John Swinney
Scottish National Party · Scotland
“Since the report from several years ago was published, the Government has presided over the passage of legislation to rationalise that area of activity. Work is under way to transfer the responsibility for the funding of further education student support from the Scottish Funding Council to the Student Awards Agency Scotland.”
“I appreciate the urgency of the general policy elements of the question, because a number of applications are now being considered by planning authorities. My view is that, given the concerns that have been expressed by planning authorities, the Government has to be responsive to the issue.”
“For as long as we do not have a proper strategy on prison capacity, rehabilitation and clearing the court backlog, early release will be a revolving door, with people going in, coming out and going back into our prisons. Our justice system is in crisis, so we need a strategy.”
“I associate myself unreservedly Mr Cole-Hamilton’s comments about the feelings in the Muslim community. On Monday, I visited the Broomhouse mosque along with Simita Kumar and the Annandale Street mosque in Edinburgh with Ben Macpherson.”
“The development of further guidance will be undertaken in a manner consistent with the ruling by Lady Ross. Malcolm Offord: I thank the First Minister for his answer, which was more comprehensive than I expected.”
“I am a huge supporter of apprenticeship programmes. With foundation apprenticeships and graduate apprenticeships, the Government has brought forward important reforms that create new and successful pathways for young people. I am determined to make sure that every young person has that desirable pathway for their future.”
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“That is concerning, given that incidents of raptor persecution often occur outside of the grouse moor. I simply reflect on the fact that, since the bill was passed, we have seen continued raptor persecution happening across Scotland. That is deeply concerning, and we need to get to grips with it. For example, the nest sites of some birds, such as buzzards and goshawks, are usually found off the grouse moor area, and those nests can be a target for those who want to persecute the birds. Amendment 317 seeks to close that unintended loophole, clarifying that a grouse moor licence would cover an entire landholding, thus keeping the licensing scheme in line with the intention of Parliament. 19:45 Because of those concerns, NatureScot has attempted to plug the loophole with a new licence condition, but it is considered by many to be unworkable.”
“Amendment 316 disagreed to. The Deputy Presiding Officer: Group 18 is on the licensing of land on which certain birds may be killed or taken. Amendment 317, in the name of Mark Ruskell, is in a group on its own. Mark Ruskell: Eighteen months ago, Parliament passed the Wildlife Management and Muirburn (Scotland) Act 2024, which introduced a licensing scheme for shooting red grouse in Scotland. The policy intent of that legislation was for the whole area of an estate to be included in the licence, given that gamekeepers are normally employed to undertake predator control over the entire estate. A loophole in the legislation is allowing grouse moor managers to specify a specific part of an estate to which the licence is to apply—essentially, the grouse moor itself rather than the surrounding land of the estate.”
“For Burgess, Ariane (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Chapman, Maggie (North East Scotland) (Green) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Greer, Ross (West Scotland) (Green) Harvie, Patrick (Glasgow) (Green) Mackay, Gillian (Central Scotland) (Green) [Proxy vote cast by Patrick Harvie] Mason, John (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) Ruskell, Mark (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Slater, Lorna (Lothian) (Green) [Proxy vote cast by Maggie Chapman] Against Adam, George (Paisley) (SNP) Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire South) (SNP) Beattie, Colin (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) Briggs, Miles (Lothian) (Con) Brown, Keith (Clackmannanshire and Dunblane) (SNP) Brown, Siobhian (Ayr) (SNP) Burnett, Alexander (Aberdeenshire West) (Con) Callaghan, Stephanie (Uddingston and Bellshill) (SNP) Carson, Finlay (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Coffey, Willie (Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley) (SNP) Cole-Hamilton, Alex (Edinburgh Western) (LD) Constance, Angela (Almond Valley) (SNP) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Don-Innes, Natalie (Renfrewshire North and West) (SNP) Doris, Bob (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) Dornan, James (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) Dowey, Sharon (South Scotland) (Con) Dunbar, Jackie (Aberdeen Donside) (SNP) Ewing, Annabelle (Cowdenbeath) (SNP) Fairlie, Jim (Perthshire South and Kinross-shire) (SNP) Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) FitzPatrick, Joe (Dundee City West) (SNP) Forbes, Kate (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) Fraser, Murdo (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Gallacher, Meghan (Central Scotland) (Con) Gibson, Kenneth (Cunninghame North) (SNP) Gilruth, Jenny (Mid Fife and Glenrothes) (SNP) Golden, Maurice (North East Scotland) (Con) Gosal, Pam (West Scotland) (Con) Gougeon, Mairi (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) Gray, Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (LD) Gulhane, Sandesh (Glasgow) (Con) Hamilton, Rachael (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP) Haughey, Clare (Rutherglen) (SNP) Hepburn, Jamie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) Hyslop, Fiona (Linlithgow) (SNP) Halcro Johnston, Jamie (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Kerr, Liam (North East Scotland) (Con) Kerr, Stephen (Central Scotland) (Con) Kidd, Bill (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) Lochhead, Richard (Moray) (SNP) Lumsden, Douglas (North East Scotland) (Con) MacDonald, Gordon (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) Macpherson, Ben (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (SNP) Maguire, Ruth (Cunninghame South) (SNP) Martin, Gillian (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) Matheson, Michael (Falkirk West) (SNP) McAllan, Màiri (Clydesdale) (SNP) McCall, Roz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) McKee, Ivan (Glasgow Provan) (SNP) McLennan, Paul (East Lothian) (SNP) McMillan, Stuart (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) McNair, Marie (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) Minto, Jenni (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Mundell, Oliver (Dumfriesshire) (Con) Nicoll, Audrey (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) Rennie, Willie (North East Fife) (LD) Robertson, Angus (Edinburgh Central) (SNP) Robison, Shona (Dundee City East) (SNP) Roddick, Emma (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) Ross, Douglas (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Smith, Liz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Somerville, Shirley-Anne (Dunfermline) (SNP) Stevenson, Collette (East Kilbride) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Fulton MacGregor] Stewart, Alexander (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Stewart, Kaukab (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) Stewart, Kevin (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) Sturgeon, Nicola (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) Swinney, John (Perthshire North) (SNP) Thomson, Michelle (Falkirk East) (SNP) Todd, Maree (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) Torrance, David (Kirkcaldy) (SNP) Tweed, Evelyn (Stirling) (SNP) Webber, Sue (Lothian) (Con) Wells, Annie (Glasgow) (Con) White, Tess (North East Scotland) (Con) Whitham, Elena (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (SNP) Whittle, Brian (South Scotland) (Con) Wishart, Beatrice (Shetland Islands) (LD) Yousaf, Humza (Glasgow Pollok) (SNP) Abstentions Baillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Choudhury, Foysol (Lothian) (Ind) Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Duncan-Glancy, Pam (Glasgow) (Lab) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Griffin, Mark (Central Scotland) (Lab) Johnson, Daniel (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lennon, Monica (Central Scotland) (Lab) Leonard, Richard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Marra, Michael (North East Scotland) (Lab) McNeill, Pauline (Glasgow) (Lab) Mochan, Carol (South Scotland) (Lab) O’Kane, Paul (West Scotland) (Lab) [Proxy vote cast by Michael Marra] Rowley, Alex (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Russell, Davy (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (Lab) Sweeney, Paul (Glasgow) (Lab) Villalba, Mercedes (North East Scotland) (Lab) Whitfield, Martin (South Scotland) (Lab) The Deputy Presiding Officer: The result of the division is: For 9, Against 88, Abstentions 20.”
“That plan will take a wide-ranging approach and will look at private purpose trusts in all contexts and not just in relation to land ownership. I hope that the commitment to comprehensively address the issue offers the necessary reassurance. Ministers have been clear that decisions about that part of the 2024 act will, rightly, be made only after that work has been completed. For those reasons, I ask Rhoda Grant not to press her amendment 208. Rhoda Grant: Given the cabinet secretary’s assurances, I will not press amendment 208. Amendment 208, by agreement, withdrawn. Amendments 314 and 315 not moved. Amendment 316 moved—[Ross Greer]. The Deputy Presiding Officer: The question is, that amendment 316 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No. The Deputy Presiding Officer: There will be a division.”
“Mairi Gougeon: I was grateful to meet Rhoda Grant to discuss amendment 208, which would remove trust property that is land from the definition of a private purpose trust. However, as drafted, the amendment would not have the intended effect, because such trusts could continue to exist and still be set up anew under Scots law. Amendment 208 would therefore have no effect on existing trusts of that nature, and it would not prevent new trusts of that nature from being established. This Government views it as essential that we have in place the highest anti-corruption standards, and that includes information about beneficial ownership. That is why we have committed to looking closely at private purpose trusts as part of an anti-corruption strategy in our next open government action plan.”
“It can be a bit like a Russian doll, with a set of layers hiding the ultimate owner. The Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2016 introduced the register of controlled interests in land, which launched in 2022. However, that register does not require registration of beneficiaries as a matter of course. As the law stands, private purpose trusts could effectively hide land ownership for the purpose of the register of controlled interests in land unless the provisions in the Trusts and Succession (Scotland) Act 2024 are amended so that private purpose trusts cannot be used to conceal beneficial owners. That is the policy intent behind amendment 208, and I urge the cabinet secretary to support it—or failing that, to give a commitment to bring forward legislation to tackle the matter, not only in the context of land reform but throughout wider society.”
“Amendment 206 disagreed to. Amendment 207 not moved. The Deputy Presiding Officer: Group 17 is on private purpose trusts. Amendment 208, in the name of Rhoda Grant, is the only amendment in the group. Rhoda Grant: Amendment 208 will improve the transparency of land ownership in Scotland. It seeks to modify the Trusts and Succession (Scotland) Act 2024 to target private purpose trusts. One in five properties owned through offshore companies do not disclose publicly who owns them. That represents £3.2 billion for 670 properties in Scotland. Of those, £1.2 billion-worth of properties are controlled by complex trust arrangements to keep their owners’ identities secret. Those trusts can be used to obscure those who ultimately benefit from land or property in Scotland.”
“On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I am afraid that I was unable to be connected. I would have voted no. The Deputy Presiding Officer: Thank you. I will ensure that that vote is recorded. For Baillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Boyack, Sarah (Lothian) (Lab) Burgess, Ariane (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Chapman, Maggie (North East Scotland) (Green) Choudhury, Foysol (Lothian) (Ind) Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Duncan-Glancy, Pam (Glasgow) (Lab) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Griffin, Mark (Central Scotland) (Lab) Harvie, Patrick (Glasgow) (Green) Johnson, Daniel (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lennon, Monica (Central Scotland) (Lab) Leonard, Richard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Mackay, Gillian (Central Scotland) (Green) [Proxy vote cast by Patrick Harvie] Marra, Michael (North East Scotland) (Lab) Mason, John (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) McNeill, Pauline (Glasgow) (Lab) Mochan, Carol (South Scotland) (Lab) O’Kane, Paul (West Scotland) (Lab) [Proxy vote cast by Michael Marra] Rowley, Alex (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Ruskell, Mark (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Russell, Davy (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (Lab) Slater, Lorna (Lothian) (Green) [Proxy vote cast by Maggie Chapman] Sweeney, Paul (Glasgow) (Lab) Villalba, Mercedes (North East Scotland) (Lab) Whitfield, Martin (South Scotland) (Lab) Against Adam, George (Paisley) (SNP) Adam, Karen (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) Adamson, Clare (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Arthur, Tom (Renfrewshire South) (SNP) Beattie, Colin (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) Briggs, Miles (Lothian) (Con) Brown, Keith (Clackmannanshire and Dunblane) (SNP) Brown, Siobhian (Ayr) (SNP) Burnett, Alexander (Aberdeenshire West) (Con) Callaghan, Stephanie (Uddingston and Bellshill) (SNP) Carson, Finlay (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Coffey, Willie (Kilmarnock and Irvine Valley) (SNP) Cole-Hamilton, Alex (Edinburgh Western) (LD) Constance, Angela (Almond Valley) (SNP) Dey, Graeme (Angus South) (SNP) Don-Innes, Natalie (Renfrewshire North and West) (SNP) Doris, Bob (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) Dornan, James (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) Dowey, Sharon (South Scotland) (Con) Dunbar, Jackie (Aberdeen Donside) (SNP) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Ewing, Annabelle (Cowdenbeath) (SNP) Ewing, Fergus (Inverness and Nairn) (Ind) Fairlie, Jim (Perthshire South and Kinross-shire) (SNP) Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) FitzPatrick, Joe (Dundee City West) (SNP) Forbes, Kate (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) Fraser, Murdo (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Gallacher, Meghan (Central Scotland) (Con) Gibson, Kenneth (Cunninghame North) (SNP) Gilruth, Jenny (Mid Fife and Glenrothes) (SNP) Golden, Maurice (North East Scotland) (Con) Gosal, Pam (West Scotland) (Con) Gougeon, Mairi (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) Gray, Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (LD) Greer, Ross (West Scotland) (Green) Gulhane, Sandesh (Glasgow) (Con) Hamilton, Rachael (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP) Haughey, Clare (Rutherglen) (SNP) Hepburn, Jamie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) Hoy, Craig (South Scotland) (Con) Hyslop, Fiona (Linlithgow) (SNP) Halcro Johnston, Jamie (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Kerr, Liam (North East Scotland) (Con) Kerr, Stephen (Central Scotland) (Con) Kidd, Bill (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) Lochhead, Richard (Moray) (SNP) Lumsden, Douglas (North East Scotland) (Con) MacDonald, Gordon (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) Macpherson, Ben (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (SNP) Maguire, Ruth (Cunninghame South) (SNP) Martin, Gillian (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) Matheson, Michael (Falkirk West) (SNP) McCall, Roz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) McKee, Ivan (Glasgow Provan) (SNP) McLennan, Paul (East Lothian) (SNP) McMillan, Stuart (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) McNair, Marie (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) Minto, Jenni (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Mundell, Oliver (Dumfriesshire) (Con) Nicoll, Audrey (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) Rennie, Willie (North East Fife) (LD) Robertson, Angus (Edinburgh Central) (SNP) Robison, Shona (Dundee City East) (SNP) Roddick, Emma (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) Ross, Douglas (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Smith, Liz (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Somerville, Shirley-Anne (Dunfermline) (SNP) Stevenson, Collette (East Kilbride) (SNP) [Proxy vote cast by Fulton MacGregor] Stewart, Alexander (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Stewart, Kaukab (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) Stewart, Kevin (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) Sturgeon, Nicola (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) Swinney, John (Perthshire North) (SNP) Thomson, Michelle (Falkirk East) (SNP) Todd, Maree (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) Torrance, David (Kirkcaldy) (SNP) Tweed, Evelyn (Stirling) (SNP) Webber, Sue (Lothian) (Con) Wells, Annie (Glasgow) (Con) White, Tess (North East Scotland) (Con) Whitham, Elena (Carrick, Cumnock and Doon Valley) (SNP) Whittle, Brian (South Scotland) (Con) Wishart, Beatrice (Shetland Islands) (LD) Yousaf, Humza (Glasgow Pollok) (SNP) The Deputy Presiding Officer: The result of the division is: For 27, Against 91, Abstentions 0.”
“I very much regret that Lord Bracadale felt it necessary to resign from chairing the Sheku Bayoh inquiry. I want to place on record my admiration and appreciation—and those of the Government—of the service that Lord Bracadale has given to the inquiry, which I think has been exemplary, but I respect and understand his decision to step down. The Deputy First Minister has thanked Lord Bracadale for his work and is now engaging on how to progress the inquiry. We will keep Parliament updated on the steps that are necessary to do so. As Mr Mason will know, we have to undertake statutory consultation on the chairing of the inquiry. That will be undertaken timeously, and we will keep Parliament advised of the steps that we take. The Presiding Officer: That concludes First Minister’s question time. Point of Order 12:47”
“There is a full range of different opportunities for those issues to be properly and fully considered. A huge amount of scrutiny is applied to applications of that type, and significant assessments are required, particularly for environmental reasons. Mr Eagle will be familiar with the contents of those, because they are part and parcel of statute. There are opportunities for engagement on all those questions. Sheku”
“Given my commitment to deliver 15 walk-in GP clinics across Scotland, added to the falling numbers on NHS waiting lists, the Scottish people can look forward to a strong national health service under Scottish National Party leadership. Offshore Wind Park (Community Representation)”
“I am very pleased that we are seeing a decrease in new out- patient waits that last for longer than a year. I am delighted that we are seeing the total waiting list for out-patients, in-patients and day-case lists decreasing compared with that in the same month last year. I am delighted, too, that the number of treatment time guarantee waits for more than a year have decreased by 6 per cent when compared with those for last month. I am also delighted that the health secretary has managed to reach agreement with the British Medical Association’s Scottish general practitioners committee, which will see general practice receive additional funding of more than £500 million over the next three years.”
“I am very sympathetic to the point that Mr Sweeney puts to me and will ask the Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Local Government to engage directly with him and make the representation that he asks for. Credit unions provide an essential foundation in our society, particularly for people who are on low incomes and have low savings levels. It is important that financial security is available to them. National Health Service (Investment)”
“First, let me reassure Tess White that I believe in free speech and think that it should be protected at all times in our society. Secondly, I understand from media reports and the contents of Tess White’s question that the issue actively involves Police Scotland. It would be inappropriate for me to comment on a case that is under active engagement by Police Scotland. If I were to do that habitually, lots of members of Parliament would complain about my doing so. Family Protection Plan (Maiden Life)”
“The Scottish Government has been consistent in its opposition to the development of nuclear energy in Scotland. We think that Scotland has a golden opportunity to develop renewables and should concentrate on doing so. Vandalism Charges (For Women Scotland)”
“The First Minister: I reassure Ash Regan that a number of the law’s central provisions have already been implemented, including the prohibition on providing or making available fireworks or pyrotechnic articles to children, a new statutory aggravation for courts to use when sentencing offenders who have used fireworks to attack emergency service workers, the powers relating to firework control zones and new offences on possession of pyrotechnics in public places and at designated venues and events. Very strong action has been taken, but I come back to the point that I made in my original answer, which is that anyone who takes part in illegal activity or disorder can expect a robust response from Police Scotland. That is what has taken place in the past, and I expect that to be the case in the future.”
“Firefighters, police officers and paramedics continuously put themselves in harm’s way to protect the public, and they deserve more than warm words—they deserve the delivery of the law. The licensing system is still undelivered, and vital fire stations such as Marionville, in my constituency, face closure. Public trust is on the line, so will the First Minister commit to looking again at implementing the law in full?”
“There have been four bonfire nights since the law was enacted, and the constituents and emergency services that I worked with to introduce the law remain at their wit’s end. With respect to the First Minister, I note that firework control zones do not work without controls on purchasing. Only the United Kingdom Government can ban fireworks, but the public consultation on the issue was one of the most responded-to consultations that this Parliament has ever run. In constituencies across Scotland, communities on the front line— mine is one of them—have become annual bonfire night war zones. Those communities deserve the use by Scotland of all the powers that we have available to us to help them, but they are now bracing for impact.”
“The majority of the 2022 act has been implemented, including support for local authorities to implement firework control zones in order to tackle hotspots where disorder has been experienced. We have also introduced new offences of providing fireworks or pyrotechnics to children and of using fireworks to attack emergency workers. The licensing system has been paused due to the cost of introducing it at present, but that will be kept under review. Anyone taking part in illegal activity or disorder can expect a robust response from Police Scotland, as demonstrated by the recent major seizures of fireworks. Ash Regan: The Parliament passed that law more than three years ago to protect the public and our emergency services.”
“I hope that that reassures Pauline McNeill that the Government has increased the SPPA’s resources quite significantly to ensure that we can make timeous progress on the issue. Fireworks and Pyrotechnic Articles (Scotland) Act 2022 7.”
“The First Minister: I agree with that point. What I would provide as reassurance is that, when the remedy letters are issued, they will give a choice and, if a higher pension applies, the individuals will receive any arrears, including interest, which will be paid for by the United Kingdom Government. That issue has implications for the UK Government. Work has been taken forward by the relevant minister, Ivan McKee. Colleagues know the assiduous way in which Mr McKee carries out his responsibilities. That has involved increasing the SPPA workforce by more than 30 per cent to ensure that experienced staff, who are necessary to calculate often complex recalculations of pension entitlement, are able to do so.”
“It has broken at least two statutory deadlines, and it will miss a third deadline tomorrow. Delays are now expected to run until 2027. Every year in which a deadline is missed represents a cost to the taxpayer in interest payments of 8 per cent. Does the First Minister agree that, after seven years, it is unacceptable that the SPPA has not put this right? Given that it is a Government agency, what action is the First Minister prepared to take to bring forward the work that is required to issue remedy statements and pay public sector pensioners on time? What further redress will he provide for those who are impacted by this debacle? Here, I am talking about those who have already retired on reduced pensions. He could at least agree— The Presiding Officer: Thank you, Ms McNeill. Pauline McNeill: —that there is a need for urgency.”
“The Scottish Public Pensions Agency is working to ensure that all those who are awaiting their remedy receive it, with the bulk of statements being delivered by the end of 2026. Pauline McNeill: This has been described by those who are affected as a national scandal, and that is what it is. Public sector workers including nurses, police officers, firefighters and local government workers are still to receive pension funds amounting to tens of thousands of pounds. Seven years on from the McCloud judgment on pension discrimination, 55,000 people are still waiting on pension remedy statements, which must be received before any compensation is paid. Some people have died waiting for their pension remedy statement from the Scottish Public Pensions Agency.”
“We recognise that the McCloud judgment affects the administration of pensions across the United Kingdom and that timelines have been extended to reflect the challenges of delivery. In Scotland, there are approximately 215,000 members of affected schemes that are administered by the Scottish Public Pensions Agency. We should note that the vast majority of those scheme members have not yet retired and will make their remedy choice on retirement. Of the 65,000 retired members who are affected, many will already be getting the best-value pension. For those who have a choice that enables a higher pension, they will receive any arrears, including interest, to be paid for by the United Kingdom Government.”
“It is laughable for the Conservatives to come here and ask for more money for something if they will not vote for the Government’s budget. It is hypocrisy in action. We get it every year from the Conservatives, and I will call it out every time the Conservatives ask for more money in this Parliament. The Presiding Officer: I remind members that it would be helpful if we could hear one another.”
“I can confirm to the Parliament that more than 25,000 people started a modern apprenticeship in Scotland in 2024-25 and that 39,000 individuals were in training at the end of quarter 4 of 2024-25. Regarding college funding, allocations from the Scottish Funding Council provide a 2.6 per cent sector increase in teaching funding for 2025-26 compared with the previous year, and no college had a reduction in teaching funding in 2025-26 compared with the previous year. In addition, the Government is supporting the funding of Fife College’s new Dunfermline campus, which will be available to local people. [Interruption.] Let me make a final point to Roz McCall, because I hear that I am being heckled by her and others.”
“A local college source all but confirmed that, although there is the capacity to provide many more courses, colleges simply cannot afford to offer those courses to students, given the financial situation that the Government has placed colleges in. This year’s funding allocation included a £1.3 million cut on top of a 19.4 per cent reduction in the past three years, with the principal of the college stating that “The scale of the challenge” is now “precipitous”. Does the First Minister accept that the reduction in investment in skills is making it harder for young people in Scotland to access training and employment and for our businesses to recruit the local workers they need? The First Minister: There are a number of issues in that question.”
“The latest data shows that there are already more than 14,000 full-time-equivalent college students on engineering courses in Scotland. We are working to support colleges to meet Scotland’s future skills requirements and are investing £750 million in colleges in the current year. Roz McCall: Employers in Fife, such as Babcock, are crying out for investment in local skills to drive local growth and opportunities, but college budgets have been cut by a staggering 20 per cent over the past five years and the number of apprenticeships has sharply declined by as much as a third in the past decade. The truth is that the Scottish National Party Government has categorically failed to maintain investment in the skills that local employers need to fuel economic growth.”
“I assure Emma Harper and colleagues who represent constituencies that have an interest in fishing that we will do everything that we can to get a different outcome for”
“The First Minister: I very much agree with Emma Harper’s point and reiterate to Parliament that Scotland previously received 46 per cent of the UK’s EU fisheries funding allocation, but the figure has now gone down to 7.78 per cent, despite the fact that the overwhelming majority of fish in the United Kingdom are landed here in Scotland. That is completely and utterly inequitable. I saw one of my parliamentary colleagues in the House of Commons asking whether the Secretary of State for Scotland had made any representations to ministers about that point. No answer was forthcoming, so it would be interesting to know whether the Secretary of State for Scotland actually bothered to stand up for Scotland or whether this is just another example of the UK Government taking a decision that is prejudicial to Scotland.”
“Fishing is a hugely important contributor to the local economy in south-west Scotland, including in Kirkcudbright, where landing and processing take place. Given that, and given the pressures that the sector faces, which range from proposed cuts to quotas to dealing with the on-going impacts of Brexit, does the First Minister agree that the deal, which is an insult to and betrayal of Scotland and our fishing sector, cannot stand and must be reconsidered? What further steps will the Scottish Government take to protect and support the Scottish fishing sector?”
“We have had no reply to that letter. Scotland previously received 46 per cent of the United Kingdom’s European Union fisheries funding allocation, compared with just 7.78 per cent of the new UK fund, which is spread over 12 years, with no guarantees beyond the current UK parliamentary session. We are told that the UK fund is specifically aimed at revitalising the fishing sector, so allocations should reflect the relative size and importance of Scotland’s fishing sector. Scottish industry leaders have urged UK ministers to reconvene a meeting of the Scottish seafood industry action group to discuss the issue, and we plan to support that call in writing. Emma Harper: The recent funding announcement is yet another example of a UK Government that does not understand or care about our fishing and coastal communities.”
“That is why we are trying to take steps with other parties to create a broader political consensus in favour of council tax reform, and we will endeavour to do that. In the previous budget, for which we appreciated the support of the Green Party, we were able to deliver a much better settlement that improved the financing of local government. I pay tribute to Green and Liberal Democrat colleagues for voting for the budget, unlike everybody else in here, who was not interested in giving a better settlement to local government—at least the Greens, the Liberal Democrats and the SNP were. We will continue to engage constructively to support local services, because I share Mr Greer’s view that we rely on local services to support the population in Scotland. Fishing and Coastal Growth Fund 4.”
“Children with additional needs go without the support that they need at school because the staff are not there. Community centres and libraries have closed. The Government promised to scrap the council tax 18 years ago, and this week it launched another consultation. The First Minister knows that that farce cannot continue, so will he commit today that, whichever options find the most support through the consultation, the Scottish Government will introduce a bill to reform or replace the council tax after the election? The First Minister: In relation to council tax, the Government made and consulted on proposals for replacing the council tax when we put the prospect to the public in 2007, and we were unable to command a parliamentary majority on those questions.”
“The reason why the Government could not agree to remove the King’s personal tax exemption had nothing to do with practical difficulties—I think that we can all understand why the Government did not support that. There are options. Land and buildings transaction tax, non-domestic rates and council tax are all wealth taxes, and they are all entirely within the Scottish Government’s control. The largest single form of wealth in Scotland is property. Property wealth has surged by almost £100 billion in the past decade, but council tax is still stuck in 1990, so the poorest pay more than they should and the wealthiest get off with an absolute steal. In turn, our local services are at breaking point. Families cannot get social care packages for elderly relatives.”
“On some of the suggestions that Mr Greer has made, as he knows from his previous engagement—indeed, I have been engaged with some of these questions personally—we have explored some of the practical aspects of the proposals that he has put to us, and we have not been able to find a pathway that would work effectively without consequences that would be damaging to the policy intention. We have used the land and buildings transaction tax, for example, to weight tax charges towards the higher end of the income spectrum. As I say, we will consider those issues in the formulation of the Government’s budget. Ross Greer: I look forward to discussions with the First Minister about the budget, because, as he mentioned, we have options.”
“Mr Greer will know from his detailed experience of engaging with the Government that we set out our tax proposals in relation to the budget, and that is exactly what the Government will do. We will give every consideration to those questions. I am absolutely at one with Mr Greer’s concern about inequality in this country. That is why my Government is driven by the determination to eradicate child poverty, in which, as a consequence of the tax decisions that we have made, we are making progress in being the only part of the United Kingdom to have a falling level of child poverty, when it is projected to rise in every other part.”
“The fact that all the SNP has to offer is bizarre comments and rank incompetence proves that we cannot risk a third decade of this incompetent SNP Government. We face rising levels of violent crime, the legalisation, in effect—[Interruption.]”
“I do not want my comments to be misunderstood. People who have committed heinous crimes and have been sentenced to long- term imprisonment should serve those sentences. However, there are debates to be had about the appropriateness of prison in all circumstances, because of the pressures on the prison estate. There must be appropriate disposals for individuals. Community justice authorities, the funding for which the Government has substantially increased, have a role to play. All those factors are relevant in a rational debate about the prison population, and I hope that Mr Sarwar is able to contribute to that. Anas Sarwar: John Swinney and the Scottish National Party have been in charge of the justice system for 18 years—nobody else. On their watch, the entire justice system is in chaos.”
“Therefore, there are judgments to be made by the criminal justice system, independently, about the issues in relation to whether an individual should be on remand. The other issue is about short-term sentences. There have been umpteen reports—indeed, a report that has been welcomed warmly by Mr Sarwar’s colleagues in the United Kingdom Government was produced by David Gauke, who was a very imaginative Secretary of State for Justice in the Conservative Government. Mr Gauke’s report indicates the issues that have got to be considered about short-term prison sentences. There is a debate that must be had here in the Parliament—which my justice secretary is undertaking with numerous statements to the Parliament and a comprehensive committee appearance yesterday—about the appropriateness of prison in all circumstances for all prisoners.”
“The First Minister: One of the many flaws in Mr Sarwar’s argument as he has just put it to me is that the Government is currently implementing the proposal to build HMP Glasgow to a design capacity of 1,344 prisoners, which will add 357 places to the overall prison estate. That debunks the nonsense that Mr Sarwar has just put to me in his diatribe. There is a serious issue that the Parliament has to address, which is this: because of the successful prosecution of people who have committed serious crimes—many of them historic—in our society, people are serving longer sentences. Therefore, there are more long-term prisoners in our prison estate. Of the 8,000 or so prisoners who are currently in our prison estate, 2,000 are on remand. A proportion of those prisoners will not end up in the system on a long- term basis.”
“increased levels of violence, widespread drug misuse and self harm” and “plummeting staff morale”. Unbelievably, his justice secretary said yesterday that the SNP will not build any more prisons because, in her words, “If we build them, they will come.” Angela Costner—sorry, I mean Angela Constance—thinks that having more prison places encourages crime, but letting criminals out early discourages crime. That might be one of the most incoherent and stupidest things that I have ever heard in my life. What are they going to claim next—that building more hospitals will somehow make people in Scotland more ill? Who does John Swinney agree with: Angela Constance or prison officers?”
“The Government is taking action to address the size of the prison population, but there are significant constraints in relation to the proposals that the Government puts forward for which prisoners can be considered eligible for early release. Those standards will be rigorously applied in all that the Government takes forward. Anas Sarwar: That is a woeful answer to the fact that there are 10,000 outstanding arrest warrants in Scotland. John Swinney is unable to admit to his Government’s failure, but if he will not listen to me, maybe he will listen to people who are working on the front line. Only yesterday, the Prison Officers Association published a report that says that our prisons are at crisis point, with “serious overcrowding and understaffing ...”
“The first thing that I would say, to give some context to the issue that Mr Sarwar is raising, is that Scotland is a safer place since this Government took office. Recorded crime remains below the position immediately prior to the pandemic in 2019-20 and is down 39 per cent since 2006-07, when this Government came into office. I acknowledge that, at any moment, there will be outstanding arrest warrants. The execution of warrants is an operational matter for Police Scotland, which remains focused on the investigation of crime and on keeping communities safe. Police numbers are well supported in the country; the latest official statistics show that there were 16,427 police officers as of 30 June 2025, and there remains a healthy recruitment pipeline for police officers in Scotland.”
“I appreciate that that is of absolutely no comfort to Mr and Mrs Inglis in the loss that they have suffered, but I hope that it reassures members of the public that the Government is taking action to ensure that the type of experience that Mr and Mrs Inglis have faced will be mitigated in the future because of the steps that we have taken to change the law. I will, of course, give consideration to the points that Mr Findlay has raised and, as always, I will be happy to see Mr and Mrs Inglis, if that would be of any assistance to them. Justice System 2.”
“The First Minister: I am familiar with the points that Mr Findlay has raised and, as always with issues that relate to the criminal justice system, we will give them consideration. I hope that this provides some degree of reassurance, but under the recent legislation that the Parliament approved, the single bail test makes it clear that the court should specifically consider the protection of the victim from the risk of physical and psychological harm before making a decision on bail. In my view, that would provide the type of protection that Mr Findlay is looking for, and it is already in statute.”
“It says that “social workers are not obligated to verify bail addresses”, which explains why a violent criminal who was a known danger to women and children was repeatedly bailed to Claire’s home address. The report describes that as a “systemic flaw”. My party has published a paper today setting out changes that are needed to fix Scotland’s justice system and to put victims first. Fiona and Ian have urged the Government to back that specific change so that courts must check the veracity and safety of addresses. They say that that could prevent another family from suffering such a tragedy. Will John Swinney commit to urgently ending the bail blind spot that is putting women and children in danger?”
“That is why I asked the Crown to look at the matter again and why Mr Findlay has the report in his possession. That was at my instigation; I judged that the initial inquiries were totally unsatisfactory. There is a matter of further consideration as to whether a fatal accident inquiry would shed any more light on the issue than the exercise on which Mr Findlay has the report. However, I will raise these issues directly with the Lord Advocate and ask her for her consideration of the matter, to ensure that Mr and Mrs Inglis have as much support as possible to come to terms with the loss that they have suffered. Russell Findlay: Another reason why an FAI is absolutely critical is that the Crown’s report reveals a major flaw at the heart of Scotland’s bail system.”
“Fiona told me: “When we came here last year, we looked John Swinney in the eye and took him at his word that our questions would be answered, but we are still being kept in the dark.” Will John Swinney back the family’s calls for a fatal accident inquiry? The First Minister: I am trying to be as helpful as I can. I hope that Mr Findlay understands the sincerity of my engagement on the issue. The calling of a fatal accident inquiry is a matter for the Lord Advocate independently. I understand that Mr Findlay is able to call for such inquiries but, as First Minister, I have to respect the independence of the Lord Advocate. For me to act otherwise would contravene my oath of office, which I will not do. The process of investigation that was originally conceived of in Stirling Council was not acceptable—it was not good enough.”
“I will ask the Lord Advocate to engage further with Mr and Mrs Inglis to ensure that they can have a fuller understanding and to help them to come to terms with the tragic loss that they have suffered. Russell Findlay: I agree that the Lord Advocate’s focus is sincere and welcome, but the way in which the Inglis family is being treated is cruel and disrespectful. In 2022, Stirling Council held a serious incident review of Claire’s murder, which concluded that a full review was not needed. The expert disagrees, saying that a comprehensive review is “absolutely necessary”. However, to the astonishment of Fiona and Ian, the Crown Office says that it has still not decided whether their daughter’s murder merits a fatal accident inquiry.”