YouSaid · the spoken record

Dr. Sue Johnson

lines on the record: 118
first: 2024-06-19
most recent: 2024-06-19
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“When you help people have the words, and there aren't that many words, there aren't that many core emotions, there aren't that many ways to dance with a loved one, you can basically reach from them when you're vulnerable, you can shut down and numb out and shut them out, or you can up the ante and get anxious and demand all kinds of responses from them. That's about it. They're the main moves in the dance of love, and they can all be useful at times, but if you get stuck in one of the negative ones like blaming and pushing and demanding and upping the ante to try and get the other person to respond or shutting down and withdrawing, that generates a dance that ends up in disconnection and more anxiety and more problems for both of you.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You lead people in. The point is you lead them into their emotions. The point is, I know where I'm going. And so does every goody FT therapist. I know where I'm going because I've got a map. And so attachment gives us a map to how we dance together with the people we love, where those dances go in terms of outcome. It gives us a map to our own vulnerabilities and emotions. It tells us how supremely sensitive we are to signals of rejection or abandonment by other people and that this sensitivity is wired in. There's nothing weak or strange or we framed these vulnerabilities in very strange ways, very unaccepting ways. Some of the ways we've talked about love have been so misleading.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Really worried, or anything. Yes, you are. You're just being a regular guy. So I say, oh, all right. It's not dangerous. It's just a bit, this gentleman said, I loved him. He said, it's disconcerting. I said, oh, I said, oh, it's disconcerting. Yes, it's very disconcerting. I understand. So I say, so let's go over this again. So then I go over it again when you do. This happens. You hear this in her voice. And then your body does. And it's disconcerting. And there's something here, disconcerting. Could you help me? It's like you don't know what to do. And no matter what you do, it's not going to be right. He says, yes. When I feel that way, it's a little bit alarming, isn't it? He says, yes, it's alarming. I said, Oh when you feel this tightness in your chest, it's alarm.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“She's irritated with me. And, you know, she's going to be irritated with me and nothing I say is going to make any difference. You hear her tone and you say, I've already blown it. I've blown it. I've blown it again. And when you, is that right? He says, yes, that's what I say to myself. I've blown it. She's irritated with, oh my God, now we're going to get stuck in that thing. I've blown it again. And you feel this tightness. He says, yes. I said, you help me with the tightness. It's like you shut down because this is it shutting down? You say, yeah, it's like shutting down, Sue. So I say, uh-huh. It's like shutting down because there's something here that's dangerous, isn't it? Then if you're a regular guy, you say something like no, it's not dangerous. I mean, you know, I'm not like...”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“All that happens to me is when and then it's specific. When I hear that tone in her voice, so what's the trigger? When I hear that tone in her voice, all I know is that I just go tight. I just go tight. And I just stay there with you. And I say, so help me. What do you hear in her tone?”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Our emotional needs, vulnerabilities, feelings, it gives us a map. And what I think it's a relatively simple, elegant map. So if you say to me, I hear you that you have a more limited vocabulary, there's a good reason for that. You were bought up as a man in a North American society. You weren't taught to look inside and pay attention to your emotions and develop a vocabulary your girlfriend was taught to do that. It was acceptable for her. And so women have more language. The bottom line is, though, you are human beings. So you have the same basic emotions. We talk about six basic emotions. And you have the same basic physiological responses. So if you said to me, Sue, I don't know how to talk about this. That's great, right? That's Sue. I don't know how to talk about this.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, you have to put it in context. I mean, the point is when I go in to something like that, there's always a specific thing that's happened. A client's told me a story or is feeling something in the moment or is having a specific emotional reaction. Or if I'm working with couples, there's a piece of drama going on. So there's usually a specific trigger. And the thing about attachment science is it gives us a map.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And it's because she moves. In the session, she moves out of her obsessions, addictions with not eating, addictions for planning, anxiety, she moves. And so she gets exhilarated because she starts to feel more whole as a human being. Some of the cliches we have about love are really awful. Misinformation. But one of the cliches that's really true, and that this is true in most religions, is that when we're loved, we grow and expand. We grow, we find more resources inside ourselves, we find more strength inside ourselves, we're better at problem solving when we're safe and secure and we feel we matter to others and that they have our back, our potential and our resources come out. Now again, I'm having such fun talking to you. I'm not sure I answered your question. Oh yes, it was about micro. And things like reflecting and”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, can you say that again? Can you see your mom? Was your mom looked like in the chair? Close your eyes. She closes your eyes. She said, yes, I see her. Say, oh, what do you see on her face? She says, she tells me she's tired. She doesn't have time. You know, she's tired and she's working three jobs. And, you know, I should just be quiet and go to bed and stop my grizzling. Stop my. That's what she's telling me. And what do you want to say to her? I want to tell her, mom, that's not fair. That's not fair. I'm just little. And I can never reach for you. I can never reach for you. You're not a mom. You're not a good mom to me. I need a mom. And I say, how do you feel about that? She says, I feel fine. That feels good. That feels different. Then she emails me after the session and says, you know, Sue, the sessions with you are hard, so I don't understand why I sing all the way home.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We talk to them and we have these dramas with them. So if I'm doing individual therapy, I might use these same reflections and evocative questions. Instead, I'll say, Planned every interaction with your mother, you planned it for hours, you planned how to go and ask her for a hug. You planned, right? Right. So can you see that little girl who always got smacked and taken back to her room and left in the dark? Can you see that little girl sitting on the bed by herself? What would you want to say to her? What would you like to have been able to say to your mum? And she says something like I tried so hard, mum, I tried so hard, but I could never reach you. Was it really my fault? Was I really such a bad little girl? I just think you weren't among you weren't a mum to me. Say good what does it feel to say that? She says that feels different I've never said that before to myself I've always said I didn't plan enough I wasn't a good enough middle girl.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And then I'll help her move this into a drama with another person. And by the way, when we do individual therapy, we've just started to really teach EFIT, which is emotionally focused individual therapy. There's a book coming out next month of September on that. When we do individual therapy, we still do this, but we use the representations inside people's heads. So you have a cast of characters inside your head, so do I. I'm very thankful. My main attachment figure when I was a child was my father. And I'm very aware that all through my adult life, especially through moments of failure, moments of joy, key moments, I can hear my father's voice. My father's still a reality for me, right? I carry him inside of me and that's what we do with our loved ones.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Was an accident in front of her truck, and she got out of her truck and she walked into flames to pull out the trucker who was trapped underneath the truck in front of her. I realized that this is an enormously powerful image. And if I want her to move more into it, if she can handle it, if she can't handle it, I'll stop. But if I want her to move more into it and I think she can handle it, I'll say, let's stay with that image. It's like fire. Fire burns, fire is terrifying. You're telling your partner. It's too hard for me. I can't, I can't do this right now. It's too hard. It's like walking through fire to turn and open up to you. I just can't do it. And she says, yes, that's right. I say, good, tell him that. Now create, I'll clarify the emotional music. Help her with it. Help her accept it”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“We can't deal with big, vague, huge, overwhelming problems. We just want to run away from them. So I'll use evocative questions. I'll use reflections. I'll use repetition to help you stay with that feeling. I'll use an image. You know, if you said to me, there's fire across, I can remember one client said, it's like walking into a fire when you ask me to turn and open up to him. I can tell you that I'm afraid. I can look into your face and tell you because you're just a silly therapist. You don't matter to me much. Actually, that's what I said. I said, that's because I'm just a silly therapist and I don't matter too much. She said, yes, that's right. So I said, so I can tell you about my fear. When you ask me to turn and tell him about my fear, you're asking me to walk into a fire. I knew that this lady, she was a trucker.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Again, I'll hold it for you. I'll specify it. I'll ask evocative questions. I'll get you to stay with the experience. And then I'll say, what do you want to do when you feel that way? And you might say, I want to stop it. I want to get out. I don't want to feel any more of that right now. I want to shut it down. I want to stop the feeling. Say, okay, so you want to run. Yeah. And we've put your emotion together in a safe, specific, safe way. People can deal with emotions that when they...”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“She tells you stories that have you move into your own softer feelings. What is that like for you, Tim? And you might say, oh, I don't know. You say, well, what happens in your body, Tim? Can you tell me a moment when you felt that rush of emotion? You say, oh, well, it was when you said this. Oh, so that's the trigger. And I'll help you put your emotions together with evocative questions and reflections. And I'll say so when you heard me say this. That was important for you that stood out. And you started to feel a lot of feelings. Can you help me? What happened in your body? So, oh, well, I felt this tightness across my chest. And I felt like I wanted to cry. And then what did you say to yourself? I said to myself, My goodness, that's just how I felt when I remembered feeling that way when I was three years old. And I say I understand. So I'll reflect.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Invocative questions focus on the process of how you're experiencing, not the content. So I would say to you, Tim, what happens to you when you sit and do interviews with crazy people like Dr. Sue Johnson?”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“No, I'm from England. I came to Canada where I was 22, but you never kind of lose that accent. But I cannot imagine even today a woman prime minister walking into the British Parliament with a baby and holding that, I would love that. I think that would be progress for Britain for me anyway, but never mind. Sorry, I got off track there.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Have to go back to work at a certain point, whether you're a parent or not. There's no accommodation in most workplaces for parenting. Was it the Prime Minister of New Zealand who bore her baby into the parliament? I thought, yay, lady. It's like yay, you know, she brought her baby into the pump. That takes That's, I think. So good for her, but boy, I can't even imagine that happening. Obviously, you can hear I'm English.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Attachment goes from the cradle to the grave. Just very basic things like I talk in one of my books somewhere about that I think it's love sense there's a movement called Nobody Dies Alone where people get together in certain cities and their commitment is to go in with somebody who's dying and who has no human figure to be there with them and simply be with them at their most vulnerable moments and For me that speaks to the fact that maybe one day we could have something called a civilized society civilized society would not let anyone die alone a civilized society would support families and support parents help us learn how to parent so I don't think it's just the couple who are stressed I think it's the demands of our society you”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Science, we should be supporting our parents like crazy. We should be teaching people how to have good secure relationships. We should be teaching them about relationships, educating them. We should be having more leave for parents. We should be supporting the basic unit of our society, which is our family. We don't seem to be that keen on that. We seem to be more keen on supporting economic security or corporations. So I don't think we support parents enough. And maybe that needs to change. Maybe our understanding of supporting human families needs to change. I mean, attachment has changed parenting. It's changed the way we see our children. It's changed the way we see their emotional needs. We understand that to be emotionally alone traumatized as a child. We need to apply That to adults because in that sense, we never grow up.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And providing you gave her all kinds of hugs in the morning. She was this happy little clam. So it was different. So I understand that parenting can be hard. I think for me, it's the hardest thing I've ever done. For one thing, parenting's a moving target. You accommodate to your child, then your child changes. You think, wait a minute. Like, I just figured it out. And now you're changing. You've become, good lord, you've become an adolescent. I don't know what to do with this. You know, my son turned in from this wonderful, bubbly, charming, delightful little being into this stroppy, judgmental, moral person who was pointing out how wrong we were about everything. I thought, you know, who is this person? Where did this guy come from? So parenting is hard. And if you take the social implications of attachment,”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Him and rock him for ten, fifteen minutes and put him down. And we got into the habit of that and we did that and we accommodated to that. We thought about having him sleep between us, but we usually slept at that point. We adopted him very soon after we got together, which we were incredibly lucky. So we adopted him about a year after we got together. And so we slept pretty entwined. So we didn't really think it was, and also he was so tiny at first, I didn't think putting him in the middle, I felt, I'm going to crush him if I turn up. So my husband's a big man. Oh, we're going to crush him, this little one. So we didn't do that. And then it changed and it was fine. My daughter was totally different. Very shortly after she was born, she went to sleep, you know, regularly, went to sleep at the same time at night, slept through after a few months.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Not wired for self sufficiency. And shutting down and numbing out is a fragile strategy. You can't keep it up for your whole life. It shatters under any kind of pressure. So I'm saying it glibly because this is an interview. But what I just said to you, I can give you research studies to back that up. Okay, I'm not just saying it. No, I don't think sleep training. On the other hand, I can remember I adopted my son. He was a premature and he came home. He was the tiniest little thing. He scared the hell out of me. He was so tiny. And he had something wrong with his digestive system. And for the first 18 months of his life, he would wake up every two hours at least, but maybe sometimes 90 minutes. And the only thing that would help is that one of us would go in and sing to him and talk to him.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“What your child learns is that no matter how I cry, nobody will come. From my point of view, that's a bloody disastrous lesson for any child to learn. So I have a huge bias against. Now again, it depends on how it's done and it depends on what else is happening. So let's not get too judgmental here, but why not? Let's get judgmental. I think it stings. So if that's a religious war, I'm on the attachment side because It seems to me that the sleep training thing feeds into a myth that we have that is so dangerous. The myth is about self-sufficiency and regulating our own emotions. And the bottom line is the only self-sufficient human being is either numbed out on some drug or dead.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Life rules, which I think you have to make your own rules there, I think being emotionally responsive to your kids is the key. And for them to know that you're there for them is the key doesn't mean you have to always show up in the same way and you have to be constantly available. For me, I don't think so. On the other hand. I do have a visceral reaction to sleep training. I would like to suggest that when you do sleep training, your child does not calm down and learn to rely on itself. What your child does is numb out.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, my perspective is that what attachment says is that emotional balance when you're securely attached and you feel safe in the world and you know you can count on others for support, you have your emotional balance. And sometimes when we take on huge complex issues, we lose our emotional balance. I don't think to create security attachment in your kids that you have to sleep with them. Okay, I don't think so. You can if you want. And I think you have to balance things like if you sleep with your kid in between you all the time for three or four years, what does that do to your couple relationship? And what your kid needs is a good couple relationship in the parents who can cooperate. Believe me, that's what your kid needs. So that's an issue I think people sometimes go over the top. They take the good sense and the science of attachment and they turn it into rigid.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Tuning into others, reading their cues, collaborating, cooperating, moving close, supporting. That's the way we've survived. And if you look at the problems facing our world right now, we better be learning from this science because we better be able to do that or we're not going to survive. We've got to be able to come together.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And that reality of our long-term vulnerability has wired our nervous system in particular way and creates these social dramas, wired our social dramas. What the father of attachment science John Bowlby, who is an English psychologist, really did, which is brilliant, is he linked biology and who we are and how our nervous system works to our social interaction patterns, to the way we dance with other human beings. He linked within and between, he linked those two together in an elegant, beautiful, testable way that gives us a map to love relationships, how to shape them, how to fix them, how to repair them, how to keep them, and to who we are as human beings. And this map is the way human beings have survived through the centuries is through”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You mean I'm not crazy, bad, deficient, defective, unlovable? No, no, you're not. You're just a human being who needs that connection with another human being and who is terrified of rejection and abandonment. And the reason you're terrified of rejection and abandonment is because those are pure danger cues to your mammalian brain. Danger cues. Our young are vulnerable for longer than any other species. And while our brain is developing, we know perfectly well. On a visceral level, that if we call and no one comes, we die. That's the truth”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So it takes this strong image and says, no, you're in trouble. And dependency became this dirty word. And I think what attachment science says is we are interdependent human beings wired for connection with others from the cradle to the grave. And when you present that to people, not the way I just said it, which is abstract. And when you move people into that reality and you accept it and say, of course, this is who we are as human beings and we all get stuck here and we all need this. People go.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Think it is common, and I think the power of attachment science is, it tells us who we are, it tells us that we are social beings wired for connection. We need safe connection with others to survive and thrive. Dependency became a dirty word somewhere through our history. And we all fell in love with the image of the lone cowboy riding over the range, the eagle song Desperado. I love that song. It's my favorite song because it basically takes that image of the lone cowboy and basically says, buddy, you better find someone to love you because you're in deep trouble.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Their partner has no idea. Partner says, You just don't want to be close to me. You just don't want me. No, I do desperately want you. I'm just terrified to let you see me. In psychology we're very good at looking at the behaviour and the problem. And sometimes I feel like we're not so good at what we are supposed to be the experts in, which is looking underneath the behavior and the problem and seeing the emotional realities that push that problem forward and keep people stuck in that problem. Don't know if I answered you, Tim. There's so much to talk about here. I tried to answer.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Have to be involved in it. And for some of us, if we've been desperately hurt when we were niddle and we learn that that kind of openness was desperately dangerous, it's like jumping off a cliff. And you have to respect that. You have to respect. Emotions are in no way illogical. That's one of the big mistakes we've made in psychology. They're in no way logical. They have their own logic. They're a supreme information processing system that wires us to see the world in a particular way, to move in a particular way. And we haven't taught people how to understand them, how to listen to them, and how they make sense. They always make sense. If someone's terrified of that kind of openness, it's because they have very good reasons to be. And often they haven't told their partner. They haven't told their partner anything about it.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Lady broke my heart, she said. I was so careful when I asked my mother for attention. I was so careful I'd plan it and plan it in the dark for hours. And no matter how I did it, it never worked, it never worked. She was always angry at me. So I said to myself It's me, it must be me. There's something wrong with me. I'm just not lovable Then she weeps When she does that her partner reaches for her naturally her partner reaches for her and says This vulnerability when you really help people move into it with safety evokes caring and compassion It just does so then the partner moves in and supports and gradually gradually the other person's able to open up. It's not something that you do once it's not something that you can Do mechanically”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“She'll tell me that I'm weak. There's something wrong with me. And the reason that I've been alone all my life is because there was something wrong with me. And the reason I was so hurt when I was little was because I wasn't a good enough kid or a special enough kid or if I didn't do it right.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Just felt that you didn't want to share with me. I never knew it was so hard. I never knew that it was scary for you. I never understood that. I can't believe I understand. I understand that now you've helped me understand how scary that is. I can't believe that you're even here telling me this. And I love you for taking that risk. Thank you for taking that risk. And then the door opens wider. And then I say usually I say, because we always have this catastrophe in our head when we're afraid. We create catastrophes in our head to try and prepare for them, right? So I say, what is going to happen? If you really show her who you are, You show how scared you are to really open up and show your vulnerability what is going to happen. He says she'll tell me what I've always known.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I don't think I can do it. I don't think I can risk letting you really see me. I'm so sure that you won't want me or that you'll find some way to hurt me. Then I don't know what would happen. I don't think I could tolerate it. I don't think I can do it. Could you turn and tell her? And what I do is I hold the person and I help them speak their emotions and say their emotions clearly and I hold them in that. I support them in that. So guy turns and tells his wife. And his wife says, and this is the amazing thing about bonding, this is who we are. We are empathic creatures. That empathy is blocked by all kinds of other things. We are empathic creatures. My experience is the partner will say, I never knew that.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“With the softness of their heart, all the good reasons in the world, you have to start there. I've worked with lots of traumatized folks, and you have to start with somebody saying Well, I understand now the patterns and how we've been caught in this dance. I understand that you aren't always trying to hurt me or have me prove myself to you or prove me wrong. But I want to tell you, the idea of really opening up to you and showing you who I am just feels impossible. I don't know how to do it. It's impossible. I don't think I can do it. So you start with people are. You don't get people to do it in spite of how they feel. You get them to trust their feelings. My experience is someone will say that. And I will say, could you turn into... Your partner, please.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Our partner, and we say, What's wrong with you? So we help couples see how they scare the hell out of each other. And create even more insecurity and stop each other from being able to be vulnerable and risk. When they start to see that it's the pattern that's the problem, the dance that's the problem, and the fact they don't know how to do a more positive dance, they start to blame the dance rather than each other. And they start to be able to say, hey, we're stuck in that thing. We're stuck in that thing we do where I shut down and shut you out and you must be getting alarmed right now. And the other person says, yes, I'm starting to freak out. And they say, oh, let's not do that. Let's try and help each other feel a bit more safe. So we create that platform first, but then you have to start with people are. And sometimes with a hold me tight conversation with somebody who's been very traumatized and has all the reasons in the world not to trust another human being.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Where we start with couples, many of whom have experienced being alone most of their lives, traumatized or not, where we start is we help couples see the dance they're caught in. Love is a dance. We help couples see the dance they're caught in. We help couples see the negative patterns, the most popular one of all is I become aware of the disconnection between the two of us. I get worried about it. It makes me anxious. And I don't feel safe enough to turn and really share my vulnerability. So I demand, I blame, I tell you, where are you? What I'm really saying is, where are you? Where are you? I can't find you in that alarms me. But what I say is things like, you don't talk to me enough or, you know, you never tell me how you feel. Or, you know, if you're a man, you'll say, you never tell me you want to make love. You don't ever show me you want me. What's wrong with you?”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“For the first time, they feel seen, they feel accepted, they feel held. And once you feel seen, accepted and held, there's a natural human growth process that happens. Attachment of science is all about development of the personality. There's a natural growth process. So we tune into that natural process in the Holmitite conversation. And those conversations predict over study after study after study after study, those conversations predict success in EFT. They predict more secure bonding. They predict better sex, more sexual satisfaction in couples. They predict any sort of measure of good, positive functioning you can imagine, those bonding conversations predict all the good results we get in EFT. And they predict results follow up.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I've been alone all my life, haven't I? And that What attachment science tells us is that emotional isolation is toxic for human beings. I mean, we found out that in the pandemic, but we still don't get it. I wish we would get it on a different level. It's toxic for human beings. It's not who we are. And when people start to have these hold me tight conversations, all kinds of amazing things happen. They don't just understand how relationships can be and how you can shape relationships. don't have to just have them happen to you. You can shape love. They understand something very deep about themselves. Couples grow each other in safe relationships. I watch severely traumatized people learn to trust another human being by having these homie-tight conversations with their partner and it changes everything because they have a secure place in life.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It creates joy in people. You don't have to persuade people to keep doing it like going to the gym or meditation or their communication skills. People will do this. Once they know how to do it, they'll keep doing it. And that's why I think we get good follow-up results. Because once you start having these conversations, and it's very moving sometimes to see people's response like people will start to cry and say things like when they discover these homely conversations, people will say, I'm thinking of one man who said, I never knew that you could talk to somebody like this. I never knew that you could ask for these things and that she wants me to be vulnerable to her. I never knew that. I never saw that growing up. I didn't know people did that. And then he wept and he turned to the therapist and said,”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That there's no mistakes because mistakes don't matter. We're just playing. Then I relax, I'm in my body, I tune into their cues, and we move together naturally. So that's kind of what happens. And it's a hold-me-tight conversation. And it's sort of cascades. Each time you have this conversation, your nervous system goes, ah, this is comfort. This is home. This is safety. This is what I need. And you see your partner as a resource. You see your partner as somebody who can provide this safety, comfort, caring, reassurance, social support, if you want to use a psychological, formal term for it. You see your partner as this person and your partner connects and you know how to do this dance. This dance is innately rewarding.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You're right. Yeah. I really like those. I really, I do want those conversations. I've just been so exhausted and I've been doing this and I haven't wanted to tell you how stressed out I am. So then it becomes reciprocal. I say, oh, I didn't know that you were so stressed out about this decision we've made and that it's taking up all your energy and you're worried about it. So then we start to have an open, responsive, engaged conversation where we can share vulnerabilities, comfort each other and we're literally better at tuning in to each other. And I think that's because when I feel safe, I can tune in to you. When I think about the people I can dance with in Tango really well, it's the people I feel emotionally safe with.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Like, I'm not sure that that closeness matters to you. And so I could get angry about it, but actually what's happening is it sort of scares me a bit because I need those conversations. Now, I've talked about my fears I can only do that if I have some sort of model that it's okay to do that, that that doesn't mean I'm a wimp or mentally ill or weak or pathetic. From my point of view, it's strength to do that. And that's what we teach. And it's strength to do that. And that's what securely attached people can do. They can reach from a position of vulnerability. So I say that to him. And that pulls, he says, oh.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Oh, that makes me feel really somehow anxious and uncomfortable if he doesn't miss them because the big question in love relationships is, are you there for me? Do I matter to you? Can I count on you? Maybe those conversations don't matter to him. Do they really matter to me? So I am aware on a different level of me and I'm specifying that scares me a bit that maybe these conversations don't matter to him. I can tune into my own emotions. Then I take the risk and reach for him and say to him, I'm open. I say to him, you know what? We haven't been having our usual talks late at night and somehow it doesn't look like you miss them. And somehow that makes me feel kind of really sort of uncomfortable. It almost feels...”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Is that I would be more able to tune into my own needs, more aware of my own needs, accepting of my own needs. And I would realize, oh, I'm really missing those conversations with John. We've been married for 32 years. We're both very strong people, so it's been quite an adventure. So I think, oh, I'm missing those relationships with John. And maybe he doesn't miss them.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So we're off, right? Okay, that is the typical demand withdrawal, demand defend, dialogue that you'll see in a distressed couple, and it's totally predictable. You can also have it with your kids. I can remember a glorious argument I had in Starbucks with my adolescent son that was just a perfect example of the wave distressed couples talk to each other. So I'm blaming and pointing fingers and he's rolling his eyeballs and basically telling me what a dreadful mother I am. So you can have it with anyone, but with partners, it's very predictable and it has everyone feeling completely threatened and unsafe and unable to dance together. If you shift that into a hold me tight conversation, the way it would go,”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“By the people we love, acutely sensitive. That's how we're wired. So he hears that he's blown it. He hears it that I'm rejecting him. I'm telling him he's done something wrong. So he says, I don't want to talk about this right now. I say, oh, let me guess. You have to go to bed because you're so tired.”
2024-06-19 · The Tim Ferriss Show · #747: Seth Godin and Dr. Sue Johnson · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT