YouSaid · the spoken record

Sally Kohn

lines on the record: 178
first: 2018-04-30
most recent: 2018-04-30
sittings or episodes: 1
sources: podcast

Every line below is reproduced as it was said and linked to the record it came from. Nothing here is summarised or generated. Directory · Search · Corrections

“And so we have to be able to challenge each other, and we have to be able to try to listen and engage even when it's hard, even when we don't want to, right? And not get, so that, again, that for me is the piece going forward. I hope this can be, I would like this to be, a constructive and kind engagement. And I, for my part, will continue to try to uphold that and will continue to try to apologize and do better.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So again, look, all I can do, listen, it sucks. Nobody likes learning lessons and it sucks to learn them in public. And trust me, part of what I want to stand for is that we have to be able to have these conversations because this is the only way any of us get better and learn.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The minute I found out she was upset about the quote, about the context, about the way it was used that I have done what I could to... Apologize and to fix it.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“About you, but I think about it. But I've already, but as a reporter, I haven't had this happen to me. I'm a great journalist. I know, but I've already answered you that I did and that I wish I'd reconfirmed the quote and wish I'd reconfirmed that she was okay with musing it. And I want to also make clear that privately.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I won't get a tech. I'm asking about you, but I think about it. No, I get it. I've told you. But as a reporter, I haven't had this happen to me, and sometimes I go, I did not get that quote right. And I'm just saying you have to do any journalist. I know.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And intentions and Goals and values to have to in any way, shape, or form. attack someone else. I won't. So I won't do it.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Think this is the case is a willful not hearing, a willful ignorance of what's happening. And so I just want to get from your perspective, what do you think is your looking back on it happened here? Do you think you misquoted her or didn't hear her correctly? Or do you think you absolutely did? You're sticking with that.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“When I read that quote and I know her very well, I was like, she would never say that. I've had a million discussions on this topic. And so I thought, so I was trying to figure out like she absolutely wouldn't have said that. Like it seemed so wrong that she would say something like that. And you have said she said this in the car, correct? So I was like, she'd never, ever say that as someone who has talked to her dozens of times on this issue. So I wondered what then I was like, what happened did Sally miss hear it? Did she not take the correct notes? You know, as a reporter, I know that issue. Like, people don't think they got quoted correctly. I've had that happen to me not too many times in my career, but many times, even if you produce an audio thing, people say they didn't say it. You know what I mean? You get into those things. And so what I want to get to is, because the same thing is happening online that we just talked about, is we do not hear each other in some fashion or we misunderstand each other or, and I don't.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Well, can I And how do we get out of it? Let me just finish. Go ahead. Sorry, sorry, sorry. So I think it's fascinating this situation with Amina is really very similar to a lot of things you're talking about, how we miscommunicate or we don't hear each other or we don't look at each other in the correct way, clearly, right? I mean, I think that's...”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I got that. I got that. Let me just unpack that just a tiny bit. Because what was interesting is I'd love to get to why that happened too, because I think you do have a responsibility to do that because in this book, you're talking about that, how we get to where we get in an ugly discussion, right? That's what the book is about, is how we get ourselves into these situations. And you're in an ugly discussion, right? Presumably.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“There's a difference. I know there's a difference. That was not my intent. But intent and impact are very different things. Sure. And that was the impact that was felt. And all I can do going forward is try to learn and be better.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I wish I had gone back and reconfirmed that she was okay with musing that quote. I wish I had. I've apologized that I haven't. And in general. Again, the point of my bias, my blind spots, my privilege, my not seeing the ways in which I was pitting their ideas and thus them against each other in my book. I also regret, and I am sorry. And all I can do.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Is that as a white woman? I did not look at that quote in the context in which I was using it or in general and see the ways in which it Perpetuated stereotypes. And could expose her to vulnerability. That is also true. And for that reason, Not just because of the circumstances in which it was, but period.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I respect her memory of the situation. And that's that. I took notes on my phone. I pasted them into my Scrivener in the book writing program and I pasted them back into my statement. Now, what is also true.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“No, no, not where you were going. No, no, attacking someone else or their insistence. Right? Listen, I respect, I mean, I respect her voice.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I'm a reporter. I know. I know. But it's here's the thing. It's very, in my worldview, my principles and who I am. I don't like being in a position where to defend myself, I have to In any way, shape or form come close to.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“She went online. Facts are right. So I know. Facts are facts. I just want to be clear that I had consent to quote Amina. She said the quote, I took notes visibly in contemporaneously while she was talking. I have since produced those notes People are going to believe what they want to believe, but this was in the car. Those are the facts. Now, what is Google Notes? You put them on Google, because I'm just curious.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I think that this is an important conversation. So we could get into the details. I really don't want to litigate what's happened.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yes, who had the issue on Facebook? You were juxtaposing them. Two women of color. I want to hear from you what you think happened, and then I will give you my thought. I'll push back where I feel like I should. So tell me, I know you've talked about this a million times with people, and I've watched a lot of it.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Negative as in politics, and then we vote for the people who run the negative ads. Yep. So, yeah, they need to change, we need to change. All right.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“That changes structurally in terms of our leaders. It's the same thing with negative ads in politics. Over and over again in polls, we say we don't like”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“In general, right? Workplace, private, whatever. Fine. Maybe they do. I'm not going to listen. Oh, they do. But just so you know. I don't think everyone's equal in this, right? No, I'm pretty bad. So like, yeah, but you probably The point is Online. I know you do. And you know what, honey? Listen, mostly funny. You go do you. You do you. No, that's funny. I never mean it's funny. It's funny. Is to just not engage, right? First, do no harm. That's fine.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Um, I have to tell you, I'm pretty close. Right. Myself, if you're not going to get off, look, here's the thing. You can respond when there's hate, when you encounter hate online. We tend to have a they started at philosophy of hate in general, right? Workplace, private, whatever. Fine. Maybe they do. I'm not going to listen. Oh, they do. But just so you know. I don't think everyone's equal in this, right? No, I'm pretty bad. So like, yeah, but you probably don't, I don't know if you start. The point is someone, whatever, doesn't matter. The point is, do you continue it? So when you encounter hate online, I know you do. And you know what, honey? Listen, you're mostly funny. You go do you. You do you. No, that's funny. I've never mean it's funny. It's funny. You have a choice to me. You have three choices. One is to just not engage. First, do no harm. That's fine. Protect your own sanity and security. Second is to engage hate with hate, to feed hate with hate. More hate leads to more hate, leads to more hate, leads to more hate. That's what I have a problem with. And the third is to respond with compassion or kindness or humor or curiosity or generosity. So I do think, yes, at the end of the day, we, the people, need to push.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Accountable and demand that the change also behave differently, and then we'll take a break. So, what do individuals do? So that's what companies have to do. What do individuals have to do? Just get off of this stuff or what?”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yes, that's right. It's hard to bucket. It is hard to bucket. It's hard to buck. And you still can Cor Correct. And so we have to, we, the people, have to hold the systems accountable and demand that they change and also behave differently.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Yes, but if the systems are designed that way, then you behave that way. Yes, that's right. It's hard to bucket. It is hard to bucket. It's hard to bucket. And you still can. I'm not letting regular people out of it. Correct. They are designed to addict and anger. Correct. and irritate.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“For crowdsourcing. But what I will go back to is, and this was my part of what I hope to do with the book, is, again, we go back to that point about if you see nasty comments, you're more likely to leave me in comments. That means that we are. We are role models for others in the way we behave.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Amen. I get into this in the book that I think, for instance, media outlets need to get together. They need to, there needs to be some kind of, I don't know if it's a bipartisan. I'm a little bit worried in the short term that we can actually do anything about this. But for instance, to acknowledge that there is that not all information, not all news, not all reporting, not all writing, not all columns are the same. We need to have media literacy so that people understand the difference between reporting and opinion. And also that when a piece from New York Times or the Wall Street Journal for that matter pops up on my Facebook feed, it should be treated differently. Maybe there's a green check or there's something that I know that's different than something from Breitbart or I know they don't.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“By the way, there's also studies that when we're asked to leave a comment, right, the research is, you know, you have to leave a comment on a website, and the first three comments that are visible are hateful or nasty or trolling comments, you are then more likely to say something hateful and nasty. So again, so for me, and I get into comments. To a comment, coax.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Does it the work. It's the biggest problem on Twitter. I think seriously address issues of anonymity. There are studies, there's research that anonymity festers sort of negative cruelty. Yeah, and you contacted some people behavior more. Yeah. And there's also, by the way, there's studies that, you know, when people are sort of given assignment to type a message on a computer to someone else, when we can see a video of the other person's eyes, we write kinder messages.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Be more aggressive in policing trolls and bots. Okay. Apply your standards, apply them more evenly and aggressively. Across Facebook and others. Across all platforms. I happen to think Twitter.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So give me a few descriptions and then we'll get to our next section. Give me some prescriptions from your book and others is that, you know, besides reaching out, what being nicer online, what is the prescriptions of what the company should do, what people should do.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“The flip side to the challenge that it is now more invasive and sort of surround sound nature of it is because we're all implicated in it, is also that means we all have a part of the solution. So back in the days of the newspaper wars, Regular folks just had to kind of sit there and watch. And, you know, maybe you bought this one or you didn't buy that one, but that was sort of the extent of our power. Now we actually make the media with our clicks and our reclicks and our tweets and our posts. So yes, I think there are structural things that the companies need to do. I think the media needs to get its act together. Stop giving us prescriptions.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“To do that. That's right. And I don't, you know, when anyone says, like, oh, it's so much worse now than it ever was. It feels worse because it's more pervasive and we're all implicated in it. It's quicker and it's sort of surround sound of this. But like we have a deep history of hate in this country and in civility. And I mean, we are a country that was built on hate. So I don't necessarily think it's worse than it ever has been. I still think it's bad enough we have to do something about it.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“So, what happens when we have this is the way we do national discourse? I've just been listening to the Andrew Jackson biographers, which is fascinating. And similar fights. So they did it in newspapers. They did it in a very highly invective way. High levels of... Anger and their version of it, but it was a similar kind of thing. So it's sort of an American way to do that.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Actually, no, fear works better. Turns out. And hate, listen, hate, there are studies that we bond more through hate. So we will more readily bond with someone who we find we have things we dislike in common than things we like in common. So what happens when”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Not constructive anger, just sort of demonstrative, performative anger. Remember that the president uses it almost continually when he's not screaming at people on Fox News. Just today, just with the Kanye and the stuff around that, it was exhausting. It was not illuminating in any way. And it just... But it's also highly addictive.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But it has become an incredibly reductivist, outrage-driven sort of unhealthy, unconstructive angle, not constructive anger, just sort of demonstrative, performative anger.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“But they're playing an increasingly important role in our democratic Process and our discourse and our civil society. So I realize it's complicated. I would like to see them address it. I think issues of anonymity should be addressed. It's what makes Twitter worse than some of the other platforms But I also think it is ultimately true. It's up to us. So we as people, there are examples in the book of people who did incredibly kind and generous and used Twitter in ways to break down barriers and to spread compassion. And certainly when we talk about getting outside of our bubble and meeting people who are different than us, right? That's also what we can do on social media. That's incredible.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“You know, I have to say, I think Twitter should be taking some responsibility, right? Like they have seemed to have, because it helps their valuation, they seem to have no interest.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Gossip. It's like the national inquirer and it's pylons without fact and it's attacks and it's smears and it's this and it's that and it's a complete lack of nuance”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Some of it's funny, yeah. Oh, but it's But I will say, first of all, it's just so much, it feels like so much a minefield. Right, and even the news sometimes it's actual important breaking substantive news, and I'm grateful for it to happen.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“And it felt democratic and constructive, and I was meeting people and I was having these conversations. And for me, who didn't kind of know anyone in the media and whatever, it was a space to access and engage people who were important and important voices. And it felt like a marketplace. And now it feels like, you know, sort of public spectacle. Of attacks and smears, and it's just, it's gone.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Not confined. It has become worse and worse and worse. I remember Twitter. So I got on in, I think right around when I started all this, so 2009-ish. And I remember it was a space to engage.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Absolutely. So let's talk about that concept. So you have all these, you reached out to a lot of people online because I think a lot of people feel that online has become Twitter? Twitter. Yes. So talk to me about Twitter and what you think their responsibility is”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Did everyone know I'm gay? And they all raised their hands for me. And then we look, we talked about what? Here's what I would say. I want to leave him there. You know, I have had people had this happen to me. It wasn't John Hannity, but I think my answer was you cannot die soon enough. That's what I said. Yeah, okay. So guess what?”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“I said, I asked the whole makeup room. I was like, everyone, quick show of hands. Did everyone know I'm gay? And they all raised their hands. And then we look, we talked about, but what would I rather say? Do I want to leave them there?”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“On the show. I sort of went, you know, I'm not saying that. It's not personal. And I said, Sean, it is personal. You're talking about my family. And he sort of kind of stumbled through it and then the segment ended. And then he found me the next day, I think, in makeup.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“My deeply held convictions and beliefs. It's engaging in a way that I don't say, hey, you're canceling out my humanity, and so you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to cancel out yours. Yeah.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT
“Are you sincerely suggesting that your family is superior to my family? Now In that moment, let's think about that. In that moment, I could have said. Sean, you're a hateful bigot. I could have said, Sean, you're being a homophobic asshole. I could have said, you know, I can't write. I called him in instead of calling him out. I said, are you really saying that? So it's not saying, all right, well, if you disagree with me, all right, fine, let's meet in the middle somewhere. No, I'm not letting go of.”
2018-04-30 · Decoder with Nilay Patel · Recode Decode: Sally Kohn · IDENTIFIED FROM THE TRANSCRIPT