Robin Newton
East Belfast · Democratic Unionist Party · Northern Ireland
“I thank the Member for giving way. The Member is aware that the Education Committee took on the very early role, as he requested. Mrs Dodds made the point that the Bill does not have a natural home, and that many suspect that its required budget will be much greater than that outlined in the Bill.”
“I thank the Member for giving way. She is absolutely right about how despicable a crime human trafficking is and about the attempt, via the Bill, to address it.”
“That is not the type of language that we expect to see from such respected bodies. Their overall concern is the education of our children. They represent schools, and they say that the Bill is "flawed" and "not fit for purpose", but it looks as though we will vote it through. <BR /> <BR />I move now to the history of the Bill.”
“Thank you. There seems to be a similar attitude to this legislation. We, on this side of the Chamber, and indeed others, have consistently argued that a private Member's Bill is not suitable for this type of legislation. The ramifications of the Bill are significant.”
“Again, it has been referred to that the chief executives of the Council for Catholic Maintained Schools; the Controlled Schools' Support Council; the Governing Bodies Association, which is the body covering voluntary grammar schools; the Catholic Schools' Trustee Service; the Transferor Representatives' Council, which represents the Presb…”
“As we have done at every stage, we oppose the Bill. Mr McCrossan is not in the Chamber at the moment, but I am not unlike him in the sense that I believe in all our children being educated together.”
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“I thank the Minister for that very detailed answer. I acknowledge that he has recognised the potential of the employer-led scheme, which, I understand, results in 80%-plus of apprentices ending up in employment with their host company. Why are we not seeking to further expand the employer-led scheme? Employers recognise that they are meeting the needs of the industry, they have an input, and jobs are being offered to those who take part.”
“I thank the junior Minister for her answer. I do not think I have to spell out just how important the revenue projects are, but I ask the junior Minister if she will take on board the need to push forward, in particular, on the employment and education revenue initiatives. Does the junior Minister agree with me that, in addressing capital investment, it is much better to take a strategic approach in an area — I suggest the Clarawood estate — rather than a piecemeal approach to the development of any capital projects.”
“For the Shared Education Bill and its effects, June 2018 is really just around the corner. To think about the financial effects and to see them as a cost burden is to look at it in the wrong way; it is to look at it outside the ethos and purpose of the Bill. We need to look at the investment in our children's education, rather than see it as a cost to education. Shared education has much to bring to the table, and we should look at it as an investment rather than as a cost.”
“I believe that we will be sharing the strengths of one school with another. There is a very strong economic case for shared education. The skills and knowledge of teaching staff will be shared with other schools, and there is the capacity to build a much stronger teaching and professional staff through shared education. <BR /> <BR />There is a need, and I have said this previously, for us to ensure that communities, parents and boards of governors are willing and able to travel this journey together. There must not be a forcing of shared education, but there must be leadership in the shared education field. <BR /> <BR />In concluding, I will make a few remarks about the explanatory and financial memorandum, particularly about paragraph 18 on the financial effects of the Bill. I welcome the fact that:”
“It is the bit in the middle that I have the problem with. Opposing amendment No 8 says something about the overprotection of one sector because the Member perceives — it is only a perception — shared education to be a danger to another sector. I do not believe it is. The two can perfectly well thrive and enjoy success together. <BR /> <BR />I think that we are hitting all the right buttons in terms of the future for our children's education in Northern Ireland.”
“Mr Lunn and I are very much in agreement on approximately the first half of what he said. Indeed, on his concluding remarks on parental choice I am very much in agreement with him.”
“I believe that we will reach consensus on the Committee to facilitate the regulations on shared education. <BR /> <BR />I want to express my disappointment at amendment No 8. I know that Mr Lunn is a strong supporter of the integrated movement, and that is fine. It is a very worthy aspect of education in Northern Ireland. The parents of 7% of pupils attending school enjoy and have opted for integrated education, as they are perfectly entitled to do. However, in not buying into the shared education experience, he is removing something. The Alliance Party tells us that it is all for a sharing movement, working together and integration. It is disappointing that Mr Lunn has not been able to allow amendment No 8 to go without expressing some opposition to it.”
“<BR /> <BR />We have long-standing examples that I have used in the Chamber before of where good practice in education is already happening and children are enjoying company from whatever background. I particularly welcome the fact that, in this legislation, we will deal with children from a background that is perceived to be disadvantaged and, indeed, that we will be helping those children. <BR /> <BR />Mr Weir dealt extremely eloquently and professionally with the position of DUP members on the Committee. When he was speaking as Chair, he went through all the amendments, so I will not deal with those. I want to refer to only two of them. I welcome Mr Lunn's decision that he will not move amendment No 10 and will discuss it further. That is a wise and sensible move.”
“It is also, I believe, a major demand from education professionals, many of whom already practise shared education. We will be aiding and underpinning that shared education. <BR /> <BR />I want to take issue with a word that Mr Hazzard used; indeed, his colleague Ms McLaughlin used the same word on two occasions. They described shared education as "a concept". Shared education is a reality. It is happening out there; it is not a concept. You do not have to share Mr Lunn's support for integrated education to enjoy shared education. It is not a concept; it is already there. As we travel down this route, we will underpin and build on that. A concept is only a general notion or an idea, but the reality is out there and the demand for shared education is out there. I will come back to that in a few minutes.”
“I thank the Committee Clerks and their support staff for all the work that they have done. I especially want to thank all those who gave evidence to the Committee as we travelled on the journey to where we are today. The evidence was extremely helpful, and it was always delivered in a very professional manner, regardless of the background from which it came. Indeed, it gave the Committee an opportunity to witness the commitment of the elements that make up our education service. As we travelled this journey, we made visits to schools, which very much went the extra mile in providing services, opportunities and advice to the Committee members who turned up. <BR /> <BR />The Bill has been described in previous debates as small but significant, and I agree with that. It is a major plank in the Programme for Government.”
“I will be very quick. I know that car parking has been a problem in the past. That issue might need to be addressed in the future.”
“They certainly have the potential to add to our tourism and visitor offering, and they have the ability to add to the quality of life for those who live in the locale. <BR /> <BR />The site is a feature that, I believe, we are all rightly proud of. I finish by paying tribute to the excellent work that is done by the grounds staff. Let just me mention, Mr Speaker —”
“We moved away from that and learned a lesson, and subsequent concerts have not been controversial. I am not talking about that kind of major event; I am talking about events that would not annoy the neighbours or bring any form of disruption to the area. I am not talking about promoting large events; I am talking about small groups using the site. <BR /> <BR />I will finish with this, Mr Speaker: the grounds are an asset. They add to the work of the Assembly and the opening up of Parliament Buildings. They allow for the promotion of the Assembly and, in many ways, goodwill and identification. It may be — I only use the words "may be" — that the grounds have the potential to create a small number of jobs as well.”
“They are all extremely complimentary, but there is nothing that allows them to have a proper guided tour of the facility. Since those are the circumstances, there is the potential for us to do more in that sense. <BR /> <BR />I have already referred to the wildlife, the trees, the flora and the fauna that is all there for the likes of youth groups, the Boys' Brigade or schoolchildren doing their academic qualifications. It is also there just for children to be allowed formally to enjoy the site. Many groups of children come to enjoy the site. <BR /> <BR />We know that there has been a history of large concerts on the site. Initially, when Mo Mowlam started them, one in particular was so controversial that I got 300 letters of objection to it.”
“We need to compare it with the use of the Building and the super work being done on the tours and the educational facility. We need to benchmark it against that internal work and see what we can do about bringing a greater interest to it. Who would be interested? I think that the general public would be interested. I live in close proximity to the site and walk here during the summer months. The number of foreign visitors you meet in these grounds is amazing. Much of that is because there is an international hotel on the other side of the road. In the summertime, at 6.00 pm, 7.00 pm or 8.00 pm, the grounds are still open, and visitors staying in the hotel walk the grounds. You frequently get an opportunity to speak with them.”
“It is a very safe environment, it is attractive, and it is well out of the way of all traffic. In fact, it could not be safer. <BR /> <BR />I spoke earlier about the interest; people stopped me on the Estate and in the corridor and asked, "What do you mean by the 'use of the Stormont Estate?'". I joked with them: I said, "Well, we need to measure the number of dogs coming in and going out; they should all be chipped. Only people with dogs that have been registered with the council should be allowed in". Obviously, there has been some controversy about dog walking. We created the feature referred to as the bullring for dogs to be exercised. <BR /> <BR />We have this jewel in the crown — this asset — sitting on our doorstep.”
“There are many important aspects. <BR /> <BR />Turning to the Mo Mowlam Children's Park, I did not agree with a lot of Ms Mowlam's politics, but she has left a legacy in the Estate in what she created in terms of the trails through it, the wooded areas and the forest trail behind this Building. In creating the playground, she created what is probably the best playground in the whole of Northern Ireland. Obviously, it was done to meet the international standards that the European Union demands of children's playgrounds today. The playground is locked up at a certain time each night. Maybe, under certain circumstances, it has to be locked up each night. I encourage as many children as possible to use it. It has also the potential for organisational use, be it by groups of Scouts, Cubs, the Boys' Brigade or local schools.”
“That is a significant feature of the history of this Province.”
“It has been there since 1951, having come from that exhibition. We are now in 2016, which has importance from many perspectives. How many people, whether formally or informally, visit the Battle of the Somme granite stone that is placed with a group of six cedar trees and bears the following inscription?”
“All of this is of interest to young people as part of their education, whether in school or youth groups. There are also the strawberry trees, the flora and the most predominant feature, the line of trees up the mile, which are now around 80 years of age. <BR /> <BR />We can also look at the importance of The Gleaner statue. It stands nearly as a contrast. The Gleaner sculpture is by John Knox — I do not think that is the John Knox of Protestant historical importance — who originally exhibited it as part of the 1951 Festival of Britain. The sculpture shows a woman on bended knee gathering, with the inscription:”
“Although it is featured in publications put out by the Assembly, how many people know that it was originally created as the sculpture of a man and woman embracing across barbed wire to depict the inspiration for peace? The sculpture was originally conceived in the aftermath of the war. How many people know about that statue and its impact and importance in not only a Northern Ireland context but a much wider context? <BR /> <BR />The wildlife on the estate is also important. It presents an opportunity for our schoolchildren and the Scouts, the Boys Brigade, the Girl Guides and all those types of organisations. The wildlife includes a wide variety of birds. An otter was spotted on the estate recently. Work is being done to protect the red squirrels on the estate.”
“Mr Douglas and I were at a meeting on Friday night. I have been surprised at the interest that the title "Use of the Stormont Estate" has had. It was raised with us on Friday night. When asking how many people could identify features of the grounds, only two out of a group of 40 had any real knowledge of the grounds of Stormont. These grounds contain many historical features. How many people know about Craigavon's tomb being in the grounds of Stormont? There are not that many. How many people know about the bomb site, where the German bombers got closest to bombing this place? How many people have actually looked at it and reflected on that? <BR /> <BR />Carson's statue is the dominant feature of the estate, but how many people know about the Reconciliation statue and its history?”
“Those tours and the educational work contribute very much to the well-being, the feeling and the use of the Building — to an aspect of life in Northern Ireland. <BR /> <BR />I will take what is happening inside the Building and reflect on what might happen on the outside of the Building in the grounds of the estate. We all know about the history and features of the site, or we should do.”
“However, I believe that more could be done to fully realise the potential of the Stormont estate. I recognise that this is a working estate. It is where people come five days a week — some of them, six days a week — to do business. It is also a through-traffic estate. Sometimes, it is like a huge car park, given the nature and the interest of what is on in the Chamber. <BR /> <BR />Let us reflect on the fact that, when the Assembly got under way, we did not have the opening up of Parliament Buildings as we do today. That we have that today is in many ways thanks to the work of the Speaker's Office. It is very much about the professional way in which the educational unit deals with our schoolchildren.”
“I pay tribute to their skill, knowledge of the estate and commitment. As a frequent user of the estate, I have spoken to them and know that, for many of them, the commitment to the work that they do goes beyond just doing their daily job. It is something that they have a fondness for. Indeed, the grounds are an asset and a feature of our life, certainly in Belfast. They contribute in many ways to the quality of life in this locale. <BR /> <BR />I will say a few things about the history, the potential and the uniqueness of the grounds. I do not think that there are any other seats of a Government that have such a magnificent setting. Nor do I believe that there are any other seats of a Government that have been attributed green flag status, which reflects the park-type quality of these grounds.”
“Mr Speaker, I thank you for being here this evening. I know that you had other choices that you could have made, so I am grateful to you. I also thank the Minister for staying behind for an Adjournment debate, given the pressures that he has been under today, the very serious matters that have been debated in relation to the Budget and the time that he was in the Chamber. I am grateful to him for staying behind to talk about what is essentially a constituency matter — or at least that is how it is perceived. However, I do not believe that the use of Stormont estate is something that can be confined to east Belfast. I believe that it is a jewel in the crown of east Belfast, Belfast and Northern Ireland as a whole. <BR /> <BR />I want to pay tribute to the ground staff and the rangers who look after the estate.”
“The disposal of a property is in line with the disposal of the building or its potential future use. Often, deciding on a future use or the eventual clearance of the site takes so long that the building becomes a blight on the area or somewhere for vandals to gather and create a nuisance. Is there a timescale within which the decision-making process should be completed, so that the two scenarios that I have outlined do not become problems for those who live close by?”
“I welcome the Minister's statement. I want to refer to two areas: EU funding opportunities and educational underachievement. In the statement, the Minister indicated that he is applying for ERASMUS+ funding for 2016 in relation to language learning. There does not appear to be any application for educational underachievement. ERASMUS+ offers an opportunity for applications on the basis of personal development and, indeed, qualifications. If, as all of us in the Chamber agree, educational underachievement is significant, why are we not looking at the potential to make an EU application for ERASMUS+ funding to address that issue, as well as language learning?”
“I welcome those assurances from the Minister. Might she give examples of how she would take that activity forward, and what sort of budget is she prepared to devote to it?”
“I thank the Minister for recognising that George Best Belfast City Airport is a responsible, if noisy, neighbour. Does he agree that the airport contributes to the economy and to the employment of 1,500 people, plus all the businesses that it supports in the greater Belfast area, so that, when he does his work, he should take all those aspects into account?”
“I thank the Minister for his answers so far. Will he confirm when the review of the affordable warmth scheme will be completed and implemented? What are the expected outcomes of the review?”
“and allow them to mix with those who are not experiencing it, and to allow schools to implement initiatives that can ensure that those from a less-well-off background have the opportunities to go to what might be regarded as some of the more elite grammar schools. That takes us another step forward that can only be of benefit to our schoolchildren, young people and the future of Northern Ireland.”
“If we are to be successful and this Bill is to deliver, we need to have successful, effective and holistic area planning. There needs to be a holistic approach to the planning of our schools estate, not a sectoral approach. It brings benefits to the Minister's budget and releases money to be spent on other things if we have an area plan that works. <BR /> <BR />This is a good step forward. Further work is needed on the Bill. Other steps need to be put in place for the Bill to work and to deliver in and around our education. Let me finish with the one area in the Bill that gives me great encouragement. It refers to not only dealing with Protestant, Catholic or others. The Bill will help those:”
“They are professional, dedicated and committed to their teaching profession, and shared education gives them an opportunity to share those skills and knowledge with a wider range of pupils. <BR /> <BR />I have already said that we cannot force the pace of this initiative, but we can indicate to parents and schools what the benefits might be for our children and young people. Where I think there is an essential feature if we are to fully gain the benefits — reference was made to it — is the matter of area planning. I have been greatly disappointed by what I have seen of area planning activities, which were described by one learned gentleman who came to give evidence to the Committee as being a cut-and-paste exercise. Many will agree with that description.”
“I am not sure that I can totally agree with what the Member said, but he has shared that view in the Committee and, indeed, in the Chamber on previous occasions. <BR /> <BR />If we are going to move forward on this, we have to recognise that we have a very good cohort of teaching staff.”
“If we put that building block in place, I have no doubt that, when the benefits of it are seen, other communities will follow. <BR /> <BR />There have been a number of examples in the past, one of which was education for mutual understanding. I happen to believe that it was not a great initiative, but it was an initiative nonetheless. I know that Trevor Lunn is very much tied into the integrated education movement, but he recognises that it has not set the education world alight, given that he said that only 7% of the school population is involved in the integrated sector. Parents have not bought into the integrated sector, generally speaking, and pupils are not flocking to it.”
“Why would we not allow a wider range of children to experience, or live within, those leadership qualities and gain from the knowledge and enthusiasm that some teachers can impart, beyond what others can do? <BR /> <BR />Moving forward, in the next five, 10 and 15 years, buildings and resources will be tight and at a premium; so why would we not want to share them where possible. There is a strong economic and educational case for shared education. <BR /> <BR />I have made the point that communities need to be comfortable with it. I suggest, as others have done, that not every community can move at the same pace and not every community will have the same opportunity, but a start needs to be made and a building block needs to be put in place.”
“<BR /> <BR />Much can be made of sending a class of A-level pupils to one school or another and sharing facilities. Is that really what we want? No, it is not really what we want, but it is a step forward. Where we have a school with a good reputation in mathematics, science, English, the arts, or whatever it might be, and an adjacent school that is maybe not just as strong in an area, why would we not want the former to share its strengths? Why would we not bring those schools together? Why would we not let that be shared with the pupils in the schools, or the young people in the colleges, for the benefit of their education? <BR /> <BR />On sharing the skills of our teaching staff, there are teachers who are exemplars and have leadership qualities that are way beyond what might be regarded as the norm.”
“They turned me down. <BR /> <BR />That long history and ethos, and the good practice that is there, is embedded in that school. There is much good practice in other areas, and Trevor referred to those as good examples. Much of it has been done below the radar, where a song and dance has not been made about it, where press releases have not been issued, and where communities together have got on with each other and have done it and seen the benefits. If we are going down this route, as we are, then I suppose that the ethos and objectives need to be encapsulated in the Bill. Certainly, we need to see an improvement in education standards and all that flows from that for our children and young people and we need to further explore and examine at the next stage how that can be built in, too.”
“If we can get the Bill passed, we will have taken a very positive step forward in education. All the evidence and all of what we have seen has been positive. The visits that we have undertaken as a Committee have been good examples of good practice, and, where projects have emerged, they have involved the essential condition or criteria that local parents, schools and communities have been supportive of them. I think that this is one of the essential ingredients as shared education moves forward. <BR /> <BR />There are good examples, and Trevor Lunn referred to the long history of Methodist College, or Methody. I am not a former pupil, by the way. I never had the brains to go to Methody.”
“The third objective was to substantially increase the number of schools sharing facilities by 2015, and, in welcoming the progress that is being made in that sphere, I can say that some excellent examples have been brought to the Committee as evidence of that. Indeed, the Committee has had the opportunity to go out and look at the practice that is in operation. I do not think that any member of the Committee has not been impressed by what they have heard or what they have seen, appreciating all the difficulties and hurdles that principals and boards of governors have had to get over to make the initiatives work. <BR /> <BR />Reference was made to this being a small Bill, and I would not use the words "mercifully small". It is small, but it is significant, and it is a significant step in progress in Northern Ireland.”
“Like others, including the Chair, my party colleague, I am generally supportive of the Bill. I think that it is important to recognise where the Bill is coming from, what its genesis was and what its driver is. It is coming from the parties that sit around the Executive table and that develop the Programme for Government. <BR /> <BR />The Programme for Government placed specific objectives on the Department of Education, and those were determined to be in three areas. The first was to establish a ministerial advisory group to explore and bring forward recommendations to the Minister of Education. The second was to ensure that all children had the opportunity to participate in shared education programmes by 2015. We may have missed the target of including all children.”
“<BR /> <BR />While the motion does not do any overall harm, I think that it could have been constructed in a much more purposeful and meaningful way to take the subject forward.”
“Parents are generally supportive of grammar schools, and they are supportive of them because they are ambitious for their children. Grammar schools, however, should not be seen as a reason for underachievement in other sectors. <BR /> <BR />I welcome the fact that the Assembly today decided to form an all-party group to address underachievement. It has the perhaps more ambitious title of promoting educational excellence, but its intent is to address underachievement. It is, I think, an excellent initiative by Assembly Members to pick up the gauntlet. <BR /> <BR />Addressing underachievement is necessary. We need further initiatives, from various Departments, to address and tackle it. I welcome the initiative taken by OFMDFM under its signature project: having additional teachers to tackle numeracy and literacy problems proved successful.”
“I apologise, Mr Deputy Speaker. The motion would have benefited from rewording to confirm that schools have the right to use selection and that there is no community consensus on the way forward. Indeed, the motion should have taken up the clarion call from parents and others for cooperation between those who provide the selection tests, to work together to the benefit of children, parents and, indeed, the schools. <BR /> <BR />Despite the words that have been used earlier about the selection process, parents still want to get their children into grammar schools, as is their right. The mover of the motion indicated as much when she said that there was a growing number — 14,000 plus this year — who will sit the selection tests for grammar schools.”
“I rise to support the motion, but not with a lot of enthusiasm. I do not see the need to divide the Chamber, but I think that the motion might be described as being somewhat unskilled and sloppy in its construction. I refuse to believe that Danny Kennedy was happy with the construction of the motion, given his ministerial experience, his usually forensic mind on political matters and his long-term political experience. Given all that, I cannot see him being happy with the motion as it stands. <BR /> <BR />It is a great pity that the DUP amendment was not accepted, because it would have done three things —”
“I thank the Minister for his answer. Given what he has outlined with regard to a principal's role, which is separate from a principal's role in a special school, can he explain why the principal of a special school cannot achieve the same standard of management of his or her whole budget in the school from the commencement of the academic year?”
“If we do not take the communities along with us, we will have done the report a disservice.”
“Methodist College is a school that I hold dear. It has, for generations, without being coaxed or cajoled or having any other form of encouragement, stood up and integrated the children together; it has shared the education. It has taken steps to make sure that children who may not come from such a privileged background as some others are able to take advantage of that. Shared education, this report and its recommendations will take us forward. <BR /> <BR />I will dwell on only one aspect. All of the 11 recommendations are important. Recommendation 5 is drafted in such a way so as to encourage educationalists and the Minister to address the teachers' concerns, the parents' concerns, the concerns of the children and, above all, perhaps, the concerns of the communities in which the schools are situated.”
“I understand what he is saying, but the evidence of pupils enrolling and parents approaching and wanting to be in the schools has not stretched beyond 7%. That is the real evidence. <BR /> <BR />There are very good examples of where there is a desire to see a sharing of education. They have been referred to; I will mention only three. Two schools in Ballycastle saw it in the best interests of the pupils, the parents and the educational system to come together and work together, sharing education. The Moy was referred to. Trevor was speaking in not the glowing terms that I would have spoken about the two schools in the Moy that recognised the difficulties and addressed them as best they could, despite very intensive lobbying from one sector in particular against them taking the two schools onto one site.”