I worked at the Washington Post for a long time. I don't know if you know that. I do know. Yeah, back in the day. I love what they're doing. I love their, someone was making fun of their democracy dies in darkness, but I love it. It's like flashy and fun and like.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That was a joke Well, I'm more and more influenced, I have to admit that I spend much more time on the post site now than the New York Times site. I think the post is becoming more global. I think the problem in New York Times has always been very provincial, very new. I want them all.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That would be interesting. That was a joke. But I think it's someone who's, you know, it's got to be in the political arena of the Salzburgers and stuff like that. It'll be interesting. It would be interesting what you, not maybe a billion dollars, but what would you do with a half a billion dollars? And it's not, again, it's not in a charitable way because I think Bezos is doing at least, I don't think it's ever going to be a big, big, big business, but it certainly could be a viable business that has enormous impact, I guess.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think she's a good owner. I was trying to think, you know, there was a point a couple of years ago, many years ago where I think Eric Schmidt did look at the New York Times when they were having all those financial troubles. She's a very interesting person. I think she's just recently been investing in media. She bought the Atlantic. She's invested in a whole bunch of media properties. She's obviously interested in the space, and she understands that it's”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“They don't have a business. No, but it's not a charity. They would have a business. It's the idea of what's wrong with investing in this. Like, think of it as don't just give up that it's a loss cause as a business.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, but on the other hand, you wouldn't want to transform the New York Times into the Guardian where they don't have a business.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Think about, I suggest this is on stage like, what if it was just a billion dollar investment for a certain part of it? I asked Dean Bequet this, what would you do with a billion dollars? And he's like, I can think of a lot of things I do. It would certainly relieve pressure on that company financially. Yeah, but on the other hand, you wouldn't want to transform the New York Times.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Understanding the weight of history. I'm waiting for someone to lead, and the person who is best. I would agree. Best positioned and who has the ability. And I really admire what he's done with the Washington Post. Right.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“From us But the difference is Bezos was always an adult. He started as an adult. And so a lot of there are adults. I was just talking to someone and I think I was talking about Apple and I go, one of the pleasurable things is they're adults. Like you're talking to adults. They know what they're responsible for. But adults wasn't an adult.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And I'm wary of throwing around phrases like a moral responsibility. But if anyone has a responsibility, it's him because he has the resources, the vision, the intelligence. And I don't believe he's drunk the Kool-Aid. His company is different from the others as well. It's certainly not ideal in their labor practices. But someone has to lead. Benioff has done an interesting job, but I don't think he has the profile of a bezos. And Bezos knows now that he has to become a philanthropist. He made that famous tweet asking people how he should give his money away. But he knows he didn't tweet at the beginning of Amazon saying, should I have, you know, Amazon web services? Should I have e-commerce? He knows this. He has to take responsibility.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“When he starts. Yeah, but he's not a geek. He's not like Paige. He understands it. He's the richest man in the world. And I think...”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And in my book on morality and getting these people to grow up, I again bring up the example of 19th century industrialists who were incredibly rich and often rather cruel in their business lives. Who reinvented themselves? So are Carnegie? Whose business career was certainly wasn't exemplary in the moral sense. But then he spent the second half of his life investing in infrastructure and libraries. And I think the guy who is the most interesting and, well, I think Gates is a bit of a stereotype. But I think the one who, and I hope he's listening to this, although I'm sure he's too busy, is Bezos. Because I think he's a mench. He's a grown-up. He's incredibly smart.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And that's why it might be founders. But let's again, Kara be historical. I know you want to talk about the future, but to talk about the future, you have to talk about the past. Right.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think some of them, the penny is dropping for absolutely sure, but I think they start off. What I always think about is the people who we're dealing with founders and therefore they're more religious, you know, versus like if you remember, if you go back and read about sort of Tesla and Edison, it was a religious war between them.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But I think they're different. I mean, you know these people better than I do. They're not sitting in there. But someone like Larry Page, I would think.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“What does that mean? Well, you know, it's political. I think they understand the challenge. I do think he understands the challenge. I just don't think he likes some of the discord against them. They're sort of shocked by people who disagree with them. And it's not the same thing as dealing with people who are They're actually almost visibly personally hurt. It's a very different kind of encounter than you would get with someone from Hollywood. They get it. They get what the fight is. You know what I mean? And they get their...”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“She was, you know, one thing time she said to me, and I really did appreciate it. I thought she was, you know, she had people had different opinions about Katie. But she says, I'm just here to sell cell phones. Like, that's my job. But she”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I have to admit, you asked me about my career and you didn't ask me a question which sometimes people ask me, why did you change your mind? Why did you go from being an entrepreneur, very pro-tech to being a critic? And I think one of the reasons was I just got so sick of all the PR shit, you know, this sort of nonsense, this. You know, touchy, feely, good feeling stuff that is completely wrong.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Interestingly, it's such an interesting disconnect of how they view themselves. I remember when I took a communications class, one is how you perceive yourself, how others perceive you, how you perceive others perceive you, and how you really are. There's different ways. I think they perceive themselves still as change makers and world changers and helpful. They perceive that they look in the mirror and that's what they see.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, I think your point about PR is an interesting one. I think PR people in the valley, again, you know this better than I do. I mean, they're incredibly annoying. And they think they control the world. And they've had it very easy for 25 years. They've had nothing to deal with. They've been basically being given softballs for 25 years. Now they're going to have to grow up. Now they're going to have to realize they're going to have to learn from the PR people at banks and car manufacturers. And oil companies and big pharma companies and understand that they're no different from them. And actually they're more powerful. And increasingly in the public eye, they're seen as the problem, not the solution.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think big tech is ready for a PR fall. They're ready for a fall in terms of their reputation. But we're only at the beginning of this thing AI, Internet of Things, self-driving cars, blockchain, automation, everything is about to change. I still think we're in the very earliest stages of the technological revolution. I agree. So the idea that big tech is about to take a fall, I think, is a profound mistake. And the idea that somehow big tech will be put back in its cage and the old show will carry on is absolute nonsense. The world is dramatically changing.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, and it's only going to, again, if you want to make predictions about the future, I wouldn't make this about 2018, but certainly in the next five years, Scott Galloway is saying big tech's ready for a fall.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And what is the impact? Because initially the reaction could be, because there are quite stubborn people. It's like, we'll PR our way out of this. I think there is an inclination of them to say, I mean, I've gotten calls recently like, hey, you got to calm down on this stuff. I'm like, I don't think so. I think I'm not going to calm down. And it's more complicated. And, you know, you want to be a reasonable person. Like, you don't want to be like, as you said, a luddite, but at some level, it's even like walking. You know, when you walk around San Francisco and this is a visual thing and you see the extreme homelessness next to the extreme wealth, you cannot help but say something's a myth, like the people living on. Yeah, and it's only going to...”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And the incredible wealth here and the incredible disparities and the impact on the local economy, you're already seeing it with Gavin Newsom. You know, there's no one in Silicon Valley, no one in the Bay Area who is historically been more, excusing the pun here and more in bed with tech than Gavin. But even he now is beginning to distance himself and he made a famous speech at UC Berkeley graduating engineering school last year saying, you've got to take responsibility. You've got to be accountable. So the political atmosphere is changing sharply. And you have people like Roger McNamee and Tristan Harris and more and more Silicon Valley insiders were waking up to this and realizing that they need to be much more vocal and responsible.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And they're going to have to work hard like Wall Street and like any other industry to get what they want. And increasingly, I think politicians will discover, and I don't think this is necessarily a good thing. I'm certainly wary of this, but I think they'll discover Silicon Valley as a punching bag. You're going to see people like Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders suddenly wake up to the recognition. Corey Booker already has. Right. The five largest, look, the five largest companies and the wealthiest companies in the world, none of them are banks. None of them are from Wall Street. They're all tech companies.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“What he understood is that we're in a new stage, the political stage. And need the government's, and you don't have, you know, Eric Schmidt basically running the White House. You have a situation where it's a challenge, where there are other voices where Silicon Valley now is no longer the sort of apple in most American citizens' eye.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The kind of trends that we're talking about are going to manifest themselves. And I think Steve Case was right in his third wave book.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, I'm not going to sit here and make a fool of myself and make predictions about 2018 because I don't know exactly what's going to happen. But what I would predict that in the next two or three years”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That we've taken for granted for the last twenty five years doesn't work and is at least in terms of this new law illegal. I think that the growing calls for antitrust regulation or at least investigation and conversation in the US will grow more and more. I think you already got people like Jonathan Taplin who are very credible, Hollywood music people, you've got Franklin Foe, just came out with an important book about this. And Noam Cohen, the ex-New York Times reporter, I know he's been on your show. Whether it's the old cliche and Silicon Valley, we always assume that the immediate future is, what's the quote, the immediate future is going to happen. And we always overestimate the short term and underestimate the long-term.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think that some of the stuff going on in Europe will begin to have some relevance. I think, for example, the general data protection act that is starting this year will make it very clear that the kind of surveillance capitalist economy”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“What happens this year with all these companies keep trooping up to Capitol Hill? There's issues in Europe. There's all kinds of regulatory, this and that. Do you imagine any regulatory actions anywhere? I don't. I think the U.S. government's going to punt on it myself.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The middle term and the long term. That's a big question. I know that. Well, answer you're a big thinker. You can handle it. The future, it's not like where do you”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And that's why the Facebook reform, I think, is so problematic, because they're actually borrowing further and further into their hole. If all we do is see what our friends say and think and the links they give, then what becomes of the middleman, what becomes of some sort of objective version of the world, we just hear what we want to hear.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Same thing It's twitchy reactiveness that I think is the problem everywhere is twitchy reactiveness almost everywhere. And I think social media only made that. You don't consider things like you move from books and newspapers to Twitchy.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That's true. And then we had McCarthyism, and then we didn't, right? But to be fair, and I'm the last person really should be defending the digital revolution. But to be fair, television has been as much responsible as doing for the MSNBC and Fox are as responsible, certainly Fox.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The problem when the addiction becomes... Discussion. Right, but I think there's something about it that's dangerously addictive, all of them. You can feel it. You're like something's gone real wrong. And I was just actually talking to someone like, how do you turn it back once you've had McCarthyism and then we didn't, right? But to be”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Denmark But I'm not sure that addiction in itself is a bad thing. As long as you keep up with it. The problem when the addiction becomes narcissistic, where you live in an echo chamber and you believe all the lies that your own side puts out and you're not open to any kind of discussion.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It's hard to say because I think there's a natural human instinct to probably Europe, probably Europe in many ways. Denmark? Well, they're also nice in Denmark. I think it's hard because it's very compelling. Fear and hate is very compelling for a lot of people, and it's a way to blow your steam off. It feels, it becomes, it's also, it has elements of addictiveness to it too. So people know this about me. I don't drink or smoke or anything else. But I got to say, I feel addicted to the news cycle in a way that I imagine what it feels like.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But I think it's also important to remember that America still has the potential to build a digital democracy, and America still is a positive model when compared both with China and Russia.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But these tools are certainly been much abused, I think, or easily abusable, and I think a lot of the people who created and didn't either they didn't anticipate fully how they might be used or they didn't care.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think it's also important to understand, I try and make this argument in the book, that we have a new kind of international system germinating. In the 20th century, the Cold War was premised on democracy versus authoritarian or totalitarian government. In the digital 21st century, we have this chasming, increasing chasm between supposed free societies and then a country like Russia, which has become a troll state, which is using trollery and investing in trolls, buildings full of trolls to undermine its enemies. And then the appearance, which is, I think, is most worrying of all of a kind of digital big brother in China, a true dystopian state. So the digital revolution is Pioneering and new kinds of kind of ideological division in the world, which is very Challenging, interesting, and worrying all in the same time.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think he's taken tools that were created and using them in the worst possible way well. You know what I mean? You cannot deny the impact. He's created distraction, persistent lying works. He's just doubling down on the negative parts of all these tools”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think it's a mistake to think America always is infecting the world and that everything begins in America. I think what you're seeing with digital society, or at least what I argue in the book, is new models for new social contracts, new way of organizing the data relationship between government and citizens is actually being developed elsewhere. Even India now, in some ways, is pioneering stuff which America isn't doing. I mean, America is so stuck because of its political paralysis, because of the dysfunctionality of its political system.”
2018-01-22 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Andrew Keen, author, 'How to Fix the Future' · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT