Sir Roger Gale
MP for Herne Bay and Sandwich · Conservative · United Kingdom
“In welcoming the Prime Minister to his place, let me say that I noticed his criticism of the water companies—a justified criticism, in many cases. May I direct his attention to the predatory activities of another private company?”
“The Secretary of State appears to think it is scaremongering to suggest that, with effect from this weekend, passenger and freight traffic using the channel tunnel and the port of Dover will be disrupted as a result of the European entry and exit system.”
“Before I call Esther McVey to move the motion, and then the Minister to respond, I remind Members that they may make a speech only with the prior permission of the Member in charge of the debate. No such notice has been given.”
“As the Minister has indicated, over the spring bank holiday there was chaos at Dover, at St Pancras and at the channel tunnel because of the failure of the EES. The French authorities were quite simply not prepared or able to implement the facilities properly.”
“This House has the capacity to criticise, but it also has the capacity to be fair. The Minister probably finds himself between a rock and a cliff face in a situation that he did not make himself. That does not absolve the MCA from the criticism that has rightly been levelled at it earlier today.”
“To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department, what measures the Government have put in place to ensure that in the coming holiday season, travellers and business freight are not delayed at our ports, our international railway stations and our airports as a result of the imposition of the European entry and exit system.”
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“Dr Aleksandra Fox of the Ash surgery in my constituency is one of a number of GPs who have pointed out to me the deleterious effects of an ill-thought-through Budget. In addition, charities such as Shooting Star and Demelza children’s hospices are facing problems now. They cannot wait for discussions through the normal channels while this cock-up is put right. When will something be done about it, please?”
“The right hon. Gentleman referred to the amount of money being made available for flooding. The devastation caused by flooding pales into insignificance compared with the damage that will be done by inheritance tax. This weekend a farmer in my constituency has cancelled the building of a new barn because of it. Park home owners in my area are in despair as a result of what the Budget is doing to them. Does the right hon. Gentleman not understand that?”
“This is a one-hour debate. Four Members, in addition to the Member in charge, have already indicated that they wish to speak. We are pushing the clock a bit, so anybody who has not already so indicated is unlikely to get called, although that depends on how long Members speak for. Members may wish to consider intervening rather than trying to make a speech.”
“Before I call the hon. Member for North Down to move the motion, I inform Members that the Parliamentary Digital Communications Team will be conducting secondary filming during today’s debate.”
“Will those Members wishing to speak please stand up? I want to see who they are. Right—I am going to put a time limit of six minutes on each speech. There are four who certainly want to get in and we need to hit the winding-up speeches at about 5.5 pm.”
“Order. Mr Shannon, I appreciate that you have been detained elsewhere with other business in the House but we are playing “beat the clock”, so I will not be able to call you. Ordinarily, because you arrived so late, I would not be able to allow you to intervene, but under these circumstances, if you choose to intervene on one of the Front-Bench spokesmen, I will allow you to do so.”
“In the rural England that I am privileged to represent part of, they say that you should live as if you are going to die tomorrow and farm as if you are going to live forever. Do the Government not understand that if we inheritance-tax our farms out of existence, there will be no forever, and there will be no food from what was once the garden of England?”
“I ram home this message to the Minister and ask him to take it away to the Secretary of State: when we set up, as I am sure we will, a national cancer strategy, the Government must make certain that the 13-to-25 age group is given the recognition it deserves, so that they get the diagnoses in time, before they die, and the treatment they need, and so they are included in clinical trials.”
“It is the largest single killer of young people in this country—bar none—yet young people are overlooked when it comes to clinical trials that could be lifesaving. There is a real reason why young people as a proportion of the population should be included in clinical trials, but they are not—they are overlooked. Why? Because there is the assumption that it is not a disease that affects young people. But it does. I make my plea on behalf of those in my family who support the Teenage Cancer Trust, and those in the Teenage Cancer Trust who have taken the trouble to brief Members of Parliament.”
“It is not infrequent for a young person, subsequently diagnosed, to have to make at least three visits to a general practitioner before even being referred, because it is assumed, completely wrongly, that cancer is something that affects old people—people like me. I am expected to get cancer, but young people do not get it, do they? Well, sadly, yes they do, at a rate of seven a day, rising to 10 a day by the end of the decade. My plea is for the Minister to take away this message: however much money is being pumped into the health service and being made available for investment in diagnostic kit, there is a real need to address one area of the population that has been neglected. That area is teenage cancer victims.”
“The point was made that, every day, seven young people between their teenage years and their mid-20s are diagnosed with cancer. By the end of this decade, that figure is likely to have risen to 10 per day. Most of us in the Chamber probably have family members who have had experience of cancer—or even have personal experience, as the hon. Member for Wokingham clearly has. We all know somebody who has had cancer, and sadly some of us know, only too well, people who have died of cancer. But the instances of cancer among young people are widely disregarded and neglected within the health service and beyond.”
“I do not want to go down the road of party politics. The previous Government poured shedloads of money into the national health service, but throwing money at the problem is not the answer. I am not saying that there is not any demand for more capital expenditure—there is—but that is not the point. Unless we get the structure right, we will go on wasting more and more money. We need to be grown up about this; we must all understand that. In the few minutes I have, I want to concentrate on an issue that the hon. Member for Wokingham (Clive Jones) touched on, but only briefly: the incidence of cancer in young people. It is many years since my eldest son used his wedding—and probably his bride too—to raise money for the Teenage Cancer Trust. In the time between then and now, sadly not a very great deal has changed. That is lamentable.”
“Given that answer, does the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office consider that the reported presence of the United Nations Secretary-General at Putin’s summit in Russia will be helpful or unhelpful to Ukraine? If the latter, what is the Minister doing about it?”
“In sharp contrast to the presence of the United Nations Secretary-General at Putin’s summit in Russia, which sent out all the wrong signals, this statement is hugely welcome, so I thank the Secretary of State. Further to the question that the Chairman of the Defence Committee asked, is it not now time that not only Storm Shadow but all the matériel supplied to Ukraine by the western alliance should be used by Ukraine in the manner that it sees fit?”
“Order. The Minister has a very limited amount of time to wind up. I appreciate that there will be hon. Members who have not said everything that they want to, but I ask them to resist the temptation of doing so if the Minister is to respond to the debate.”
“Order. Before we proceed, let me first point out that I am going to call those who have submitted letters. Not every Member present and not every Member rising has written in. I have to give priority to those who have submitted an application to participate in the debate first. The second point I have to make, sadly, is that this debate is very time limited indeed. I am going to have to impose a time limit of three minutes and I may have to reduce that.”
“Some minutes ago, the right hon. Gentleman said that the young people of Torfaen believed in and wanted equal opportunity, a point reiterated by the hon. Member for Reading West and Mid Berkshire (Olivia Bailey). I am not quite sure how that equal opportunity squares with a Labour party that wants to stuff the House of Lords with its cronies. I cannot see any equal opportunity in that. That aside, this legislation, on which we will be required to vote, is ill thought through. Will the right hon. Gentleman accept that the hereditary peers who are Members of the House of Lords have made, and continue to make, a considerable contribution to the work of the upper House, and if so, has he given any consideration to, at the very least, ensuring that those hereditary peers who are abolished are given life peerages in a future Parliament?”
“I have long advocated—with, I think, the support of my right hon. Friend the Member for Goole and Pocklington (Sir David Davis)—the abolition of the House of Commons, the abolition of the House of Lords, and instead four national Parliaments, each with a First Minister, and an upper House dealing solely with defence, foreign policy and macro-taxation, which was the original purpose of Parliament. Why is the hon. Lady prepared to go half hog rather than the whole hog?”
“Setting aside the hon. Gentleman’s ageist remarks, which I find deeply offensive, let me consider the point that the hon. Member for Richmond Park (Sarah Olney) made. Why is it okay for the Labour party to maintain the Prime Minister’s patronage to appoint party cronies to the House of Lords while abolishing the hereditary peers, who do a good job?”
“Will my hon. Friend agree that if this legislation is to go through, there should be a provision to ensure that all the hereditary peers are offered a life peerage as part of the package?”
“I do not wish to detain the House, but when I raised this point during the Minister’s remarks he indicated that it would be perfectly proper and possible for a leader of a party to put forward hereditary peers for life peerages, but that is not the point. The point is that there should be a separate list in this legislation to accommodate all of them.”
“In an earlier intervention, my right hon. Friend said that this Bill is an opportunity missed, and that such legislative opportunities do not come by very often. For the moment, the Cabinet Office has this Bill. Might I suggest that replacing 92 hereditary peers with what my right hon. Friend the Member for South Holland and The Deepings (Sir John Hayes) called “placemen” is not reform? Would it not be a good idea if Ministers gave a clear undertaking this afternoon that they will accept amendments of the kind that my right hon. Friend the Member for Stone, Great Wyrley and Penkridge (Sir Gavin Williamson) proposes?”
“This is a policy dreamed up in 2014 by the present Chancellor of the Exchequer—that is on the record. It is a policy made in No. 11 Downing Street and endorsed by the nation’s undertaker in No. 10. It is cruel, it is heartless, and it is going to lead to deaths this winter, so while I believe that there should be a means test, the manner in which the Government are going about it is profoundly wrong and deeply flawed and will cause untold-of hardship. It has got to change.”
“My wife, Suzy, is over retirement age. She is also in full-time employment. I am over retirement age. I am also in full-time employment and a higher rate taxpayer. I have always believed that the winter fuel allowance should be means-tested, because while we give it to charity, there are other, perhaps younger people—such as the young and disabled, who cannot run around and keep warm—who could use the money. I have believed that for probably as long as the now Chancellor of the Exchequer has believed it. Let us be clear: this has nothing to do with black holes in the economy, which Laura Kuenssberg identified while interviewing the Prime Minister on Sunday as being largely contributed to by inflationary pay increases for the unions—for railway workers and junior doctors.”
“I am grateful for my hon. Friend’s question, because it does not lie with the hon. Member for Ealing North (James Murray). It lies with the Chancellor of the Exchequer and with the Prime Minister, both of whom should be on the Government Front Bench this afternoon, but neither of whom have been present during the debates—although the Chancellor did come in to vote, and then nipped out again. That in itself is shameful. I abhor the fact that there are politicians sitting on the Labour Benches who are quite prepared to fight to the last drop of somebody else’s political blood, because that is what is happening this afternoon.”
“Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker—I stand chastised. The Leader of the Opposition was in the Chamber earlier this afternoon, but I saw no sign whatsoever of the Prime Minister. However, the answer to the hon. Lady remains the same: the responsibility for this policy lies directly with the Chancellor of the Exchequer and the Prime Minister, and they are going to live to regret it.”
“There seems to be a belief that the next election is five years away. The next general election may be five years away, but the next election is next May, and those voting in the county council elections in May—those pensioners and their families—will not forget this.”
“I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. I have made the point, and will make it again, that I have no quarrel with the principle. I have a huge quarrel with the manner in which this policy is being implemented, because it is cruel and heartless. It is going to leave thousands, if not millions, of pensioners literally out—or more probably in—in the cold this winter, and some of them will die as a result. It is not necessary, it does not have to be done, and it will not save money, so there has to be a rethink. Just to conclude, I detect a degree of arrogance on the Government Benches this afternoon. The fact that there are only about 30 Members on those Benches speaks volumes to those outside who thought that Members were going to come and hear this matter being seriously debated.”
“The hon. Lady has misrepresented me. She knows perfectly well that while I said I supported the principle, I abhor the way she is going about it.”
“The national planning policy framework clearly militates against building on agricultural land. Notwithstanding the Minister’s desire not to interfere in local democracy, will he write to the leader of Thanet district council to remind him that agricultural land is the stuff that we grow food on, and cannot be for housing if we are to remain sustainable?”
“This summer marks the 50th anniversary of Turkey’s illegal invasion and occupation of the northern part of the island of Cyprus. Will the Foreign Secretary tell the House what steps and initiatives his Government are going to take to seek to resolve that frozen conflict, for which the British Government have a historical responsibility as a guarantor power?”
“It is good to see you in that Chair, Madam Deputy Speaker. I am not sure whether the Secretary of State has discussed her proposals with the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs or the National Farmers Union, but the answer she gave on food production was risible. What she has announced today is effectively a recipe for disposing of the land that will be needed to feed our children and grandchildren. Just before she goes ahead with that, will she tell the House how many planning consents that have been granted are sitting there unbuilt-out? Should we not use those first?”
“When in opposition, the present Administration made some efforts to criticise the then Conservative Government’s record on animal welfare. The King’s Speech, of which the right hon. Lady indicates she is so proud, contains not one word relating to animal welfare. Was that a deliberate omission, or a careless and uninterested oversight, and when might we have a Bill to outlaw the proceeds of trophy hunting?”
“Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker—Mr Speaker. [ Interruption. ] Another Freudian slip! The old dog is off the leash. May I first thank the Prime Minister and the Leader of the Opposition for their supportive policies in relation to Ukraine? Their expressions today will have been of great comfort to the thousands of Ukrainian residents in the United Kingdom who simply wish to return to their lawful home. Further to the answer to my hon. Friend the Member for Broxbourne (Lewis Cocking), can the Prime Minister tell the House how his planning reforms, which will smother with houses fields in east Kent that currently yield wheat for bread, are compatible with the desire of his own Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs to achieve sustainability?”
“We owe it to the grandchildren of every Member present to get it right. Finally, I am concerned about an omission from the King’s Speech. Given the comments and publicity, I am sad that the speech makes no mention of animal welfare. I would hope that, at the very least, His Majesty’s new Government will reintroduce and ram through the trophy hunting bill that two Members of Parliament—one Labour and one Tory—tried but failed to get through the last Parliament. With that, in the interests of this United Kingdom, I wish the Government and their programme well. We will hold feet to the fire where necessary, but I trust, as the Leader of the Opposition said this afternoon, that we will not be obstructive. A Government have a right to get their business through.”
“The proposal is to build on marshland immediately next to a site of special scientific interest, having crossed the Pegwell bay nature reserve, a 90-foot high structure the size of about four football pitches. National Grid has got this so horribly wrong that it only now realises that marshland is wet, which means it will have to pour thousands of tonnes of concrete into the land, drill down and pile before it can even begin to build its structure. Viable alternatives have been suggested, so I hope that the new Secretary of State will take this concern on board and use his powers to instruct National Grid to go back to the drawing board and get it right. We all want clean energy and renewable energy, and we all want to hit the net zero target, but not at any price. If we rush into this, we will get it wrong.”
“The new Secretary of State for Energy Security and Net Zero has moved very fast indeed to grant planning consents that give me cause for concern. I find it wholly unnecessary that East Anglia and Thanet should have to place solar farms on prime agricultural land—grade 1 land—that generates wheat of bread-making quality. We have acres of rooftops and car parks in public ownership that could and should be used to protect the land that we need. I have a particular concern about a project that two colleagues from East Anglia referred to earlier. The Sea Link project is designed to run a power cable from East Anglia under the Thames and around the coast to make landfall close to Sandwich.”
“There are three issues that I want to raise very briefly this afternoon. I have grave concerns about the proposed reforms of planning law. Like Many Government Members, I represent a rural constituency and I fear for the loss of farmland. I am not sure—this is a genuine confusion and concern—whether it is the Chancellor of the Exchequer or the Secretary of State for Housing who is driving the proposed planning reform policy. I have a very real concern that local democracy will be removed, and that we shall find ourselves with a slash-and-burn policy that will destroy yet more of not only the green belt, but of the land we need to grow the food to feed our country. I trust that the Government will address that issue very clearly and very seriously indeed.”
“There are many who envy us for that, and it is a precious jewel that we should never lose. This King’s Speech has much in it that I trust we can all applaud. It makes clear reference to defence of the realm, which is so vital to our country, and a commitment to NATO. It also commits us to support Ukraine in what is not just their war but our war—a war to defend democracy. There is also a commitment—although not everybody will agree with this—to a two-state settlement in the middle east. Those are all laudable aims, and I trust we can all support them. There are other areas that are greyer and that we shall have to take some issue with. That is the job of the Opposition, as the Prime Minister would expect. The Opposition will hold his feet to the fire and hold him to account when we think that he has got it wrong.”
“New colleagues on both sides of the House who have not heard these types of speeches before—you and I both know this very well indeed, Mr Deputy Speaker—will find that they will make great friendships right across the House over the coming weeks and months, and that is as it should be. Out there, in the real world, people do not understand that we work so closely together, but we do, and so we should. Jo Cox was absolutely right when she memorably said that there is much more that unites us than divides us. And so it is with this speech today. I should also place on record my thanks and, I hope, the thanks of the whole House to the Leader of the Opposition and the Prime Minister for the way in which they have managed with great dignity the transfer of power. This country does state openings rather well, and it does democracy even better.”
“I have not visited Wolverhampton for over 60 years, and I do not know whether the Ambassador bowling alley is still there, but I recall that Berry Gordy brought the Motortown revue to Wolverhampton, and I actually watched Stevie Wonder playing ten pin bowls in the Wolverhampton bowling alley—think about that. It is 41 years since I was first elected to this House as the then youngest Member of Parliament for the new seat of North Thanet, and I am delighted that, 41 years later, I find myself elected as the youngest Member of Parliament for Herne Bay and Sandwich.”
“Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I would like to start by adding my congratulations to both the hon. Members for Bootle (Peter Dowd) and for Vauxhall and Camberwell Green (Florence Eshalomi) on their speeches earlier this afternoon. I suspect that you and I have heard quite a number of such speeches, and I think we can probably agree that those were two of the very best we have ever heard. May I also congratulate the hon. Member for Wolverhampton West (Warinder Juss), who spoke movingly of his football team and of his town, in which he quite clearly has great pride.”
“Order. Before we proceed, this concludes my last session in the Chair for this Parliament. I thank the House for the courtesy and understanding that I have received during my time as a Deputy Speaker. It has been hugely appreciated. Thank you all.”
“Order. I am sorry to have to interrupt the right hon. Gentleman—there will be an opportunity to return to this on the carry-over motion later, if he wishes to do so. I accept the fact that his speech has been interrupted, and that will not count against him if he seeks to catch our eye again.”
“Before we proceed, the Leader of the House has made it plain that she will make a further business statement tomorrow morning. Of course, I will take a contribution from the Opposition spokesperson, but this is a very narrow statement indeed. I do not expect a business questions session after this.”
“Mr Brine has indicated that he wishes to raise a question that is probably relevant to a number of Members. I will call Mr Brine, but after that I will call these proceedings to a close on the understanding that a statement will be made tomorrow.”
“The occupant of the Chair, as hon. Members know, is always completely impartial. However, the sentiments of the House are quite clearly unanimous on this issue—slava Ukraini.”
“Order. I remind the hon. Lady that interventions are interventions, not speeches. If she wishes to speak on Third Reading, she will have the opportunity to do so.”
“I again congratulate the hon. Lady on piloting her Bill through the House. Question put and agreed to. Bill accordingly read the Third time and passed.”
“I was interested in the hon. Gentleman’s remarks about his childhood dream to be an astronaut. When I was a child, I recall one Yuri Gagarin circumnavigating the world, I think for 90 minutes. It seems like a very long time ago. I call Mr Jonathan Lord to wind up.”