Jim Wells
South Down · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. In November 1982, I made my maiden speech in the Chamber, and, here we are, 40 years later, and I am making my last speech in the Chamber as a DUP MLA. I was the last person in the Public Gallery when the Assembly collapsed in 1976.”
“<BR /> <BR />Mr Deputy Speaker, I thank you for your indulgence and for your patience with me over many years. Unfortunately, Mr McGlone has just left the Chamber; I was about to thank him. I have enjoyed my 27 and a half years in this Building.”
“I wish that I could, but I have only five minutes. <BR /> <BR />That was so that a very small number of Irish language zealots could go in and register their marriage or civil partnership in Irish or in dual language: £261,000. Did anybody stop to think about whether there was a more cost-effective way of doing that?”
“We are all perfectly happy with a genuine expression of people's culture. That is fine. However, when the language is so cynically used by militant republicanism, unionism has difficulties. Why, for instance, is there no translation into Irish of the words, "United Kingdom", "Londonderry", "Northern Ireland" or "Her Majesty The Queen"?”
“The Member has made the point for me. The official who came to the Committee made it absolutely clear that £261,000 had been spent already. It was farcical to bring that before either the Finance Committee or the Assembly, because the money had been spent and the processes had been set up.”
“If they want the unionist community to accept the Irish language as a genuine cultural expression, they should get rid of the political baggage and extremism, and stop using the Irish language as a political weapon to try to subjugate unionism.”
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“I seem to be on a good run, because this is the second time there has been very little opposition to what is, of course, technical legislation. <BR /> <BR />I am glad that Members appreciate that this deals with some of the difficulties of matching the new scheme with taxation law. It is not a rehearsal of the debate on Hutton or the nature of the changes to pensions; it is something that simply has to be done if we are going to be able to start running the scheme from 1 April 2015. Members of the Fire Service and the unions, whilst not happy with the overall direction of pensions legislation in the United Kingdom, feel that, given where we are, these regulations are absolutely necessary. Therefore, I commend them to the House.”
“Subject to affirmative resolution, the regulations will come into effect from 1 April 2015.”
“Specifically, they ensure that parts of the ill-health pensions available to members who fall ill are not measured twice for annual allowance and lifetime allowance limits simply because of the transitional mechanics for payment of ill-health benefits. Put simply, the modifications ensure that the tax regime will apply in the way intended by the Government to those members who move into the new scheme and then retire because of illness. <BR /> <BR />In conclusion, I am sure that Members will agree that these are very technical modifications to wider pensions legislation, which seek to ensure that firefighter pension scheme members can get the pensions they expect without any unexpected effects as a result of tensions within wider law. I therefore commend the modifications to the House.”
“For the new firefighters' pension scheme, the process has been simplified, ensuring the new scheme, and therefore its members, continues to be contracted out of the additional state pension until the end of the contracting out period in April 2016. There are also provisions to stop transitional members who are taking ill-health retirement from being assessed twice against annual allowance and lifetime allowance limits. <BR /> <BR />The regulations also seek to modify provisions within the Finance Act 2004 to ensure that members with service in a new and existing pension scheme who retire with an ill-health pension do not face unintended tax consequences.”
“In addition, modifications to the regulations that govern contracting out, specifically those that dictate the process that a scheme must follow to be contracted out, are in the regulations.”
“Therefore, their old pension service will terminate only when they leave the new scheme. <BR /> <BR />That will ensure three things. First, the benefits they accrued in their existing scheme are not revalued as though they were deferred members. Secondly, their right to a cash equivalent transfer value, a refund of contributions or a cash transfer sum applies only when they leave the new scheme. Thirdly, anti-franking provisions do not apply as though they were deferred members on 1 April 2015. Mr O'Dowd made exactly the same point about his scheme. <BR /> <BR />The proposed modifications mean that, for those purposes, such individuals do not cease to be active members of their existing scheme until they leave their new scheme.”
“<BR /> <BR />The regulations are simply the means to ensure that the design of the firefighters' pension scheme, which was widely consulted upon with members and unions, works properly within the wider framework of pensions and tax law. They will make sure that members of the firefighters' pension scheme get the pension that they expect and do not lose out as a result of any tension between scheme design and wider law. <BR /> <BR />There are also provisions to stop transitional members being treated as deferred members of the pre-2015 scheme. A set of modifications are being made to the Pension Schemes (Northern Ireland) Act 1993, the first of which is to ensure that members moving from their existing scheme to the new scheme also remain non-accruing members of the old scheme.”
“That review considered what needed to be done to have sustainable public service pensions, given the increases in longevity and associated costs. <BR /> <BR />These reforms were much needed to balance taxpayers' legitimate concerns about the cost of public service pensions with the need to ensure adequate levels of retirement income for the millions of people who have devoted their lives to the service of the public. I am pleased to say that these reforms received the Northern Ireland Assembly's support during their legislative passage. <BR /> <BR />The reforms will apply to all public service pension schemes in Northern Ireland, including the firefighters' pension scheme. The design of the new firefighters' pension scheme has now been settled and will come into effect from 1 April this year.”
“The regulations make consequential modifications to the Pension Schemes (Northern Ireland) Act 1993 and the Finance Act 2004 to ensure that the firefighters' pension scheme, which was created under the Public Service Pensions Act (Northern Ireland) 2014, operates as intended. <BR /> <BR />The proposed regulations make small and technical modifications to the law governing the new firefighters' pension scheme. I remind Members that the Public Service Pensions Act (Northern Ireland) 2014 provides framework-enabling legislation for the reform of public service pensions in Northern Ireland. The Act gives effect to the recommendations from the Independent Public Service Pensions Commission, led by Lord Hutton.”
“<BR /> <BR />However, I can say that, since 23 September, things have moved in the right direction and have moved quickly and effectively. We can do no more than that. My officials tell me that they have had full cooperation from their counterparts in the Irish Republic and have done everything possible to move this project forward. It is to the benefit of children not only from Northern Ireland but the Irish Republic. The extra children from Northern Ireland will give Our Lady's the numbers that it needs to maintain a first-rate service for its children from every corner of the Republic of Ireland. Therefore, it is a win-win situation, as it will be when patients from the Irish Republic come up to Northern Ireland for vital treatment in our hospitals. It will definitely be a two-way process.”
“One of the first events that I attended was a fundraising event in Banbridge for children in this position, and some of the stories that I heard there made for pretty difficult listening. <BR /> <BR />I know that there is a huge public interest in this issue and a huge interest in it in the House. It is interesting that a health statement would normally attract about six MLAs, mostly from the Health Committee. It is very unusual to have a turnout as huge as we have here today and to have so many questions. I know that I am being watched on this, that I have to deliver and that the Member and the Health Committee are watching me, as they should. Therefore, we are going to have to make certain that every i is dotted and every t is crossed.”
“Five hundred pounds will go to the Member's favourite charity if the phrase "the North of Ireland" ever crosses my lips from this point on or previously. It is a phrase I do not recognise, because the north of Ireland includes Donegal. I refer to that part of Her Majesty's realm known as Northern Ireland in all my speeches. <BR /> <BR />Being serious about it, monitoring and keeping an eye on the progress of this entire proposal is absolutely crucial. We are dealing with something that forms a very small part of the health service budget in Northern Ireland but that is highly emotional and emotive and is so important to communities that tend to have a great deal of empathy for parents in this situation. I have heard some heartbreaking stories about what parents have faced.”
“The outcomes indicate that, even though there is extra distance, the child has a much better outcome by doing that. Some of the roads in the west of Ireland are certainly less superior to our own, yet the children are still getting there as quickly as possible.”
“Had it been in Dundrum or Dún Laoghaire — at least I know something about the geography of Dublin, if not Donegal — it would be more difficult, because the child would have to be brought through Dublin city centre or around the ring road. At least we have a facility in Dublin that is to the north of the city, which makes it much more convenient for parents from Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />I guarantee that that will be prominent in the oversight of this entire decision. We want to make certain that the Ambulance Service is up to scratch to get our children there, that we have the correct vehicles and that we can get there as fast as possible. I keep coming back to the point that, if you are from Tralee, you have a much longer journey than you would have from Banbridge or Rathfriland.”
“The crucial issue here is the network from Belfast to Dublin, because many of these children will be brought to Belfast initially and then taken on to Dublin for surgery or acute treatment. Most of us accept that transport links between Belfast and Dublin have improved dramatically, and it is possible, for instance, for an ambulance to get from somewhere like Banbridge to Dublin within the hour. Sometimes escorts will be required and radio contact will have to be made to make certain that, for instance, the toll bridge is open down near Drogheda. <BR /> <BR />This is an absolutely crucial issue and why we want the parents on board. We want to look constantly at transport arrangements to see whether these children are getting safely and quickly to the new facility.”
“<BR /> <BR />The service in Birmingham and Evelina is very good, but parents have told us that it represents far too much of an upheaval for them and the close family network required to support those children. I used to say that there are various shades of grey in this argument, but I have stopped using that phrase for very obvious reasons. It is a choice of the lesser of two evils, to some extent. The option of having full-blown care in Belfast was simply not on the table, and there is no way I can avoid that.”
“These surgeons are like gold dust; they are very hard to attract and extremely hard to retain. They would start to drift away to the larger centres. Therefore, the facility would close, and the Royal College would tell us, "You simply can't sustain it." <BR /> <BR />This is not unusual; it happens elsewhere. We moved all the serious cancer surgery and treatment to the Belfast City Hospital. This means that people from Strabane, Enniskillen, Kilkeel etc are travelling big distances but are doing so in the knowledge that they are far more likely to survive because of the concentration of skills in that unit. Equally, people will be travelling the long distance to Dublin confident that the best possible service on the island of Ireland is there.”
“For parents in my constituency of South Down, or in Newry, Armagh or Craigavon, it is a much more convenient place for the care of their child. <BR /> <BR />I accept Mr Robinson's comments about children from the north of the Province. There was no great enthusiasm; the parents would have loved to have gone down Mr Allister's route of having a full-blown modern paediatric congenital heart disease surgical team in Belfast, but the problem is that the team would have been working at only one third capacity. For many of the days, there would not be the children to look after at the level we need. Eventually, the surgeons would start to lose the skills they require because they would not be practising on a wide range of patients, and they would drift away.”
“Yes, we could have opted for a model where we fly all our children to Birmingham or Evelina in London, but he has to understand the huge upheaval it is to the family, and the inherent dangers there are, in flying in an air ambulance or chartered flight to London. The fact is that the parents have to stay for maybe days, weeks or even months with their child in Birmingham or London. That is extremely expensive for them and extremely difficult for their children back home. <BR /> <BR />Parents said throughout all this that they were not particularly happy with having to go down this route but that, if it were a choice between driving down the motorway to Our Lady's in Crumlin with their loved one or having to fly to the mainland of the United Kingdom, then the former was definitely the lesser of two evils.”
“We have many people in Northern Ireland with heart disease, and they will continue to require treatment in Northern Ireland. The issue is specific to one specialist service that has to be delivered to numbers of at least 400, numbers that we simply do not have. I could stand here on my political soapbox and say that, because I am a unionist, I will not move children to the Republic. I could do that, but when the first child were to pass on or develop a very serious condition because of my intransigence, I would have to answer to the media and to the parents. I have dealt with some very passionate, upset parents who are desperate for the best care for their children. What am I going to do? I do what the experts tell me, and they tell me that this is the right model.”
“I know where the Member is coming from, and I suppose that, if I had been sitting in his seat six months ago, I would probably have thought the same. However, when I am faced with absolutely overwhelming evidence that a child's life is best protected by adopting this model, I have to set aside any political difficulties that I may have and do what is best. It is difficult, I have to say that. <BR /> <BR />The Member raises a legitimate concern about adult cardiology. The fact that we have invested £1·2 million and will continue to have cardiology services delivered by experts in Belfast indicates that there is absolutely no need to transfer services other than paediatric services to Dublin. The numbers are sufficient in Northern Ireland to justify a top-class service, so the issue does not arise.”
“We could still have that additional investment, but I can say that we have already committed ourselves to the £1·2 million, and that is an indication, in terribly difficult times, of just how committed we are. I know how painful this is for him as a parent and for the many folk who have spoken to him, but I hope that he will respect my motivation, which is to do what is best for some of the most vulnerable children in our community. This has to be the right way forward, or else, by continuing to operate a service that is not up to the standard of the one available in Crumlin, we run the risk of children either not surviving or having very poor outcomes.”
“The model has worked well for the Republic, even though the distances are large: children go to a centre of excellence, of which we are now going to avail ourselves. I am therefore reassured that there is a fair wind behind the process, but I can assure the Member that it will continue to be investigated and scrutinised. <BR /> <BR />My final point concerns the £1 million investment identified by Mr John Compton. It remains on the table to be used in the context of the £5 million recurrent expenditure on the new service. It is still there potentially, but, as the Member knows, not a penny in the Department of Health ever sits unused.”
“It could be Frank Mitchell. What I am saying is this: we know the level of scrutiny. <BR /> <BR />As far as my visits to Donegal are concerned, I remember that, on my first visit there, it took four guards armed with sub-machine guns to get me in and five to get me out. I am glad to say, however, that times have changed and that I do not have any fears about going up there now. Yes, I am not exactly a world authority on the geography of Donegal, but I was making a very serious point. <BR /> <BR />I believe that Fanad Head is in Donegal, as is Malin Head. A child in Malin Head who has a cardiac arrest and needs surgery has to travel a much longer distance than anybody in Northern Ireland, and that is something that has to be recognised.”
“Yes. This has been a difficult decision; it has been one of the most studied, consulted upon and discussed decisions made by the Assembly in many years. I wish that I was not in this position, but, when I read the documentation that came to the office, I found the evidence so overwhelming that I would have been negligent had I decided that, for some party-political reason, I wanted to retain the service in Belfast even though we are selling our services to the Irish Republic in many other fields. <BR /> <BR />I am therefore content that we have made the right decision. I also know that the level of public interest in the decision is such that we are being watched by every possible group. If there is one slip, it will immediately be exposed on a certain radio programme that will remain nameless but is on at 9 o'clock of a Monday morning.”
“I wish that it was £2 million, but my understanding is that it is £1·2 million plus the £85,000. I will double-check because I know that the Member raised that before. I certainly have not seen where the other £1 million is, and there are very few pots of £1 million sitting around the Department unspent, I can assure you. I will check that for him.”
“Those individuals are specialists and know one another integrally; they work together all the time in teams and consult regularly. There is no wall around Northern Ireland as far as paediatric congenital surgery is concerned. Therefore, those skills will be retained, and you will have people with a Northern Ireland accent carrying out surgery in Crumlin. Those people may know the patients and their families extremely well. I am confident that those skills will not be lost, particularly given that we are making a £1·2 million investment in new facilities at the Royal. Without those, we would have lost that team. That is absolutely certain. There is also the investment of £85,000 in nurses. <BR /> <BR />The £1 million will be spent on the infrastructure and staffing required to invest in the network in Belfast. There is only £1 million.”
“It is important to say that the honourable Member for North Antrim has made an invaluable contribution to this debate, and we wish his son Evan all the best as he continues to progress. <BR /> <BR />I will outline what has been going on. In 2011-12, 97 paediatric surgeries were carried out in Northern Ireland; there were 13 in the Republic of Ireland and 40 in England. That is a total of 150. In 2014-15, to date, there have been only 12 in Northern Ireland, four in the Irish Republic and 58 in England. Therefore, the numbers being undertaken in Ireland north and south have rapidly declined, and that will be the case until the new service is up and running. <BR /> <BR />A fully integrated team from Belfast will go to Dublin from 1 April to maintain skills; we are not losing those skills.”
“People who report initially with difficulties will be dealt with in a local hospital, but the complex paediatrics will be done in Our Lady's.”
“Dr Damien Armstrong, from the South West Acute, has been asked to serve on the implementation group.”
“<BR /> <BR />The irony was that the most difficult question I had when I first announced this was from Mr Gerry Kelly from North Belfast. We had the rather surreal situation of me trying to argue to him why it was important to have an all-island solution. I am glad to say that he was won over in the end and supported it; he was maybe being a wee bit humorous. Certainly I am pleased that so many parties in the Assembly have bought into this. I have no political baggage here; I will do what is best for the children of Northern Ireland no matter where I have to send them. We owe that to the children. It does not matter whether it is in England, Dublin or Belfast; we will do our best for those people. <BR /> <BR />There will of course be help for outpatients in cardiology in other parts of Northern Ireland.”
“Any child who has this complication would always be taken to the Royal because that is where the expertise has been to date. From now on it is probably more likely that someone will be taken there for stabilisation, although in his case in South Down it is more likely that they will be taken directly to Crumlin, because once you are in Newry you can get down to Crumlin very quickly. There is no real role to expand paediatric congenital heart surgery in any local hospital or any of the acute hospitals outside the Royal in Northern Ireland. It is a very specialist area with a relatively small number of children. The scale that one needs for this is 400. Northern Ireland will be producing less than a third of that, and that is why we are going down that model.”
“The Member may have picked me up wrongly: the clock has well and truly started ticking. Staff have been down to Crumlin and seen the work that is already ongoing there. I would be genuinely worried making this announcement if everything had fossilised in Crumlin; that has not been the case. At every meeting I have with the Minister for Health in the Irish Republic, this is second or third, if not first, on the agenda: "Give us an update on what is happening". <BR /> <BR />I was absolutely certain the Member would weave Daisy Hill and Downe hospitals into his question, as he always does. The reality is that paediatric congenital heart surgery has always been concentrated in the Royal, long before this decision was made.”
“Similarly, parents will, I think, understand that their child has a much better outcome if they are taken to where all the best clinicians, equipment and facilities are available, even though it is inconvenient. They will do that because their child has the best chance of survival and a good outcome. We have done the same for cancer and are doing the same for stroke services and trauma. Unfortunately on this occasion we do not have the population to have that centre of excellence in Northern Ireland, but I still think that in five or 10 years people will look back and say the stats show very clearly that children are surviving, moving on with their life and doing well as a result of this excellent service.”
“If I lived in Limavady, Ballycastle or Coleraine, I would be concerned; I think that is reasonable, but I hope that, once the service is up and running, people will realise that the outcome for their child will be best when they are taken to the centre of excellence. <BR /> <BR />I thank everyone who has been so friendly and helpful to me in my personal difficulties, but, having seen the standard of service that my wife has got in acute stroke, I would take my wife to Strabane for that service quite happily — to Strabane, Enniskillen, Belleek or wherever — because I would rather she be treated in a centre of excellence than in a local hospital that does not have that excellence.”
“I am not surprised that a representative for East Londonderry has raised the issue. That is one of the most difficult matters that we have to deal with. Remember that, at the moment, a child from Letterkenny or Lifford or — I cannot think of another town — Donegal town has to pass through East Londonderry maybe on his or her way down to Dublin for the same treatment. One of the reasons why we set up the CHD patients and family group is so that we can have frank discussions on this issue. A child in Limavady, for instance, would almost certainly be taken to the Royal for stabilisation and then transferred to Dublin for whatever surgery is required. The practical difficulties are the reason we have asked for the parents to be directly involved in the two charities.”
“If there is any doubt whatsoever, we will not proceed until we are content with the level of service. Minister Varadkar and I have discussed this: he is committed to getting this right, and so am I. Therefore, I am confident and hopeful. The fact that we have already met many of the targets in the statement issued in September indicates to me that this has a fair wind and is going in the right direction. <BR /> <BR />I can also reassure Members that the staff in Crumlin have exactly the same high standards as those trained in the United Kingdom. They have exactly the same qualifications and letters after their names. These highly qualified consultants and surgeons trained together and know each other extremely well, so there will be no reason why the standard of care should not be at a very high level in Crumlin.”
“We have children who are very vulnerable — some of them in a critical condition — and have to balance the trauma of families being flown to England for that treatment with the fact that there is not the capacity and experience in Northern Ireland to carry out the surgical procedures. Even when we had full-blown capacity in Belfast, we still flew many children to England for surgery, and that was also happening in the Irish Republic. <BR /> <BR />We hope that we can be ahead of target. I understand that progress in Crumlin is going well. That is remarkable given the difficult economic situation that the Irish Republic finds itself in. We have had no problems with the HSE in the Republic securing the funding for this. Many of us will be down there before we cut the ribbon, as it were.”
“I accept that it is traumatic for families to travel to Dublin for this surgery. Remember, however, that parents from Waterford, Sligo, Kerry and Wexford already travel much greater distances. There is only one facility in the Irish Republic, and vulnerable children already have to be brought a considerable distance. For many people in the southern part of Northern Ireland the distance will be less than for parents coming from those areas. <BR /> <BR />As far as using Evelina and Birmingham is concerned, the difficulty at the moment is that those are the two centres of excellence that have the capacity in the United Kingdom to deal with children in this position. We do not have much choice because we have negotiated capacity with both.”
“Given that mix of management and health-related experience, we are dealing with someone who has expertise in Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic and could command the confidence of the public. I am delighted that someone of his calibre has agreed to take on this important position.”
“Therefore, it is absolutely essential that spokespeople for those parents are represented on the CHD group. <BR /> <BR />Many in the Assembly will know Mr Len O'Hagan. He was chairman of the Belfast Harbour Commissioners from 2006 until recently. He has board positions on a number of international public companies such as Jefferson Smurfit and Safeway Ireland, of which he is the chairman. He was previously chairman of the Belfast Metropolitan Arts Centre. He is vice-chairman of the Ireland-US Council and a non-executive director of Independent News and Media plc. He was recently appointed chair of the board of Northern Ireland Water and will take up that appointment on 1 April. In 2013, he was appointed chief executive of the Royal College of Physicians of Ireland for a two-year period.”
“First, one of the very good recommendations was that we create a CHD network board. That will include family representatives from Northern Ireland and, indeed, the Republic of Ireland. It will be underpinned by the family advisory group. Hopefully, it will empower families in shaping future services in a way that we have never had before. I must say that we have benefited enormously from the input to this debate from the two charities, which have been extremely forthright and articulate in their arguments, and the numerous meetings that I have had with family members, as well as the various events and the extremely constructive consultation meetings that we have had throughout the Province, where the parents engaged. It was not an argument or a battle; the parents engaged and talked through the recommendations in a very responsible way.”
“Therefore, that is an incentive to make certain that we get it absolutely right.”
“We do not envisage a huge degree of revenue change; most of this is capital. It is quite expensive to fly children by special chartered plane to Birmingham and London and to take their parents over, put them up and give them all the support that they require. It is technically much easier, particularly for parents who live in the southern part of Northern Ireland, to travel down the motorway to Crumlin. The good news is that Crumlin is in the northern part of Dublin, which makes it more accessible to parents. Therefore, in a way, we are saving money on that aspect but spending more on our commitment to cardiology services in Belfast. I would like to feel that, at the end of the process, we will have got the best of both worlds. I also realise that at least a dozen MLAs will be watching this very carefully.”
“First, I should make it clear that we are investing £85,000 in that specialist nurse support. That is an indication of just how committed we are. It was extremely difficult to find the money in 2015-16 for the service. If you saw some of the documents that are on my table at the moment about the efficiency savings that I am required to make, you would realise how difficult our finances are in the health service, but, because we knew that this was so important and we knew of the vulnerability of the children involved in cardiac surgery, we successfully put our case to DFP for the extra money, and we have been able to find a 20% addition to that in our own budget. That is committed, and that will be spent on that service. That is the assessment that we need at the moment. <BR /> <BR />I will constantly look at this.”
“Already, almost one third of the patients in the renal facility in Daisy Hill come from Louth and north Monaghan, and I hope that we will be able to extend the use of the cath labs in some of our hospitals to patients from the Irish Republic. It is not all one-way traffic; it is cooperation between two Governments.”
“You have to balance the need for convenience against the need for a first-rate service, and the only model that anyone can provide me with that achieves that is an all-island one. <BR /> <BR />I must pay tribute to the two charities, which were very responsible and very helpful throughout this process, as were the parents. In all of the consultation meetings, everyone expressed a concern about recommendation 7, but not one individual was able to offer an alternative that enabled us to give first-rate treatment to the children whilst retaining the Belfast service. That is the dilemma that I am in, and that is why I have to go down this route. <BR /> <BR />It is not one-way traffic. Many patients with cancer will come to the new Altnagelvin facility in Londonderry once the new radiotherapy centre has opened there.”
“This is no different from many, many issues: for instance, muscular dystrophy patients are sent to Newcastle upon Tyne because we do not have enough patients, particularly those with Duchenne, to provide a first-rate service in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />I accept that this is painful. I would love to have been in the position to retain the facility in Northern Ireland, but the lack of patients would mean, first, that we could not have a sustainable service because there would not be enough patients to keep it going. Secondly, and more importantly, we would not have been able to attract and retain the first-class surgeons that we need in this field to provide the best possible care for our children.”
“The honourable Member for Upper Bann has raised the most fundamental question, and that is the matter of dealing with recommendation 7. During the various consultation meetings around the Province, this issue came up constantly. Separately, four eminent experts each produced a different report, all telling me that Northern Ireland simply does not have enough children with a congenital heart condition to sustain a world-leading facility. We need at least 400 children a year to sustain that on an all-island basis. Even with the addition of the children from Northern Ireland, we have just enough numbers for an all-island model.”
“There will be no question of a child from Kerry, Galway or wherever being given precedence over a child from Belfast or Londonderry simply because they are from the Irish Republic. The children will be assessed entirely on need, and, if a child from Northern Ireland requires treatment ahead of a child from Longford or Wexford, that will happen. That is part of the arrangement that we have made with the authorities in the Republic, and I am reassured by that. I know that there will be situations in which children will be rushed down the motorway at great speed as a matter of urgency, and those children will be given priority no matter where they are from.”