Mark Durkan
Foyle · Social Democratic and Labour Party · Northern Ireland
“That review involved an extensive engagement exercise with charities, regulators and funders, aimed at creating a more modern and proportionate regulatory system.”
“When the review was commenced in 2021, many organisations were still in the midst of responding to the pandemic. Since then, they have faced a succession of new and evolving challenges. The ending of European funding programmes, on which so many in our communities relied for decades, has left a significant gap.”
“<BR /> <BR />The broad principles behind the Bill are sensible. The changes will modernise charity regulation, strengthen the Charity Commission's ability to intervene where misconduct or mismanagement occurs, improve information sharing and, importantly, reduce unnecessary red tape, particularly for smaller charities with limited adminis…”
“I welcome the opportunity to speak today. Before turning to the detail of the legislation — there will not even be that much detail in the debate today at Second Stage — I pay tribute to our charity sector. Across every constituency, charities provide support that changes and saves lives every single day.”
“<BR /> <BR />Whilst the SDLP supports legislation that removes unnecessary bureaucracy, we should not kid ourselves that administrative reform alone will secure the future of charities and organisations in the voluntary and community sector.”
“I thank the Minister for giving way. Like other Members, I welcome the fact that we have reached this point. There seems to be consensus among Committee members and, I am sure, all Members that the introduction of these measures will save lives, which begs the question of whether the 10-year delay in introducing the measures had an opposi…”
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“I thank the Member for the question, his first to me. I know that he is just fresh out of local government, so hopefully he had some input into his former council's stance on reducing greenhouse gas emissions before coming here. I think that the new councils have an extremely important role to play and that, by and large, councils have embraced that when it comes to tackling climate change. I believe that the opportunities that they have to do so are huge, be it through their community planning or even through their work on their own local development plans, because it will now become more of a factor when applications come in for planning permission. Factors such as environmental or wider impact around the emission of greenhouse gases and so forth will be taken into consideration when applications are being assessed.”
“I think that some people in the Chamber and maybe some not in the Chamber at the moment — maybe not in the Chamber anymore — are beginning to accept the impact of climate change and the importance of doing something about it.”
“<BR /> <BR />I would like to reiterate to the Member my commitment to working across government and with all sectors of our society, as well as all sections within the House, to agree on measures that can help to address both future and current climate change. My Department has already implemented a number of key actions to help reduce greenhouse gas emissions. It is not something that my Department can do alone. We need other Departments to sign up and buy in. There are ongoing cross-departmental working groups and meetings in that regard, and I believe that progress is being made. It may not be being made as quickly or dramatically as we would like, but it is being made.”
“I thank the Member for that question. In response to the first part of the question: there are not that many MLAs in the Chamber, but, of those present, I am confident that the vast majority will support me in my efforts to tackle climate change and to secure the international agreement that is required. With regards to the other question, Environment Week did kick off last night and has been extremely successful so far. I encourage all Members to drop into the Long Gallery to participate, or at least to observe events today. I congratulate the Environment Committee for its initiative and the Northern Ireland Environment Link (NIEL) for its work in making the week possible and coordinating events.”
“I have written to the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change, Amber Rudd, indicating that I do intend to go to Paris, where I will make it clear that we should be striving to secure an ambitious international agreement this year and pushing for opportunities to increase the EU emissions reduction target further as a result.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Paris conference is, without doubt, an opportunity for the world’s leaders to deliver a global climate agreement that is unquestionably in our, and the entire global community's, best interests. We cannot underestimate how critical that is, and that was further underlined last week when Pope Francis held an unprecedented audience with all the European Environment Ministers and Commissioners and appealed to them to show leadership and push for a long-term decarbonisation goal.”
“Although climate change is often and rightly seen as a global issue, we are all too aware of the impacts that it is having at a local level, such as severe weather events that threaten our health, homes, businesses and way of life. That is why I have publicly stated many times my view that we all can and, indeed, must do more to reduce our greenhouse gas emissions. <BR /> <BR />The main aim of the 2015 United Nations conference in Paris will be to achieve a new international agreement to create the vital framework that the world needs to limit the average global temperature increase to below 2°C. By successfully doing so, we will help to combat climate change effectively, boost the transition towards resilient, low-carbon societies and avoid the worst impacts of climate change.”
“People have concerns about potential impacts on their health, and rightly so, and, although the reports indicate that the effect of discharge from Sellafield and other nuclear plants is negligible, I fully appreciate that those concerns will persist. All that I can do is ensure, as Minister, that my Department and the agency will continue to do everything that they can to monitor the situation. <BR /> <BR />Regarding other health impacts, questions would probably be better directed to the Minister of Health. There will probably be a 10-minute window next Monday when the Member can do that.”
“Since the 1970s, my Department has had a very comprehensive programme in place to assess the impact of radioactive discharges into the Irish Sea on the coastline of Northern Ireland. The results of the programme are published annually in a report titled, as I outlined in an earlier answer, 'Radioactivity in Food and the Environment' which is issued jointly by all the environment agencies on these islands. The report focuses on key information that demonstrates that, in the North, food is safe and the public's exposure to ionising radiation from discharges is insignificant. <BR /> <BR />The health concerns raised by the Member have been raised before, and there have been long and loud campaigns from South Down elected representatives on behalf of its people over the years.”
“The dumps to which the Member refers fall within Scottish waters and are therefore not the direct responsibility of my Department or the Northern Ireland Environment Agency. However, I am aware of the issues raised by the dumps in many areas across the North, in particular and in recent times the south Down coastline. Correspondence on the matter came to my Department before my time as Minister. When something comes ashore, responsibility rests with the local authority, so it would be up to the local council to remove it. However, given the dangerous nature of the materials, there would be assistance from Britain to do so, and there would be an input from the Northern Ireland Environment Agency as well.”
“I thank the Member for that supplementary question. Neither I nor my Department are experts when it comes to arms dumps.”
“<BR /> <BR />On average, people in Northern Ireland receive 2,500 microsieverts of radiation a year from all natural and artificial sources. Of that, 50% is due to exposure to radon in the home, 12% is from medical exposure, and less than 0·1% is from nuclear discharges. It should be noted that the lowest yearly dose likely linked to increased cancer risk is 100,000 microsieverts. <BR /> <BR />In addition to that comprehensive monitoring programme, the UK has a 24/7 nuclear radiation monitoring and emergency response network known as Radioactive Incident Monitoring Network (RIMNET).”
“The programme includes checks on the radiation levels of the coastline at approximately 50 locations around the North, as well as monitoring the levels of radioactivity in seawater, seaweed, shellfish and fish. The adequacy of the monitoring programme is reviewed regularly and, where appropriate, will take into account any changes in the discharge of radioactivity from Sellafield. <BR /> <BR />The results of the programme are published annually in a joint report entitled 'Radioactivity in Food and the Environment' produced by the four UK environment agencies, in conjunction with the Food Standards Agency. Results for last year, like those in previous years, indicate that the levels of contamination are negligible in terms of radiological impact on the population of the North.”
“Nuclear energy and nuclear installations are excepted matters under the Northern Ireland Act 1998 and, as such, are not within the remit of the Department of the Environment. Radioactive discharges from the Sellafield site are regulated by the Environment Agency and the Office for Nuclear Regulation. My Department has responsibility for monitoring the environment in Northern Ireland to assess the impact of radioactivity produced elsewhere, including nuclear facilities such as Sellafield. <BR /> <BR />The Northern Ireland Environment Agency (NIEA) has a comprehensive environmental monitoring programme to assess any such impact on the Northern Ireland coastline.”
“I thank the Member for that question. As it stands, I can make decisions on what is before me. I was required to make a decision on genetically modified crops by 3 October, and I have done so. I understand the Member's confusion as regards other genetically modified foods, and it is not dissimilar to the point that Joe Byrne raised with regard to GM feedstocks. <BR /> <BR />Responsibility for the deliberate release of GM material into the environment, including GM crops, rests with me as Minister of the Environment. However, as a courtesy, I wrote to Michelle O'Neill, the Minister of Agriculture and Rural Development, to notify her of my position and my decision.”
“However, we are talking about the current EU Commission's GM-approved list. I have no doubt that, in the future, there will be additions to the list, and while I have made my decision and it is a strong statement of intent, it is not carved in stone. As and when new crops are added to the list, I or a future Minister will have the ability to revisit that position.”
“I thank the Member for that supplementary question. With all these GM questions, I feel like I am on 'GMU'. There is a lot of science out there on this issue. Scientists are like lawyers. Different scientists have different opinions and draw different conclusions on different subjects. There is science out there, and over the past 24 hours I have received criticism and correspondence on my stance from scientists who say that GM crops are great and pose no risk at all. However, there are also scientists out there who take a contrary view. <BR /> <BR />My guiding principle, when it comes to making decisions, is a precautionary one. I am charged with safeguarding our environment here in the North, and until there is complete and robust scientific evidence that it is safe, I am unable to approve the cultivation of GM crops here.”
“However, given the similarities between the size of agricultural holdings in the Republic and, indeed, the fact that they, like us, depend so heavily on that clean, green image when it comes to exporting our produce across the world, which we do so well, I am fairly confident that they will agree with me on this issue.”
“I thank Mr Byrne for those supplementaries. I certainly do accept that the agriculture industry as we know it would not be viable without the use of imported GM animal feed. However, I am certainly satisfied that the approved varieties of genetically modified feed pose no risk to either the environment or human health. <BR /> <BR />As regards conversations or discussions with my counterpart in the Republic, Minister Alan Kelly, there has been ongoing dialogue on this issue at official level over the past month. While no announcement has been made yet by those in Dublin, I anticipate that there will be one soon and that they will make the right choice too. The Member quite rightly identifies potential issues, should the Republic of Ireland take a different approach to us on this.”
“I consider that the costs of doing so could be significant and, in many cases, totally impractical. Furthermore, we are rightly proud of our natural environment and rich biodiversity. We are perceived internationally to have a clean, green image. I am concerned that the growing of GM crops, which is acknowledged to be controversial, could damage that image.”
“The European Commission has put in place transitional arrangements to allow member states to opt out of growing approved GM crops. To take advantage of those arrangements, member states must let the Commission know by Friday 2 October. Responsibility for matters relating to the deliberate release of GM material into the environment, including GM crops, rests with me. Accordingly, the Member may be aware that, last night, I announced that I am prohibiting the cultivation of GM crops here. <BR /> <BR />As I remain unconvinced of their advantages, I considered it prudent to prohibit their cultivation for the foreseeable future. In addition, the pattern of land use here and the relatively small size of many agricultural holdings would create potential difficulties if we were to seek to keep GM and non-GM crops separate.”
“As I said earlier, there are balances to be struck between environmental protection and growth of the economy via reductions in regulatory burdens on businesses. I believe that this Bill strikes the right balance. I fully understand that we all need to be sure that it does and I am committed to considering the views of Members to ensure that we arrive at the best possible package of measures. <BR /> <BR />I and my officials look forward to working closely with the Committee for the Environment as it begins the detailed scrutiny of the Bill, which, I have no doubt, will prove to be equally valuable. I commend the Bill to you.”
“I thank the Member for that intervention and declaration, although, from what I hear, he is not that good at it anyway.”
“Again, I would like to thank Members for their contributions to the debate on the Environmental Better Regulation Bill and for the questions and issues that they have raised. To conclude, as I said earlier, there are balances —”
“I would also like to assure the Member, the House, environmental groups and businesses that, 'You've got a friend in me'.”
“I also concur with the Member on the role that the angling fraternity plays as custodian of some of our rivers. Mr McCrea made a good contribution as well. I have to tell him that I would much rather be compared to Sheriff Woody than the Sheriff of Nottingham.”
“I am glad to hear that. The Member has read it, yet still thinks that there are proposals to ban certain fuels. This is not about taking fuels off; this Bill is about allowing new fuels to be added, and it is exclusive to the controlled zones. She was a wee bit concerned, as were other Members, about a lack of detail. We are only at Second Stage. Lord Morrow was so concerned that he described it as a "skeleton Bill". I look forward to working with the Committee to put more flesh on those bones. <BR /> <BR />The Member also expressed concern that the consumer will pay. This is about aiding consumers. This legislation and its implementation will ensure that the type of major and heinous environmental crimes that he talked about are much less likely to occur, and certainly much less likely to go undetected.”
“While it is hardly as dramatic as an episode of 'Eastenders', it is an area that affects many people and many businesses. <BR /> <BR />Mrs Overend made a good contribution as well. She focused — as I suspected she might — on the issues around clean air. It was an issue raised by Lord Morrow as well. First, I assure the House, again, that there are no proposals to ban fuels of any type. The first part of a cross-border study has been carried out. A report has been shared with stakeholders. It has also been available in the Assembly library for over a month. I do not know if any or how many Members have availed themselves of the opportunity to actually read it.”
“<BR /> <BR />The Member asked a question on powers of entry. Currently, powers of entry are spread over 60 or 70 pieces of legislation. I was just chatting to one of the officials in the Box who showed me his warrant card that lists the specific pieces of legislation that he has powers of entry under. There are other officials, I am sure, who have much bigger cards, and some who practically have books giving their powers of entry. The Bill will also give greater clarity to those who are regulated when an official lands to carry out an inspection and says under what piece of legislation he is there. <BR /> <BR />Mr Maginness made a good contribution. It was very supportive, as always. However, I have to say that I am very sorry that he does not find the issue of permitting and registration particularly exciting.”
“I can assure the Member that there was an awful lot of streamlining, not just in my speech but of my speech. I took it from 26 pages to 16. Initially, this is essentially a desk-based exercise, the benefits of which will be apparent to and welcomed by those who are regulated, many of whom — Mr McElduff will be aware of this from a rural perspective — feel overburdened and over-regulated. It will ease the pressure on good businesses by reducing the number of permits and licences that they need to apply for. That will not reduce the height of any environmental hurdles that businesses need to clear, but it will reduce the number of them and will ensure that there are not loads of hurdles very close together, one after the other, that businesses and individuals find extremely difficult to navigate.”
“I look forward to the Committee's continued and intensified involvement, and I pledge to work with it to get the best better regulation Bill that we can. <BR /> <BR />With her Committee Chair hat off, Ms Lo outlined the need for the legislation from the perspective of environmental groups as well as of businesses. Let me assure Ms Lo that, over the next couple of months, I intend to work with my staff, NGOs and DARD to ensure that the ethos and enforcement of environmental protection is at the heart of the new Department. <BR /> <BR />Mrs Cameron's contribution was also very welcome. She made the very important point — I picked it out specifically — that the Bill will not dilute environmental regulation. <BR /> <BR />Mr McElduff said that the Bill appeared to him to be very technical in character.”
“I am grateful to the Chair of the Environment Committee and to Members from all sides of the House for their consideration of the Bill and their contributions to the debate. Their comments have, as always, been most valuable. <BR /> <BR />I would like to respond to issues that have been raised. I can assure Members that I will also read the Hansard report of the debate to ensure that I have not missed any issues. If I find that I have, I will write to the Members concerned. If I do not find the issues that I have missed, please feel free to come and remind me of them. <BR /> <BR />Ms Lo was first to respond. I very much welcome her support for the Bill and the rationale behind it. She gave a synopsis of the Committee's involvement to date.”
“That approach has the additional benefit of reducing the risk of long-term serious non-compliance going undetected and has strong similarities with good practice in other countries such as England, Wales, the Netherlands and Australia. <BR /> <BR />The measures that the Bill introduces will provide a modern, fit-for-purpose regulatory regime and a more attractive regulatory environment that will help businesses to invest and grow whilst maintaining environmental standards. Creating a more streamlined and effective regulatory regime will support compliant businesses and target those who flout environmental law. It will reduce the risk of environmental harm and the very significant costs involved in cleaning up and restoring the environment, of which the Assembly knows only too well.”
“It has resulted from extensive stakeholder engagement between businesses, regulators and environmental groups, and it aligns with the Executive's Programme for Government priority of growing a sustainable economy and investing in the future by having a simpler, harmonised and easier-to-understand regulatory framework. <BR /> <BR />The Bill also supports the Executive's initiative, Building a Prosperous and United Community, which refers to the need to reduce regulatory burdens and red tape for businesses. Let me be clear: the Bill will not change the substantive requirements of permits in environmental protection, but it will reduce the administrative burden necessary to deliver those requirements. The benefits for business will, therefore, generally be expressed in terms of savings in administrative costs.”
“Those regulations will, of course, require full and detailed regulatory impact assessments at a future date when the respective regulations giving effect to the powers in the Bill are developed. Those assessments will also be subject to consultation along with the draft regulations. <BR /> <BR />As Environment Minister, I am passionate about delivering better environmental outcomes. This rationalisation of environmental law will, I believe, deliver better and smarter environmental regulation by providing a more streamlined and effective regulatory system for businesses and regulators.”
“In practice, my Department's Drinking Water Inspectorate carries out regulation of drinking water in the North on behalf of both Departments to cover both areas since the previous responsibility was split from DOE following the 2007 water reform process that created NI Water. The intention is to simplify arrangements for the inspectorate, giving back my Department sole responsibility for its duties. The transfer has also been approved by Minister Kennedy. <BR /> <BR />The Bill has been assessed to determine any regulatory impact, and it is considered that it does not contain any provisions that will result in an increased or adverse impact on businesses. That is not surprising, given the better regulation aims of the Bill. <BR /> <BR />I have spoken about the regulations to be made under the Bill after it has been passed.”
“District councils were supportive of the policy to remove the requirement, as they see further assessments as an unnecessary burden that is an impediment to the speedy implementation of local action plans and prolongs non-compliance with prescribed air quality objectives. <BR /> <BR />Part 5 amends the Water and Sewerage Services (Northern Ireland) Order 2006 to transfer sole responsibility for public drinking water regulation from DRD to DOE, thereby allowing my Department to have full responsibility for the functions of the Drinking Water Inspectorate and simplifying regulatory structures. Currently, responsibility for the regulation of drinking water quality for public supplies rests with DRD, while regulation of private supplies is the responsibility of DOE.”
“<BR /> <BR />Part 4 amends the Environment (Northern Ireland) Order 2002 to remove unnecessary burdens on district councils in respect of the preparation and implementation of local air quality action plans. As part of the ongoing review of local air quality management across England, Scotland and Wales, the Department has consulted with district councils about the need to undertake further assessments of air quality to supplement information that it already has.”
“That will provide a speedier process for manufacturers to have their fuels approved or fireplaces exempted and published in accordance with the provisions of the Clean Air Order. The current process requires the Department to issue regulations every six months, adding new approved fuels and exempted fireplaces. The amendment will remove the requirement to produce regulations and replace that with an approved list, which will be updated monthly. The list will be approved by a senior official and published on a UK website. That revised process will allow manufacturers a much quicker route to market and reduce the administrative burden on the Department, while still providing an open and accountable process.”
“The review will also help to determine how the Department intends to bring forward a simpler and more streamlined set of powers of entry and associated powers. It is important to have in place a robust mechanism to ensure that powers of entry are considered carefully and to question whether they are fully justified and proportionate. As with the code, any changes proposed in the statutory review will be subject to affirmative resolution procedure in the Assembly. <BR /> <BR />Parts 3, 4 and 5 of the Bill contain miscellaneous provisions that also help to deliver environmental better regulation, albeit in a small number of discrete areas. <BR /> <BR />Part 3 amends the Clean Air (NI) Order 1981 to provide for the streamlining of the method for listing authorised fuels and exempted fireplaces in a smoke control area.”
“The code will contain guidance on such matters as notices given to owners or occupiers of premises, witnesses who may be permitted during inspections, conduct of officials during searches and the retention of records about the exercise of powers. The draft code will also be subject to consultation. The final version of the code should help greatly to provide clarity for the regulator and the regulated. <BR /> <BR />Part 2 also makes provision for a statutory review of powers of entry. The Bill, therefore, ensures that a review is carried out to clarify what powers of entry and associated powers exist across the body of environmental law, how they are exercised and what safeguards are in place.”
“As I have already said, the draft regulations will be subject to full public consultation. <BR /> <BR />Part 2 of the Bill provides enabling powers for the rationalising of the powers of entry and associated powers for environmental inspection and investigation. It ensures that powers of entry and associated powers should not simply be reviewed on an individual basis. Rather, groups of similar powers should be combined to improve transparency and synergy, provide more consistent safeguards and, ultimately, reduce numbers of powers of entry in statute, making powers of entry easier to identify and understand. Part 2 also contains provision for a code of practice in relation to the exercise of powers of entry. Regulators must have regard to the code.”
“Schedule 1 to the Bill also enables the regulations to provide for emissions trading schemes; charging schemes; local enquiries; public registers; compliance and enforcement; rights of appeal; and payment of compensation in respect of any loss or damage. <BR /> <BR />The proposed regulations will transpose all or parts of a number of EU directives which have previously been delivered through various subordinate legislation. That will include, but is not limited to, the waste framework directive, the landfill directive, the industrial emissions directive, and the waste electrical and electronic equipment directive. <BR /> <BR />The drafting of the regulations is at an early stage, due to their length and the complexities involved in rationalising a number of different permitting and licensing regimes.”
“It allows for detailed procedural provisions to be included in the regulations governing how an application for a permit or registration may be made, how that application will be assessed and how a permit or a registration may be granted. It also provides a framework for the extent to which the regulations may allow requirements to be imposed in permits and registrations, as well as allowing regulations to provide mechanisms for transfer, variation and consolidation, and for the suspension and revocation of permits or registration together with a requirement to take associated preventative or remedial action.”
“<BR /> <BR />Regulated activities may require a bespoke permit, a standard permit, a registration or to be subject to general environmental rules, depending on the complexity of the activity and the environmental risks that it poses. The public will, of course, have the opportunity to comment on the draft regulations during consultation, just to reassure Members, and the regulations will be subject to the affirmative resolution procedure, which is the more stringent form of Assembly control. <BR /> <BR />Schedule 1 contains the finer detail of all matters for which regulations may be made under clause 2. Amongst other things, it enables the regulations to specify the procedures relating to the authorisation of regulated activities by permits and registration.”
“<BR /> <BR />In that respect, I think that it would be helpful to briefly outline at this stage how I intend to exercise the enabling powers through regulations and what I envisage the regulations will contain and, indeed, to reassure the Assembly of its scrutiny role and approval. The regulations under the Bill will provide a common set of environmental permitting procedures to replace several regimes under existing arrangements and will allow for a single permit to cover multiple activities on a site where appropriate. That will simplify compliance-assessment arrangements and will, in some cases, reduce the number of inspections that are required. It will reduce red tape for compliant operators and will allow my Department to focus on higher-risk activities.”
“Part 1, along with schedule 1, specifically provides enabling powers for my Department to introduce regulations, supporting measures and guidance to enable the Northern Ireland Environment Agency and councils to change the way they work with business. The regulations will contain a lot of detailed technical provision that would be inappropriate in a Bill. Such measures would also need to be regularly updated to take account, for example, of technical developments and new EU and international obligations of the UK. The flexibility that is needed in this area would not be available if the relevant measures were specified directly in primary legislation.”
“My Department needs a regulatory system that will deliver desired environmental outcomes and help responsible businesses to operate effectively within environmental limits. By reducing regulatory burdens on compliant, responsible businesses, the Bill will have the added benefit of freeing up resources to target irresponsible businesses and bring them into compliance. It will result in a system that is more effective in avoiding major and costly non-compliance or that can detect it at an early stage, thus reducing the risk of very expensive environmental restoration. That is why the Bill is important and timely. <BR /> <BR />I will now address each of the Bill's provisions in turn.”
“Alongside the environmental permitting provisions, that will allow for the simplification and optimisation of compliance-assessment and enforcement arrangements. In so doing, it is important to respect human rights and the rights of individuals in their own homes and businesses against unnecessary intrusion. It is essential that powers of entry, as with any enforcement power, achieve the right balance between the need to enforce the law and ensure public protection and provide sufficient safeguards and rights for the individual. <BR /> <BR />It has become more difficult for the regulated community to understand and meet its obligations. The complexity of the current system inhibits regulators from taking a holistic approach to environmental regulation, performance and management.”
“The Bill creates a streamlined system of regulation and guidance that makes it easier for individuals and businesses to understand this important area of environmental law. <BR /> <BR />The Bill provides for the rationalisation of powers of entry and associated powers, making them easier for all parties to understand and follow.”