John Swinney
Scottish National Party · Scotland
“Since the report from several years ago was published, the Government has presided over the passage of legislation to rationalise that area of activity. Work is under way to transfer the responsibility for the funding of further education student support from the Scottish Funding Council to the Student Awards Agency Scotland.”
“I appreciate the urgency of the general policy elements of the question, because a number of applications are now being considered by planning authorities. My view is that, given the concerns that have been expressed by planning authorities, the Government has to be responsive to the issue.”
“For as long as we do not have a proper strategy on prison capacity, rehabilitation and clearing the court backlog, early release will be a revolving door, with people going in, coming out and going back into our prisons. Our justice system is in crisis, so we need a strategy.”
“I associate myself unreservedly Mr Cole-Hamilton’s comments about the feelings in the Muslim community. On Monday, I visited the Broomhouse mosque along with Simita Kumar and the Annandale Street mosque in Edinburgh with Ben Macpherson.”
“The development of further guidance will be undertaken in a manner consistent with the ruling by Lady Ross. Malcolm Offord: I thank the First Minister for his answer, which was more comprehensive than I expected.”
“I am a huge supporter of apprenticeship programmes. With foundation apprenticeships and graduate apprenticeships, the Government has brought forward important reforms that create new and successful pathways for young people. I am determined to make sure that every young person has that desirable pathway for their future.”
The complete record
Every one of 2,608 lines we hold for John Swinney, in date order, each linked to its source. Free to read, in full, without an account. Page 50 of 53.
“The living standards of our population depend on that, and it must be given greater priority than it has been given since the change of Government in July last year.”
“I agree with Clare Adamson on both points: that Scotland would be best served by being an independent member of the EU, and that Brexit has been an economic disaster for Scotland as part of the United Kingdom. It is as a consequence of our membership of the United Kingdom that we have lost our EU membership. The economic damage done is obvious. That is what is undermining living standards in this country. I accept and acknowledge that and have a solution to it, which is that we should repair our relationship with the European Union and ensure that our businesses and organisations can trade and that we can benefit from freedom of movement. I assure Parliament that we are encouraging the United Kingdom Government to repair the damage that has been done to our economy and to our relationship with Europe.”
“I give Claire Baker the assurance that I will do that as a consequence of our exchange today. Brexit (Economic Impacts)”
“I am familiar with those details and extend my sympathies to the family of Demi Hannaway. I understand the family’s concerns about the information that has been put in the public domain and am familiar with the fact that a complaint has been made and is being handled by the professional standards channel of Police Scotland. The Crown reserves the right in all circumstances to review any new evidence in a particular case. It does that independently of the Government, so it would be wrong for me to prejudge any of that information. However, I will raise with the Lord Advocate the point that Claire Baker has made to me about the family’s desire for further investigation of the case, because taking that forward would have to be a matter for the Crown, given the circumstances.”
“The law on freedom of information is absolutely crystal clear, and all organisations should comply with it and follow its provisions. If the matter is being looked at by the Information Commissioner, I will leave the commissioner to undertake its statutory duty. Demi Hannaway (Review of Investigation)”
“Those principles are enshrined in law because this Government put them into law. We intend to follow that through consistently; my colleague Elena Whitham has my absolute assurance on that. The Government is investing about £1.3 billion more than the funding that we are forecast to receive from the UK Government through the social security block grant adjustment, because we want to invest in supporting people to be able to make as much of an economic contribution as they can. That will be the ethos of this Government. Data Breaches (NHS Tayside)”
“I encourage the Labour Government to take a different course from the one that has been advertised. It is maintaining the two-child limit. Although the Scottish Government will act to remove that in Scotland, our task would be made easier if the issue was remedied at UK level. We will take every measure that we can. In the budget, we are taking further measures on the two-child limit and the expansion of free school meals in an effort to address child poverty, which is the overriding priority of my”
“due, at least in part, to the Scottish Child Payment.” Although that is very welcome, the Labour UK Government is doubling down on austerity measures such as the two-child limit, the bedroom tax and the benefit cap, and it is now pursuing welfare reforms that could slash benefits for hundreds of thousands of long-term ill and disabled people. Will the First Minister offer an assessment of the potential impact of UK welfare reforms on poverty levels in Scotland and outline how the draft Scottish budget for 2025-26 will expand anti- poverty work here? The First Minister: In its analysis, the Joseph Rowntree Foundation says that it expects the gap between the child poverty rate in Scotland and rates in the rest of the UK to widen because of the action that we are taking to tackle the issue through measures such as the Scottish child payment.”
“I welcome the Joseph Rowntree Foundation’s report and its analysis, which finds that Scotland is the only part of the United Kingdom that will see child poverty rates declining, thanks to policies such as the Scottish child payment. Through the Scottish budget for 2025-26, we will go further by committing resources to develop the systems that are required to mitigate the impact of the two-child limit. The Child Poverty Action Group estimates that scrapping the two-child limit could lift a further 15,000 children in Scotland out of poverty. Collette Stevenson: In its report, the Joseph Rowntree Foundation confirms that “Child poverty rates in Scotland ... remain much lower than those in England ... and Wales ...”
“For me, that was an indication of the value of the investment that the Government makes in ensuring that future generations understand and appreciate the awfulness of what happened in the Holocaust, and of why those generations must be reminded of it. Mr Carlaw has my unequivocal commitment that, for as long as I am First Minister, this Government will be a firm funder of Holocaust memorial education in Scotland. I see that as part of our obligations to the past and the future, and it will have my unreserved support as First Minister. “UK Poverty 2025” 6.”
“Will the First Minister commit to ensuring that the funding of such programmes continues in perpetuity? The First Minister: First, I associate myself with Mr Carlaw’s comments about Paul O’Kane’s hosting of tonight’s event. I welcome cross-party co-operation on this question. In his members’ business debate last night—in which, as ever, Mr Carlaw gave the deep and solemn commitment that he has always given to the issue—he generously referred to the fact that I had taken part in one of the visits to Auschwitz by Scottish school pupils that are supported by the Scottish Government. He correctly indicated that the experience that I had that day will never leave me. I saw, too, the profound impact on the young people who travelled with me on that occasion.”
“Jackson Carlaw: I welcome the First Minister’s participation in tonight’s event, which I will co-host with my Labour colleague Paul O’Kane. I commend the First Minister and the Scottish Government on their work to ensure that Holocaust education schemes across Scotland are second to none in comparison with those available in the rest of the United Kingdom. It is a real tribute to the efforts of the Scottish Parliament, and the various Governments that have presided within it, that Holocaust education in Scotland is as remarkable as it is. If this year’s theme is “For a Better Future”, we must surely realise that that future depends not on us but on the generation that follows. Fundamentally, such education programmes are critical to the understanding of the next generation.”
“On Holocaust memorial day, we honour the 6 million Jews who were murdered by the Nazis in one of the darkest chapters in human history. As we proclaim, “Never again”, we also reflect on the subsequent genocides in Cambodia, Rwanda, Bosnia and Darfur. This year, we commemorate the 80th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz. I welcome the decision of His Majesty the King to travel to Auschwitz to represent us all at the commemoration. This evening, alongside Mr Carlaw and the Minister for Victims and Community Safety, I will participate in the Scottish ceremony for Holocaust memorial day. At that event, we will stand united against hatred and for building one Scotland, together, for a better future.”
“The Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Local Government will raise the issue with the Chief Secretary to the Treasury next month. It seems to me that that particular decision is having a damaging effect on the UK Government’s growth agenda. Although I am wholly supportive of that agenda, that measure is counterproductive to trying to deliver growth in the economy.”
“What engagement has the First Minister’s Government had with the UK Government to get it to see sense and to rethink its daft decision to tax jobs, so that we can protect the Scottish economy? The First Minister: I have raised the impact of the planned increase in reserved taxation with the UK Government and I wrote to the Chancellor of the Exchequer earlier this month. The Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Local Government has also raised the issue with the Treasury. We have made clear the wide-ranging concerns about the impact that the change—which was introduced with no consultation—will have on Scotland. The UK Government seems determined to ignore those concerns, but we will continue to raise the issue and the impact that it will have on the Scottish economy.”
“I was deeply concerned by what I read in the CBI report on business confidence in the United Kingdom. In my regular engagement with Scottish business, I hear directly that the impact of the recent employer national insurance contribution increases at a UK level is a significant factor. The Scottish budget for 2025-26 includes a raft of measures to support business and economic growth, as well as enhanced measures to attract private investment. Kevin Stewart: The CBI’s monthly survey highlights weak hiring intentions, with business and professional services expecting a 20 per cent reduction in head count, while consumer services anticipate a sharper 44 per cent fall. Labour’s employer national insurance hike is a tax on jobs, and the decisions relating to it are already beginning to bite.”
“We will deliver a winter fuel payment for pensioners, and the Labour Party and the Tories will not support it when the budget comes to Parliament. Confederation of British Industry Report 4.”
“Over the course of Mr Cole-Hamilton’s question, he was subjected to yah-boo behaviour, principally of the Conservatives, who have contributed absolutely nothing to, and have achieved absolutely nothing out of, the budget process. Those are their actions and conduct. The Labour Party is in exactly the same place—it has achieved nothing out of the budget process to date. I say to Mr Cole-Hamilton that parties have to work together in the common interests of the people of Scotland. I welcome the collaboration that has taken place, because the Government is interested in delivering solutions for the people of Scotland, and not in coming here to posture, as the Labour and Conservative parties are doing. We are interested in doing the hard work to deliver for the people of Scotland.”
“That is Liberal Democrats acting responsibly, setting aside differences and getting things done. We also fought for a winter fuel payment for Scotland’s pensioners, and it is happening. That matters, because we learned this week that a third of households are in fuel poverty. After 18 years of Scottish National Party Government, why are so many people still freezing in cold homes? The First Minister: First of all, this is the first time that I have formally had the opportunity to welcome, in Parliament, the support that the Liberal Democrats have expressed for the Government’s budget and for the agreements that we have reached on policy priorities—which we have also reached with members of the Green Party and with the member from Alba. That is an indication of how Parliament should work.”
“Alex Cole-Hamilton: It is because of the Liberal Democrats that the Scottish budget now includes a new Belford hospital in Fort William; a replacement eye pavilion for Edinburgh; support services for babies born addicted to drugs; investment to make it easier for people to see their general practitioner or a national health service dentist; long Covid care pathways; backing for hospices; new skills pipelines for care and for offshore wind power; business rates relief for hospitality; more affordable homes; a better future for young people at Corseford College; the right for family carers to earn more; and more money for councils, ferries and social care. Our priorities will now be backed by hundreds of millions of pounds of Government investment.”
“The Cabinet will meet next Tuesday and ministers will have the opportunity to consider the implications for the Scottish budget of the welcome agreement that has been reached with the Scottish Liberal Democrats, the Scottish Green Party and Alba. All that we are waiting for is some common sense to break out in the Labour Party and the Conservatives.”
“The First Minister: Presiding Officer, I see that Mr Sarwar’s allies in the Conservative Party have come to his rescue once again. There was not a single solution offered by Anas Sarwar in all of that long diatribe to Parliament, because he is high on rhetoric and low on delivery. [Interruption.] The Presiding Officer: Thank you, members. The First Minister: Mr Sarwar promised the WASPI women—women against state pension inequality—in Scotland that he would be at their side. At the first whiff of change, the Labour Government came in and shut the door on the WASPI women. That is why Mr Sarwar is high on rhetoric and low on delivery, and why Scotland does not take him seriously. Cabinet (Meetings) 3.”
“After 18 years, why can John Swinney not see that Scotland does not need another failed SNP First Minister, another failed SNP health secretary or another failed SNP plan? It needs a new Government and a new direction. The First Minister: There was not a single solution offered by Anas Sarwar—not one. [Interruption.] The Presiding Officer: Let us hear the First Minister. The First Minister: Listen—we will be here for as long as it takes for me to explain my point to the Parliament. [Interruption.] I see that Mr Sarwar’s allies have come to the rescue! The Presiding Officer: From the screen in front of me, I am aware that a huge number of members would really like to put a question today. I am very keen that our constituents have an opportunity to hear this session. I ask all members to bear that in mind.”
“Anas Sarwar: That answer proves why John Swinney cannot fix the problems in our NHS. Scotland’s NHS is in desperate need of reform, but the brutal truth is that John Swinney cannot see the damage that his party has done. He cannot see it, but I will tell you who can: the 863,000 people who are stuck on NHS waiting lists, the 100,000 Scots who have been waiting for more than a year for treatment, the record number of people who have been forced to pay to go private and the staff who his Government is failing every single day. We need a Scottish Government that will do whatever it takes to clear the NHS backlogs and make sure that the NHS is there when Scots need it—always free at the point of need and fit for the future.”
“In my speech on Monday, the Government set out a series of interventions to strengthen the national health service and its capacity by delivering extra procedures at a number of centres around the country, by improving referrals through radiology services and expanding the rapid cancer diagnostic service, and by making sure that we expand capacity in a range of different disciplines through eye condition care and the NHS Scotland pharmacy service. Those are the practical steps that will make a difference, but they will happen only if the Government’s budget passes. Who stands in the way of the Government’s budget passing? Who is not going to lift a finger to support and endorse that investment? The Labour Party in Scotland— Labour members should be ashamed of themselves.”
“After such a record of failure, why should anyone believe John Swinney and the SNP? The First Minister: Mr Sarwar has made the same mistake that Jackie Baillie made last week of saying that things are getting worse week by week. I go back to the same information that I put on the record last week. On accident and emergency waiting times, four-hour performance has increased week on week since the week ending 22 December. Jackie Baillie and Anas Sarwar are once again saying— [Interruption.] The Presiding Officer: Members, let us hear the First Minister. The First Minister: —things that are not true.”
“Of plan 1, in August 2021, the SNP First Minister said: “This plan will drive the recovery of our NHS—not just to its pre-pandemic level, but beyond.” Instead, we are doing 50,000 fewer operations compared with pre-pandemic levels. In launching plan 2 in July 2022, the SNP health secretary said: “I am announcing some of the most ambitious targets in the UK.” The SNP Government did not meet a single one of them. In October 2023, the SNP First Minister said that plan 3 would cut waiting lists by 100,000. Instead, waiting lists went up by 20,000. Of plan 4, in June 2024, the SNP health secretary said: “I am not looking to publish another strategy. ... Our task now centres on listening and delivery.”—[Official Report, 4 June 2024; c 56.] This week, we have a new plan and a new strategy.”
“As Mr Sarwar knows, because I told him last week, I am engaging directly with all the interested parties in the health service to make sure that we create cohesive leadership and a focused agenda to improve and strengthen the national health service. That is what is occupying my time, and it is what is occupying the time of the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care. We are getting on with doing that. We are not promising jam tomorrow; we are promising the largest budget settlement for the national health service in a few weeks, and the folk who are not going to vote for it are that lot, Labour, and that lot, the Conservatives. Anas Sarwar: John Swinney has been passing budgets for 17 years and things are still getting worse in Scotland—I just remind him of that. We have had five NHS recovery plans in less than four years.”
“That would be stupidity on stilts from the Conservative Party, to add to all the other economic chaos that it has created. The Parliament will face a very simple choice in a few weeks. Mr Findlay wants me to prioritise the health service and make sure that investment is in place. Investment is in place, but the Parliament has to vote for it. What will the Conservatives do? They will vote against a record funding settlement for the health service. That tells us all that we need to know. For all that posturing from the Conservatives, they do not care about the national health service. National Health Service Recovery Plan 2.”
“The projects that are in the press releases need to be delivered, and taxpayers’ money should be spent much more effectively. Right now, across Scotland’s health service, more than £850 million is being spent on communications, human resources and other departments. That is almost £1 billion a year spent on backroom corporate functions, not front-line medical services. If the SNP attempted to cut that bloated bureaucracy and kept its countless promises, waiting lists could come down. Would it not be better to spend less money on back-office staff and more money on doctors and nurses? The First Minister: It would not be possible to spend more money on doctors and nurses if I followed Mr Findlay’s tax plans, which would cut £1 billion from public expenditure.”
“The First Minister: What has not helped me has been Mr Findlay’s support for the economics of the madhouse, which was brought forward by Liz Truss, whom he wanted me to follow. [Interruption.] Mr Findlay wanted me to do exactly what Liz Truss had done. Thank goodness I never followed the stupid ideas of Liz Truss and Russell Findlay. Russell Findlay: I only asked the man when he is opening those treatment centres. What we heard back is the populist party’s disease of blaming someone else for its failings. The SNP Government gets record funding and it is continuing to pick the pockets of taxpayers. The state of the NHS in Scotland is entirely on that lot over there. The SNP needs to stop chasing headlines and start doing some hard work. We need a health secretary who is focused on the job.”
“Now, John Swinney is again making the same old promises to deliver national treatment centres. Can he please tell the truth to the thousands of Scottish patients who are waiting in agony: when will those centres actually open? The First Minister: Here is some truth for Parliament. [Interruption.] In the years of austerity under the Conservative Government, the capital budgets of the devolved Governments and the United Kingdom Government were slashed. Why? Because of economic and fiscal incompetence by the Conservatives. That is what happened. I am now going to deliver the national treatment centres. What has certainly not helped me— [Interruption.] The Presiding Officer: Members!”
“Russell Findlay: I was not making a single noise. I was just smiling in incredulity, because I asked the First Minister about an app and he went off and read from a different script. That answer tells patients that the Government has no idea when the app will appear—if it does. That is not the only reheated promise that John Swinney made this week. A decade ago, the SNP announced plans to create a network of national treatment centres. They were supposed to be all over the country—[Interruption.]—if Shona Robison would care to listen. But here we are: the centre in Livingston is not open, Ayrshire is not open, Perth is not open, Lanarkshire is not open, Edinburgh is not open, and—[Interruption.] The Presiding Officer: Thank you, members. Russell Findlay: —Aberdeen is not open.”
“We will expand capacity at national treatment centres, and a number of other centres—Gartnavel general hospital, Inverclyde royal hospital, Stracathro hospital, Perth royal infirmary, Queen Margaret hospital and the Golden Jubilee hospital in Clydebank—will deliver extra cataract procedures. We will also reduce the radiology backlog. I hope that that is enough detail to show that, while— [Interruption.] I am very happy to go on, Presiding Officer. The Presiding Officer: I am content that your response is complete, First Minister. However, before I call Mr Findlay again, I remind members that the purpose of this session is scrutiny. If we have on-going noise in the chamber, all that is happening is that fewer members will have an opportunity to put a question. I ask all members to bear that in mind.”
“When exactly will Scottish patients get access to that vital technology? The First Minister: What I set out on Monday and what have been followed up in regular engagements between me, the health secretary and health service leadership around the country are practical steps to improve the health service and to secure delivery. We will concentrate on steps such as expanding the NHS Scotland pharmacy first service to improve access to healthcare and increasing general practice capacity in the country through a £10.5 million investment to expand its activity. We will deliver a new acute interior eye condition service, which will free up a combined 40,000 hospital appointments per year in Scotland. We will expand the capacity of hospital at home to create at least 2,000 beds by 2026.”
“Russell Findlay: I hope that John Swinney heard what the British Medical Association had to say about his speech. Dr Iain Kennedy of the BMA said: “we still lack the detail and comprehensive vision needed to make any plan a reality.” In a classic case of Government by press release, all that matters to John Swinney is an easy headline; he has no interest in the difficult job of delivery. I will give an example of that. Six years ago, all NHS patients south of the border were given an app through which to access information. They can make appointments, order prescriptions, view medical records and more. Two years later, in 2021, the SNP announced plans for a Scottish NHS app, but there is no app, and John Swinney has had the audacity to announce it all over again. The SNP has kept Scotland’s NHS trapped in the analogue age.”
“At the start of the week, I set out the Government’s focus, which will be on three key areas: ensuring that the resources are used to the greatest effect and have an impact in driving down waiting times and clearing treatment backlogs; reforming the system to deliver the right care in the right place; and making a long-term shift to prevention. We will accomplish that by providing the necessary policy direction, which I have just set out, and the resources, which will be included in the Government’s budget, with the biggest settlement for the health service. I am very pleased that we have parliamentary support for the budget, but it is well shown that the Conservatives are not part of the agreement to move the health service forward in any way, shape or form.”
“The next item of business is a members’ business debate in the name of Michelle Thomson. There will be a short suspension to allow people to leave the chamber and the public gallery. 12:49 Meeting suspended. 12:51 On resuming— Women’s Role in Net Zero”
“The issue will not be with CalMac, because it will have to follow the regulatory regime that is put in place by the animal health regulator. If that situation has transpired, I welcome it. I am very familiar with the strength of the agricultural community in our islands. Indeed, on Monday, Mr Fairlie and I were involved in discussions with the agricultural community in the highland Perthshire area, and representatives from Orkney travelled down to take part in one of the other round-table discussions that I was involved in this week. I want to make sure that we can support our island agricultural communities. I will explore whether we need to make any further advice available but, if the situation that Mr Eagle has put to me has arisen, I am pleased to welcome that. The Presiding Officer: That concludes First Minister’s question time.”
“Obviously, I want those issues to be resolved. Health boards have a responsibility to exercise their functions properly in that respect. I will seek an update from NHS Tayside on that question and share it with Mr Marra. In my previous exchange on the issue with Mr Marra, I made the point that, as the case may well reach an employment tribunal, I have to be careful about what I say in that respect but, with that caveat, I will try to give Mr Marra as comprehensive a reply as I can on the current situation in relation to the case. Animal and Plant Health Agency (Livestock on Ferries)”
“That is one of the measures that we are bringing forward as part of our programme. We have provided £3.7 million of funding to support the industry in developing an energy skills passport, which will help the transition that Audrey Nicoll refers to. It is important that the skills that we have available to us in Scotland in the oil and gas sector can be utilised in all aspects of economic activity in Scotland, and I am very optimistic that that will be the case with renewables as well. NHS Tayside (Job Grading)”
“Yesterday, the Deputy First Minister and I, along with a number of ministers, visited the new headquarters of JPMorganChase, which employs more than 2,500 staff at a magnificent state-of-the-art campus that it has opened in the centre of Glasgow. We should have a lot of pride in the strength of our financial services sector. The Scottish Government will always engage constructively with any company that is examining the footprint of its operations in Scotland. Energy Skills”
“That is a significant issue. The point that I would make is contrary to what Mr Balfour has put on the record. If I heard him correctly, he mentioned the closure of the BNY Mellon site. However, that is not what BNY Mellon said this morning, which was that it is “currently evaluating the scale of our operations at our Capital House site in Edinburgh”. It is really important that members of Parliament do not cause unnecessary alarm among members of the public who are employed by companies. If I misheard Mr Balfour, I will apologise, but I do not think that I did. We engage constructively with BNY Mellon, which is a great investor in Scotland: it is one of a huge number of financial services companies that employ thousands of people here.”
“That has meant that the cost of travel to our islands is formidably lower than it would have been had we left the matter to the neglect of the Labour Party, which did not introduce the road equivalent tariff before this Government came to office. Bank of New York Mellon (Edinburgh Office)”
“The Government has had engagement with DFDS on that question. I will ensure that an update is provided to Rhoda Grant on that, so that the concerns that have been raised can be properly addressed. Obviously, it is a decision for DFDS. The Government has to operate a sustainable ferry network, and the price increases that have been put forward are essential to ensure the sustainability of the ferry network, which is critical to the delivery of good services and to individuals’ access to the islands. Of course, many ferry journeys benefit from the road equivalent tariff, which was brought in by the Scottish Government.”
“The HPV vaccination programme has achieved great success in Scotland. Since the programme started offering immunisation to girls aged 12 to 13 in schools, research has shown that no cervical cancer cases have been detected in women who have been fully vaccinated as part of the programme. It is a remarkable achievement by the programme. The Scottish Government is working with Public Health Scotland and the cervical cancer elimination expert group to ensure that our measures to eliminate the diseases that are caused by HPV are available to all and effective for all, with the aim of eliminating cervical cancer. This year’s vaccination programme is under way. I strongly encourage parents to give their consent and ensure that young people receive the protection that is offered by the vaccine. Uist (Haulage Costs)”
“I am happy to provide Mr Mundell with a substantive response to the points that he has raised. Our enterprise agencies do a very good job of securing investment and working with companies to create employment. They have a formidable track record of success. There will, however, be ventures that do not come to fruition. Members who have any understanding of the economy understand that there is risk; some ventures succeed and some ventures do not. However, I am assured and confident that our enterprise agencies do a fantastic job in attracting investment to our country, and we should all applaud the work that they undertake. Cervical Cancer (Vaccination Programme)”
“I regret that decision. Obviously, the Government will use its agencies to support any individual who is affected. We will also engage with the company to see whether there is any way in which we can ensure continuation of production in the Dumfries and Galloway area, given the importance of authenticity in the source of production of important products of that type. Pinneys of”
“However, it is just nine years later, and the situation that Pauline McNeill has put to me demonstrates the pace at which roll- out of technology is happening. The UK Government has said that it intends to amend the Data (Use and Access) Bill to criminalise those who create artificial images either for sexual gratification or to cause alarm, distress or humiliation. There is perhaps an opportunity to move at pace because of what the UK Government has done and because it has a legislative vehicle available for us to utilise legislative consent to make urgent progress on the question. I give Pauline McNeill the assurance that the Government will engage constructively with the UK Government, with urgency, to ensure that that is the case. The Presiding Officer: We move to general and constituency supplementaries.”
“Does he agree that there is now urgency to close any loopholes in the law in Scotland by working with the United Kingdom Government, which is doing the same? As I said, it is the sharing of images that is illegal, so we need to close that gap. Does the First Minister agree that we, as a Parliament, and the Scottish Government need to send a clear message that dealing with that type of abuse is part of the campaign to eradicate violence against women and girls? The First Minister: Yes. I agree with that point from Pauline McNeill. She makes an important point about the pace at which the threat has arisen. The answer of substance that I gave was based on the fact that, in 2016, this Parliament passed the Abusive Behaviour and Sexual Harm (Scotland) Act 2016, which provides for the action that I set out in my answer.”