YouSaid · the spoken record

Julie Gurner

lines on the record: 59
first: 2023-06-27
most recent: 2023-06-27
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

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“About doing X, everyone. Not only does it flag all of its competitors at that point, but it's because it's really not useful to the build of what you want to do. And that's true for individuals too. That's why I say, you know, don't tell other people if you're going to do this thing. Just make it you versus you and do the thing that you want to do and make it personal and make yourself proud. See again with that grit and happiness correlation, and then you're accomplishing a goal, so that's building confidence, all the research really stacks in your favor when you start to do these little things. And they lead to big changes.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Rather than just like this is the end goal, this is amazing because you know, you don't want to hit that reward center just like on social media. I know everyone's a big fan of like building in public and I'm not, I'm absolutely opposite of that. And I'm much more of the Sun Tzu, like let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night. And when you fall, fall like a thunderbolt, right? Like that's my that's more how I would think about operating. You get yourself together. You know what you're going to do. You put your head down. You do it. And then when you fall, I mean, like pull back the curtain and let people see and you can get the praise if you want it then or get the criticism then. But when you're talking about your goals online, oftentimes you get people who give you feedback, people who say certain things, people get in your head. People give you suggestions. And unless you want those things, like I don't know how useful it is. And I feel like it's often a detractor. And I don't see that as being common with other people. Google doesn't say, hey, we're really thinking about it.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Absolutely. And you know, research and psychology shows that when you share your goals and people give you praise, it actually pulls from motivation to achieve them. So it's why vision boards aren't really all that great for you because you look at it and you tell your friend like, you know, hey Ted, look, I'm going to buy.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And what you start to notice is that when you start having some wins outside, you will start to pull that mindset in your work, in your business. And you get a little bit of a swagger to you that I think is really healthy.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Think that we learn to take risks, and I would have anyone who is hesitant around that to take risks in low stakes places first, right? Go sign up for a 5K if you've never run a race and you are physically capable of doing it. And sign up for a 5K in like five months, which gives you a lot of time. Download the couch to 5k app, not affiliated with them in any way, and just say, I'm going to try to do something here. Like I'm going to give it a shot. And nobody has to know it's not about your work. There's no kind of public anything about it. It's just you and you and do something small for yourself and like nail it. And I think that if you can do small things, even if just smaller than that, right? But, you know, challenge yourself to build something in your garage. Challenge yourself to be able to lift a certain amount of weight. Challenge yourself in some small way where you're going to take a risk and go outside of yourself. It translates.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“With our current mindset. Oh, that is so true. That is so true. I think we like to reinforce ourselves in ways that we can and make sense in the world that we've constructed for ourselves.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I don't think that we should be uncomfortable, but I think that we should be grateful for what we have and where we're at, but always feel like, hey, could we do more? Would we be happier if we were able to do this other thing? And sometimes, you know, the end goal is not what people think. You're going to, I have certainly worked with people who want to build these massive companies and they're doing it because they want to be able to give back in some other way or to have influence in some other way or to build wealth in some way that is beneficial far beyond themselves. But those are often not the stories that are told or the things we don't focus on. We focus on the very loud, bombastic, radical actions of some people that capture headlines and we forget that there are thousands of people who are not represented because good stories aren't always the headline grabbing stories we'd like to read.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think we have to put it on luck, right? Like, oh, they got lucky. I think that's a really good observation, or that we see things that other people have done and we'll have to find immediately a reason why they did it and we didn't. Maybe they're a bad person and we're not. Or, you know, they are not as immoral as we are, or they are not as something as we are. Like I often hear that people who are very wealthy exploit other people. And, you know, like that's certainly, you know, if we want to look at where bad people are, I mean, there are so many people who are abusive parents and I mean it doesn't always have to do with wealth whether you're good or bad person. They're bad people everywhere. They're great people everywhere. And I think that we always have to find reasons to make ourselves feel better. We're telling ourselves certain messages to keep us comfortable with where we're at. And I think that's a really important point that like, should we really be as comfortable where we're at?”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You know, this on her kids, or you know, they'll find a way to kind of discredit things. And I always think it's fascinating that we will find ways to discredit things that we want to. That we don't like or that we don't think is possible for us, and it's harder to say, oh, yeah, she was an airhein stewardess. And now she has multiple billion dollar companies under her belt. Like, that's pretty amazing. Why aren't we kind of focusing on, we always focus on like, oh, but this person did this or this person did that. And so it's amazing our tendency to try to tear others down rather than to see them as inspiration and say, oh my God, like how does someone who's an airline stewardess get to that point? What a brilliant move or series of moves to be able to capitalize on what they had in front of them.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Right. I mean, it isn't like Sam Altman swoops down from wherever he's at and says, you know, you're never going to do this. You're right. I mean, I think that that's an interesting observation because you have people who are struggling themselves who want you to see that like that's the struggle we all should have. It just isn't, right? And I think that there are different ways to react to people who are doing very well or who think differently than us. We can say, for example, when someone is really focused on doing big things, you know, some people will be envious, some people will see it as inspiration. And I always think that that's every now and again I'll throw out that I'll say something like I guess this is controversial, but I'll say, oh, you know, Chris Jenner's really done some amazing things, right? She's built multiple billion dollar companies and people tend to overlook that and they'll say, oh, you know, she did it because of a...”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, I do think that sometimes, you know, if you're ever on Twitter, it's really fascinating is that you put something big and bold out there, you'll always get people underneath. You get a lot of cheering folks, but you'll get people underneath who will try to set you straight, right? of why things won't work, why things won't happen. And I always like every time I see a response like that, I always think, oh, wow, like I am so sorry. Like this is a framework that is going to, it's going to keep that person small. And I always hope that there is a way in which they can see that like this isn't the only way to look at it, like keep following along, like keep being a part of things and don't give up on reading some of this stuff because it'll hit eventually, hopefully, as you watch people doing some of the things that they talk about doing.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, I mean, I guess there's some value, but if you're evolving, you shouldn't be the same. So someone saying, oh, you've changed. Yes, consider that a compliment, right? Like you want to change. You want to be different. You want to grow. And I always feel like when people say things like, don't forget where you come from, sometimes it's a way of saying, well, you know, remember you're not that great.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I would. I think that it definitely comes from how we speak to ourselves, but also just how we think about ourselves as, and those are two distinct things, right? Like how we talk to ourselves, how we think about ourselves, how we conceptualize ourselves, who we see ourselves being in the larger space. And I think that that is a really important thing. And it's also why I really dislike sometimes when people will say, you know, like never forget where you come from, right?”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“As you begin to continue to take risks, but I also think that hesitancy pulls you into this kind of negative loop where it builds on itself too. And you really have to be cautious that things don't kind of set on the table and you just kind of look at them as you come in and out because that will keep happening and you'll keep looking at it and it will keep bothering you. And then eventually you just feel like you'll make up some rationalization why it didn't happen like, oh, you know, I'm so glad I didn't do that because I didn't really have the time or I got to spend a lot of extra time doing this or whatever it is, but you'll find a reason to rationalize it and eventually it will go to the place where dreams die and there will be a lot of other things that will set in that bucket with it and it will be unfortunate for you because you never got to see what would happen.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Watch other people taking the chances and doing well now you're one step behind and then you watch them continue to take chances now you're three steps behind and you watch them just continue over the course of a year you're watching someone blow up and do great and you know that person well like man that guy's doing it and here I am still thinking about that idea I had and I didn't do it and it just it's an erosion of confidence just over and over and over again that hesitancy and so I do think that even if that bias to action and the ability of people to make those moves as you said you know you watch them do it and they do it over and over and over again they know they can figure it out because the first leap just taking that leap is like a shot in the arm and it makes you feel a little bit more confident because you made that leap nothing went wrong and now you can figure out can you do the next one can you figure out the next step it like confidence stats”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, I think that there is a very strong link more than we think with like hesitancy and self-esteem. So for example, I think the more you hesitate, you see other people doing things, you watch, right? And like if you don't take the chance.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Don't think that they're going to say, like, oh, I'm going to lose it all if this happens. I think they'll say, well, I'll figure out another way, right? And I think that that is a common trait that they'll say, there's not just confidence in taking on the task. There's confidence that no matter what happens in uncertainty, that they'll figure it out. And a lot of times they're often people who are learning new skills all the time. I don't think the boats are always ever entirely burned. I think they see that there's probably a dinghy out there they can take somewhere. But it's fascinating because they do go all in. And I think that is a, and they'll do things that are just ridiculous and audacious. And I think that that is fun to watch and be a part of that kind of, well, why not? Why can't I do this? And it pushes against those, you know, imaginary rules that we talked about earlier where people would say, oh, you can't do that.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think that there's a truth and a non truth in that, if I can push back on some of it. Yeah, please do so. There's a truth in that there's a lot of power in focusing on one thing. I don't think that they see themselves burning boats because I think that they see that no matter what happens, they'll figure it out.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And they like winning. And they enjoy it, right? Like they enjoy setting up things that they can win at. And I think they don't really care much about what other people think about how they operate. I also think there are people who make really big bets and are willing to take really big losses. A guy who's going to spend, you know, 8 million bucks on a machine and then buy a few anticipating that his company is going to catch up. Those are big bets. People who are deciding that they're going to hire people in advance or that they're going to do something that's pretty close to the edge as far as in regulations. You take big chances. And I think that they enjoy those kind of big swings.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I love when I deal with people who are outliers because they are resolutely like themselves. I think that they tend to be very quirky people as individuals. And I think it almost is a forcing function to pushing them where they end up going, right? Like if you somebody who easily, I often wonder, and this is just my own theory, right? Like if you're somebody who easily fits in the crowd and you're somebody who's very much like the people, I think it's easy to kind of tampen other areas of your life to be a part of those people and to be a part of those communities and to be socializing and doing all those things. And these are often people who are a little quirky and maybe aren't the most popular person in high school, but they are all smart and they are all really focused. They have an ability to like.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“To make it intentional to be better in multiple spheres of his life, you know, you're not going to hit 100 all the time, but it was still a really nice, I think, way of moving forward.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I don't know. That's a really good question. I mean, the whole notion of regret minimization, I think hits us when we're already at the point where we're regretting. But I would hope that people are thinking about those types of things. You know, there was a guy that I was able to speak with in the past at some point, and he said he'd always bring a note card with him. And he would write on that note card, you know, how am I going to be the best? One thing I can do to be the best husband today, dad today, CEO today. And he just had one thing that like, you know, and maybe it was something really stupid for his kids. Like, he's going to swing by the store and bring home some candy or he's going to like take everyone out for ice cream after or maybe it's just watching a movie or playing a video game with them with his wife maybe it was just like hey i'm going to make sure that i'm you know affectionate or i'm going to do something you know whatever it is but he would always have one intentional thing and i always thought that was really interesting that he had something”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Think that we a lot of times people will use being good at work as an escape if they're bad at home. So like, for example, you'll see that sometimes people who reach pretty great heights aren't always the best dads. They're not always the best husbands. Sometimes they are. They're phenomenal. So I don't want to make that a generalization. But I think that it's also very easy to be pulled into areas where we feel competent and good and where we feel rewarded and where we feel that we're winning. And it's hard to go into areas where we might be falling down, we might be dropping the ball, we might need to do some work. So I do think sometimes that can also reinforce a very bad cycle where things are really crappy at home. I'm going to stay at work for an extra two hours. And, you know, I'm really going to get set the company up for this big win and you feel good and everyone pats you on the back and you're all, you're creative and you're productive and then you go home and you just”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Energy source and actually pull you and distract you away. So, what you're going to have in your life be intentional include it, nurture it, make sure that it's stable because the things that are not are going to pull at you everywhere. Like if you think about it, we bring ourselves everywhere we go. And so those things that pull at us or that take from us, you know, that is also going to be reducing our effectiveness or our mood stability and some of those other things in our work. We think we're good at compartmentalization and often we're not as good as we think.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And take care of it. If you're going to be somebody who in other foundational items, as you've mentioned, like with sleep and eating and nutrition and all of those things, be good enough that it provides a level of stability and foundational elements. I think about medical needs too. I'll have people who will put off like a nagging shoulder pain for I don't want to address this now as physical therapy. Oh my God, you know, like who has time for that address it like address those nagging medical things, get yourself up to par. So it is an eating headspace. It isn't eating into your energy. It isn't something you have to worry about. So basically what I'm trying to do is say, hey, let's build a lot of different legs to that stool. Maybe you're someone who's in the spirituality or you're somebody who's in like have some foundational things in your life that you take care of, but also don't have things that you're not taking care of that are going to tap into that.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think about it as that if you have only one leg of a stool, it's easy to kick out, right? So like if you say, hey, everything that I am is my business and you put your identity in that, when your business does poorly or it collapses, it just shakes you. If you have multiple legs of that stool, you're much more stable. And so I do think about creating stability in multiple prongs of success and multiple prongs of grounding in people's lives as foundation. So for example, like if your relationship is very conflictual or high conflict, that's going to eat into your headspace in your work. So take care of that. Like make it a priority and be good about it. If you're going to invest in that, I mean, there are some people who will say, look, maybe this isn't the right time for you to be in a relationship at all. That's fine. But have some stability in that and know who you are in that space.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“To move quickly, not over committing, not having too many open loops. All of those things are ways in which we're not having the proper boundaries. And then even committing time for our personal life, right? Having a date night with your spouse once a week and holding to that, like actually holding to it and not saying, well, you know, really important thing came up. So boundaries do free us and they allow us to live our best life, but we have to really enforce them and we have to be really clear on what they are. And we have to communicate that clarity sometimes to others in ways that sometimes make people uncomfortable because we like to make people happy. And setting boundaries makes very few people happy. It will make you happy eventually. But with other people, I think their tendency is to kind of push and test, but you have to really hold on to that so that you're able to operate in your highest use.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Know, oh, I get up and I do this, and then I do that. But a lot of people I work with, you know, they get fit later and they kind of really like not as fit perhaps always during the creation process of their businesses. It's hard to fit in and have a spouse or anyone else in their life. So, you know, boundaries are incredibly important, but boundaries do ultimately free us. As you're scaling, for example, as a CEO or someone's starting a business, you'll notice you do everything at first. And then, you know, you start to pull into your areas of highest and best use. And those shift over the course of your business. And if you stay in the weeds, you're going to compromise on scale. You got to set boundaries. If you get involved too much in product, which is something very typical for a lot of people, and you get your tentacles in there too much, you're not paying attention to some of these other things. So to me, boundaries are freedom.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It frees us, right? I think that when we set boundaries around what we should be taking on and what we should not be taking on, we set boundaries around what is our optimum use of time and what is not. We set boundaries around how you operate and how you don't, what you make time for and what you don't.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But others, I mean, I remember there was a wonderful interview with Oprah, and she said, you know, when I left my job to do to start out on my own, to do this talk show, every single person in my life told me I would fail except for one. And, you know, it was her best friend at the time, or I think still her best friend. But the point being that sometimes those areas, the people who will cheer you on will be few. And it doesn't mean that it's the wrong move.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Important in how you think about those as well. So seeking validation, I think, is normal and is natural. I think being in a social media world makes that really challenging. And I think that that makes that hard for a lot of people being able to establish boundaries around that. But I think also boundaries are very confusing generally for people, right? Like how do you set the line on a lot of things in your life? But yeah, seeking validation, I think, can really be a double-edged sword. I think that we should seek it from the right people in our lives, but we certainly don't want to be seeking it outside of that. And I guess I'm of the belief that that circle of seeking validation should be incredibly small. I mean, a few people, you know, your spouse, your kids, maybe one other person in your life that you really trust and feel like has your absolute best interest at heart.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I agree. And you hear people say, screw what everyone thinks, right? And I think that that's a quick way to become a jerk because you don't want to do that. You want to care what some people think. And so you want to care what people think who are maybe, you know, your spouse or your children or, you know, some people around you. But that's where I think your social circle really matters because these people are going to reinforce certain imaginary rules that will or they'll help you break them. They'll say, hey, you're worth more than that. Why are you putting up with that at work? Or they'll say, man, yeah, we all got to deal with these terrible bosses and like, we're all in it together. And those are very different groups of friends, right? I mean, there'll be people who are cheering you on to start something new or maybe pushing you to start something new. And then there are the people who say, I wouldn't risk it. Like, why do you want to do that? So these are people who, like, the people that surround you are going to really be.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“True, but there are ways in which we kind of figure out our own place and we're figuring out other people's place. And, you know, it's kind of what we tell ourselves. And I think that we could do a lot more. Most people are capable of far more than they imagine themselves to be. And we stay small because we believe these imaginary rules to be true.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Lives, but many people, I would say that most people, if you ask them, most people will say, you know, you ask them, do you feel as though you are, you know, you're the author of your life, you are the person who is in charge. Everyone will say yes. I mean, of course. And then you ask them, well, what did you want to be when you grew up, right? Like, what did you want to do? And they'll say, oh, I wanted to do this or I wanted to do that. Most of the times they haven't done it, or you'll, you know, or I didn't know that was possible for me. Or, oh, I didn't even think I could do that. You'll hear them bumping up against these rules all the time. And I think people in everyday life are bumping up against them and they don't know what it is, but they're frustrated. And so then they begin to ascribe things to other people that aren't true. Like the only people who make a million dollars a year, oh, those people, they must exploit other people. Those people must be born into money. Those people, I mean, all of these rules, you'll hear them. And they're not necessarily...”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“To expand beyond yourself. And the internet makes that wonderful, by the way. But unless you find ways to expand beyond yourself, these imaginary rules that you carry around often keep you very small because you will limit what you feel you can do. You will limit how much you feel you can earn. You will limit what you feel you're capable of because you've never seen it and also because other people have reinforced it. You know, I don't know about you, but you know, when you grow up, sometimes you have a very limited world. You know, for me growing up, I thought the wealthiest person you could be was a physician, right? I mean, that's what I thought. And, you know, their imaginary rules that everybody lives by, you know, it shapes their world what they try for and what they think. And then you start to see outside of those imaginary rules. And all of a sudden they start to break. That is, those are incredibly important moments in people.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The thing about imaginary rules that I think are really interesting is that we're all raised with rules and some of those rules are great, right? They teach us to be well mannered and not to get arrested and how to operate in society and all of those things. And I think those are fantastic. But we are also simultaneously ingesting other rules that are unspoken and that are really unsubstantiated, right? Like what is possible for us? What are the things that we can do? What are we capable of? What are we capable of earning or doing or creating? And I think that those things are ingested and we don't talk about them. And then we end up becoming kind of, we're raised in ecosystem, like echo chambers and kind of little systems of operation that are reinforcing these rules all the time. The rules that we don't challenge, the rules we don't talk about. And unless you find a way.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The hassle, the time that it takes, because those are the moments that allow you to really gain ground and to have a much more productive future, to have much more productive relationships, to be more productive at work. To really intervene early. And I think intentionality is really the key thinking about how you want your life to look and what you're willing to put up with. What kind of standards are you holding for yourself? And how do you value yourself? And a lot of those are around when you take action and how much you give and what you're waiting for and how much you're willing to take.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I agree. I think that we let life happen to us, right? And we don't decide that we are going to control the trajectory of it. And I think that that's true whether it's in the small moments and sometimes even in the large ones. Like people will stay unhappy at a job or stay unhappy in their role and they'll just stay unhappy instead of just saying, hey, you know, like eventually they'll reach a point. And this is true for everyone, right? They're unhappy, they're unhappy, they're unhappy. And then finally, I've had enough. And all of those excuses they've used, there will come a point when none of the matter and they're going to take that leap. But why does it have to get to that point? And why can't we kind of flag things earlier on? And I think early intervention, you know, I talk about that notion of like fighting up front. Early intervention in almost every case is worth the attention.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Working on those traumas is important. If you go to a therapist, and I think that that's really valuable stuff, and it's worthwhile because it can change the course of your life. But if you're somebody who uses other events as a reason to self-destruct, your seeding power, and we see that even with companies, right? Like, I'm doing this because so-and-so made me angry. I'm doing this because, you know, and you end up making some poor decisions and ceding power because of someone else. You know, you're willing to make a poor decision. You're willing to give up. Sometimes people are willing to give up their entire future dreams because of X, Y, and Z. And it's a tragedy. So you want people to really understand the power they have to create their own lives at some point and that creation is not given to anyone else but you.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Are down look as relaxed as could be. And so some people are going to say, you know, when you get home, like, why are you so upset? Oh, is the traffic? The traffic makes me nuts, right? But if the traffic really makes people nuts, it would make everyone nuts. And so it can't be that. It's how we're thinking about the traffic that really makes people be relaxed and productive, or it makes them be just absolutely enraged and out of control. So when people are telling me that like, you know, I'm doing this because of my childhood. I'm doing this because of you're giving up some amount of power. You're giving up a lot of power to something outside of yourself. And you're also how you're interpreting that event is not useful to you. You know, it may be, there may be a lot of truth to the terrible things that have happened. But, you know, those terrible things, you have to shut the door at some point and say, you know, I am my own man or woman, and I move forward. And, you know,”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So this is really fascinating to me too. And I love hearing things like that when they come up because they're such clear flags and clearly they are for you as well. Like you hear that and you're like, oh, this is a problem, right? I mean, immediately. So I think about it like this. You could be sitting, and this is the example that I always think about because it pulls people away from some of the more emotional stuff, but you could be sitting in traffic and we've all sat in traffic, right? I mean, traffic as long as the eye can see. And there will be some people you'll look out and they'll be like beeping and dodging and they're all over the place. And you can surmise how that person must be thinking, right? I mean, it's just like never going to get there. Can't believe this is happening. We could anticipate that these are coming from strong thought patterns and emotional places. But if you look to your right, I mean, there's probably also some guy or girl listening to a podcast, texting someone.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“What they're capable of, and sometimes to see what they're capable of in ways that they quickly forget, right? I mean, negative things sometimes shadow our entire mindset and how we think about things. And we end up tossing aside some of the good things, right? Like you'll have, you know, 20 compliments on your haircut and one person says, oh, what'd you do to your hair? And that's the person who gets all the attention. You think about, I don't want them shoving aside those 20 compliments or those 20 times they took the chance or the 20 times that they overcame something really incredible that they kind of shove off to the side, I want them to see those things very clearly and to see the minority of, yeah, you know, things happen periodically that aren't great for us and don't make us feel well and we make some bad decisions, but so what everyone does.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“In that case, it is based on their strength and ability, and you want them to see those things rather than seeing the kind of helplessness and powerlessness. It's the reason why oftentimes, you know, like people engage with me and they think we're going to go back in time and talk about their, I don't know, inner child or something. But I am someone who's going to start with who you are today because going back to the past is not really useful unless it informs who you are standing in this moment. We can't change it. We can't, you know, go back. And going back to times of powerlessness also, it puts you in a bad mindset. It sets you up in a negative way. So I oftentimes will go back and restructure some things around risk, for example, is a really good area where we'll do some discussion when people are hesitant to take risk. I want people to go back and say, hey, tell me about times you took risk and it really paid off. Like, let's talk about that. I want people to understand.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That's a really great question. I think that there are two ways of looking at victim things that have happened to you. You can be a victim or you can be a survivor. And those are two very different cognitive positions. You know, you can't control what happens to you in either circumstance. But one is very powerful. You have overcome. One is, you know, you have had something happen to you and you are under that thing for quite some period of time. So for me, if I hear someone and I hear that kind of helplessness,”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Certain things, and then kind of this creates a cycle where they don't feel they are capable of overcoming. And that's a real challenge. That's a real cognitive setup that can defeat people for long periods of time. And it can be a really tragic end in that case.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Boxing ring that fear starts to go away, and he began, he says that he begins to feel like a god because he had trained so hard and there's nobody on earth who could have trained as hard as he did. I see that sometimes with people who will tell themselves, you know, I will never be poor. I will never be X. And there is a certain type of driver even there that we can use something negative and really flip it to something positive if we have it in the right framework. And I think that's where you begin to see some discrepancies in psychology. There are these kind of inflection points in people's lives where they will choose to overcome or they will choose to be kind of beaten by things. And you will see over and over again that there are groups of people who will always choose to overcome and there will be people who choose, people can argue whether they choose it or not, but there will people who will be beaten by.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It does. And I think that that is, I think that's really the key to a lot of things. People are more adept to working against than oftentimes we give them credit for. So we often think of people working for things, but they often work against things too. They work against poverty. They work against their upbringing. They work against some of these things just as much as they're working for them. And, you know, some people are very fear driven. And we talk about fear as being very negative, but it also can be very positive. There's Muhammad Ali and others. I think it was Mike Tyson who said, you know, Tyson would say that he was afraid, you know, every single day that he was going to be humiliated in front of groups of people. And he would just be training and training and training out of fear that he was going to be, you know, just publicly humiliated. And he would notice in himself as he's walking to.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“To much, and now you have 50 million bucks in the bank, but that's still not enough. I'm going to still show her, right? Like I'm still going to push that forward. And it isn't so much about her, but proving it to yourself. And that's when it really becomes quite a motivator. And if you talk to people, you'll still hear these kind of echoes, as you've said, of people who have chips on their shoulders and they're still running hard.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It's interesting because there's a lot of people who talk about that chip, and there's a lot of controversy, I think I've read around should you be using these negative things to fuel you? And I'm a big fan of using negative drivers as well as positive drivers. I think if you have deep rage, deep anger, deep resentment, it's how you channel that that will make it beneficial or detrimental. I mean, those things can be absolutely destructive and people can really kind of, you know, burn their own homes down with that kind of energy. But channeled properly, that energy is also a force to be reckoned with. And so I think that that chip on your shoulder can be a real motivational pull for a lot of people because there's nothing that they will ever reach that will fully prove it wrong, right? I mean, so that becomes that endless source, you know, that your third grade teacher told you you'd never”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The gentleman who is a chairperson, I want to say he's in his mid 70s or so. And man, that guy is hungry as ever, even though he's just advising and, but he is engaged. And you see that with Warren Buffett, and you see it with others. Like they just kind of don't lose that. And that's where I see, you know, when you talk about motivation, that's a pull that just, it is an endless source of fuel. And then when you tie that with something, you're like obsessed by, you know, the researcher who can be in a lab and look at a peptide for 20 years. It's just something that is very, very challenging to beat. And I think that's what really creates a lot of, you know, elite operators because, you know, you can be interested casually in something, but someone who is obsessed and motivated and pulled and driven. You just can't beat that level of operation.”
2023-06-27 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · Dr. Julie Gurner (Part 1): Caring Deeply, Challenging Directly · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT