Nuala McAllister
North Belfast · Alliance Party · Northern Ireland
“I have submitted quite a number of questions for written answer on autism services, and the answers, sometimes on the same day from the Department, contradict themselves. The Minister often refers to the emotional health and well-being framework as the idea that will frame all of the uniform services.”
“Absolutely. Everyone is taking my speech; I was going to say that. Of course, it is complex and subjective to the individual person. If we are truly talking about keeping an individual safe and other prisoners safe, we would not do what the amendment proposes; we would carry on in the way that the system already operates, using a risk-bas…”
“I thank the Member for his question. The Assembly Commission is progressing a programme of remedial works to address defects identified in the roof of Parliament Buildings and to protect the long-term integrity of this grade A listed building. The works have been structured in two phases.”
“More often than not, we have conversations in the Chamber or in public about trans women, but that would place a trans man who has been convicted of a violent crime against a woman in a prison with women. It does not make sense, and it is not coming from the perspective of safety; it is coming from ideology.”
“In providing catering services throughout Parliament Buildings, the Assembly Commission strives to meet the differing demands of the special dietary needs of our wide customer base.”
“I support amendment No 96 and oppose amendment No 97. I do not plan to speak to amendment No 96, as there were a number of interventions last night, and I will leave many of the remarks to my party colleague the Minister of Justice. <BR /> <BR />We oppose Timothy Gaston's amendment.”
The complete record
Every one of 1,216 lines we hold for Nuala McAllister, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 8 of 25.
“Sundry costs incurred by the Interpretation and Translation Service, including for learning and development and office equipment, have been absorbed by the budget allocated to the Office of the Official Report (Hansard).”
“I thank the Member for his question. Further to a direction from the Assembly in June 2021, the Assembly Commission provides a simultaneous and passive system for interpretation. That service is provided by the Interpretation and Translation Service, which has been operational and available to interpret from Irish to English since May 2022. <BR /> <BR />The cost of providing the Interpretation and Translation Service, from Irish to English, over the two years from 1 October 2023 to 30 September 2025 has been £387,000. That cost reflects the salaries paid to one senior interpreter at Assembly grade 5 and two interpreters at Assembly grade 6.”
“Another element of the podcast is that it shines a light again on the resistance of many in the PSNI to investigating Katie's death, which many knew was a murder. The question of why her murderer's records were hidden from the internal PSNI systems has been made public again. That could not have been a mistake. <BR /> <BR />The release of the episodes has brought a raft of new concerns into the public domain. I assure everyone who has listened and contacted me, Tanya and others that I remain committed to uncovering the full truth behind those events. I want to make sure that nothing like this ever happens again, and, for that, there must be accountability and transparency from everyone involved.”
“I give credit to Tanya Fowles, a journalist who kept pressure on the police to ensure that the information came out to the public. <BR /> <BR />The revelations about Katie's death and the subsequent investigation that finally came out at the weekend are so significant that attention must be drawn to them. Tanya Fowles has made it public that a staff member of an elected representative contacted her to tell her to back off and that there was nothing to see, using information that could have been gained only from inside the police. That is hugely significant, so I will say it again: political interference by a staff member of an elected representative with knowledge and information known only by the PSNI.”
“Katie Simpson was murdered in August 2020. Her death and the failure to achieve justice for her is still felt today, but her legacy will live on. That legacy will be that this will never happen again. However, that legacy will be truly lived only if there is full transparency and accountability in respect of what happened. <BR /> <BR />At the weekend, we saw the release of the second half of the BBC Sounds podcast 'Assume Nothing' about Katie's death and the subsequent investigation. I have known the details around the issues for some years and have brought them to the relevant authorities every time that new information has come to light. I have often been met with raised voices and patronising remarks, with people telling me to keep my questions private.”
“I thank the Member for taking an intervention. I neglected to mention in my speech that I also did a ride-along to a custody suite. There has been a media spotlight on young people who are not in a mental health crisis but are under the care of social services, who remain detained in custody suites because the health service cannot find a home for them. It is not just about Right Care, Right Person; it is much wider.”
“I thank the Member for giving way. I note that you made that point almost to get back at us for using the words "failings in the health ... system". Those are not words that I alone use: they come from family members whose loved ones died by suicide because the system failed them. That does not mean one individual healthcare worker; it is a system failure. Whether we like it or not, families have had loved ones take their own life because they did not have the support that they needed. That is a fact. It comes not come from me but from the people who reach out to us to say, "I want my loved one to be here. They should have got the support that they needed".”
“I thank the Member for giving me the time to make an intervention. It is important to acknowledge that, in a power-sharing Executive, we have to advocate and speak up for individual issues across each Department in the Executive. We have no problem with the DUP amendment and will also support it. You raise the issue that the Department of Justice and the PSNI have supported that model and have run with it, but it has taken years of trying to get everyone else on board. That is a realistic factor, and we need to achieve that.”
“The motion is not about policing stepping back from any and all responsibility in those crisis scenarios. The PSNI has been clear that it wants to fulfil its duties in that area. It is about pressing the Department of Health to ensure that the health sector can fulfil its responsibilities, rather than have the current unfair and unsustainable burden lying with the police, and, ultimately, to ensure that people in a mental health crisis get the right care, by the right people, at the right time.”
“Delivering the mental health strategy is a perfect example of that, not least because it will reduce the burden on policing and free up officer time to deal with crime in our community, which is something that every MLA in the Chamber is vocal on, calling for more resource to deal with it. However, most importantly, it is about the individual and the care that they need at the right time.”
“They are spent on the officers waiting in A&E for up to 14 hours a day, who have no choice but to respond to the "concern for safety" calls. They are spent in the community by the community and voluntary sector that picks up the pieces when our statutory services fail. They are spent on the health services when people's mental health is so badly affected that their care and the response to their care is so much more significant where there has been a failure to act early for each person. For what it is worth, I would prioritise spending on investment that would result in savings, either in the future or for another service.”
“However, despite that, the failings in the health sector limit the success of that approach. The police have been upfront that they cannot and will not leave a person in crisis unaccompanied, meaning that they still spend countless officer hours supporting people who need more appropriate support from healthcare professionals. Let me be clear: it is not the fault of the individual healthcare staff in our workforce. Many GPs, front-line hospital staff and approved social workers are doing everything they can with the resources available to them to support individuals facing a mental health crisis. <BR /> <BR />I hope that we do not hear that the financial situation surrounding the Department of Health is a reason for not implementing Right Care, Right Person, because the resources are already spent.”
“That has been advocated for and lobbied on by the senior leadership of the PSNI, not least due to the issues I have already highlighted around the Mental Health Order. <BR /> <BR />The PSNI and the Department of Justice cannot be found lacking in trying to find solutions to the problem. They have taken a leadership role in implementing the Right Care, Right Person model, ensuring that individuals in mental health crisis can receive the right care from the right person at the right time. The PSNI leadership team has hosted cross-agency meetings with the trusts, the Department of Health and relevant health representative bodies to emphasise the opportunities that a collaborative approach through the model could create for everyone — the police, health workers and, most important, the individuals in need of care.”
“Other forces in England and Wales are now following suit, and Northern Ireland must not be left behind. Unfortunately, I have also witnessed at first hand the detention of people in my constituency of North Belfast, and it is in no way an easy thing to do. A person who is in a mental health crisis is already going through a traumatic and difficult time, and the presence of the police can sometimes exacerbate that. Not only does it result in the unnecessary stigmatisation of those in crisis, who are potentially seen as criminals due to the presence of police officers in stab vests with sidearms, but it is not a therapeutic way of dealing with a mental health crisis. Furthermore, it leaves officers in the extremely difficult position of making potentially clinical decisions when they have no authority to do so.”
“This is not a new issue; it has been discussed at length at the Policing Board, and colleagues from across the Chamber have joined with the PSNI to advocate about it. It was also discussed at a joint Justice and Health Committee meeting last November, and the PSNI made it clear that the pressure from dealing with mental health crisis calls was unsustainable. Policing has become very much baked into the everyday public sector response to unmet Health demand. <BR /> <BR />As a member of the Policing Board, I have seen the Right Care, Right Person model from its inception in Humberside in 2021 to its replication in other forces. However, over the last four years, we have yet to see its implementation, and that is not for the want of trying on the part of the PSNI.”
“During that period, at least 8,142 officer hours were spent on "concern for safety" calls, which include calls about people who have walked out of healthcare settings, mental health detention calls, the transportation of people who are in a health crisis and dealing with voluntary mental health patients, which means taking people to hospital who are going there voluntarily rather than detaining them because of concerns about their mental health. Over the course of a year, the 8,000 hours scale up to over 100,000 hours and £4 million of officer time. Of those hours, over 29,000 were spent waiting in emergency departments (EDs), and that location accounted for the highest percentage of the three-plus-hour waiting times at 38%.”
“<BR /> <BR />It is no secret that Northern Ireland faces a substantial mental health crisis. Regardless of whether that is due to our unique history, levels of deprivation or many other factors, our rates of mental ill health are the highest on these islands. That has resulted in a specific strain on our health services due to the number of people at crisis point who are trying to access support or are calling for an urgent intervention for their loved ones in a crisis. However, as the motion states, that intervention, which should be a Health response, is, too often, falling to the police. <BR /> <BR />As a result of the strain facing the police, the PSNI conducted a survey over four weeks last year to understand the impact on resources.”
“The powers that we are predominantly focusing on today are the powers under article 130, under which we see officers answer "concern for safety" calls and remain at emergency departments with people in mental health crisis. <BR /> <BR />Before I get to the statistics that are outlined in the motion, I must seek clarity from the Health Minister regarding the full implementation of the Mental Capacity Act 2016 and when we might expect to see the safeguards in that legislation enacted. They may not always help in circumstances in which the police are the first responders for emergency deprivation of liberty, but, currently, when the police are the only body able to act on "concern for safety" calls and subsequent deprivation of liberty, it is clear that the Department needs to act on that 2016 legislation.”
“Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker. I rise as spokesperson for Alliance on the Health Committee and as a member of the Policing Board to propose the motion, which highlights the pressures faced by the PSNI due to health system failings around mental health crisis services and calls on the Health Minister to ensure that he plays a proactive role in the implementation of the Right Care, Right Person (RCRP) model. <BR /> <BR />Under the Mental Health (NI) Order 1986, police officers have a power to enter private premises with a warrant and temporarily remove people to a place of safety and a power to remove persons from public places to a place of safety, provided that specified criteria are met.”
“There is not enough time. Sorry. <BR /> <BR />— to tackle violence against women and girls. <BR /> <BR />I turn to the case of Alexander McCartney. It is right to point out that there were failures because of policing resources, which led to the gaps between the first, second and third arrests, resulting in the death of young Cimarron. I convey my sympathies to her family. Online sex offences against children are scary, and we need to prioritise them. However, let us be honest: if resource is an issue, we have to have a serious conversation about the way in which the police use their resources in Northern Ireland. It is not their fault; it is the fault of many people in Northern Ireland. That is something that Alliance is serious about tackling and something that we all need to prioritise.”
“In the same period, there have been 201 recorded instances of stalking, which is another offence introduced in the previous mandate, and 91 instances of image-based sexual abuse. Those are just a few of the tools that the police can use —”
“It is timely that we are having this discussion on the International Day for the Elimination of Violence against Women, which marks the beginning of 16 Days of Activism. An important part of tackling violence against women and girls is ensuring that the community is safe and that, where that safety fails and crimes are committed, we have police action and an overall criminal justice system to take that action. I recognise the many steps that the Justice Minister took in the previous mandate to introduce new offences that became tools for the PSNI to use. I think, for example, of coercive or controlling behaviour, an offence introduced in the Domestic Abuse and Civil Proceedings Act 2021. We have seen 747 recorded instances of that.”
“The funding of the Department of Justice and, ultimately, the Police Service is inadequate. It is simply not good enough. That is not for want of trying by our Minister in the Executive or, to be honest, our Executive as a whole at this time with the UK Government. We need to reflect on the fact that this is on the UK Government as well. We also need to be realistic about the fact that the Department of Justice's entire budget has fallen while other Departments have seen an upward trajectory in theirs. Things have to change.”
“I thank the proposer of the motion. It is an opportunity to have a good debate in the Chamber. It is great to see that everyone is getting along so well. It is almost as though everyone had their Weetabix this morning and a good lunch. <BR /> <BR />Funding and resourcing the police is an important issue because it is about the safety of our community and the people whom we all represent in the Chamber. I want to recognise the comments that were made by the proposer of the motion and, indeed, by other Members in the Chamber.”
“Minister, I welcomed the judgement. My child's rights are of equal value to your child's rights or anyone else's. Many faith groups have welcomed the judgement, and so have those of no faith. Now that the judgement has been made, will you confirm whether you will meet groups such as Parents for Inclusive Education NI to discuss and lay out a way forward for those voices to be included in the new guidance? Will the interim guidance also include the issue of opting out not being sufficient for children, on which the judgement focused heavily?”
“I thank the Minister for being transparent, and I welcome the fact that he has asked for a report on the issue. Minister, last week, at the Health Committee, you said that 70% were already in receipt of the real living wage. We have now heard through the media that over 80% are not in receipt of it. The question now is this: did you make the decision on the basis of knowledge of those facts? Given what you said at the Committee last week, were you not aware that 70% were not getting the living wage when you made the decision not to pursue the living wage from September?”
“It is important to have that review and options for people who have had a negative experience. Sitting alongside that family court system and the issue of social workers is the gateway team, and there is disparity across trusts between transfer from the gateway team to the day-to-day children and family social services. Is there going to be an increase in the next year in the number of social workers or in the members of the multidisciplinary teams for which Professor Ray Jones advocated so that we can see the waiting times go down?”
“It is not a race to have the best figures; it is a race for treatment and to save lives. The latest waiting time statistics released by the Department of Health show that just 6·6% of women were seen by specialists within 14 days of being urgently referred. I thank Dr O'Hagan for speaking out on the issue. We can stand in the Chamber and discuss statistics and figures, but if we only do that, nothing will change. Nothing better illustrates the crisis than the words of the women themselves, who are waiting, scared and worried.”
“Last week, in my constituency of North Belfast, Dr Jilly O'Hagan, a GP in Notting Hill Medical Practice, spoke of specific women in our constituency. Some of those women had been waiting for over eight weeks to be seen by a consultant. Three of those women received a late breast cancer diagnosis. Dr O'Hagan also highlighted the fact that a number of women waited unacceptable times, which ended up in them receiving treatment too late. One in particular has waited for over 10 weeks and still has not seen a consultant. <BR /> <BR />We heard from the Health Minister in the Chamber last week that, as of the beginning of this month, the waiting list had been reduced from a high of 10 weeks to seven weeks and two days. That contradicts medical people on the ground who say that their patients wait for 10 weeks. Which of those is right?”
“I will speak again about the unacceptable waiting times for breast cancer diagnosis and treatment. I made a similar statement on this issue in September, regarding specific constituents from North Belfast and beyond who had been in touch. <BR /> <BR />Last week, we had GP practices and doctors speak out on the issue. Patients have been waiting up to seven, eight, nine or 10 weeks to see a specialist following an urgent referral, despite the Department's target being 14 days. It is deeply regretful that we need to stand here to advocate for those women again.”
“Without those people and the clinicians doing that work, we would not have the better outcomes for clinicians and medical practitioners to deliver treatment.”
“However, when you are waiting for a yes or no diagnosis and do not know what your future looks like, silence is worse than waiting. It is important that we up our game when it comes to communication. <BR /> <BR />I also want to focus on research. The Minister, in responding to the previous motion on waiting lists, which was in May, focused on the progress that we have made, and it is important for all of us across the Chamber to point to the North West Cancer Centre at Altnagelvin Hospital, the Shared Island Fund being its main promoter. It is important that the amendment focuses on cross-border collaboration, which is why we will support it, because health does not know borders. We must also pay tribute to the Patrick G Johnston Centre for Cancer Research, which works with Queen's University and Cancer Research UK.”
“I appreciate that there are privacy and confidentiality issues involved in data sharing, and I also appreciate that there are issues with sharing data with external providers, but I hope that we can move towards having a system through which data can be shared appropriately in order to enable and encourage that innovation. <BR /> <BR />We all know the impact that delays in receiving treatment can have on cancer patients. The proposer of the motion spoke about her constituent's breast cancer referral, and many of us in the Chamber will share the sense of sadness and frustration, knowing the impact that that can have on someone's private and family life. We need to get to a position in which those who are waiting receive communication, because we all understand that the health service is under pressure.”
“I would appreciate it if the Minister could provide us with an update on when we can expect all trusts to have completed the full roll-out of Encompass so that we no longer have to wait to receive the full statistics. Although we are talking about the importance of collecting and analysing data so that we in the Assembly can then scrutinise it, data is also important for clinicians and academics who work in the field of research. As members of the Health Committee, my colleagues and I have been approached by many organisations about the use of secondary data and what they can do to process it. Often, they cannot get their hands on it.”
“Only 32% of patients began their treatment within that period. England and Scotland sit at 67% and 69% respectively, so it is evident that we are falling behind, and that is not acceptable. As if that were not concerning enough on its own, Cancer Research UK highlights the fact that we do not know the true scale of the problem, because the statistics from the Department of Health do not tell us how many patients are waiting beyond the 62-day period, nor do they tell us exactly how many patients are still waiting. <BR /> <BR />An issue that we have raised many times in the Chamber concerns the impact that the roll-out of Encompass has had on statistical analysis. We often wait for the publication of statistics from many trusts, only to hear that there are issues with the roll-out of the system.”
“Treatment is essential, but so is research, and I pay tribute to the many hard-working individuals who have the innovative skills to work in what is a difficult climate in Northern Ireland. They are competing with the rest of the world to ensure that Northern Ireland has a firm footing in clinical trials now and into the future. <BR /> <BR />We have a target here of at least 98% of patients who are diagnosed with cancer receiving their first definitive treatment within 31 days of a decision to treat. In the quarter from April until June of this year, only 87% of patients began their treatment within that 31-day period. The 31-day period is not the only significant target. Where a patient has suspected cancer, we also have the 62-day target from referral by a GP to beginning their first definitive treatment.”
“I thank the Members who tabled the motion. It is important that we keep our eye on the issue. When the waiting list statistics for cancer come out every quarter, it is often important to raise them in the Chamber and in the Health Committee. We will support the motion and the amendment. I think that we all agree that waiting times are a national shame, and that is no better evidenced than through the impact that they have on the lives of individuals. It is very important to highlight, as Members who have spoken previously did, the hard work that health service workers do and the compassion that they show to those who have been diagnosed with cancer and to those who are waiting on a diagnosis.”
“Teachers' workload is, of course, a very important issue, because it has an effect on their private and family life. The issue of workload is also an important one for children. Will the Minister's Department seek to review the workload, particularly homework, for very young children now or in the future? There is a disparity across schools in Northern Ireland, and it has an effect on children and family life.”
“Thank you, Minister. Much earlier in the debate, you said that the plan was not "radical", because we cannot be radical. However, with respect, you are the Minister who stood up and said that there was a blank sheet of paper and that you were willing to take on the solutions. Many in the sector said that the plan was not good enough. That comes not from us as MLAs in a vacuum but from our engagement with people in the sector who carry out the work.”
“Sorry, I have run out of time. I look forward to hearing what the Minister says and what is new in the plan.”
“We need to address that. We also need to address the 10,000 care plans that were cited. Are those new care plans or the care plans that GPs already offer, and will those be additionally resourced? It is important that we have answers to those questions, because people ask us them, as members of the Health Committee. We were told back in January that we would have a blank page, new developments and new plans to deal with the issues, so we should have those. Hopefully, through the new framework or plan for winter preparedness, we will see more solutions to the issues.”
“Many have mentioned the allied health professionals, whether it is occupational therapists or physiotherapists, and some of the new initiatives that trusts are rolling out to care for people in their home. The Northern Ireland Ambulance Service, GPs and even the Department all have a role to play, but, given where that role is carried out every day, those people will have solutions to the problems. <BR /> <BR />I would like to highlight a few issues that others have focused on, including domiciliary care, where there have been 7,000 redirected hours. Of the 300,000 hours that are offered per week, that is just 2·3%. That is not new. It must be welcomed, of course, but it is not new. Dementia beds are an issue. There are people in the sector who are pulling away from providing dementia beds because it is difficult to do so.”
“We have often been critical of engagement and consultation with those on the ground who are delivering the care. It was really important that we gave the Health Minister and the Department time and space to go away and work up plans to do things differently, but, unfortunately, that has not borne fruit. I acknowledge that there has been some engagement but not enough to use the feedback to deliver something that can make tangible change. I also recognise that there is a large resourcing pressure on the Department of Health. However, as many in the Chamber have acknowledged during many debates, the Department of Health receives over 50% of the Executive's Budget. <BR /> <BR />We need to listen to those who deliver the care.”
“I support the motion and the amendment on the winter preparedness plan or the start of the winter preparedness framework, as it has been called. <BR /> <BR />It is really important that we discuss the issue enough. My colleague mentioned that, at the Health Committee at the start of the year, the Minister said:”
“You say that having an independent agency will not fix Lough Neagh, so let us look at other ideas that will potentially fix it. The nutrient action plan — you voted against it. An increase to cross-compliance penalties for repeat polluters — you voted against it. Climate targets — you voted against them. Your record stands for itself. There is no need to hide behind absolute nonsense when it comes to protecting our environment in the future and for the future.”
“We know that that may not happen, because of the position in which we find ourselves when it comes to power-sharing. That is why I turn and call on the DUP to support the motion. I hear what it says about governance issues and bureaucracy, but we do not buy that. We do not believe that.”
“I recognise and welcome the comments from the proposer of the motion, which clarified the SDLP's position on that. It is important that we put that behind us, move forward and work together to get the independent agency up and running.”
“How many of us who are in the Chamber today have contacted our local councils or the NIEA about illegal dumping, whether that is tyres, rubbish or thousands upon thousands of other instances of illegal dumping within our urban or rural environment? How many of us have been told by them that they have bigger fish to fry and cannot deal with those smaller issues? How frustrating is it for all of us, as elected reps, to be told that? We simply do not have enough when it comes to protecting our environment. That is not because of Alliance's wishes. Indeed, it is not because of one single party in the Chamber. It is because of a collective failure, over the years, to recognise that our environmental protections need to be strengthened. <BR /> <BR />We attempted to do that through the Climate Change (No. 2) Bill.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Lough Neagh crisis did not develop overnight. We all recognise and accept that. It took a generation for it to reach the current worsening and deepening crisis, and it will take a generation to fix the problem, but we can do it if we all — Government, Opposition, local councils and communities — work together. <BR /> <BR />Alliance has long supported the establishment of an independent environmental protection agency and has always supported the establishment of a body that will have that protection and independence from not just one Department but all Departments, into the future.”
“I support the motion and welcome the SDLP's tabling it. I will speak about the preservation of our future for our future. We have sewage spillages; pollution in our rivers and lakes and on our beautiful beaches; and illegal dumping in our rivers, country parks and countryside. We all feel the consequences of that, regardless of whether we are in a rural constituency or an urban constituency. It is not just about abstract ideas, theories or fearmongering; it is about real-life events that affect our lives and our biodiversity, that are affecting the extinction of species — our natural fauna and plants — and that increase or worsen flooding. Pollution affects our air quality, and we all know that the people who live in the communities that are already affected by poverty are the worst affected by air pollution.”