Jim Wells
South Down · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. In November 1982, I made my maiden speech in the Chamber, and, here we are, 40 years later, and I am making my last speech in the Chamber as a DUP MLA. I was the last person in the Public Gallery when the Assembly collapsed in 1976.”
“<BR /> <BR />Mr Deputy Speaker, I thank you for your indulgence and for your patience with me over many years. Unfortunately, Mr McGlone has just left the Chamber; I was about to thank him. I have enjoyed my 27 and a half years in this Building.”
“I wish that I could, but I have only five minutes. <BR /> <BR />That was so that a very small number of Irish language zealots could go in and register their marriage or civil partnership in Irish or in dual language: £261,000. Did anybody stop to think about whether there was a more cost-effective way of doing that?”
“We are all perfectly happy with a genuine expression of people's culture. That is fine. However, when the language is so cynically used by militant republicanism, unionism has difficulties. Why, for instance, is there no translation into Irish of the words, "United Kingdom", "Londonderry", "Northern Ireland" or "Her Majesty The Queen"?”
“The Member has made the point for me. The official who came to the Committee made it absolutely clear that £261,000 had been spent already. It was farcical to bring that before either the Finance Committee or the Assembly, because the money had been spent and the processes had been set up.”
“If they want the unionist community to accept the Irish language as a genuine cultural expression, they should get rid of the political baggage and extremism, and stop using the Irish language as a political weapon to try to subjugate unionism.”
The complete record
Every one of 1,869 lines we hold for Jim Wells, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 28 of 38.
“Mr McKee has made it very clear that some of what we are asking will be exceptionally difficult to deliver.”
“Eighty-three per cent of the total cost of the Northern Ireland Fire and Rescue Service are staff related, with the other 17% taken up with items such as training, uniforms, publicity, equipment etc. That makes the decision on how to achieve those savings even more difficult, because any form of staff reduction has a commensurate cost. Therefore, I accept that the Fire and Rescue Service has difficulties with that. Indeed, I am meeting the chairman of the board, Mr Joe McKee, this afternoon. I have already had discussions with the unions, and individual firefighters have approached me about this. I am under no illusion as to how difficult an ask this is for the Fire and Rescue Service, and I accept that it is causing severe problems.”
“Indeed, the Executive endorsed that definition as part of the draft Budget for 2015-16. The Executive believe that the Fire Service should not receive the same protection as front-line health and social care elements mostly delivered, of course, by the five trusts. That is consistent with the decision taken on other front-line services, such as the Police Service.”
“The difficulty that I face is that the new budget for 2015-16 that I received as part of the October monitoring round has assessed firefighting and the Northern Ireland Fire and Rescue Service as a non-front-line service. I understand why the Member has great difficulty with that. Indeed, I know that those who work for the Fire Service have a very different view. The problem is that, whilst we were awarded an extra £200 million, we have to find £50 million savings in what are termed non-front-line services. There is actually a very small proportion of my budget where I can find that £50 million. If I were to accept that the Fire Service is front line and should not be subject to those reductions, it is extremely difficult to see where we would find the rest of those savings.”
“As part of the Department's planning process for 2015-16, the Northern Ireland First and Rescue Service has been asked to develop a range of savings proposals that could deliver the best possible outcomes under three scenarios — 5%, 10% and 15% reductions. The Northern Ireland Fire and Rescue Service will be required to risk-assess and prioritise savings proposals on the basis of those that minimise the impact on service delivery before submission to my Department.”
“<BR /> <BR />I regard this as a crucial and serious issue because, regardless of our present situation, the vast majority of us will have someone we love in a residential nursing home, or some of us may be residents ourselves at a future time. It is vital that we learn from the stark lessons that this example has exposed and ensure that we do not have a repeat of the Cherry Tree House issue.”
“It is quite clear that the issue has caused a great deal of concern among elected representatives in the East Antrim constituency. It is entirely correct that Mr Dickson decided to use his Adjournment debate opportunity to raise the matter. I hope that, when I meet him — hopefully, fairly soon — we will be able to talk through the lessons learned by this unfortunate situation. <BR /> <BR />Perhaps the one good thing that can come out of all this is that, in future, vulnerable elderly and, sometimes, severely handicapped people in residential nursing care will be guaranteed a much higher and much more acceptable level of care than was evident in Cherry Tree House.”
“<BR /> <BR />My Department is also reviewing the minimum standards for nursing homes, and the revised standards have recently gone to public consultation. My Department is also taking forward the development of the adult safeguarding policy in conjunction with the Department of Justice to introduce a package of measures aimed at improving safeguarding outcomes for children and vulnerable adults across Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />The objectives supporting the policy will range from the prevention of adult abuse through the implementation of good safeguarding arrangements to effective protective responses from lead agencies when adult abuse occurs or is suspected. The intention is that we will publish the finalised policy in 2015. <BR /> <BR />Finally, I thank all who contributed to the debate.”
“I emphasise that because several Members raised that issue, including Mr McMullan, who is no longer with us. <BR /> <BR />I am certain that, if Members have any concerns about the issue, they will be tabling questions for written or oral answer or writing to me to keep themselves up to date with what is happening in the implementation of the recommendations. There are certainly Members in the Chamber this evening who are extremely keen to write to me, because I get a vast amount of correspondence daily. <BR /> <BR />I was worried when I read about the Cherry Tree House issue. In fact, it arose when I was Chair and Deputy Chair of the Health Committee. I shared the same concerns that Mr Dickson so ably articulated. I have given my commitment that the Department will do all it can to implement the recommendations as quickly as possible.”
“Everybody accepts that that is the case; no one would deny it. However, it would be remiss of me not to place this in context. Every day in Northern Ireland, care home staff deliver high quality care to almost 10,000 people who live in our residential and nursing homes, with just over 7,000 receiving nursing home care. In the vast majority of these cases, the care provided is of the highest standard. However, as we have seen, sometimes things go wrong and standards slip. What is important is that, when this happens, there are strong and effective measures in place to identify and deal with these cases. <BR /> <BR />My Department has fully accepted the report's 22 recommendations and is working with the relevant HSC organisations to ensure that they are implemented as soon as possible.”
“<BR /> <BR />Of course, another important safeguard for the health and social care system is the identification of a positive whistle-blowing culture. Mr Hilditch made the interesting point that a publication on this very issue was released today. All my Department’s arm's-length bodies are required to have a whistle-blowing policy in place. I am encouraged to note that, in a recent HSC staff survey carried out in 2012, 78% of the staff surveyed said that if they were concerned about negligence or wrongdoing by staff they would know how to report their concerns, and 60% said that they would have confidence in doing so. So, I think we are making considerable progress on this issue. <BR /> <BR />The Cherry Tree report makes it clear that there were shortcomings in the care provided there over a period of time.”
“<BR /> <BR />Where complaints are raised with the trust, it is its responsibility to establish the nature of the complaint and consider how best to proceed. The complaint may also trigger the need for an investigation under protection of vulnerable adults procedures or, indeed, highlight non-compliance with statutory requirements. <BR /> <BR />If the RQIA is notified of a breach of regulations or associated standards, it will review the matter and take whatever appropriate action is required. Trusts work closely with the registered providers, other professionals and the RQIA to enable appropriate decisions to be made. HSC trusts must also assure themselves that care homes that deliver care on their behalf are effective and responsive in their handling of complaints.”
“Complaints may be made by service users or persons acting on their behalf, providing that they have obtained the service user's consent. The registered provider is required by legislation to ensure that the complaint is fully investigated. <BR /> <BR />Alternatively, individuals may, if they prefer, raise their concerns through the local health and social care trust that has commissioned the care on their behalf. As Mr Dickson stated, it is mostly the Northern Trust in this case. The trust commissioning the care has a continuing duty of care to the service user and should participate in local resolution as necessary. Mr Dickson has been helpful in pointing out that, recently, £653,000 of trust money has been used to fund places in Cherry Tree; that is a very significant amount of money.”
“In discharging this statutory duty of quality, trusts work closely with the RQIA in the event of regulatory issues arising, including both care and environmental issues. <BR /> <BR />Notwithstanding all of this, should any individuals or their families or carers have concerns about the care they are receiving, they can make a complaint in whatever way they are comfortable with. So, individual residents or their representatives do not have to wait until an inspection is carried out. Direct contact can be made with the RQIA if anyone has concerns. I urge MLAs to take that on board and let the RQIA know if they hear of any concerns in their community. <BR /> <BR />All regulated care homes must operate a complaints procedure that meets the requirements of applicable regulations, relevant minimum standards and the HSC complaints procedure.”
“<BR /> <BR />The frequency of inspection will increase above the statutory minimum in response to specific enforcement action and/or concerns about the quality of care in a registered home. Registered providers are required to notify existing residents and their families of formal enforcement action. The RQIA revises and updates its enforcement policy on a regular basis. The current enforcement policy was extensively updated as recently as March 2013 to reflect the lessons learned by the authority in taking enforcement action. The RQIA has also initiated a review of its inspection methodology. <BR /> <BR />In addition, trusts have a statutory duty to ensure that they provide quality care to all service users and are responsible for carrying out formal reviews of the care packages provided to individuals, as a minimum, once a year.”
“I am being honest with Members. The report issued in July 2014 does not paint the RQIA in a particularly attractive light. I accept that. What I am hoping to show is that the RQIA has learnt from errors and misjudgements in relation to Cherry Tree House. The penny has dropped, as it were, that improvements were required, and changes have been instigated by this and other examples. <BR /> <BR />We also have to recognise the impact that closure can have for residents, who may be obliged to give up their home as a consequence. It is also worth pointing out that not every resident of Cherry Tree complained. Some residents were relatively content. But, I also have to admit that many others were not content, and that is an important issue.”
“<BR /> <BR />Each time the RQIA takes enforcement action, the nature and extent of that enforcement action is published on its website, so there is total openness here. A member of the public can go on to the website and see what has been said about their local residential or nursing home. <BR /> <BR />The sanctions available to the RQIA include the imposition of conditions on registration, restriction of further admissions until improvement is demonstrated, or cancellation of registration, which results in closure. So, the sanctions are quite draconian when used. The RQIA adopts a stepped approach to enforcement. Closure or urgent closure would be considered as a measure of last resort to be deployed when all other sanctions have failed.”
“That is why we have a strong independent regulatory body for Health and Social Care (HSC), the Regulation and Quality Improvement Authority, or the RQIA as it is commonly known. This body has statutory powers to inspect standards and to enforce sanctions. I should emphasise that this body was formed in 2005, the time when concerns were being raised by Cherry Tree, and that is relevant, as we will hear later on. <BR /> <BR />The RQIA inspects provision against departmental minimum standards for nursing and residential care homes. The RQIA uses these standards and the corresponding regulations as the basis for regulation of the sectors. These standards set the benchmark for the quality of care that residents can expect to receive.”
“I am grateful to Mr Dickson for securing this debate today. I know that he has worked tirelessly to represent the families of people in Cherry Tree. I listened very carefully to his views and those expressed by other Members. As I promised earlier in an interjection, I undertake to meet Mr Dickson and the families so that we can look at this very difficult issue in much more detail. <BR /> <BR />I assure Mr Dickson and Members of this House that I am committed to ensuring that people living in our nursing and residential homes receive a safe and quality standard of care. The important part of achieving these goals involves ensuring that proper and effective processes are in place to identify and rectify any instances where the care provided falls short of what any of us would regard as acceptable for our loved ones.”
“Yes, I am aware of the request, and I will meet you and the families.”
“Can I make it absolutely certain that we are taking this consultation extremely seriously? The community now has time to put forward its views on what it feels are the defects of this decision and to provide suggestions for an alternative. This will be taken seriously; the Member has my commitment on that.”
“No, I simply have to finish this. I am sorry, Mr Dickson. <BR /> <BR />The door is now open for the public to have their say — albeit within a tight timescale, as I believe that the deadline will probably be around 31 January — with a clear prospect that the envisaged four-month temporary closure of these services could potentially come to an end sooner. My Department will monitor the situation closely over the coming weeks to ensure that the service provided to MS sufferers in Northern Ireland continues to meet the needs of the local population. <BR /> <BR />I can now give way to Mr Dickson.”
“The only proposal that I am making is that there will be no new admissions — no new admissions. Those who are there already will continue to be cared for up until the point at which they would have been moved on as if this decision had never occurred — in other words, in line with medical assessment. <BR /> <BR />Any alternative proposals that are suggested in the responses to the consultation must release broadly equivalent resource savings that, in the view of clinicians, would provide services safely in terms of the impact of the proposal on the quality, sustainability and accessibility of services, and provide assurance about adherence to established standards of service.”
“I need to make the point that there will be no fresh admissions but that those who are already in the hospital will continue to receive the care that they require until they are clinically assessed and allowed to leave — in other words, as if this decision had never been made. Any alternative, viable proposals —”
“I would be absolutely delighted if Members or the community or those who are experts in this field provide viable alternatives. But I have to make a very important point. They must release an equivalent amount of saving to what is being achieved by the decisions —”
“Mr McIlveen raises an important point, and I would be happy to look into that issue and address the points he has raised.”
“<BR /> <BR />However, we have four months before the end of March next year, and in view of the widespread concern, my Department will be instructing the Northern Trust to immediately begin an eight-week public consultation, as Mr McMullan requested, on this temporary closure to see whether there are alternative viable proposals that could be put in place to allow the services to reopen before the end of March.”
“The trust will continue to do all it can to communicate with all stakeholders to ensure that everyone understands the decision and the options now available to them. I have met the MS Society, elected representatives, health professionals and members of the Ballycastle community. I visited Dalriada Hospital on Friday. I met Tony Stevens of the Northern Trust to discuss this issue on 13 November. <BR /> <BR />Mr Speaker, I have listened to the widespread concerns expressed by patients and families about the potential adverse impact of the temporary closure of services at Dalriada. I am very aware of the public’s dissatisfaction that patients and clients have not had an opportunity to participate in a formal consultation process on these proposals. I cannot stress enough that we also need to ensure patient safety.”
“Trust senior management attended Dalriada Hospital on Thursday 30 October and spoke with patients and staff. <BR /> <BR />Personnel staff continue to work on the ground to help and advise those staff affected. The trust will continue to meet and discuss redeployment options with those staff. The trust communicated with trade unions on 30 October and formally met with them on Friday 31 October. The trust also continued to communicate with all political representatives in the area and met Moyle council representatives on 3 November and attended a public meeting that same evening. <BR /> <BR />Ongoing communication is taking place between the trust and the MS Society and, of course, the media.”
“Permanent staff will be redeployed to support acute community and emergency services. No staff — and I emphasise this — will lose their jobs, and the hours they work will remain as per their contract. There are a number of jobs in the Causeway locality and the personnel, staff and services managers are currently on the ground, working with staff to match their skills to vacancies available and to ensure that, as far as possible, individual circumstances are taken into account. <BR /> <BR />Following the announcement, the Northern Trust contacted MS service users and families from the northern area and advised them of the decision. Relevant key workers are currently meeting patients to discuss options for their future respite care. The trust also linked with the Western and Belfast Trusts regarding this change.”
“I will try at the end, but I really have to get to the end of the speech. Members will understand when I do so. <BR /> <BR />Demand in the unit tends to peak at certain times, such as in February and during the summer months. That means that, at other times, the unit has a very low occupancy rate. Members have to accept that. I am advised that, today, there will be two patients remaining in the MS unit in Dalriada Hospital and seven receiving intermediate care. I make it absolutely clear that none of those patients will be required to leave unless it is clinically appropriate to do so. There is no cut-off date on 30 November. If someone requires clinical or respite care at that date, they will continue in the Dalriada. <BR /> <BR />It is anticipated that half of the employees associated with the Dalriada site may be affected.”
“In 2013-14 — I mentioned this when answering a question from Mr Swann during a Question Time — the number of bed days available was 4,380. Of those, 1,402 were used. That equates to a 32% occupancy rate. That is worrying, because it indicates that, whilst the standard of care is very high, the demand is not as pervasive as Members suggest.”
“I have no doubt that, when the board was discussing the issue, other options were considered, maybe even the Robinson, but by the time that the decision got to me, there were not options. I was given a list of what the trust, in its professional judgement, considered to be the best option for saving the money. I have no doubt that the Member could well be right, but the list that I have does not include an either/or. It simply states, "Dalriada". <BR /> <BR />Most of those — 80% — who access MS respite services at Dalriada come from the Northern Trust , with the remainder predominantly coming from the Western Trust. There are also two users from Belfast. The other trusts have already made alternative arrangements.”
“It is worth mentioning that the demand for respite care in the winter period is extremely low. At the time of the decision, only one person was booked in for the second part of November. The next peak of demand was not until February. The trust officials were content that there was easily capacity in the north Antrim area to meet that demand. It is not a matter of scuttling around trying to find alternative provision. As it turned out, there was time and there was capacity.”
“I acknowledge and appreciate the commendable service that the MS respite centre provides for service users and their families.”
“However, it believes that it can be more cost-effectively provided elsewhere. Alternatives being discussed include direct payments, local independent sector provision for individuals or local bed-based group provision to facilitate groups of friends. In the case of individuals assessed as requiring respite care in a hospital setting, arrangements are being made to assess the Robinson Hospital in Ballymoney. In-reach services provided to service users while they receive respite at Dalriada, such as podiatry, dentistry and physiotherapy, will continue to be provided in the alternative setting decided on. <BR /> <BR />The trust provided an assurance that there will be no change to the booking of anyone who had been booked into respite care in November. That commitment will be honoured.”
“I assure you that I did not have other options to consider. It was not a question of me picking out Dalriada in preference to taking some other difficult decision. I was given enough money to make the savings, and that was that. <BR /> <BR />The temporary closure of the respite beds and intermediate care beds in Dalriada Hospital will result in a significant saving of £0·6 million. Should the measure be proposed to be made permanent, I have been explicit that a full consultation exercise will be carried out. <BR /> <BR />The Northern Trust has affirmed that it will endeavour to minimise the impact on front-line patient care. It is important to note that everyone who wishes to receive respite care will continue to do so. The trust is committed to continuing to meet people's assessed need appropriately.”
“Since summer 2013, the Department has explored and implemented opportunities to curtail and control this expenditure. <BR /> <BR />As I have said before, my priorities are to ensure that the services provided by health and social care trusts are safe and effective and that my Department achieves financial balance, as is required of all Ministers. To achieve these aims, health and social care trusts have provided a range of contingency plans to secure financial break-even, which is an obligation that is required of all Ministers. I have to be absolutely clear here: I asked the trust to come up with a series of savings, and it gave me a list. I did not make a choice on those savings. I was given a list that it believed was necessary.”
“I dare not tell him how many sleepless hours I have had over this particular decision; this decision has been exceptionally problematic for me. <BR /> <BR />I much regret that the Northern Trust has had to consider this action as a consequence of budget pressures. No one in this entire debate has told me that we do not need an extra £70 million to balance the books or that we do not have to save that money. The difficulty is that I am not getting any options on the £70 million or the decision on the Dalriada. <BR /> <BR />The pressures facing health and social care were substantial in 2013-14 and included a wide range of services, such as domiciliary care, acute services, safety and quality, emergency department unscheduled care and children's services.”
“Thank you, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker. First of all, I want to say that I may not be as liberal with taking interventions as I might normally be, because I have an important point to make at the end of this particular contribution. <BR /> <BR />I thank the community and the Save the Dal campaign on the north coast for the understanding and respect that they have shown for me. I have absolutely no argument whatsoever with the way in which I have been treated. I appreciate that, in a situation where of course they feel exceptionally strongly about the issue. <BR /> <BR />I have listened carefully to Members' contributions throughout the debate. I want to say to Mr Dallat that I apologise if I did smile during the middle of a contribution. I take this issue terribly seriously.”
“I think that I was first. Even if I accept the Member's premise, and we did lay off management — 90% of our management costs are on staff — we would not receive any savings for three years. So that suggestion would not get me out of the intense difficulty that I am in. I have to find £70 million by the end of March 2015.”
“In case this runs as an argument, that was not the case. There was no second division. We asked the trust to come up with a series of savings, and it came back with a list to meet the target. No alternatives were given, and there was no decision by me that favoured one over another. The list that I have is the entire list, and the Member has it. There are no other options on the table.”
“This issue is far too important for anyone to have doubts about my commitment or that of any of the three Departments. We owe it to thousands of our children and young people to make certain that we as an Assembly do everything we can to eliminate this scourge. If devolution is to mean anything in Northern Ireland, it must lead to better protection for our children. If we cannot do that, we should not be here. It is essential, and I am totally committed to doing this, as he will well know.”
“I need to make it clear that the protocols of the House set out that one Minister has to take the lead in any statement. Therefore, it would not have been possible for two other Ministers to have given their input on the report. However, I can assure him that, prior to this, I have received strong support from both Ministers. <BR /> <BR />It is not a question of rejecting any recommendations; we have to sit down and talk to the other Ministers because there is some overlap. As a Department, we have to examine carefully all the recommendations, some of which we have publicly committed ourselves to today and some of which require further consideration. I guarantee him that, when we come to that conclusion, the House will be made aware, probably through a written statement, of what exactly we are doing.”
“<BR /> <BR />Finally, let me say that many Members opposite have been given the opportunity to pledge their total support for openness on this issue, and not one of them has taken it. I find it very worrying that that opportunity has been missed, time after time after time. Are they committed to dealing with this scourge on society, or will they look after their paramilitary friends in towns and cities throughout Northern Ireland?”
“<BR /> <BR />The Executive and the Assembly as a whole must take the issue seriously. We cannot do it alone and nor can DOJ or the Department of Education. The report takes the novel step of making a recommendation for the Assembly rather than individual Departments and calls on the Assembly to take the issue extremely seriously and provide, through the Budget, the money required to invest in the future safeguarding of our children. If we do not do that, we will build up a backlog of the most horrendously difficult situations that we will have to deal with when those young people become adults. As a result of sexual exploitation, they could end up in care and could themselves end up as exploiters, as is often the case. Therefore, we must try to deal with this case immediately.”
“The specific remit of the Marshall report was looked-after children, which includes children in foster care, children in residential care and children in homes and placements. There is also the thematic report, which will identify a specific number of cases — we think that it is 22. We hope that the more general education and awareness programme that we are initiating will help parents, who are obviously the first line of defence against this awful activity, to provide protection for their children. However, sadly, in many cases, the abuse has been carried out by a parent. I find that particularly horrific, given that I am a parent and a grandparent: I just cannot fathom how people could do that. However, it is widespread. We are trying to put as much effort as we can into the public awareness campaign.”
“Internet access by teenagers as a percentage is way into the high 90s, and they can be exposed to the most dreadful, sadistic, horrible pornographic material. I see this as an absolute priority, and I want buy-in from the whole Assembly on it. <BR /> <BR />There is a difficulty with the issue. We saw the 'Spotlight' programme the other night. Where was the website based that was exploiting children in Northern Ireland? Israel. That is part of the problem. Much of it is being marketed outside Northern Ireland. We really need to get a grip on what is a terribly difficult situation.”
“I emphasise to the Member and others that the Department of Health cannot deal with the issue alone: it is a problem that affects Northern Ireland's society in general and has to be dealt with by the entire Northern Ireland Executive. <BR /> <BR />We give our children all the freedom of the fox in the chicken run. We expose them to things that were absolutely unimaginable to most people during their childhood. Fortunately, my children have escaped the worst of it, but I shudder to think what my grandchildren will be exposed to. Over 60% of boys under 13 have been exposed to hard-core pornography. What impact is that having on future relationships? What impact is that having on their relationships with girls and, hopefully eventually, their wife or partner? What is going on is truly dreadful.”
“First, may I say that I could not agree more with the Member on the issue. How did I protect my children from all sorts of undesirable activities online? I simply ensured that the computer was kept somewhere where there could be some form of supervision. That is utterly meaningless today, when children from five onwards have access to the most horrific content online through their mobile phones and tablets. The days of parental control are over, and it is getting more and more difficult. <BR /> <BR />The safety strategy has been prepared in the last few weeks, and we are dealing with that as a matter of great urgency.”