Ng Kah Ting
Singapore
“Mr Speaker, Sir, before I ask my supplementary question, may I declare, on behalf of the Member for Kebun Baru and myself, that we are both involved in the building of Montfort Secondary School and Montfort Junior School both of which are Government-aided schools. My question now, Sir, is: when will this take effect?”
“But, Sir, at the end of this debate on the Second Reading and the Bill committed to a Select Committee, I sincerely hope that all those who have the interest of Singapore at heart should come forward and make their contributions, be they critical or ways and means on how better we can improve upon this Bill.”
“But the basic foundation, I submit, and that is, the political stability-honest, efficient and an incorruptible political leadership-is paramount to the future well-being of Singapore, and that is, if we are to continue to enjoy our good standard of living, our good government and of course as an independent, sovereign entity or nation.”
“Sir, I knew that the NCMP would come out and say that-don't mix up the ISA with PPSO because basically it is the same. I say, no. Because in 1958, PAP was not in power. It was the Lim Yew Hock government. That is the difference I am trying to make. So let us not go around in this wild political rhetoric. I understand that.”
“Sir, before I make my observations, I just want to make a couple of points in reply to the Non-Constituency MP, Dr Lee. He said that in 1958 when he was asked to stand as a PAP candidate in Kallang he was afraid of the ISA. I do not think that is quite correct because in 1958, Sir, there was no ISA.”
“We should take advantage of the present political stability to provide for the future. In conclusion, Sir, let me draw an analogy. With Singapore being the No. 1 port in the world, this analogy is not inappropriate.”
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Every one of 1,870 lines we hold for Ng Kah Ting, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 34 of 38.
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, That the sum to be allocated for Head 63 be reduced by the whole sum in respect of subhead 104. Sir, I would also like to range over amendment (2)* which stands in my name. * Amendment No. (2) reads as follows: That the sum to be allocated for Head 63 be reduced by the whole sum in respect of subhead 105. Sir, while I am in full agreement that the Central Abattoir in Jurong is needed for the slaughtering of animals for the meat canning factory there, I shall be grateful if the Minister for Law and National Development will look into the inconvenience caused to butchers in the rural areas who have to go all the way to Jurong to have their animals slaughtered, especially pigs. This will result in extra expenditure which will have to be borne by the consumer. 6.15 p.m. Under subhead 105, Rural Abattoirs, a provision of a token vote of $10 is made. I would urge the Minister to make full use of this token vote to press for the building of rural abattoirs. Sir, in rural areas or constituencies like Upper Serangoon, Changi, Tampines, or, for that matter, Punggol - Paya Lebar to be included, Sir - the butchers face much difficulty. This is the point we must understand, and where a token vote is provided for, we should make full use of it. Much representation has been made by the butchers, especially those in Punggol and Upper Serangoon. but I am sad to say that they seem to have fallen on deaf ears. With this token vote for rural abattoirs, I hope the Minister will press that there is a need ---”
“Sir, I thank the Minister for his reply and I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.”
“Sir, I beg to move, That the sum to be allocated for Head 62 be reduced by $10 in respect of subhead 201. Sir, I wish the Minister can explain why the $300,000 has to be revoted for when there was none last year or this year, and the number of car parks that will be built and their locations.”
“I beg leave to withdraw. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn. The sum of $303,600 for Head 56 ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates. Head 58 -”
“Agreed. I think it is a pure waste of public funds, since we have heard earlier in the day that certain Ministries are not able to obtain more funds.”
“Do you want to sink so much money into one fountain when so many Ministers are getting up to say-”
“When my colleague the Member for Choa Chu Kang pointed out that the Tivoli Fountains can be considered as one of the wonders of the world --- An hon. Member: Why cannot we build one ---”
“No. I disagree with all the points he has raised, except one, and that is to beautify Singapore. Yes, to beautify Singapore but to what extent of the public expenditure? Do you want to spend $138,000 on one fountain and when my colleague [Interruption] ---”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, That the sum to be allocated for Head 56 be reduced by the whole sum in respect of subhead 301*. * The same amendment also stood in the name of Mr Tang See Chim Sir, this item is for a water fountain to be installed in a lake. I would like to know where this fountain is to be located. Firstly, I would have thought that there are no lakes in Singapore, but we do have ponds and reservoirs. Secondly, why is it necessary to build such a costly fountain? Would it serve as a tourist attraction? And would not the amount of $138,000 be better utilised for the benefit of the community?”
“Sir, I beg leave to withdraw. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn. The sum of $481,300 for Head 55 ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates.”
“I think the Parliamentary Secretary is very confused over my suggestion. I was saying that suppose a community centre has some vacant space, would his department consider putting up a playground there? The problem that I can foresee is probably the question of ownership of that ground. Then the Parliamentary Secretary might say, "Look, if the Social Affairs Department puts a playground there and also looks after it, then it is the property of the Social Affairs Department." But I say: for the benefit of the community, fqrget these little technicalities, and grant these facilities.”
“Sir, the Parliamentary Secretary has answered only one point of the three points I have raised. I want to know the number of playgrounds built this year and the number that will be built next year. But if he can provide supplementary information at a later stage, I will be grateful to him. He has not answered my question as to whether it will be possible to include a children's playground in a community centre if there is enough space.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, That the sum to be allocated for Head 55 be reduced by the whole sum in respect of subhead 104.* Sir, I would like the Minister or his Parliamentary Secretary to inform the House of the number of children's playgrounds that have been built this year and the number that will be built next year. Why is there a necessity for a revote of $40,400? I have a suggestion to make. Is it not possible to include some playgrounds in community centres if there is enough space?”
“Sir, I do not wish to press my point further. I beg leave to withdraw.”
“Sir, I quite appreciate what the Minister for Education has just explained, but there is a relationship that I am trying to point out. You have the vocational institute, but you also have the vocational school to give the primary school-leavers - the failures, so to say - more training. But he says that there is a lack of funds to carry out such a project. I remember well the phrase "Spring source of the Nation" and also the words "Education is the best form of investment a country can have." These are our policy statements. But as to the lack of more funds, I hope the Minister for Education will try to persuade his colleague, the Minister for Finance, to give the necessary funds to carry out such a project, so that our young children will benefit. You do not have to throw out our projects just because of a lack of funds!”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, That the total sum to be allocated for Head 22 be reduced by $100. It is indeed gratifying to note that there will be piovision for more vocational institutes to be built, and also the need to pay for land acquisition in respect of sites for vocational institutes. Therefore, I would ask the Minister for Education whether there will be other vocational institutes, apart from those mentioned in the various subheads, to be built and, if so, their locations. Realising the important part played by vocational training, will the Minister consider increasing the period of vocational training which it now provides? In this light, I would suggest that a four-year vocational training period be implemented, i.e., to provide the necessary know-how in respect of skilled labour, or technical know-how which is urgently required in our industrialisation scheme and in the various trades too. I notice that the vocational institutes provide a two-year course of training for primary school-leavers, especially those who do not make the grade for academic or technical secondary training. I think a two-year course is barely sufficient to enable a 14-year old child to be able to pick up the necessary skill or know-how. I think if the four-year scheme were to be implemented, it would not only tremendously benefit the students looking fo: jobs in the labour market, but also the public. 3.45 p.m.”
“Sir, I am satisfied with the Minister's explanation regarding primary and secondary schools. I beg leave to withdraw my amendment. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn. The sum of $5,937,120 for Head 21 ordered to stand part of the Development Estimates. Head 22 -”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, That the total sum to be allocated for Head 21 be reduced by $100.+ + The same amendment also stood in the name of Mr Teong Eng Siong. Sir, I take it that this head deals with the building programme of both primary and secondary schools. But I notice that under primary schools the three items have to be revoted. I shall be grateful if the Minister can explain these revotes. What are the schools? Are they for existing schools or are the schools in the process of being replaced, and what are the new schools? Coming down we have the secondary schools. I would like to inquire as to the number of new schools that will be built and where these schools will be located. Also, is the number of schools, both primary and secondary, sufficient to meet the ever increasing school population demand, not forgetting that more and more students are going into the pre-university classes?”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, this question was debated on the 30th of December, 1965. The Hansard Volume is No. 24, issue No. 14, col. 788 when I moved the Development Estimates then. I quote: 'I would like to urge that the plan to build an Adult Education Centre be speeded up,...'. I went on to say something about the Adult Education Board for which a bouquet was in turn handed back to me by the Minister of State for Education. Today, I am indeed greatly disturbed to hear that such a plan for adult education purposes has to be shelved because of its low priority. I shall be very grateful if the Minister will elaborate on why this plan has to be dropped.”
“Sir, I beg leave to withdraw. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.”
“Sir, I well remember that when I was debating on this particular topic some time ago, the Minister of State for Education was painting a very good picture of what the Adult Education Centre would be and today ---”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I think the Minister has not answered my last point on the Adult Education Centre. Can he please oblige?”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, That the sum to be allocated for Head 20 be reduced by the whole sum in respect of subhead 302. Sir, under this item I notice that an Institute of South-east Asian Studies is being proposed. Can the Minister for Education inform this House: (a) What the proposed Institute of South-east Asian Studies is? (b) Why cannot it be organised and run by the History, Political Science, Sociology and other similar Departments of the Singapore and Nanyang Universities? (c) What are the proposals for staffing the institute? Will recruitment of the staff from overseas take place? (d) Has Government explored the possibilities of foreign aid in the way of money and talent for the proposed Institute? Sir, with your permission, can the Minister for Education also explain to this House what progress has been made towards the building of the Adult Education Centre? As I see it, Sir, it is no use coming to Parliament to ask for big sums of money to be voted when the establishment of such an institute cannot be realised.”
“Point of order, Sir. Even before he moves his amendment, the Member has started to debate on it! The Chairman: Mr Teong, I take it that you are withdrawing your amendment?”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, the Minister of Defence has said that the Punggol Point Community Centre is responsible for putting up a chain-link fence. Sir, we all know that it is very costly to put up a chain-link fence. In view of the small monthly subsidies given to community centres, I think the management committees will have to manage within the limited scope of the subsidies granted. The second point refers to the Staff Club House for the People's Association. While acknowledging the good work done by the staff of the People's Association to the community, I would like to ask the Minister (1) where is the Staff Club House to be located? (2) who will be allowed to use it, not forgetting that a good number of the staff are sprinkled all over the community centres in the island? (3) why is it necessary to build it? and last but not least, can we afford it?”
“I would like to say that, inasmuch as we would like to have dozens of community centres in a constituency, there is a limitation of land and funds. As for MacPherson Estate, I have every sympathy with the Member concerned and I will look into the problem.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, you know that land in Singapore is rather limited, and if everyone wants to have a community centre right in front of his doorstep, it is something that is impossible. If a man is really imbued with civic consciousness and is willing to serve the public and, at the same time, wants to enjoy some of the facilities provided by a community centre, a distance of a quarter of a mile to the community centre is nothing. The Member for Anson has said that his community centre is too small for his constituency. I for one would like to see large areas being made available for community centres. But, unfortunately, as the hon. Member knows, there is a limitation of land in Anson and in most constituencies in Singapore, and land is quite costly. It is a question of putting every available piece of land to the best economic use. Similarly with Mountbatten, Mr Speaker, Sir. The present community centre there is sited about a quarter of a mile away from the place which the Member for Mountbatten thinks is a suitable site. I have my doubts, because if we were to spend money on building another community centre in the place indicated by him, in a year or two he would come round and say the same thing, that it is badly sited. So all in all, I think these community centres are sited in the best available spots and they can serve the community there quite well. For the information of the Member for Kampong Kembangan, what the Prime Minister said was not, "Where you have 200 or 300 people in an area, a community centre will be built." I would rather think it is nearer the truth if his statement was 300 or 400 families living in an area.”
“Thank you very much. For the information of the Hon. Minister of Defence, the construction of the centres was carried out in 1961 and I was elected to this House in September 1963. Mr Lim Kim San: Sir, I did not say that the Member for Punggol was consulted. I said the Member of Parliament of the constituency, if there was a Member, or else the sites were decided after the Prime Minister had visited these areas and had come to an agreement with the elders of the villages. Therefore, having sited these centres and having spent the money which was provided by the Ministry of Finance, it would be wasting public money to shift them. As my colleague, the Minister for Finance has said, if they feel that a certain centre is badly sited, they can move it themselves. There are lots of things which they can do themselves. For instance, the residents of Changi themselves built a community centre, and Changi is a rural area. 3.00 p.m. I would like to take up another point brought up by the Member for Punggol and that is the vacant land adjoining the community centre at Punggol Point which can be used to provide better facilities for the community centre. I would say the fault lies with him and his committee, because the People's Association have obtained permission from the owner of the land for its use, subject to the management committee of the community centre building a chain-link fence. They have done nothing so far and, therefore, they cannot make use of the facilities. Mr Speaker, Sir, the Member for Punggol has also said that his community centre is badly sited because it is about a quarter of a mile away from the nearest concentration of population.”
“Sir, since the Minister for Finance has asked us to move the centres ourselves, may I add that Punggol Constituency is a rural constituency and, for that matter, the rural people may be classified as poor people? I think it is the duty of the Minister for Finance to allow funds to be allocated for the building of community centres for the benefit of the community.”
“Thank you, Sir. There is a provision of $60,000 for works and buildings for which $15,500 is asked to be revoted. There is another revote for furniture and equipment. I would like to point out the lack of facilities in my two standard community centres - one is the Punggol Community Centre and the other at Punggol Point. Regarding the Punggol Community Centre, I notice that there is a piece of vacant land near the centre to which facilities can be extended. Similarly, at Pungol Point the centre has been trying to obtain the necessary permission for the adjoining land to be utilised as an added facility. Sir, I hope the Minister concerned will look into this matter. Sir, I now come to the rural community centres. Again the two items are revotes. I wish to talk on the poor siting of some of the rural community centres in my constituency. They are Kampong Sungei Tengah Community centre, Jalan Serangoon Kechil Community Centre and another is located at 7½ m.s. Upper Serangoon Road. In my opinion, these centres are badly sited. No doubt the centres are there, but very few people go there to make use of the facilities. For example, in Jalan Serangoon Kechil the centre is sited in a rubber estate, much to the inconvenience of the people in the kampong which is about a quarter of a mile away and where the population is about a couple of thousand people. I do hope the Minister will take steps to move such centres to suitable sites so that they can be of benefit to the community.”
“I am sorry to interrupt the Minister. It is clearly stated that the fee for the temporary permit is $12 per year for renewal. Formerly it was $2 in the rural areas. Now it is $12 per year. There is an increase.”
“On a point of clarification. Mr Barker resumed his seat.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, can I just pick up two points which the Minister has said? First is the question of quit rent. I said that the bill was a property tax bill and it was $1.92 which was collected until about 1960. From 1961, below $2 no collections were made. This is the point I want to bring home. And I can supply the Minister such bills. The second point is about the transfer of ownership. As I understand it, the question of ownership does not relate very much to the Registry of Titles and Deeds. 6.30 p.m. In this respect, Sir, let me explain. For example, if Mr A wants to apply for transfer of ownership and hw cannot trace the previous owner, he makes out a statutory declaration. Or in another case, if the house was registered under the name of one of his parents who had passed away many years ago, all the brothers and sisters would have to become signatories to that particular statutory declaration which does not bind the Property Tax Division to any liability, to the best of my knowledge. In other words, the registration of ownership only means that the tax on such property will be duly collected by the Property Tax Division. Hence there is no connection between the Registry of Titles and Deeds and the Property Tax Division.”
“Sir, I do not think it was a reduction. As far as I can remember, the property tax bills in respect of temporary huts were made out for at $1.92. I can show the Minister such bills. Then there was an increase to $6. I do not think there was a reduction, Sir.”
“On a point of clarification, Sir. Dr Goh Keng Swee resumed his seat.”
“Or Sembawang, as the case may be, are known as temporary structures with temporary permits. The Inland Revenue Department, through the Property Tax Division, would come along and say, "Look, chum, we will have to assess your property which no doubt is temporary in nature at a high rate." And when we write to the Deputy Commissioner of Property Tax, he would say, "1 am afraid I cannot reduce the annual value. Therefore, you have to pay so much." I hope the Hon. Minister for Finance will sympathetically consider what I have mentioned and also those points raised by my colleague, the Member for Choa Chu Kang.”
“This is no empty talk, as my colleague, the Member for Changi, has stated. The other point, Sir, is my last point. My colleague, the Member for Choa Chu Kang, has mentioned the annual value of property in the rural areas. Bear in mind that most of the houses in the rural areas, whether they are in Changi, Choa Chu Kang, Tampines or Punggol ---”
“Years, my hon, colleague has just mentioned. But I would say years is a bit exaggerated, Sir. I would say it would take months and probably up to a year. My unfortunate part was having to write to the Deputy Commissioner of Property Tax. I have on record in my own file of "Meet the people sessions" copies of such memoranda sent to him and in most cases there was no reply. I am just wondering what this Division is doing. Just to get a house number! A chap who could not get it would come to me and ask, "Please, Mr Ng, can you help?" All right, there goes a copy of my note. No reply. I can dig it up and show it to the Minister himself. I think this is going too far, Sir. Something must be done.”
“The next process would be done at the Property Tax Division, which is a unit in the Department of Inland Revenue. The Property Tax Division would send its own officers to the site and investigate again and find out which number to give. Here is where it is my unfortunate lot to have to bring to the attention of the Deputy Commissioner of Property Tax the fact that there has been undue delay of months.”
“The Member for Choa Chu Kang is of the opinion that it should be demolished, but I would say that if the Minister says, "Go ahead with the demolition of all the unauthorised structures in Choa Chu Kang," I think the Member for Choa Chu Kang will be the first to stand up and say, "Sir, these are the reasons, and on compassionate grounds they should not be demolished, etc., etc.". I think he was probably not attentive during the previous years' Budget debates if he was here. The position is this: you have an unauthorised dwelling house in existence for umpteen years - 10, 15, 20 years - and there is no house number. And as I have mentioned just now, with such social amenities available at the doorstep, the owner of this unauthorised dwelling house comes along and says, "Can I apply for a house number?" But before he does so, he has to make an application for the retention of an existing house, for which a form is supplied by the Chief Building Surveyor. No doubt it does not concern the Ministry of Finance, but somehow it will and I will dwell on it later. This applicant fills up the form and sends it to the Chief Building Surveyor's Department, which is the processing department, because after investigation by their officers a temporary permit will be issued. This temporary permit costs $12 per year and is subject to renewal. 6.15 p.m. Prior to that, Sir, up to 1965, as far as I can remember, the temporary permit was only $2. With effect from last year it was increased to $12 - a 600 per cent increase - for one year to have a temporary permit. Be that as it may, Sir, to obtain a temporary permit sometimes takes a couple of months. That may be the earliest, if not much later.”
“And I take it that the Property Tax Division would come to his assistance. The rural folks now realise that with such amenities available at their doorstep, they can have them, and in order to facilitate such matters the Property Tax Division should come to their assistance. The second point I want to raise is this, and that is in regard to renumbering of houses. I think this issue is not new, it has been brought up in previous Budget sessions, and today I have to bring it up again for the simple reason that some houses in certain areas have been renumbered and some have not. The main reason I was given to understand was that the owner's name, as listed in the register of owners, was different from that of the present, and hence a number could not be given. Of course, in this case the Minister could get a better look at it and say, "Will the Member submit me a list of names and so forth, and I will look up?" I say, Sir, that such cases do exist. With that I come to my third point, and that is the application for a house number. This subject again is not new, and I am sorry I have to trouble the House again with a little bit of detail just to see how a house number applied for would be given. It goes like this. First, you have an unauthorised hut or dwelling house, to put it whatever way you like.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, since this amendment has been moved by my colleague, the Member for Choa Chu Kang, I have also to move my amendment* on the same subhead, but the difference is that my amendment is to reduce the subhead by the whole sum. I should, however, like to speak on the amendment moved by the Member for Choa Chu Kang. * Amendment (2) reads as follows: That the sum to be allocated for Head 0807 be reduced by the whole sum in respect of subhead 1101. Sir, I am fully of the same view as that expressed by him. But I have something more to add, and I hope that the Minister for Finance will look into such matters. First of all, Sir, I refer to the application for transfer of ownership in respect of those who own houses. This concerns my constituency very much. I have had on many occasions received complaints from my constituents, especially those involved in applying for transfer of ownership. If I may trouble the House with a little bit of detail, Sir. Let us say, for example, that Mr A bought a house from Mr B some 15 years ago, and that house has been given a number. Today with the social amenities available to him, for example, electricity and water supplies, Mr A wishes to apply for such services. But unfortunately, Sir, on the property tax bill, the name of the owner is different. In other words, the previous owner's name is given on the bill. Mr A has to make an application to have his name registered in the owner's list. Unfortunately, too, Mr B, who sold the house to Mr A, could not be traced. There arises the complication. Poor Mr A would probably have to make a statutory declaration to the effect that to the best of his knowledge and so on and so forth, he is the sole owner of the house.”
“I am not moving. The sum of $9,028,700 for Head 0804 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I am rather disturbed that the Minister for Finance has not been able to answer the little question that I posed. But it does come under the head "Contributions and Charitable Allowances". In view of the explanation given by the Minister for Finance, I will not press the matter further and I beg leave to withdraw. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, That the sum to be allocated for Head 0804 be reduced by $10 in respect of subhead 2341. Sir, this subhead concerns the Amenities Fund for Students in the United Kingdom. As I understand it, the provision for this year is $31,000 and for next year it is $25,800. I would like to know what sort of amenities our overseas students, especially in the United Kingdom, are accorded, and whether the reduction in the vote will mean a similar reduction in amenities.”
“I want a vote to be taken, Sir. Question on the amendment put, and negatived.”
“When will the report of the Salaries Commission be out, Sir?”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, we have been given a detailed explanation of a system that was instituted by the previous Government and which led to so many anomalies in the salary scales of the teaching profession. Schemes agreed to in January 1953 had retrospective effect to January 1950 -three years and it was known as the Singapore Education Service Scheme. The Minister has just explained that the Ministry is already aware of such a defect in the salary structure and has written to some quarters making representations with a view to rectifying such anomalies. I shall be grateful if he will name the quarters and when this was done.”
“However, I must stress that I am not against these civil servants obtaining any higher pay if they so deserve as a result of being promoted. Therefore, I would like to propose to the Minister for Education that this kind of payment be scrapped and in its place a proper salary structure be instituted so as to give not only uniformity in the salary structure but also opportunities to aspirants to reach the very top rung of the education ladder.”
“Mr Speaker, Sir, 1 beg to move, That the sum to be allocated for Head 0601 be reduced by $10 in respect of subhead 1001+. + The same amendment also stood in the name of Mr. Lim Guan Hoo. Sir, having gone through all the heads of expenditure of the various Ministries in the 1968 Estimates, I am drawn to some curious footnotes that appear on pages 153, 155, 156, 158, 159 and 161 which explain the posts of some of the officers in the Ministry of Education who are drawing, in addition to a salary, certain allowances. For example, a footnote appearing in page 153 states: '(v) In certain cases, holders of these posts draw in addition pensionable allowances of $120, $180, $240, or $300 p.m.'. Sir, I have been trying to find out whether other Ministries have payments of these so-called pensionable allowances. In fact, I believe I can see none. I suppose these so-called pensionable allowances are given to certain officers who have been promoted, say, from the post of teacher to principal, or lecturer, or school inspector, or specialist teacher. If my supposition is correct, I am inclined to believe that the payment of such kind of allowances is far from satisfactory. I would like to know whose brainchild it was to grant such pensionable allowances, and how much it has cost us each year when this system was instituted. Furthermore, is the Minister for Education aware that the other Ministries have no such system of pensionable allowances? To me, Sir, it would appear that any officer in the Ministry of Education who has been promoted, be it to principal, inspector of school, specialist teacher, inspector, or lecturer, would automatically enjoy such benefit in pensionable allowances.”