YouSaid · the spoken record

James Carville

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79
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2019-05-02
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2019-05-02
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  1. I can't live in it and I know people notice because of the show, but I know anybody in politics that I've met and over the years. You and I have always had a very good relationship, and it could have gone frayed during the 2008 primaries. It could have gone frayed at any point. People in politics all have big egos and everybody wants to think they're better than that. And I think that one of the things our value is that I think we've always enjoyed our relationship. We've always had mutual respect for each other. And we played tough, but at the end of the day, we knew what we were doing. And I appreciate your friendship. And I'm just really happy to be part of what you're doing here at the University of Chicago.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  2. You know, we've been married 1983, so we'll be 26 anniversary coming up. You know, I think we're not a novelty anymore and we're just a kind of old married people like this weekend. We sat there and kind of watched. Binge watch documentaries. She snapped at me when I asked if she'd read pay if I'd read Peggy Noonan's column in Wall Street Journal Santa, so I knew not to go to half. You know, we got two kids. We in love and I've been fortunate. You know, I've got married at 49 and I've been married once, which is I'm a statistical freak. I don't know. So it works for me. And then somebody called me about George Conway and Kelly Aaron and I said, good, pass the baton to them. They can have it. But it was just one of those things. And, you know, we got married and it was a stunt. It was like a Washington hedge fund. It was everything else.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  3. You know, I said in the New York Times, I understand that they're mad at me and they're friends of mine, Mike, Steve Brichetti. Even I know Vice President Biden well, not as well as I know these guys, and I believe this. The only organization that has and is being run by 80-year-olds is the Roman Catholic Church. I don't know what the country needs for sure, but 80-year-old president is not one of them. I mean, I'm 74, I'll be 75 this year. And I just can't, you know, when I used to do West Coast speech, I used to say I like to get out the day before. Now I like to get out the day before the day before. I mean, you just cannot. You can't do what that job requires. And I don't care how experienced you are. I don't care how many good people you have around you.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  4. The other thing is that we know and other people don't, the primaries are just hard. They're exhausting. They're unending. You don't even know where you are. Once you get to the general, you got airplanes and staffs. The generals are not. That particularly difficult. But the primaries have really, really, and we're going to see a lot of stumble and regrouping here, and hopefully we're going to see some unappreciated political skills.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  5. You know, I hate to say it, but to be determined. And somebody, political skills, people can grow. And people can kind of frame mishas. I don't see anybody, Maya Pete, I interviewed him right now based on what I know now, I may even vote for him myself, but there's a lot more that we're going to learn about these candidates. There's a lot more we're going to learn about their ability to develop a narrative and to see where their political skills are, how they handle attacks, how do they see coalitions, how they're going to.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  6. That's the tragedy of what the other tragedy of the thing is, a lot of us, of what Clinton ties it, she was actually... Much more of a populist than he was. Her instincts were that was not her instincts. And she grew up in small town. In Pennsylvania. And I don't know. She never liked NAFTA at all. Was argued against it. She was very skeptical of corporate power. I mean, serious. And somehow another, he became the people's guy and she became... You know, part of the new coalition, and I think she got talked into that. I think he's.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  7. watches and stuff. And that's the aura we, the Democratic Party gives off the same aura that the KDs that LSU do. We're cooler than everybody else. And that's a terrible

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  8. I don't deny that. But some don't. And if I were... If what they perceive is they're not part of the hip urban educated, diverse. Senate coalition. I mean, I saw Paul Krugman saying, you know, they don't understand our policies are actually better for them. I think Paul is right, but he didn't understand the nature, the human nature of I'm left out and I'm not part of your frack. I told my daughter, she goes to LSU and she's in one of these high-end sororities. And they all five ache and weigh 128 pounds and drive BMWs. I said, everybody hates y'all. Don't you understand that? So when you walk around that campus to other people, like, you know, like, how to hell with that? Rich girls are just, you know, sitting there with all their

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  9. Yet it is okay to say all rural white people are the same Have college degrees, some don't, some are married, some not. Some go to church, some don't. Some have guns, some don't have guns.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  10. It would makes me uncomfortable as a Democrat Rural Whites of people, I'm one. The reason that most people become Democrats is we don't hate anybody. I mean, that generally is the emotional reaction we have when we choose that. Why, you know, if I said that all African Americans were the same. All Jews were the same. All Irish people were the same. All Asian people were the same. People said, but Jane, you can't say that this individual, and I would appropriately be chastised for that.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  11. That was encouraging. One of the projects that I'm working on is we are targeting 40 counties in four states, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, and Florida. And it is my belief when I looked at the returns, particularly in Florida, but I looked at Pennsylvania, we got slaughtered. I mean, like 8515. I mean, just, I mean, disgustingly slaughtered. And if we could cut that from 8515 to 7525, as you guys did in the 8 and 12. On a table. Little things produce. These big margins, and you know, we're told that we have this urban. You know the counter argument

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  12. Unless he repeats what he did So, as we used to call it Tens You know it is. And of course, like everywhere else, I mean, Philadelphia and Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh, booming. I mean, it's booming, but the rest of the state, not so much. So you're absolutely correct. And I got in the Milicana's race, which is a district that Trump carried about 20 points. And I knew Connor Lamb's grandfather, who was Governor Casey's legislative director. And if you notice as well as anybody, the governor's legislative director is really good at politics. He really knows the state or the governor.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  13. To Joe Connor, a I hear more terrific things about it. He's so much part of these, I haven't met him. We swap calls. But people say, Connor Lamb, that guy's going to be president one day.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  14. Right. And South Carolina is talking about not even having a Republican primary because it'd be a waste of money. But once Mark Sanford Corps was hanging, That change everything.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  15. At the time, I was not Particularly that is consensual. It was what it was. Look, I wish you wouldn't have done it. I said during the whole thing he's a good man, did a bad thing. What else can I do? But the thing was Stealing. It wasn't like hateful or anything like that. In my Cajun mind, It was

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  16. You know, most people in America, David. They touch each other. You go and you meet people and people, you know, I mean, there's a lot of that kind of stuff. It's particularly true among African American people. I've seen hugging people and it's just... Just a way that people do around the country. And I think somebody. Different cable. I don't think Joe Biden has erotic thought in his mind. All right

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  17. Well, I can only speak for myself, okay? And this is kind of an old Louisiana, kind of probably a French thing. It's just sex, right? I mean, if you were stealing and it's lying about sex, I tell people that have me against the wall with a blindfolding a cigarette, and I'd say, I swear I never touched it. I mean, it did not. Bum mind, it doesn't even rise to the level of misdemeanor, mores and things have changed. My sort of framework in 1998. And, you know, yeah, look, I think that Al Franken got the most bum deal of anybody I've ever seen. I really do. But that's the world that we live in. You know, you got to be very cognizant. I know that I do not, there's no way in my teaching I'm going to be by myself with any female student. I mean, the door is going to be open. It's going to be somebody in. Not that I think that there's anything.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  18. Drag $100 on the trailer park, no matter what you come up with Jenna Flowers actually paid $250,000 In Linda Greenhouse, to her credit, wrote the story and said I was alluding to Paul Jones. I said, Linda, I'm telling you, go look at the transcript again. It was at like the Spurling breakfast. And she called me back and took her. She said, James, I'm horrified. You're right. Do you want me to do a correction?

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  19. Clinton was the easiest thing to know in politics that no one ever learns. And he taught me that. You know, you want to make it about me. I don't want to do that. I want to make it about the voters. And that's always what, and it's a way to, it's a little, it's press bashion, but it's press bashion with skill. And it's very.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  20. Yes. And I mean, I just never seen anybody with a back to the wall perform with that level of skill. And he kept saying they are doing everything that they can to make this about me. And I'm doing everything I can to make it about you. And God almighty, you know, I watch till this day. I watch a politician. And the thing that anybody at home can do this watch how much time this men talking about themselves and how much time it's been talking about voters. If the ratio is anything less than four to one voters to themselves, and the only thing that matters about their story is how it fits into the larger narrative.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  21. Shit. And you talk to everybody else, and then you talk to him. It's like, really, you know, what attracted you to Babe Ruth? Well, I mean, it was just from Michael Jordan. I mean, it was Michael Jordan, and then there was not that these aren't great guys anything. No, no, it was just a.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  22. I said, Yes, sir. We'll get it down right away. Still Russia was over the weekend. We couldn't, we didn't. So Mausen goes in post, and a guy's dick. I mean, that's it. There's no campaign left. I mean, we ran ahead of everybody. And it was just all it was, you know, I wish I said that when I saw that, I knew people would react like they did. But boy, I didn't. But man, and that was just an accidental intern or whatever head back then pulling tape out. That's why you said what you said.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  23. And I'm going, all I was doing was just waiting for when they would show that because you just knew they would come out to chat. So Carl and I put an ad together. Pete Dawkins on why he moved to New Jersey, and it was just him. And at the end, it was, come on, Pete, be real. And I was there. So, of course, the ad runs during either Rosh Hashanah or Yam Kapoor, one of the Jewish holidays. So Frank is like, so we run that ad on TV. I mean, getting 1,100 points. So he calls me in front of you. Goddamn it, Mason put gimbals on the goddamn air. What are you people doing? And people here, you know, synagogue town, this is crazy. I'm giving you money and you run this asshole on TV.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  24. So I get this call after focus group, and Anna says, man, they really react bad to that. So I started going to the focus groups. Then they would play that tape and people would go He's full of shit I wouldn't live here if I had that kind of money I'd be living in Palm Springs I'd be living somewhere else what's he talking about people down here like rude to you and

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  25. I said, Carter, Carter was actually delegated. And I said, let's get somebody to tape his. Announcement. It's great. And so I said, we do it in focus groups. And Anna Bennett. Cole Mausner doing a polling. So there was just one thing that this guy picked out, and he says, you know, my wife and I have moved 20, lived in 21 different places in 20 years, but we've never found a place that we like more than our beautiful garden state. It struck me as sort of usual kind of political background noise bullshit. I'll tell you what, the people in South Chicago are the finest people. But, you know, that kind of crap.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  26. Who was a military guy? At West Point, totally the youngest general in the history at home. I mean, he wasn't custos a general, he was 23, but that's okay. That was part of his thing.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  27. This is literally one of my favorite stories in politics. So Bloutenberg. Was writing and said, Republicans got Pete Daw Pete Dawkins

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  28. Then, when that happened Right, yeah, you know, you know. So Harrison's, you know, if a criminal has a right to a lawyer, why didn't a working person have a right to the doctor? It reminded me of an opening when Baden Roja was like dope dealers. We ran this spot and says, let me ask you something. If a 13-year-old can find a drug dealer, why can't the police? Of course the answer is the 13-year-old is looking for the 13-year-old and not the police, but it's one of those things people here, they go, oh yeah, I like that guy.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  29. But we did commonly done now. We did a paragraph describing Thornberg and a paragraph describing Wafford. With the healthcare. So we kind of knew we had the magic dust. So Wavan comes in and he said, you know, I was talking to optometrists or pediatrists of some kind of guy. And he says, you know, if the criminal has a right to a lawyer, why doesn't a working person have a right to see a doctor? Bingo, like they had was. And it was just one of these magical things where if you look at the chart of the Poland data, it's almost in a perfect upward line.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  30. Interesting to me because this is this is you go to storytelling this is storytelling supreme so Mike Donlin who is a dear friend of mine who's

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  31. And God, I love the old man. He was a different kind of guy. I'll say that. Really different. And the son has done a really good job. I mean, some of the most honest people I've ever dealt with in my life.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  32. Redemptive for both of you guys. Call me in February and David Duggan, Bob Trump. And I went up there. We were like the two ugliest guys and the ugliest girl in a palm was marred. We couldn't go. I couldn't get anybody to hire me and he couldn't get anybody to work for him. I mean, we were both flat-out losers in 1986.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  33. I miss it. I saw Grizzy, I was in San Francisco. Larry Grizzolano, yeah. And you just can't. It's stunning and you see them all have kids and, you know, grandchildren now uname it.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  34. Young people. In a relationship, I mean, it's this whole thing about the whole 92 Clinton people all talk to each other four or five times a week. You know, all like complaining about our prostates and hair loss. You name it. But the great thing about it.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  35. Like you have confidence that you can do what you're doing. And that's a great gift in life to just have that for any period of time in your life.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  36. I mean, that was one of the most talented statewide campaigns ever. That was when I was, you know. In 1988, I used to like all campaign managers, I'd get into office early. Lily sat at my desk and said, because remember I had that experience of saying in 1978 if I had to hire a lawyer, I wouldn't hire me, so I wouldn't ask anybody else to. And it's the best feeling of my life. I said, you know what? If I had to hire a campaign manager, goddamn it, I would hire me.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  37. Paul Gallard, Mark McKinnon. You know, a lot of us guys, the 88. The 88 Lautenberg campaign, Larry Grozzlano, John Anzalone, Paul Begala, Chernolik.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  38. And so they hired me as a campaign manager in Virginia in'82, and we lost the close race, but we lost. And then in 1984, Lloyd Doggett was running Phil Graham for the Senate in Texas, and that result was predictable.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  39. Yeah, I wasn't doing it. I started in Virginia in 1982. I was working for the Mayor Baton Rouge in Peter Hart and Mark Shield. It started with a guy with unsuccessful candidate for governor of Louisiana in 1979, a man by the name of Bubba Henry. And so I called him and I said, I'm working at the situation I was in was not tenable in the May's office in Bad Roose. And I said, look, I'm 40 years old. I got to do something. And I wasn't 40 of 36. And so Peter said, you know, I think you have skill at politics. I got an idea. I'm going to call. Thomas, the guys are like a big lobbyist in Virginia, and Dick Davis was running for the

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  40. I was like going out on shoots and you know go to meetings and that kind of stuff. It was, you know, general flucky. Know, I mean, they'd let me speak up every night and then, but that was not very good at putting TV spots together.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  41. I worked for Raymond. He had a partner named Gus Wilde who didn't came born nasty famous. Those guys taught me a lot. And I mean, they understood. Raymond really understood the value of narrative and really understood the value of messaging.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  42. Another really colorful character. So, yes, and I got. I got my teeth cut, and when I left, that's when I started out and kind of political consultant is slept in around the country.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  43. I did, and it was not very good at it. I sat at my desk one day and said, you know, if I had to hire a lawyer, I wouldn't hire me. I'm getting the hell out of here. No one tried to encourage me to stay. One answer, you know, James, you didn't need to rethink this decision.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  44. It was just always assumed that boy can talk, he needs to be a lawyer. That is enough one to be a lawyer, but it was a good experience. And it didn't cost anything. It was law school was like $110. It's like, well, why not? Now Know these kids go to law school and they're taking on $200,000 in debt. And if, you know, I wouldn't tell anybody That you go to University of Chicago, oh, I couldn't get in anyway, I couldn't get an OSU Law School to tell you the truth. No one would pay that kind of tuition for a three-year experience to just like think of things differently anymore. The world doesn't work like that.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  45. College and then went to school. I have taught school. In St. James Parish during because that was when you first had integration, I was like a good Southern liberal. I wanted to be part of the grand experiment. And then after that I went to law school in 1970.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  46. You know, it gave me the kind of pride of being part of, I think, a fundamentally good organization. I needed the experience of being part of something, of making my bed every morning, of having to show up and having no choice whether or not to be late. I mean, it just gave me two, I needed two years. And unfortunately, that's not available to people now. And the military is not a place for wayward use to go and find their place. But at that time, I was just fortunate enough that it all worked out for me.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  47. I had a machine gun MOS. I wouldn't be here. And they said, anybody who has a discharge date prior to June the 15th fallout A man was June 6th. So the first sergeant comes up and he says, tell you what I do. I'll give you an extra stripe. I'll make you a carpal. I'll give you $1,300 if you sign up for two more years. I said, Gunny, top. And he looked around and he said, I don't blame you. I son of a bitch. And I get the hell out of here

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  48. And, you know, 6666, I'm sure to sign it, so some fundamentals. It's like having a curse in my house. I was fortunate because I was in for two years and I didn't get shot

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  49. Between you join the Marine Corps. What happened was I fucked out and I was going to be drafted. And I saw this article that said the Marine Corps is now accepting two-year enlistments. And it's like, you know, you're going to jail, so why not start as soon as you can? And so I went down there. I said June 6th, 1966.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  50. He has a guy Price LeBlanc, who is like a real car to he ran for the Louisiana legislature, and I put up signs for him and that kind of stuff and he lost. But I just was fascinated by it. And I was started young Democrats at LSU. We started, three of us went up to Southern and helped him start the first young Democratic chapter. People not familiar, Southern University. At one time was the largest black university in the world. I'm sure there was some in Africa. They're now bigger, but I think it's still the largest in the United States. And that was considered radical in 1964. God, how did you get in? How did you get out? Did you get into fighting? Oh, no. Just kind of been up there. You got methods and students and, you know, Whatever you did to get something sort of activated, so I was interested, you know, even at that point.

    2019-05-02 · The Axe Files with David Axelrod · Ep. 323 — James Carville · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source