YouSaid · the spoken record

Matthew Cox

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500
first
2024-01-17
most recent
2024-01-17
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1
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podcast

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  1. “Yeah, I am. I'm not a flashy person. Like, I'm not driving, you know, like I didn't go out and buy a red Lamborghini. You know, I'm driving 40,000, 50,000 dollar cars. I've had some sports cars 70, 80. Maybe that's $150,000 sports car now, but it's still not flashy. It's not like it's bright red or yellow. I mean, these are, it's always something nondescript. And I'm living in areas that these cars are everywhere. You know, I go to, so I end up going to Charlotte, North Carolina. We rent an apartment. We decide to run a scam. In South Carolina. So I go to Columbia, South Carolina, and in between this period of time, we go to Las Vegas. And I”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  2. “No, but I mean, now every day you're looking your name up every day. I'm not, because I'm just trying to get a bunch of money and just blend in, right? Things were not as interconnected at that time as they are now. But they're starting to get interconnected. But of course, I have no idea how much. I barely go on the internet for anything, you know, dating. That's the only thing the internet, you know, I'd never been on Facebook. At this point, Facebook isn't even out yet. This is 2006.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  3. “U.S. Marshal is just fugitives. They don't do any invest Yeah, like the U.S. Marshals are like, let's say. An arm of All of the various law enforcement agencies, federal agencies, not the states. The states have their own fugitive task forces or fugitive.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  4. “Right. I'm on the FBI's On a list. At that point, the Secret Service got involved once I leave Atlanta. So when Becky and I pack up our bags and we leave Atlanta, the Secret Service got involved because of identity theft, banking, identity theft. The Secret Service doesn't just do counterfeiting and protect the president. They also protect the financial infrastructure of the United States. And they especially have jurisdiction when identity theft is involved.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  5. “So, the FBI is looking for me kind of in Tampa. And they've put out a fugitive warrant for me, which is how the U.S. Marshals got involved.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  6. “Excuse me, Mr. Cugno? And I said, Yes, sir. I turned around and he goes, I'd like to know that I feel very apprehensive about this transaction. And I go, really, what is it exactly? He goes, I can't put my finger on it. And I go, it'll come to you. And I turn around, I just bolt right out of there. And keep in mind, a week or so later, the Secret Service shows up. You cash a check for $29,000 so. What's so funny is like that was one of the last checks we cached. So we ended up with like 400,000.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  7. “Right. Wait there, terrified still. They come out about two minutes later. The manager comes out plus a woman. I'm assuming maybe that was Kim. She never said anything. And she walks out and she says, and he counts out the money twice, $29,000, $29,000. And I stand up. And I mean, just like I like shoving the money in my pockets. Like I'm trying to get out of there so quick. I'm like, hey, I'm like, okay, cool. Like I'm thinking this whole thing is feels bad. And I'm getting up and I'm so. Starting to walk out of the bank, and he goes.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  8. “In any other way, they could have gotten in touch with a real Michael Shanning So I was like, oh, okay, hang up the phone.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  9. “Right. They're saying they're trying to get in touch with Michael Shanahan. So then the phone rings. Cell rings again. I look and it's not Becky's, not Becky. So I pick up the phone and I go, hello. And she says, hi, this is Kim. Is it from SunTrust Bank? Is this Michael Shanahan? So I'm like, yes, it is Michael Shanahan. And she says, there's a guy here. He's trying to cash a check. It's very large. Could you verify the payee? And I go, sure, it's Scott Cugno. I said, I believe the amount's $29,000. And she goes, that's right. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. I said, okay. I said, hey, by the way, how'd you get my number? This is my cell number. And she's like, oh, I'm sorry, we called the title company And the title company gave us your phone number. Well, I closed those loans. That's my sale. That's why if they.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  10. “Right, right? Okay. Okay. And he walks away. The phone rings. Becky, what's going on? I go, they're trying to get a hold of Michael Shanah. Oh my God. Oh my God. And I'm like, and I would remember thinking I shouldn't let her the keys, there's a good chance I run out of this place and she's not there.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  11. “Yeah, hold on, and he leaves again. And I remember my cell phone rang and I pick up the phone and it's Becky. What are you doing? What's taking so long? I go, ah, the guy's being a jerk. You don't want to give me the money. She's like, oh my God, get out of the bank, get out of the bank. And I went, I can't get out of the bank. The guy's got my ID. He's got my credit card, my ID, and the check for $29,000. Like, he's going to call the police if I just jump up and run. And I go, don't call me again. I'll let you know. It'll be fine. Hang out the phone. Calls back. Same conversation. It'll be fine. Hang out with the phone. He comes back out and he goes, hey, so what's taken so long? And he goes, we're trying to get in touch with Michael Shanahan to verify the That's not good for me”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  12. “And he goes, No, it's good. It's good. You have the money. And he's like, yeah, we have the money. He said, it's just odd. Hold on. He goes back in the back and he comes back and he says, where'd you get the check? Cashier's check. I said, was it cashier's check? It was drawn off of a closing for somebody's property that I were doing, the company I work for, we're putting on an addition on Okay, that makes sense. Comes back. Well, why do you need cash? And I was like, I'm cashing guys' checks that work for the company. Like there's a lot of these guys that are like Mexican guys. They give them a check. They go to a check caching company or they get charged 5-10%. So I cached them. I'm like, I don't under like what the check's good, right? Like my, and he's like, yeah, we're just trying to verify some stuff. Any”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  13. “So I'm sitting in the bank. I go in there and I say, I need to cash this. And she says, You're going to have to talk to the manager. I go, okay. She says, go sit down over there. I go sit down in a little glass cubicle. He comes over and he says, I see you're trying to cash his check. And I was like, right. He goes, why don't you just deposit in your own bank? And I went, my bank is a credit union or something. And it's in like Florida. Like they'll hold this thing for like two weeks. Like I need the money now. I have people I need to pay. He's like, well. I'm not sure. And I was like, well, it's fine. It's a cashier check. Like, it's good.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  14. “They have banks where they cash, they actually cash large checks. If you go into the Bank of America and you try and cash a check for $15,000 or $25,000, they probably won't do it. They'll tell you we don't have that much cash on hand. We don't this. We don't that. They have certain banks that do that. So they told me where one of those was. I went there. I had a check for like $29,000. Had been cut on a closing for Michael Shanahan. Remember, I refinanced Michael Shanahan's, I've got a check for $29,000 that was issued to Scott Cugnow.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  15. “What happens is we get that little chunk of money. We put it deposited into these bank accounts and we start pulling out cash. And which works out fine because if we got a bunch of accounts and we're pulling out little amounts, 7,500, 8,000. And, you know, I would cash checks against her accounts. And they would call her to verify, there's someone here trying to cash a check for $9,000. Can you verify the payee and they go, oh, yeah, that's Scott Cugno. Oh, okay, thank you. And they cash the check. You know, these are new accounts. So it looks odd. But we're always, I open the account. So what ends up happening is. Caching them, and I remember getting really frustrated because it was just taking forever. And I gone into a bank one time.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  16. “Yeah, Becky's a problem Some point I actually send her to a psychiatrist and they give her, they put her on Zoloft. She takes it for like a month or two, and then she stops taking it. She thought she was all better. You're not all better”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  17. “It was that she was the type of person that would start an argument at one o'clock in the morning. And scream at the top of her lungs and get the cops called. So I can't have the place called. I can't get taken downtown and fingerprinted. I can't have the police showing up. I don't know who's really looking. We haven't had plastic surgery at this point. We're still pulling money together.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  18. “No, she was useless. She was horrible. And she just spent money all the time. What I realized too very quickly is she's bipolar. So she's bipolar and she's Absolutely insane. She smokes pot all the time.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  19. “So we schedule three separate closings. None of them know about the other person. So what I do is I close. I closed one loan on, let's say, Monday and then one on Tuesday, and then one on whatever, Wednesday or Thursday, or that may have all been the same day, to be honest, but I don't remember. The point is I go to three separate title companies or real estate attorneys and we close and I get checks for after costs and everything. The total ends up being roughly $400,000. So I've got 400,000. Becky and I run another scam in Tallahassee, Florida, and we get like 50 grand. And plus the 80s dwindled down to close to nothing because we had gone on several vacations. We went to Bermuda and I think we went to Jamaica. We actually stayed at the Rits in Jamaica. It was very nice.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  20. “I'm living in this place. I make a fake ID in the name Michael Shanahan and I call up three secured or sorry three hard money lenders. A hard money lender is a guy that lends his own money or other investors money on property. Kind of like a bank, but he's lending his own money so he doesn't have to really meet the banking requirements and he can charge a much higher interest rate. These guys are charging 12, 13% interest, simple interest. And they're only lending you a much lower percentage of the value of your home. So they're not lending you 90% of the value. They're lending you 65%, 60%. So I call three of these guys. They all come out to the house at different times. And each one of them says, I'll lend you $100,000. Or it's like $150,000, $150,000. Like they all lend roughly $150,000.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  21. “With my picture. Yeah. But it's honestly not pre internet, but it's post internet, but it is in its infancy. Like nobody's, it's not huge. And honestly, it's a local newspaper in Tampa. It's not that big of a deal. Like I'm not concerned about that so much at this point. What I'm concerned about is getting a chunk of money and just moving on and kind of reestablishing ourselves in a better way where we're not living in a building that we're going to be committing fraud in with our house.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  22. “I needed to get the money as quick as possible. Like, I want to get out of Atlanta. And at this point, by the way, there's multiple articles showing up in Tampa. So the St. Petersburg Times is writing multiple articles about me”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  23. “Oh, well, I mean, right now I'm living in this guy's house, and I satisfied his loans. The house was worth $200,000. So, what happens is one day we go and we check public records. Remember, I told you it takes months for it to show up and it shows up. He's got no mortgages on the house. So now I turn around and I make a fake ID in the name Michael Shanahan. I'm living in his house. But I have no credit, right? There's no credit. So the ID, I've got a social security number. And I order some secure credit cards in his name. So if you pull that credit profile, it shows up saying he's got some credit cards, but they're only a month or two old. So I can't go to Bank of America. I mean, I could.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  24. “Some of them. Like, I might order Secured credit cards. So I can't get credit. I'm building their credit. Like, it's not helping me in any way. I'm just sending out $500 to get a capital one card or a American Bank of America secured credit card, whatever. Building their credits, but not all of them. Only a few because I'm collecting them. Also, going to be moving soon. I'm only here to get a few hundred thousand dollars and move. I need some kind of a base. So I don't want to start getting credit cards and building up a history in Atlanta, in anybody's name, but I am getting driver's licenses in other states. So I've been at like North Carolina, South Carolina.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  25. “Legitimately, I walked into the DMV That hi, my name's Michael Eckert, and I just moved here about three weeks ago, four weeks ago. Here's my lease. And I lost my driver's license, bro. Like, I don't know what I did with it. I don't know. I don't know what happened. I don't know. And they're like, it's all right. What do you have? I need proof of residency. Well, I have my lease. Oh, okay. I need a primary. Okay, here's my birth certificate. Okay. And I need a secondary. Here's my social security card. But I also registered, you know, I registered to vote. My girlfriend made me vote immediately and she said I would need. Oh, yeah, it's perfect. You're good. I don't even need that. Okay, great. Stand over there. Pay that. They call your number 275, you know, 45 minutes later, you go, you pay your 25 bucks, you stand in front of the screen, they take a picture, you got a driver's license, you walk out, it's still warm. It's beautiful. It smells like pop plastic. It's amazing.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  26. “So, I'm going to Florida. So, over the course of this whole thing, I've had 27 driver's licenses in like seven different states. I've had two dozen passports. Because if you're going to get the driver's license in the guy's name, you might as well get, or an ID even. You might as well get a passport because a passport's not difficult to get. They don't fingerprint you. All they look, all they're doing is saying, this is your ID and were you born here and then they run a check and if it comes back or it doesn't and back then you could do it expedited and I'd have it in like two weeks like now it takes like 90 days or 60 to 90 days to get one”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  27. “They did. They showed up like I left on a Sunday night or something because for some reason my stupid Thought I thought, well, they won't arrest me on the weekend, like they don't work on the weekends. So they came on like a whatever it was, like a Tuesday or Wednesday, Thursday. Like within a few days, they come in the office, they rate it, they're looking for me, but I'm gone. Nobody knows where I am. And so now I'm surveying the homeless guys and I turn around and I'm ordering their documents. And as their documents are showing up, I'm going to different states and getting IDs.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  28. “In Florida, back in Florida, when I left and drove to Atlanta and left, remember the FBI was going to show up a few days later. We were going to arrest me.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  29. “Three things to get a driver's license in your name, right? You know, I'd come in with like six. Because what you do is you get in front of the guy at the DMV and you kind of fumble through like, oh, I got this. What else do you need? I know exactly what you need. But, you know, they'll be like, oh, was that high school transfer? Yeah, I'll take that. And oh, voter's registration card. Give me that. Yeah, you're perfect. You're good. Sit down right over there. That's it.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  30. “Right. Took a survey. Went home, ordered their, and of course they give me everything, name, database, social security number, mother's maiden name, where they were born. Have they ever been in the armed services? Have they ever had a passport issued? What states have they had identification in? Have they ever been arrested? Have they ever been on probation? Have they ever claimed Social Security disability, SSI? I mean, I had like 17 questions and it absolutely answered everything. What high school did you go to? Because high school transcripts are great for documentation. A lot of times they'll ask you for high school, you know, can you get us a copy of your high school transcripts? Like, that's good to know. And I'm a big believer in overkill. So, I mean, I ordered a ton of stuff. If I needed...”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  31. “Mark Leida is amazing. He's amazing. And one of the things he had said was like these are, he was like, these are real people and he's like their stories. He's like, they have stories and they need, you know. But if you also talk to Mark, he'll tell you, you can't just give him money. You can't, like, he's tried over. Them in apartments, fed them, got them back on their feet within six months, they're back on the street. I mean, it just happens over and over and over again. I mean, I think the amount of money that would have to be dumped into correcting that problem. I don't know. I mean, you can say, yeah, but just you should do it because it's the right thing to do. I don't know who's paying for it.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  32. “But most of them are on the street because they've just messed up over and over and over again. And they just kind of gave up”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  33. “I mean, being in prison and then the people that are in prison that are going to be homeless or have been homeless or the mental illness that I've dealt with in the halfway houses and even doing this. I don't know what you do with these people. I don't even know that you house them. You can't necessarily even house them together. They cause such problems. Like, I don't know what the solution is other than just kind of keeping them fed, maybe, and keep them away from normal people, you know, so they don't cause crime or whatever. I don't know about housing them in one area. That seems like a mistake. Like there is absolutely no good solution to that problem. None because it's not like, hey, if we gave you a house and we gave you job training and we gave you this, okay, you might get 5%.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  34. “They don't file taxes. So one of the questions I even ask the guy at one of the last questions I said, Do you believe that you will be gainfully employed within the next two years? Every one of them said no. No, no. So, you know, it's like, okay, they're not even trying. And they all had alcohol problems. Or honestly, the few of them I talked to was pretty clear. I mean, it tastes literally five minutes, less than five minutes to fill out the form. And I filled it out form, of course. But even filling it out in that brief just asking questions back and forth, half of them you could tell you've got some mental illness. Like something's not right with you. Like these aren't guys that are going to go out and get are going to get jobs. They're not cleaning up. So they were perfect for my purposes as horrible as I know that sounds.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  35. “Start surveying homeless people. Don't judge me, bro. I was in a bad spot. I was in a bad spot. I see the judgment. I see the judgment. Let's maintain civility here. Stay neutral. Stay neutral.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  36. “So I went home, I typed up what I called a federal statistical survey form. And I made a little thing. I mean, I went online. I mean, I'm always filling out federal documents as a mortgage broker. So it looked identical. I mean, I had like this little, like the recycle symbol and it was like, you know, federal form 17017. So I print out these forms. I get a go buy a clip board. I make a little a salvation army ID. I pin it on me and I go out and I start.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  37. “He said, people from halfway houses and what do you say social workers and stuff, they'll come out and they'll pass out stuff and they'll ask us questions and stuff. I'm like, oh, okay. And I was like, I thought, that's good to know. So I go back. I get grab Becky and she's like, oh, she's like, did you give him money? I said, give him like $40 or $60 or something. Forget what? She was like, that's a what a waste of money. That was good. That was money well spent. I said that guy's perfect. I said, that guy is, he's got everything. He has no way to be contacted. He has no documentation on him. I said he's not going to drive a car. He's not going to get a UI. He has an expired license. I just have to get his license reinstated. And I can be him.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  38. “Though I give him like another 20 bucks, ask him a few more questions. And then, oh, and I remember in the middle of it, he said, he goes, well, you're taking a survey or something? And I remember I kind of chuckled. I go, you get a lot of surveyors out here like that. And he goes, yes, sometimes. And I was like. Really? He goes, yeah. He said, like”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  39. “I said, when was the last time you were gainfully employed? He was like, ah, whatever. Ten years. I go, okay. Have you ever a criminal record? He's like, ah, I've been arrested in misdemeanors, like, you know, vagrancy. And he names off some things, you know, drunk in public, whatever. And I was like, are you on probation? He goes, I can't, I can't do probation. They don't give us probation. They keep us for 90 days. They release us. Like the judge knows I can't do. I'm not going to show up for a probation. I'm like, okay, do you have a driver's license? He's like, maybe I don't think so. I think it's just like, is it a DUI? He's like, no, I think it's just expired. Did you have a driver's license with you? He's like, no, I got nothing. I'm like, okay, well, you know, he told me he lived in like a tent in the woods.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  40. “Said, hold on, pulled over to a subway, got out. She went inside to get subway. I walk across the street, pulled out like 20 bucks and I said, hey, bro, can I ask you some quick questions real quick? He's like, yeah, what's up? And I go, here's 20 bucks. I said, listen.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  41. “I said, what if I steal somebody's identity? I get a driver's license in his name for states from where he lives, and he gets a DUI. I could get pulled over two years later and get arrested for a DUI that he got in Florida. And she's like, well, what are you thinking? Are you thinking like criminals? Or are you thinking like prisoners, like mental patients? And I went, I mean, I don't, and I looked over and there was a homeless guy holding a sign. And I went like that guy. She goes, she's the hobo? Like, I don't know who calls them hobos. And she's like, the hobo? I said, yes, that guy.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  42. “I have a driver's license in his name. I am him. So he did show up. He showed up at the lawyer's office. So So I do that. I'm living in the house. And we're driving along one day. I'm saying we got to get real. Like these people that are calling, like that, one guy, I get his information, but during the course of taking the application and I'm asking like these government survey questions at the very end, there's like 20 questions and I'm rambling them off. And at some point he was like, he said, he volunteered. Like I didn't know, I never even asked anybody about criminal history. And he just, he ended up saying something. Well, I do have a felony. Does that matter? I mean, he's like, I mean, he was a DUI. I've had a couple DUIs, but I got my license back. And that was part of the reason he had bad credit. And it was like, okay, no, no, it doesn't matter. Don't worry. I'm thinking, you're not getting a loan. So this is, I'm just taking your, I'm just stealing from you, stealing your information. So I get all this information. I'm gathering it. And so one of the things I said to Becky while we are sitting at this stoplight is I'm like, we got to get real people's real information. And I said, like, for instance,”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  43. “Saying home loans available, good credit, bad credit, no problem, call now government loans, you know, government, VA, FHA, finance, whatever, call this number. So people start calling. I'm getting their information. One of the guys I got was Michael Eckert. Yeah, I remember Michael Eckert. Poor Michael Ashley legally changed his name to Michael Johnson at one point. But at this point, it was just Michael Eckert. So I don't. Wanted to see, you know, I'm bored. I want to see what the process is. How much does it cost? Is this possible? Let me see if I can change this guy's name. It was $1,500. I changed it.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  44. “Public records, they're not notified. So those are gone. But it takes about a month or two for it to show up. Atlanta was that far behind. I think it was Fulton County. They were just way behind. So we just kind of have to dick around for a while, right? So we're going on little vacations. We're going to New Orleans. We're going to different places. Has Scott Cugno driving a car as Scott Cognow? We opened up several bank accounts. We opened multiple bank accounts. And then we end up going to Vegas. And we do go to Vegas, but what happened was we're driving around. And I remember thinking telling her, I was like, you know, this is a problem. Like we have to get real IDs, real driver's licenses. I mean, this is real, but this is a real person too. And he may stumble across it. And so what I did was I started running ads in magazines.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  45. “Filled out two of them. I just ordered, you know, you can do research. So when I went downtown, I researched Bank of America satisfaction of mortgages. And thousands show up. So I just grab a couple of them. Now I know what the basic template is. And they're all different, by the way. So it's not like you even have to be that close. But whatever. I mimicked some of them where I had a notary stamp, not hard to get. You know, you just, you go in and you'll go into three different office depots and you say, hey, I need a notary stamp and you give them the information and you come back four day or whatever a week later and they give it to you. So I've got these notary stamps. So I notarize the satisfactions. I go down town. I file them. Boom. The mortgages are gone. Keep in mind, Bank of America, he's still paying the mortgages. They don't know that they've been satisfied.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  46. “Get like a Honda or something. So now we're living in a house. We've got some furniture, bedroom furniture, and I go downtown, I pull the title to this guy, Michael Shanahan's house And I go downtown and I satisfy the loan on his house. So he had two loans with Bank of America. And so I create two satisfaction of loans from Bank of America. So Michael Shanahan owns a house. In the name Michael Shanahan, he has one mortgage with Bank of America and a second one. When you pay your mortgage off, the way public records knows it's paid off is they mail public records a satisfaction of mortgage. It's a one-page document and it's notarized.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  47. “And I think that's all I needed. And then I went to Alabama and got a driver's license in his name. So I went into DMV, give him all these documents Which are almost all of them are real except for the lease. I said, sit over there. I sit over there. I sit down. Boom. 20 minutes later, I have a driver's license. It was $20 something dollars. It was nothing. So I get the driver's license. Now I'm driving this. I'm still driving a car, an Audi that is in the name of Matt Cox. So I parked that. I then go. Get social security to issue me a social security number in the name Scott Cugno. And I then turn around and I go and I get a loan. You put down 20-30%. There's all these first-time buyers. 30% down.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  48. “Go to Atlanta, make an ID, set it up, make some business cards, set up a couple websites, set up some, get an HQ, which is a company that will, you can do virtual, you can rent offices and they'll answer your phone for like $100 a month and they'll afford them. So it seems like you have an office. They give you a phone number, you call up, and they say, you know, hi, United Southern Bank, you know, and they'll answer the phone and forward messages. So we get one of those make a business card for Becky. She rents a house from a guy named Michael Shanahan. So we rent Michael Shanahan's house. It's like $200,000 $200,000 house in Alpharetta. I then go to Alabama. Wait, I then order. Scott Cugnosed birth certificate, social security card. I think I registered a vote in his name. And I made a lease agreement in his name.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  49. “This is Florida, but it was just a made up name. I'd gone to high school with a kid named David Freeman. So I had an idea, but I can't give that to a cop. Like, that's enough to get rent a place or do something. So we go.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source

  50. “Were you born here? You were born in, where are you from? Oh man, I was born here. I was born in such a so it was no big deal. We get to Atlanta. I make a fake ID for both of us. But keep in mind, I don't have, I don't have a driver's license. I do, but they're fake. Like, I can't give this to a cop. Can't give a driver's license that says David Freeman.”

    2024-01-17 · Lex Fridman Podcast · #409 – Matthew Cox: FBI Most Wanted Con Man – $55 Million in Bank Fraud · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT · source