Colum Eastwood
Foyle · Social Democratic and Labour Party · Northern Ireland
“Thank you, Mr Speaker. Given the fact that the Good Friday Agreement envisages an Assembly, a power-sharing Executive, North/South Ministerial Council and other bodies, is it the case, today, that, if we do not have the nominating officer here from Sinn Féin, no Executive will be formed?”
“Mr Allister has made my point for me. The Good Friday Agreement is absolutely 100% clear. The power-sharing Executive, the Northern Ireland Assembly, the North-South Ministerial Council: at any point over the last 1,000-plus days, those institutions could have been restored. People on these Benches have tried hard.”
“That is why we are here today. We will gladly take part in those institutions but we will not be party to a stunt that is using and abusing people's emotions and sensitivities over a very difficult issue, which could have been dealt with at any point over the last 1,000 days.”
“<BR /> <BR />Is it the case, Mr Speaker, that without Members here present to my right or who should be to my right that there will not be an Executive formed today? If that is the case, we will be in no position to support a Speaker and allow for the undermining of the Good Friday Agreement through a unionist-dominated shadow Assembly.”
“<BR /> <BR />It is, of course, true that because of the DUP's despicable and disgraceful behaviour, not just around RHI, we have got to this point. It is also true that they were let do all those things. They were allowed to do all those things.”
“We put the papers in on all manner of subjects, topics and areas, but nobody wanted to negotiate back. Nobody wanted to talk to us about how we can invest in the Irish language, protect equality for LGBT people and tackle poverty and discrimination right across our society.”
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“The Minister has committed to putting some money into road safety, but he will have to be very creative about how he gets the message out because very little money was left in the pot after it was raided. It is clear that local government has been affected. Poorer councils will be affected — in my council, it will be to the tune of hundreds of thousands — because of the different cuts and different grants from central government. We have to be mindful that we can all play politics in our local area, but when a cut comes as a result of a cut from central government, that is where the issue is.”
“There are many reasons why rates go up and down, but when you send a cut to councils — not all councils will have seen it because of the rates support grant — they have to decide whether to cut services, maintain services or increase rates. Unfortunately, at times, they really have very little choice but to increase rates. It is worse for some places than for others, and, hopefully, there will be some mitigation. <BR /> <BR />Somebody has done a nice little graph showing where the money has gone and where it has increased. Clearly, the DOE's budget has taken the largest hit. Mr Weir is right: it affects road safety. As we look at the Budget now, there is no money whatsoever for road safety, whereas, last year, I think that £2·2 million was spent on road safety.”
“In large part, it has to be passed on to local government. That is —”
“You caught me by surprise, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker. I, too, congratulate you on your elevation. I do not think that I have had the opportunity yet to do so. I wish you luck in your role in the future. <BR /> <BR />This has been well debated and the arguments well made, so I do not propose to go through all of them again; I will focus on a couple of particulars. I want to pick up on something that Mr McCrea said about Mid Ulster. I have a lot of family in Mid Ulster, but I am no expert in how the rates process was set and what the money is being spent on. However, it is a bit disingenuous to say that the DUP voted against a rates increase that, like a lot of other rates increases, will be, in large part, due to the cut being made to the Environment Department, which has to be passed on somewhere.”
“Aside from upgrades of facilities, can the Minister tell us how much money has been given to clubs for general grounds maintenance and pitch maintenance?”
“Thanks. The Member points out that single tier might lead to more taxis. I do not know whether that is true, but the point that I made about you not being able to get a taxi is not based on there not being enough taxis. It is because not enough of them can stop and pick people up. The problem is empty taxis driving past people, not that there are not enough taxis.”
“I hope that, after today, we can begin a sensible conversation about how we move forward.”
“The weight of public opinion and of all those who are interested in the issue is with the Minister. Public hire taxi firms have the right to be angry and annoyed, and they have lobbied very strongly, but public opinion is with the Minister on the issue. It is a shame that, if people in the House get their way, we will not move towards a single-tier system, a system that makes sense for all the reasons that I have outlined. After today, we need to consider seriously how people can move around this city easily, a city that tells everybody that tourism is a major growth sector for it. It is bizarre that we now tell people that it is very difficult to get around the city, and that is what we are advertising today. <BR /> <BR />I am against the motion, and I support the Minister.”
“The airport recently changed its system and has moved to one that allows for more private hire than public hire. The Member is right on that point. However, my point stands: if it is private hire, members of the public should still be able to flag down a taxi as they walk out of the airport, as you would in any airport in any other place in Ireland, Britain or the world. We have to understand that it is a strange system, and the Minister is trying to simplify it. <BR /> <BR />There has also been strong support for the proposals from Disability Action and other disability groups, because they recognise that the regulations on wheelchair access are 30 years out of date. They need to be updated very quickly. <BR /> <BR />Some of us can probably predict what will happen with the vote. That is unfortunate.”
“You can also just flag down a taxi in any other place in Northern Ireland. The Minister is attempting to bring Belfast and the North into line with the rest of the world, where visitors from different countries can easily get around the city. Tourism is a major part of the growth potential for this city and the whole of the North. If tourists do not know how to get around the city, the system is not the best. That is highlighted most starkly when you get off a plane at Belfast City Airport. It is strange that you cannot walk outside and get a taxi. The new system means that you have to ring somebody, which, I think, tourists do not understand. I think that what the Minister proposes is a fairly simplified —”
“I can only imagine that that is the same in Belfast. <BR /> <BR />The regulations simplify a very complex system that most who have to use do not really understand. I know from experience of trying to get a taxi in Belfast that it is quite difficult, especially if you are leaving a pub or nightclub. It seems almost impossible at times to get to where you are going because you have to phone a taxi and wait for it to come, whereas, in any other place in the world, you can just flag a taxi down.”
“<BR /> <BR />For members of the Committee who live outside Belfast, it is important that we remind people that there is life outside Belfast. There are operations and systems outside Belfast that work perfectly well. Looking in on it, some of us view the system in Belfast as kind of strange, to say the least. I have been contacted, as I am sure other Members have, by the North West Taxi Proprietors, an organisation well known to some Members. They have clearly stated their support for a single tier. They said that they have invested heavily because they believed that the issue had been resolved. They also clearly support metering and a fairer and more uniform system of charging across the system — I understand that, because the public in the place that I know best, Derry, definitely support that.”
“Thank you, Mr Speaker. You caught me by surprise there. I will speak against the motion and in support of the Minister. This has been an ongoing saga. We have been through it quite a bit. It has been over and back, and people have been lobbied by different organisations on all sides of the debate. I think it fair to say that there are strongly held views on all sides. <BR /> <BR />A number of years ago, the Department did some consultation work and research, and talked to the public about their view on the issue. It turned out that 84% of those surveyed supported the Department's proposals. The Consumer Council, Disability Action, Women's Aid, Victim Support, Belfast Chamber of Commerce, the Northern Ireland Hotels Federation, Pubs of Ulster and Visit Belfast supported them.”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. Some people would say that, even if we do meet the targets, we are still not meeting the real number that we need to build across the North, and, in my constituency in particular, that is very stark. Some people suggest we could alleviate that by allowing and supporting the Housing Executive to find creative ways of borrowing money or whatever to build new houses. Does the Minister have a view on that?”
“I thank the Minister for her answers thus far. Given the recent proposals on the reduction of Departments and the rejigging of the Executive, are there any plans to move the social investment fund to a Department that many people felt it should have been in before — a Department that has direct responsibility for disadvantage in our communities?”
“Will the Minister inform the House how many letters he has received since he took office — I am not sure on what date that was — asking for the Union flag to be shown on the driver's licence?”
“I thank the Member for giving way. The Member and other Members of his party have talked quite a bit about the right to have the Union flag on the driving licence. Can the Member point me to any international law that says that you have that right?”
“— it is for all of us, and it is about parity of esteem.”
“<BR /> <BR />The DUP has had the Environment Ministry. Maybe it was before my time, but I do not remember previous Environment Ministers looking to have the Union flag on driving licences here. Why can you not just be a bit more generous and understand that it is easier for you? By the way, the word "UK" is in big letters in the European Union flag on the driving licence. I do not necessarily like that, but that is how it is, and we accept it. Why do you then need to shove it down people's throats even more by putting the Union flag on it? This issue has been created by UKIP in Britain and acquiesced in by the Tory party, and the DUP and the Ulster Unionists are jumping all over it. You need to learn the lesson and understand that equality is not just for me or just for you —”
“Instead of upping the ante all the time, creating antagonism and encouraging your supporters to be angry, why not try to be more confident in your position? Let them know that the Union is safe until I and people like me can persuade enough people to change the constitutional status quo. That is a position that we have accepted, a position that Sinn Féin has accepted and a position that the nationalist people across Ireland have accepted. We have accepted that we cannot change the constitutional position of Northern Ireland until we persuade enough people to do that. Surely that is a victory. Can you not claim that as a victory? Instead, you wind up your supporters by putting out 40,000 leaflets, and you create mayhem. You create an issue about drivers' licences that nobody was talking about before.”
“Do we want to do this again? I do not understand unionism sometimes. Maybe I do not understand it a lot of the time, but I try my best. The Ulster Unionists and the DUP got the SDLP and Sinn Féin to support and vote for the flying of the Union Jack — the Union flag — over Belfast City Hall for the same number of days as it flies over this Building, by the way. You did not claim victory; instead, you claimed defeat. It always happens. You told your supporters that they were losing something and that their identity was being eroded, when, in fact, you had nationalists voting to support a flag to which we have no allegiance being flown over Belfast City Hall in the same way as it is flown here.”
“Do you want to listen? It is not just your sensitivities but everybody's sensitivities. The idea that your identity has somehow been eroded or the fact that we are part of the UK — unfortunately, in my opinion — has been eroded —”
“You would never sign a petition of concern about anything. <BR /> <BR />We believe that this is about equality. The word "equality" has been bandied about by DUP spokespersons today. It is good to hear that they are now on the equality side of the argument. We believe that equality is not about shoving things down people's throats. It is not about making people feel like second-class citizens in their own area. That is what we have done for far too long in this part of the world. <BR /> <BR />I am delighted to hear DUP Members quoting the Good Friday Agreement to us. If that means that they are now supporters of the Good Friday Agreement, that is a very good thing. That agreement talks about acknowledging the sensitivity of the use of symbols and emblems for public purposes, acknowledging the sensitivities, not just your —”
“As far as I know, the timing of that announcement came from DfT; it was not from the Minister here. <BR /> <BR />The crux of the matter is, and it is interesting —”
“We are back here again. We have spent a few hours debating the Budget, which many of us have difficulties with, but we will not go into that again. We are living in a situation where serious austerity is being brought down on our people. We have issues with the health service, education, joblessness and emigration, but tonight we are talking about a very important issue: whether we can put a flag on a small driving licence. I just do not understand it. This place has a credibility problem. Every time we have a debate like this, we end up making it worse. <BR /> <BR />People on the opposite Benches have lauded the Stormont House Agreement. Part of that agreement was to set up a commission to look at all these issues. It will be set up, I think, before the summer.”
“I promoted you there. I thank the Member for giving way. The rates support grant is there to look after the poorest councils, which, by the way, happen to be largely in the west of the North. I do not know why that is. Will the Member agree that, if we cut that grant, we will end up hitting long-suffering families and long-suffering businesses with rates hikes or will end up having to cut services drastically in those areas? That is no way to go about reviving our economy.”
“Will the Minister give way? Will the Member give way?”
“I thank the Minister for his answers thus far. Given the importance of street lighting in deterring antisocial behaviour, has the Minister done any studies to find out what impact the cuts have had on antisocial behaviour and public safety in general?”
“I wish that the Member, instead of jumping up and down on his high horse, looking at his faulty crystal ball, would wait until May, examine the report and join all of us in a proper, informed debate about where we go next.”
“Thanks. I will probably not need it, Mr Speaker. Thanks for your intervention, Mr Wilson, but I do not think that the terms of reference say that we are just going to take one part of it. They do not say that we are going to look just at fuel poverty or at air quality; they say that we are going to look at all of it. That makes perfect sense. It also makes perfect sense to do it in an all-Ireland way, as the air that we breathe and the water that we drink are all related. The air that we breathe is the most obvious, since the border makes no impact on it. Therefore we should examine it in an all-Ireland way. I for one am prepared to wait until May to make up my mind.”
“However, we have to make a balanced decision; we have to make a decision based on all those factors, as well as factors of air pollution. We know that smoky coal, however you want to describe it, is not the only thing that contributes to air pollution, but we know that it does. We have to take all the evidence on board. High numbers of people across the North and across this island die because of air pollution every year. We need to examine that. I say it again: we need to examine the facts. Go ahead.”
“Then we can have a debate that might be a little bit more informed, rather than an hour and a half late on a Tuesday evening without even having a report that any of us can read. <BR /> <BR />I recognise that there are grave concerns. The Member obviously has concerns in his constituency. We all know that. We have concerns in ours. The Foyle Port in Derry is heavily reliant on the import of coal, and many people are employed in that industry. I do not think that anybody will take a decision that would jeopardise that. We are also very aware of fuel poverty issues. All of us deal with people every day who are in fuel poverty. I think that some of the Executive's decisions could do a whole lot more to alleviate some of those issues.”
“Unfortunately for some of us, the Minister in the Republic does not have jurisdiction over this part of the world. I wish he did — maybe some day he will — but he does not. It is not a decision that this Minister or any other Minister from this Executive can be held accountable for. The whole premise of the motion is wrong. The idea that the Minister has made up his mind, made a decision and made a proposal — none of that is correct. It is good that we can have this debate, but let us have it in an informed way. Let us have it after the report has been published, when we can all have a proper opportunity in the Committee, the House and the Department to examine it and go through it.”
“I am good friends with the Minister, and I am on the Environment Committee and have spoken to the Minister about this issue many times. I do not think that the Minister has a position on this issue yet, because, like the rest of us, like the proper organs of the House — the Assembly Chamber and the Environment Committee — he is waiting for the results of this report. As any parliament, any assembly or any legislature should do, we should take the report and examine it and either take on its findings or throw its findings out without implementing them. We have to have some respect for the democratic institutions that we are all in, and let us make a decision in the proper way. <BR /> <BR />It is interesting that the Member has also said that the Minister in the Republic has made his mind up.”
“I am not sure how he can come to that conclusion. Maybe he was using the crystal ball that he used to write some of the Budgets that got us into the black hole that we are in. He has also called:”
“I am very interested in the motion and in Mr Wilson's psychic powers, which have been on display today and in the writing of the motion. When I sat down to read it, it was kind of strange to understand how it even got to the Floor of the House. I know that he has pre-empted this attack, because he has obviously realised his mistake. I do not know how he can say:”
“Could I ask the Minister a question that might matter to some people in Northern Ireland? Jobs were lost in the DVA, and promises were made by all the Ministers at the Executive table to decentralise other jobs and bring them to that area. How many jobs were decentralised and by which Departments?”
“We have put jobs in Derry; we have decentralised jobs to our city. We recognise that they are not new jobs. However, we also recognise that hundreds of people with no quality of life whatsoever leave our city on the 6.00 am bus to Belfast to take up positions in the Civil Service. If we can get to the point where the DARD jobs go to your constituency, Mr Campbell, it would be fantastic for the people travelling to Belfast at the minute. We need to see more of that; we need to see a commitment by all Departments not only to announcing things but to doing them. The SDLP will continue to decentralise whatever jobs we can to our city and to any city or area that has high economic inactivity. Of course, Derry is at the wrong end of that league table.”
“Our Ministers, even if we have only one, have a long track record of bringing jobs to Derry, whether it is this Minister, Alex Attwood, Margaret Ritchie or Mark Durkan.”
“Let us see the Executive as a whole — we will play our part — come out and support the development of Magee to at least 10,000 students and get moving on the A5 and A6. <BR /> <BR />I gladly support the Sinn Féin amendment on decentralisation. I will recommit our party, because Mr Campbell asked me to do so, to the decentralisation of the DARD jobs. We give that 100% support. However, the SDLP does not just say things; it actually does them. When the DVA jobs went and all Ministers said they would do their best to put some jobs in Coleraine, the only Department that did so was the Department of the Environment. I am not just saying that because the Minister is sitting beside me.”
“If this ministerial subgroup or task force does anything, we will see what the Minister said, which is a commitment to the expansion of Magee to at least 10,000 students within the next CSR period. <BR /> <BR />The One Plan has been talked about. It was a great example of how people would get together and use all the economic and social data to ensure that we had ideas for change in our city to turn it around. Everybody bought into it. I was there when Peter Robinson and Martin McGuinness came down to launch it, and it was great. However, we did not see any of those things being put into the Programme for Government. That is why we are still not there. We are now saying that we will look at the next CSR period. I think that it is too late, but we do not have too much choice at this stage, so I will gladly give that my support.”
“Limerick, Galway and Belfast recognise that the only way to develop an economy is to ensure that you have enough students doing the right courses, courses that are market-related and can attract jobs into the city and encourage entrepreneurs to set up and employ people. It is not that complicated. <BR /> <BR />This is not a whinge, as some people would have it; this is a plea for common sense. The only way that we can deliver on the promises in the Executive's economic strategy that Derry and Belfast would be the two economic drivers for the North is by investing in skills and infrastructure. It is recognised worldwide as a way of developing and creating jobs in any city or town. It makes perfect sense.”
“Derry is probably the only city in Ireland that does not have a motorway entering it from any direction. How can we say that we are committed to developing the economy in the north-west if we do not commit to developing properly and significantly the motorway infrastructure and the university infrastructure? <BR /> <BR />It is nearly 50 years since the Lockwood report made a sectarian decision to put the University of Ulster at Coleraine. I am not saying that just because it is 50 years ago and it is an old complaint that we are always making. That wrong has never been righted. We still have far too few university students at Magee. Everybody recognises that.”
“I am glad to support the constituency of West Tyrone. It is a bit difficult to include Omagh in the north-west; it depends on how wide we want to go. We did not put Donegal in either, but maybe we should have. <BR /> <BR />What have the Southern Government done to encourage outside investment? We talked about corporation tax, but they have also developed their motorway network and their universities and skills. The only place on the whole of this island that has not seen that investment has been its north-west corner, including north-east Donegal. North-east Donegal, Derry, Strabane and Limavady do not have the inward investment that is required. Why do we not have it? We do not have the university expansion that is so desperately needed, nor do we have the motorway connection.”
“We have to get angry. It is not about whingeing or complaining; it is about trying to get people to sit up and do something. It is very simple. This is the positive bit: we need to invest in infrastructure and skills. It is that simple.”
“I am glad that he is nodding and has said that he is as angry as I am.”
“I can show him any number of press releases in which I have welcomed jobs announcements for our city and I would be glad to do that again. However, I will also release press statements when we see the figures stacking up in Belfast and not in Derry and when there are 5,000 jobs announcements for Belfast and 50 in our city. The Member across the Chamber should be as angry as I am about it.”
“It is about time that we recognised that there is a problem, and if you recognise that there is problem, you have to do something about it. The meetings should be fairly short, because we all know the answers. We are not up here complaining that we do not have enough jobs in Derry because everybody is out to get us and that it is all everybody else's fault. We understand what the issues are. I know that Mr Campbell said that we like to complain, but it is not about complaining. I would far rather be up here welcoming jobs for our city and for my friends and people who I know well. I would far rather not have to leave people off at airports to travel all round the world to find work.”
“We need to ensure that our young people can stay, study in our city and get a job in our city and do not have to join the dole queue or the security queue at Belfast airport or City of Derry Airport to get out of here to find work. We need to ensure that that is a thing of the past. <BR /> <BR />This is not about being negative, but it has been outlined by other Members who spoke that we find ourselves in a very difficult situation in our city. We have had a fantastic couple of years with festivals and events; the City of Culture and everything else. However, the stark reality remains that we have the highest level of unemployment in any Westminster constituency and we need to begin to do something about it. <BR /> <BR />I want to recognise and welcome the ministerial subgroup.”
“However, it is also particularly sad when you have to leave those people back to the airport, and during the week after, when you see a lot fewer people you know from school and a lot fewer people are in and around the town, as they just do not live in our city any more. <BR /> <BR />That it is a very stark reminder to all of us of the number of people, young people in particular, who have had to leave our city and our shores to find work and a better life. It is an indictment on all of us that that is still the situation and is still a very stark reality for my generation. We all need to put our shoulder to the wheel to change that reality.”