Liz Kimmins
Newry and Armagh · Sinn Féin · Northern Ireland
“I do not know how it will have affected North Antrim specifically unless the Member is referring to something in particular. We all have a responsibility in climate change and what we do to try to mitigate its impacts.”
“As the Member rightly said, removal of the zero-detriment policy is for the AERA Minister, and I have engaged with the Minister on that, as well as on the removal of the statement of regulatory principles and intent. I recognise that removing that would have detrimental impact on future development.”
“In response, we recently developed and introduced new appraisal guidance, which represents a significant and deliberate shift in approach. Under the previous arrangements, schemes were largely determined by a monetised cost-benefit ratio threshold where, typically, projects that fell below a ratio of one did not progress.”
“A number of significant issues have led to that scenario. I assume that the Member is referring to waste water capacity. I have said that NI Water has suggested that it needs between £3·5 billion to £3·6 billion for the next price control period.”
“Recruitment is a key challenge faced by all Departments. In questions to the Minister of Health, my colleague from Newry and Armagh referred to the recruitment issue that recently impacted on Daisy Hill. The challenge is not unique to DFI. I want to put a focus on ensuring that we build our internal capacity and improve staffing levels.”
“The Executive and the Assembly agree that the Executive's Budget is not adequate, which is why we are in that negotiation. When it comes to the capital budget, we have to factor in a timeline for the legal challenge that we are going through. It is unlikely that we will get a decision from the court on this side of the summer recess.”
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“When funding looks more likely, we will, hopefully, be able to engage in consultations. <BR /> <BR />I will quickly recap on some of the other points that were made. My colleagues in Newry and Armagh raised connectivity for people coming from Newry, south Armagh and, indeed, South Down, who, for various reasons, may have to go to Craigavon Area Hospital instead of Daisy Hill. That is a point that we have consistently raised. We recognise that, on the whole, our hospital network is changing with the transformation of health services, but we have to ensure that hospitals are easily accessible to all. That is an issue that I am acutely aware of. I hope that any future transport plans are made in tandem with the transformation work of the Health Minister and his Department.”
“I take on board the concerns that have been raised, which form an important part of any planning or development process. To date, the Department has taken the lead and engaged with the health trust and with the adjacent housing developer and landowners to develop a solution, and planning approval was received. As has been pointed out, the major benefactor of that access route would be the health trust. Therefore, it was agreed that the health trust and the Department would be responsible for a lot of the funding and would be required to make it available. Officials continue to engage with the trust on that. At this stage, we are unable to commit to taking forward the project until funding is secured. However, I take on board the concerns that have been raised in relation to residents.”
“Associated with that work is the awarding of the contract to build the replacement footbridge at Moylinn in Craigavon, which will connect the local community. The Black Paths also form part of the national cycle network, providing access to the local leisure centre and shopping facilities. It is my intention that further projects will be delivered in the Craigavon area that encourage and enable safe, active and sustainable travel choices. <BR /> <BR />A number of Members raised the issue of having a secondary access route to Craigavon Area Hospital. As some pointed out, in partnership with the Southern Health and Social Care Trust and a local developer, officials have explored the potential of a new secondary access route to the hospital coming from Lisnisky Lane.”
“I thank the Member for his intervention, because it leads me on to the next few points that I was going to make. <BR /> <BR />Officials continue to take forward active travel projects in local areas, including Craigavon. There is a proposal to upgrade and improve the links to Craigavon Area Hospital on Mandeville Road from Parkmore towards the hospital. Earlier in the year, work was undertaken to upgrade the existing segregated cycle tracks and footpaths along the Black Paths between the underpass at South Lake leisure centre and Drumgor youth centre. As the Member said, doing that will hopefully help improve active travel connections to local schools and other amenities and, importantly, improve the connections for residents in the surrounding area.”
“<BR /> <BR />A number of Members talked about active travel. As Members will know, I am keen to promote and encourage the use of sustainable transport modes such as walking, cycling and public transport as an alternative to the private car. Officials are reviewing submissions received as part of the public consultation stage of my Department's draft active travel delivery plan. The consultation concluded on 28 February. I thank everyone who took the time to respond to it. The consultation will lead to my finalising the delivery plan.”
“That is consistent with traffic patterns and conditions across many of our towns and cities. It is important to recognise, however, the potential impact that the congestion may be having on access to Craigavon Area Hospital. <BR /> <BR />My Department's transport strategy and its suite of transport plans will set priorities for the future development of our road and rail network up until 2035. Mr Tennyson's comments about some of the plans that were in place previously and whether we will have to start over will feed into setting those priorities, because the strategy is working to address the challenges that we currently face. There are a growing number of cars on the roads, so, yes, it is about congestion, but we must also consider the climate emergency and transport safety, which are key priorities.”
“<BR /> <BR />Regrettably, the resource funding position is equally challenging. It will mean having to continue with a limited service for road maintenance that targets the highest-priority defects in order to protect public safety until such a time as we have increased funding or find a better way forward. I continue to work with Executive colleagues to ensure that the appropriate investment is made to improve the quality of our road network and to contribute to the delivery of priorities in the agreed Programme for Government. <BR /> <BR />Local traffic congestion has been the key theme of the debate. I am aware that traffic can build up in some parts of the Craigavon area, including the Northway, as Members mentioned, and the A27 Lurgan Road, at peak times in particular.”
“It is also important to say that, at this time, my Department is considering a new road maintenance strategy. I hope to be able to provide the Assembly with more information about that in the time ahead, because we have to look at whether we can do things differently. <BR /> <BR />The Executive agreed the 2024-25 Budget, and best use has been made of that funding, by my predecessor and, in the short number of weeks that I have been in post, by me, to target road resurfacing. In this financial year, £104 million has been allocated to capital structural maintenance, which includes resurfacing. That figure includes £12·5 million of the £19 million that my colleague the former Minister for Infrastructure secured for essential road maintenance and street-lighting work from the October 2024 monitoring round.”
“We have all seen the continued deterioration in infrastructure over the past 10 years as a result, as the Member outlined, with a large number of potholes, some of which beggar belief, and other defects developing across the road network. The weather has also played a critical part, particularly in recent times. <BR /> <BR />The estimated value of the difference — this encapsulates the scope of the shortfall in funding — between what was needed to maintain the network and what was available to spend between 2014 and 2024 is approximately £1 billion. That clearly identifies where the challenges lie and makes apparent the difference in quality that should be expected when such a significant shortfall in maintenance spending occurs.”
“I thank the Member for raising that point. Given that it is a significant route, my assessment is that it would be prioritised, but I can get further information from officials on the specific area. The topic of the debate is broad, so I do not have the specifics here, but I am happy to come back to him on that later. <BR /> <BR />I am well aware of the frustration and, at times, inconvenience that is caused. People and communities in the area rely on the road network to do business, go to work and school, connect with one another and, more important to this debate, access critical health services. Officials have worked hard to maintain the road network; they have nonetheless been forced to concentrate on only the highest-priority road repairs.”
“<BR /> <BR />It goes without saying that investment in new roads and in maintaining roads is critical to ensuring the safe movement of people and goods, allowing the growth of our economy and ensuring good health outcomes. I stress that the North can have whatever quality of road network that it wants; it just needs to be funded. Without such funding, roads will continue to deteriorate and pose a safety risk and will impede safe movement. My Department, like other Departments, has operated in a difficult financial environment for a number of years due to the chronic underfunding that we are all aware of, with the austerity of successive British Governments. That creates significant challenges to our ability to maintain the road network in a safe condition.”
“I thank Mr Beattie for securing this important debate on concerns about the road infrastructure leading to Craigavon Area Hospital. The issue is important to me, as a Newry and Armagh MLA and a former member of the Health Committee. I listened intently to Members as they commented and raised issues, and I have heard their concerns, particularly about the inner road network in Craigavon. The area is similar to others in the North, but, having been at the hospital in a personal capacity and for meetings and other things, I am aware of the surrounding road network. I am not familiar with all the names, but, in my mind, I can see it. It has been useful to get a real insight into it, and I thank Mr Beattie and other Members for Upper Bann for the information that they gave.”
“Go raibh maith agat, a Leas-Cheann Comhairle.”
“On a point of order, Mr Speaker. During Members' statements, Timothy Gaston raised an issue in relation to my announcement yesterday on Irish language signage for Grand Central station and indicated that an equality screening had not been completed. I want to rectify that. An equality screening had been completed, and the findings were that the signage would have a minor positive impact, which did not require me to move to an equality impact assessment.”
“The investigation is restricted for six weeks. I hope that we will receive the report shortly after that to ensure that we can move on and deal with the outcome of it as quickly as possible.”
“At this stage, I do not have the estimated cost, but I can come back to the Member when that is available.”
“At present, the total budget is £500 million, so just £0·5 billion.”
“That is exactly why we are doing this. I am acutely aware of how important the issue is. Water quality is key. We have to do more to ensure that the money that has been allocated is spent in the right way and that we are using it in the most efficient way to deliver the services that the Member outlined.”
“My decision today indicates that I have not lost control of my Department. Every ALB is having difficulties, but a number of them that are linked with my Department have lived within their budget and have had to make very difficult decisions in order to do so. As I said earlier, this is my approach to try to tackle that issue, to understand very clearly why NI Water is in this position and, if we can do more, where we can do more, both within the allocated budget and as we move forward as an Executive.”
“As I have said, I am continuing with the three-pronged approach that is already in place. Today's announcement will, hopefully, strengthen the work that I am doing with Executive colleagues on future allocations and complement the other work that is happening around the waste water and sustainable drainage Bill and developer contributions. <BR /> <BR />There is a recognition across the House that we have to do everything in our power to try to resolve the issue. There is a real willingness on my part to do so, but the one thing that I will not commit to do is to put an additional financial burden on domestic customers.”
“Evidence from water and sewerage companies operating under mutual and privatised business models in England and Wales has clearly demonstrated that significant operational pressures persist in many of those companies, particularly with sewerage infrastructure, in addition to serious concerns about debt management and the cost of servicing debt. <BR /> <BR />As the Member will know, I am opposed to the introduction of domestic water charging, as it would impose additional financial burden on people and families in the midst of a cost-of-living crisis.”
“50% of its revenue from government subsidy, and borrowing is provided through my Department. Reclassifying NI Water as, for example, a mutualised company would require the removal of NI Water from central government oversight and the introduction of a guaranteed and predictable funding stream that is not subject to direct political control or competing public-sector priorities. Additionally, NI Water would be required to secure debt financing through the private bond market, potentially resulting in huge risks due to the scale of borrowing and servicing of that debt.”
“We are doing a range of work to address those issues. The Member has outlined in particular the delivery of housing. She will be aware that, last Friday, I launched the developers' contributions consultation. This is another step in our work on numerous issues to address the overall funding issue. <BR /> <BR />NI Water is classified as a non-departmental public body (NDPB). It receives”
“That is still being finalised. We hope that the investigation will commence in approximately a week, so we are in the finalisation stage. Departmental officials expect to engage on a very regular basis — weekly — with NI Water, and we have made it aware of that. That, hopefully, shows our commitment to concluding the investigation as soon as possible and as thoroughly as possible. The forensic accountant will be completely external to the Department. I hope that they can look at it from a different perspective that will give us a clearer view of the inner workings of how budgets are managed and where we can make changes to resolve the issues.”
“As I said, it has been an ongoing issue, and we have said it on numerous occasions through my engagement, my officials' engagement, my permanent secretary's engagement and my predecessor's engagement with it. It has been an ongoing matter for discussion. Whilst the overspend has significantly reduced through the year, we are, unfortunately, still in this position. It is important that I recognise the seriousness of this and that we take steps to ensure that it does not happen again.”
“The issue is that the overall Executive Budget is not enough — the Member is fully aware of that — and the allocations that I have received are not enough, so we have to dot our i's and cross our t's to ensure that every penny goes where it needs to go. This is a really good opportunity for NI Water to outline its position clearly so that we can stand over that when allocations are made and say that NI Water cannot continue to reduce. <BR /> <BR />I hope that the Member is reassured that health and safety is paramount to me and that we are doing these things because we want to ensure that everything is done as effectively and efficiently as possible.”
“I do not underestimate the challenges that any ALB has in living within its budget. The point of the investigation is to ensure that everything that is being managed within the budget is done in the most effective and efficient way. A number of factors have led to the overspend, and I have been working with NI Water to identify those and find where savings can be made.”
“Health and safety is paramount in every case. I have said clearly that we have been working with the board. However, if my Department overspends, there is a consequence. We all have difficult work to do to ensure that we live within our budgets.”
“NI Water received a letter early this morning, as we were working on the matter right up until late last night. I hope that that indicates how seriously I have been taking the issue and the consideration that has been given to taking these steps. We have had frequent engagement with NI Water throughout the process. As part of that, I have offered to meet NI Water's board to discuss the next steps. I hope that we can do that in the near future. <BR /> <BR />Members have raised a number of questions on a possible fraud investigation, and responses have been provided. I cannot comment on the detail of the investigation, as we will not know that until we do the investigation. It would not be fair to make any further comment at this point.”
“No. I understand that, in December 2023, when the Assembly was down, and in the absence of local Ministers, NI Water highlighted a potential overspend of over £30 million in its capital budget. NI Water resolved that at the time by slowing down elements of its capital spend to ensure that it remained within budget. In recent years, NI Water's resource pressures have been reduced in-year or addressed through in-year allocations, meaning that it has lived within budget.”
“The issue was raised at Committee, and, as it was my first appearance, we were not clear what was and was not made public. At that stage, it was my assumption that the documents were public, but we gave a commitment to go back and provide the information, which we have done. The reports that have been provided are in the public domain. That tells me that the others are not, for whatever reason. We can get information about why that is the case and provide it to the Member.”
“I thank the Member for his question. In making my decision, when I was considering the steps, the time that the process would take was really important. I want the work to be done not only as thoroughly but as effectively and efficiently as possible. We hope that it will be concluded in about six weeks, with it starting in the next week or so. We are trying to do a short and sharp investigation, but we hope that it will be as thorough as possible. The next steps will depend on the outcome of the investigation. I intend to update Members, particularly those on the Committee, on that.”
“As I said earlier, the Department has worked throughout the year with NI Water on its budget allocation. The chair of NI Water wrote to me on 11 March to advise that, in the event of no further resource funding being made available or the overspend not being regularised, the board of NI Water had determined that the appropriate course of action was to issue a directive to the chief executive to overspend by something in the region of £5 million. As I said, it is hugely disappointing that, despite ongoing engagement with the chair on the need to live within budget, the board decided not to take action to do so. We have had numerous engagements on the issue. The overall amount has reduced in recent days, but, unfortunately, given the fact that we are so close to the end of the financial year, I was required to take these steps.”
“There is a consequence of every action related to this, and I have been mindful of that. That also led me to make the decision, because we cannot continue to operate on such a trajectory. We need to find a way forward so that NI Water and any other ALBs do not find themselves in a position where they are frequently required to overspend on their budget.”
“As I said, the challenge is the fact that there are significant challenges across my Department on many competing priorities, and Members will be fully aware of that. My predecessor was required to take difficult decisions to balance the overall departmental budget while maintaining the essential services that the Department delivers. Opening capital and resource budgets were provided to fund essential services, including allocations to NI Water and other ALBs. It was recognised that, in all cases, those fell short of what had been identified as being needed and that further difficult decisions needed to be taken. <BR /> <BR />For the Department to provide additional funding to regularise NI Water's budget, I will have to take and redirect money from other essential services.”
“Yes. I hope that I will be able to provide feedback to the Committee and the Assembly. At the end of the day, that is one of the key reasons why I took the decision. I am very mindful that I am accountable to the Assembly and that we need to be sure that public funding is spent in the right way. I am happy to provide an update once the investigation concludes.”
“It is not an issue of having confidence in the board. It is hugely disappointing to me that, despite ongoing engagement with the chair on the need to live within budget, the NI Water board decided not to take action to do so. I hope that everyone recognises that my decision to appoint a forensic accountant is a necessary step that takes a measured approach. A number of options were available to me, and that is the best way forward: it will help us to work in partnership with NI Water and, going forward, to plan better in a time of constrained budgets.”
“<BR /> <BR />For me, the investigation is not about undermining the work of the Utility Regulator. It is an opportunity to look as thoroughly as possible at the issue and at where there are any gaps or things that could be done internally. If there are not, it will strengthen the case for additional funding, and I can bring that to Executive colleagues at a later stage, but it is very important that we do the investigation at this stage.”
“We have had frequent engagement with NI Water throughout the year. We have engaged with NI Water regularly since I came into post. We gave it as many opportunities as possible to ensure that it did everything that it could to live within its budget. That was made clear not only by me but by my permanent secretary, officials and my predecessor, John O'Dowd. This is not the first year in which it has happened. I hope that the fact that it has happened close to the end of the financial year indicates how hard everyone has been working to get us to a point where we did not have to take those steps. However, in the past number of days, NI Water indicated that it is still looking at an overspend of close to £3 million. It is therefore incumbent on me to make a decision.”
“Without going into the detail of the investigation at this stage, I hope that, ideally, it will help us to see exactly what position NI Water is in from a budgetary perspective. This is an opportunity for us to cross-reference the information that has been provided to us so that we can agree a proactive way forward. The Member and others have asked questions in the Chamber about my confidence in the figures that we have been provided with to date. This investigation should be seen as a pragmatic approach that will affect how we move forward with funding. As I said before, however, the funding model that is in place is the best one, but we have to look at how that money is being managed internally by NI Water and whether it is being used in the most effective and efficient way to allow it to deliver what we need it to do.”
“<BR /> <BR />In line with my decision to proceed, I have instructed my officials to put in place the necessary steps to urgently appoint suitably qualified forensic accountants to progress this investigation as quickly and thoroughly as possible. Members will appreciate that, because this will be a live investigation, I do not propose to comment further until such times as the investigation is complete. <BR /> <BR />In closing, I very much hope that my decision will help us to move forward together in partnership. These are difficult times for us all, and we must ensure that we do the best that we can with the resources that are available.”
“I have considered those options carefully, and my decision to appoint a forensic accountant is a necessary step that takes a measured approach to help us to work in partnership with NI Water and to enable better planning going forward in these times of constrained budgets. <BR /> <BR />I wish to reassure Members that I am taking the possibility of an overspend very seriously, while adopting a pragmatic approach to understanding how we have ended up in this situation so close to the financial year-end. I hope that any learning from this investigation will be useful for both parties and will help to prevent such an occurrence in future years.”
“Difficult decisions are having to be made across all Departments and arm's-length bodies; therefore, it is essential that I fully understand the budgetary management decisions that NI Water has taken this year, which have led to NI Water's board proposing this unprecedented and disappointing course of action. <BR /> <BR />I was, therefore, faced with a number of options, given the serious nature of the board's intention to instruct NI Water to incur a potential budget overspend and, in particular, the wider implications for other key essential services that my Department funds.”
“Following the October 2024 monitoring round, it was made clear to NI Water that it was required to live within the increased resource allocation, as it was unlikely that any further funding would become available. Unfortunately, in recent weeks, NI Water's board has indicated in writing that it is minded to instruct NI Water to overspend unless additional budget is made available. It is estimated that any potential overspend could be in the region of £3 million, although the exact quantum of that remains subject to cost variations between now and the year-end close. <BR /> <BR />Protecting public funds is of the utmost importance, particularly in light of the wider pressures that are being faced not only by my Department but across all areas of our public services.”
“In addition, £2·9 million was provided to deal with the aftermath of storm Éowyn, bringing the current allocation to just over £152 million.”
“Opening capital and resource budgets were provided to fund those essential services, which included allocations to the Department's arm's-length bodies (ALBs). It was recognised that, in all cases, those allocations fell short of the need that had been identified and meant that further difficult decisions and prioritisation by the ALBs would be required. <BR /> <BR />NI Water was allocated an opening resource budget of some £137 million, which represented almost one quarter of the total resource allocation available to my Department. Recognising the importance of water and waste water services, bids were submitted for additional funding for NI Water as part of the in-year monitoring process. An additional £11·5 million of resource was secured for NI Water in-year.”
“for the opportunity to address the Assembly. My statement is on my decision to start the process of engaging forensic accounting services to investigate why NI Water has been unable to live within its resource budget allocation this year. <BR /> <BR />Members are fully aware of the budgetary challenges that my Department faces following years of underfunding by the British Government. In the current financial year, my predecessor was required to take difficult decisions in order to balance the budget while maintaining the range of essential services that are delivered by my Department. Those essential services include maintaining our road network, providing public transport and delivering essential water and waste water services.”
“I am loath to say that decisions on where houses are built are taken based on the area of the community that people are in. Everything has to be assessed on its merits. I will say that, where there are difficulties, NI Water's developer constraints team engages with developers to find solutions. The broader issue is not specific to North Belfast but is something that we face in our constituencies across the North. That is why we are trying to find a solution that will help us to deliver on all the challenges that we face in housebuilding and in all the other building schemes, whether healthcare, education, retail or hospitality, that are really important to us.”
“Other models, as the Member outlined, have been looked at time and time again. The model in the North is similar to that in Scotland and in the South. My priority is to ensure that we do not put additional costs on domestic water users. That would be problematic, and I am committed to not doing it. There are other things that we can do with what is available to us that will improve the situation.”
“If we can find a more equitable, fairer solution that brings in a more consistent amount of funding, we have to consider it. All those concerns can be looked at as part of the consultation response.”