YouSaid · the spoken record

Suzanne Iasenza

lines on the record: 97
first: 2020-02-04
most recent: 2020-02-04
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“Open there, they bring it in for a tune up and hardly anyone. So dates are important, date nights, whether they're sex date nights or just date date nights. Or if you don't have money, it doesn't mean you have to go out. There's a lot of ways to have fun at home. But to really nurture the relationship is really important.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Love you or I appreciate you. Know so sometimes I'll tell couples you get into bed before you pass out how about just one word of gratitude I'll just say, I'm so happy you're still in my life. I love your sense of humor. You know, you really make me laugh when I feel so bad, when I felt bad. One word, and then you could pass out, even if you have five kids. You know, it's like, how do you nurture that relationship? The 80-year-olds who are still doing well, they never forgot to be grateful and appreciative of their relationship. And that's very important. And people don't often think that they need to nurture. Just falling in love is not the end of the story. It's the beginning of a story. It's the beginning of a process. It's not the end. And too many people, I think, will walk down the aisle or moving together or whatever commitment means to them. And they think, oh, I did it now. Now I have my partner for life. Phew, that one's done. Check it off the list. And no, actually, now the fun begins. This is when you really need to, you know, some people take care of the cars more than their relationships.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Almost like we do with everything. We take our health for granted. There are a lot of things we could take for granted. But I talk to, especially when kids come into the picture. Some people become so child focused that they lose that there's another thing that needs to be nurtured. I often say to couples with kids, the relationship's another child. You don't have one child. You have two. It's called your child named Mary. And then you have a marital relationship to still nurture. And people don't get that a relationship has to be nurtured. You have to water it like a plant. It isn't just to be taken for granted. And I think too many people just think, oh, we're in love net. We were in love and got married. We had kids or were committed. He should know why so many people said she should know why I love her. I said, no, how about telling her you love her? People never are too old to feel, you know, like I like to hear her I still look good.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I'm really glad you say they're not complacent because I find sometimes when I do histories to find out what went wrong, you know, like a lot of times it's important to ask, well, you had sex so well for the first five years, what happened, right? Or you used to really enjoy each other and have fun. What happened? And I'm always interested, when did it stop happening? When did the fun stop? Or why do you think the fun stopped? So maintenance, many people take relationships for granted, I think.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And underneath most attacks is usually an unmet need. And if you can help people shift from those more aggressive ways of being that are harmful to being able to be more vulnerable, vulnerability is a tough one to get people into, but really if people can be vulnerable and really speak from the heart the truth, they can get to a lot of a way to work out a conflict. Even if they're very different underneath with all that vulnerability, they could find, I often say, how about just think of the Venn diagram. There you are, there you are. Let's find the overlap in the Venn diagram. All we need is a little space in here to start feeling like, is it possible? But when you do enough couple therapy, if the Venn diagram stays with the two big circles and there isn't even like a little inch that's overlapping, that's when sometimes it means really is that mean that we can have a little space with the vendor.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, it's meant to harm. You know, there's a difference between expressing anger. When you do X, I feel so angry because it's different than you're so selfish. You know, you're so into your own thing. You don't care about me making big statements about another person. So it really breaks down anger for it to be much clearer about what you need. Because almost behind every attack is behind anger is usually hurt”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, fighting unfair, we know what that can be, right? Some of it would be the attack and using contempt to be aware of the things that people sarcast. And there are many things you can say in a fight that really isn't fair. You know, it's really passive.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So I kind of help them. It's almost like you're at the UN. You're trying to teach translation skills. So it's like, could you just share this way as opposed to that way? And you'd be surprised how changing from a you to an I can make a big difference. So listening how you say things, how to fight well, John Gottman, a great couple therapist, talks about fighting fair.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You do this. Yes, you this. You're this, you're that. You do this. You don't do that. Instead of I need. So sometimes I'll say, you know, instead of making a comment about your partner, how about saying what a need that you're having right now? So let's switch to the comment about your partner. You never listen to me to the need. You know what? I really need more attention from you when you come home from work. I really need you to hear how my day was. It's so different to say, and I need as opposed to you are or you're not.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Doesn't mean you're agreeing with what your partner said. You're only demonstrating that you heard him or her, that you listened to them. So that expressing like empathy or understanding doesn't mean I agree with you because then you'll have your chance to say what your perspective is, your subjectivity is, which could be very different. And then the other partner gets to hear you out and not interrupt you and not be creating the retort, you know, the response, but instead to be listening. So listening is a big skill. And then, of course, speaking's a skill. How do you say your truth in the most constructive way? You know, sometimes we'll say use I statements, don't say you. One's important is going to say you, I get prepared because it's like they're probably not going to be saying something good.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Listening is a really, that helps. A lot of people can't listen very well, I notice, in general, in society, but in couples. You know, when a partner is starting to say things that trigger us, some people have to have the retort ready. So by the time they're, even if they don't interrupt, some people just interrupt and shut up their partner or talk over them or start yelling or fighting. But let's say they don't do that in their minds they could already be developing the retort. They're not even listening to what the partner said in the first place. So there's like a very common kind of couple dialogue that couple therapists can do that speaker listener method you probably heard of it, but where you just forced the couple to say, all right, you know, John has five minutes and Mike has to be quiet and let John speak, right? And you can't say anything, Mike. And then after John stops, you have to paraphrase back to John what he said. So John knows you understand. And that to show empathy or to show understanding.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I always tell people the real strength is how do you recover from something not the fact that you already had the fight or the rupture but how do you recover how fast you recover how well what are your skills to recover”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And now we're reconnecting. Yeah, well, still, whatever the crisis was, if there was a crisis that brought them to the brink of thinking they were going to break up, let's say, an affair could be a typical one. But anything else. And then to slowly say what needs to be repaired. And often I will tell couples, I give this notion of from analytic work, you know, there's rupture and repair in almost any authentic relationship. Like it's really important to develop your tolerance for disappointment, both to be disappointed by your partner and to disappoint your partner. So many people have such a hard time allowing disappointment to be part of a really healthy, authentic relationship. So when I talk about authenticity, I said, if you're really authentic, you're going to hurt each other, not even intentionally, but unintentionally, even if it's because of your own wounds or your own unconscious conflicts you haven't dealt with.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It's best for the kids, and it refocuses a lot of them. Yeah, some people can. In fact, having a kid in the picture really can give them the strength to stay there and really tough out the really difficult conversation.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So that's, but I try and create the biggest container I can, and sometimes I might even say, hey, I know this might feel too much now, but how about maybe you each meet with me individually next week, right? Why do we have two individual sessions and come back then the next week and maybe you can come back in the office as a couple and talk more about how to break up? So I try and figure out different ways to still make a big enough container for people to learn as much as they can and make for the best breakup. If kids are involved, then it's even more so really important if they're little kids because how are you going to help the kids not feel guilty, not feel like it's their fault?”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Eyes, that's terrible. Whether it's the failure narrative or whether it's the rejection narrative or whether it's the guilt narrative. Sometimes the person who is breaking up that can't tolerate staying in the room because they feel too guilty about it.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Newell. Some people can't tolerate. And I don't cast judgment about that. It's just that people have different levels of capacity.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, the good practices, the separating in the world. We hope that eventually would they be able to stay in a room long enough, especially the person for whom, let's say they don't want to break up, to be able to tolerate that level of hurt or rejection or whatever, to be able to say, what can I learn from this, including the pain of being left? That's pretty amazing. Some people can do that. I always think that everything in life is a learning experience. Even probably our most terrible experiences are our best learning experiences. So if a couple can stay in an office long enough once the writing's on the wall that this isn't going to work and get the most they can get out of it, including how does one separate from a bond that was so meaningful, that's pretty good stuff. And some people can do it, some people can't. The minute there's the least bit of an indication they're out of there. Like people get up and run out of my office or say, that's it. I mean, yeah.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But I do a lot of assessment. If a couple comes to me saying they want to open, I do so much assessment that by the time they're finished with it, they might say, who knows if we're equal.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, what's really challenging is sometimes that in some couples, one person really wants, let's say, polyamory, but the other person doesn't. Well, that could be tricky. You know, both people want the same thing. Sometimes that could be a little easier. But one person may want the outside recreational sex or boyfriend or girlfriend addition to the spouse, and the other doesn't. That could be tricky. I mean, it's not not doable, but it takes a lot of consciousness, integrity. Honesty, trust. And some people can pull that off. Some primary couples will say this open relationship made me even more committed to my partner, even more trusting of my partner, even stronger. So it's not always an exit ramp. Some people are afraid it's an exit ramp.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Is what you have to give up to be monogamous. And I don't see it that way. I see it as actually more challenging, I think, to have an open relationship for all those reasons. How are you going to navigate that material? If you're going to do it with integrity, with me.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“What I often tell people is this is an immoral question, it's like it's a high maintenance activity if you're going to do it well. Because imagine, even like the way I think of it, right? If all sexes, group sex, just with two people, now throw in a girlfriend or a boyfriend or throw in, like, you know, whatever someone is going to be, you have your boyfriend and your husband at the Thanksgiving table. Now you've got three sets of histories to cope with, or four or five. So certainly I think it's more complicated. There are more moving parts. I think it does at least consciously make people have to deal with jealousy much more upfront. They have to deal with envy more upfront, competition. These are tough feelings to have in general, but I don't think that either form of relationship is inherently more or less healthy. I do think some therapists believe that. They believe that people who are in open relationships or polyamorous arrangements are less mature. You know, I've heard some colleagues say, oh, that person just wants to have their cake and eat it too. Why can't they just live with the change?”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Isn't it? But anyway, you have to highly sexual person with the person who really is a very low valence so they could care less. And the highly sexual person says, I love this person, but I don't know if I want to live the rest of my life non-sexual. Now maybe they can go into other alternatives like can have an open relationship, can, you know, consensual nomenagamy, polyamory, you know, what's possible?”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And sometimes I think that's true, especially with older gay folks for whom coming out meant they lost their family's origin and they were either cut off or whatever. So they had a friendship family so that if a partner is that important to you and then you break up, some people aren't going to give up the friendship just because they're now not partners anymore. And some heterosexual couples are that way too. They just, as they're breaking up, because they really have to, like sex can be a breaking point. Like if you wind up with one partner who still is quite sexual, just sexuality is important to them. With truly a partner who says, I could care less if I ever have sex again in my life, and there's nothing wrong with that too, or they could be asexual, by the way. Asexuality doesn't get enough attention in our society, because I think some people don't even know they're asexual, and they get labeled sexually dysfunctional because they don't, you know, sex isn't a major variable for them, for attraction. They still want to be partnered.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And those are not necessarily the same date. That's right. And even there are some people that are now moving on and they're still connected all these years later. They've become sometimes in the gay community they'll say that they never do break up. I mean, they break up, but then they're at the Thanksgiving table.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“If they feel like even if one person is really initiating it more, which is always more painful, obviously, or if one person wants to leave the other doesn't, that's really tough. But in whatever way I can help them stay in a room enough to understand how calm and to be able whatever was good, be able to still be part of the separation process to bring that good that was there when they were both happy to the separation process, that's a gift they can give each other. And some people get there to be able to do it. Even the person who could sit there, sometimes they have a couple might want to see me a little after a divorce or the couple therapy ends, especially the one that didn't want to break up because they want to sit and help me understand even more of how do they go forward with this and what could they learn from it because sometimes the person who leaves the relationship was more ready to give up the relationship than the person who gets the bad news, right?”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Memories, but now it's time to, and it's so moving. I try and help people with that frame to offer that frame and for them to shift to a point of saying, you know what, I really can see why you were in my life if I even, though we're getting divorced, I would still do it this way. That is like one of the best endings because you could say whether this is a spiritual way of thinking about it or whatever, or soulmates, whatever, but there's certain people come into your life, even friends, not just partners, but who really are there, who really through the ups and downs are real teachers. And for some couples, they really can say that they were real teachers, but the lessons need to be done not together anymore. And even part of the lesson can be to be able to separate well. And for many people, I think...”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, sometimes that's another narrative I try and help them transform, especially in a relationship that really had real substance, you know, even though it wound up, is that some people come together really for certain reasons, good reasons. And they really grew together and they really produced whatever. And sometimes it could be the kids or it could be other things. And then sometimes the growth isn't going to go anywhere anymore and actually could be going in an opposite direction. It could be really positive.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Means failure, and I've never failed at anything. That's right. That's right. And they feel shame about it. And they even play in all their, everybody we have to tell and they have to come out about it. And then if there are kids involved, it's even worse, you know, especially if it's little kids.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Many times even therapists can, a couple therapists can feel like the breakup is a failure. And I think that's a narrative that's really one to be dealt with as people are trying to decide or one person wants to leave that relationship. They think it's over. That some people won't say that it's over because they don't want to feel the failure of it. Yeah.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Can't devastate the partner, or they are too frightened for themselves. And you know, I don't minimize that. Like for some people, then a lot of their work needs to be to understand what's so awful about being alone. And for some people for whom they really will stay in such an unhappy relationship because the alternative is so much worse. That sometimes if I'm the couple therapist, I would probably refer them to individual therapy because it might be a much deeper issue that I can't do as the couple therapist. But I don't think it's my job necessarily to force that person to have to say that to a partner when they're still in the process of not even knowing why they're so terrified to be alone, because maybe if they work on that issue individually, they may be able to come back and want to recommit to the relationship.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Again, there are two levels to that. Sometimes some people really don't even really let themselves know it. So sometimes, let's say that fear of I'm really with him or her because I really would rather not be alone. They don't even know yet. And it impacts over time as we do more layered work and as we're really taking the content of each thing they're unhappy about, we try and make it better. And sometimes you could see each thing gets better, but a half of the couple might not still be more committed and more happy. That can give you a clue that there could be still something about this person really doesn't want to be here. But they might not have known it. So for some people, they really didn't know that and they don't know it until they really do the work and then they really realize this just isn't enough. It's not going to work. Almost like the course is already out of the barn. Other people do know it, but they can't say it, either because they”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yeah, whatever that book is, that's exactly. Some people are terrified of being single. They're really, either they have such low self-esteem, they feel like there's no way they could find anyone else, or they feel like, well, it depends when they're breaking up, but some older folks I'm working with really might not be able to find partners.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That's right. Or I don't want to be with you. I don't want to be with you, but I'm more afraid of being alone than being with someone I'm happy with. And that's interesting, that sometimes...”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Be quite resistant. And those are the ones that then are usually more deep-seated and might have trauma connected to it, might have other kinds of relational experiences or wounds from childhood that they're not even conscious are connected to that narrative or that belief. So that's where you start to unpack the deeper.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“To normalize differences and maybe learn some skills and how do you manage differences, right? And they might then change a narrative that were not so not compatible. We don't have to break up or we shouldn't have gotten together in the first place. And sometimes that will happen fairly rapidly, almost like a cognitive process, because part of offering alternative narratives is a cognitive process, but then other times people are very wedded to certain narratives that goes way back. And it can be grounded into family dynamics. It could be grounded into kind of more racial or gender or class or sexual orientation narratives. So often I will find that as I begin to do narrative therapy very early on by starting to deconstruct how they're saying a problem exists and the stories and so forth, some things will shift fairly rapidly, but some”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It depends because some of the things let's say we have a communication problem as a couple and then I say tell me what you mean by communication problem and give me each of your versions because they could be different. And let's say they say, well, what really they mean by communication problem is you like Chinese food and I like hamburgers. So see we're not compatible. We shouldn't be together. So sometimes what they mean is we have a communication problem because he's too different from me and we just can't make it work. And then because differences are bad and differences mean we're not compatible. So let's say an alternative narrative is actually differences are to be expected. They're not bad. And actually even differences could be complementary. They don't have to be not compatible. You start to unpack how they feel certain differences mean that we really shouldn't be together and that perhaps it means that we need to be.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That's right. Maybe we'll have sex four times a month each by each model, you know. But truly to give people alternative narratives. That actually can depathologize them, I think, is a real gift to narrative and a narrative approach.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It depends on the narrative. Some narratives, when I think about transforming narratives, for some people it means dropping one. Many times it could mean replacing one. Like even with the idea of, let's say, without sexual desire, we're a broken couple. The narratives were a broken couple, one or both of us don't feel desire. So we can't have sex. Well, if they begin to be even educated that there are these other models way beyond these older models that don't include desire as a starting point for sex, that narrative can begin to be dropped and replaced. So there's some couples who leave therapy with me that even can joke about it. They could say, well, what narrative are we going to do this week, honey? Are we doing masters in Johnson? Are we doing Helen Singer Kaplan? Are we doing Joanne Lulen? Are we doing Rosemary Bessell? And they can joke about it and be fluid about it.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Beyond blue and pink and Jean-Mal passed one of my good friends actually who leads the gender project at Ackerman Family Institute. Talks a lot about the blue and the pink because there's so many people who have given the opportunity to be open-minded and to know that there's nothing wrong with it would live much more on the continuum as it relates to gender, whether it's gender expression or whether it's truly how they would identify if they had a choice. And more people are. I think the changes with the trans movement is educating people that they're more than two ways to experience gender.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That's right. Parents begin to treat the kids differently right away, and kids, it's fascinating to watch children even in the most gender open places. They get gender very early on. Like some boys would say they'd never wear a pink shirt. You know, it's like, what's wrong with pink?”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, scientifically, we would say there's, well, I don't know if we'd use the term gender technically. Some people use the word sex for whatever secondary sexual or genetic makeups we are. I don't know if you know Anne Fausto Sterling's work from Brown University. She's retired now, but she made an argument that there's more than two genders genetically. I mean, scientifically, and if you look in the animal kingdom, you know, some animals actually shift gender, some fish, you know, et cetera. So what is gender? Gender, though, as opposed to sex anatomical or what you're born with or what some trans activists would say is what we're assigned at birth, is that gender is socially constructed. And so that part of the argument is, you know, what do we assume to have to be once we're born? That's one of the first identifiers, boy or girl. It's a boy, it's a girl, right?”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Be able to be more assertive and be able to, you know, women can lead, be a CEO of a company. We don't have to worry that you can't handle it. She can be a mother and be a leader. But we see even now even more contemporary society. We still are burdened with. We haven't had a female president in this country yet, really. And I think partly that is gender scripting about women and being able to be leaders and how many men can really express their vulnerabilities. I think there's still some men that feel like they would be harmed by being that sensitive. So it does play out. But I think that people have pushed against it. I think the feminist movement has helped. I think also I think the trans movements really helped because that's sort of throwing gender up in the air and saying what's gender anyway isn't that socially constructed in many ways.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think it really is variable. I think that is another one of those gender scripts that, you know, all stereotypes usually have a little bit of truth in them. Men certainly aren't raised, I don't think. Even now, unfortunately, I don't think men are raised to feel like you can really be a man and be masculine and manly and be sensitive and vulnerable and share your feelings. And some women put that burden on men. It's not always men putting that burden on men, like the men have to go when they have to be at the bar and say how many people did they have sex with this week. Some men have to do that to each other. They one-up one each other. But some women actually make it hard for men to be more vulnerable. So I do think there are some gender, and there's some gender scripts or assumptions that women are emotional messes and, you know, can't contain themselves and aren't tough, right? I'm old enough to remember the feminist movement making a big change in that department that freed women.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Sexual men. I don't like being the initiator all the time, but I feel like my wife or my girlfriend would think I'm less of a man, or she might not be as attracted to me if I don't always initiate. But personally, I would be happier. That might be a big secret he has to tell me individually, that hopefully I could bring into the couple therapy and talk about. And then maybe that woman actually wouldn't mind sharing it too, but she felt he's not there's so many secrets that couples could be burdened with and they don't share it with each other and they could be under false kind of assumptions that the partner really needs to maintain a certain type of gender script that actually they can be more fluid about.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And feminists have said that the feminist movement was like they wanted more sexual agency. They want to be able to call their shots. And if they're with men, they'd like their men to be able to submit or surrender and to be able to play with power in a way and for them to feel it. Some women love strapping it on and doing their men anally if they would let them. There could be all these different kinds of ways to play with power. And I think initiation is, there's power in both positions though. I don't think just the person who initiates really has more power. Some people might argue it's actually the person who's seducing the other or plays the other part that has power. But there are gendered scripts and some people buy into those unconsciously and it doesn't work for them. And one of the secrets they may share with me might be this isn't working for me. Some men, let's say, might say to me alone.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And then what happens in the gay milk couple? I have no idea. Yeah, two males right now. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think it really is, probably most sex therapists would say it's more socially constructed than biologically determined, even though, yes, cisgendered men have more testosterone in their systems than cisgendered women, let's say. There's a hormonal difference, which can”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Have reciprocal sex every time you do it, that's also a burden. Many couples don't have sex because one of the partners may not want to, let's say, be up for an orgasm or even be able to experience arousal that easily. So they might opt out and have nothing. And wouldn't it be great if one person would pleasure the other one, that could be complete that night. And doesn't have to mean everybody has orgasms both time, but everybody even gets aroused at the same level both times. So to be able to be more fluid that way is a real resource for couples.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So many times I'll say to people, look, you have at least three different models out there, narratives, what sex is. You could say desire ending an orgasm. That's the more traditional one. Okay, nothing wrong with it if it works for you, great. If it works for both you, great. But there are two other ones. One starts with willingness and ends with pleasure, and another one starts with like a willingness, Besson would say, but ends in satisfaction, which could mean like connection, like emotional connection. So some partners could say, I had a great time with sex Saturday night, and I'd say, good, tell me about it. They didn't get aroused, they didn't have an orgasm. They touched, they did a lot of touching, kissing, hugging. Maybe their partner got aroused. Maybe their partner came. And for them, the enjoyment and the true kind of pleasure, as Emily might say, right, to see their partner be pleasured and have an orgasm. So also we talk about in the work that you don't have to always have.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“It could be physical intimacy? It could be intimacy, it could be connection. Rosemary Basson, the Canadian woman whose work is so really paradigm shifting, her and one of her end goals, she would say, is more like satisfaction, but it's not just physical or sexual satisfaction. It can be emotional satisfaction.”
2020-02-04 · The Knowledge Project with Shane Parrish · #75 Suzanne Iasenza: Rewriting Relationship Narratives · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT