Michelle McIlveen
Strangford · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“Public confidence depends not only on effective enforcement but on enforcement being exercised fairly and consistently. <BR /> <BR />There is widespread concern across Northern Ireland about the condition of many of our lakes and rivers, and there are a vast number of factors that contribute to water quality challenges.”
“Although we support the overall direction of travel, I think that is appropriate to reflect on the concerns that have been raised and ensure that the legislation is proportionate, practical and capable of delivering its intended outcomes.”
“If we are therefore serious about improving our aquatic environment, every source of pollution must be addressed. New legislative powers are meaningful only if the Department has the resources, the expertise and the personnel necessary to implement them effectively.”
“There is, however, a need for accompanying clear guidance and support and for regulatory consistency and prompt decision-making. Delays, uncertainty and excessive bureaucracy will undoubtedly discourage investment and undermine confidence in the sector.”
“Subordinate legislation should not become a substitute for proper democratic accountability. Consultation and engagement must be undertaken before regulations are introduced, and I cannot overstate the need for stakeholder engagement. <BR /> <BR />I will now talk about the Bill's proposed enforcement powers.”
“The DUP broadly welcomes the Bill. As has been said, it provides an opportunity to modernise legislation that, in some areas, has remained largely unchanged for decades. The Bill strengthens the protection of our fisheries, improves the regulatory framework for aquaculture and enhances the management of our water environment.”
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“I thank the Member for his contribution. I hope that, in light of what he has said, he will consider his position in relation to his support for the amendment. It is at odds with what he has said. <BR /> <BR />Finally, I move to the comment made by Mr Lyttle in relation to Northern Ireland Water's inefficiencies, because it is a public company. Whilst it is true that Northern Ireland Water has to comply with the constraints of public-sector spending, it is also true that, through a more efficient and effective operating model, partly due to the aforementioned PAC report, Northern Ireland Water has been able to reduce the cost of providing water and sewerage, and it is to the company's credit that it is doing so.”
“<BR /> <BR />Mr Lyttle said that it is just a technical issue, and he asked what the problem was. However, this provision cuts across existing statutory roles in an area that is already heavily regulated and reported on; and there are also issues in relation to the involvement of the Department of the Environment that need to be explored.”
“I am somewhat disappointed that Sinn Féin and the SDLP have indicated their support for it. I know that, tongue in cheek, Mr Dallat made the comment that it was an election stunt; however, I believe that it is a little more than that, and, if you look at the consequences, it is much more onerous. It has consequences in relation to the requirements that it places, not only on the Department but also on the Utility Regulator, given the fact that this is a company that is highly regulated. The timing of what is suggested does not fall in line with what is being asked of the company. I ask those parties to reconsider their decision and see what this is really about. It is about gaining evidence in order to do exactly what both parties ask us not to do — introduce water charges. So I ask them to look at that again.”
“I appreciate the Member's comments and am happy to look at that. <BR /> <BR />Mr Lynch and Mr Dallat highlighted the issue of flooding and, obviously, we send our commiserations in many respects to those who are having to deal with the devastation of their homes and properties. Essentially, their livelihoods have been washed away in floods. I am acutely aware of the need to manage surface water in a more sustainable way. I am looking towards doing that; hence I welcome support for what we are doing today. Obviously, other issues are associated with that in relation to riverbanks and so on that need to be taken into consideration. It is not entirely about surface water; there is more to it. <BR /> <BR />I turn to Mr Lyttle's comments in relation to amendment No 7.”
“You ask why Northern Ireland Water does not recover the cost of the meter from homeowners. Had water charging been introduced for domestic customers, the cost of the meters would have been offset against those charges. It would not be appropriate to pass on the cost of equipment that is not actually being used to householders. I can confirm that the cost of the meter is £45, but the other costs referred to by the Member are in relation to connection charges.”
“That subsequently changed, and the type of company that we now have is not as was envisaged at that time, hence the installation of the meters.”
“My officials are working with stakeholders to promote soft SuDS and to introduce an appropriate regime for the approval and ongoing maintenance of soft SuDS. That will be ongoing, and we will liaise with the Committee on that work and anything that comes out of the discussions that will continue. <BR /> <BR />A number of issues were raised during the debate, which is welcome. Mr Dickson, although not making a full contribution, had a number of interventions and raised a number of issues, particularly around the installation of meters. It was envisaged that Northern Ireland Water would become a private company when the legislation was in place in 2006. At that stage, it included the requirement to install water meters to enable charging by the company.”
“I thank the Chair of the Committee and other Members for their comments on the amendments. It is important that the Bill obtains Royal Assent before the end of the mandate and before my Department's power to pay the subsidy in lieu of domestic charges to Northern Ireland Water expires at the end of March 2016. I know that Members appreciate the importance of the issue. In addition to securing the ongoing subsidy-paying power, the Bill will make significant progress on important governance and environmental issues and will benefit everyone living in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />I note the positive comments of the Chair of the Committee and Mr Cochrane-Watson. I am conscious of the need for clarification of the different roles and responsibilities.”
“In addition, the regulator has expressed concern about the proposed amendment and, indeed, considers that it may undermine her role as set out in statute. I fail to see how the additional reports and assessments called for in this amendment would add to the already comprehensive suite of reports available in the public domain. <BR /> <BR />I am fully committed to the principles of ?openness, transparency and accountability, and I am confident that the existing reporting framework provides for those. On that basis, I cannot support the proposed amendment. <BR /> <BR />That concludes my comments on the amendments. I look forward to hearing Members' contributions and to them supporting my amendments.”
“I contend that it would not be appropriate for my Department to give its assessment of Northern Ireland Water’s environmental performance. That is clearly within the remit of the Department of the Environment. <BR /> <BR />The reporting cycle proposed in the amendment would mean that reports would be due, biannually, by mid-March. That would not align with any of the time frames of the existing reports, which are based on either a financial year or a calendar year. Therefore, the proposed clause would require considerable additional resources in the Department and the regulator's office to conduct reviews and to produce reports, which would be over and above the existing framework and which would duplicate the work already funded and carried out by the governance and reporting regimes that are currently in place.”
“The format is designed to facilitate the benchmarking of Northern Ireland Water against the water industry throughout the United Kingdom. That is an issue to which the Public Accounts Committee attached considerable importance in its report on Northern Ireland Water performance. In addition, the regulator requires Northern Ireland Water to produce capital investment monitoring reports on a quarterly basis to track the progress of the investment programme. <BR /> <BR />NIEA reports annually on water utility compliance, and those statistics are presented to the Environment Committee and published on the NIEA website. The Drinking Water Inspectorate also reports annually on Northern Ireland's performance in relation to drinking water quality, and those reports are published on the NIEA website.”
“This is the basis for Northern Ireland Water's current public expenditure requirement, and Northern Ireland Water is delivering against the efficiency targets contained in it. <BR /> <BR />One of the principal aims of the price control is to ensure that Northern Ireland Water invests efficiently and effectively and so delivers the desired environmental, public health and customer service improvements at value-for-money prices. To ensure that the outputs agreed during the PC process are delivered by Northern Ireland Water, the regulator requires the company to produce a detailed annual information return, which it scrutinises to publish its cost and performance report for the price control period.”
“The process takes into account customer opinion and reviews government priorities and the requirements of other regulators on environmental issues, including compliance with the urban waste water directive and the industrial emissions directive and achieving the good water status requirement of the water framework directive. Compliance with those directives is a key driver for determining the prioritised investment programme. <BR /> <BR />Through the detailed price control process, which is subject to public consultation at various points, the regulator scrutinises a comprehensive draft business plan and independently determines the company's income requirements. The current price control determination period, known as PC15, covers the six-year period 2015-16 to 2020-21.”
“It has experience, knowledge and access to a range of required industry skills, as well as its own resources. The regulator's role is provided for in the Water and Sewerage Services (Northern Ireland) Order 2006. The authority's primary duties under the 2006 Order are to protect consumer interests, where appropriate, by the facilitation of effective competition and to ensure that NI Water operates properly in all areas of Northern Ireland and is able to finance those activities properly. <BR /> <BR />The principal method of control is through the price control (PC) process. This involves a detailed scrutiny of the company's costs and performance against the PC15 outputs.”
“That being the case, I do not consider that it is required. <BR /> <BR />Northern Ireland Water is a regulated utility and is subject to economic regulation by the Northern Ireland Authority for Utility Regulation. In addition, the status of Northern Ireland Water as a non-departmental public body for public expenditure purposes has brought further significant governance and monitoring over and above that required of other water companies in the United Kingdom. Aspects of Northern Ireland Water's operation and performance are also regulated and reported on by the Northern Ireland Environmental Agency, the Drinking Water Inspectorate and the Consumer Council for Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />The regulator is an established independent body that already has statutory duties and powers to regulate water and sewerage services.”
“This will build on the existing SuDS guidance available from both the Northern Ireland Environment Agency and construction industry bodies and on Planning Policy Statement 15 and the Strategic Planning Policy Statement for Northern Ireland, which also cover the requirement to consider sustainable drainage. <BR /> <BR />I will now address amendment No 7. First, I have to say that I am somewhat surprised that a member of the Regional Development Committee is proposing an amendment on an issue that he did not choose to raise during the Committee's consideration of the Bill. Had the Committee had the opportunity to consider the need for this additional clause, the Member may have come to the same conclusion as I have: the proposed additional clause would introduce a duplication of the reporting regimes currently in place.”
“The promotion of soft SuDS is also included in 'Sustainable Water – A Long Term Water Strategy', which is currently with the Executive for their agreement to publish. My officials will consult widely on the most suitable arrangements for approval and management of soft SuDS in Northern Ireland. I assure Members that all due consideration will be given to the matter. In addition, as recommended by the Committee, my Department will consider, in conjunction with other relevant statutory bodies, publishing appropriate guidance on approaches to SuDS in the Northern Ireland context on the basis of authoritative industry standards.”
“The amendment introduces the terminology relating to soft SuDS into the Bill but does not alter the original policy intent of the clause. The inclusion of that terminology will encourage the use of soft SuDS as well as the more traditional hard engineered solutions. I am grateful to the Committee for working so constructively with me and my officials in reaching a common position on that amendment.”
“<BR /> <BR />Amendment No 6 to clause 5 will add a specific reference to soft sustainable drainage systems, commonly known as soft SuDS. These are the use of landscaping, green areas or other natural features that can be designed into a new development to provide drainage. They will be added to the Bill and provide a fuller explanation of what is meant by the term "sustainable drainage systems". <BR /> <BR />The issue of soft sustainable drainage systems has been the subject of considerable debate. The Committee heard evidence from a number of stakeholders during the Committee Stage and provided constructive and useful comments on the issue. I have, therefore, sought to amend the Bill to reinforce the use of soft sustainable drainage systems.”
“The subsequent subordinate legislation required to enact the power to cease the installation of water meters will be subject to draft affirmative resolution, and a full consultation will take place. Should a future Assembly change its view on water charging, the subordinate legislation required to reverse the requirement to install water meters can be made fairly quickly. Since 2007, almost £2 million has been spent on that nugatory work that could very well have been spent on the much-needed upgrading of our water and sewerage infrastructure. Clause 3 is important to the Bill, and the public will be further assured on the position in respect of water charging, should the installation of water meters cease.”
“<BR /> <BR />With the number of new houses built each year being in the region of 3,000 to 4,000, the additional cost imposed by the legislation is approximately £135,000 to £180,000 per year. My predecessor expressed concern at that situation, particularly given the pressures on public funding, and, in November 2014, asked for the requirement to install meters at domestic properties to be removed. At its meeting on 15 January 2015, the Executive agreed the final policy proposals in respect of a new water Bill, including the power to make subordinate legislation to cease the obligation to install water meters at all new domestic connections. The Executive have undertaken not to introduce household charges in the current Assembly mandate, so this practice is causing nugatory expense that, in the current climate, cannot be sustained.”
“<BR /> <BR />In relation to clause 3, current legislation requires NI Water to install meters at all properties, whether domestic or non-domestic, that are connecting to the public water supply system for the first time. Meters have been installed at new domestic dwellings since 2007. However, they are not being read and are not being used for charging purposes. This is a result of the Executive’s decision not to introduce household charges during the current Assembly mandate. It costs about £45 to install each meter. During the period December 2014 to June 2015, 2,300 meters were supplied and installed at newly connected domestic properties, with an approximate cost of £103,500 for that six-month period.”
“I have agreed a way forward with the Examiner and tabled an amendment that is of a minor and technical nature and uses the terms "suspend" and "revive" instead of "repeal" and "re-enact". That amendment addresses the Examiner’s concerns. <BR /> <BR />Amendment No 5 to clause 3 is to include district councils as statutory consultees on any subordinate legislation made under the clause. Clause 3 relates to the power to remove or relax the duty to install water meters. If the Department decided to make regulations under that clause, the consultation process would ordinarily include district councils. Therefore, I am happy to include them as statutory consultees.”
“<BR /> <BR />Amendment Nos 1 to 5 help clarify certain aspects of the Bill but do not result in a material change to the policies agreed by the Executive prior to its introduction. Amendment Nos 1 to 4, which are to clause 3, involve a technical change to the power to repeal and, subsequently, to re-enact the requirement to install water meters for domestic connections. The Examiner of Statutory Rules considered that the powers included in clause 3 might go too far for subordinate legislation. He suggested a change to the drafting of the clause to enable the legislation either to suspend and revive the requirement to install water meters or to repeal the requirement entirely.”
“There are seven amendments in total, six of which I believe strengthen the Bill and reflect the detailed work carried out by the Committee, the Office of the Legislative Counsel, the Examiner of Statutory Rules and officials in my Department. <BR /> <BR />I put on record my thanks to all involved in the process for the efforts that they have made. I am grateful for the support shown for the Bill. In particular, I thank the Committee for Regional Development for its positive engagement and thorough scrutiny of the Bill. During Committee Stage, the Committee raised several issues, and, as a result, I proposed a number of amendments to address those. I am pleased to say that the Committee has therefore agreed to support the Water and Sewerage Services Bill, subject to my proposed amendments.”
“I am happy to get that information. I will ask officials to forward it to you, if it is in a format that is easy to forward. <BR /> <BR />As a constituency MLA, as we all are, I am aware of the difficulties for people with a disability, as well as mothers with prams and so on in being able to use footpaths. Through my office — I am sure that others have the same experience — I have lobbied Transport NI, or Roads Service as it was, to make provision where necessary.”
“I thank the Member for his question. I do not have that information at hand, but I am happy to give it to the Member by way of a written answer.”
“I am happy to look at it as a project. However, I emphasise again that it is a tourism-led project as opposed to something of strategic importance for my Department. Nevertheless, I am happy to look at it.”
“I thank the Member for her question. I am aware of the Narrow Water Bridge project, which was proposed and sponsored primarily as a tourism project under INTERREG IV. My Department has, and has had, very limited interaction with the original project, other than on those matters relating to bridge orders and licensing. I am unaware of any specific intentions in bringing the project back to life, although I have heard speculation in news reports. As yet, I have not had any firm update.”
“I am conscious of the bottleneck in the area. The scheme proposal is now at the third stage of a three-stage development process. Stage 1 concluded in May 2008 with the selection of the proposed corridor; stage 2 concluded in February 2010 with the selection of the preferred option for the scheme; while stage 3 involves detailed assessment of the preferred option and ongoing consultation with key stakeholders. That will result in the publication of the statutory orders: the draft direction order, the environmental statement and the notice of intention to make a vesting order. The current budget allows that development work to continue. However, progression of the scheme to publication of the statutory orders will be subject to future years' funding.”
“I thank the Member for his question. Perhaps those who cycle to work might suggest doing that as an alternative. Transport NI is aware of traffic congestion experienced by commuters along the A2 between Holywood and the Dee Street junction in Belfast. The A2 Sydenham bypass scheme proposal for the route is to widen the existing two-lane dual carriageway to a dual three-lane carriageway.”
“I thank the Member for his supplementary question. I understand that he recently had a meeting with my predecessor about this in the Donegall Pass area. I am happy to pursue this and to seek a resolution on the issues that have been highlighted.”
“I thank the Member for his question. Certainly, regardless of whether it is in Belfast city centre or even some market towns around the Province, parking can prove to be a problem, particularly in residents' areas. I am aware that my officials have been involved in advertising and in the consultation process for a parking scheme in south Belfast. I understand that there were a number of objections, which are being worked through.”
“I thank the Member for his supplementary question. Catseyes are recognised as a safety device used in road marking. As the Member highlighted, they are particularly effective in wet weather and in fog, when the effectiveness of road markings themselves are particularly reduced. Obviously, the requirement for catseyes to be installed in a road will be assessed by the local section office. However, as I have said, road safety is a priority and anything that will mitigate loss of life should be included and seen as a priority in my budget.”
“I thank the Member for his question. How could I resist coming to the Assembly for my first Question Time? It was the really the only thing that I wanted to do today. <BR /> <BR />Obviously, a death on the roads in Fermanagh or, indeed, on any road in Northern Ireland, is a tragedy. My Department works closely with the PSNI and other agencies to assess any safety measures that are required on specific roads. It also takes account of all the recommendations made by police and takes action where necessary. Again, as I have made clear to other Members, if there are roads with particular issues that you believe require specific attention, I am happy to meet the Member to discuss those.”
“I thank the Member for that additional information. My understanding is that the numbers using trains from Newry, Poyntzpass and Scarva probably do not justify additional services, particularly early morning services. I will ask officials to look again at the timetabling in Newry to see whether there is a possibility of maximising further usage out of the station. You will understand that the revised timetables came about as a result of a reduction in budget to the Department and, therefore, to Translink. It is all part of a review that has been carried out. I am happy to take it back and look at it again.”
“I thank the Member for his question. It might be useful if he gave me some more information about where he feels there may be failings and about his perspective from the constituency. Would he like to enlighten me?”
“I thank the Member for her supplementary question. I am happy to do that. I am also happy to discuss it further with the Member and, if it helps, to visit the site to see what the issues are and help to bring it to a resolution.”
“I thank the Member for her question. I am aware of the issue at Castlerock Road and the nature of that in relation to school traffic and the movements in and around that area. I understand that various measures have been put in place to try to reduce risk there. A microprocessor optimised vehicle actuation system was introduced in May 2013; a puffin controlled pedestrian crossing was installed; and we have looked to improve cycling and pedestrian facilities along the Castlerock Road. There are competing demands in that area, and it has obviously become an issue. We are monitoring how those measures progress as a solution.”
“I thank the Member for her question. My Department has obviously prioritised its resources. Our key priority is to salt main traffic routes just to keep traffic moving freely. At the end of the 2014-15 winter season, Transport NI had arrangements with 25 of the 26 councils to provide salt to allow councils, where their resources permitted, to salt busy town centre footways in a time of prolonged ice and snow to keep the local economy moving. At this stage, Transport NI is in discussions to roll those arrangements over with the new councils. It is not anticipated that there will be any issues with that. I hope that that answers the Member's question.”
“It is about raising awareness and making sure that everyone realises that they have a responsibility to look after their own property.”
“In fact, a number of Members in the Chamber, including members of the Committee, took the opportunity to get involved in some photographs in preparation for the campaign last week. <BR /> <BR />Northern Ireland Water intends to use media interviews to advise customers on the prevention of frozen pipes and wastage caused by burst pipes, including a video on precautionary measures. Northern Ireland Water also maintains a major incident plan to provide a fully planned reactive response to any incidents that may impact on customers, the environment or business. The plan has been regularly tested during the year and has been exercised in response to real-life emergency situations, including the multi-agency response to industrial action events of December and January 2015. I hope that answers the Member's questions.”
“I thank the Member for his question. In relation to that, it is particularly around Northern Ireland Water. I remember that particularly well: at that stage I was Deputy Chair of the Regional Development Committee. One of the key recommendations coming out of the Northern Ireland Authority for Utility Regulation report on the freeze/thaw of that year was that Northern Ireland Water undertake a major public awareness campaign in an effort to reduce the extent of water wastage on the customer side. Northern Ireland Water is currently embarking on the fifth year of its winter advertising campaign, which will include television, radio, press, outdoor and online advertising. The theme of the campaign will retain the well-established "Beat the freeze" message.”
“I thank Mr Kennedy for his good wishes as I move forward in the role; I appreciate that. Yes, I can confirm that there is adequate funding to maintain a normal winter service.”
“The roads that they are on are ungritted, and we should give them a lot of praise for the work that they do.”
“In addition to the preparations for adverse road conditions, Northern Ireland Water maintains a major incident plan to provide a fully planned reactive response to any major weather-induced incidents. Translink also has severe weather management plans in place to cope with the effect of severe winter weather on public transport services. <BR /> <BR />I fully recognise the importance of winter service to the people and the economy of Northern Ireland. I recently visited winter service depots at Ballykeel in Ballymena and Airport Road in Belfast to meet staff and see at first hand the vital work that they do. I realise just how passionate they are in caring for all of us at a time of severe weather. They take on a responsibility, and we should be mindful of the fact that they actually go out when it is frosty.”
“The Member will, of course, know that the winter service programme is provided to mitigate the effects of adverse winter weather; it does not eliminate them. My Department will provide a normal winter service with over 300 staff and a fleet of 130 gritters available every day to salt the main road network. Salt barns have been filled to a maximum capacity of over 70,000 tons, with reserve stocks of around 20,000 tons in place. Salt bins and grit piles will be provided at strategic locations for self-help purposes. To further improve resilience, I have approved the purchase of four more snowblowers to supplement the Department’s fleet of eight. Snow clearance contracts are in place to enable contractors and farmers to be mobilised to clear roads during prolonged periods of snow.”
“Yes, I can. Immediate action was taken in conjunction with the contractor to address that. The contractor replaced the affected surfacing to ensure that it met the standards that my Department requires. There was no additional cost.”
“At this stage, the approved scheme estimate for the works was approximately £133 million. As the contract for the work is ongoing, the out-turn cost has not yet been finalised, so I am not in a position to give the Member the figure at this stage.”
“The traffic model suggests that, on average, journey times along the section of the A8 between Coleman's Corner roundabout and Ballyrickard Road will reduce by approximately 25% as a result of the scheme. That equates to a journey time saving of between two minutes 24 seconds and four minutes 56 seconds, which seems terribly precise, depending on the direction of travel and the time of journey.”