YouSaid · the spoken record

Audrey Tang

lines on the record: 74
first: 2020-10-07
most recent: 2020-10-07
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Well, first of all, I've done a tremendous amount precisely because I designed the spaces for the people who care about things to make things happen. So certainly not me personally that have done those things. I just hold the space. And the second is that laziness also means that you do not overscare yourself. You evaluate, this is called lazy evaluation, evaluate the parameters, the input and so on as the situation calls it. And so that also enables a much more balanced work-life balance, I guess.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, I think the better parts of themselves are shown much more visibly, that is to say if they have an agenda that benefits the humankind or the planet or the cosmos, they're much more likely to share it because it's also performative. They understand that people from the future will see it. But the parts of themselves, they are thinking for the next quarter only of linear individual growth or GDP growth at a cost or expense of future generations. That part doesn't seem to show.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, these two are certainly orthogonal, I mean I can imagine being radically transparent but deliberately moving in a very slow fashion and only act on the lowest of the lower hanging fruits I can see merits in that too. I can also see of course this slow moving part being non-radically transparent and then the main repercussion would probably be that people cease to feel that it's relevant to their lives and will not devote their energy to it.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I don't know because outrage is the beginning of social movement. The thing is where do you direct the outrage to? If it's directed to revenge, that is to say hurting imaginary or real people, or if it's directed to, I don't know, discrimination, which is lowering other people's social status without elevating one's own. Of course, those could be destructive, as you said, but it could also be directed into co-creation, that is to say, make new institutions so that the old problems that provoke the age in the first place do not happen again. And that's how democracy grows. And so I'm awful outraged, actually.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Yeah, I think so because when I was 20 years old, I would wake up, log into the Pearl IRC channel, that's internet relay chat, antipeverrun, and then a bot will just paste a random paragraph, literally a random paragraph from Finnekins Wake, which will begin my day's wake. And so that's social too. Everybody in the chat channel sees it. And so I'm sure that it has influenced our work on Pearl, which is full with haiku and poetry and things like that.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, because it's very complex and complicated and I can enjoy it without understanding it, just treating it as lyrics like a notebook, literally a book of notes.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Theoretical it's even extraterrestrial, right? So if there's European astronauts and so on, they're still regulated by the GDPR. So I think there's two things going on here. One is about the data norm and for the EU citizens it extends by the framework of human right and therefore of course travels with the individual not within the territorial jurisdiction and the other view of course is based on the infrastructure where the data is collected where the data used under native data localization and even sovereignty we have heard that word too when used on data borders and so just like the example I mentioned of the Singaporean app with Filipino workers in Taiwan buying grocery for their families it's by its very nature three different overlapping jurisdictions and all have a governing interest in it and so it's a reality and GDPR is”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I am saying that awe of society deliberation, the style of the twenty fourteen sunflower need to happen for the society come to a common value about this sort of things. And this is what we call data norm. Do you think it is normal for facial recognitions and such data that you are just filming yourself to be aggregated to a single state and of which there is no jurisdictional accountability of using such data? If you think it's great as a country, well, more powers, but if you think it's not great as a country, then maybe you collectively can find something to do.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Take a systemic risk assistance approach, do what the Taiwanese people did in 2014, which is people on the street deliberate it with their own experience working with people who are from the PRC, coming to a consensus on the street that there's no pure private sector companies in the PRC, and the party or the state really the same thing can just replace and swap leadership as they like through the party branches. So we decided eventually that making the infrastructure components in the PRC while the state subsidy looks quite lucrative, amortize is actually a higher overall cost of ownership because you have to reassess for each upgrade whether the state have already taken over that so-called private vendor.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I've never been to Cupertino, so all my work with Apple for six years were telework, so I'm biased. I think it's pretty smooth, and if we don't like the tools that we're using for telework, we just make the tools better. And that's the main idea about open innovation in that if people don't like the particular way that a tool is limiting our imaginations, they can always improve on it. So, yeah, I think, again, this is not about excluding people from participating in the work, it's about expanding the idea of face-to-face meetings and the kind of empathy and broad consensus that we can form and scale it to the more remote places. It's not a replacement, it is augmentation to the face-to-face form.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“While working from a distance does not mean that you don't meet people face to face, it only means that we transcend space boundaries when we're talking to each other. And so if it is something that you can opt in too, then of course there are places and ways of work that improve the work quality. And I'm quite bullish on that, but if it's the must and you have to work from a distance even for the kind of work that doesn't quite suit just working from distance, then of course it's going to hurt the quality of work.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, that may be the case because in Taiwan the most popular Reddit equivalent is the PTT and it's still terminal based. It's like a late 90s version of the bulletin board system. And we do see that it leads to better discourse qualities.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I use of course stylus all the time and so the touch screens are useful when I don't have the stylus and keyboard Hansi as a kind of fallback but if the touch screen is the primary interaction button then of course it builds addiction”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, of course that between one and one million there is many, many assuming levels, I mean if you look at a open street map but you can only zoom to the globe or zoom to an individual block in a city or even just to an individual level then that map is not very useful at all. What's useful is in the transitional zoom levels that makes sure that people can build the context in their head and connect their experiences with people who are slightly different but not at all that different and that builds common values. So the transition between the zooming level is much more important than the one and a million level.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“There is much more factory farming, that's exactly right. On the other hand, of course, people understand how animals suffer more. And so that leads to more people understanding the animal welfare and animal right angles. It also leads to innovations such as the impossible burger, the future of meat, and things like that. Maybe people eat it only because it actually tastes better and is free of the possible industrial farming side effects, specifically on carbon emissions. Whatever reason you approach those new kinds of meat, I think they are superior in almost every regard than cost. And that part, the science I work on it too.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“I'm not sure that the states is a useful abstraction when you talk about empathy, empathy are between human beings or at least animals.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Definitely open innovation that is to say innovation that is co created to bring technology to people rather than asking people to adapt to technology.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, first of all, that's the value alignment part. What you're saying is that it more or less agrees with the epistemic norms, that is to say the norm around knowledge that the society has. The other part to ask is about the accountability, like when it makes mistakes, who get to correct those mistakes, when it's biased, who get to participate in overcoming the bias. The source code is the API, is the data that uses participatory, or it is known to only a few.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Of course, that depends on what you mean by pretty good. Does it make satisfying sounding answers? Does it make answers that seems real? Does it make mostly factual but not empathetic answers? Does it make mostly empathetic but factually untrue answers what does good enough mean to you?”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“But why not do both? I mean, you can definitely take the Sunneman Lake and just in the Son Lake have a conversation and watch together how it works in Mumbai and vice versa. I mean, we just had a Asia-Pacific social innovation partnership award. And in the summit, we hear the designers in Singapore working for a app that enabled the foreign workers, the offshore workers from Philippines in, say, Taiwan to take care of their loved ones instead of sending cash home, they can do grocery shopping to make sure that their money is not spent on luxury goods and so on. So that's like three different countries and cultures right there.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“So only if it's shared reality though, I hear you talking about your amazing VR Paris vacation, but unless I can answer the same space and make it an extended reality that contains both of us, it would not become a social reality and just an individual reality and that may of course have some therapeutic effects or overview effect I'm not denying that, but I would say that this is pro-social but not necessarily democratic.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, first of all, I think democracy is an ongoing process, so definitely something that makes the listening at scale work, that makes co-presence work, that enables people who are closest to the suffering, amplify their experiences, and so that people with various different backgrounds can empathize with that experience. So in short, software that enables listening and feeling at scale.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“If the makers of the software decide to eavesdrop themselves, then there's no physical property, only mathematical property that stops the conversation being eavesdropped. Now those, what we call the public key cryptography mathematics at its very real danger of being broken within a decade or so, or two decades if you're optimistic, by the quantum computer themselves.”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source
“Well, of course a quantum resistant cryptographic channel will really help that enable true secure conversation that once it's someone try to intercept, you will know immediately”
2020-10-07 · Conversations with Tyler · Audrey Tang on the Technology of Democracy · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source